# Chuck Williams Fan Mod, WOW!!



## johnboy

I thought I should let all of you know. I had Chuck Williams over yesterday. He modified the fans in my NEC 10PG. From what I understand he has a similar modification for the Sony's as well. The fans that use to be loud are so quiet that its amazing. I would say about a 90% difference in the sound being lowered. And yes the projector does NOT get hot at all. Forget hush boxes and all of the construction needed to help quiet your projector. Run don't walk to the phone and ask Chuck for his fan modification. Its the perfect solution. Thanks Chuck for a great job, I now can enjoy my projector during those quite moments in a movie.


Regards

Johnboy


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## Dave Harper

FYI, there is also a fan mod for the Electrohome Marquee line of projectors that quiets the noise considerably for all you Marquee owners out there!!!


Tim Martin knows how to do it, as well as myself and a few others if interested.


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## jrwood

Sounds cool, any tips for a LCD newbie?, my first projector is a Sony VPL-CX1 if thats any help 


thanks!


James


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## bryan_chow

Is there a mod for the Sony 1272? How much (roughly) would a mod cost to install?


Thanks,

Bryan


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## macleodm

Quote:

Sounds cool, any tips for a LCD newbie?
 Here is a tool that will quiet any lamp projector for only $44.99


I have heard reports on poor reliability after the mod though...


Mark.


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## jrwood

Tah Mark great help, having a bad day are we


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## macleodm

Quote:

Tah Mark great help, having a bad day are we?
Sorry, just having a little fun. Lamp projectors are difficult to quiet while still maintaining cooling.


Mark.


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## shanemac

...thanks mark...


That was the best laugh I had all week.


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## gn2

Hah, Hah, Hah, Hah.......Hah, Hah!!!


Good one! (Wiping away the tears)


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## Tom Rosback

Hurry hurry, only one left in stock!


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## jrwood

You guys should be CRT salesmen, your commision would be ...


np mark


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## Chuck Williams

John,


Thanks for your post! It was pretty quiet after I was done, wasn't it?


I'll be posting more info on this mod in a couple of days. It will work on Sony VPH12XX and NEC PG series, and maybe later, XG series.


Chuck


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## midmadn

Quote:

_Originally posted by Chuck Williams_
*John,

I'll be posting more info on this mod in a couple of days. It will work on Sony VPH12XX and NEC PG series, and maybe later, XG series.


Chuck*
Wow, I'm so excited. The thought of not having an Airplane, (1271Q) taking off next to me while watching a Movie.


Thanks in advance for sharing this tweak with us.


Jack


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## johnwcookjr

Chuck,


A mod for my XG135 would be most welcome. Keep me posted.


John


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## Curt Palme

Jumping in late here, but excellent post Mark! You forgot one thing though, you need this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI...tem=1664801746 


afterwards for a decent burial.


Gotta say, it's been a bit boring on the forum, posts like these keep me laughing!


Curt


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## jrwood

I think that tractor should just about do for the size/weight of these CRT projectors 


However they would make great sleighs with a bit of converging / tweaking


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## alared

I was looking at the fan in my Sony last night, it is typical to the Fans used in computers. Frankly I didn't look into the connection, but I thought it was the same voltage.


Computer fans range from $5 to $20 depending upon the bearings.


Has anyone used these in their CRT?


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## Randy S

There was an extensive thread discussing fan mods for the 1292 some time ago. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...+quiet+VPH1292 


Can't wait to see what can be done to the 1272.


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## Chuck Williams

Quote:

_Originally posted by alared_
*

Computer fans range from $5 to $20 depending upon the bearings.


Has anyone used these in their CRT?*
The problem with that is these fans in these projectors have a sensor output to tell the computer that the fan is running. If the computer doesn't see this signal, it shuts down.


Also, you can't just lower the drive voltage to the fans because to get them reasonably quiet with a lower voltage they won't start up upon power up. What I'm working on is a small circuit that applies full power to the fans at power up, then applies the lower running voltage once they're going.


Chuck


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## Alan Gouger

Hi Chuck


I also have a 10pg.


Can this mod be bought from you and installed by a knowledgeable person or does the projector have to be shipped to you?


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## uncle eric

Chuck,

Anything like this for Barco's. I have a BD808s.


Eric


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## kevinu

Chuck,

I would like to do a fan mod to my NEC 9200.

Thanks, Kevin


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## gigone

Quote:

_Originally posted by alared_
*I was looking at the fan in my Sony last night, it is typical to the Fans used in computers. Frankly I didn't look into the connection, but I thought it was the same voltage.


Computer fans range from $5 to $20 depending upon the bearings.


Has anyone used these in their CRT?*
I own a Sony VPH 1270


I substituted all four 80mm original fans with the quiet pc-powerandcooling fans (rated almost 20 dB).


It was an usless waste of money since the noise is due to airflow blowing within closed spaces. If you remove the original fan from its orginal position and you let it run in open air you'll discover that it is almost inaudible. :-(


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## Chuck Williams

Alan,


If you're even moderately handy with electronics, you can install it yourself. The problem with doing it on a 10PG and a Sony 12XX is that you have to remove the power supply to get to the two fans mounted there, and they are two of the noisiest.


Eric,


I've never had a Barco in my possesion to play with and possibly trash, so I've never tried it on a Barco, but since my basic premise on this issue is that these projectors are industrial grade units, the cooling system is designed for harsh environments and worst case situations that just aren't there in a home theater application, it really should work on a Barco, too. I'd need to know the fan voltage and polarity of the supply voltage.


Gigone,


According to my service manual, there are 6 fans in a 1270, the two yoou didn't find are on the power supply, and like the 10PG, are tough to get to and make a lot of the noise.


Chuck


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## osker

HI, Chuck

Were would be a good location to put a sensor to monitor the temp. on a NEC PG projector? and would you know what the normal operating temp. should be? Alos if your thinking of making a list of people who would want to buy this circuit board, or parts, please put me on your list. Thanks for your imformation. Osker


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## Gordon Fraser

Chuck's correct. There are two more fans. I found them by chance when I took my lenses off to clean the thing out.


If you pull out the power supply boards that are situated under the lens assemblies you'll find the screened housing with the two fans on the internal side. Easiest way to get at them is probably to remove the lenses first then the housing itself.


Gordon


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## Bruno Lovisi

Hi,


Just to complete Chuck answer about sony's 12xx fans :


there are 7 fans, a little one is located at rear of pj, under IR cell board and it's not the quietest! a 40mm I think


my 2 cents!


I can't wait for your solution Chuck! quick!


best regards



Bruno Lovisi

Nice, France


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## gigone

Quote:

_Originally posted by Chuck Williams_
*Alan,


Gigone,


According to my service manual, there are 6 fans in a 1270, the two yoou didn't find are on the power supply, and like the 10PG, are tough to get to and make a lot of the noise.


Chuck*
To tell the truth I did find the two fans located near the power supply but I preferred not to change them in order not to reduce the capability of cooling of that section of the projector.


Could you -kindly- add me to your list of people interested about your mod?


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## David F

Chuck, add me to your list of interested people for a mod to a 9PG. (I had you up to my place to do a calibration last spring, in Harrisburg, PA). Thanks!


David Forbes


e-mail [email protected] or [email protected]


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## FAR64

Chuck,

Please contact me when you have a mod for the xg135lc ready to go. You can reach me at [email protected] 

Thanks

FAR64


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## Patrick J

I'm also very interested, I have a Sony 1252.

[email protected] 



Patrick J.


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## JasonBrooks

Count me in for the Sony 1252 mod. My email is [email protected]


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## Brian Hampton

Hey,


I'm interested for my Sony 1271. I'm also confident I can perform the mod myself as I can access all the fans and I can build the likely simple circuits.


Chuck Rulz.


-Brian


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## Colin

Chuck

You seem to have quite a following among sony 12XX folks. Guess we are pretty tired of our noisy machines. Anyway, your point about these being industrial units is well taken, but slowing down the fans does make me a bit nervous. Anyone else? This probably comes from a feeling that there is something to be said for headroom/fudge factor. Will the PJ shut down if it gets too hot, and is there a difference in life expectancy over the long hall if the internal temp is say 20 degrees higher than if the fans were at full blast? 10 degrees? 5 degrees? Thanks and please add me to the list of interested people


Colin
[email protected]


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## Chuck Williams

Colin,


Glad you asked about the "increase" in temperature. What's made me really begin to think that this is a dandy idea is what I refer to as the "two finger touch" common sense approach. I've taken a Sony 1252 and essentially slowed the fans to much slower than what they will be with my mod, pumped 720p at max horizontal width into it and let it run for a couple of hours. Then I take two fingers and touch the heat sinks on the deflection board, power supply and video output circuits. They are warm to the touch, but not hot, and not very different from normal. This leads me to believe that the difference in life expectancy between slow, quiet fans and full blast roaring fans is negligible. The noise difference, however, is stunning.


I've also done this on a PG9 over two years ago because the customer wouldn't live with the noise it put out, so it was either make it quiet or loose the sale. Even with full blast fans, the heat sink on the deflection board gets pretty hot and almost fails the two finger test, but this projector has been running just fine for two years now. John Klados's PG 10 (he started this thread) is super quiet, and he doesn't detect any increase in temperature around the projector.


Will it work on an NEC XG/Barco/AmPro? I don't know yet, but I'll bet it will. Can I absolutely guarantee there will be no long term reliability problems? No. Can I guarantee it will run quietly and with reasonable assurance of reliability? Absolutely.


Everyone interested in this mod should please e-mail me at [email protected] , and I'll keep you informed as I work out more details.


Chuck


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## johnboy

Allen,


I believe Chuck told me that he was planning on having them available for those in the know who can install it themselves.


Johnboy


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## Jerry Arseneau

My 1272 must be more sensitive to reducing the fan voltage than others, so I had to settle for the fans running at 1/2 speed instead of 1/3 normal speed as Chuck's original circuit did.


When doing the installation, I started with the fans near the control panel which slowed down with no problem. But when I patched in the fan on the side, the FAN STOP code kicked in when the slowdown engaged. The same thing happened with the fans in the power supply. All the fans _ran_ in the slow mode, they just made the protection circuit kick in. I found that the protection circuit needed between 7.5 and 8V to the power supply fans to not get the error code. Chuck had some suggestions for reducing the sensitivity, but since the power supply is about as easy to remove/install as a car radio in a '67 Camaro, I opted for the higher speed.


To get the mod to work in my 1272, I substituted a 9.1V zener for the 6.1V zener that controls the reduced voltage to the fans. This way the fans startup with -15V and then go to -8. Even at this level the noise reduction is great! The only fans I still hear are the power supply fans and now they sound more like a computer fan instead of an air conditioner.


Thanks Chuck for a great idea!


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## Randy S

Jerry - Don't suppose you took any temp readings inside the housing pre and post mod did you? Also, what is the length of the delay provided by the 555?


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## Jerry Arseneau

The 555 delay is close to 1 second. Sorry, I don't have a temperature probe but nothing appears to be hot when I put my hand on the components with the covers open.


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## Randy S

Thanks, that's what I'm seeing; one second just seems brief. Here's a calculator I ran across that will allow you to experiment with different resistor and/or capacitor values to see what's necessary to increase the delay should you need to. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homep...Bowden/555.htm 


I took one reading in the rear of the chassis, hood on, for a period of 2 1/2 hours and the temp peaked around 98 degrees before the mod. I'll take another tonight between the boards to establish another baseline.


12/4 - I placed the temp probe under the DC & E boards near the tube cavity and the temp peaked around 105 degrees (Pre-mod). Temp went up roughly 10 degrees after the mod.


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## Chuck Williams

Randy,


Glad it seems to work for you. One second is all you need to get the fans going, that's the point of the circuit. If you just applied the lower voltage to the fans at turn on, they wouldn't start up reliably. And, 98 degrees is zero problem. How's the fan noise now (as if I didn't know )?


Chuck


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## Randy S

I changed the 12k resistor to something in the 46k range to give me approximately a four second delay. No particular reason, but it's a great reminder of whence we came each time you turn the projector on. In light of Jerry's issues with the 6.1v zener, I went in with the 9.1v as well.


When I powered the projector on, the fans ran full tilt for three or four seconds, then dropped down to roughly half speed. My wife thought the projector turned off! The difference in sound level is very impressive.


Post-mod temp reading under the DC & E boards (right behind the tubes) went from 105 to 115 degrees. I don't believe a 10 degree jump is going to have a material effect on the projector.


At some point, I may install a 7v or 8v zener to see what effect that has on the temp and fan noise.


And yes, the fans on the back of the power supply ARE tougher to deal with than installing a car radio in a '67 Camaro as Jerry suggested. 


Thanks again Chuck!


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## Chuck Williams

Randy,


Which model do you have? I would expect a temperature increase like you describe on a 1270, less on a 1251/1271 and less still on a 1272/1252. I think the heat you're measuring is coming from the video output section (the metal box under the E and DC boards), and the video output section from 1272/1252 runs much cooler than a 1270.


Chuck


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## Randy S

It's a 1272, or supposed to be 


I'll take a reading from the rear of the chassis tonight. The last reading in this area was 97 degrees or so (pre-mod).


My projector is ceiling mounted, what impact do you think convection has on this? Seems that as heat rises and collects in the top (formerly bottom when floor mounted) of the chassis, the overall temp would rise higher than if it were floor mounted?


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## G_ROM

Chuck any idea if your mod could be done on a VPH-D50QM ?


I would love to have a much quieter projector...


G_ROM


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## Chuck Anstey

How are you guys configuing your 555's and how are you wiring them in? It sounds like a mono-stable configuration. Has anyone tried a pulse-width modulation configuration? I suppose you could even use a temperature sensitive resistor to increase the pulse width when the projector got hotter. I remember from my model railroad days that the DC motors of the trains ran best with pulse-width modulation @ ~40 Hz. Much better than simply lowering the voltage.


I love to know exactly what you guys are doing and see if I can apply some of my old micro-circuit knowledge to play around.


Chuck Anstey


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## George Kouzev

Chuck,


Do you know id a Sony D50 would work well at reduced fan speeds. As you probably know, it has three fans only at the back which are easily accessible for modification.


GK


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## Jerry Arseneau

The 555 is used solely to actuate the 12V bypass relay. The relay contacts put a short accross the power transistor to get the fans full voltage for a second which overcomes inertia, goo, etc.


The eventual fan voltage is controlled by how much the power transistor is biased ON. So the frequency to the fans is just DC with no pulsing. It would be interesting to see how the protection circuit reacts to a pulsed output to the fans. The high level of the pulse might keep the protection from tripping even at very low speeds, or the low part of the pulse might make it react at any reduction.


Randy - I can see your point about the 4 second delay. The most fun about the mod is hearing the fans go from a roar to a whisper.  You might want to check if the power transistor is getting really hot from the longer time it gets shorted this way.


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## steve

Actually, the 2N3055 would remain cool during the period of time that the collector and emitter are shorted, because the current would be flowing through the relay contacts and not the transistor. The 2N3055 passes the current (and hence, heats up), once the bypass relay opens.


Regarding the heat builup of the 2N3055, this is a 115 watt NPN power transistor. If you know how much current is being drawn by all the fans, you can calculate how much power the transistor passes, and hence, what kind of heatsink it needs. If you are concerned that the transistor is operating near its design limit, you can always change to a higher power transistor, or connect two 2N3055's in parallel to increase the power handling capacity. However, for most users, this should not be a problem.


You may wish to consider adding a fuse before the voltage regulator input to protect the source from which you are drawing the 15 volts, as a safety precaution. Should, for example, the voltage regulator short out, the possibilty exists that the circuit supplying the 15 volts to the fan speed reduction circuit (such as, for example, the deflection board) could be damaged.


steve


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## alared

Quote:

_Originally posted by Chuck Williams_
*


The problem with that is these fans in these projectors have a sensor output to tell the computer that the fan is running. If the computer doesn't see this signal, it shuts down.


Also, you can't just lower the drive voltage to the fans because to get them reasonably quiet with a lower voltage they won't start up upon power up. What I'm working on is a small circuit that applies full power to the fans at power up, then applies the lower running voltage once they're going.


Chuck*
The computer fans I speak of are those that have a 3rd sensor wire. This wire is for connection to a motherboard, and looks the same on my 1272Q. The purpose of this 3rd wire is to read the speed of the fan, thereby controlling it at startup and when things get hot. I picked up one from my local computer store for $5. Cdn.

Thought this might help.


Alan


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## Chuck Williams

Quote:

_Originally posted by Jerry Arseneau_
*The most fun about the mod is hearing the fans go from a roar to a whisper. *
That is very cool, isn't it  ?


Steve,


Did you get the addendum I sent? I suggested shunting the 2955 regulator with a 50 Ohm 3 watt resistor to share the current and make the transistor run cooler, plus adding fuses for safety.


Alan


These fans have sensor wires, also, but they only tell the micro that the fan is running, not how fast they run.


Chuck


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## RolandTT

Hi Chuck,

what is the addendum? Anything I could need for my 1270?

Thanks,

Roland


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## hiko

hi chuck or anyone who has the info,


could someone please send me the mod for a sony 1272? my email is [email protected] .



thanks a lot in advance,


hiko


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## Chuck Williams

Hiko and Roland,


I'm out of town today, but when I get back I'll get you the info.


George and G Rom,


I'm sot sure doing this mod to a D50 is a good idea. These don't seem to be built to anywhere near the degree of toughness as these other units. A D50 will overheat and burn up some components on its deflection board if the chassis is opened up and the unit is running for more than about 15 minutes. Also, I've never had a D50 to experiment on.


Chuck


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## steve

chuck:


No, I did not get the addendum. Could you please send it to me.


BTW, by "2955 regulator", are you referring to the 2N3055 power transistor, or the 78l05 voltage regulator? I don't think you would want to shunt the voltage regulator, and it most likely is not needed for the power transistor. The less circuitry, the better.


Steve


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## alared

Quote:

_Originally posted by Chuck Williams_
*


That is very cool, isn't it  ?


Steve,


Did you get the addendum I sent? I suggested shunting the 2955 regulator with a 50 Ohm 3 watt resistor to share the current and make the transistor run cooler, plus adding fuses for safety.


Alan


These fans have sensor wires, also, but they only tell the micro that the fan is running, not how fast they run.


Chuck*
Chuck:


On my 1272, on the left rear corner, I noticed a hole where a fan may have been. Do you know if there should be one there? On the right side there is a fan, and the cable connects to a plug about 8" forward, but I cannot locate a cable connection or plug location on the circuit board.


Have you worked out a fan mod for the 1272?


Alan


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## MauriE

Quote:

_Originally posted by alared_
*On my 1272, on the left rear corner, I noticed a hole where a fan may have been. Do you know if there should be one there? On the right side there is a fan, and the cable connects to a plug about 8" forward, but I cannot locate a cable connection or plug location on the circuit board.
*
There shouldn't be any fan on that spot in 1272. The 1270's have it though.


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## Jerry Arseneau

Quote:

Have you worked out a fan mod for the 1272?
The fan mod mentioned will work for any 12xx series.


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## KennyG

One thing to remember here, when you are getting a 10 degree increase in temp inside the tube cavity, the actually heat producing items are getting somewhat hotter than that.

I'm hoping to try Chuck's mod on my XG110, along with my hush box. I"ve decided no matter how quite it is, I'm keeping the Hbox, first because it will disperse more hot air than the pj's fans can, and that will possibly keep my internal temps where they are now, and second because all the air that reaches the pj is being filtered, and that's a nice idea.


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## bryan_chow

Chuck,


Can you send me a copy of the 1272 instructions too? My address is [email protected] 


Thanks!

Bryan


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## MikeEby

Kenny,

I understand Chuckâ€™s common sense approach but I come from a product-testing world. (Automotive industry, yes folks we really do test them before we sell them! ) I am like you I like to back things up with data. I can probably come up with a data acquisition board and some thermocouples. I have done testing like this before in my job. The thermocouples can be attached to certain parts of the projector with dental cement and the temperature monitored. You might have seen the post I just bought a projector lift on Ebay and if we can come up with key locations on the projector to mount thermocouples I would feel a lot better with the modifications. The lift will make the job much easier. It wonâ€™t be a project I will start tomorrow but maybe during the holidays, because I have that week off. Looks like I need to start getting ready to sell the Barco and get ready for the XG installation. Let me know I can take some digital shots of the XG guts and we can kick around where to put the thermocouples. I would think 8 sensor or less should be fine.


Mike


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## Randy S

Four pages of thread. 2700+ views. wow!


Appears to be an issue with a lot of interest and an opportunity for someone to mass produce voltage reduction circuits.


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## KennyG

Mike, that sounds good to me, Chuck has ask me if I'd like the schematic and I also said yes, so we can attack this thing from both ends.

I have a pair of cheap digital thermometers with remote sensors that I got from Wal-Mart, but once we move this thing into full swing I'll buy a couple more...or if you wish, since you have a week off, you may be able to move the testing phase of this along faster.

One area you won't have to worry about temp is within the card cage, I've done checks in there before and that area runs 10 to 12 degrees cooler than the tube cavity, there's no heat buildup in there at all...in fact I was able to drop the temp in the card cage by using duct tape to seal the card cage from the tube cavity...once the tube cavity's hotter air was stopped from entering the card cage, it's temps went from the mid 90's to the mid to upper 80's.

So the temp probes should be concentrated in the tube cavity and the major heat sink on the swing down panel.

I have access to a temp probe that uses a laser as the sensor, just point it at the surface you wish to know the temp of...the thing for me to do would be to get the XG up and running, then use the laser probe to pick out the hot spots, the eight hottest spots I find would be the places we'd want the sensors attached to.

Chuck what say you???


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## Chuck Anstey

Could I have the schematics you guys are using for a G70? I would like to try working on a pulse-width modulation circuit to drive the fans to see if it is better or worse. I have built such a circuit to turn a digital game pad into an "analog" steering wheel for my old 3DO (farther you turn the wheel, the larger the pulse width). The circuit I am thinking of should not require any changing of existing components, just inlining the controller.


Chuck Anstey
[email protected]


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## Chuck Williams

Kenny and Mike,


Knock 'em dead and keep me posted on you're findings!


Remember, though, you're bound to note an increases in internal temperature with this mod, the question is how much is OK. For instance, if you have a room air conditioner cranked to max, the temperature might get down to the mid sixties. If you turn it on low or off (depending on how hot it is outside), the room might go up to 75 F. So, depending on the environment the projector is in, a temperature increase may be no big deal.


Chuck Antsley,


I haven't experimented with a G70, so don't have any info for you.


Chuck


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## mraub

For those of us whose skills in electronics technology are a bit rusty and limited (former Advanced Class Ham Radio license holder), I wonder if some one could post a parts layout and connection drawing for this mod. It's been years since I tried to build something from a schematic, and when I did the components didn't have more than 3 pins to worry about.

Thanks.


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## KennyG

Chuck very true, I'm picking up the Laser temp probe today and will note internal temps and room temps, this will give us a baseline.


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## MikeEby

I would think that a 10% to 20% change from the baseline would not be of much concern. As Chuck said these are industrial type units built for harsh environments. What do you think Kenny? The ambient room temperature should also be monitored during the test, both before and after the modifications. Maybe for my own application I will test with or without Evac running and with and without if a hushbox if needed. In my case the projector is recessed partially into the ceiling but with the lift I will test only in the open. Then for my own information move into place and test. I can't see how the modification will quiet the unit enough to run without a hush box because mine is that loud but I am keeping an open mind about it. I have yet to build the hush box and wonâ€™t until I feel I have no other choice.


Mike


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## Chuck Williams

Kenny and Mike,


I installed this on a XG135 yesterday before I began a set up and calibration from scratch (new istallation), and my common sense approach tells me that after running for 5 hours, the projector could care about having 8 of the 11 fans slowed down (the ones connected to the HV board). It was much quieter, but since the two fans in the power supply are still at full speed, it wasn't as quiet as I would like.


Chuck


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## steve

Chuck:


Just curious as to why you did not slow down the power supply fans in the XG. Is it too difficult to get to, or are they different type fans?

steve


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## Dan Ellis

I thought everyone might find a post I made back in January interesting:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...g135lc+quieter 


In a quest to quiet my XG135, I settled on changing fan supply voltage as the cleanest, cheapest, and easiest solution. I measured internal temperatures and sound levels before and after, and they are noted in the post. The post mentions the insertion of a series resistor in the fan voltage supply wire. That was a temporary testing solution, and for the final modification I changed the fan power supply resistors on the circuit board instead. No one could ever tell this wasn't a factory job. It took less than 1 hour start to finish. I have been using the projector several hours per day since, and there has been no ill effect. It is not totally quiet, but disappears once some source material is playing. In stock form, my ears became fatigued over a viewing session, not unlike spending an evening in a noisey bar. I could still do more, quieting other fans in like fashion, changing to quieter fans where warranted, and adding some damping material. But, I haven't found the need. We are now happily enjoying our HT. I would be happy to answer any questions others may have about this procedure and my results.


Dan


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## MikeEby

I thought I remembered reading a thread somewhere but I was unable to find it. KennyG started a new thread like â€œEverything you wanted to know about XG noise but was afraid to askâ€. I will post a reference to your thread there.


Mike


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## daviddam

Please send the info for the 1272 mod to [email protected] . Thanks!!


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## Iceman

Guys,


Before everybody get carried away, the statements of "virtually noise-free" or "much quieter" regarding fan-modded XG135LC's are subjective. The noise sensitivity of different individuals varies quite a lot and the measurement results Dan Ellis provided (thanks, Dan) point towards a total SPL reduction of no more than some 3-4 dB(A). While certainly welcome, this is usually considered the smallest noticeable change for a noise source without A/B-testing.


As I stated earlier in this thread, a totally "noise-free" (as defined by no more noise than the background noise level in the room) would mean a reduction of 15-20 dB(A) for an XG135LC. This is what I am aiming for myself and I will report back as to my findings. Just as a small teaser, I believe a reduction of some 15 dB(A) is doable without a hushbox! However, this will require:


1. Adding thin steel sheets to the inside of the plastic cover (for increasing the sound reduction index of the thin plastic) as well as filling up the cover ventilation openings.


2. Silencing inlet and outlet with resistive silencers (not as fancy as it sounds ) while adding fans in the outlet silencer. This will make the air flow at least as high and even quite possibly higher than in the unmodified case (the projector is not linked to any ventilation ducts and a small temperature increase is to be expected in the room). The outlet silencer will require a relatively small box behind the projector and this will be the only modification visible from the outside.


----------



## daviddam

I just received an email from Chuck saying he would be out of town until after the Holidays and won't be able to get the info to me before then. Could some kind soul email me at [email protected] with the info? I really wanted to implement this BEFORE the Holidays so that my parents could enjoy the experience even more when they come to visit. Thanks!


----------



## RolandTT

ygm


----------



## Chuck Williams

Iceman,


I wouldn't consider a 3 to 4 dB improvement in noise to be worth the hassle. The units I have worked on had a substantial and noticable improvement, especially the Sony 12XX's and the NEC PG's. The noise reduction on these is nothing less than stunning. I have personally only done one XG, and this was slowing eight of the eleven fans. I am still waiting on more info on quieting the two power supply fans from others, but it looks like that's a go also, and the noise improvement should also be dramatic.


Dave,


I'm sure someone can get youo the info beforfe I get back home, but if not, I'll get it to you then. My new design doesn't use a relay (I should have thought of that before!).


Chuck


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hi everybody!


could someone please send me info about the mod???????????

thanks a lot!!

[email protected] 


THX!


----------



## RolandTT

Hi everybody,

could any of you guys who have the mod installed make some pictures of it. I would be especially interested on how you connect the fans to the board. Is there a spot from where all fans can be reached by connecting the board just to one spot or do you have to install a wire from every fan to go to the board?

Hope this question is not stupid, any reply is highly appreciated.

Thanks,

Roland


----------



## Chuck Williams

Roland,


I've never actually investigated that question, I just figured it was much easier to clip the black wire (in the case of the Sony VPH's) on each fan, and run a wire from the circuit to each fan. The NEC PG's have a central fan voltage source on the mother board, but it's a major hassle to get to it. The NEC XG's have a very convenient source voltage for eight of its eleven fans on the HV circuit board, and that's where my mod goes on them, and soon (once I'm sure it's a good idea), with a second wire to go to the fans in the power supply.


Chuck


----------



## osker

Hello, I used Chuck's mod on a PG-9100. I made a change to the Mod,instead of using a Zener to control the regulator output, I used an adjustable voltage regulator with a 4.7 K potentiometer that way I can control the voltage to the fans. I had temp. sensors in four different locations and determined that the hot spot on the PG-9100 is on the STK's below the green CRT and the hottest by a degree is on the back side of the power supply below the blue CRT. Temp readings before Mod was 98 degrees. Using Chuck's Mod with a 9.1 volts output the reading was 108 degrees. Increasing the voltage to 10 volts dropped the temp to 103 degrees. Chuck has mentioned that 104 degrees is a safe operating temperature. The sound level of the fans sitting directly below the projector dropped 7 DB. If anyone would want a picture of the sensor location email me and I will get it to you. TKS Osker.


----------



## Iceman

osker,


Thank you very much for your thorough measurements of temperature and SPL. While a reduction of 7 dB is quite apparent, most CRT projectors will still be too noisy to be called quiet after the mod. For reference, a reduction of 6 dB corresponds to half the sound pressure. However, due to the non-linear characteristics of the hearing system, most people consider a reduction of 8-10 dB a subjective "halving" of the noise level.


For anyone interested in noise measurements, please note that A-weighing should be applied when taking readings on a SLM. This ensures that especially the very poor low frequency sensitivity of the hearing system is corrected for (as opposed to the linear characteristics of the measurement microphone). In practice, a SPL reduction of 7 dB (Linear) may thus not be the same as 7 dB(A), although in this case the difference will probably be negligible.


----------



## daviddam

I got the "old" design with relay yesterday. Thank you!! I went out and bought the parts last night and put it together - I couldn't wait 


I have run into a slight snag however. Admittedly, I haven't cracked the case yet, but I am assuming that there won't be a board with a big "E" labelled on it when I open it, so I was wondering if someone could tell me where the E-Board is. And specifically where connector E2 is. I am using a 1272. Thanks!


Chuck, I would really like to look at your new design once you get back. When you get a moment after returning could you please email to [email protected] ? Thanks.


Dave


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hello David


E board is the big one at the right when rear of pj is in front of you, and yes there's a big E write on it


good luck!


could you post pictures ?


Thank you!


regards


Bruno Lovisi

Nice, FRANCE


----------



## daviddam

I would love to post pictures, unforunately I don't have a digital camera (yet! ). If I can grab one, I'll post pictures here.


Dave


----------



## daviddam

I have another question. I opened the case on the projector and found the E-Board (with a big "E" on it ) and found connector E2. I also found the pins to use to get power from. My question is, regarding the +15v, -15v and Ground am I supposed to splice into the wires coming from the connector to get the power? Also, do I then cut the black wire from each of the fans and run the wire still connected to each fan to the circuit? Also, can I run the 4 external fans all from the one circuit?


I know these are rookie questions, but I don't want to take any chances with the projector. I don't get a second chance 


Thanks!


Dave


----------



## smithnz

Please send me the schematics for a 1272 mod. (Maybe someone should chuck these on a website somewhere?) Thanx.


-KENT


----------



## wanderer

Chuck,


If you could forward details on the mod for my NEC 9200 that would be great. Email: [email protected] 


Regards,


Paul


----------



## RearProjection1292

Chuck, how do I get the mod for a sony 1292?

Thanks,

Happy Holidays!


Felix


----------



## Chuck Williams

Daviddam,


You could splice the wires, but I recommend carefully sweat-soldering the wire for +15 volts to the jumper on the top side of the E board near connector E2 labelled +15 volts, the wire for -15 volts to a jumper solder pad on the bottom of the E board connected to -15 volts, and the ground wire to any ground trace on the E board (or just chassis ground).


All fans can run from one circuit provided that you have a 50 Ohm current shunt resistor and the transistor is on a heat sink.


TO ALL WANTING THE SCHEMATIC:


Please e-mail me at [email protected] after December 29th, 2001. I'm away for the holidays and can't do it until I get beck home.


Chuck


----------



## DAVE CARLISLE

I'm using another variation of the mod on my 1271. Something about disabling the fan protect just bugs me. I used a DPDT relay and {2} transistor regulators instead of just one. That way I can give the power supply fans 8v to satisfy the protect circuit and the rest of the fans can ran at the more desirable lower speed.


It was either that or I was going to add a mechanical thermal switch {like used in dryers, you can get them in temp ranges from 120 deg and up} to switch the fans to full speed "if" there was ever a buildup of heat. Once temps were back to normal the switch gives control back to the mod circuit. It would be a little extra piece of mind.



Dave


----------



## Alan Gouger

Ok I finally installed Chucks fan mod to my NEC 10PG.

I find the 10PG to be on the quieter side to begin with. Maybe its because of the larger chassie and the resonating noise is not as high pitch.


With the Mod I can barely hear the unit. This is the best ever.

You need to be right on top of the machine. It took me a little over an hour to complete the mod. I am lucky because the projector is currently table mount.


Anyway, Chuck thanks for this great circuit. I hope your working on your next tweak, we are ready!


----------



## Nick Satullo

Hey . . . I've been a fan of Chuck Williams for some time now.


Looks like there's something else to do next time I lure you out here, Chuck.


Have a great new year.


Nick


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hello,


I would know if someone has improved the fan mod?


- new ideas?

- any pictures of the mod?

- any temp data after mod?


thank you very much!


regards


Bruno


----------



## Chuck Williams

Bruno,


I've finally settled on a design that doesn't use a relay. This was no big deal when used with an NEC, but since the Sonys use a negative voltage for the fan supply, I changed the circuit by adding an opto isolator in series with the Zener diode.


Now that I'm happy with the circuit, I'll be getting circuit boards printed.


Chuck


----------



## Nick Satullo

Is the fan mod for the NEC XG135 now perfected? Thought it was still sort of beta.


Nick


----------



## micj

Bruno,


I have a Pulse Width Modulation Fan control chip sample I'm waiting for. When I get it, I'm going to try some things out with that.


In the meantime, I'm intending to design an LM317 adjustable voltage regulator circuit with a capacitor to initially set the voltage to about 12 volts and then drop it down to some amount like 7 volts after a couple of seconds. This should be a pretty simple circuit for others to easily copy.

It would not affect the speed sensor output of the fans and should be able to go inline with the connector.


Perhaps I'm retracing old ground (pun not intended) that others have already tried, if so let me know.


Regards,


Ira


----------



## Doug Ravizza

Chuck,


I have been running your "original" circuit (with relay) but increased the zener value first to 6.8V and then finally 7.5V, on a 1272. I have logged ~30 hrs. in this configuration with no ill effects and with what I percieve as a better than 75% noise reduction. What concerns me however is the need to defeat the fan protection circuit in order to run the fans at this voltage.


Any thoughts on how it might be possible to have some sort of fan failure protection and still run this mod?


Thanks for sharing your ideas.


Doug


----------



## EJ

OK here's the deal...I have a 1252 ceiling mounted and would LOVE to do this mod. However...I don't have the experience to do this alone. If anyone lives near Minneapolis, I would be willing to pay someone to do this for me...I figure I would spend some money on a hush box anyway, and would rather go this route. Any ideas would be appreciated.


Thanks,


EJ


----------



## daviddam

Chuck,

Can I get the latest schematics for the 1272 Mod? I've got mine up and running, but if there are concerns about the safety of either the circuit or the projector I'd like to make sure I'm as safe as possible 


Depending on the changes to the new circuit I may need to rebuild it from scratch. Will you be selling the circuit boards and if so, how much?


Thanks for the excellent circuit!!


Dave


P.S. Does anyone know how to get to the fan above the center tube on the projector (mine is ceiling mounted)? It appears to be the biggest offender by far, but I am unsure how to get to the fan to apply the circuit to it. Is there a way to apply this circuit to it without having to take the tube out? Thanks!


----------



## Randy S

Dave - Are you talking about the power supply fans? If so, you get to them by removing the power supply, not the tube. You're right, they seem to be the worst offenders.


It's a challenge while ceiling mounted.


----------



## Chuck Williams

Nick,


The circuit works for the XG, I've just never installed it in one that included the power supply fans. But it works great for eight of the eleven fans in an XG, and if yoou want to pull the power supply, adding the power supply fans should be no problem.


Doug,


The only way to not disable the fna sense for the power supply fans is to change some component values in the fan sensor circuit for the power supply, or run the fans at a higher voltage, and they get noisy really fast as you raise the voltage.


David,


The new circuit isn't "safer," it's just more elegant. I haven't scanned in the new circuit yet, but will soon (I'm really swamped lately!).


Chuck


----------



## Nick Satullo

Chuck:


I've just signed on for the Chuck Williams Tour of Ohio in April. I hope that, in addition to general tweaking, you can install the fan mod. You know my setup, so let me know if that's agreeable to you.


Thanks,


Nick


----------



## daviddam

Chuck,

Well more elegant is cool too  I am eager to see it.


Randy,

Do you know where I can find info on how to get to the fan in the power supply?


Dave


----------



## johnwcookjr

Gentlemen,


Once the XG135LC fan mod is complete and tested someone please forward the details.


Thanks, John


----------



## Randy S

Dave - Check out this link to the manual that has a section on removing the power supply.


Good luck.


----------



## daviddam

Thanks Randy!! I'll look over the document this weekend.


The people on this forum are great!! 


Dave


----------



## daviddam

I hooked the circuit to the power supply fans last night and finally got the darn thing back into the projector and turned it on and it shut off! It breifly flashed up the fan problem error code. I'm not sure what the problem is.


The circuit worked for the other fans, why not these?


Is there something special that needs to be done to these to get it to work?


I remember reading somewhere in the forums that if you tie the yellow wire to the black wire that the protection circuit is bypassed. Is this true? Would this take care of my problem?


I am desperate at this point. I have company coming this weekend and I need to get this thing back up and running again.


Thanks!


Dave


P.S. I used the 9.1 Zener as was suggested in a previous post, so the voltage is dropped to around -8V. I also used the 46K resistor on the 555 so that there is approximately a 4 second delay before the voltage is lowered.


----------



## daviddam

Bump


----------



## Randy S

You'll be treating symptoms by defeating the protection circuit and may not solve the root problem. Verify that you're supplying voltage from the fan-mod board to the wires going to all fans. Check them individually, you may have loosened another connection while connecting the power supply fans.


For my install, all fans connected the same with no issues.


----------



## daviddam

Randy,

Thanks again for the quick reply. I'll dig out the volt meter and test the wires. Its just such a pain. My projector is ceiling mounted and since the power supply can't be taken down completely without disconnecting all of the connectors to the board its a REAL pain working on it on a ladder.


If it turns out that the fans are getting their -15v do you have any other suggestions? If options are exhausted, can I tie the yellow and black wires going to the board together to (temporarily) circumvent the protection, at least for this weekend?


Thanks again.


Dave


----------



## Randy S

I believe sending the fan sense lead to ground will fool the protection circuit (can someone verify this?).

*1/20/02 Edit - You must tie the yellow and black wires together to defeat the protection circuit.*


If you're supplying -8v to the fans, you shouldn't get a fan stop error unless there's a legitimate problem.


Consider the risks of bypassing the protect circuit, such as running your projector with one or more of the fans inoperative. Could lead to a bad weekend. 


I slid my power supply out without completely detaching it to double-check my wiring for this same project. Get someone to stand on a ladder next to you and hold the power supply (unplug AC power!) long enough for you to verify continuity from your mod circuit board to fan. If you have continuity from board to fan, I guess it's possible that you have a rogue fan that won't run at -8v?


It is error code 01 right? Don't forget the LED's are upside down, so it'll look like a 10.


Good luck.


----------



## daviddam

Randy,

Once again thank you! I didn't see your last post until after messing with the projector. I decided to check the voltages to make sure that one of the connections was not loose. As you predicted it appears that one of them was intermittent. I recrimped my connectors and am listening to the "computer level" noise of my projector as I type this.


Thanks again to Randy, Chuck and you others in this thread for helping me get my projector to a much quieter state. Now all I have to do is roll this Dynamat Extreme on the inside of the cover and I'll be completely happy with my projectors sound levels (or lack thereof ).


Dave


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Dave,


I had similar trouble with the power supply fans causing an error code. The fans would run but the protection circuit was more sensitive for them it seems.


To get the projector running again quickly, you could disconnect the wires going to the PS fans from the mod circuit and connect them to the same -15V supply you have going into the mod board. Things will be louder but you'll still have a PJ for the guests.


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hello!


GREAT POST !!!!!!!!


Randy,

*I believe sending the fan sense lead to ground will fool the protection circuit (can someone verify this?)*


Yes it's right! you can fool protection by this way, I did it with 4 fans on my 1270 and no problem, except no protection...


PLEASE SOME PICTURES of the mod !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


thank you very much!


regards


Bruno Lovisi

french winemaker 



no, I'm kidding


----------



## Chuck Williams

Quote:

_Originally posted by Bruno Lovisi_
*


I believe sending the fan sense lead to ground will fool the protection circuit (can someone verify this?)


Yes it's right! you can fool protection by this way, I did it with 4 fans on my 1270 and no problem, except no protection...
*
Are you sure? I think you'd have to tie the yellow wire (fan sense) from the connector to the black wire (fan supply, which is a negative voltage) from the connector, not tie the yellow wire to ground. Suppose, in an unmodified circuit, the fan stops running. That would be the same as the yellow wire going to ground, causing the protect circuit to engage.


Chuck


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hello Chuck,



[q]*I think you'd have to tie the yellow wire (fan sense) from the connector to the black wire*[/q]


Sorry, you're right! I've answered too quickly


regards


Bruno Lovisi


----------



## johnwcookjr

Is someone creating a brief FAQ on the NEC XG mod? If so can someone please send me a copy with proposed schematic/parts list attached?


If not, can someone point me to the appropriate thread where I can find the details?


I sure would like to quiet my 135.


Question, after the modification has been installed, if a modified fan dies, will the sense circuit detect the failed fan?


Thanks, John


----------



## JariT

I have a sony vph-1271QM, but....

I was trying different zeners with the first power supply fan, a smile on my face, until a little lapse of precaution. There was a little spark to the ground and now neither of PS fans start and I get error code 1. Guess something went kaput.

Wires from both fans go to this little circuit board marked SOPS-1001M2. Now I crave for the schematics so my dad (skilled more like an electrician) can help me to locate the broken part and change it.


Any help will be highly valued.


Jari
[email protected]


----------



## Chuck Williams

Jari,


If it's only the power supply fans that do not start up, you blew PS251 on the M2 board in the power supply. This little gizmo is just a fuse type device and looks like a signal transistor with only two leads. You can replace it with a 1.5 amp micro fuse.


Chuck


----------



## RolandTT

Hi everybody,

this is a great thread. Keep your ideas coming in. I am working with a friend of mine who has great skills on the mod. He would like to know the fans brand and the model type in order to find out the fans specs. I can easily check the top ones myself. I am just wondering if all fans are the same except the small one on the heat sink?

Would you please let me know. Maybe you guys even have the specs or would know where to find them.




Please check those pages on fan speed control:
Fan speed more ideas Temperature 


Thanks a lot,

Roland


----------



## 3rd Dr Who

Hi People,

For sensor fan replacement with non sensor type,is it possible to fool the sensors by connecting all the sensor wires to one fan only?


----------



## JariT

Thanks a lot Chuck. I changed the micro fuse and now its working like a charm again.

Patched the PS fans, 3 to go...

Fan on the side was little ill, making audible noise even when I rolled it with my hand. Has anyone found a fan type that works as a replacement with failure protection etc?


Jari

Sony vph-1271QM


----------



## Chuck Williams

Quote:

_Originally posted by 3rd Dr Who_
*Hi People,

For sensor fan replacement with non sensor type,is it possible to fool the sensors by connecting all the sensor wires to one fan only?*
The easiest way to "fool" the sensor is to just connect the yellow wire (connector side) to the fan power. For Sony's, that's the black wire. For NEC's (and just about anyone else) it's the red wire.


Chuck


----------



## pkarmouche

Wow. Great thread!


I also vote for pictures of the completed mod, anyone?



Randy/Kenny,


Please post the internal temperature results if/when you have them 


Also, what would be the best places to monitor internal temps of my 1272q??? I've built a tight-fitting hushbox that's open in front and draws air from the lower rear to exhaust in the attic.


Thanks!


----------



## Randy S

Jari - search the archives, there was an extensive thread on making a 1292? quieter that specified which fans were used and where to get them. Seems like Papst was mentioned and PC Power and Cooling was a source.


pkarmouche - Here's a picture of the board I built. It works, but it's obvious that I shouldn't quit my day job 


Look back through this thread, I posted some before and after temp readings early on. Seems like the temp rose around 10 degrees after slowing down the fans.


I didn't know the best place to monitor temp so I chose several and recorded the before and after readings.


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hi,


Thank a lot Randy for the board picture!


Did you apply the mod to the 6 fans?


Thx


Regards


Bruno Lovisi


----------



## Randy S

Yep, all six. I changed a resistor value to give me a four second delay before the voltage drops to remind me of how loud it really was.


----------



## nlee

Hi,


I was wondering if anyone has tried this

fan mod on a Sony 1292.


I am considering doing it; however, I am

concerned about issues related to overheating. I'm especially concerned about the power supply fans and fans behind each lense tube. Should

I only wire the 2 exhaust fans and 5 rear

fans to the circuit? If so, does anyone

know how much of a difference this makes

with regards to overall noise level?

Would I be better off replacing the fans

with quieter ones?


TIA,


Norm


----------



## Rice Rocket

Chuck--I was on your email list, but never received the info? Could you please email me the instructions for a NEC PG-6?


----------



## jtfischer

Hi Chuck and group,


Where can I get this fan mod. I have a NEC 135LC and it sounds like a jet taking off!!


Does the PJ have to be sent out for the mod?


Email me @ [email protected] with the current info if you don't mind.


Thanks


John Fischer


----------



## Tinman

Chuck.


I'm interested in this mod for my PG9. Also, has there been any thought regarding blowing air into the unit instead of out?


If you could email or pm me at your convenience.


Marc


----------



## areno

I just sent an email to Chuck but am not sure if he is in town. Could someone please email the mod instructions for a sony 1252 to [email protected] 


Thanks, Adam


----------



## cgeisler

Can Chuck do a fan mod on a Runco 980? If so how can I contact him?.


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

*B U M P ! *

*I LOVE THIS THREAD !*


Bruno


----------



## mercury

Quote:

_Originally posted by cgeisler_
*Can Chuck do a fan mod on a Runco 980? If so how can I contact him?.*


although i can`t answer your question,i can tell you that Chuck will be coming to my home in Howell,NJ around May,Hop Skip and a jump to Princeton,


ts


----------



## cgeisler

Thank you Mercury. Might you have Chuck's phone number or email address?.

Carl


----------



## Chuchuf

Could I get someone to dend me the diagram of this board via email to [email protected] .


Thanks,


Terry


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

Hi Terry!


I send you the diagram, if you can, please post pictures of your mod once done!

*NO MORE NOISE !!!*


regards





Bruno Lovisi


----------



## adalberto amaya

Hi Chuck.

I own a NEC 9PG and I have been searching for a modification that will quite the vacuum cleaner sounds emanating from the beast. I am very interested in your fan mod. Please email your fan mod instructions to
[email protected]


----------



## Tinman

adalberto, check your email.


Marc


----------



## Valiant

could anyone send me all the information for a modification on a sony vph-1272qm ? my pc had a headcrash and i lost all my data...


all additional information (pictures, diagrams, component list) are more than welcome!


thanks in advance!


Andy


ps: my email: [email protected] (for small emails), [email protected] (for larger emails)


----------



## Ingeborgdot

I would like to know what fan I could use to quiet down my plv60. Any suggestions. How does one get ahold of chuck??????????? Appreciate any responses.


----------



## Hank527

I would also like info if possible for a Runco 900A SDITV II. or probably a nec 6pg+ There the same thing. I cannot stand the fan and even 5DB would be a huge improvement whatever can be done.



Hank


----------



## gigone

Quote:

_Originally posted by Chuck Williams_
*


The easiest way to "fool" the sensor is to just connect the yellow wire (connector side) to the fan power. For Sony's, that's the black wire. For NEC's (and just about anyone else) it's the red wire.


Chuck*
Chuck,


Does your fan mod involve the power unit fans (regarding the Sony's VPH series)?


----------



## Randy S

gigone - yes, Chuck's mod includes the power supply fans. They're tough to get to, but worth it as they're a couple of the worst offenders.


----------



## gigone

Quote:

_Originally posted by Randy S_
*gigone - yes, Chuck's mod includes the power supply fans. They're tough to get to, but worth it as they're a couple of the worst offenders.*
Has anyone checked the differences of the temperatures inside the power unit before and after the mod?


----------



## gigone

Could anyone send me the schematics for the mod of a Sony VPH 1270?



Thankig in advance

[email protected]


----------



## Jesper Backman

I to would really like the schematics for a Sony 1270 modification.

So if someone could send it to me I would be really greatful.

[email protected]


----------



## BQ.

Hi everybody



I'm interested in this mod for my 1252q so please could I get someone to send me the diagram of this board via email to:
[email protected] 


thanks


/Lars Bergkvist


----------



## Mikromidas

Could anyone send me the schematics for the mod of a Sony VPH 1270?



Thanks in advance.

[email protected]


----------



## jaso

I can't get the fan mod working on my 1252. The problem is the fans in the powersupply. I've connected the yellow and black wires to bypass the "fan control system".

From what i understand, the projektor would start no matter what, when I have connected the black and yellow wires, but the projector just shuts down after a second.


What could be wrong?


Thanks,


Anders S.


----------



## gigone

Quote:

_Originally posted by gigone_
*Could anyone send me the schematics for the mod of a Sony VPH 1270?



Thankig in advance

[email protected] *
Bump!!


----------



## jaso

I mean, I have connected the black wire TO the yellow wire. This should disable the fan protect circuitry, right?


/Anders S.


----------



## capnbly

Thanks Chuck for your engineering. Are your boards available yet? If not, could you please send schematics and instructions for 1272, 1292, and 9PG? I look forward to quieting the 1292.


Thanks,


Greg

[email protected]


----------



## Mindless Drone

Can someone send me the plans for a Sony VPH-1271Q?

[email protected] 



Thanks


----------



## capnbly

Can someone please send the instructions to modify the following projectors:


Sony 1292

Sony 1272

NEC 9PG


to [email protected] 


TIA,


Greg


----------



## casenpt1

Could someone please send me the instructions for a Sony 1251.

[email protected] 


Thanks in advance.


----------



## rorox64

excuse me for the OT...


but... more than 11,000 visits on this thread! it seems that the fan noise is a real pain for everybody!!!


ciao

Romano


----------



## Jesper Backman

Could someone please send me the instructions for a Sony 1270.

[email protected] 


Thanks in advance.


----------



## Randy S

Romano - you're right, this thread is huge! Does anyone know where Chuck is with burning PCB's?


----------



## Elliot

I have been all the way through this post but could not find the details, would anyone mind sending me the mod for the NEC 10PG?


Send to [email protected]


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## Craig Woodhall

Any ideas if there is a mod for the ECP 4000? it is quite loud and I would like to quiet it down a bit!


----------



## xray53

Would like to modify a


NEC PG 9000 and a

NEC GP 5000


Can anyone send me instructions?


Thanks


----------



## rorox64

Randy:


pheraps Chuck is retired from the ISF competencies, working only to build Fan modifications, due the incredible request?  


ciao

Romano


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## rorox64

Craig,


first of all try to eliminate the grids in front of the 4 fans, cutting the metal. 3 of them mounted in intake. After have removed the grids you will obtain some 60-70% less noise.

If after that, some fans are still too loud, replace them with PAPST ball bearing equivalent ones.

Very probably they're noisy due the fact that they're too old (the ECP4000 is a very old model). I've solved many cases, in this way.


ciao

Romano


----------



## rorox64

Xray53,


Concerning the NEC GP, I worked on the 3 fans mounted inside the video amplifiers (the three metal small boxes mounted on the back of the pj, behind each tube). If you dismount them you will easily see a fan. They're responsible of some 50% of the overall noise. If you swap them with ball bearing silenced models (I used PAPST) you will obtain great improvements.


There are some other 8 fans (2 big on top, very quiet, 1 small close o them, quiet too, and other fans are located inside the power supply board, on the front side of the pj, under the three lenses). The fan mounted inside power supply box are the other ones to investigate.



ciao

Romano


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## Torre

Chuck is currently out of the country but he will be back soon.


I am ready to modify my XG as well.


----------



## Randy S

I finally got around to measuring the db drop pre and post mod. If you've followed this massive thread you may remember that I'm using the 9.1v zener, not a 6.1v per the original specs. I also changed the delay circuit to run the fans at normal voltage for four seconds prior to decreasing voltage instead of the suggested one second.


From roughly 18 inches away with the fans running wide open, the meter shows 63db. After the fans slow down.... 58db. Using the 6.1v zener, per the specs, you can expect a greater difference.


I'll verify these readings after I work the "honey do" list down a bit.


----------



## MrCRT

Hello,

Chuck is not here.

  


I am interesting for the Fan MOD on a NEC PG 9200G.


If anyone have this MOD, please send me the Instructions.


My E-Mail,
[email protected] 


Includes the Mod all 4 Fan`s???(Powersupply-Fan included???)


Thanx, MrCRT


----------



## SiR-ROUND

Anyone still using a Barco 801?


And did someone do the mod on that model?


Barco's are a lot more quiet than most PJ's but I think the noise is still 2 much...


Won't the increase of temperature damage parts in the long run?


Anyway, did someone do it to a Barco and with what result?


Greetz.


----------



## RolandTT

Hi,


did anybody who uses the mod notice any convergence shift that increased from before using it?


Is it possible that less cooling cause more shift?


Thanks,

Roland


----------



## SiR-ROUND

I think that if it runs slient, but a little hotter, you get more drift...


That's how electronics work...


----------



## Randy S

I haven't noticed any drift. YMMV


----------



## MrCRT

 If exist the Fan Mod for a NEC XG110 LC,

please mail it to [email protected] 


pleeeaaaasseee!!

MrCRT


----------



## Mindless Drone

Does anyone have the mod plans for a Sony 1271Q. If you do please send it to me at [email protected]


----------



## Ingeborgdot

Can a person quiet down the fan on the plv60ht?????Does anyone out there know the answer to this complicated question or do I live with it this way forever????????


----------



## Jerry

Hi,


I've found this thread to be very hopeful. I'm currently using a hush box but would rather do without it. I've emailed Chuck but perhaps he's still out of town. If someone could email me more details I would sure appreciate it.


Thanks, Jerry[

[email protected]


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## mag

He is hopefully relaxing in Caribbean until mid April , that was what he answered me anyway (not that he was relaxing thou, but I hope he dos ).


So we can terrorize him in a week or so .


//Magnus


----------



## lothario

hello chuck!

i am a 3 crt beginner in south KOREA.

i have a sony 1292.

it has very loud fan noise.

i have heard about your solution....named "Chuck's fan mod"

can i buy the whole set of it?

my friend has same problem.

so i need two sets of fans.

how can i buy it.

let me know.

my e-mail is [email protected] 

i eagerly wait your help.

with best regards.


Ryan Kim.


----------



## Continuum37

Please email me a mod plan for a Sony 1270 if at all possible.


Thanks,

Ken
[email protected]


----------



## Keith Murray

Could someone send me the schematic to mod an NEC 9PG?


Thanks

Keith


keithm [email protected] casco.net


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## rail

Has or can this fan mod be done to a Barco 1208s? I have a short ceiling(7') and an"8" riser which puts my head right under the projector, making it difficult to hear movie dialog during quiet scenes. I don't think I have enough room for a hush box. Also, how do I go about getting the supplies and directions for the modification? Thanks.

Gary


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## stefuel

You wanna know the funny part? When I installed my NEC, the first thing I noticed was how quiet it was compared to the ECP it replaced. When I installed the ECP, I was floored by how quiet it was compared to the bulb PJ it replaced. A stock 9PG is supposed to emit 45 DB and the ECP 55 DB. I sold the bulb PJ so I don't have the manual for it but it was probably about 65 DB. Not exactly a cost effective way to do it, but I'm happy...


Chip S.


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## johnboy

From What I understand it can be. You should contact Chuck, He'll be happy to send a board or the specs on it


Good Luck

JohnBoy


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## JSW

Anyone with NEC PG9200 Fan Mod plan? Please send me a copy to [email protected] 


plz plz plz


tks tks tks


Jason


----------



## rail

Johnboy,

Thanks, I just sent an e-mail to Chuck.

Gary


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## rail

Chuck just sent me the schematic for the NEC PG mod. Thank-you Chuck.

Has anyone actually done this to a Barco? What results did you have and do you have any pointers?

Gary


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## kaanage

Could someone please send me the 1272 mod. My email is [email protected] 


Thanks


----------



## jjs3

Can someone send me the 1272 directions as well?

[email protected] 


Thanks!!!


Jack


----------



## kaanage

Quote:

_Originally posted by kaanage_
*Could someone please send me the 1272 mod. My email is [email protected] 


Thanks*
Anyone? Please?


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Seeing there is more that one request and guessing that Chuck won't mind, here is a link to a .pdf of original fan mod schematic 


You will need to unzip the file and view it with Adobe Acrobat.


----------



## Bruno Lovisi

UP!


----------



## Energeezer

Could someone e-mail me the mod for a 135LC to
[email protected] 

Thanks

Steve


----------



## Blorton

I'm interested in the updated schematic as well. If anyone has it, I'd sure appreciate a copy at [email protected] .


Are the PCB's available anywhere? I'd much rather go that route if it's an option.


Thanks,

Dan


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## ChrisMcCarthy

Is there a reliable fan mod for the AmPro 4600?


Chris


----------



## Blorton

Well? Doesn't anyone have any info on the updated schematic or the pcb?


Should I just break out the BFH to quieten my 1272 down? 


Any pointers or info would really be appreciated.

Dan


----------



## BizarroTerl

Did you email Chuck?


----------



## Rickd

I have a barco 808 and I know the fans are speed controlled would this effect this circuit in any way presumably both the internal projectors speed control and this one may conflict?


I have the service manuaul so I will check the internal speed circuit perhaps I coul modify that directly.


Cheers Rick


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## Blorton

Quote:

_Originally posted by BizarroTerl_
*Did you email Chuck?*
Yes I did, several days ago.  I understand he can be pretty busy at times, I was just thinking surely someone else had purchased the pcb if they had ever been produced.


dan


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## PeteC

Here is the updated schematic I got from Chuck about a month and a half ago. It is for a Sony 12XX so I don't know if it is the same for other projetors or not but should work for the Sony's. It's a PDF file.

Pete

If the attachment doesn't work send me an e-mail at
[email protected]


----------



## PeteC

O.k. it looks like the attachment didn't work. So I am going to send it out to you all through the e-mails you have provided.

Pete


----------



## Jesper Backman

PeteC, please, send to me to:
[email protected]


----------



## fantazia2

Chuck,


what voltage are the fans supposed to run at when using you circuit. I tried building the circuit (from http://www.snaggs.com/projector/disp...&pagetitle=NEC ) in a program called crocodile technology.


The timer circuit worked alright and switched the relay for about a second, but when I measured the voltage across where the fan/s would be the voltage came out as 1.39v (15v with the initial relay switch), which to me seems quite low, but it could just be the components available in the software.


Also, is there a component list anyway giving the specs on all the items required, i.e. cap types, etc.


Chris.


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## Randy S

1.39v is not going to cut it. Output voltage is a metered by the zener diode value. Seems like the original design called for a 6.1v, but I was concerned that would slow the fans too much, so I went with a 9.1v.


This is what I had for a parts list. Use at your own risk.

(1) 100 resistor

(1) 470 resistor

(1) 1K resistor

(1) 12K resistor

(1) 56K resistor

(1) 1 N4001 diode

(1) 9.1 volt zener diode

(1) .1 uf ceramic capacitor

(1) 4.7uf electrolytic capacitor

(1) 100 uf electrolytic capacitor

(1) 555 timer lC

(1) 12 volt relay

(1) 7805 voltage regulator

(1) 2N2222 NPN transistor

(1) 2N2955 transistor with heat sink


----------



## fantazia2

Oops I put the zener diode in the wrong way round. Switched it and now gives out about 9.37v, which sounds a lot more healthy.


Did anyone test their circuit before installing it in their projector, i.e. with a spare fan or removing the fan from the proj and testing externally.


Chris.


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Chris,


Last year when I installed the mod in a 1272, I connected 1 fan to check it out. You almost need to test this in the pj because part of what you are checking is whether the fan sense circuit is happy with the lower voltage. One thing I ran into was that some sense circuits needed more voltage to not execute a shutdown.


I am about to build the mod for an NEC XG. Which projector are you working on?


----------



## fantazia2

Hi Jerry,


its a NEC 6PG Xtra. I've had it for about 6 months now and my seating position is below the projector, so I am getting annoyed with the noise now, but its still a lot quieter than my old LCD proj.


Chris


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## David_Larkins

Chuck,


could you (or someone else who can) send me the instructions for the fan mod of the NEC XG110LC?


my address is [email protected] 


Thanks a lot... I'm ready for some quiet!


David


----------



## Doug Baisey

David,

YGM. Chuck is on a vacation, the lucky guy. Doug


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Chuck sent me the updated version for an NEC a week ago. I don't think he'd mind if I hosted it here.


----------



## Brett

Hi Guys,


Glad to see this has come along this far! Though I've swapped all my fans, I'd love to add this circuit to all but the 3 CRT fans on my Sony 1292Q. Has anyone etched boards, and built circuits ready to solder in? I'm okay with an iron, but lameless at understanding circuits, etc.


Thanks in advance for your help!


----------



## Brett

Bump!


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## Doug Baisey

Hmmm,

I put one of the earlier fan mods from Chuck in a XG1101LC yesterday but couldnt get it to work, fans are trying to come on just not enough kick, anyone find this? Its was for the PG-XG and the design looks to be the same as the latest.


I get 6.5V to the fans under load and 8.2V with no load. This was from a while ago that I just had enough time to go do. I wasnt doing the test with the two power supply fans. I was tapping in at inductors 5005-5006 on the HV power board and the input voltage was correct . Thanks, Doug


----------



## stefuel

Does'nt that mod incorporate a timer IC that starts it on full voltage than drops to a lower voltage? Here's my simplistic approch to the problem. I don't know if this is doable on a low voltage motor but, would it be possible to lower your voltage to the fans and add a starting capacitor to bump the fans into motion. Once it's in motion, I'm sure it would continue to rotate. In the HVAC industry there is a product called "Jump Start" that can be added to a non cap-start motor to aid in starting. If that design could be copied on a smaller scale it would solve the problem.


Chip S.


----------



## Doug Baisey

Chip,

Yes, from what I can tell its not getting the 'Kick' unless I did it wrong, one possibility is the LC has an extra fan connector on the HV board and what I thought it might be. Doug


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Doug, I just installed the mod on an XG1350. With no load I had 15V whether the circuit switched or not (normal, since there isn't current flow to drop voltage with no load). With a load, I have 15V at startup and 7.5V after the circuit times out.


I tapped in around where you did (although my diagram says 5505, 5506). The way I tapped was by pulling the jumpers; IJ5504,6,8...16. Then I used the hot side IJ5516 to feed the mod 15V and connected the output of the mod to the load side of IJ5516 and jumpered the nonfan side of resistors R5509,11...19 and R5523 & 25. I then connected the mod's ground to pin 3 of PF09 (PF09 is not used on the 1350).


----------



## Doug Baisey

Jerry,

I think the non and LC unit is just enough to stop the fans, Seeing you had 7.5 volts with the non LC and I had 6.5V with. Ill have to wait for Chuck to determine the fix for the LC, it does have one more fan. Thanks much. Doug


----------



## KevD

Doug,

The extra fan shouldn't matter, the load current is sourced through the NPN pass transistor (2sd613). It sounds like either there is a wiring error in the circuit or the pass device is defective(emitter base is degraded or shorted). With the circuit on you should see the zener voltage plus a sat at the base of the 2sd613, approx. 7.5 to 8v. The emitter voltage should be this voltage minus a Vbe, approx. 7.2 to 7.5v. Measure these values with a load and no load and see what you get. From your previous measurements it shows no regulation at the emitter, therefore the current is taking a resistive path causing the voltage drop you are seeing. Make sure you take the measurement right at the emitter, there could also be a voltage drop between there and the fan connection, solder joint?

Kevin


----------



## Doug Baisey

Jerry, Kev,

Much thanks, Im going back out there today, I did take the measurement at the emitter. I just dont see the regulation working. Solder joints are ok. Doug


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

I don't think it makes much difference as far as the number of fans since I bench tested it with 1 fan, then installed it for only the ~6 fans connected to the HV board, then added the Power supply fans. The mod functioned basically the same. More fans (load) could spell more voltage drop but it didn't make a 1V difference in my case.


From what I've seen of the circuit in action, I'm guessing the 2SD613 is mostly a switch to short across the 33ohm resistor during startup and then opens up (or at least conducts less) so that all the current goes through the resistor and that's what reduces the fan voltage. I noticed that the resistor warms up after the timeout but the 2SD613 is only warm during startup (when all the current is going through IT) and then gets cooler.


For anyone wondering, the mod does a great job but it seems you need to include the power supply fans or the change was only about 25%. The PS fans have enough of a buzz to them that quieting the other fans only seemed to make the PS ones more apparent. Now I can't even hear the PS fans once I added them.


----------



## KevD

Quote:

From what I've seen of the circuit in action, I'm guessing the 2SD613 is mostly a switch to short across the 33ohm resistor during startup and then opens up (or at least conducts less) so that all the current goes through the resistor and that's what reduces the fan voltage. I noticed that the resistor warms up after the timeout but the 2SD613 is only warm during startup (when all the current is going through IT) and then gets cooler.
Jerry,

Looking at the circuit, it's actually the other way around. The 613 is off at startup and the fan current is supplied through the 33 ohm pullup to 15V, this gets the fans going. Once the 613 is turned on, it's emitter voltage is regulated by the zener voltage applied to the base minus a vbe which is approximately 7.5v depending on component variation. The 33 ohm resistor is now dropping the difference between the regulated voltage at the emitter and the 15v rail, approximately 7.5v causing it to dissipate about 2 watts, which is why it is warm to the touch or burning if you leave your finger on long enough.

Kevin


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Oh this is so much fun...
Quote:

The 613 is off at startup and the fan current is supplied through the 33 ohm pullup to 15V, this gets the fans going. Once the 613 is turned on, it's emitter voltage is regulated by the zener voltage applied to the base minus a vbe which is approximately 7.5v depending on component variation.
Kevin, you got me thinking about this so I checked a few more things and I'm sticking with my original analysis. With a voltmeter connected from C to E on 2SD613, there is only a 1V drop across it during startup so that means it is ON and conducting 14 of the source 15V. After the timeout the voltage E to C rises to about 7.5V which means it is at least 1/2 off or the 5W resistor is dropping it and less is getting to the fans.


The 33ohm resistor can't act as a pullup because it's in series with the load. The more current (load) that it passes, the more it drops (E=IxR). I tried connecting only 1 fan in series and the voltage to the fan dropped from 15 to 12V. More fans make it drop even lower (like to 7.5V  )


----------



## KevD

Jerry,

OK, then that would mean the timer circuit is doing the opposite of what I assumed, which it doesn't. The output of the 555 goes low after the timeout, turning off the 2n2222, this allows the bottom 2n2222 to be turned on and light up the zener through it's 100 ohm shunt. It seemed obvious that this was a regulator circuit and you would think that's how it would be used. However the parallel 33 ohm resistor is defeating the transistor action at light load, hence the reason you see 12.1v with only one fan. I understand the E=IR concept perfectly well, and it is conceivable that with currents small enough that there is enough voltage to start up. However, looking at it again it now seems that you are right and the fan voltage relies somewhat on an IR drop, not as robust as I would like it because there is no load regulation. The ideal situation is to have a specified voltage independent of load variation, a problem now seen with Doug's situation. The fact a zener is in the circuit suggest it was used as a regulator at some point, I think there may have been an oversight during a circuit change or it was just designed to work with only one specific load requirement. I would probably tweak this circuit a little so that it works as a regulated voltage source independent of load.

Kevin


----------



## Doug Baisey

Update,

Im just not seeing the regulation. I dont see the kick at all or where the timer is timing anything. Ground is ok, 15V is ok (in). Im thinking the load does have an affect. Voltage was read at the emitter. I brought it home to do more checking but we finally have Nascar starting tomorrow so thats has priority. Doug


----------



## Jerry Arseneau

Doug, check the base of the 2SD613. It should be 15V during the timeout, then 7.5 after.


----------



## KevD

Doug,

Adding the extra fan shouldn't drop the voltage more unless the transistor isn't turning on which sounds like it may be the issue. Make sure pin 3 on the 555 goes high on power up, this keeps the bottom 2n2222 off allowing the 613 to switch on hard through the 100 ohm resistor connected to the base.

Kevin


----------



## KevD

Oh Jerry,

I meant to say in my explanation above that you are right about the 613 turning on at startup, at first glance I missed the 100 ohm acting as a base resistor when the zener is off. However the 12.1v you're seeing with one fan is explained in my post above. Some of the current is shunted through the 33 ohm resistor, at light load this becomes more significant as the emitter voltage rises, stopping the base from turning on. The resistor helps to share some of the load, but at the cost of load regulation. If you just remove the resistor and allow the transistor to have control you would just have to make sure you have a good heat sink that's capable of at least 10W, assuming the total fan current is below 1 amp.

Kevin


----------



## Brett

Hi Guys,


Sorry to be a little off-topic, at least off the technical part of the topic.


Chuck told me that some of you asked for his circuit to mod your Sony 1292s - has anyone had success or issues with this circuit on that projector?


Thanks in advance,


----------



## Think Big

Quote:

_Originally posted by DHarp193_
*FYI, there is also a fan mod for the Electrohome Marquee line of projectors that quiets the noise considerably for all you Marquee owners out there!!!


Tim Martin knows how to do it, as well as myself and a few others if interested.*
I'm interested of all things to do with a Electrohome Marquee 8500!!!!


----------



## Crescent

I'm not all that comfortable going inside the projector. I"ve never owned one before. I'd like to quiet my XG 110LC. Does anyone have photos please? It would be greatly appreciated!


----------

