# Home Automation and Lighting Build Thread



## Anthony A.

This thread is a progress of my newly built (actually still being built) home. After years of researching, i finally was able to design and build a custom house with all the toys i wanted in it (on a budget of course).










I have a dedicated theater room in the basement with all the sound proofing goodies inside (see my thread in the theater construction forum). In regards to home automation, I went with an HAI Omni Pro 2 controller for alarm and automation duties. HVAC control, music, lighting, security, etc. It was affordable and did what I needed it to, so im happy about that. I like their touchscreens (if i plan on ever going that route.... and yes, i did prewire for them), but for the time being I'm going to be controlling everything from my iphone/ipod touch.


Lighting control is a Lutron Homeworks 4 system with keypads everywhere and one a handful of switches (bathrooms, closets, etc.). I initially was going to go with a Homeworks 8 system, but the added cost really didn't offer me anything more that the 4 could do. Instead of having the remote dimming modules, I placed the wallbox power modules in the electrical closet next to the Lutron control panel and have all homerun wiring to the basement. The system is designed to have 8 wallbox power modules to control all the home lighting and the closets/baths will have the maestro switches tied in. SeeTouch keypads are wired throughout the house so no more 10 switch banks on the walls.


Music control is going to be a Russound MCA-C5 controller with keypads in different locations. 6 zones and about 4 sources I will be going with in my home. Doorbell muting, etc. is going to be a nice feature.


The HAI panel with control everything and will be accessed via the iphone. It will tie in the lutron lighting (ie. turn on all the exterior lights when the alarm is triggered), music control, etc. via their customizable touchscreens (future idea for me).


Structured wiring is not as crazy as i've done in the past, but still quite extensive. Ethernet to all rooms, phone, and 2 caox. 1 coax for cable, 1 for camera. 3 structured wiring panels to house everything in, plus 1 panel for alarm and 1 for lutron.


Security has been prewired for 4 exterior cameras and will be plugged into a dvr. Alarm, motion, sensors, etc. in all locations.


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## Anthony A.

Structured wiring panel eye-candy!!!












Below are access loops i made so i can pull wires in the future from panel to panel.











Openings for power to plug into nearby outlets as well as battery backup plug-in.











Lutron Homeworks 4 panel











Other side of electrical closet. Note that I have not yet mounted the 8 wallbox power module boxes. They will be housed directly above the lutron panel.











note too that i need to install 2 more subpanels. 1 for lighting, and 1 for theater/music.


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## Anthony A.

rough-in bracket for russound keypad (on top) and lutron keypad (on bottom).










the equipment closet for ht and music control is located under the stairs with a door access. here is a pic of it in its raw state.











and finally, this is the view of the closet from my office. the opening will also house my 2 channel music stuff and will all be completely hidden under the stairs.


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## Nexus1

Anthony,


Great stuff! Keep us posted as things continue to progress and thanks for sharing.


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## Neurorad

Awesome!


I like how the Lutron HW KP is centered below the Russound KP. Nice touch.


Any conduit, basement/crawl -> attic? wiring closet -> display/projector? Makes it easier to 'upgrade' hdmi.


Print the pic showing the wiring closet door opening, and hand it to the guy who is installing/constructing the door. He'll be more careful with his nailer.


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## Anthony A.

thanks! yes, i did run a conduit from the attic to the electrical closet for future runs. no conduit from pj to equipment closet. there would have been too many 90 degree bends that it would have been near impossible to fish anything later on. i did however run 2 hmi cables and a component from pj to equip. closet. i just drywalled the theater this weekend to realize i forgot to run cat3 from the pj to equip. closet for ir control. so, i fished some in (good thing the other side of the theater was not drywalled yet), and i did a quick patch.


good idea about the wiring behind the door. don't want any screws going into the wiring!


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## cgull

Did you consider the ELK M1 Gold when you chose the HAI OP3? If so, what made you go with one over the other? I know this is sometimes a touchy subject but I'm always interested in hearing opinions on it. Construction on our new home (designed it ourselves) should start within the month so I really need to make a decision on which one I'm going to go with!


I look forward to seeing your progress with this!


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## Neurorad

You might want to consider running a couple cat6 cables to the projector, using the catx you just ran as a pull cord.


HDMI 1.4 specs released last April. Cat6 should provide some futureproofing - you'll likely be able to use a pair of cat6 in place of HDM 1.4 (and/or 1.5, 1.6, 2.14...), eventually, but the component isn't a bad fallback.


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cgull* /forum/post/17299723
> 
> 
> Did you consider the ELK M1 Gold when you chose the HAI OP3? If so, what made you go with one over the other? I know this is sometimes a touchy subject but I'm always interested in hearing opinions on it. Construction on our new home (designed it ourselves) should start within the month so I really need to make a decision on which one I'm going to go with!
> 
> 
> I look forward to seeing your progress with this!



to be honest, i think both brands are very capable and possible a toss up. i went with a dealer in the area whom i trust who happens to be an HAI 5 star integrator and had him do the entire thing, all the way to programming. i ran all the wiring, etc. myself. the nice thing about HAI is that they have new touchscreens which are fairly reasonably priced which can be customized the way you please using automation studio. you can make it look just like a crestron panel and the program is super easy to use. HAI website has webinars of how to use the program and any beginner can do it. not sure if elk has the same thing or not, but HAI seems to have a lot of integration partners and i haven't read of any bad reviews anywhere on their automation panels so it was a logical choice for me. the price really was the main determining factor as i spent all my money on the lutron homeworks setup.


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Neurorad* /forum/post/17300864
> 
> 
> You might want to consider running a couple cat6 cables to the projector, using the catx you just ran as a pull cord.
> 
> 
> HDMI 1.4 specs released last April. Cat6 should provide some futureproofing - you'll likely be able to use a pair of cat6 in place of HDM 1.4 (and/or 1.5, 1.6, 2.14...), eventually, but the component isn't a bad fallback.



thanks for the tip. unfortunately i already drywalled the second layer with green glue in between and "fishing" the wires had me cut a few holes in the first layer which i later caulked. i did get the blue jeans top of the line hdmi cables which are fully 1.3 certified so we'll see what happens in the future. if i need to run some new lines, i guess i could just sell the house and start all over again!!


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## Neurorad

A lot easier to cut and repair drywall now, during construction, than in 7 years.


However, it's pretty unlikely that it's a 'bad' cable (I bought an hdmi cable from Blue Jeans), the connectors will probably never get damaged, you probably won't ever put a nail or screw through the cable (keep your nails and screws shorter than the depth of the DD), and new hdmi standards will likely be backwards compatible.


HDMI will always suck, until it can be 'field terminated'.


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## Anthony A.

structured panels all drywalled











lutron panel with wallbox power module boxes


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## jikkjack

Those structured panels look great! I wish I had those in my house.


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## sumavguy

Anthony I saw your construction build thread, and glad that you made this one as well! Looking forward to both!


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## Anthony A.

im looking for some feedback on my theater control. right now, i have it wired for 2 keypads. 1 keypad would have the scenes on it (ie. movie, sports, etc.) and the other will have the actual light control. im now wanting to be able to control the lights through rf from a urc remote. i know that lutron has rf light switches that go hand in hand with urc remotes, but since i only have a double gang wallbox in the theater and don't want to have multiple switches on the wall, what are my options for rf light control? the 4 lighting loads are all controlled by the wallbox power module. would the cheapest solution be getting the wireless module tied into the processor?


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## Anthony A.

can anyone give me some suggestions on how to accomplish the wireless light dilemma?


thanks.


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## Neurorad

This HomeWorks question is probably best answered by your regional Lutron HW rep, the salesman, or the installer. You want 2 keypads next to each other - correct? Is there a single 10-button keypad that could be used instead, with an IR receiver in the other gang?


It seems your question is - 'how can I control the lights with a remote?'


I think the URC master controller MSC-400 can be linked with the HW4 P5 processor using serial control. So, the MSC-400 receives a command from the remote control, and the message is transferred to the processor via 232.


There are many other units, besides the MSC-400, that can convert IR to serial, at a cheaper price (MSRP $800). The MSC-400 would serve to control other AV equipment in the theater as well, via RS232. It would take some skill to implement this yourself, a skill that will take time to learn. I think Xantech makes a cheap IR to 232 converter (Edit - Xantech IRS232A ).


This is coming from someone who has never done this stuff, so make sure you do your homework, or consult a pro.


Edit - I've read that Celadon also make an IR-232 converter


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## Neeko708

Nice cable job. Where did yo get your panels?


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## Anthony A.

believe it or not, they were on clearance at a local home depot with disocunted pricing and included the hinged cover. they ended up costing me just slightly cheaper than if i would have gotten them from an electrical supplier. they can be had much cheaper on ebay though. i was strapped for time and just went ahead and paid a bit more and avoiding shipping, duties, etc.


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## jikkjack

I use the Insteon stuff for my URC RF to IR controlled lights.


Let me know if you want more detail about it.


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jikkjack* /forum/post/17516205
> 
> 
> I use the Insteon stuff for my URC RF to IR controlled lights.
> 
> 
> Let me know if you want more detail about it.



thanks for the suggestion jack. unfortunately the room has been wired to use the lutron homeworks system so it would not be physically possible to hookup insteon switches to it. all the lighting loads go into the electrical closet and only the lutron lv cable is located in the switch position in my ht. i will have to speak to my dealer and see if there is a wireless module available that will allow me to use rf control of the lights.




i picked up the wallbox power modules yesterday and had them wired in today. can't test them yet as the subpanel for the lighting loads was not in stock at the local electrical supply shop, but i should have everything wired in by next week. all the wires have been terminated into the panel and the room finally looks clean. once i get the 2 subpanels (1 for lights, 1 for HT), i will post some pics of the completed wiring. things are starting to take shape and i will be ordering all my keypads with engravings in the next couple weeks so that should be fun.


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## Anthony A.

pics of the wallbox power modules


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## Anthony A.

these things are a breeze to wire. i had my electrician wire me the subpanels and i hooked up the modules. took me less than 2 hrs to do all of them. pics to follow.


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## supsuper

I was wondering why you are using Lutron for lighting over UPB switches, which will integrate right into HAI Omni Pro controller. I am planning to go the UPB route so I am curious to know your reasoning to go with Lutron. The UPB Dimmers work well with regular incandescents as well as the newer LED bulbs. I also like the programming interface to create scenes, light timings etc.


BTW the HAI [email protected] app for iPhone seems pretty cool (integrates lighting, security, HVAC, whole house audio into a single app).


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## Anthony A.

i researched heavily into all lighting alternatives. upb, which can be very reliable in certain systems, also have their share of issues. mailnly interference, etc. from powerline. i searched and found many people on coccoon tech and worthington forums which had many complaints of upb. now i also know of many who have 100% reliable systems. i didn't want to take a chance so i went with lutron because i know it is 100% reliable and rock solid regardless. yes, it is far more expensive but it is known for quality and reliablilty. alc is also very similar to upb, but again, i chose to go lutron homeworks for 100% reliability all the time. the same is true of vantage, crestron and litetouch.


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## supsuper




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/17831528
> 
> 
> i researched heavily into all lighting alternatives. upb, which can be very reliable in certain systems, also have their share of issues. mailnly interference, etc. from powerline. i searched and found many people on coccoon tech and worthington forums which had many complaints of upb. now i also know of many who have 100% reliable systems. i didn't want to take a chance so i went with lutron because i know it is 100% reliable and rock solid regardless. yes, it is far more expensive but it is known for quality and reliablilty. alc is also very similar to upb, but again, i chose to go lutron homeworks for 100% reliability all the time. the same is true of vantage, crestron and litetouch.



Can these reliability problems be resolved with any product? I know HAI recommends a phase coupler for every installation. Anybody have any experience or success with installing a phase coupler?


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## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/17332809
> 
> 
> im looking for some feedback on my theater control. right now, i have it wired for 2 keypads. 1 keypad would have the scenes on it (ie. movie, sports, etc.) and the other will have the actual light control. im now wanting to be able to control the lights through rf from a urc remote. i know that lutron has rf light switches that go hand in hand with urc remotes, but since i only have a double gang wallbox in the theater and don't want to have multiple switches on the wall, what are my options for rf light control? the 4 lighting loads are all controlled by the wallbox power module. would the cheapest solution be getting the wireless module tied into the processor?



Have you looked at getting the IR keypad? It has 5 buttons and takes IR signals directly. It can be either in your theater or if you don't have LOS, put it in the equipment room with a repeater from your URC remote.


The other option might be a Grafik Eye. They look pretty cool in the theater environment and look to the system just like a WPM. You would have to run your HV to it though. Or you could just use one in place of the WPM (prices are similar) and run an IR blaster to it.


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## Anthony A.

hmmm, i didn't think of the grafik eye with an ir blaster in the mechanical closet. that may be a good idea, although i think my dealer already ordered the last wpm that i needed. since all the HV loads go to the closet, i am unable to place the GE in the theater itself. i did look at the ir keypad as well initially, but i already ordered the keypads so i don't want to have to re-order them again. my dealer still hasn't confirmed if there is an rf module or not that the processor can control, but i was sure that i remember reading about it somewhere.


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## Neurorad

Not sure I understand where RF comes into the pic.


You have a remote control? If not, which one do you want to use?


The processor accepts RS232 commands, doesn't it? You need to control the processor, with a remote control, so you need something that converts IR to 232 - Celadon, Xantech, URC all have this device, links above. I bet Celadon is the cheapest, but it's up to the pro who will be programming the remote, I think.


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## Anthony A.

i haven't decided completely on which remote, but lets assume i will be using a urc rf remote with mrf 260 base station. i thought i needed to have the lutron processor with an rf module to support rf controls via an rf capable remote. yes, the processor does accept rs232 commands but the problem is that i never ran an ir cable (or cat5, etc.) from the theater room to the equipment closet where the lighting modules reside. is it even possible to "learn" rf commands with a urc remote the same way you can "learn" ir?


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## Neurorad

I've never used an RF remote, but I would think you could put another RF base station in the closet, with the HW processor. Then, convert IR to 232. I would think the URC MSC400 would be an ideal component for your rack, with an input from the RF260.


I don't recall any mention of a central rack, Anthony. Is that in the plans? Sorry if I missed it.


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## captaincondor

Any updates on this project?


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## Anthony A.

sorry for the delay, i've been meaning to update both of my build threads but i have very little time lately. i had the hai installed for the most part, still some settings and tweaks i need to do, and i'm slowly terminating all the wall jacks. im waiting on my netgear switch and haven't setup my router fully yet either. im hoping to have everything dialed in shortly. i will update some pics as well. stay tuned.


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## jdodd64

Its looking good. I am glad to see someone do a home automation build. I'm not even near to building a home but it is nice to see how guys are doing it. Keep up the good work.


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## mrachul

I've been following your home automation and your theater build and I am curious how things are going on the automation side?


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## Anthony A.

thanks for the encouragement. i've been really busy with other parts of the house as of late, but my network is up and running. just a few more small parts to be installed and then i can tie up all the cables together and make the structured enclosures look nice and neat. i should have some pics in the next week or so, along with some of the equipment rack for the HT.


the HAI has been installed and works, but im still tweaking it somewhat and making changes as i go along. im hoping to hook up the russound mca-c5 controller anyday now since the in-ceiling speakers have been installed for quite some time and my wife keeps nidging me to get some tunes rolling in the house.


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## Anthony A.

okay finally i have the completed pics of my setup. on the left side of the electrical closet is all the structured wiring panels and on the right is the lutron lighting and electrical panels.


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## Anthony A.

TELEPHONE, CABLE, COAX, SURVEILLANCE CAMERAS AND ELECTROLINE DROP AMP












MODEM AND NETGEAR GIGABIT ROUTER












NETGEAR GIGABIT SWITCH












HAI OMNIPRO 2


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## Anthony A.

LUTRON HOMEWORKS 4 PANEL AND WALLBOX POWER MODULES





















CLOSEUP












PROCESSOR












200 AMP PANEL WITH 2 SUBPANELS (1 FOR LUTRON LIGHTING, 1 FOR HOME THEATER)


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## Anthony A.

FRONT DOOR HAI OMNI CONSOLE AND LUTRON KEYPAD






























HALLWAY


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## Neurorad

WOW


Very impressive, Anthony. HA Porn.


Not to be picky at all, but I see you need more line voltage outlets in your enclosures - not supposed to run the power cords through the walls. Like the one in the bottom of the modem/router enclosure, they fit into knockouts. Something like this Channel Vision item may help, if there aren't enough outlets in the knockout:









I bought mine from Automated Outlet.


The level of finish in your house is fantastic.


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## Anthony A.

thanks for the compliments. it took a while since i did everything myself (minus hooking up the HAI omnipro 2 panel and programming it), but im overall very happy with the results and look of it. i know what you mean about the line voltage stuff. im actually going to have a UPS that runs the modem, router, switch, etc. so i should have some more outlets free once i get that. also looking to get a DVR for the cameras as well and an power supply for them all. so not 100% finished, but getting there.


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## Adidas4275

it looks great man, really clean install.


I am not all the familiar with the lutron system.... why is there the bank of light switches in the closet?


control of every light in the house from 1 room via switches? is this for trouble shooting?


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## Anthony A.

they only look like switches but in fact are wallbox power modules which take the line voltage from a light load. each wallbox can control 6 light loads and is powered with a single 15a breaker. in my case i have close to 50 light loads that go into the wallbox modules and the processor controls them. its a bit hard to explain, but if you hit the lutron website it will explain the system rather simply.


the light keypads are basically a clean way of eliminating a bank of switches on your wall/ lets say in your hallway you have 4 switches. 1 switch is to control the foyer lights, 1 for the hallway, 1 for the upper hallway and another for the lower hallway. with the lutron, you can have 1 keypad control all those lights plus you can have scene's programmed such as "goodnight" that will turn off all open lights in your house when you go to bed. or you can have a "welcome" scene which turns on a specific set of lights when you enter your house.


using the hai automation controller, you can have it programmed to turn off all the lights, lower the hvac temperature, etc. when you hit the "away" button on the alarm keypad. there are endless things to do, and my setup is rather basic in comparison to systems i've seen done.


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## Fiasco

Anthony,


solid choice on the Lutron lighting system. 100% reliability is what you paid for and got.


Normally in a new installation such as yours we spread Series 4 wallbox power modules out throught the home to minimize wiring requirements (place the wall boxes as close to the loads as possible in closets, pantries ect.


You did a fantastic job on your structured wiring.


What are you using for remote control? I have a RadioRa2 system I just installed in my house and use CommandFusion on the iphone for remote control.


I use a combination of EventGhost running on an XBMC HTPC and GlobalCache units for full house automation.


So, like you, I have single automation buttons on my iphone and keypads that interact with multiple systems simultaneously. The best example in my house is the "Sleep" button on my CommandFusion iphone remote and "Sleep" button on the master bedroom RA keypad. Pushing "Sleep" delay dims lights in pathways, shuts down other lights, turns on over cabinet/undercabinet night lighting, bumps our Omnistat thermostat back to 72 deg, turns on the over bed ceiling fan and shuts down all audio/visual equipment in the house.


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## Anthony A.

wow, thats a pretty sweet setup you have going. i looked into command fusion but it did not natively support HAI, although i see you use gc for that and cf works with gc. i briefly looked into gc, but still somewhat confused as to how it integrates everything together. would it be advantageous to get one or i assume it would be reduntant with what the HAI panel offers. though i may use it in the future for future stuff i do. any info on the gc stuff would be great.


thanks.


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## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18359173
> 
> 
> wow, thats a pretty sweet setup you have going. i looked into command fusion but it did not natively support HAI, although i see you use gc for that and cf works with gc. i briefly looked into gc, but still somewhat confused as to how it integrates everything together. would it be advantageous to get one or i assume it would be reduntant with what the HAI panel offers. though i may use it in the future for future stuff i do. any info on the gc stuff would be great.
> 
> 
> thanks.



globalcache converts serial or infrared to ethernet or wireless so it's a good way to get control over devices you would have a difficult time pulling wire to.


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## jcm

You've probably got this handled by now, but there is an IR receiver on the Lutron CCO-8 board in your processor panel. You just need an emitter wired there from your MRF basestation.


jcmitch


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## Anthony A.

hmmm, thats a good suggestion. the reason i never looked into ir is because i forgot to run a cat5 cable from the theater to the electrical room. i do though, have a cable run from the theater to the equipment closet/rack so that may be a viable solution by using the mrf base station. can you elaborate a bit on this since im not totally understanding how it can be accomplished. thanks.


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## jcm

Um...Rf remote->MRF->emitter->CCO8


jcmitch


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## BradKas

Very clean install Anthony.


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jcm* /forum/post/18379742
> 
> 
> Um...Rf remote->MRF->emitter->CCO8
> 
> 
> jcmitch



okay so i use 1 of the ir outputs (fixed/variable) on the mrf directly to the cco8 board? is there a specific output on the contact closure board or any of the 8 will control it by ir?


thats it? seems so simply, wondering why my lutron installer didn't know this.


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## jcm

There is an IR receiver on the CCO-8 board. It is independent of the closures themselves. I've attached a link to an older copy of the HomeWorks Technical Reference Guide to this email. There is some detailed information on pg 27...


jcmitch

http://www.lutron.com/onespec/cutshe...on/366-963.pdf


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## Shady_

You have what looks to be a very nice home, with high-end finishes, and a HA system that is suited to match. Very well done.


You say that you chose Lutron to help eliminate wall clutter, for one reason, but I was wondering what your thoughts were toward unifying the systems into touch screens. Having a single touch screen at each room with all systems control, except maybe for the front door where a scene controller would give you an easy home/away button. Are you using any touch panels?


I know touch screens are getting cheaper (pricing of the iPod Touch is helping this), but is it just that the technology/price isn't there yet to be able to replace switches all together. I know reliability is your main concern, and rightly so, hence the structured wiring, but I'm just curious if you have any thoughts about tech that is available now as opposed to when you started the project.


Thanks for sharing.


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## jcm

Shady you'd have an awfully tough time getting a building inspector to OK replacing light switches w/ touchscreens. First, the ADA guideline for a light switch is 48" AFF, too low for a touchscreen. Second, you typically need to wake up a touch panel, read the button layout, and then press the button action. Picture that at your house. Touch panels have their place, controlling lighting can even be part of it, but they aren't a great replacement for the switch. Not all keypads do this well either, BTW.


jcmitch


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## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jcm* /forum/post/18388943
> 
> 
> Shady you'd have an awfully tough time getting a building inspector to OK replacing light switches w/ touchscreens. First, the ADA guideline for a light switch is 48" AFF, too low for a touchscreen. Second, you typically need to wake up a touch panel, read the button layout, and then press the button action. Picture that at your house. Touch panels have their place, controlling lighting can even be part of it, but they aren't a great replacement for the switch. Not all keypads do this well either, BTW.
> 
> 
> jcmitch



The first time the home owner came home and had to drop the bag of groceries to wake, find the button and activate they would be mighty unhappy with their new lighting control system.


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## Anthony A.

i would have to agree. touchscreens are super cool but also have their place. at the time, i went with HAI because they were releasing the 5.7e touchpanel which could be designed by any user using automation studio software. i took a few web tutorials and it is extremely easy to program and design. price wise they are cheaper than most competition, although it would be great if HAI allowed automation software to be used on touchpanel pc's. i looked extensively at crestron and it was priced significantly higher with using 3 touchpanels in the house (basement, family room and master bedroom). now with the ipad coming out, i think it will be amazing if HAI or someone else makes an HAI app. this tablet is priced right and has huge potential for us DIY automation guys.


i also wish russound had their sphere series remote work with the mca series controllers, as it would be ideal for rooms to control tv's and also have feedback of audio zones, playlists, etc. im still not 100% sure if im gonna go with a wifi enabled remote that will control everything, iphone control, etc. my first choice is the ipad as of now and hopefully the apps will come available sooner than later.


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## Shady_

I understand your concerns and agree with some, but I was thinking of something like Lagotek does with a touchscreen that replaces and acts as a two-gang switch box and still has the flexibility to access/control other systems.

shown here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qy_PGa8g6Q 


They have hard buttons, maybe that is how they get inspector approval.


I happen to think keypads, like Lutron's, can blend better into the wall and look better than touch screens can, but maybe in the future a screen with zero bezel could camouflage itself by matching paint/wall color (while still showing switch outlines, of course).


It just seems like we are moving toward that direction with things like touch-dimmers, keypads, and separate touch screens for audio/HA.


Thanks for the feedback, I really like your setup.


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## Swancoat




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18349475
> 
> 
> TELEPHONE, CABLE, COAX, SURVEILLANCE CAMERAS AND ELECTROLINE DROP AMP



Where did you find this Coax patch panel? (I assume that's what the thing running horizontally through the middle of the can is).


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## WayneDB123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Fiasco* /forum/post/18389597
> 
> 
> The first time the home owner came home and had to drop the bag of groceries to wake, find the button and activate they would be mighty unhappy with their new lighting control system.



If you have a true home automation setup and not just lighting control, you can have a door sensor trigger the lights to come on when you come home and the house is dark.


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## Anthony A.

home depot!







actually, i used a simple aluminum angle bracket, cut it to size, drilled holes in it, and placed f-connectors in them. tighten them up and you're done. i couldn't find a cheaper yet better way of doing it for the number of inputs i had, so i did it this way.


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *WayneDB123* /forum/post/18396932
> 
> 
> If you have a true home automation setup and not just lighting control, you can have a door sensor trigger the lights to come on when you come home and the house is dark.



I just don't see touch screens replacing switches/keypads


----------



## Swancoat




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18396944
> 
> 
> home depot!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> actually, i used a simple aluminum angle bracket, cut it to size, drilled holes in it, and placed f-connectors in them. tighten them up and you're done. i couldn't find a cheaper yet better way of doing it for the number of inputs i had, so i did it this way.



Nice. I've been looking everywhere for such a beast, but all I find are rack-mountable solutions. I will be stealing that for sure.


----------



## jcm

Swancoat,


OnQ makes 2 versions of this, an 8 port and a 12 port. 363915-01 & 364596-01


Leviton also makes one, but it comes in 2 parts. A bracket and the rail insert. I don't know the model #'s.


jcmitch


----------



## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *WayneDB123* /forum/post/18396932
> 
> 
> If you have a true home automation setup and not just lighting control, you can have a door sensor trigger the lights to come on when you come home and the house is dark.



Actually, all the Lutron keypads he has have CCI's on the back. Just wire any CC sensor or OS and program it into the system and you are good to go.


Plus, Lutron has their visor controls to allow you to turn on the lights from the car so you never have to even pull into a dark garage.


----------



## Anthony A.

does anyone know if i can access the homeworks job file by plugging a pc into the rs232 plug? i just got a copy of illumination software but i only see the option to open an existing file. is this accessible from the p5 panel or must i have my installer give it to me?


----------



## Chicagorep




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18425032
> 
> 
> does anyone know if i can access the homeworks job file by plugging a pc into the rs232 plug? i just got a copy of illumination software but i only see the option to open an existing file. is this accessible from the p5 panel or must i have my installer give it to me?



The software can extract the file from the processor via the RS232 jack


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Chicagorep* /forum/post/18425389
> 
> 
> The software can extract the file from the processor via the RS232 jack



If he knows the password/username combo.


----------



## Anthony A.

thats what i was worried about. im gonna ask my installer when he comes next week and see if he can give me a copy for "backup".


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18447599
> 
> 
> thats what i was worried about. im gonna ask my installer when he comes next week and see if he can give me a copy for "backup".



Depending upon how complex your programming is you can rebuild it manually in the software.


If you have alot of conditional logic going on that would certainly make it more difficult.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jcm* /forum/post/18376972
> 
> 
> You've probably got this handled by now, but there is an IR receiver on the Lutron CCO-8 board in your processor panel. You just need an emitter wired there from your MRF basestation.
> 
> 
> jcmitch



i've been doing more research on this approach, and it seems that you can only use the optional lutron grx-it or grx-8it remote with that specific ir eye. now the remote instructions state that both these models are for scene control. im wondering just how one programmes which scenes into the remote or if you can literally program any button and learn it to a universal remote. if anyone has any thoughts or suggestions for this approach it would be most appreciated.


the only other way i can see of controlling the lights is by connecting a URC msc-400 controller rs232 to the lutron. however there is only 1 rs232 input on the homeworks processor and it is currently connected to the HAI controller. unless i can control it through the HAI controller (need to check if it has more rs232 inputs available). once the rs232 commands are programmed into a universal remote, i assume i would be able to teach these into other learing ir remotes around the house to turn on, say the fireplace in the family room?


----------



## jcm

Lutron only gives instructions on using their remote. The truth is that any remote containing those codes works. The commands are already in the URC database (among others). The functions are as capable as any other button press in HWI programming.


jcmitch


----------



## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18448503
> 
> 
> the only other way i can see of controlling the lights is by connecting a URC msc-400 controller rs232 to the lutron.



Lutron makes IR capable keypads. Each one is the equivalent of a 5 button keypad. You could always put one or more of these in the closet and attach a flasher.


Do you have a copy of the software? If so, build a fake system and add the CCO board. See what programming options it offers.


----------



## jcm

There are IR commands for buttons 1-9, 21, 23 & 24. The button layout on the keypad does not limit the number of commands available, just the ones you can press from the front.


jcmitch


----------



## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jcm* /forum/post/18459757
> 
> 
> There are IR commands for buttons 1-9, 21, 23 & 24. The button layout on the keypad does not limit the number of commands available, just the ones you can press from the front.



Did not know that. Thanks!


Now I just have to figure out how.


----------



## Anthony A.

managed to get a copy of the illumination software as well as the file from my installer. i've been tweaking it the last day or so and using the lutron iphone app. im very happy right now.... everything is rock solid so far.


all i need to do now is hookup the russound and get the hai to display all the light commands and im golden!!!!


----------



## Anthony A.

another question for the ir folks. im looking to use ir to control a keypad in the family room which has 3 buttons on it. 1 for lights, 1 for a scene, and 1 for a fireplace. so basically its 3 commands im looking to control. is there any way to control this keypad without getting the ir faceplate (stwd-4sir)? i know that all the keypads are really 6 button with raise/lower and ir, but the faceplate is what changes them. any way to utilize the built-in ir control?


----------



## jcm

The button kits do change the keypad layout, but keypads are not all capable of IR. Any IR receiver in the system can accept the necessary commands however. So systems with 3rd part RF remotes often only have 1 IR receiver.


jcmitch


----------



## Anthony A.

ah, i see. thanks for the clarification.


on another note, i need to send my HAI installer the lutron rs232 strings for each light command that is to be tied into the omnipro2 controller. i can't seem to find anything related in the illumination software. can anyone tell me how i can find which button press code i need to have plugged into the HAI software to trigger lights on when the alarm sounds?


also, if i get a copy of HAI pc access software can i plug my laptop into the rs232 port on the omnipro2 and will it load the file automatically or is there a chance it will be password protected from the installer?


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18541086
> 
> 
> ah, i see. thanks for the clarification.
> 
> 
> on another note, i need to send my HAI installer the lutron rs232 strings for each light command that is to be tied into the omnipro2 controller. i can't seem to find anything related in the illumination software. can anyone tell me how i can find which button press code i need to have plugged into the HAI software to trigger lights on when the alarm sounds?
> 
> 
> also, if i get a copy of HAI pc access software can i plug my laptop into the rs232 port on the omnipro2 and will it load the file automatically or is there a chance it will be password protected from the installer?





For Homeworks Illumination software you can find what you need under "Reports".... "Addressing" in the RS-232 column


So, for example


KBP,[01:04:10],2


is


keypad button press processor 1, link 4, device 10, button 2


You can also find it under the programming button and looking at the device properties table below the currently selected keypad/CCO/CCI


Generally speaking, for third party automation I use "phantom" keypads.


----------



## Anthony A.

got it. so then in my case i have a keypad [1:6:10] that has 2 buttons. 1 is "INTERIOR" and the other is "EXTERIOR". "INTERIOR" button has 10 lights associated with it, and "EXTERIOR" has 6 lights it turns on/off. so with the method you mentioned, i don't need to plug in each string individually for each light load, correct? (which would be 10 strings for the "INTERIOR" button, and 6 strings for the "EXTERIOR" button). i would only need to use this string to activate all 10 lights in the "INTERIOR" button: KBP,[01:06:10],1. and KBP,[01:06:10],2 for "EXTERIOR" (which would turn on all 6 light loads associated with thie key button press. is that correct?


----------



## Blowne30M3




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18541333
> 
> 
> got it. so then in my case i have a keypad [1:6:10] that has 2 buttons. 1 is "INTERIOR" and the other is "EXTERIOR". "INTERIOR" button has 10 lights associated with it, and "EXTERIOR" has 6 lights it turns on/off. so with the method you mentioned, i don't need to plug in each string individually for each light load, correct? (which would be 10 strings for the "INTERIOR" button, and 6 strings for the "EXTERIOR" button). i would only need to use this string to actuvate all 10 lights in the "INTERIOR" button: KBP,[01:06:10]. and KBP,[01:06:10],2 for "EXTERIOR" (which would turn on all 6 light loads associated with thie key button press. is that correct?



You aren't triggering individual loads. You are triggering the buttons and the lutron programming will take care of the loads. I am with him though on the phantom keypads. It is always a better idea to attach third party triggers to phantoms in case programming ever changes.


Yes, your example is correct. Though I think the string may be off a little bit, lemme check real quick.


----------



## Blowne30M3

Alright, here's the strings:


\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A



\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A


The spaces are important too by the way. You could probably get away with removing the initial carriage returns, but I use them for safety. Those are the exact commands you need to use.


----------



## Fiasco

You can get the actual button numbers in illumiation by going to the programming screen. Pull up the keypad you want and then highlight the button you want. The description box below will tell you the actual button number you have selected.



You can test by telneting into your processor and executing the command (without the \\x0A\\x0D which are control feed/new line characters).


As mentioned, you will want to setup phatom keypads in your project and assign the buttons on the phantom keypads to control the lights in the manner you want.


Then use the RS232 addresses of the phantom keypads for 3rd party integration.


----------



## Fiasco

In the attached screen grab you can see a phantom keypad I have for a project. You will not want to just assume that the first button is #1.


As you can see I only have the middle column and 3 buttons in the third column active on my phantom keypad.


So, the Movie button I have highlighted is actually button #9 (you can see it up above the button layout on the left)


So, to press the Movie button


KBP,[01:04:10], 9


And the All On button would be


KBP,[01:04:10], 1


The button numbers are from right to left! And there is a number skipped at the bottom of each column. That additional number is used if you set one of the buttons to "raise/lower"


----------



## Fiasco

P.S. I am on Skype and don't mind helping out from time to time when I have time for Lutron owners.


Skype: CardinalZealot


----------



## Anthony A.

wow, thank you both very much for the detailed responses and help. so now i have a few more questions.


1.) phantom keypads - how do i add them in illumination and do i really need to have them if all i need to send to 3rd party is a couple of button presses?


also, my installer added a couple of phantom keypads to 2 maestro dimmers so that i could control them with the iphone lutron app. without making them phantom, there was no way to control these dimmers. does this mean that now by creating phantom keypads for the HAI they will also appear in web-based apps?


2.) so the exact string i need to input into the HAI software and i assume also universal remotes that have serial control of lutron (ie. URC mx-980 remote and MSC 400 base station) would be:


\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A


\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A



however, now im confused as to the purpose of KBP,[01:06:10],1. is this only for using inside illumination software and not for other 3rd party integration?


----------



## Blowne30M3




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18542059
> 
> 
> wow, thank you both very much for the help. so now i have a few more questions.
> 
> 
> 1.) phantom keypads - how do i add them in illumination and do i really need to have them if all i need to send to 3rd party is a couple of button presses?
> 
> 
> also, my installer added a couple of phantom keypads to 2 maestro dimmers so that i could control them with the iphone lutron app. without making them phantom, there was no way to control these dimmers. does this mean that now by creating phantom keypads for the HAI they will also appear in web-based apps?
> 
> 
> 2.) so the exact string i need to input into the HAI software and i assume also universal remotes that have serial control of lutron (ie. URC mx-980 remote and MSC 400 base station) would be:
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A
> 
> 
> 
> however, now im confused as to the purpose of KBP,[01:06:10],1. is this only for using inside illumination software and not for other 3rd party integration?



I'll let Fiasco address number 1, him being the Lutron programmer. As for #2, yes, those are the exact strings you need to put in. Like I said before the command was close, just a little bit off. You need the spaces in there for it to work correctly. The first hex codes (\\x0D\\x0A) are just to clear any existing serial commands in the queue and the last hex codes are to send to the Lutron controller (think of typing a sentence and hitting enter).


----------



## Fiasco

On #1 you are correct you must use a phantom keypad to enable direct control of a maestro device in the lutron app.


You can make any keypad show up in the lutron app by selecting it in the programming screen and setting the "web enabled" box in the property dialog below to YES, it does not have to be a phantom keypad.


In illumination it's a simple as going to the "floorplan" screen in Illumination and then selecting the Other tab in the toolbox on the right side of the screen.


Add phantom keypads to the rooms you want. (the phantom keypads will appear in the app under the rooms you place them in)


I would definatley use phantom keypads for third party controls. If you want to reuse an existing button on a "real" keypad in your project you can copy and past the button onto a phantom keypad button.


Phantom keypads allow you to tweak your setup for 3rd party controllers without messing with the original "real" keypad programming.


You can mess with phantom keypads to your hearts content without much worry of messing up your "real" programming.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18542059
> 
> 
> wow, thank you both very much for the detailed responses and help. so now i have a few more questions.
> 
> 
> 1.) phantom keypads - how do i add them in illumination and do i really need to have them if all i need to send to 3rd party is a couple of button presses?
> 
> 
> also, my installer added a couple of phantom keypads to 2 maestro dimmers so that i could control them with the iphone lutron app. without making them phantom, there was no way to control these dimmers. does this mean that now by creating phantom keypads for the HAI they will also appear in web-based apps?
> 
> 
> 2.) so the exact string i need to input into the HAI software and i assume also universal remotes that have serial control of lutron (ie. URC mx-980 remote and MSC 400 base station) would be:
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A





> Quote:
> however, now im confused as to the purpose of KBP,[01:06:10],1. is this only for using inside illumination software and not for other 3rd party integration?



This is for third party integration


Sending KBP,[01:06:10], 1


Presses button 1 on keypad 10 on link 6 of processor 1.


The reason I prefer phantom keypads for integration is that I can change the phantom keypads programming without affecting the real keypads and vice versa. After a system goes in, the homeowners always request some tweaks. If I was using only real keypad addresses for integration I would have to make changes on two fronts (to the homeworks system and to the 3rd party control).


----------



## Anthony A.

okay understood. im gonna fiddle around with the phantom keypad trick. i think i have this whole protocol thing somewhat figured (alteast for the couple of things i need to do). so just to confirm then, if i plug in these strings into the HAI controller:


\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A


\\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A


then when the alarm sounds, it will toggle these on? and when i want to turn them off, simply go to that specific keypad and the led should be illuminated and i can then toggle it off?


and what if the "INTERIOR" button is already engaged when the alarm sounds, does the lutron processor know its current state and the HAI will keep them on and not turn them off? (kind of like a discrete ir command)


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18542457
> 
> 
> okay understood. im gonna fiddle around with the phantom keypad trick. so just to confirm then, if i plug in these strings into the HAI controller:
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 1\\x0D\\x0A
> 
> 
> \\x0D\\x0AKBP, [01:06:10], 2\\x0D\\x0A
> 
> 
> then when the alarm sounds, it will toggle these on? and when i want to turn them off, simply go to that specific keypad and the led should be illuminated and i can then toggle it off?
> 
> 
> and what if the "INTERIOR" button is already engaged when the alarm sounds, does the lutron processor know its current state and the HAI will keep them on and not turn them off? (kind of like a discrete ir command)



Try this.


In Illumination

Go to Programming

click Security


You now have a bunch of options on what you would like security mode to do. Lights to be toggled, keypads to be disabled, ect. You will also see a checkbox for "restore all lights to previous levels". Check that.


Now create a phantom keypad with just two buttons enabled.


Select the first button and name it "Security Mode On". Click the globals tab and select security mode from the list, make sure "begin" is selected and add it to the button.


Select the second button and name it "Security Mode Off". Click the globals tab and select security mode from the list, make sure "terminate" is selected and add it to the button.


Now you can program your security mode in Illumination and only have to worry about pressing one of two buttons to toggle security mode off and on.


This has an added benefit. When you terminate security mode it will restore all lights/cco's/ ect to the level they were at before security mode was activated.


----------



## Anthony A.

quick update. all ceiling speakers have been installed on the main floor and basement. i have 2 in the kitchen/breakfast area, 2 in the dining room, and 2 in the basement bar. i still have to wire a pair in the master bedroom and a single in the master ensuite. i also may add one in the family room which is open to the kitchen/breakfast area.


i wil have to tackle that project when im up for it since i will need to go into the attic, move some insulation around, cut the vapour barrier, re-seal it, etc. its quite a bit of work and i now regret not building a box for them prior to drywall. in any case, here are some pics.



KITCHEN/BREAKFAST





















DINING ROOM


----------



## Anthony A.

for distributed audio, the russound mca-c5 controller is used with a total of 4 mdk-c5 keypads throught the house. 1 is located in the basement bar, 1 on the main floor in the family room (which is open concept to the kitchen/breakfast area) and 2 on the 2nd floor. 1 is in the master bedroom and another in the master ensuite. i don't think i will get much use out of them since i will be using my iphone for control.


FAMILY ROOM

(Russound MDK-C5 Keypad and Lutron Keypad)


----------



## Fiasco

Could you have mounted those two together in a 3 gang box. Is the russound controller the same width and height (minus the semicircles) as a 2 gang decora?


----------



## Anthony A.

no, it is slightly bigger. it would be nice and seamless that way, but unfortunately no dice.


what i wish i did differently was install a 1" shim on the single gang box below to have it centered to the russound keypad. oh well, next time!!


----------



## captaincondor

I am pretty sure you could have mounted them in a three gang box. I think Russound accounted for their intercom system and made an appropriate face plate. Not that it matters. I like the screwless faceplates alot too


----------



## Anthony A.

hmmm, technically you could mount the keypad and the lutron switch in a 3 gang, but i don't remember seeing a compatible faceplate for the 3. if you have a link or pic of it i would be interested. you never know, i may get the itch down the road to make some "tweaks" with the appearance.


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18551864
> 
> 
> hmmm, technically you could mount the keypad and the lutron switch in a 3 gang, but i don't remember seeing a compatible faceplate for the 3. if you have a link or pic of it i would be interested. you never know, i may get the itch down the road to make some "tweaks" with the appearance.



From the pictures it looked like the square portion of the russound controller is the same dimensions as the w x h of a dual gang decora faceplate openings (imagine the center divider between openings removed) in which case a 3 gang decora could be milled to fit both controls in one box.


I may be wrong but I think that Lutron also might custom make faceplates for such applications.


I know there is a couple fabrication shops here in STL that will custom mill faceplates for applications like yours. It all depends upon how much you are will to pay for aesthetics I guess.


If you do get that itch I wouldn't think it would be too difficult to patch the single gang and swap the two gang out for a three gang since the drywall appears to be textureless.


----------



## Anthony A.

thats true. custom would be the way to go. mind you, i really don't see myself using the russound keypads much anyway, especially since i will be using my iphone for control and possibly the ipad in several rooms around the house when it comes to canada (next month).


the only reason i never went with a full crestron setup was because i wanted to have 4 touchpanels around the house and that would have cost me an arm. the ipad is a great solution at an excellent price. hopefully HAI, [email protected] or even MYRO will come out with some nice GUI apps for it and i can have the touchpanel control i have always wanted.


----------



## gumati

nice topic mate


do u recommend Russound for audio Distribution ??


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18554391
> 
> 
> thats true. custom would be the way to go. mind you, i really don't see myself using the russound keypads much anyway, especially since i will be using my iphone for control and possibly the ipad in several rooms around the house when it comes to canada (next month).
> 
> 
> the only reason i never went with a full crestron setup was because i wanted to have 4 touchpanels around the house and that would have cost me an arm. the ipad is a great solution at an excellent price. hopefully HAI, [email protected] or even MYRO will come out with some nice GUI apps for it and i can have the touchpanel control i have always wanted.



You can always try your hand at CommandFusion for the iPhone/iPad.


----------



## JTR7

Hey,

I'm wondering. What's the necessary prewiring for HomeWorks 4? I'm considering it in the new house and I can't find it anywhere on the internet.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *gumati* /forum/post/18555051
> 
> 
> nice topic mate
> 
> 
> do u recommend Russound for audio Distribution ??



i think its pretty good for the price. audio distribution really has a lot to do with features that the end user wants/needs. the mca-c5 had the inputs and sources that i needed, and the keypads displayed all the info i was looking for. there are many choices out there and only you can be the judge. but overall, im very happy with the russound. not a glitch and the internal amps sound decent. i only wish it had a doorbell function (other than page/mute) so i could have doorbell tunes play directly over the system. that is my next project.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Fiasco* /forum/post/18555059
> 
> 
> You can always try your hand at CommandFusion for the iPhone/iPad.



im actually looking into it. i may create my own ipad version.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *JTR7* /forum/post/18614261
> 
> 
> Hey,
> 
> I'm wondering. What's the necessary prewiring for HomeWorks 4? I'm considering it in the new house and I can't find it anywhere on the internet.



its fairly simple really. basically, all your light loads go straight to the equipment/electrical room. from there, you connect each light load to a zone on the wallbox power module. the wpm has a live load/neutral and ground connection. each wpm should be on a 15a breaker, so you take the power from the main electrical panel and connect it to the wpm. thats it for high voltage.


for low voltage, you need lutron pink i believe (4 conductor) for the keypads and lutron blue (2 conductor) for dimmers. i used crestnet cable cause my dealer had extra and its essentially the same wire (thats why its green in the pics).


now this is where you need to decide. if you want to use keypads everywhere, then the light loads go directly to the equipment room. if on the other hand you want rooms to use maestro dimmers (say closets, bathrooms, etc), then you need to wire these rooms to use a light switch. these loads DO NOT get connected to the wpm. all you need to do for these types of lights is run lutron blue to each dimmer/switch location and back to the processor.


let me know if my answer is concise enough.


----------



## JTR7

That's concise enough. And if like someone else suggested a ways back you do what they do and wire the wpm into the back of a closet or something closer to the load itself to save wire. What connects the wpm to the processor?


Do keypads get wired directly to the processor then?


Oh, and by the way, what did the wpms cost each and what did the processor cost?


----------



## Anthony A.

i personally like the centralized wpm near the main breaker panel. wpm's really are designed by lutron to be put in closets, but for a homeworks 4 system, i think the centralized way is easier to troubleshoot and can always be replaced one day to a homeworks 8 or vantage, crestron, etc. you can also take the system out and run everything off the breaker panel if need be.


each wpm gets daisy chanined together and then a single wire back to the processor.


keypads all get connected to the processor, or can be daisy chained i think at a max of 6 per run.


cost for me is different since im in canada and is usually more $$$ than usa, but roughly $800/wpm and processor is around $2k-$2.5k.


----------



## Fiasco




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18619087
> 
> 
> i personally like the centralized wpm near the main breaker panel. wpm's really are designed by lutron to be put in closets, but for a homeworks 4 system, i think the centralized way is easier to troubleshoot and can always be replaced one day to a homeworks 8 or vantage, crestron, etc. you can also take the system out and run everything off the breaker panel if need be.
> 
> 
> each wpm gets daisy chanined together and then a single wire back to the processor.
> 
> 
> keypads all get connected to the processor, or can be daisy chained i think at a max of 6 per run.
> 
> 
> cost for me is different since im in canada and is usually more $$$ than usa, but roughly $800/wpm and processor is around $2k-$2.5k.



Placing the WPM's close to the loads (ie,nearby closets, pantries ect) drastically reduces the amount of wire and electrician labor over home running every thing.


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## herdfan

JTR7,


One thing to keep in mind is that Anthony used one method for installing a Series 4. You can also use a decentralized method and use wired HW Maestro's and wire the house in a standard configuration. The same processor can then control each wired device. You can also add keypads to set scenes etc.


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## JTR7

Thanks herdfan. So regular Maestro dimmers or do they have to be special?


Anthony, any idea if it's possible to use those keypads with the CAV6.6 since they both use the RNET protocol? The UNO keypads look like junk.


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## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *JTR7* /forum/post/18623284
> 
> 
> Thanks herdfan. So regular Maestro dimmers or do they have to be special?



They are special. Look for HWD as the first 3 digits in the model #. Will cost a bit more than using WPM's, but you can use traditional house wiring. You would just need to run the control wires.


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *JTR7* /forum/post/18623284
> 
> 
> Anthony, any idea if it's possible to use those keypads with the CAV6.6 since they both use the RNET protocol? The UNO keypads look like junk.



no, they only work with the mca controller. rnet protocol, from what i know, is not universal among their units and specific to each series. i know because i wanted to use the e-series style but no dice.


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## Anthony A.

i personally feel that the homeworks system strength is in using keypads to control multiple lights. lets say in the kitchen you want 5 lights to control. that would be 5 maestro switches. or, you could use a single keypad to control all of them. much sleeker in my opinion. the only place i would use maestro switches is for bedrooms, closets, baths, etc. if i could do it all over again, i would put keypads everywhere and only use maestro's for closets. once you get accustomed to using keypads, you will hate switches.


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## Anthony A.

on a side note, i just bought the [email protected] app from digitaldan and its awesome. i still don't have the lights or russound progammed yet into the HAI controller, but the HVAC and alarm is amazing. pretty soon, i will need to start researching cctv cameras for my place. i prewired for 4.


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## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/18627419
> 
> 
> i would put keypads everywhere and only use maestro's for closets. once you get accustomed to using keypads, you will hate switches.



Actually, my wife likes being able to hit a large switch as she leaves the room. For example, in our MBR at the door in a 4 gang box I have Maestro, Keypad, Maestro, Maestro. The first Maestro turns on the bedroom light. But once it is on, pressing it as you leave the room turns off all the lights. Of course, the keypad next to it allows for scene control, but 95% of the time, we use main Maestro.


Of course, I have a wireless system that was retrofit, so I already had all of those switches in place and if I were installing a new system, I might do it differently.


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## Anthony A.

well, i've run into my first issue with the HAI thermostat and my AC unit. the thermostat clicks, but does not seem to have enough power to actually turn on the AC unit. i tested the AC line voltage by bypassing the thermostat and it works fine. HAI tech is stumped, although they think i need to get an HVAC transformer. they say the thermostat power supply module will not fix the issue. my installer will be coming out in a few weeks to replace my rc-1000 to the rc-2000 and also supply a power module. i don't think this will get resolved.


any advice?


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## Fiasco

Is your Omnistat reseting when it tries to engage the AC?


You mentioned your power supply module. Your symptoms sound just like my omnistat before I installed the power supply module.


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## Anthony A.

i believe so. it actually locks up completely as it tries to start the ac. it will continue to click, but i cannot make any changes. only way to get it working again is to take the cover off... which is like a hard reset. is this the same symptom as yours?


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## Fiasco

Exactly the same. Did you already check the connections on your power module?


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## Anthony A.

i have not yet received the power module. i will be replacing the rc-1000 that i have now with the rc-2000 and at the same time add the power module in. i checked the wiring on the rc-1000 already and i have it connected properly with a common wire on #3.


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## Anthony A.

as an update the rc-2000 thermostat is still on back-order. this week has been the hottest this year and having no AC running has been very painful, especially at night. so off i went and wired up a digital thermostat i had lying around and voila... i now have AC.


so hopefully the HAI power module will fix up the thermostat issue i am having once it arrives.


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## milll36

i think that you could try another solution buy a 24 vac transformer,and connect it to connection port 1(rc i think) and 3 c , and it shoud work


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *milll36* /forum/post/18707193
> 
> 
> i think that you could try another solution buy a 24 vac transformer,and connect it to connection port 1(rc i think) and 3 c , and it shoud work



if the hai thermostat module doesnt fix the problem, that will be my next step.




on a side note, i am trying to program the lights into the hai software but no luck controlling them. for example, this is what should be written into the address field:


KBP,[01:06:07],2


in pc access i have setup "expansion"-"serial" to "lutron homeworks", and in "access" under "units", i have set the "house code format" to "lutron homeworks". all that is left is to add the "address/node id". now here is where i can't get it to work. i have tried inputting KBP, but it won't allow it. i also tried only the keypad address of 1:6:7 and no go. finally tried the actual button address 1:5:4:4 and again no luck. what am i doing wrong?


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## Anthony A.

okay, well it appears i found the issue. baud rate on lutron for rs232 link was not set at 9600, so it wouldn't connect to omnipro. i had it set at max values... i guess it must be exact for it to work. in any case, i now have the lights working through the omnipro, although the fireplace contact closures only work by making macros. also, in pc access (for anyone who has this issue in the future), you need to type in the exact light address for proper light status.


also finally received the rc-2000 and thermostat module and happy to report that it works perfectly. ac starts up no problem and the added features of the rc-2000 are well worth the price difference.


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## Anthony A.

so now that i have the system up and running the way i want it to (after hours of programming macros and testing), i am ready for more tweaks to my system. here is what im thinking of:


1.) add additional siren inside house to make it louder

2.) add an exterior siren and strobe light

3.) doorbell automation

4.) security camera integration


after talking to my installer, he said the siren output on the board only provides 1A of power. so you really should only have 2 sirens. easy enough to add the 2nd internal siren, but how do i install the 3rd outdoor one with strobe light? i was looking at the elk sirens and strobes, but any other suggestions are appreciated.


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## Snap_75

Anthony,


Sorry this is late and you may have found a solution for adding more sirens than the Omni P2 can handle but one way is to place a relay on the output for the siren. Then you can wire your sirens through the contact(s) of the relay using a seperate power supply or battery. You just need to use a 12 VDC coil relay and hook the coil to terminals INT (+12 VDC) and grnd (0VDC) on the Omni P2 for your interion horn(s). You can also add a second relay and hook the positive terminal of the coil to EXT for exterior horn(s) and the negative terminal to grnd. Hope this helps!


Samer


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## Anthony A.

im looking to get a lutron stwd-4sir keypad for one of my rooms. basically want to add a floor lamp as well as ir control. has anyone used this ir keypad before and if so, how sensitive is it? does the remote need to be pointed to it directly or can it be 20' away and still get the signal?


thanks.


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## herdfan

I have a st*r*d-4sir, which is the Wireless version and it works great. It is located off at an angle (I can measure distance and angle when I get home) and it has never missed a command.


Plus, there are 12 IR commands that can be used, so you are not limited to the 5 buttons.


I also have another one that is hooked to a URC MSC-400 that provides global house scenes from any URC remote.


But since you have a Series 4, you can also use the IR window on a CCI board and use an RF repeater with flasher to trigger scenes.



From your post a couple up I had missed:


> Quote:
> but how do i install the 3rd outdoor one with strobe light?



Don't know if you came up with a solution, but the Lutron system can flash lights as well as on/off. When our Panic button is pressed, it puts the system in security mode and flashes all the outside lights. An alarm trigger from the Elk also does this and HAI can do so as well.


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## Anthony A.

im still looking into my options for the additional sirens and strobe. little time lately












but in regards to the keypad, i think im going to pull the trigger. in my case, it is behind the sofa and would be ackward to have to point the remote backwards all the time, but if it is as sensitive as you say, then i think it will work nicely. thanks for the tip about the 12 commands too. i did not know that and it saves me from having to buy another keypad for the kitchen.


so, im assuming that:


1.) you can control any 12 lights/scenes you want in addition to raise/lower commands.


2.) you would need the grx-8it remote to program the ir commands into a universal remote. (but how do you get 12 commands from it, as it only has 8 buttons)


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## herdfan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Anthony A.* /forum/post/19355041
> 
> 
> imso, im assuming that:
> 
> 
> 1.) you can control any 12 lights/scenes you want in addition to raise/lower commands.
> 
> 
> 2.) you would need the grx-8it remote to program the ir commands into a universal remote. (but how do you get 12 commands from it, as it only has 8 buttons)



1) Actually 10 plus Raise/Lower but the R/L can be programmed as a scene instead.


2) I never bought the Lutron Remote as my URC remote has all the Lutron commands.


To program additional IR input, when you add the 4SIR to your project, you will be able to access a drop-down box under the keypad box. Just swap Current View to IR Inputs. See pic.


If you want to use the R/L as a scene, when you have selected one of the R/L buttons, on the lower righ of the pic notice the drop down box that says Raise/Lower. Change that to Default and you can program the R/L buttons as scene. I rarely ever use R/L on Keypads. In fact, the 4SIR is the only keypad I have that has a R/L button. But then again, I have all Maestro's so dimming at the source is easy for me.


Tonight I will test how well the IR sensor receives via a bounce off the wall and let you know.


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## herdfan

Ok, no go trying to bounce it off the wall. Got no response.


From my seat in the media room, it is 17' to the 4SIR and about a 45 deg angle. I need to angle the remote to about half that (20-25 deg) to get it to work reliably.


I would suggest at least putting the 4SIR in your wiring closet and using some sort of repeater system.


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## Anthony A.

thanks for trying that. experience is always the best way to test










so since the keypad is behind my seating position, i think i may have to point to it for control. its more of a convenience thing, i really don't see myself using it all the time so it may work out anyway. as for the theater room lights, i may just run a wire from the ir on the contact closure board for control or control them through my HAI controller.


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## Anthony A.

hey just want to confirm, each ir keypad is capable of 12 commands, so i could get 5 keypads around the house and ultimately have 60 stored commands on my remote, correct?


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## herdfan

Yes but each keypad will still only capable of those 12 commands. So you can't think you have 60 commands from anywhere in the house.


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## Anthony A.

okay i understand what you mean. i should have been more specific to say that 2 keypads (for the theater) will have ir emitters going to an rf base unit, so technically my theater remote could have 24 commands programmed at its fingertips and still be able to control those lights from anywhere in the house.


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## herdfan

Yes, just make sure the emitters won't hit both keypads.


You can actually get more commands if you are will to do "states". For example, "Button 1" toggles the state for A or B. Then using conditional programming, you would have 11 commands for each state.


A good remote like the MX-980 or a base like the MSC-400 can track the states on the remote, so you will be only give the commands for the state the system is in.


The states can be manually generated, ie you make them up or based on time clock.


For example, I have a Petsitter State. If it is activated (which is done via a web only keypad), then for example, the Welcome button at the front door adds additional lights and the Goodbye button turns on some additional outside lights and keeps them on for 10 minutes.


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## Anthony A.

herdfan, thanks for the help. im just starting to program a urc mx-980 remote, but it seems that there is no "homeworks" option in the ir database. i see other choices, so would i just one of these instead? for now, im going to simply use the contact closure board ir and hook it up into the MRF base station ir inputs. is there a way to get the pre-programmed ir commands or must i purchase the lutron grx remote and "learn" them?


thanks.


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## herdfan

I will look and see which Lutron one I used. I also have an MX-980.


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## kyleronan

Glad i found this thread. I learned a lot! Thanks to all helpful replies!


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## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Fiasco* /forum/post/18356067
> 
> 
> Anthony,
> 
> 
> solid choice on the Lutron lighting system. 100% reliability is what you paid for and got.
> 
> 
> Normally in a new installation such as yours we spread Series 4 wallbox power modules out throught the home to minimize wiring requirements (place the wall boxes as close to the loads as possible in closets, pantries ect.
> 
> 
> You did a fantastic job on your structured wiring.
> 
> 
> What are you using for remote control? I have a RadioRa2 system I just installed in my house and use CommandFusion on the iphone for remote control.
> 
> 
> I use a combination of EventGhost running on an XBMC HTPC and GlobalCache units for full house automation.
> 
> 
> So, like you, I have single automation buttons on my iphone and keypads that interact with multiple systems simultaneously. The best example in my house is the "Sleep" button on my CommandFusion iphone remote and "Sleep" button on the master bedroom RA keypad. Pushing "Sleep" delay dims lights in pathways, shuts down other lights, turns on over cabinet/undercabinet night lighting, bumps our Omnistat thermostat back to 72 deg, turns on the over bed ceiling fan and shuts down all audio/visual equipment in the house.



im actually looking into commandfusion at the moment for total home control. right now, i use [email protected] app that controls all my HAI automation (hvac, lutron lights, alarm, cameras, etc.). im looking of getting some ip2ir itach units so as to control my theater equipment through my ipad. i have looked into irule but the 2=way feedback is still limited at the moment. it is quite easy to program though and not sure how much of a learning curve commandfusion will be in comparison.


ultimately, i would like to have a single app that controls all of my automation system as well as my theater and living room tv setup. is this possible to do (one app for all) with command fusion? any advice/suggestions as to how 2-way would work with the HAI panel?


----------



## Neurorad

Welcome back to your thread, Anthony.










I don't recall what control system you are using for your TVs, if any.


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## Fiasco

CommandFusion will do what you want. The learning curve will be much steeper than irule. Then again, irule isn't in the league as CF.


The difficulty really depends on the integration protocols of what you want to control.


With the addition of full scripting support in CF iviewer 4 pretty much anything is possible. CF now has a JavaScript module repository on github so another developer may have already tackled some of your devices.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Neurorad* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Welcome back to your thread, Anthony.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don't recall what control system you are using for your TVs, if any.



Hehe I know, I've been enjoying my theater too much and haven't made as many appearances as I would have liked










But check out the last page of my theater build of screenshots of my URC mx980 remote with custom GUI I designed. I have all my components running off of an msc400 base station. In my living room, im using an mx450 remote and mrf260.


I want to keep both of these systems as us, simply supplement them with iPad control. I believe one member here used an mrf unit coupled to a GC itch and wad able to pass through ir commands to his components from the mrf. That is exactly what I would like to do, although it would mean me having to re-write all of my macros over again for the iPad/itch control.


----------



## Anthony A.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Fiasco* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> CommandFusion will do what you want. The learning curve will be much steeper than irule. Then again, irule isn't in the league as CF.
> 
> 
> The difficulty really depends on the integration protocols of what you want to control.
> 
> 
> With the addition of full scripting support in CF iviewer 4 pretty much anything is possible. CF now has a JavaScript module repository on github so another developer may have already tackled some of your devices.



Are there any video tutorials for beginners? After watching all of the URC tutorials, I was able to program my theater system easily and pretty quickly. Does CF have a master ir/rs232 database or must I input/learn every command/string?


----------

