# 120 Hz HDMI Cables??



## jbernardis

I was at BB tonight buying a new TV: Sony KDL52XBR4 52" LCD Panel. The salesman told me I would need to replace all of my HDMI cables with ones rated for 120 Hz, especially those going to my Blu Ray player (Panny DMP-BD30). I've always been of the mind to never pay "monstrous" prices for HDMI cables. Is what the salesman told me true or was he feeding me a line of crap?


Thanks


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## Vince2909

total line of crap


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## eskimo2176




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbernardis* /forum/post/12815785
> 
> 
> I was at BB tonight buying a new TV: Sony KDL52XBR4 52" LCD Panel. The salesman told me I would need to replace all of my HDMI cables with ones rated for 120 Hz, especially those going to my Blu Ray player (Panny DMP-BD30). I've always been of the mind to never pay "monstrous" prices for HDMI cables. Is what the salesman told me true or was he feeding me a line of crap?
> 
> 
> Thanks



He's feeding you a line. A decent HDMI cable should suffice. Monoprice.com sells decent HDMI cables for cheap.


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## joffer

I'm not sure what's funnier, if he did know he was feeding you a line of crap or if he didn't.


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## namechamps




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbernardis* /forum/post/12815785
> 
> 
> I was at BB tonight buying a new TV: Sony KDL52XBR4 52" LCD Panel. The salesman told me I would need to replace all of my HDMI cables with ones rated for 120 Hz, especially those going to my Blu Ray player (Panny DMP-BD30). I've always been of the mind to never pay "monstrous" prices for HDMI cables. Is what the salesman told me true or was he feeding me a line of crap?
> 
> 
> Thanks



So many things wrong with this one.

1) There is no such thing as 120Hz rated cables.

2) Even if there was your HDTV only accepts 24p & 60p over HDMI. While it displays at 120Hz it still only accepts a 24Hz or 60Hz signal. There are no consumer grade HDTV with a 120p input. Period.


3) Even if there were 120Hz cables (there aren't) and your HDTV accepted 120p input (it doesn't) no BD player has 120Hz (120p) output. Since content on the disc is 24p there is no reason to output it as 120p. It is output as 24p (using less bandwidth than 60p) and your HDTV applies a 5:5 pulldown to 120Hz.


Someday there may be sources (PS4, xbox 720) with an 120Hz output and someday there may be HDTV with 120p input but even those would just need an HDMI cable.


Snake Oil at its finest.


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## jbernardis

Thanks for the quick replies. I'm just going to try my existing cables, and if I have any issues, I will go to monoprice for the replacements. This is what I was thinking all along - just wanted confirmation - thanks again.


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## Glenee




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbernardis* /forum/post/12815923
> 
> 
> Thanks for the quick replies. I'm just going to try my existing cables, and if I have any issues, I will go to monoprice for the replacements. This is what I was thinking all along - just wanted confirmation - thanks again.



Total line of stuff. When you buy your cables from Monoprice. Just be sure to buy the new 1.3 that they have now for the speed and Pin 7 (I think thats it) that you will need later on.

Glenee


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## reconlabtech




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Glenee* /forum/post/12816928
> 
> 
> Total line of stuff. When you buy your cables from Monoprice. Just be sure to buy the new 1.3 that they have now for the speed and Pin 7 (I think thats it) that you will need later on.
> 
> Glenee



The 1.3 label just means they have been tested to support full 1080p, it does not mean your existing cable will not. As for PIN 7, you are maybe caught up a little in the hype yourself. HDMI cables all have 19 pins except for a higher definition version that has 29 pins.

_The HDMI Specification has expanded to include three connectors, each intended for different markets.


The standard Type A HDMI connector has 19 pins, with bandwidth to support all SDTV, EDTV and HDTV modes and more. The plug outside dimensions are 13.9 mm wide by 4.45 mm high. Type A is electrically compatible with single-link DVI-D.


A higher resolution version called Type B is defined in HDMI 1.0. Type B has 29 pins (21.2 mm wide), allowing it to carry an expanded video channel for use with very high-resolution future displays, such as WQSXGA (3200x2048). Type B is electrically compatible with dual-link DVI-D, but is not in general use.


The Type C mini-connector is intended for portable devices. It is smaller than Type A (10.42 mm by 2.42 mm) but has the same 19-pin configuration._


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## JTYoung

Let me guess, it was the Monster Cable brand that cost $150.


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## jpmst3









I have never paid more than $4 for an HDMI cable and have never had an issue, even with 1080p.


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## bob13654

I'm using cables that I bought from monoprice more than a year ago, before HDMI 1.3 was even released. I have zero problems using these cables with my 1080p TV and bitstreaming DTS-MA to my Pioneer 94TXH. They aren't "1.3" rated cables (which I suspect are the exact same cables branded with the 1.3 moniker) as many companies are advertising today, yet they work fine with all the advanced video and audio options that are becoming more common. My point is, you don't need fancy expensive cables, just good quality cables. Monoprice is so cheap that by the time you will need something else, many years from now, you won't be sweating the $5 you spent on a cable.


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## Sven26

Ha ha ha. Awesome. I used to work for the BB competition in red shirts while in college...every now and then, my department manager would call and ask for things that didn't exist like a tape deck with optical output just to show us why training was so important. Sadly, most of the time the answer was, "Yea, we've got that". My personal favorite was when a customer came in trying to figure out how to hook up her new surround sound system that she bought at BB, which consisted of a stereo receiver and a surround sound speaker package. Apparently the store associate told her to just twist a bunch of the wires together and shove them in the speaker output. Luckily, she came to us for a second opinion.


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## Quetzalcoatl

This is just sad but it shows the markup they have on those cables.


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## jbernardis




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *JTYoung* /forum/post/12817112
> 
> 
> Let me guess, it was the Monster Cable brand that cost $150.




It WAS a monster cable, but for a 10 footer it was $219. Unbelievable. And of course, I'd need two - one from the BD player to the AV receiver, and one from the AV receiver to the TV.


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## Donnie Eldridge




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbernardis* /forum/post/12819987
> 
> 
> It WAS a monster cable, but for a 10 footer it was $219. Unbelievable. And of course, I'd need two - one from the BD player to the AV receiver, and one from the AV receiver to the TV.



I would expect nothing less from BB.


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## rwestley

Another amazing BB story. I visit BB often and I listen to all kinds of nonsense from some of the sales people. So many customers ask for advice from these inexperience people and they accept it without question. Let the buyer beware. I have used many of the Monoprice cables for myself and friends over the past year and a half with no issues. We have saved a lot of money. I find it sad to see hown many people really get ripped off by the snake oil being sold.


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## jpmst3

Ya, I went up with my friend a couple years back to help with car stereo purchase and the salesperson tried to sell him extra heavy cables because the "bass box will be in the trunk and tweeters up front, so the if you use the thicker cables the sounds will all get there at the same time." "If not, your bass will lag behind the treble"


Hmm, I said, "correct me if I am wrong but doesn't electicity travel at nearly the speed of light? The car is what 12 ft long? I doubt we will notice the .0000000000000000001 of a second regardless of cabling used, let's risk it!"


Sheez! Unreal!


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## Glenee




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *reconlabtech* /forum/post/12816981
> 
> 
> The 1.3 label just means they have been tested to support full 1080p, it does not mean your existing cable will not. As for PIN 7, you are maybe caught up a little in the hype yourself. HDMI cables all have 19 pins except for a higher definition version that has 29 pins.
> 
> _The HDMI Specification has expanded to include three connectors, each intended for different markets.
> 
> 
> The standard Type A HDMI connector has 19 pins, with bandwidth to support all SDTV, EDTV and HDTV modes and more. The plug outside dimensions are 13.9 mm wide by 4.45 mm high. Type A is electrically compatible with single-link DVI-D.
> 
> 
> A higher resolution version called Type B is defined in HDMI 1.0. Type B has 29 pins (21.2 mm wide), allowing it to carry an expanded video channel for use with very high-resolution future displays, such as WQSXGA (3200x2048). Type B is electrically compatible with dual-link DVI-D, but is not in general use.
> 
> 
> The Type C mini-connector is intended for portable devices. It is smaller than Type A (10.42 mm by 2.42 mm) but has the same 19-pin configuration._



Which one is the Data Pin?


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## KurtBJC

All of them are associated with data of one sort or another, except for the power pin and the "reserved for future expansion" pin; what kind of data are you asking about? I'm very familiar with the cable spec and can probably answer your question if you can be a bit more specific.


Kurt
Blue Jeans Cable


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## reconlabtech

Pin 1 TMDS Data2+

Pin 2 TMDS Data2 Shield

Pin 3 TMDS Data2–

Pin 4 TMDS Data1+

Pin 5 TMDS Data1 Shield

Pin 6 TMDS Data1–

Pin 7 TMDS Data0+

Pin 8 TMDS Data0 Shield

Pin 9 TMDS Data0–

Pin 10 TMDS Clock+

Pin 11 TMDS Clock Shield

Pin 12 TMDS Clock–

Pin 13 CEC

Pin 14 Reserved (N.C. on device)

Pin 15 SCL

Pin 16 SDA

Pin 17 DDC/CEC Ground

Pin 18 +5 V Power

Pin 19 Hot Plug Detect


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## chris0




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbernardis* /forum/post/12815785
> 
> 
> The salesman told me I would need to replace all of my HDMI cables with ones rated for 120 Hz...





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jpmst3* /forum/post/12820862
> 
> 
> ...so the if you use the thicker cables the sounds will all get there at the same time." "If not, your bass will lag behind the treble"...



Too funny. I always wonder if these people are lying or just don't understand it themselves.


I worked at a hardware store a while back. Sometimes when someone would ask where the Crescent wrenches were I'd ask them if they wanted metric or standard.


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## isu1648

i work for a best buy during the offseason (work in minor league baseball) in the HT department and i recommend monoprice.com to about 75% of the people i talk to. it depends on the person, some people want the cables asap and dont care about the price, so they dismiss my suggestion, but most appreciate it. but yeah, dont generalize on BB employees before you get in the store, a few of us know our stuff. i guess im defending myself more than best buy, i dont particularly care for the place either.


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## BrndNtrl

I'd _hope_ that every HDMI cable is rated at a little higher than 120hz







340MHz=HDMI 1.3. That and the guy obviously didn't know jack about what 120hz actually is regarding televisions.


Our MHT guys know a fair amount more than expected (management holds them accountable for knowing their **** and we've got a few enthusiasts in the upper levels), but depending on how its reinforced you'll find things like (at our store) the occasional employee using lines like "are you router certified" in order to land some in-home installation. While your average person doesn't know jack about networking, when you run into someone who knows what they're talking about it kills the credibility of the brand.


The sad thing is it works on other people when it comes to selling, leading to praise by management or supervisors who don't know any better themselves for good performance. Unfortunately it just gives every blue shirt a bad name.


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## ricky_rocket




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *isu1648* /forum/post/12889923
> 
> 
> i work for a best buy during the offseason (work in minor league baseball) in the HT department and i recommend monoprice.com to about 75% of the people i talk to.



Thanks for the tip. That site looks like they have 3ft HDMI 1.3a "gold plated" cables for less than $5. That's less than the sales tax I'd pay for Mon$ter Cable$.


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## avsperch

Same thing happened at CC. He kept telling me I would need 120hz-certified cable. I just nodded and said no thanks. But his insistence made me hesitate and wonder, so I got online to check it out (just in case he really did know what he was talking about). So for many (most?) people, I'd imagine they'll just take the word of the sales person. I guess companies figure if you're already spending 1000s on TV and player, etc., you won't mind paying a couple hundred dollars for cables. A real shame.


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## Ranger 518

Got told it too while I was shopping. Glad to see it is BS.


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## SecretWeapon

Any HDMI Cable that is 1.3 Highspeed and has a bandwidth of 10.2 GBPS (Gigabytes per second) will pass 1080p at 120hz. To say any HDMI will pass 120hz is wrong there are many cables out there with a rating of 2.2 GBPS at that band width you can only handle 1080i at 60hz. BB has all of this info. If you question a salesmans judgment you can have them call there specailists and get the real facts. They do carry more inexpensive cables that will support 120hz.


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## solepixel

I too recently purchased a Sony 52" LCD (KDL52W4100) and got the same spill from the sales rep from BB. "You must buy this HDMI cable (pointing) to receive full 120hz blah blah blah." I told him I would find one online cheaper than $150, so no thanks. I mean, you've got to be freaking kidding me trying to push another $150 on me after I just spent $2400 on a Freaking TV! Greedy bastards.


Anyway, the story goes (although this may not be the case 100% of the time) is these guys (and girls) get hired there not really knowing much. Sometimes they're like me and "think" they know a lot, but when they finally get in the world of electronics and computers, get their eyes opened wide. I started working at CompUSA @ 19 (about 8 years ago) and I'm not one to go telling somebody something that I know isn't true, however I was unaware that half the time I was telling people things that I didn't know was false.


What happens is a manager or a "more advanced" team member will tell you something to this effect, like "Your surge protector must be 1028 Joules", and you, the ignorant one, says "Oh, really, I did not know that". Now you are passing that "knowledge" on to anybody you talk to. This is just one example (still not even sure about the truth on that one), but the cable thing is a bit rediculous. Even though I didn't know everything mentioned in this post, I did know that any cable bought at Walmart, Circuit City, BestBuy, hhgregg, etc. were all marked up over 800%. I remember one of the last things I bought with my employee discount at CompUSA was a SCSI2 cable that retailed for $74. I got it for $4 (cost).


It's really sad how high they have these marked up and even with the number of places on the web to buy these, they still have not brought these prices down. It's just sickening.


I'll be honest though, I have had some guys tell me "Here's the cable you need, but you can get it online for much cheaper." I like these guys and stores listed above need more of them.


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## ccotenj




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SecretWeapon* /forum/post/14747546
> 
> 
> Any HDMI Cable that is 1.3 Highspeed and has a bandwidth of 10.2 GBPS (Gigabytes per second) will pass 1080p at 120hz. To say any HDMI will pass 120hz is wrong there are many cables out there with a rating of 2.2 GBPS at that band width you can only handle 1080i at 60hz. BB has all of this info. If you question a salesmans judgment you can have them call there specailists and get the real facts. They do carry more inexpensive cables that will support 120hz.



ummmm... no... ratings aren't a "maximum limit"... and your cable doesn't care what refresh rate your tv is using...


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## mattf2686




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *isu1648* /forum/post/12889923
> 
> 
> i work for a best buy during the offseason (work in minor league baseball) in the HT department and i recommend monoprice.com to about 75% of the people i talk to. it depends on the person, some people want the cables asap and dont care about the price, so they dismiss my suggestion, but most appreciate it. but yeah, dont generalize on BB employees before you get in the store, a few of us know our stuff. i guess im defending myself more than best buy, i dont particularly care for the place either.




you're a bad salesman, lol...


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## senojscott

Good info.. I purchased a 52" Sammy 7 series 120hz tonight and got the same lame attempt at BB to sell me a $200 HDMI cable.


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## J0HNNY H0PK1NS




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *senojscott* /forum/post/14797609
> 
> 
> Good info.. I purchased a 52" Sammy 7 series 120hz tonight and got the same lame attempt at BB to sell me a $200 HDMI cable.



I've bought 2 Sammys (LN46A650) (LNT4069F) both at 120hz from CC. Each time I went, even before I asked an associate to get me each unit I said "dont bother trying to sell me any cables". Its funny because they act like I'm the stupid one for not considering the purchase of some useless Monster hardware.


My girlfriend gets pissed at me when I test the associate to see if they know what theyre talking about but...I asked a female TV associate to tell me "why I need a 120hz HDMI monster Cable @ $135.00". She asked me if I watched Blu Ray movies and how. I said "my ps3". She then said "that particular cable allows the 120hz signal to get to the TV uninterupted" I then proceeded to laugh almost uncontrollably and ask her if she was just kidding around. Then told her she needs to do some research. Or go back to CC rip off training


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## Truky46

The government is the only guilty of this bad practice letting the companies to lying to the costumers in the name of profit.

Somebody needs to put a stop to these immoral practices on these days.


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## greensonor

This happened to me last night. Was told I needed a more expensive Monster or Rocket Fish brand cable to pass 120hz. I contacted my Attorney General's office and lodged a formal complaint. It's blatant bait and switch.


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## BNut

LOL after reading these posts... I had the same thing happen to me at BB but to be honest I was picking a fight. I had already looked up the HDMI highspeed specs online using my iPhone and then proceeded to explain to the sales guy how the $30 Belkin cable they had was "better" than the $200 Monster cable because the specs on HDMI's website showed the Belkin was rated for 340hz but evidently the Monster cable "only" did 120hz because that's what the packaging stated!


The same sales guy was also convinced that the PS3 would "magically" send 120 or 240fps (ie hz) if I hooked it up to a LCD TV that was 120 or 240hz. He was also convinced that Plasma TV's could do 480 or 600hz because of the "sub field drive" specs plasma TV's list on their marketing hype. I asked him if he actually owned a PS3 and knew their was a setting on the PS3 to "limit" it to 24fps and this confounded him as well.


I'm guessing most of those people are making a little over minimum wage so our real complaints should be with the store managers, not the high school and college kids working there to make a few extra bucks.


I actually own two Monster cable products, one is a Toslink cable (No discernable difference from the Acoustic Research Toslink cable I own) and the other is one of their "uber" component cables. The connectors were so tight I was worried about breaking my TV and A/V Reciever whenever I connected or disconnected them. Finally I had enough used a pair of needle nose pliers to bend part of the connector back so it would more easily slide onto the TV and receiver.


I currently own a $12 Blue Jeans Series-2 6' HDMI cable and will be comparing it with $9 Monoprice cable that is also 6'. I also have the 6' HDMI cable that came with my DirectTV receiver and so far I can't tell a difference b/w the Blue Jean HDMI calbe and the freebie DTV HDMI cable while watching Blu-Ray's from my PS3 on a 46" Panny 1080p Plasma TV.


Bring a cheap freebie cable to BB some time, have THEM hook it up to their 240hz TV on display and see how it compares side by side with a $200 Monster cable. Most TV's support split screen mode from two different inputs right?


Take care,

Brian


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