# Scott's Wall of Bass Immersive Audio HT Room



## Scott Simonian

*Power up!
Sequenced amp power-up when I turn on my main sources*









_*"Let's all go to the lobby!"*_












_outdated pics_
   



*Equipment List

Sources*
Oppo BDP-103d Universal Blu-ray Player
Oppo BDP-203 UHD Blu-ray Player
Sony MDS-JE510 Minidisc Player 
HTPC

Win 10 Pro 64-bit
Intel i7 4770k
Geforce GTX-970
Silverstone GD-08 HTPC case
*AV Electronics*
Yamaha CX-A5100 preamp processor
(3x) Behringer DCX2496 Ultradrive Pro digital crossover

*Amplifiers*
(3x) Samson SX1200 amplifier _*(mid/hf)*_
(3x) Behringer EP4000 amplifier _*(midbass)*_
Behringer NU4-6000 iNuke amplifier_* (side and rear surrounds)*_ 
Behringer NU4-6000 iNuke amplifier* (front and rear overheads)*
Behringer NU4-6000 iNuke amplifier _*(bridged - rear subwoofers)*_
Behringer EP2500 amplifier _*(subwoofer riser)*_
Cerwin Vega CV-5000 amplifier _*(front subwoofers)*_

*Projector*
Sony HW-40ES 1080p 3D Projector

*Screen*
Seymour AV Center Stage UF material _(DIY frame - 126" diagonal 16:9 acoustically transparent)_

*Speakers*
(3x) Custom 3-way cinema LCR speakers 
_- (JBL Pro 2226j 15" midbass, 10" midrange hornloaded, SEOS12 hf horn Denovo DNA-360 compression driver) - full active_
(4x) JBL Pro 8330 surround speakers *(side and rear surrounds)*
(4x) JBL Pro 8330 surround speakers *(front and rear overheads)*
(4x) Dual Opposed sealed 18" subwoofer _(DIY - Stereo Integrity HT18d4) *(front subs)*_
(2x) Dual Opposed sealed 18" subwoofer _(DIY - Sound Splinter RLp18d4) *(rear subs)*_
*Subwoofer Riser* _(DIY - 2x Sound Splinter RLp18d4)_

*Acoustic Materials*
Owens Corning OC703 4" rigid fiberglass
Knauf ECOSE 2" "eco-friendly" rigid fiberglass
GIK Acoustics Gridfusor diffusion panel
and many foam products of various thicknesses 

*Equipment Rack*
Omnimount RE27
Sonax ML-1220 Component Rack 

*Cables*
copper ones

*Control*
Harmony 650 remote

*Power*
(2x) Furman PS-8R Power Conditioner/Sequencer

*Seating*
An uncomfortable futon


*Subwoofer Riser Platform*

*   * 

*Additional Construction Pictures*


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## Scott Simonian

*Main Frequency Response

*_notes included in photo

_ 

_**as of 7/16/2016**

_*Bass Tone Control

*_I can't to go by with just ONE bass response. Some movies just need that bit more bass and sometimes there is one that needs to be tamed a bit. Or maybe I just feel like having more or less depending on my mood. With much trial and error I found that simply adjusting the BASS TONE CONTROL on the Yamaha to bet the most convenient and useful way to manage my need for changing the response on-the-fly. This next graph shows the effects of this tone control (only CC shown) and it's total range. 

Notes included in photo.

_

**frequency response shown as of 7/16/2016**


*Tactile Response

*_This information is related to the TACTILE RESPONSE of this system. These measurements were taken from a Nexus 7 tablet using the VIBSENSOR app available on the Android market (iOS also available). Essentially this information is showing the response shape and power of the TACTILE RESPONSE which is different from the above FREQUENCY RESPONSE graphs. Frequency response, as you know, is the audible range measured. These tactile response graphs show how you FEEL the bass. Frequency response shows you what you HEAR.

For more information about Vibsensor and the topic of TACTILE RESPONSE see this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...8090-vibsensor-accelerometer-test-thread.html


_












Spoiler


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## BornSlippyZ

I love what I see man! Bass to rattle your bones apart!


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## Frohlich

As somebody who is a big fan of the "wall of sound" look and sound, job well done. I bet it sounds awesome. Though I think I see a couple of square inches of free space where you could have probably added another speaker...whats up with that slacker???


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## 357

You're mad. I love it.


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## coolrda

Cool man. Love the room. Looking forward to a very thorough description of all the details.


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## QuiGonJosh

So you're deaf now, right?


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## LastButNotLeast

And broke.


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## ivanpino

Scott,

I love those pictures. Hope to hear it soon. Congrats...


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## ivanpino

Scott,

I love those pictures. Hope to hear it soon. Congrats...


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## aceg1

Nice setup.


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## NorthSky

Scott, you're one of, if not the coolest guy here @ AVS. ...Definitely, you are!


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## DotJun

So much woofage in such a small room, or what looks to be on the small side


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## jedimastergrant

Love the mad scientist approach Scott. I like to think of you in your room with a white lab coat and goggles conjuring up your next permutation. Just one evolving experiment. Thanks for sharing all your experience with us. 

What are the white things on the horns that look like little pieces of paper?


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## Kain

Holy crap!


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## LastButNotLeast

jedimastergrant said:


> What are the white things on the horns that look like little pieces of paper?


They used to be big pieces of paper.


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## jbdawson

Rap music and beer in that thing would be freakin awesome. Lol


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## Scott Simonian

Thanks guys! 



jedimastergrant said:


> What are the white things on the horns that look like little pieces of paper?


Grant, I took that picture while I was still assembling everything and had labels "L, C and R" on each to keep consistency. They aren't on there anymore.



jbdawson said:


> Rap music and beer in that thing would be freakin awesome. Lol


Everything is awesome in this thing.


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## NorthSky




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## LastButNotLeast

Post #2 is reserved for your REW graphs, right?


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## Scott Simonian

No but I guess I can post some of those too eventually. Every so often I go and make changes so that renders most of my "up to date" graphs as not so up-to-date. By the time I've posted one, it's already changed....maybe.

I think I did one last week when I took these pics (see the mic?) so I'll upload one or something.


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## DAK4

That looks awesome and would love to hear it somehow someday but only after you install the flame throwers.


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## Scott Simonian

Those go in next Tuesday.


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## LastButNotLeast

Don't bother. They'll just get blown out by the subs.
Heck, they could probably get blown out by the _*horns*_.


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## DAK4

Scott Simonian said:


> Those go in next Tuesday.


Cool, I'll be over Wednesday. Have Mad Max ready. I'll bring the guitar and bungies


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## DAK4

LastButNotLeast said:


> Don't bother. They'll just get blown out by the subs.
> Heck, they could probably get blown out by the _*horns*_.


Good point! Just have to enjoy the awesome sound I guess.


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## Spanglo

Be honest, did that space use to be your walk-in closet? 

I love the brute force approach.


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## Waboman




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## K9woofer

One of your 2226's is upside down.


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## NorthSky

DAK4 said:


> That looks awesome and would love to hear it somehow someday but only after you install the flame throwers.





DAK4 said:


> Cool, I'll be over Wednesday. Have Mad Max ready. I'll bring the guitar and bungies


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## Scott Simonian

K9woofer said:


> One of your 2226's is upside down.


Was waiting to see how long until someone mentioned that. 

What happened is the wire going to that one enclosure was so short and tight that I had to rotate the enclosure around for it to reach the terminal. They were all offset diagonally on the back.



Waboman said:


>



More like:


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## cellarnoise

Love the work in progress. Though my back is in fear of that couch... always room for improvement I guess.
I need to read up on how your sub riser performs...


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## Nightlord

cellarnoise said:


> Love the work in progress. Though my back is in fear of that couch...


+1 !


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## Nightlord

K9woofer said:


> One of your 2226's is upside down.


No, the rest of them are.


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## NWCgrad

Scott, it was great talking with you at Brandon's GTG a couple of weeks ago. A few projects down my endless list is re-making my 4 Pi speakers into a three-way system with the midhorn (and possibly a second JBL 2226H driver just for fun). When I get to this project, will be hitting you up for advice.

Have you listened to Roger Waters new Wall blu ray? It would be epic on your system. May induce flashbacks so be careful.


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## Scott Simonian

Hey, you too! Hope we can catch each other again at the next big GTG.  Yup. Hit me up. Sounds interesting. Will have to be a active/passive hybrid system it sounds like. Guaranteed to be killer though. 

Nope. Don't have it. Probably won't get it unless I hear it somewhere and it impresses me.


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## Waboman

Scott Simonian said:


> More like:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcxfsEe_e9I


Lol. I recall (vaguely) seeing Van Halen's 1984 tour. They had a massive wall of Marshalls. Kinda reminds me of that. What's this GTG talk? Any pics of this alleged GTG?


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## kevings

Scott,

Out of curiosity, do you currently have your eye on anything new for the theater? Also, great job with the setup....looks intimidating, and crazy fun, at the same time.


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## NorthSky

Spoiler



Click me; Scott's theater room, the other side of that door =>






...watching Mad Max, right now.


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## Scott Simonian

kevings said:


> Scott,
> 
> Out of curiosity, do you currently have your eye on anything new for the theater? Also, great job with the setup....looks intimidating, and crazy fun, at the same time.


Hey, Kevin! Where the hell do you keep going off to?

Yes and no. I've finally reached a point in a long, long time where my room feels "complete" with no nagging urge for the next item to upgrade or replace. Sure, given the money I'd like to get all sorts of thing changed but in it's current state it is very adequate. But .... I do have plans. That's half the fun of this hobby is the next change or upgrade. 

I think the next thing I'll tackle is the side surrounds. As seen in the pictures, they are quite intrusive. I'm thinking about removing the acoustic treatment behind them and somehow mounting them in that area. Will push them closer to the side walls by half a foot which doesn't sound like much but will make a huge improvement in several ways. Haven't figured out how I want to do it yet so for now they stay. Another thing is I might go about "blacking out" the rest of the room. Will probably just get some material each month and work my way front to back. Actually do not need to do this much so I'm in no hurry. I'd love to upgrade all my surrounds and heights but if I do them all at once I'm looking at two grand or so in new speakers. Ugh. Rather not.

Realistically, I probably won't get much new hardware for some time. I see my next thing being a UHD Blu-ray player when they come out. Or not. First generation players always suck ass. Maybe I'll just wait for OPPO's first player. They said they won't have one the first year of the new format so it'll be a while which is fine with me.

So no... not much, Kev. I'm up to my eyeballs in bass and awesome dynamic sound. New projector is excellent and I'll have to quadruple the price I paid for it to get a worthy upgrade in PQ. No complaints about the OPPO 103d player. Atmos sound from my new Yamaha is also excellent. Any improvements in sound will come from different surrounds or better placement of which I have little room for change there.

Come on up sometime and check it out, Kevin.


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## ambesolman

Sweet manchego! That's quite a setup, well done. Just one question...when you add your front wides, will your right one be in front of or behind your grandma's shower curtain? If positioned behind, is it acoustically transparent?


Sent using Tapatalk since the mobile version is still


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## Scott Simonian

Yes, yes, very well.... very well. 

Notice I covered my granny curtains. 

Probably will not do wides in this room. Don't need them.


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## javanpohl

Those curtains really pulled the room together


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## javanpohl

LOL... didn't even see that last post till after posting that. Hahaha... perfect


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## Kain

Sorry if it has been already mentioned somewhere else but what is the size of your room?


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## Scott Simonian

Kain said:


> Sorry if it has been already mentioned somewhere else but what is the size of your room?



Didn't post that.

It's roughly 18ft long x 10.5ft wide x 9.75ft tall.


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## LastButNotLeast

Which, after the speakers, is 8 by 6 by 9.75.


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## Scott Simonian

Pretty much.


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## Mashie Saldana

How did you integrate the six Atmos speakers? I understand you have four channels matrixed into six using some version of Dolby Pro Logic II. Did you set the speaker distances on the Yamaha or on the Harman Kardons? Also at which stage in the setup process did you run the room corrction on the Yamaha, before or after enabling PLII?

I will most likely do the same approach for a 7.1.6 setup in my 12'x12' room once NAD get their act together and release Atmos MDCs for their AVRs.

I like this build, it is insane.


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## Scott Simonian

Mashie Saldana said:


> How did you integrate the six Atmos speakers? I understand you have four channels matrixed into six using some version of Dolby Pro Logic II. Did you set the speaker distances on the Yamaha or on the Harman Kardons? Also at which stage in the setup process did you run the room corrction on the Yamaha, before or after enabling PLII?
> 
> I will most likely do the same approach for a 7.1.6 setup in my 12'x12' room once NAD get their act together and release Atmos MDCs for their AVRs.
> 
> I like this build, it is insane.


Hello, Mashie.

Yes, I extract a common center image from the two sets of overheads. Dolby Prologic 2 is the post decoder that extracts my two middle overhead speakers. Movie mode in particular but 'Music' mode is good for "center fill" of the overhead sound and then I can also use Stereo/Direct for a bypass of the whole thing if I want. The main receiver feeds the two auxiliary receivers by RCA cables. Front left and rear left to one and front right and rear right to the other. Here is a block diagram of the hookup:


Spoiler















I run all my main calibrations first on the Yamaha with decoding bypassed on the two extra receivers. Assuming all as if 7.1.4 layout. After main calibration do I activate PL2 decoding and then tweak here and there til just right. 

Thanks and good luck!


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## Mashie Saldana

Hi Scott,

Thank you for the information, can't wait to implement it myself.


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## Carrick

That room is sick!!

It's been 25 years since I was in car SPL competitions in my '88 Civic hatchback, so I sure wish current wife loved bass 

Good thing she is a great cook 

Congrats and enjoy


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## NWCgrad

Scott, have you thought of using the miniDSP program for extracting center from stereo signal? May be a little more rack friendly than two extra receivers.
https://www.minidsp.com/products/plugins/rear-center-channel-detail


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## LastButNotLeast

Or do it the old-fashioned way: run the positive lead from the left and right channels to the center. The disadvantage is that you have no separate control over the volume (unless, of course, you wire in a potentiometer).
Michael


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## Scott Simonian

NWCgrad said:


> Scott, have you thought of using the miniDSP program for extracting center from stereo signal? May be a little more rack friendly than two extra receivers.
> https://www.minidsp.com/products/plugins/rear-center-channel-detail


Yes I have, actually. It sounds like a decent approach on paper but looking at the diagrams available it isn't clear if the MDSP solution not only "makes" a center output but also cancels that same information from the L&R as PL2 would. Would only be useful as a "center fill" if that information is left in those channels. Not the worst thing ever but it's an investment that will not net any additional versatility or performance over what I have now.

If I knew for sure then I would definitely do this. Or if I get bored sometime I'll try one. Idk.



LastButNotLeast said:


> Or do it the old-fashioned way: run the positive lead from the left and right channels to the center. The disadvantage is that you have no separate control over the volume (unless, of course, you wire in a potentiometer).
> Michael


Umm, no.


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## dubwoofer

I love the insanity of this. It's just pure overkill.

How far do you sit from the screen, and how do you like the Center Stage UF material? I'm thinking about going AT in my next setup...


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## Scott Simonian

dubwoofer said:


> I love the insanity of this. It's just pure overkill.
> 
> How far do you sit from the screen, and how do you like the Center Stage UF material? I'm thinking about going AT in my next setup...


Hey, thanks!

I sit roughly 10 feet away and the screen is 110" wide (126" diag). I really like the UF material. It's just as good quality as their regular XD material (I had that before the UF) just that the weave pattern is MUCH smaller. You really do have to put your face against the material to see the gaps. You can barely see the pattern at all even about a foot away. At the seat, I don't see the weave pattern at all which is what I was going for. The old XD material I could just make out in full, bright white backgrounds at the same distance.

I would highly recommend the UF material. Just note that it is lower gain than the standard XD material.


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## GizzeGutten

Above awesome!  We have the same taste in crazy dynamics it seems.  I bet it sounds awesome in such a well treated room. I'm working on adding more acoustic remedies to my own room. On the wall behind me I have 2 feet deep stack of insulation from floor to ceiling and it really helped clean up that waterfall and improve the reverb of the room.

What exactly are you using for the 10" horn loaded midrange and what is the passband for that driver, please?


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## Scott Simonian

GizzeGutten said:


> Above awesome!  We have the same taste in crazy dynamics it seems.  I bet it sounds awesome in such a well treated room. I'm working on adding more acoustic remedies to my own room. On the wall behind me I have 2 feet deep stack of insulation from floor to ceiling and it really helped clean up that waterfall and improve the reverb of the room.
> 
> What exactly are you using for the 10" horn loaded midrange and what is the passband for that driver, please?


Thanks! Haha, yes we do! You can tell when someone is serious about dynamics and uncompressed output because their system will look like yours or mine. 


The hornloaded midrange is a kit from Wayne Parham of Pi Speakers. Here's a link: http://audioroundtable.com/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=16581

The driver is an Eminence Delta10.

I use it between the JBL's and high frequency horn. The bandwidth is roughly 300hz to 1.2khz of which I can change as I'm fully active. I got the best response (at the time of installation) with these frequency bookends and stuck with it. I could very well run the HF lower and/or the JBL's higher... or whatever. Because it's a sealed rear chamber, I could run the midhorn full range but it will run out of throw below 100hz at high levels. In fact, once I messed up some settings and watched quite a few movies near reference with the JBL's effectively off and the midhorn doing all the work.  I thought things sounded quite off til I found the problem and fixed it.  But it held up!


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## GizzeGutten

Haha, yes! The danger of a system like this is it will sound good all the way to total deafness. 

Thanks for sharing the details. That's a very interesting horn, and I think I understand why you are using it drawing from my own experience with 2226 crossed too high. We have the same pass band for the mid too. I found that the addition of a dedicated midrange driver elevated the perceived tightness and clarity vastly. Speaking to the choir here, but one part of the tactile feel is the actual punch, another thing is the sound of the punch. 2226 is a beast driver at producing the tactile punch, but the 10" driver makes sure that the punch sounds as tight as it's felt.  It's not just in terms of punch though, voices etc are reproduced better. Less muffled sort of.

Haha, good thing it didn't break. I've had my fair share of mistakes too, sometimes even without noticing. Like forgetting to turn on the subs and thinking the bass is as awesome as ever 

For music listening I bet that all of your sealed 2226's can do a very nice job even without subs. I high pass them whenever things are going to be pushed. Getting more drivers added has the benefit of avoiding that high pass. I recall seeing that was one of the design goals you had with all the drivers too, no?


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## Scott Simonian

GizzeGutten said:


> Haha, yes! The danger of a system like this is it will sound good all the way to total deafness.
> 
> Thanks for sharing the details. That's a very interesting horn, and I think I understand why you are using it drawing from my own experience with 2226 crossed too high. We have the same pass band for the mid too. I found that the addition of a dedicated midrange driver elevated the perceived tightness and clarity vastly. Speaking to the choir here, but one part of the tactile feel is the actual punch, another thing is the sound of the punch. 2226 is a beast driver at producing the tactile punch, but the 10" driver makes sure that the punch sounds as tight as it's felt.  It's not just in terms of punch though, voices etc are reproduced better. Less muffled sort of.
> 
> Haha, good thing it didn't break. I've had my fair share of mistakes too, sometimes even without noticing. Like forgetting to turn on the subs and thinking the bass is as awesome as ever
> 
> For music listening I bet that all of your sealed 2226's can do a very nice job even without subs. I high pass them whenever things are going to be pushed. Getting more drivers added has the benefit of avoiding that high pass. I recall seeing that was one of the design goals you had with all the drivers too, no?


Yes, I can get very good bass with all the subs off. But I cheat, I sum the LFE channel to ALL of the 15's.  

Your cabs for your 2226's look extremely similar in size to mine. With room gains they are surprisingly flat down below 20hz. I have watched some stuff and you can get some serious bass from just some "pro" midbasses. I wouldn't recommend it for a real, serious system but they can hang. Definitely. I do not run any high pass filters at all. I do use bass management of course and that is handled by the Yamaha.

I don't have a ton of personal hands-on experience with horn speakers. This is my first but I have heard a lot of them. I came straight from passive 2-way speakers with a dome tweeter to full bore full active, multi-way horn-loaded mains. A BIG STEP UP!! Not for the inexperienced or faint of heart. Read up and studied for years before making the jump. I don't regret it.

Most find the midrange horn a rather odd choice but it does exactly what I wanted. I wanted controlled directivity down as low as possible. Wanted as much vocal range to be covered with horn speakers. You're right about punch! People think it is all sorts of things and rarely the right combination of things. Heheh. I can get as close as possible with this gear but the only work I can do now to improve that is to get a whole new environment than my little domestic room.


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## LTD02

hey scott, just realized that i didn't make a mention...it all looks great. i was going to ask where you ended up for the midhorn frequency response, but i see that you covered that. anything left to improve or have you finally *arrived*?


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## Scott Simonian

LTD02 said:


> hey scott, just realized that i didn't make a mention...it all looks great. i was going to ask where you ended up for the midhorn frequency response, but i see that you covered that. anything left to improve or have you finally *arrived*?


Hey, John! Thank for dropping a line.

Yeah, that is how I've been using the midrange and fairly happy with the results so I have not really bothered tinkering with it all. Is it perfect? No. But if I got to the point where I don't care to fiddle with it and just content with it.... that's right where I wanted to be. Super anal perfectionists need not apply to my setup. I put a lot of thought into every little bit of this setup but there is a point of enough is enough. Happy is the goal and I'm there.

For the most part.  Of course there are ALL SORTS of things I'd like to continue doing but yes, for the first time in a decade I feel complete. Now it's more so small details to touch on than big sweeping strokes.

For instance, I'd LOVE to put even more bass in here. But what's the point? I'm handicapped by the electrical system that I can not upgrade (can't do it) so no point going with even more subs. And what if I do get more subs? I'd need to add at least four or more to even notice and it would be such a negligible difference. I'm already smoothing the bass response and have subs in nearly every spot of the room save for the ceiling. Seriously thinking about putting some up there but again...what's the point? 

I'd love matching speakers all around but I can't physically fit them. I've thought about that A LOT! Hahah. No... now I seriously need a bigger room to do what I want to do from here. And I've got plans for that but it won't happen any time soon.


There are things that will change though. I will be upgrading the Yamaha 3050 to the 5100 pre/pro this next week. My friend is selling his and I'll just sell the 3050 to pay it off. This is "forcing" me to get an external amp for my surrounds so I've already got another nu4-6000 on the way and should be here tomorrow.

On that note, been thinking about Volt10's all around (surrounds/heights). Might start with a pair or two for the side and rear surrounds. Then more for heights.

Beyond that? Highly likely that I'll pick up a UHD BD player once Panasonic releases theirs. Unless it turns out that having an HDCP 2.2 pre/pro isn't enough and I'll get locked out of playback. My projector isn't old but it isn't HDCP 2.2 afaik. Hopefully I'll get a 1080p picture from UHD BD's but with their Atmos sound. That's why I'd get the format. For the immersive audio releases.

Still thinking of a new couch. The ones I want are expensive. The ones that aren't so bad won't fit. So I'm stuck with this folded up mattress futon thing which I'm not a fan of.

So yeah. Not much new on the horizon. The next big step would be a whole new room.


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## LTD02

congrats on the 5100. what is your buddy upgrading _to_?


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## Scott Simonian

I think he is getting the Denon 7200 so he can test DTS:X right away. Haha! Really, it's more of a side-grade than an upgrade. 

The Yamaha's aren't getting DTS:X for another month.


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## GizzeGutten

Second that. Congrats on the 5100. I've got the 5000, so no atmos, no X, but it's doing a very good job. Only thing that bothers me insanely is that LFE is RCA, but 5100 has XLR's. Also wish it had more flexibility with the sub management filters and the XO point & slopes, and while we're at it I'd love digital outputs for every channel, but I guess we can't have it all.


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## Scott Simonian

GizzeGutten said:


> Second that. Congrats on the 5100. I've got the 5000, so no atmos, no X, but it's doing a very good job. Only thing that bothers me insanely is that LFE is RCA, but 5100 has XLR's. Also wish it had more flexibility with the sub management filters and the XO point & slopes, and while we're at it I'd love digital outputs for every channel, but I guess we can't have it all.


Yeah, I had quite a beef with the design of the 5000. No XLR jack for the subwoofers?!? WTF?!?! 

A tragic oversight. Thankfully rectified with the 5100 which does and is fully supported by Dolby Atmos and will soon have DTS:X support as well. 

I love this 3050 but the 5100 will top it just. Will hang onto it until it either dies (unlikely) or whenever Yamaha makes a 9.1.6 equivalent of it.


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## Scott Simonian

*New gear added!*


Picked up a Yamaha CX-A5100 pre/pro last week to replace the 3050 receiver.

In light of moving from a receiver to a pre/pro, I was in need of additional power for the surrounds speakers. Picked up second Behringer NU4-6000 4ch amplifier and now have it powering the side and rear surrounds.


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## NorthSky

Scott Simonian said:


> *New gear added!*
> 
> Picked up a Yamaha CX-A5100 pre/pro last week to replace the 3050 receiver.
> 
> In light of moving from a receiver to a pre/pro, I was in need of additional power for the surrounds speakers. Picked up second Behringer NU4-6000 4ch amplifier and now have it powering the side and rear surrounds.


Congrats Scott. I'll be following your coming comments and comparisons...makes life exciting.  

* Yamaha is built to last. Just too sad that it doesn't offer Auro-3D.


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## Rich May

Did you build this in a bunker?


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## Scott Simonian

Rich May said:


> Did you build this in a bunker?


Spare bedroom.


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## Kain

Scott,

How do you like your Center Stage UF screen? How far do you sit from it and are you able to view any screen artifacts and/or the actual screen material during bright scenes?


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## Scott Simonian

Kain said:


> Scott,
> 
> How do you like your Center Stage UF screen? How far do you sit from it and are you able to view any screen artifacts and/or the actual screen material during bright scenes?


I love it! It was an upgrade from my previous screen material which was their Center Stage XD material. I very much liked it but I could see the pattern from where I sat. At the time I was ~9.5ft from a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen. The size was fine but I could definitely see the weave on very bright and more solid white scenes. I sit roughly 10ft away from this screen which is much larger. About 126" diagonal 16:9. I do not see the pattern anymore. The overall gain is a little bit lower but I also got a new projector and honestly don't notice any drop in brightness. But the "featureless" screen is just what I wanted. Plus the material was stretchy (the XD was not) and that made putting the material up easier so that's a win. And it cost less than $300. Can't argue with that price and the results! 

I've seen all sorts of high-end brand name screens. All sorts. This looks better than all of them and I don't say that simply from bias. I'm in a happy place where I'm not left wanting a better screen. Ever.


BTW - if you are curious about the material, contact SeymourAV and request a sample. They will send out a rather small one for free (I think) but you can get a 24"x24" one for like $10-20.


----------



## Kain

Scott Simonian said:


> I love it! It was an upgrade from my previous screen material which was their Center Stage XD material. I very much liked it but I could see the pattern from where I sat. At the time I was ~9.5ft from a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen. The size was fine but I could definitely see the weave on very bright and more solid white scenes. I sit roughly 10ft away from this screen which is much larger. About 126" diagonal 16:9. I do not see the pattern anymore. The overall gain is a little bit lower but I also got a new projector and honestly don't notice any drop in brightness. But the "featureless" screen is just what I wanted. Plus the material was stretchy (the XD was not) and that made putting the material up easier so that's a win. And it cost less than $300. Can't argue with that price and the results!
> 
> I've seen all sorts of high-end brand name screens. All sorts. This looks better than all of them and I don't say that simply from bias. I'm in a happy place where I'm not left wanting a better screen. Ever.


Thanks! 

Do you think this screen would be good for a 8 ft viewing distance?


----------



## Scott Simonian

I think so. 

That was something I tried out when I first got it installed. Really couldn't see ANY weave pattern until I had my face right up on it. Before then, I could start to see some pixel structure and pixel gap (even with LCoS) so ... I'd say you could get away at that distance.


----------



## Kain

Great, thanks.


----------



## coolrda

Scott Simonian said:


> I love it! It was an upgrade from my previous screen material which was their Center Stage XD material. I very much liked it but I could see the pattern from where I sat. At the time I was ~9.5ft from a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen. The size was fine but I could definitely see the weave on very bright and more solid white scenes. I sit roughly 10ft away from this screen which is much larger. About 126" diagonal 16:9. I do not see the pattern anymore. The overall gain is a little bit lower but I also got a new projector and honestly don't notice any drop in brightness. But the "featureless" screen is just what I wanted. Plus the material was stretchy (the XD was not) and that made putting the material up easier so that's a win. And it cost less than $300. Can't argue with that price and the results!
> 
> I've seen all sorts of high-end brand name screens. All sorts. This looks better than all of them and I don't say that simply from bias. I'm in a happy place where I'm not left wanting a better screen. Ever.
> 
> 
> BTW - if you are curious about the material, contact SeymourAV and request a sample. They will send out a rather small one for free (I think) but you can get a 24"x24" one for like $10-20.


I love the XD except for the grain issue. Tried to order this but it was new and delayed and I couldn't wait. I knew the XD would somewhat handicap the viewing experience as I'm at 10 feet as well. I concur on the mounting of the XD material. On a curved screen it's almost impossible. Ive remounted my three times and it's still not perfect. That's doing it by the book. Any difference in sound quality/attenuation?


----------



## Kain

One more question. 

What do you think of your wooden riser(?) for your seating? Does it help with feeling the bass? Do you have a solid concrete room? My room is solid concrete on all sides with a tiled floor. Would you recommend I use one too?


----------



## Scott Simonian

coolrda said:


> I love the XD except for the grain issue. Tried to order this but it was new and delayed and I couldn't wait. I knew the XD would somewhat handicap the viewing experience as I'm at 10 feet as well. I concur on the mounting of the XD material. On a curved screen it's almost impossible. Ive remounted my three times and it's still not perfect. That's doing it by the book. Any difference in sound quality/attenuation?


Not any change I noticed. The XD "sounded" fine and the UF sounds the same to me. 

Do you buy the whole screen or just the material? Maybe swap out for the UF material so you don't have to see the weave pattern.



Kain said:


> One more question.
> 
> What do you think of your wooden riser(?) for your seating? Does it help with feeling the bass? Do you have a solid concrete room? My room is solid concrete on all sides with a tiled floor. Would you recommend I use one too?


Awesome. Yes. Yes. And of course, Yes. 

Just before installing the sub riser, I had gone across the country to experience some other members systems. Several of which had some form of transducer and/or nearfield subwoofer placement. Buttkickers do the job but I find them artificial. They can bring some serious grunt though. The Crowson actuator is my personal favorite. Feels very natural. My thoughts were that it was like being on a subwoofer in a good way. Where as the BK's kinda just kick your ass, literally. My feelings are of the sub riser that it's the best of both. I'm using beefy 18's so they can really belt out the bass but they can move a lot too. I like it. I did it because I had extra amps and two extra 18's and needed a riser so.... yeah. 

On concrete floors but with >12 18's in a room I was still moving the foundation pretty good. This is even better.

I would recommend it if it suits your needs. Otherwise, BK or Crowson and possible nearfield subs too. Lots of ways to attack the issue.


----------



## Kain

Great, thanks. 

How close does a subwoofer have to be to be considered nearfield?


----------



## Scott Simonian

That's a matter of opinion.

Some say it has to be a foot or less. Inches away would be preferable for those people. Mine are mere inches away and certainly conveys a presence.

Just depends on what you're trying to achieve.


----------



## LastButNotLeast

This:


----------



## coolrda

Scott Simonian said:


> Not any change I noticed. The XD "sounded" fine and the UF sounds the same to me.
> 
> Do you buy the whole screen or just the material? Maybe swap out for the UF material so you don't have to see the weave.


Sounds like the way to go. I just need the material. Added to the list.


----------



## coolrda

Kain said:


> Great, thanks.
> 
> How close does a subwoofer have to be to be considered nearfield?


Scott's presently awaiting medical board approval to have his extensive sub array surgically fused to his thoracic spine.


----------



## shivaji

Kain said:


> Great, thanks.
> 
> How close does a subwoofer have to be to be considered nearfield?


I would say, near field is anywhere where the subs are near the general vicinity of your sitting position. I have 2 subs, each one about a foot away from the side of the couch. I'd call that near field.


----------



## Rockerob

Kain said:


> Holy crap!


Let the juices flow


----------



## Kain

Got another question...

Is your equipment rack located in-room? If so, do you hear the fans in the pro-amps during use?

Edit: Noticed you have six ceiling speakers. Are you running x.x.6? If so, how is it with one row of seating? I've been told four ceiling speakers are plenty for one row of seating. Do your two additional ceiling speakers add to the experience even with one row of seating?


----------



## chrapladm

Scott do you have a drawing or build pictures of your sub-riser? And how much depth does your mains take up?

I will very slowly be building a 10ft x 16ft room. And it looks like I will do something similar for screen size and mains. My mains will be only single 15's but trying to maximize subwoofer space also.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Kain said:


> Got another question...
> 
> Is your equipment rack located in-room? If so, do you hear the fans in the pro-amps during use?
> 
> Edit: Noticed you have six ceiling speakers. Are you running x.x.6? If so, how is it with one row of seating? I've been told four ceiling speakers are plenty for one row of seating. Do your two additional ceiling speakers add to the experience even with one row of seating?


The equipment rack is in the room. Behind the couch is a closet (with the doors removed) that houses all the amplifiers, projector and pre/pro. Believe it or not, it's the projector that really makes most of the heat. The amp stack gets at worst 'warm'. Each and every amp is modded with quiet fans. Some more quiet than others. I can hear them just barely. It's not anywhere near as bad a stock. Ugh. But I can still hear them a bit. I think about modding some of the amps with even quieter ones but that requires more work than simply fixing a fan. So I haven't bothered. As this is said, the noisefloor is not too bad in my room. Could be better but better than most.

Yes, have run six overheads since September when I got Atmos. It is great with one row of seating. Mostly advantageous when sitting far off-axis at the edge of of the couch. 

However.... I have disabled the Atmos-EX processing and been listening to "conventional" 4ch Atmos/DTS:X sound for a couple months now.

Reason being... I want to remove the two extra receivers. Not because I didn't like the sound (actually Atmos-EX works splendidly) but because of other mostly ergonomic reasons.

First, I like using the Yamaha APP to control it and a real remote for the OPPO. Don't ask me why, I just like working that way. No interest in a universal remote (lots of experience with Harmony) for this room. Just... no. So each time I go into the room I have to separately power up the two extra AVR's which sometimes I forget and then wonder why the overhead sound isn't so great.   They also add a little bit of hiss but it's pretty minor. Still, rather have none. Another reason is that the chassis for both tend to creak every so often or a relay will click. It's not predictable and when I hear it (right behind my head) it's a real immersion killer. Last but not least, they both produce a significant amount of extra heat into a room. A room with poor A/C circulation, a stack of amps and a projector and is hit by the sun ALL g'damn day. Plus it's in the 110's in the summer. F**k all that! I could do with two less things producing more heat in this little room. On top of all that, it's just two less things that need power and all those extra hook ups. 

They are still in operation as they power all the presence speakers. I simply have them set to STEREO mode and are in full bypass. Eventually will remove both and in place will be a third iNuke 4-6000 amp. Sometime this year I'll do that. Would have done it already but I'm in debt after building an uber gaming PC. Smart move. Ugh. Broke as s**t.  

For whatever reason when I first got my Yamaha with Atmos, the 4ch presence speakers did not ever sound very good. Middle overhead to the rescue! Or so I thought.... after a while and lots of fiddling, I found that the overhead sound can be just as good with just four speakers. Sounds odd but I tried both for real and I can say I am extremely happy with the overhead sound. So much so that I really don't care anymore about 6ch heights. Really, it's not even a priority anymore. I feel a bit embarrassed as I hawked on and on and on about them and it really did sound good but I was able to get the same sound with four speakers so.... might as well keep it simple, yeah? Sound great! When the day comes that regular priced gear starts to support native 6ch overhead sound then I'll get back into it. For now... I'm good.


Sooo... yeah, it was totally cool but for reasons other than sound quality, it will all be disabled. I will leave the speakers above cuz... well, I can't be bothered taking them down.




chrapladm said:


> Scott do you have a drawing or build pictures of your sub-riser? And how much depth does your mains take up?
> 
> I will very slowly be building a 10ft x 16ft room. And it looks like I will do something similar for screen size and mains. My mains will be only single 15's but trying to maximize subwoofer space also.


Mains are about 18-20" deep with everything considered.

Here are the only pictures I've ever taken of the subriser. No drawings. Designed it in my head.


----------



## coolrda

Per wikipedia, the hottest places in the solar system are the surface of the sun, the sun side of mercury and the southern San Joaquin Valley. Good to hear about going to four Tops. Two weeks back I finally aligned mine with the MLP and what a huge difference that made. Now I'm pumped to get my matching surrounds done. Bro, you have got to get one of these. Heat es no bueno.


----------



## chrapladm

Scott do you have any integration problems or other anomalies with the riser sub where it sits?

I was always worried about the riser sub integrating with the rest of the subwoofer system. I still have a long way to go before I start anything but I am building a suspended floor also so I may not need the riser. Who knows.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Everything goes through one of three DCX's (except for surrounds/heights). It's all a matter of setting delays.

Suspended floor, eh? Yeah, maybe not but if you need a riser you could build a sub-less one.


----------



## chrapladm

My room will be in a garage. So I will build a room inside the existing structure. The floors will be regular framing on type of rubber sheets on top of the concrete floor. SO not sure how tall the framing for the floor will be but not to tall. Because I know I will have to use much bigger boards width wise for the ceiling. And I only have 8.85ft to start with.

Either way just trying to gain as much knowledge as I can. Definitely want to utilize the subwoofers as much as I can. not going to have 16 subs in my small room. Maybe 6 and thats it.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Yah. That's the great thing about this subwoofer riser. If you can accommodate it's own height, it doesn't really take up any space and houses at least two heavy duty 18's. It's very much effectively nearfield so throwing in another quad subs up front in farfield would be a pretty potent combo and take up (relatively) little space.

Good luck with your layout!


----------



## Scott Simonian

Made a big update to the thread. Finally started filling out some technical specifications about this system. This weekend I decided to add the (current) frequency response with LCR+LFE shown. Also displaying my tone controls for overall bass presentation. Also included is measurements of the tactile response of this system via Vibsensor app (Android).

More information about the system to come including details about bass system and the custom 3-way speaker up front making up a large portion of the bass wall. 

Enjoy.


----------



## coolrda

Scott Simonian said:


> *Main Frequency Response
> 
> *_notes included in photo
> 
> _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _**as of 7/16/2016**
> 
> _*Bass Tone Control
> 
> *_I can't to go by with just ONE bass response. Some movies just need that bit more bass and sometimes there is one that needs to be tamed a bit. Or maybe I just feel like having more or less depending on my mood. With much trial and error I found that simply adjusting the BASS TONE CONTROL on the Yamaha to bet the most convenient and useful way to manage my need for changing the response on-the-fly. This next graph shows the effects of this tone control (only CC shown) and it's total range.
> 
> Notes included in photo.
> 
> _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> **frequency response shown as of 7/16/2016**
> 
> 
> *Tactile Response
> 
> *_This information is related to the TACTILE RESPONSE of this system. These measurements were taken from a Nexus 7 tablet using the VIBSENSOR app available on the Android market (iOS also available). Essentially this information is showing the response shape and power of the TACTILE RESPONSE which is different from the above FREQUENCY RESPONSE graphs. Frequency response, as you know, is the audible range measured. These tactile response graphs show how you FEEL the bass. Frequency response shows you what you HEAR.
> 
> For more information about Vibsensor and the topic of TACTILE RESPONSE see this thread: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...8090-vibsensor-accelerometer-test-thread.html
> 
> 
> _
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler


At first I thought that graph came from JPL. Magnificent.


----------



## LastButNotLeast

I've been reconsidering "house curve" in light of current readings and findings about tactile response and mid-bass modules. My thinking (perhaps incorrect ) is that the "improvements" we've been able to make in low bass reproduction has "drowned out" some of the midbass.
The "traditional" house curve starts around 50Hz and increases lower bass 6dB to 10dB to the bottom limit of the subs. I think your graphs represent a better concept of our target now: starting at about 100Hz, up the same 6dB to 10dB and flat to the lower limit of the subs.
I have found that even with my not-very-exotic system, the sound is more appealing to me. 
Thoughts?
Michael


----------



## Scott Simonian

LastButNotLeast said:


> I've been reconsidering "house curve" in light of current readings and findings about tactile response and mid-bass modules. My thinking (perhaps incorrect ) is that the "improvements" we've been able to make in low bass reproduction has "drowned out" some of the midbass.
> The "traditional" house curve starts around 50Hz and increases lower bass 6dB to 10dB to the bottom limit of the subs. I think your graphs represent a better concept of our target now: starting at about 100Hz, up the same 6dB to 10dB and flat to the lower limit of the subs.
> I have found that even with my not-very-exotic system, the sound is more appealing to me.
> Thoughts?
> Michael



Well... if you want more midbass, you'll have to increase those frequencies. 50hz and below is _not_ midbass. Soo... 

I've actually updated my FR, once again, after staring at the new pics of it were posted. Flattened the bump at 70hz (which I think I liked) and filled in the dip ~150hz. 

I'll repost those pics sometime later.


The traditional "house curve" is fun and pleasant at first which is why a lot of people do it. After a while and with such a poweful subwoofer system, it gets tiring and some stuff just sounds "too heavy". So that's why I chronicled (lol) the whole bass control range cuz I find that I need that sort of control over the overall bass presentation.


----------



## LastButNotLeast

So maybe you can help out here:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...-bass-suggestions-demo-disc.html#post45587473

Michael


----------



## jbdawson

Hey Scott be honest how many sound disturbance calls have you had? 

Lol


----------



## Nightlord

jbdawson said:


> Hey Scott be honest how many sound disturbance calls have you had?
> 
> Lol


That's not the proper measurement for a bass system - it's how many false earthquake tremors reported from the nearest seismograph he's had.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Only a couple of complaints but that was before I built the "mega system" even (receiver power and only two 18's) and when my closest neighbors kids were still infant/toddler age. 

In the past couple of years...no complaints.


I can not confirm or deny that I have induced many several a few earthquakes in my area.


----------



## DS-21

Hey Scott, I'm curious about your overhead speakers. There's a pretty big headroom drop-off from your surrounds to your heights: 8" 3-way to 5.25" 2-way. And obviously a gigantic drop-off from your front speakers to your heights.

Have you ever heard anything to make you think you need more capability up there? If not, that means I could probably get away with 4" concentrics for height at the volume levels I listen. That makes going from 7.1 to 7.1.4 channel much more practicable...


----------



## Scott Simonian

DS-21 said:


> Hey Scott, I'm curious about your overhead speakers. There's a pretty big headroom drop-off from your surrounds to your heights: 8" 3-way to 5.25" 2-way. And obviously a gigantic drop-off from your front speakers to your heights.
> 
> Have you ever heard anything to make you think you need more capability up there? If not, that means I could probably get away with 4" concentrics for height at the volume levels I listen. That makes going from 7.1 to 7.1.4 channel much more practicable...


Excellent question!

Yes, it is quite noticeable. Especially with the Emo surrounds as heights. Realistically a near 20dB gap in overall sensitivity from front mains to the Emo overheads. Yes, there have been several times when I have nearly overloaded them with overhead content that was of high level. Some people think that the heights/overheads don't get much of strong signals but they do and these speaker locations should be treated like every other speaker in the system. Should be noted that I have never overloaded them in the past listening at or near reference levels when used as conventional surrounds. Also, I cross them at 80hz like the rest. I could probably get less distortion from them in these events if I pushed that higher but I like to keep this crossover as a global setting. Things sound more alike that way to me.

I've been planning on relocating the front pair of overhead speakers. They are physically the furthest speaker from the MLP yet they are the least sensitive. I mounted them as such because it was easy. It will require some new light construction to mount them where I'd prefer them to be but this will allow me to drop their levels down 4-5dB and that should be enough to stop them from being overloaded from time to time, I think.

I'm only using them because they are free as I already owned them.  At some point I'd like to upgrade ALL of the surrounds and overheads to identical speakers. Not sure what I'll do. The cheapest route would be another pair of JBL 8330's (have a third pair in storage) and just use those too but they are pretty heavy. Was thinking eight Volt10's would be cool and not too expensive relatively.


So to answer your question, you might be able to get away with 4" KEF's but I'd probably cross them a bit higher. Which in your case might be alright because you usually have high quality, low inductance-type subs all over. Not super sure about reference with those but for 99% of the time and at sane levels...I think you would be alright.


My JBL 8330's seem to hang just fine. They are _very_ close to the seats though so that helps a lot.


----------



## Mashie Saldana

Scott, I think you need to upgrade to 13 active 3way speakers, nothing else will do at this stage.


----------



## DS-21

Scott Simonian said:


> Yes, it is quite noticeable. Especially with the Emo surrounds as heights. Realistically a near 20dB gap in overall sensitivity from front mains to the Emo overheads. Yes, there have been several times when I have nearly overloaded them with overhead content that was of high level. Some people think that the heights/overheads don't get much of strong signals but they do and these speaker locations should be treated like every other speaker in the system.


Thanks for the detailed answer, Scott!


----------



## Scott Simonian

Mashie Saldana said:


> Scott, I think you need to upgrade to 13 active 3way speakers, nothing else will do at this stage.


Heh! Yeah, that would be pretty cool. Dunno about ALL of them being active. Would be a big PITA but fun...maybe. I could definitely "settle" with beefy coax's for overhead and surrounds. Right now I have enough extra JBL 2226's that I could make identical speakers all around with dual 15's and use four overheads with a single 15". In that case it would be 7ch active 3-way and four passive speakers up on the ceiling. 



DS-21 said:


> Thanks for the detailed answer, Scott!


Hey, no problem. Good luck!


----------



## coolrda

I see your going from 6 to 4 overheads? Is 4 the better solution or good enough? Throw some Volt 10's up there?

That riser needs some skin, pronto. Ok, thats as much of your money that I feel comfortable budgeting in this month. I got a late start. Don't worry, I'll make up for it next month.


----------



## Scott Simonian

coolrda said:


> I see your going from 6 to 4 overheads? Is 4 the better solution or good enough? Throw some Volt 10's up there?
> 
> That riser needs some skin, pronto. Ok, thats as much of your money that I feel comfortable budgeting in this month. I got a late start. Don't worry, I'll make up for it next month.


Heheh. Yeah.... if only you knew how broke I have been this year.  

But... sure. I've thought about covering up the riser but... I can't be bothered. I'm usually in the room alone and it doesn't bother me. I'm so short my feet don't really reach the floor of the riser when I slouch back in the sh**ty futon anyway. 

Volt10's all around are my preferred "affordable" solution. No money to afford them so....

Rather get a UHD player at this point.

Yes, four overheads is both good enough and "better". Planned on swapping out my two ancient receivers powering my overheads with just some four channel amp so when I do that it will be "better" for ergonomic reasons. Six channels works and sounded good but I got the same sound from four so I'm going with four. Easier to process. Less cables. Less headaches. Most people have no idea what it's like to get to my equipment rack. If they knew... they'd understand.


----------



## LORDSANSUI

Cool system.

Grats


----------



## wse

Scott Simonian said:


> Yah. That's the great thing about this subwoofer riser. If you can accommodate it's own height, it doesn't really take up any space and houses at least two heavy duty 18's. It's very much effectively nearfield so throwing in another quad subs up front in farfield would be a pretty potent combo and take up (relatively) little space.
> 
> Good luck with your layout!


The sound must be massive Now all you need is to decorate the room


----------



## Scott Simonian

wse said:


> The sound must be massive Now all you need is to decorate the room


Covering every square inch in blackout velvet is the plan.


----------



## BP1Fanatic

Awesome system!


----------



## starcat

Hi Scott, nice setup, well done! 
Do you by any chance have a link to your "(4x) Dual Opposed sealed 18" subwoofer (DIY - Stereo Integrity HT18d4)"? 

Thanks much!


----------



## Scott Simonian

starcat said:


> Hi Scott, nice setup, well done!
> Do you by any chance have a link to your "(4x) Dual Opposed sealed 18" subwoofer (DIY - Stereo Integrity HT18d4)"?
> 
> Thanks much!


Hi, starcat.

Sorry, there was never any real build thread for any of my current gear. Just...never bothered. There isn't much to the dual opposed enclosures I built. 1" MDF baffles and 3/4" MDF walls. Single brace. R13 lined. That's it. Nothing special and pretty much bare minimum.

This is the best I can provide for that: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-diy-speakers-subs/1505963-here-s-lil-tease-what-s-come.html

Lots of collecting of parts and some construction pics in there.


----------



## awediophile

I was wondering: It looks like your frequency response shelves down about 6 dB below 12 Hz or so. Is that because of your personal preference or other issues like signal chain roll-off?


----------



## Scott Simonian

awediophile said:


> I was wondering: It looks like your frequency response shelves down about 6 dB below 12 Hz or so. Is that because of your personal preference or other issues like signal chain roll-off?


A little bit of both. 

I've long had solid extension down to the upper single digits. Even with my previous dual LLT system. The sealed system does require some boost to make it flat though. For a while I was really pushing it with ~15dB of boost!  Enough to make it flat to 5hz but... I actually didn't like it. Sure, it was "cool" for those effects but a lot of the time the system's tone was just too heavy. I didn't enjoy the sound and it was wasting so much amplifier headroom. Decided to take off some 6dB worth of boost and left it there. Rather have 6dB of extra headroom everywhere than some extra ULF "awesomeness" sometimes occasionally rarely. And there is where I have left the FR for the bass. Mostly...

In an ideal world (system) I'd like to have the system flat to 2-3hz or something but in this case I compromised some for more overall SPL and that I enjoy (and paid a f**k ton for in sweat, blood, tears, time and money). :laugh:


----------



## Ruckus55

Scott Simonian said:


> In an ideal world (system) I'd like to have the system flat to 2-3hz or something but in this case I compromised some for more overall SPL and that I enjoy (and paid a f**k ton for in sweat, blood, tears, time and money). :laugh:


Im willing to pay in blood and tears, mainly tears. BUt the rest of it, especially the money seems to be the problem.


----------



## lukeamdman

Scott Simonian said:


> in this case I compromised some for more overall SPL and that I enjoy (and paid a f**k ton for in sweat, blood, tears, time and money). :laugh:


Blasphemy!!


----------



## Crunchyriff

Scott- Your L/C/R rig reminds me many years ago when I had three full Marshall stacks setup in my den between gigs...hehehehe. I love it.


----------



## coolrda

Scott Simonian said:


> A little bit of both.
> 
> I've long had solid extension down to the upper single digits. Even with my previous dual LLT system. The sealed system does require some boost to make it flat though. For a while I was really pushing it with ~15dB of boost!  Enough to make it flat to 5hz but... I actually didn't like it. Sure, it was "cool" for those effects but a lot of the time the system's tone was just too heavy. I didn't enjoy the sound and it was wasting so much amplifier headroom. Decided to take off some 6dB worth of boost and left it there. Rather have 6dB of extra headroom everywhere than some extra ULF "awesomeness" sometimes occasionally rarely. And there is where I have left the FR for the bass. Mostly...
> 
> In an ideal world (system) I'd like to have the system flat to 2-3hz or something but in this case I compromised some for more overall SPL and that I enjoy (and paid a f**k ton for in sweat, blood, tears, time and money). :laugh:


What is up!

I hear ya brutha. Ok...you can pile on now Luke.


----------



## Shreds

Oops, wrong section...


----------



## Scott Simonian

Shreds said:


> Oops, wrong section...


Bye?


----------



## Scott Simonian

coolrda said:


> What is up!
> 
> I hear ya brutha. Ok...you can pile on now Luke.


Hey!

I never saw this post. Sorry, man.

Yeah....about that quoted post. I still have extension to the single digits. They are just a bit lower in intensity than the rest of the bass. Still present, definitely. Just doesn't sound as badass to say I'm down 6-8db. Whatever.


----------



## coolrda

Scott Simonian said:


> Hey!
> 
> I never saw this post. Sorry, man.
> 
> Yeah....about that quoted post. I still have extension to the single digits. They are just a bit lower in intensity than the rest of the bass. Still present, definitely. Just doesn't sound as badass to say I'm down 6-8db. Whatever.


No Worries. I'm with you on this. Lost my good mid bass because of chasing the ULF extremes. Everything you said is dead on. I stopped using Dynamic EQ and everything is back to normal and it sounds a ton better.


----------



## kgveteran

Hahahahaha i got a stupid futon too


----------



## javanpohl

Scott Simonian said:


> BTW - if you are curious about the material, contact SeymourAV and request a sample. They will send out a rather small one for free (I think) but you can get a 24"x24" one for like $10-20.


Hey Scott, I've been trying to find the answer to this lately with no luck and I imagine you might be one to know--was Seymour screens started by that guy that had the epic thread for his garage home theater (main picture always seemed to be that clown fish on the screen) where he completely built his own steel-framed curved screen? *edit: in case anyone else was curious about this, it was SMX screens "Sandman's theater" build thread. Apparently the guy was a crook and took off with a bunch of money that people gave him for order deposits. The build thread has also been gutted. Damn shame, all of that.*

Been trying to find that thread lately but not having any luck (though I wouldn't be too surprised if he took it down seeing as it started a screen company yet gave everyone all the info they needed to build their own). Want to look into how to build a 4-way masking system and thought he might have info on it.

Also, six overheads to four... interesting. I finally went from .2 to .4 and I'm finding various pro/cons for both. I'd like to think .6 would be all pros and no cons, but I suppose we'll see when we get a true (and affordable) .6 pre-pro offering (don't let us down Emotiva!!)


----------



## Scott Simonian

javanpohl said:


> Hey Scott, I've been trying to find the answer to this lately with no luck and I imagine you might be one to know--was Seymour screens started by that guy that had the epic thread for his garage home theater (main picture always seemed to be that clown fish on the screen) where he completely built his own steel-framed curved screen?
> 
> Been trying to find that thread lately but not having any luck (though I wouldn't be too surprised if he took it down seeing as it started a screen company yet gave everyone all the info they needed to build their own). Want to look into how to build a 4-way masking system and thought he might have info on it.
> 
> Also, six overheads to four... interesting. I finally went from .2 to .4 and I'm finding various pro/cons for both. I'd like to think .6 would be all pros and no cons, but I suppose we'll see when we get a true (and affordable) .6 pre-pro offering (don't let us down Emotiva!!)


Context, Javanpohl. Context.

My 6ch overhead system was derived from post-processing "Scatmos". It's not native 6ch overhead. So it's hard to say "should be all pro's, no con's". It's not a fair comparison Nothing really supports more than two pairs of overheads now. I might like it if it were native.

Moving from 2 to 4 is completely different.


No, sorry. I am not familiar with the thread you are remembering. It's been such a long time. I just know that they SeymourAV guys are awesome and I will continue to purchase from them and recommend them to others.


----------



## Nightlord

Scott Simonian said:


> Hey!
> 
> I never saw this post. Sorry, man.
> 
> Yeah....about that quoted post. I still have extension to the single digits. They are just a bit lower in intensity than the rest of the bass. Still present, definitely. Just doesn't sound as badass to say I'm down 6-8db. Whatever.


I may be the odd one here, but I'm actually more impressed by your room than the extension itself, myself I've had to dial back solely because I will have too much interaction from things in the room or the room itself at those frequencies... Currently I've shut off the infra-boost card in my active crossover even.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Nightlord said:


> I may be the odd one here, but I'm actually more impressed by your room than the extension itself, myself I've had to dial back solely because I will have too much interaction from things in the room or the room itself at those frequencies... Currently I've shut off the infra-boost card in my active crossover even.


The house complains quite a bit, believe me. The real deep stuff causes certain things to buzz, creak or rattle. Higher SPL higher frequency bass does too. 

The louder I go the more house noises go with the sound. Ugh. I hate it. I need a concrete bunker for my HT.


----------



## javanpohl

Scott Simonian said:


> Context, Javanpohl. Context.
> 
> My 6ch overhead system was derived from post-processing "Scatmos". It's not native 6ch overhead. So it's hard to say "should be all pro's, no con's". It's not a fair comparison Nothing really supports more than two pairs of overheads now. I might like it if it were native.
> 
> Moving from 2 to 4 is completely different.


Yes, I was aware that you were using Scatmos--I didn't think you had the Trinnov Altitude

Did you think going from 2 to 4 was a much bigger difference than 4 to 6?


----------



## Scott Simonian

javanpohl said:


> Yes, I was aware that you were using Scatmos--I didn't think you had the Trinnov Altitude
> 
> Did you think going from 2 to 4 was a much bigger difference than 4 to 6?


I never had just one pair of overheads. I started with six and went to four.

I can tell you that having four is worth it. A single pair only allows stereo overhead imaging. A front and rear pair allows full 360 imaging overhead.


Yes, I'd imagine going to four would be a worthy upgrade. I wouldn't do anything less unless I had no choice.


----------



## Kain

Scott,

With all those pro amps in-room, do you have any issue with fan noise being too intrusive?


----------



## Scott Simonian

Kain said:


> Scott,
> 
> With all those pro amps in-room, do you have any issue with fan noise being too intrusive?


Yes and no. 

There are many and they are quite close, only a few feet away. All the amplifiers with fans have been modified with quieter fans but I can still hear them slightly when the noise floor drops to nothing. It's not really an issue as you can't hear them during normal playback. 

I can tell when the amps are on from off during pure silence but it's all inaudible when actually listening to anything.


----------



## Scott Simonian

So Photobucket decided to kick the bucket. Pun intended.

Pictures should work in post 1 and 2 now.


----------



## Waboman

Scott Simonian said:


> So Photobucket decided to kick the bucket. Pun intended.
> 
> Pictures should work in post 1 and 2 now.


Yeah, photobucket in their infinite wisdom wants $40 a month to allow embedding pics. Horrible business decision. Anyway, what image hosting site are you using now? I'm using flicker now, but don't like their app.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Waboman said:


> Yeah, photobucket in their infinite wisdom wants $40 a month to allow embedding pics. Horrible business decision. Anyway, what image hosting site are you using now? I'm using flicker now, but don't like their app.


Trying out Imgur with this set. 

So far, so good.


----------



## Waboman

Scott Simonian said:


> Trying out Imgur with this set.
> 
> So far, so good.


Trying it now. You get to be my Imgur guinea pig. 


Spoiler


----------



## Scott Simonian

Waboman said:


> Trying it now. You get to be my Imgur guinea pig.
> 
> 
> Spoiler


Ooo! I'll have to find a bottle of that stuff.


----------



## coolrda

Is this the men's dressing room? Btw, sick FR and TR. I just had to take a quick peek as I'm suffering from riser withdrawal.


----------



## Scott Simonian

coolrda said:


> .... as I'm suffering from riser withdrawal.


Watched Skull Island the other night...

Had to turn DOWN the subriser, there was so much TAC-TILE!


----------



## Droogne

Scott Simonian said:


> Watched Skull Island the other night...
> 
> Had to turn DOWN the subriser, there was so much TAC-TILE!


Hey

I have some questions about the riser. I'm looking into building something like this myself (need to raise the couch as I cant lower my tv). I assume it's a sealed box? How did you figure out the dimensions and drivers (also what drivers did you use?). Why did you choose to go with a subwoofer and not some bass transducers? Would you say it's better than transducers? 

Preety neat setup by the way! You inspire me


----------



## vitaminbass

Not much activity in here for awhile...I had kinda the same question. If I understand correctly his primary subs are sealed, and so is the riser. I would think mixing these types could cause issues otherwise...

You could go ported and do the same thing but would likely take a larger box or a smaller driver, assuming you wanted to tune it low...


----------



## jdhelaman

I'm sure that many of you have already run into this situation as I just have. I was looking at the AVS Forum where analysis is made of equipment and found a list of the equipment that has Dolby Vision or will be receiving a firmware that will update their equipment with firmware. As you can imagine, I was very disappointed to find out the my RX-A3050 will not be receiving a firmware with the Dolby Vision. I went through this same thing in 2015 when I found our that my RX-A3010 did not have the specifications needed to run my equipment with the standards at that time. I spent about $2,000 for the RX-A3010, and then another $2,000 for the RX-A3050. Is there another option so that we poor retired folks don't have to spend another $2,000 for the RX-A3060 or 70? I'm just an old man of 70, but I have not lost my eyesight nor my hearing (yet, no thanks to my wife, children, and grandchildren) and like many of you, I want to have great presentation in sight an sound. I love these new 4K movies, but if they are going to be in Dolby Vision, I'll have to go to Tom Selleck and pull out the equity of my home and use it to upgrade my theater, and no, my children or grandchildren are not going to inherit anything, because if there is any money or property left, my wife and I plan on dying in Tahiti on the beach. (my wife is going to be 69 March 4th and she is still a babe. Did I tell you my eyesight is still good and thank goodness, Viagra is still available.)
Let me know what you all are going to do about Dolby Vision and any other upgrade that we won't get a firmware. Thanks, and the best to you guys. You are the best.


----------



## Marc Alexander

@jdhelaman it is possible that Yamaha could provide an update to support DV. Although chances are slim, once D+M provides the update for their 2015 we should know yay or nay with Yamaha. If nay, they may lose some loyal customers (a 2015/16 D+M is not too expensive). I moved to D+M in 2015.

Checkout the HDFury AVR Key and Vertex solutions for splitting HDMI and bypassing your AVR for DV. I use the Vertex and it works properly with DV. If you are not aware, UHD Blu-ray players (other than Xbox) already have dual HDMI outs for this very purpose. So you only need an HDFury for devices with one HDMI output like Chromecast Ultra.


----------



## jdhelaman

Marc Alexander said:


> @jdhelaman it is possible that Yamaha could provide an update to support DV. Although chances are slim, once D+M provides the update for their 2015 we should know yay or nay with Yamaha. If nay, they may lose some loyal customers (a 2015/16 D+M is not too expensive). I moved to D+M in 2015.
> 
> Checkout the HDFury AVR Key and Vertex solutions for splitting HDMI and bypassing your AVR for DV. I use the Vertex and it works properly with DV. If you are not aware, UHD Blu-ray players (other than Xbox) already have dual HDMI outs for this very purpose. So you only need an HDFury for devices with one HDMI output like Chromecast Ultra.


I appreciate your input. I've looked at the HDFury AVR Key and the Vertex solutions and I would like to know why you chose the Vertex over the AVR Key. The Vertex is about $350 and the AVR Key is about $150. Another issue I am concerned with is, will the AVR Key split the HDMI cable like the Vertex or will I need to buy the Vertex to accomplish using Dolby Vision? I have already seen several 4K Blu-ray Discs with Dolby Vision and Dolby ATMOS. Do you think this is a picture of things to come? Another question I have is, what is D+M? I know it is the initials of two companies that merged, but are they releasing equipment under the name of D+M? Anyway, I appreciate your help in pointing me to another option. It is cheaper to buy the Vertex than the Yamaha RX-A3070, but I am concerned about the technical issues it will take to get either of them running. I've printed out the manuals and hope they will help, but I would appreciate anything else you can do for me. Thanks.


----------



## Marc Alexander

jdhelaman said:


> I appreciate your input. I've looked at the HDFury AVR Key and the Vertex solutions and I would like to know why you chose the Vertex over the AVR Key. The Vertex is about $350 and the AVR Key is about $150. Another issue I am concerned with is, will the AVR Key split the HDMI cable like the Vertex or will I need to buy the Vertex to accomplish using Dolby Vision? I have already seen several 4K Blu-ray Discs with Dolby Vision and Dolby ATMOS. Do you think this is a picture of things to come? Another question I have is, what is D+M? I know it is the initials of two companies that merged, but are they releasing equipment under the name of D+M? Anyway, I appreciate your help in pointing me to another option. It is cheaper to buy the Vertex than the Yamaha RX-A3070, but I am concerned about the technical issues it will take to get either of them running. I've printed out the manuals and hope they will help, but I would appreciate anything else you can do for me. Thanks.


I chose the Vertex because I needed the extra features of the Vertex. I'm not sure you need either HDFury devices. What Dolby Vision sources are you trying to pass? To what displays?


----------



## Mashie Saldana

Anyone know where Scott has gone? No post from him since August. Did the wall of speakers fall over him?


----------



## sdurani

He's fine. Just taking a break.


----------



## starcat

Is Scott live again? 

Anyone know where I can find some
Stereo Integrity HT18 D4 subwoofer drivers

Thanks much!


----------



## chirpie

sdurani said:


> He's fine. Just taking a break.


I hope that's still the case. I like that dude.


----------



## sdurani

chirpie said:


> I hope that's still the case.


Still the case (spoke to him for a couple hours on Tuesday).


----------



## chirpie

sdurani said:


> Still the case (spoke to him for a couple hours on Tuesday).




Thanks for the heads up! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Scott Simonian

Droogne said:


> Hey
> 
> I have some questions about the riser. I'm looking into building something like this myself (need to raise the couch as I cant lower my tv). I assume it's a sealed box? How did you figure out the dimensions and drivers (also what drivers did you use?). Why did you choose to go with a subwoofer and not some bass transducers? Would you say it's better than transducers?
> 
> Preety neat setup by the way! You inspire me





vitaminbass said:


> Not much activity in here for awhile...I had kinda the same question. If I understand correctly his primary subs are sealed, and so is the riser. I would think mixing these types could cause issues otherwise...
> 
> You could go ported and do the same thing but would likely take a larger box or a smaller driver, assuming you wanted to tune it low...



Yes, sealed.


I figured the internal volume by using a simple spreadsheet to calculate the space needed. 

https://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/enclosure-volume-calculator/
I used two (at the time unused) Sound Splinter RLp18 subwoofer drivers. I had six of them, four used in two dual-opposed subs in the rear corners of the room just behind my futon couch. I chose this option because it would not cost me additional cash. Essentially free to build aside from the material to make the riser which wasn't very expensive at all. I would have gone with dual (or more) Crowson actuators but that would have cost at least $1k of which I could not afford. Very pleased with the results and after a few years of use I would not consider changing them to anything else now. Better? Maybe. I've had great (and bad) demos of nearfield subs, Buttkickers and Crowsons. It all really lies on the setup and this riser seems to be able replicate the best of all methods. I'm very happy with this system.


Thanks! I know it's been a while so I hope you found your answer one way or another and have been fruitful in your pursuits.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Mashie Saldana said:


> Anyone know where Scott has gone? No post from him since August. Did the wall of speakers fall over him?



Sometimes, I wish they had.  Nope. Just took an extended break from AVS.


Hi, Mashie! *waves*


----------



## Scott Simonian

starcat said:


> Is Scott live again?
> 
> Anyone know where I can find some
> Stereo Integrity HT18 D4 subwoofer drivers
> 
> Thanks much!



I am .... ALIVE. 


Sorry but the HT series was discontinued by Stereo Integrity. The best you can do is find them on the used market. Good luck!


----------



## Scott Simonian

chirpie said:


> I hope that's still the case. I like that dude.



I like you too! Hey, Ryan! *waves* 



Very interested in how your new theater is coming along.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Not a whole lot has been updated with my room. Some changes though. Haven't spent much time in it this past year. Have not had a lot of motivation to work on things or even be in there. Been dealing with.... life.





Been a long while since I've been on. I missed a lot of people here.


----------



## Frohlich




----------



## PioManiac

He's Back?!?

 

Missed Ya Bud!


----------



## Scott Simonian

@Frohlich 

@PioManiac



Hey guys! I missed you too.


----------



## chirpie

Scott Simonian said:


> Been dealing with.... life.


Totally get it. We have a phrase we use around the house after every long-ass trying tiring impossible day... "It's a lot of work being alive." 

Thanks for coming up for air for a moment.


----------



## FOH

Damn, I miss the best of AVS. This build ^ what a brute-force gangster approach. A nice slow progression from single soft dome tweeters up front, to this.... in one step!

Overwhelming swept volume, high sensitivity controlled directivity, implemented via massive DSP, a measurement mic, an eye on the gain structure/noise floor. Just really dig this... 

The overall audio-lab aesthetic resonates with me too, as my room is in a state of flux with experiments and the ceiling mounted sides/rears are mounted on an exposed Uni-Strut grid system so I can move and re-orient them according to seating changes in our high use (six adults, I know wtf?) media room. 

Scott, I truly hope this finds you well.
What a great build.


----------



## Scott Simonian

chirpie said:


> Totally get it. We have a phrase we use around the house after every long-ass trying tiring impossible day... "It's a lot of work being alive."
> 
> Thanks for coming up for air for a moment.


Thanks, Ryan! I'm a year late and COVID-19 still a thing... it IS good to be alive. 
Just went and visited your new build thread. A lot to catch up on! Looks great!


----------



## Scott Simonian

FOH said:


> Damn, I miss the best of AVS. This build ^ what a brute-force gangster approach. A nice slow progression from single soft dome tweeters up front, to this.... in one step!
> 
> Overwhelming swept volume, high sensitivity controlled directivity, implemented via massive DSP, a measurement mic, an eye on the gain structure/noise floor. Just really dig this...
> 
> The overall audio-lab aesthetic resonates with me too, as my room is in a state of flux with experiments and the ceiling mounted sides/rears are mounted on an exposed Uni-Strut grid system so I can move and re-orient them according to seating changes in our high use (six adults, I know wtf?) media room.
> 
> Scott, I truly hope this finds you well.
> What a great build.


Woah! Waaaaaaaaaaaatttt?!??! I know I have gone MIA but where have YOU been?! Good to hear from you and thanks for the visit and kind words. I would hope that you approve. Not many people will commit to a system like this and not to pat myself on the back but.... pretty badass. Doing what I can to achieve "Flat, Deep, Clean, Linear, and Loud ". 

Bro.... you got some PM's to catch up on a thread in a place full of data about bass.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Well now....



Have had some catching up to do and have gone and made edits to the OP. There has not been a lot upgraded in my theater as it has been used very little in the past couple years. Forgot to update the system list with UHD player, new amps, speakers and the now permanent HTPC.

Small changes to the 'Wall O Bass' theater. I relocated the Yamaha CX-A5100 from the rear amp rack area to the front with the rest of the source components. I like this configuration so much better. Added an OPPO-203 (before they closed shop), my old minidisc player and included a new-ish HTPC. The HTPC is not in it's final internal form. It is made up primarily of hand-me-down components. Enough to get a system working and mostly sufficient. Nothing really super high-end... maybe one day. The point was to have a permanent spot in my HT rack for a computer (this isn't my first HTPC) so I build it from a Silverstone GD08 case. I like it because it looks great with other AV components and is roomy enough for a full-size videocard and storage if I want. The only new components are the case, power supply and a low-profile air cooler for the CPU. The rest are hand-me-downs from previous pc's or from a friend. At some point I'll put nicer stuff in it but right now it serves to have actual Windows 10 interface with media and a better way to use the Omnimic system.

I had forgot to remove mention of my previous Scatmos configuration and have now updated the amp list to reflect that. Scatmos has not been active in my room since roughly 2016-ish. Still have some old pics in the OP that show the middle overhead but they are not there anymore. Overhead speakers are now JBL 8330's just like my side/rear surrounds which is great for overall sound uniformity. They are powered by an additional Behringer iNuke NU4-6000.





I moved my side surrounds into the framework that supports all the surrounds and rear overheads. This adds about 1ft of width to them physically (doesn't sound like much but it is a very narrow room) and covered them with some speaker cloth. Doesn't look super high end but it is stealthy now and does make the soundstage seem a bit wider which is great.


----------



## BP1Fanatic

Stealthy!


----------



## Waboman

Scott Simonian said:


> Have had some catching up to do and have gone and made edits to the OP. *There has not been a lot upgraded in my theater* as it has been used very little in the past couple years. *Forgot to update the system list with UHD player, new amps, speakers and the now permanent HTPC.*


Like a HT ninja. The Simonian is back. How ya been? 

Sounds like pretty much everything was upgraded. Lol.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Waboman said:


> Like a HT ninja. The Simonian is back. How ya been?


I'm hanging in there, bud. Good to be back!




Waboman said:


> Sounds like pretty much everything was upgraded. Lol.


Well maybe it was poorly worded but not much has changed *in the two years I have been absent here.* As I mentioned, I was simply updating my thread with changes since sometime in 2016. Guess I was too lazy and neglected to change the equipment list some time ago. The only thing actually new in my theater in the past two years is the HTPC and even it isn't fully new components. Just wanted to get something in there with a new case. Everything else is the same stuff. Took some new pictures though! Still need to update a few angles but it is good for now. (I say that and then several years later.... still no pics lol) Made a sick gif of the amps powering up!


----------



## Scott Simonian

Ugh. Good ol' AVS...

For some reason my OP that I had just updated with new pics and equipment reverted to how it was years ago.

I'll fix it soon. Hopefully it stays put when I do.


----------



## Scott Simonian

8/9/2020 

OP fixed and updated with current equipment.


----------



## Scott Simonian

I do have one more fun thing to add to my system thread...

A sweet concession stand!

*"Let's all go to the lobby!"*










An 8oz popcorn popper, a nacho machine and some assorted candy. Yay! 

This was built from an office desk from Office Depot. I forget the brand. I tilted the top shelve to give a "display" look. The drawer hosts some chocolate bars, necco wafers and other small assorted candy that is not fit for display on the shelf.

*This concession stand is not in the theater, btw, but in the kitchen nook area.* The popcorn machine gets regular use and produces popcorn very similar to what you get at the movies. If you enjoy movie theater popcorn, you would love the results. I, myself, am a huge nacho guy. Both that I am a fatso and that I greatly enjoy nachos. _buh dum tish_ I always wanted a nacho dispenser as an accessory to my HT system and struggled with what type to get and their very high price tag for such a novelty item. Definitely not for everyone. For the longest time I wanted a pump type dispenser because growing up, that is usually what I encountered when getting nachos. I wanted some fanfare and a lighted sign and all that but it was just too much and also a tedious affair cleaning up for something that probably will not get used very often. So I went back and forth between a couple and settled on the one I have now which is of a 'bag type' nacho dispenser. I leaned this way because there is very little to zero clean up and bags are readily available on Amazon. To those interested, nacho cheese bags can be pricey often ~$20 a bag or so depending on what and where you get it. Another reason I like the bag type is they stay edible for several days without having to put it away each night in the fridge.* I must emphasize I rarely use this but when I do it is great fun! *If I know friends are coming over or that I will have some serious movie marathons about to happen.... it is nacho time!  Candy is something I also rarely touch but built up what you see over time. I'm not one for sweets but some sour watermelon gummies can be nice.

This picture is a couple years old but it looks about the same now. The leds at the bottom were later secured and usually you never see them because you looking at this stand at a higher angle than what was shot. I do not plan to change much and will likely stay as it is, changing up the candy from time to time. Candy is super expensive right now so I have no pressing needs at the moment. I may add a warmed butter dispenser but I can not justify >$100 for such a thing, at least right now.


----------



## SBuger

Way cool!! It’s making me want to watch a movie and have some goodies just by looking at it all 

My daughter would go nuts over all those sour patch and skittles packages!!


----------



## Scott Simonian

SBuger said:


> Way cool!! It’s making me want to watch a movie and have some goodies just by looking at it all
> 
> My daughter would go nuts over all those sour patch and skittles packages!!


Haha, yeah! They can be tempting, that's for sure. I'm well disciplined to stay away from the candy....now. At first I'd get a new variety and be like, "oooh yeah, peanut butter M&M's!" Hahaha. But I'm better these days. I too prefer the fruity candies! Tropical Skittles and these watermelon Sour Patch gummies hit the spot. The supply is starting to dwindle this year, so no new pics. I check all the time on Amazon and this year bulk box candy is super high in price. No thanks, I'm good. I'll wait to see if the prices drop and get some more.


----------



## Mashie Saldana

So are you still rocking your ScAtmos setup?

Mine is still going strong and will hopefully do for another year when the time has come to go native 16ch processing. 

One of my NAD Dolby PL2 AVR's are on the last legs now with the display randomly coming on and off. No impact to the sound yet thankfully.


----------



## Scott Simonian

Mashie Saldana said:


> So are you still rocking your ScAtmos setup?
> 
> Mine is still going strong and will hopefully do for another year when the time has come to go native 16ch processing.
> 
> One of my NAD Dolby PL2 AVR's are on the last legs now with the display randomly coming on and off. No impact to the sound yet thankfully.


Hey Mashie!

Nah, the Scatmos was removed several years ago. I talked about it in this thread. Scott's Wall of Bass Immersive Audio HT Room

Just plain, boring ol' 7.1.4 audio now. 

Glad you're enjoying yours! What you have done with it is pretty impressive. Hopefully your gear hangs in there long enough for you to pick up an HTP-1 or something.


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## BP1Fanatic

I'm like you, I love being able to use my Sony TV remote to control the AT&T TV streaming box (using Direct TV settings) and Sony AVR.


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## Mashie Saldana

Scott Simonian said:


> Hey Mashie!
> 
> Nah, the Scatmos was removed several years ago. I talked about it in this thread. Scott's Wall of Bass Immersive Audio HT Room
> 
> Just plain, boring ol' 7.1.4 audio now.
> 
> Glad you're enjoying yours! What you have done with it is pretty impressive. Hopefully your gear hangs in there long enough for you to pick up an HTP-1 or something.


Hi Scott, I didn't realize you stopped using ScAtmos that soon after you came up with the idea.

The current setup better keep on working as it will be towards 12 months before I'm in a position to get a HTP-1 with 15ch of Hypex nCore external amplification. The amps are doubling the cost of entry. 

At least it will give Monoprice the time to implement DTS:X Pro as it would be a shame to have to downgrade the current experience.


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