# The prepress system



## prepress


*The shadow knows...*











At the request of several members, I'm taking a stab at starting a thread for my system. I have only a 2-channel setup which handles both video and audio, in a room that's 14' x 18'5" or so. The system is in a state of flux as I begin, but I hope the final config will be in place in the next couple of weeks or so. I should also point out that I don't quite have the hang of embedding photos. So with that caveat, the equipment is as follows (subject to change very soon):

*Analog*

VPI HW-19 MkIV/SME 309/Grado Reference Platinum

Magnum Dynalab MD-90

Day-Sequerra antenna
*Digital*

McIntosh MCD301

Scientific Atlanta Explorer 4250HDC (TW Cable)
*Video*

Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD

Oppo BDP-83

Pioneer Elite DVL-91

DVDO iScan Duo

Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD
*Preamp*

Audio Research LS3

Aragon 47K
*Power amp*

B&K M-200 Sonata monoblocks (2 pair)
*Speakers*

Mirage M3-si
*Power*

Tripplite LCR2400

Triplite HT1210ISOCTR

VPI SDS
*Cables*

Kimber Hero, AQ Black Mamba II

Kimber 8TC
*Furniture*

Sanus Euro

Hooker Entertainment console


 

For the story of the system, read on. How it is here isn't what it will be . . .


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## hometheatergeek

Ok Dude. I can call you dude right? Welcome to the WYSC night edition.










That is a very impressive list of equipment you have. We are so happy you took the first step in posting and starting a thread and look forward to seeing many more BRIGHTER pictures in the future







Now you just need to invest in a Light, Lightbulb and maybe a Digital Camera or better cell phone.

















All kidding aside I am really glad to see you have your own thread and plan on stopping in everyday for a chat.


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## prepress

Hello HTG, we'll see what happens, right? Everything is in transition here. Meantime, here's a photo without the special effects from back in October when I began to move things around, it's my (then) just-purchased sofa:











It's more comfortable than the one it replaced, which was 19 years old.


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## prepress

And here's one from when I was beginning to really mess with things last year. Note the food containers (hamburgers) in the foreground, sitting on the coffee table in front of me. I also hadn't dusted in a while. More when time permits, but this is a start.


By the way, that's a DVDO EDGE on the left rack, now replaced with a Duo.


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## prepress

And finally, from that same time...











I had bought fans and other stuff, and the room was chaotic. Last year was crazy. I wasn't organized at all, and the stress of work, my duties with church, and fatigue issues kept the place a bit sloppy. That's being worked on. I hope as things progress that will be noticeable.


Notice the VPI record cleaner in the foreground. _That's_ not where I want it!


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## ddgtr

Charles,


Although the first pic is really dark, the room feels like it has a good vibe to it!

I agree with HTgeek, very nice gear! When everything settles down a bit, take some detailed pics of the gear and speakers!!


Cheers


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## hikarate

Great gear and I always like reading your posts. Is that a fireplace I see in the background? I consider myself in good company if it is.


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## KahunaCanuck

Woohoo!


Welcome Prepress to your own thread! A nice subtle start to build up the drama...very smart!










I have the DVDO Edge...what is better about the Duo??


Mike


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hikarate* /forum/post/19214073
> 
> 
> Great gear and I always like reading your posts. Is that a fireplace I see in the background? I consider myself in good company if it is.



Hello there, hikarate (with a name like that, do you use aftershave?)







,


It is a fireplace, but I'd have preferred a regular wall for setup reasons. There's also a big radiator behind the CD rack to the right of the system. I don't use that radiator because it makes things too hot in here; I had the building management turn it off completely, in fact. I can use all the wall space I can get, but they can't (or won't) really take the radiator away. If I move, the next person may want it and they'd have to lug it back in here.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* /forum/post/19214265
> 
> 
> Woohoo!
> 
> 
> Welcome Prepress to your own thread! A nice subtle start to build up the drama...very smart!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have the DVDO Edge...what is better about the Duo??
> 
> 
> Mike



Off the top of my head, more inputs and a color management system. I don't use the CMS, but I wanted more analog inputs. I was able to do a trade-in with the EDGE (which had gone back for repair). It's the same 2010 chip, though.


Thanks for the welcome.


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## Bunga99

Very sweet set-up!


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## prepress

And here's one more recent, with "cable mountain" in the front...











At this point, I have all this leftover cable that I couldn't use. It's Tara Labs stuff which I wanted to use but couldn't because the TV stand's rear slots aren't wide enough to pass it through (I destroyed one pair in the attempt). There are several HDMI cables as well (Blue Jeans, one Belden). But at this point I'd begun to modify things. The Denon tuner is on top of my turntable temporarily, as I figure out what to do with it. The MD-90 is in the cabinet, there on the lower left.


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## Waboman

Whoa! What's going on here? Has the Earth reversed it's rotation around the sun? Prepress has his own thread, dogs & cats living together.










Hey man, congrats! I echo everyone else in saying you have a great system and I look forward to seeing more picks.


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## Franin

Finally prepress fantastic setup well done !!


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## prepress

Thanks, gentlemen. Here's one from a slightly different angle, days before I began reworking things in earnest. And that does include dusting! This is an older building, and dust is a constant issue.











From this angle, you can just make out the second Tripplite in the larger Sanus rack to the right (the silver guy with the multi-color LEDs) and the Day-Sequerra antenna connected to the MD-90 (on top of the LP/LD cabinet).


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## hometheatergeek

Well, now that you have started your thread and have all of us stopping by, you could start a side business and auctioning off all of your


> Quote:
> I have all this leftover cable that I couldn't use. It's Tara Labs stuff













I don't know if it is my computer or the work police but I can not see any of your attachments. I am going to have to switch NIC cards on my computer and go through the other router we have here back in the PC lab. BRB


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## hometheatergeek

Nope, I still can not see your pictures.







Is it my computer or are the rest of you having the same issue?







Charles can you see your pictures on your work computer?







I only see the pics in post 1 and 4.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19221232
> 
> 
> Nope, I still can not see your pictures.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is it my computer or are the rest of you having the same issue?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Charles can you see your pictures on your work computer?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I only see the pics in post 1 and 4.



I'm at work now (on a quick break) and I see the pics in #1 and #4 only as well. At home, I can see them all. It may be the work police, but it also may mean I'm not embedding some of them properly. I am still figuring that part out. I note that #1 and #4 have attached thumbnails, whereas the others don't. I may be on to something with that idea.


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## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19221336
> 
> 
> I'm at work now (on a quick break) and I see the pics in #1 and #4 only as well. At home, I can see them all. It may be the work police, but it also may mean I'm not embedding some of them properly. I am still figuring that part out. I note that #1 and #4 have attached thumbnails, whereas the others don't. I may be on to something with that idea.



Charles, same here I cannot see any new pics. It just shows a blank space. I don't think it's the work police...


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/19221714
> 
> 
> Charles, same here I cannot see any new pics. It just shows a blank space. I don't think it's the work police...



Would appreciate knowing if anyone out there can't see pics at home, especially the ones without attached thumbnails.


ddgtr, HTG, thanks for the alert.


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## hikarate

Post #1 and Post #4 show pictures (Both have thumbnails). Others do not show up for me.


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## prepress

Okay, I went back and added thumbnails to the offending photos. I hope they can all be seen now. I'm thinking of just making attachments rather than try to embed, since that takes up more space. We'll see.


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## prepress

Here's a look inside the Hooker cabinet. The Marantz is redundant, but I have shelf space, so it's in there. That triangular thing next to the VPI SDS (lower right shelf) is an upgraded power supply for the Aragon 47k phono preamp. The smaller one which came with the unit is in its box, stored away.


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## prepress

Now, things are changing. First, I finally put together my CVD/CD rack last weekend (with help) which sat here for over a year. It's a Wood Technology TO-1260. It's great because it'll hold 560 DVDs, 1260 CDs or any combination. I don't have any VHS tapes, so I won't worry about those. Not sure this is the final location, but it will stay where it is for now.


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## hikarate

Hey can you pop the covers on those speakers? What year are those? I've only seen mirage speakers in a few threads but they don't look like yours. Yours look very old school and I really like that.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hikarate* /forum/post/19224585
> 
> 
> Hey can you pop the covers on those speakers? What year are those? I've only seen mirage speakers in a few threads but they don't look like yours. Yours look very old school and I really like that.



I bought them in February 1993. No plans to upgrade (no money either). It was a case of being comfortable immediately when I auditioned them; the feeling that says, "this one." Mirage doesn't make full-range speakers like this any more; unfortunate, in my view. If I _had_ to replace them, I'd go for Definitive Technology, since they make bipolar speakers also and I like the concept. Such speakers have more independence from the room, so here's more freedom of placement.


The piano black caps do come off, but they don't get me inside the speaker. And the grille isn't designed to come off; it's like a sock on the speaker.


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## prepress

Here's one from Saturday, when I completed the reconfig of the first (near) rack.


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## prepress

And a change to the inside of the cabinet. Notice the VPI SDS is gone, and the 47k is moved down a shelf.











I've also ordered a couple of these.
http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=PGAC9


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## hometheatergeek

Morning Charles,


Looks like you got the handle on the picture situation.







Now that we can see them I am throughly impress with your collection of HT and 2 channel gear. I really like the older Mirage speakers. I almost bought them myself back then but decided on the Klipsch's Forte II instead. I think it was right around the same time back in 93. I think it's great that our speakers have lasted this long and says alot about the quality of the speakers that were built back then. Have you ever thought of redoing or is there anyone out there that makes new or improved crossovers for the Mirage like there are for Klipsch speakers? Only reason I'm asking is the componets in the crossovers do wear out over time and after I did my Forte IIs they now perform better then when they were new.


Al


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19231759
> 
> 
> Morning Charles,
> 
> 
> Looks like you got the handle on the picture situation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now that we can see them I am throughly impress with your collection of HT and 2 channel gear. I really like the older Mirage speakers. I almost bought them myself back then but decided on the Klipsch's Forte II instead. I think it was right around the same time back in 93. I think it's great that our speakers have lasted this long and says alot about the quality of the speakers that were built back then. Have you ever thought of redoing or is there anyone out there that makes new or improved crossovers for the Mirage like there are for Klipsch speakers? Only reason I'm asking is the componets in the crossovers do wear out over time and after I did my Forte IIs they now perform better then when they were new.
> 
> 
> Al



I hadn't thought of this, actually. I had thought more of something with the drivers maybe wearing out at some point. Thanks for the heads-up. How did you research your Klipsch work?


I also notice (I'm at work) that the sofa photo is still hidden; I must have forgotten to update it. I don't need to I guess, with the thumbnail there, but why not be consistent, right?


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## hometheatergeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19231870
> 
> 
> I hadn't thought of this, actually. I had thought more of something with the drivers maybe wearing out at some point. Thanks for the heads-up. How did you research your Klipsch work?
> 
> 
> I also notice (I'm at work) that the sofa photo is still hidden; I must have forgotten to update it. I don't need to I guess, with the thumbnail there, but why not be consistent, right?



My Klipsch research/rework was easy. There are two gentlemen that belong to the Klipsch forum who do crossover work. So I just spent some time looking around the web and it looks like there is not the same opportunity for you and your Mirages. Even the Community Mirage forum does not load a web page.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19233736
> 
> 
> My Klipsch research/rework was easy. There are two gentlemen that belong to the Klipsch forum who do crossover work. So I just spent some time looking around the web and it looks like there is not the same opportunity for you and your Mirages. Even the Community Mirage forum does not load a web page.



I'm not sure they were designed with that type of access in mind, anyway. I'm sure I could find something else if need be (i.e., Definitive Technology), but I hope that's not for a while yet.


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## prepress

In case anyone was wondering about the reconfiguring and rearranging, it's simple. The monsters are coming. THE MONSTERS ARE COMING.


Tomorrow.

 

1773_MC501.pdf 147.6298828125k . file


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bunga99* /forum/post/19216360
> 
> 
> Very sweet set-up!



Thanks, Bunga. By the way, I just asked a question over in your thread about the SubMersives.


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## Bunga99

I just saw it and answered.


MONSTERS - indeed!









Please be sure to take some pics of the Monsters after you get them set up and they find a comfy spot in their new home.


I meant to ask you....I've heard last week there was a Tornado or Tornado warning in Brooklyn. Hope none of that impacted you or your family.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bunga99* /forum/post/19235270
> 
> 
> I just saw it and answered.
> 
> 
> MONSTERS - indeed!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please be sure to take some pics of the Monsters after you get them set up and they find a comfy spot in their new home.
> 
> 
> I meant to ask you....I've heard last week there was a Tornado or Tornado warning in Brooklyn. Hope none of that impacted you or your family.



Fortunately, no. But there were two tornadoes and a macroburst confirmed by the National Weather Service. It got plenty dark, and the telltale greenish cloud color told me a tornado was happening somewhere. Staten Island and Queens were hit also. Some houses had roofs taken off, lots of trees blown over, uprooted. I'm supremely grateful there wasn't an Oklahoma City-level tornado.


EDIT—Having gotten additional information, I must correct myself on this one. Actually, I was in the tornado and didn't realize it. I thought that it was a strong wind gust, when it was the tornado passing through my neighborhood on its way east, where it took off some roofs and knocked over trees. It was an EF0, the weakest on the Fujita scale. Winds were 80mph. The other tornado, in Queens, was stronger; an EF1, with 100mph winds.


But no damage to anything of mine or in the neighborhood other than some tree branches down. And again, very thankful no Oklahoma City-level storm came through.


Back to the audio—I'm using one pair of the B&Ks now, and the sound is a bit thinner without the other pair, less dynamic. I'm trusting the "monsters" will fill in the gap.


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## prepress

I forgot. Here's the VPI SDS in its new location.











I wish I could keep it as dust-free as it looks right now. I used to take my system apart once a month and dust everything down (it took about 2 hours to disassemble, dust and reassemble). Now, with a more elaborate system, it's too much time and work. And the 501s won't be moving once they're in place so dusting under them may not be an option. But we'll see. Things need to stay presentable, as I hope to have company now and then.


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## prepress

And, here's a look at the other Tripplite, the HT1210ISOCTR. I have the two Tripplites chained, actually. The LCR2400 (a voltage regulator/line conditioner) has everything but the SDS plugged into it; then, the LCR is plugged into the HT1210.











I like the readout of how much power is being consumed and the line voltage on the HT1210. But once I have a read on how much power the full setup with the Macs takes, I may put the LCR into the wall. I'll need an extension cord, as the LCR's cord (non-detachable) doesn't reach the plug; Shunyata has an extension cord (Venom 3, which is 2m) I may consider.


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## prepress


Gentlemen:





























And about 10 minutes after the install guys left, FedEx showed up:











I'm going to use the stock cords for a couple of days to get used to them, before swapping out for the Pangeas. If I don't hear an appreciable difference I'll send the Pangeas back and just get a longer cable to replace the one that's too short. Or just run it through the heavy-duty strip as I'm doing now, to get it to the LCR2400. More later.

 

Thus, the initial equipment list changes. The McIntosh MC501s replace the B&K M-200 Sonatas, and the Pangea power cords will replace the stock cords on the 501s.


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## Bunga99

Man they look freggin sweet in their new home!!!










I bet your back isnt feeling so great right now after moving those bad boys into place!










Looks like you are gonna have a great weekend ahead - Enjoy and Congrats!


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bunga99* /forum/post/19240689
> 
> 
> Man they look freggin sweet in their new home!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I bet your back isnt feeling so great right now after moving those bad boys into place!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like you are gonna have a great weekend ahead - Enjoy and Congrats!



Thanks, Bunga. I've managed to spend about 90 minutes with the Macs using the stock cords and I'd say the main difference over the B&Ks is the Macs sound more livethat is, like a live performance. And perhaps a bit more transparent.


As for my back, I gave in and had the store's installers do the job. The weight per se wasn't beyond me, but the amps were in boxes, and that made them too awkward for one person (this is a second-floor walk-up). When it's time to dust, I'll get a workout for sure.


But the real workout will be straightening up after all this. I have boxes and cabinets and stereo equipment to get rid of. That's not a one-weekend deal, I can see.


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## ddgtr

Charles, they look GORGEOUS!!


It's great that you were able to hear a difference! Looking forward to more impressions as you go through your music collection.


Congrats!!!!


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## prepress

There's one casualty in this, though. The Pangeas are going back, as they're too inflexible and heavy for my setup. As good as things sound with the stock cables, I don't need (nor can I afford) to get anything expensive. I have ideas in mind and am waiting for responses to some e-mails.


I've been using the tuner primarily. Now and then something pops out and I think, "that sounds like it's in the room." There are 7 hours put in total on the amps now, and I'm going to have to get into LPs, CDs, LDs, DVDs and BDs as things go on, but I'll need to have time to sit and enjoy them, as I have the "aftermath" to deal with...











Right now, I have nowhere to put any of this. The boxes are available, but that won't help much. It's a long-term project for sure.


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## Spurrier Sucks

New amps? Nice!


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## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19238017



Very nice, prepress! It's been a long road, and you did very diligent research. Kick back, put your feet up, and enjoy all your hard work.


They look awesome holding court on each end of your system.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19248413
> 
> 
> Very nice, prepress! It's been a long road, and you did very diligent research. Kick back, put your feet up, and enjoy all your hard work.
> 
> 
> They look awesome holding court on each end of your system.



Hello Wabo, and thanks,


I'm waiting to get over the distraction of the "new" pieces for sure. Saturday I was cooking and had the system on, and I kept coming into the living room every so often to look at them.


Well, the meters are cool.


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## prepress

I have decided to look at aftermarket cords for the 501s. There are budget constraints, so my choices are limited to the following:


PS Audio Jewel AC

Wireworld Stratus 5

Shunyata Venom 3 (plus Venom extension cord)


Anyone who has experience with any of these feel free to chime in.


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## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19249634
> 
> 
> Hello Wabo, and thanks,
> 
> 
> I'm waiting to get over the distraction of the "new" pieces for sure. Saturday I was cooking and had the system on, and I kept coming into the living room every so often to look at them.
> 
> 
> Well, the meters are cool.



Lol. I know exactly what you mean.










You have an awesome system, prepress. Enjoy it.


Have you had a chance to crank it up yet?


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19258264
> 
> 
> Lol. I know exactly what you mean.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have an awesome system, prepress. Enjoy it.
> 
> 
> Have you had a chance to crank it up yet?



Volume-wise, not quite. I'll need to see how loud I can get things without overdriving my speakers and while not making it too loud for me (it's not that big a room, after all); I'm very mindful of the fact that my speakers are rated up to 300 watts whereas the 501s can do 500. But I have begun to go beyond using the tuner, and have played the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra, Santana, Yes, Heart, and Anthony Newman. With the ASO the meters jumped from 5w to 50w output during _Fanfare for the Common Man_.


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## prepress

I have another project to consider. I chain my two power conditioners; the LCR2400, with a 12AWG cord, is plugged into the HT1210 with its 14AWG cord (both are non-detachable). I've decided to remove the LCR and put it into the wall directly, thinking the heavier gauge will be a benefit that way. All the gear except my SDS is plugged into it. I'm wondering if there's any benefit to getting a Shunyata extension cord for the LCR, which will need an extension anyway as its cord doesn't make it to the wall outlet. My thinking is that the Shunyata will take up at least some of the filtering slack lost with the HT1210.


I also want to go to a bi-wire pair of speaker cable to reduce wire clutter. I like Kimber 8TC, so I'd stay with that. As for aftermarket power cords for the 501s, I will either stay with the current stock cords (which don't sound bad at all), at least until I can afford some of what the Cable Company recommended, get regular 12-gauge cords, or compromise with some low-cost PS Audio Jewel or Wireworld Stratus 5. More as this develops, but money is a powerful factor at this point.


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## prepress

I ordered one of these.











It's an extension cord version of Shunyata's Venom III power cord. I'm going to use it to connect my main Tripplite to the wall. Twelve-gauge all the way! I decided it made no sense to chain a component with a 12-gauge cord to one with a 14-gauge cord, so that other Tripplite will handle the computer equipment instead.


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## ddgtr

Charles, sorry for the late reply, I was on the road all day today.


I can't find my Pass stock cord, I wanna say it was 14 gauge...


Congrats on the Venom, you're going to be happy with it. It gets nothing but great reviews and I know at least one person with super hi end gear who swears by it.


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/19270363
> 
> 
> Charles, sorry for the late reply, I was on the road all day today.
> 
> 
> I can't find my Pass stock cord, I wanna say it was 14 gauge...
> 
> 
> Congrats on the Venom, you're going to be happy with it. It gets nothing but great reviews and I know at least one person with super hi end gear who swears by it.



Interestingly, I've had difficulty finding 12 AWG "regular" cables. One company which does offer them doesn't have any in stock, and the company they referred me to doesn't have any on their website I could find (they do offer 14 AWG shielded cables though, and at ridiculously low prices). A hardware store website offers a 12AWG extension cord, but the shipping would be as much or more than the cord, I think.


Still not sure how I want to approach this other than not spending a great deal of money, but Venom cords wouldn't be a bad idea. If my system configuration ever changed so that the 1.5m was too short there could be an issue, but another extension cord would cover that.


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## prepress

While waiting on my Venom extension cord, and what to do about power cords for the 501s, I've realized I have another issue. I'd planned to get rid of the Leslie Dame CD/DVD cabinet just replaced with the TO-1260. But I can't because my CD rack is pretty much full.











That means my 16.5 will have to be relocated, also.











Yet more drama. This is going to take up a lot of time and figuring out the configuration of my room. The bottom line is, of course, I have too much stuff. Fortunately, I have some days off scheduled next week.


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## prepress

The Venom extension cord came today, along with a goodie for my turntable...











I'll connect it at some point soon and see if there's any difference, though I think it would need to be upstream for that (according to Music Direct, it should make some difference even chaining my LCR to the wall). If I'm able to find a regular 12-gauge extension cord (none so far) then this Venom will extend another power cord to the LCR from my right-side 501.


I notice the Venom's color isn't as bright as it appears in online photos and in ads; it's more a slate blue, and a fairly dark one at that.


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## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19281903
> 
> 
> The bottom line is, of course, I have too much stuff. Fortunately, I have some days off scheduled next week.



Too much stuff? What's that mean? It's like too much fun. There's no such thing.










A few days off next week, prepress. Just what the doctor ordered.



> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19292498
> 
> 
> The Venom extension cord came today, along with a goodie for my turntable...



Venom cords and Chicago on vinyl. That there is a recipe for a good time. Rock on!


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## ddgtr

Charles, congrats on the new additions. Have fun!!


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## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19295107
> 
> 
> Too much stuff? What's that mean? It's like too much fun. There's no such thing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A few days off next week, prepress. Just what the doctor ordered.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Venom cords and Chicago on vinyl. That there is a recipe for a good time. Rock on!



Okay, I mean too much stuff for my space. There may be some hard decisions upcoming. The system sounds good even with all the stuff in the room. That's why I like bipolar speakers, they're more room-independent than more conventional designs. Still, all the clutter probably has some effect.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/19295288
> 
> 
> Charles, congrats on the new additions. Have fun!!



I may be "waiting for the weekend," as they say, but yes. I want to be able to sit down with the LP and go!


I still wish the regular Venom came in something longer than 5 feet. I believe you can get custom lengths, but that will take a month at least.


----------



## ddgtr

I too found the 5' to be an odd length. Had it been 6' it would have given me a bit more flexibility to move the amp around. I did not know you can get custom lengths...


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/19295348
> 
> 
> I too found the 5' to be an odd length. Had it been 6' it would have given me a bit more flexibility to move the amp around. I did not know you can get custom lengths...



Someone on another forum did it, but said it was going to take about a month to get. A 2.5 or 3m would be nice. I spoke with someone at Wireworld, and they, too, will do custom lengths.


----------



## hometheatergeek

Looking good buddy. So have the MACs excided your expectations?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19299275
> 
> 
> Looking good buddy. So have the MACs excided your expectations?



I've listened with their boxes between me and the right speaker, plus the still-unresolved clutter in the room, but preliminary report is that they are a definite step up from the B&Ks. The sound is more refined, cleaner. This may vary with the source or the recording, but that's my initial impression. There is a greater sense of "live" than before. They're not fully broken in yet, so things may improve in time.


I still plan to get aftermarket power cords for the 501s, but the sheer number and commentary out there makes it confusing. It's suggested that the gauge should be heavy as possible, even if it's heavier than my line conditioner's cord (12AWG). The marketing hype doesn't clear much up, either. A major determining factor will be my wallet, plus as a practical matter I won't go beyond maybe 10AWG or so. I think it gets too unwieldy after that. I have several I'm considering. If I come across a "regular" 12AWG cord in the meantime, I may just go for that and put an end to the confusion.


----------



## prepress

Having grown weary of the seemingly endless permutations regarding power cords, I took the plunge:











PS Audio PerfectWave AC-5s. They should be here early next week. I got a good price. Now, they're 2m, so I'll still have the issue of getting the right amp to my LCR2400. This is where the Shunyata comes in, unless I go for a JPS POWER AC + Outlet Center. More as it develops.


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19309375
> 
> 
> PS Audio PerfectWave AC-5s. They should be here early next week. I got a good price. Now, they're 2m, so I'll still have the issue of getting the right amp to my LCR2400. This is where the Shunyata comes in, unless I go for a JPS POWER AC + Outlet Center. More as it develops.



That there is a sexy looking power cord, prepress. Congrats!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* /forum/post/19214265
> 
> 
> Woohoo!
> 
> 
> Welcome Prepress to your own thread! A nice subtle start to build up the drama...very smart!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have the DVDO Edge...what is better about the Duo??
> 
> 
> Mike



I forgot, the Auto AR feature too. The EDGE and Oppo weren't getting along in that way. Everything 4:3 would get stretched with the Oppo's Source Direct mode and I'd have to correct it manually. No such problem with my 09, by the way.


----------



## hometheatergeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19324385
> 
> 
> By the way HTG, I see that Venom III now comes in a 2m length. And, as noted in my thread, custom lengths are available. I now wonder if I shouldn't return the PS Audio AC-5s I ordered (due to arrive today) and get all Venom cables now, to go with the extension I already have.



That's a tough call. If the PS Audio has a liberal return policy I would at least try them out and see if you notice an improvement. If not then that would be a good time to try out the Venom. But I would just purchase one of their 2m cables, try it out and if the Venom makes the difference you seek then you should order the custom lengths.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19326613
> 
> 
> That's a tough call. If the PS Audio has a liberal return policy I would at least try them out and see if you notice an improvement. If not then that would be a good time to try out the Venom. But I would just purchase one of their 2m cables, try it out and if the Venom makes the difference you seek then you should order the custom lengths.



The AC-5s are probably going back anyway (they arrived earlier; UPS didn't ring my bell). The problem isn't sonic as much as practical. They're too stiff; I didn't think about that when I ordered them, and flexibility is a prime criterion with me. It was a bit of a struggle to get them connected to the 501s due to the limitations of my setup. They are 10 AWG, so that's got a lot to do with it. The Cable Company has a 30-day return policy, so I'm good there.


There is the AC-3, at 12 AWG. The Venom 3 is 12 AWG and very flexible, based upon the extension cord I already have. I didn't get Venoms first because at the time there was no 2m option, except as a custom length. Now there is.


I also just discovered that one of those Pangeas I returned (the 7 AWG behemoths) took a chunk out of the casing of the receptacle it was plugged into on my LCR. Too heavy and stiff.


----------



## hometheatergeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19327140
> 
> 
> The AC-5s are probably going back anyway (they arrived earlier; UPS didn't ring my bell). The problem isn't sonic as much as practical. They're too stiff; I didn't think about that when I ordered them, and flexibility is a prime criterion with me. It was a bit of a struggle to get them connected to the 501s due to the limitations of my setup. They are 10 AWG, so that's got a lot to do with it. The Cable Company has a 30-day return policy, so I'm good there.
> 
> 
> There is the AC-3, at 12 AWG. The Venom 3 is 12 AWG and very flexible, based upon the extension cord I already have. I didn't get Venoms first because at the time there was no 2m option, except as a custom length. Now there is.
> 
> 
> I also just discovered that one of those Pangeas I returned (the 7 AWG behemoths) took a chunk out of the casing of the receptacle it was plugged into on my LCR. Too heavy and stiff.



7 AWG


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19331391
> 
> 
> 7 AWG



Yes, 7 AWG. And the PSA AC-5s went back yesterday, as they were too stiff also (though they didn't bust up my plug as the Pangea did). But, I now have a plan for what to do about cords for the 501s and the whole setup, and use the credit at The Cable Company I'll have as well. I need to figure the final cost, first, and then move on this.


----------



## prepress

I mentioned those evil Pangeas took a bite out of my LCR. Here's the damage (look away if you're squeamish!). . .











As I said, no more stiff, heavy-gauge cables for me. Unless there's _extreme_ flexibility, nothing beyond 12 AWG, and maybe not even then.


----------



## prepress

I've narrowed my power cord choices for the 501s down to the Wireworld Aurora 52, Stratus 52, PS Audio Jewel AC, AC-3 (outside shot), Pangea AC-14 (for sources only, though they can be used with power amps), and Shunyata Venom3. These all reflect the state of my budget at this point, and the AC-3 is the most expensive of the bunch (MSRP $239.99/2m).


I haven't determined how I want to set up finally. Now, I'm using a power strip to extend the right 501 to my LCR2400 power conditioner; I think an extension cord would be better but the best is a direct connection, which means a 3m cord (and more money). I am also considering a PSA Duet to extend my LCR to the wall rather than plug in directly, to offer an additional layer of filtering and the automatic shut-down feature; this is available with my current setup, but the HT1210 the LCR goes into has a 14-gauge cord rather than a 12-gauge as the LCR has. I wonder if I'm limiting current, even though the system doesn't pull anything _near_ the HT1210's capacity (12A, whereas when playing music the system pulls only around 2A). Getting a Duet would necessitate another cable.


I notice a lot of people with WW cords on their Macs, some with PSA cords. Venom is getting a lot of positive press, but the 1.5m length is tricky in case I reconfigure my system and they prove too short. I was thinking about doing that next year if possible, with a Salamander rack replacing the Hooker cabinet I use now. The PSA cords have the detachable ground pin, which could be an advantage; they and the Pangeas also come in a C7 configuration should I go for upgrading my source components that use them.


Then, of course, there's flexibility. This is a major criterion, and the PSA AC-3 would be the least flexible from what I gather so far. The new WWs are said to be flexible, and due to multi-strand construction I'd think the Jewel AC is also. The Venom3 extension cord I have isn't too bad.


I have a $500 credit with The Cable Company I want to use. I'm hoping to sort this out soon.


----------



## KahunaCanuck

I vote for the WWs! 2nd would be the PS Audios...


This is half the fun deciding...Good luck!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* /forum/post/19379174
> 
> 
> I vote for the WWs! 2nd would be the PS Audios...
> 
> 
> This is half the fun deciding...Good luck!



It's work.










I had thought of upgrading the source components with Pangea AC-14s, and since Jay Victor was also part of PS Audio's PerfectWave cable design, PS Audio would then make sense for the amps too. I have one component that needs a C7 connector, which I don't know if WW does. There is now the Kimber PK10, said to be more flexible than the PSA AC-3, even though it's 10 gauge versus the AC-3's 12 gauge. But like the Venom3, it doesn't come in a 3m version. I'd still need a power strip or extension cord. I could substitute the WW Matrix strip for the standard Fellowes I'm using (the MAtrix is shielded), but I'd have to buy an addititonal cable for it probably.


Too many choices. Argh.


----------



## prepress

I am thinking about one of these to replace my second Tripplite, the one my LCR is plugged into.











It has 15A capacity rather than the 12A the HT1012 has, plus it has the same extreme voltage range as the LCR (89–140); the HT1012 shuts down sooner. I probably don't need the extra amps since the system at its normal-use peak isn't pulling much more than 4A or so, but who knows? True, it does have a captive cord, but that's one less PC I'd need to get. Plus, it has the voltage/wattage display, which the next model up doesn't (though it does offer 45A peak current versus this unit's 30A).


Still thinking about my power setup. Money is an issue now, along with the need to be practical, so I have to be more careful.


----------



## prepress

Earlier this week I was watching the Eric Clapton/Steve Winwood DVD of their Madison Square Garden concert and enjoying my favorite track, "Them Changes." And about midway through the track I thought, "wow, this sounds _good_". And maybe it was there before and I didn't notice, but I sensed a transparency I hadn't previously. This is a well-recorded DVD, but even so, if the system sounds this good with stock cords and my 2 Tripplites, do I _really_ need to do anything else? If it weren't for that Cable Company credit, I might not.


So I'm researching (again







) and note that my HT1210 (not 1012 as previously typed) offers 5700 joules of protection. I can't find this info for the Furman so far, but PS Audio's AV 3000 offers 7344 joules; in fact all the PSA conditioners do, even the little Duet. There are several options out there, not only for power cables but conditioners. It's been well said that too many choices can be paralyzing. The inability of the audio part of me to decide means I'm going to have to fall back on my practical side for this current research; my "Vulcan" half, you might say.


----------



## ddgtr

True, too many choices definitely make it harder...


Charles, do your Tripplites buzz/hum? Say if the room is all quiet, do you hear any noise coming from them?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/19447331
> 
> 
> True, too many choices definitely make it harder...
> 
> 
> Charles, do your Tripplites buzz/hum? Say if the room is all quiet, do you hear any noise coming from them?



Under normal circumstances, no. If I put my ear up to them, I hear a faint hum. There's a third Tripplite running my computer equipment which is audible, though not disturbingly so; perhaps that's because of its built-in UPS. The low, steady hum is actually like a bit of white noise.


----------



## prepress

Well, I see PPPs on sale amid reports that they're being discontinued. Amazingly, I'm considering trying to get one before they go. From a purely practical perspective there's no way I need to spend the money, especially in light of the big hit I took buying the McIntosh 501s; the bank account is low enough that even with a $500 store discount, a PPP would be a major expenditure.


And as it seems to always be, there would be necessary associated costs, like a power cord long enough to reach the necessary plug and something to compensate for the lack of outlets (the PPP has 10; my Tripplite LCR has 14). I do have a heavy-duty power strip I could use (I'm using it now to extend a 501 to the LCR), but that's not ideal. Add to that the loss of convenience: the LCR has 2 outlets on the front, allowing me to plug in my iron (9.6A) and just go; the PPP doesn't, plus the iron is near its capacity. PSA says that although the PPP's maximum output is 1500W (short bursts), its normal output is more like 1200W. The LCR will handle the entire line if it has to (LCR*2400*, after all). But the PPP will better isolate components from one another, possibly improving the sound a bit.


One other idea is to upgrade the HT1210 the LCR is plugged into, perhaps to a PF-i (the PF has a 45A current reserve; PPPs offer 50A, no big deal in my system anyway) versus the HT1210's 12A, then a modest upgrade to the AC cords for the 501s and the Furman.


I'll figure something out, I imagine.


----------



## KahunaCanuck

I don't mean to be your crack dealer, but once you taste a PPP in your system, there ain't no goin back.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* /forum/post/19634100
> 
> 
> I don't mean to be your crack dealer, but once you taste a PPP in your system, there ain't no goin back.



The other factor here is that I have plans to be away for Christmas, so ordering _anything_ is tricky. It's unclear whether I could get a delivery before the 21st (when I'm scheduled to leave). And economics play a role, as this is Christmas season, who knows what will have happened by the time I get back from travel. I may want to engage a trainer to help me with my workouts (need to decide soon, as rates go up 1/1). Let's not forget power cords as well. The more I spend on equipment, the further down the food chain they'll be.


Economics and practicality have to come first, I think. I also thought of replacing my TV stand next year, but the Salamander Triple 30 is too wide for the space I have. Realizing that technically I don't need ANY of what I'm considering, I'll go from there as a starting point.


----------



## prepress

On the other hand, I'm considering this Panamax M5400-PM in light of the PPP situation (Cable Company is sold out) and a bit of a desire to upgrade my voltage regulation.




















It has 5 zones and 11 outlets (I'd rather have more, but oh well). I could eventually team it up with the Furman PF-i with its 45A current reserve (which the system doesn't seem to need, frankly) if I wanted to redo everything. For now I'd keep the Tripplite HT1210 in play because I really like knowing how much power the system pulls...


----------



## hometheatergeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19660614
> 
> 
> On the other hand, I'm considering this Panamax M5400-PM in light of the PPP situation (Cable Company is sold out) and a bit of a desire to upgrade my voltage regulation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It has 5 zones and 11 outlets (I'd rather have more, but oh well). I could eventually team it up with the Furman PF-i with its 45A current reserve (which the system doesn't seem to need, frankly) if I wanted to redo everything. For now I'd keep the Tripplite HT1210 in play because I really like knowing how much power the system pulls...



I would wait on the PPP. The Panamax is a good unit but not as robust as the PPP.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/19660838
> 
> 
> I would wait on the PPP. The Panamax is a good unit but not as robust as the PPP.



Probably true, HTG. The PPP does more than regulate power, it regenerates it. There are reasons I look at alternatives, however. One is that the PPP is being discontinued, which is why you see the discounted price all around. With the CC store credit, it would've been an easier purchase to justify; without, it's tough considering the other stuff I have to deal with now and near-future.


The other thing is that power protection is my main consideration rather than sound, and the Panamax does things my LCR2400 doesn't, though as with the PPP more outlets would be helpful. So it's still an upgrade.


It comes down to money and practical considerations. I will be away for about a week beginning Tuesday and will see what the landscape is like when I return. Christmas will be over, I'll have a better view of my funds (or lack thereof), and can see what's what.


----------



## hometheatergeek











PREPRESS


----------



## prepress

Thank you, HTG. I just got back from Nashville about 25–30 minutes ago and will catch up on posts perhaps tomorrow. My head is wasted from the flight (the whole motion sickness/inner ear balance problem) and I can't really focus right now. I do hope that your Christmas was a good one, though.


----------



## prepress

I have given in, and ordered one.











It should get here about Tuesday I was told. Now, having bought this I can't afford any more than entry-level cables, and after-market cord is probably necessary depending upon final system configuration. So it's either PS Audio Jewel AC or Wireworld Stratus, I guess. I have only $500 to work with now.


----------



## KahunaCanuck

Congrats pre!


Trust me, PPPs rock! You will notice a huge difference!


This is a crappy shot, but here are my twins:










Happy New Year!


----------



## Waboman

Happy holdiays, prepress.


I did not know you purchased a PPP. Very cool. Welcome to the club.


Since we're posting pics of our twins, here's mine.










Enjoy the last day of 2010.










Cheers.


----------



## Franin

Happy new year prepress best wishes for 2011


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* 
Congrats pre!


Trust me, PPPs rock! You will notice a huge difference!


This is a crappy shot, but here are my twins:


Happy New Year!
What's that white block the right one is sitting on?


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Franin* 
Happy new year prepress best wishes for 2011
Same to you Franin, and to everyone.


Unlike the major systems you all have, mine will be running on one PPP. Because of the low system draw I can get away with this. But the lack of a convenience outlet on the PPP means having to make yet another change, unfortunately, as I need that feature. So I still look at a Furman to sit in the rack with it. And I'm fast approaching the point where I really have to watch the spending.


----------



## prepress

Okay, this is on the way as well.











It should arrive around Wednesday next week. Money is now officially tight, so I should use stock cords temporarily. Those WW Stratus are looking good right about now, plus I prefer the jacket color. I know, Auroras are supposedly better, but I have only a $498 credit to use at the store. Still thinking.


----------



## KahunaCanuck




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19738248
> 
> 
> What's that white block the right one is sitting on?



It's a 2x4 leftover piece of wood to raise the PPP up, my BDI rack has a ridge at the back that makes the big cords hard to connect. I have that door closed all the time so you can't see it...a little "ghetto" I know!


What's a convenience outlet? Switched?


----------



## KahunaCanuck




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19738146
> 
> 
> Happy holdiays, prepress.
> 
> 
> I did not know you purchased a PPP. Very cool. Welcome to the club.
> 
> 
> Since we're posting pics of our twins, here's mine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enjoy the last day of 2010.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers.



Those twins are sure pretty...what is it with us guys, twin PPPs, twin 501s, it's like we have been trained to like sets of twos...hmmmm


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *KahunaCanuck* /forum/post/19740158
> 
> 
> It's a 2x4 leftover piece of wood to raise the PPP up, my BDI rack has a ridge at the back that makes the big cords hard to connect. I have that door closed all the time so you can't see it...a little "ghetto" I know!
> 
> 
> What's a convenience outlet? Switched?



It's the outlet on the front of the unit; "convenience" outlets are what they're sometimes called. Very handy for quick connections. I need it and the PPP doesn't have one.


By the way, the power cord issue is resolved as well. I just used up my Cable Company credit with a bit over. There are 2 WW Aurora 5.2s and 2 Stratus 5.2s on the way. The Auroras will connect the 501s to the PPP, and the Strats will connect the PPP to the 15PFi and the 15PFi to the wall.


And with this, no more upgrades; only replacements should something break. That's the plan. If I hear a big difference with the WWs, I may consider something for the source components down the road (C7 as well as IEC connections where possible) but not now. I and my wallet will need to recover a bit. Of course, my original thought was to try and get a Salamander Synergy Triple 30, but they don't make them in the width I need.


----------



## ohyeah32

It's nearly New Years Eve over where you're at, and soon after it'll officially be 2011. Have yourself a Happy New Year!












Seth


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ohyeah32* /forum/post/19740607
> 
> 
> It's nearly New Years Eve over where you're at, and soon after it'll officially be 2011. Have yourself a Happy New Year!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seth



A quiet one, I hope. I have a headache, which is going to be followed by peppermint tea, a shower, and bed.


----------



## Waboman

Happy New Year, prepress. Here's to a great 2011.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19742994
> 
> 
> Happy New Year, prepress. Here's to a great 2011.



Same to you and everyone.


Man, those WW Auroras are ugly







. They'd better make some kind of difference, because they'll shoot down the color coordination I prefer in my setup.


----------



## prepress












It's here. I'll let everyone figure out what it is. Waiting on power cords rather than use extension cords with it for now.


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/19762874
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's here. I'll let everyone figure out what it is. Waiting on power cords rather than use extension cords with it for now.



Hey prepress. Just to let you know, I get no picture.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/19763178
> 
> 
> Hey prepress. Just to let you know, I get no picture.



Okay, I think I fixed it.


----------



## prepress

Okay, FedEx has struck twice this week, the second time mere minutes ago. . .











Now, I'm waiting for power cords to connect these two.


----------



## prepress

Box number three is here. . .











Now, I can start to put things together. Or, wait until next weekend, when I could have some help (not that I need it, but it would be fun to have the company). I plan to post a picture or two when things are set up fully.


----------



## KahunaCanuck

Woohoo!


Power in the Prepress house! Enjoy your PPP!!


----------



## Waboman

Holy moly, prepress. You're keeping the UPS man busy.










Welcome to the triple P club.


----------



## prepress

Actually, the PPP and Furman were FedEx







. But UPS got into the act on box #3.


I have a potential setback here. My shoulder, which has been bothering me, is really bothering me today. Limited range of motion and pain with almost every move (and even some when I don't move) will make it difficult to get things happening. But I intend to try anyway. It will be difficult to even straighten up with only one arm functioning. I went to the doctor, who suspects a rotator cuff problem and wants me to have a few weeks of PT, then an MRI if that doesn't work. But I saw him Monday; it's Saturday and the shoulder's much worse. I intend to argue for the MRI first if the shoulder doesn't calm down by Monday or Tuesday.


However, after a snack, it's time to do some unboxing.


----------



## prepress

I've just made the attempt to connect my PPP, and I get no power, only a single blue light. I've tried into the wall and through two different conditioners, but no go. The PS Audio logo (the power switch) doesn't do the trick; it doesn't light up, in fact. The unit doesn't respond to the remote. The rear switches are set to "always on." Am I missing something or do I perhaps have a lemon?


If anyone has ideas, it would be appreciated.


----------



## prepress

Well, I have a UPS pickup scheduled for Monday for the DOA Power Plant. More, this isn't an exchange; I'm returning it for credit.


The day after I'd ordered the PPP I had a bit of buyer's remorse, but nothing too serious (i.e., big knot in the stomach). But I had time to think, and when it arrived dead that helped convince me to return it and stick with what I've got for now. So I'm running my Tripplite LCR2400 through the Furman (that I'm keeping). At some point I may look into replacing the LCR, but not now; I don't need to get back on the upgrade horse. And I realize the influence of magazines and (especially) forums, as I got caught up in the upgrade bug, what with the PPP being on sale and everyone raving about it.


If I were to replace my LCR, at this point there are only 3 options: a Furman SPR-20i (I'd need a 20A-15A adapter for that) or Panamax's M5400-PM or Max-7500. All 3 regulate voltage and offer more functions than my LCR, though the SPR lacks the convenience outlet I want. But as a practical matter, I'm only 10 years or so from retiring (God willing), and need to take a careful look at large discretionary purchases like this. So taking the more reasoned approach (not nessarily an audiophile one), I think I will stand pat and try enjoying the music for a while.


I may decide to replace some more power cords on the front-end equipment, getting shorter ones to mitigate the bird's nest behind my right rack in particular. That wouldn't cost too much, and I could do it soon.


----------



## prepress

I have made some small progress with my living room. Here's a photo taken today. The room looks more open, even with the remaining clutter.











The Mac 501 boxes have been put away and the B&Ks have been placed in their boxes; that's them on the floor around the coffee table. I now have my coffee table back







and don't have to contend with boxes blocking sound from the speakers. Or feeling closed in. The 501 boxes are easily 2x the size of the B&K boxes.


I am using the Furman Elite-15PF1 to support my Tripplite LCR2400, and am pleased. But the LCR now looks rather inelegant with its rack-mount faceplate. I may yet replace it with something else, perhaps a Furman SPR-20i. I missed a chance to get one at a significant discount, but may still do it later using my AMEX rewards points to bring the cost down; I don't do it now because I used half of them up on Amazon, and the remaining points would be good for only $275 off. The Panamax MAX 7500 is a little busy to my eyes, and it's more money than the Furman. Of course, a purchase like this isn't truly necessary, so I can take my time and consider carefully.


----------



## prepress

Coming into the home stretch. The Furman is great, but using its coax protection means the dreaded 60Hz hum is back. Using a Mondial Magic Brick kills the hum, but in combination with the Furman takes out more channels than the Tripplite HT1210.


So...











Anybody ever use one of these?


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles, what is up my man!!


Long time no talk. I too am curious as to how well the isolator above works. Hum is a terrible thing in a system. Do you get it all the time or just when the cable box is on?


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *ddgtr* 
Hey Charles, what is up my man!!


Long time no talk. I too am curious as to how well the isolator above works. Hum is a terrible thing in a system. Do you get it all the time or just when the cable box is on?
Hello there, dd.


I get hum anytime the stereo is on unless the Mondial is in place; as long as the coax feed is connected, there's hum. It's worse with the Furman than with the Tripplite HT1210. I plan to connect the Jensen later today, and will report on how it does. It's designed specifically for this 60Hz hum issue with CATV/cable systems; it doesn't work for satellite. If you're curious, I attached a product PDF.


And, I've decided to go for the Furman SPR-20i mentioned previously, unless something unforseen prevents it. I'm waiting for the closing date on my Optima to pass first. That way, I have two moths to pay for it







.

 

vrd1ff.pdf 293.73046875k . file


----------



## prepress

Okay, I connected the Jensen and no hum! Unfortunately, the Jensen/Furman combination loses channels, a large number, though only one is HD (MSG).


So with just the Jensen, I still don't get MSGHD. The cable guy is coming today. We'll see what happens.


----------



## prepress

Okay. The next piece has been ordered, the Furman SPR-20i:




















It's a voltage regulator meant to replace my faithful Tripplite LCR2400, which I'm planning to repurpose. The SPR offers more features, and that's good if the other conditioner in my setup fails or goes weird on me. I do now have a system reconfiguration facing me, because the cord (it comes with two, which is cool; one each with a 15A and 20A wall plug) is only 7 feet long, not long enough to reach the wall. The LCR has a 12ft cord, not long enough either, but with my Shunyata Venom extension, is more than long enough. I'm not sure about chaining a second Venom to get the SPR to the wall plug.


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles, this is cool! Do you think it'll help with the hum? Also, what did the cable guy say?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20038799
> 
> 
> Hey Charles, this is cool! Do you think it'll help with the hum? Also, what did the cable guy say?



Hey ddgtr,


As for the missing channel(s), I had to disconnect the Jensen and go coax direct into the box. The cable guy went to the main junction and found I was on a splitter (which I didn't know). Fixing that should improve signal strength. The Time Warner rep I was working with over the phone has asked me to monitor things using NO filters and report back to her. I don't know if the cable guy checked the grounding, but 60Hz hum can be a result of improper grounding.


As for picture artifacts and such, I've seen those, and yesterday two channels disappeared for a while (likely an issue on TW's end). But I'm not going to disconnect the coax cable every time I want to play music, so the filter's going back on. I'll deal with the missing channel if need be, but the current situation doesn't work for me long-term. There are some other things I can try first, though. The story continues.


----------



## ddgtr

Charles, is the Furman in yet??


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20060160
> 
> 
> Charles, is the Furman in yet??



No, unfortunately. It's being drop-shipped directly from Furman, and I hope it will be here next week. I'm to be notified when it's on the way by the vendor. A 10% discount takes a bit of the sting out of waiting, though.


----------



## prepress

ddgtr,


Looking at your photos over in your thread again, it causes me to think that perhaps it isn't all that important to have a TV stand that's of comparable width to the TV. It certainly doesn't hurt your setup. I thought having a stand the same width as the set (or close) gave a more solid look to my setup, and it does. But I'm wondering now about returning my trusty Sanus Euro to the job or going all out on a Billy Bags rack (a lot more money). My side racks are tall, and the thought was the gap between would look too awkward. The Sanus is 40"; BB racks are customizable. I think I could get away with the Sanus if I shorten the side racks by a shelf. I'm trying to visualize, but perhaps a diagram or scale drawing will help.


If I make this move it'd be in summer. Currently BB is behind on orders, so it's reasonable to consider this could take a while.


----------



## ddgtr

Mornin' Charles,


I understand.


In my case, I just wanted something that would allow me to do play around with the components' location. I took into consideration the fact that I will do tube swapping in my preamp, try out and compare different components and so on. I am starting to have a better idea of what the final look would be, probably a custom made Ikea-style simple design that would be a bit wider than the tv to give it that solid look you were mentioning.


----------



## prepress

Yes, reconfiguring systems can be challenging. The flexibility is a plus for you, since your final combination isn't set yet.


Another thought is, in my case, it means i can do more experimenting with interconnects, namely the AQ King Cobra I have going from preamp to power amp versus the Tara Labs Quantum 4 (from way back in the early '90s) I was happy with before. The Hooker cabinet is a nice piece of furniture, but isn't friendly to the type of equipment I have. And depending upon the way I reconfig, it would mean new power cords.


Knowing me, I'll end up getting the more expensive option (Billy Bags) if I do this, but I'd like the flexibility to move things around or just swap interconnects easily, and either option will do that. But which will look and be best in the long run? That's the question.


----------



## BrolicBeast

I just went through all five pages of this thread, and I have to say--this journey of yours is quite interesting. I will be staying tuned. I just ended difficult decision between getting a PS Audio AV5000 or adding a second Panamax M5300--I ended up getting both, and deciding to downgrade a power cable order from some foolishly priced Pangea Power Cable to the PS Audio AC5 to even out the cost......so here I'm going through these posts, and i see it's really stiff. I'm hoping it's not too stiff for my set up. I'd hate to have to return it.


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* 
I just went through all five pages of this thread, and I have to say--this journey of yours is quite interesting. I will be staying tuned. I just ended difficult decision between getting a PS Audio AV5000 or adding a second Panamax M5300--I ended up getting both, and deciding to downgrade a power cable order from some foolishly priced Pangea Power Cable to the PS Audio AC5 to even out the cost......so here I'm going through these posts, and i see it's really stiff. I'm hoping it's not too stiff for my set up. I'd hate to have to return it.








Hello BrolicBeast,


I've seen the Pangea cords at quite reduced prices from Audio Advisor. Where did you get yours? The PS Audio cords were too stiff for me, but that may have been exacerbated by my setup, as one amp is on the shelf directly below my voltage regulator. I got it connected, of course, but it was too awkward for my comfort level. Sound-wise, there seemed to be a bit more bass, though that wasn't confirmed with having the cords in place long enough to verify that as a consistent feature. I like the look and construction, though, and they should be less stiff than the Pangea (if you mean the AC-9, which is 7AWG, versus the PSA AC-5's 10AWG). The only problem I have with the Wirewrold Aurora 5.2 I use now is the jacket color. Magenta doesn't match anything in my setup (or the room, for that matter).


By the way, I just took a quick look at your setup and was impressed by how clean it is. It's a nice setup, and the kind that makes me wish I had a house, rather than a 1BR apartment, which I've probably crammed too much stuff into.


----------



## BrolicBeast

Quote:

Originally Posted by *prepress* 
Hello BrolicBeast,


I've seen the Pangea cords at quite reduced prices from Audio Advisor. Where did you get yours? The PS Audio cords were too stiff for me, but that may have been exacerbated by my setup, as one amp is on the shelf directly below my voltage regulator. I got it connected, of course, but it was too awkward for my comfort level. Sound-wise, there seemed to be a bit more bass, though that wasn't confirmed with having the cords in place long enough to verify that as a consistent feature. I like the look and construction, though, and they should be less stiff than the Pangea (if you mean the AC-9, which is 7AWG, versus the PSA AC-5's 10AWG). The only problem I have with the Wirewrold Aurora 5.2 I use now is the jacket color. Magenta doesn't match anything in my setup (or the room, for that matter).


By the way, I just took a quick look at your setup and was impressed by how clean it is. It's a nice setup, and the kind that makes me wish I had a house, rather than a 1BR apartment, which I've probably crammed too much stuff into.
Greetings, I just checked Audio Advisor and it wasn't a Pangea Audio Cord that had been in my cart...it was another PS Audio Cord called the AC-12. (I don't know how I got the names confused--maybe it was the "P" and "Audio" in both the names. Two weeks ago, I was a guy who did not believe that Power Cords could make a difference...I'm still on the fence, as I only took the plunge on an aftermarket Power Cord because it's tax return season and I wanted to see if the hype was real. It should arrive next week, so I suppose i'll find out then.


All this gear is in a one-br apartment???? my gosh--that's great!!! Back when I was doing the apt thing, my entire apartment could have fit in your living room!! lol...*sigh* college memories come to mind--primarily of being a broke college student studying on the floor! lol. If the AC5 is too stiff (or If I can't discern a difference), I may just stick with the stock Emotiva cord and call it a day. The amp already sounds phenomenal.


----------



## prepress

The PowerWave AC-12 is PSA's top-of-the-line power cord at 8AWG. Bound to be stiff. In terms of flexibility, I'm told that the Kimber PK10 (which I'm interested in) is even more flexible than Wireworld, which is more flexible than the PS Audio AC-5. What amazes me about this is that the Kimber is heavier gauge (10AWG) than the Wireworld (12AWG). It has to do with stranding and construction.


When I think of power cords, my thinking has been the heavier gauge is good for power transfer which _could_ open up the sound a bit. Better power transfer can affect dynamics, as the amp has more available to work with. Yet, professional reviewers do cite differences in sound, sometimes with dramatic language. There was a recent survey in TAS (the December 2010 issue) on 13 power cords, with a description of how each affected the sound compared to a very expensive reference. It was interesting. I'm a _cautious_ believer on this subject.


And yes, a 1BR, with a 14 x 18.5' living room. Ceiling is about 11'. IF I can ever get out from under the paper in here, it'll look better. An atomic shredder would help, over the one I have now.


----------



## ddgtr

Power cords and sound differences are a touchy subject...







Just to make sure my amp is getting proper juice I added, as you know, the Shunyata cord.


What puzzles me a bit is say if the power is distributed to the rooms by whatever gauge wires meet minimum local building code requirements (and you KNOW the builder used the absolute minimum gauge required) then how is a much heavier gauge going from the plug to the amp going to make that better!?


Also, I would love to compare the Shunyata to the stock cord, but by the time I swap them I forget the sound signature (if any) of each. A switch based system is out of question for obvious reasons and the other alternative is too expensive which would be to have two identical systems side by side.


That said, better to have heavier gauge than not! Looks cooler, too!!


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *ddgtr* 
Power cords and sound differences are a touchy subject...







Just to make sure my amp is getting proper juice I added, as you know, the Shunyata cord.


What puzzles me a bit is say if the power is distributed to the rooms by whatever gauge wires meet minimum local building code requirements (and you KNOW the builder used the absolute minimum gauge required) then how is a much heavier gauge going from the plug to the amp going to make that better!?


Also, I would love to compare the Shunyata to the stock cord, but by the time I swap them I forget the sound signature (if any) of each. A switch based system is out of question for obvious reasons and the other alternative is too expensive which would be to have two identical systems side by side.


That said, better to have heavier gauge than not! Looks cooler, too!!








As long as it's not too stiff!


One point some make is that, from the component's perspective, the power cord is the _first_ few feet of the chain. And I'd guess the heavier gauge does allow current to flow more freely. How much of a difference in sound that makes is another story, but plenty of people hear a difference. I didn't get my WW cords expecting to hear one, certainly.


According to that same TAS article I mentioned earlier, the point was made (if I recall correctly) that any differences tend to be subtle usually, and unless one's system has enough resolving power, they may not be heard. As I say, I'm a cautious believer. Not totally sold, but not a true skeptic either.


Now, I'm waiting to find out when my new Furman will ship.


----------



## prepress

I am pleased to report I got word today that the Furman SPR-20i has shipped (yesterday). I have a tracking number and can follow its exploits on its way to my place. A system reconfig is definitely in my future.


----------



## prepress

Okay, the other Furman has arrived:











It came while I was at work. I'll plan to post a picture or two once it's out of the box and in place. With this, my planned gear purchases are over. I said "planned" because you never know. And I don't count a possible change in my A/V stand this summer as gear, really. My plan is that there won't be any more gear purchases anytime soon unless something _needs_ to be replaced.


But then, I said that years ago and look at what happened in the last 2 years plus. . .


----------



## prepress

A TW Cable foreman was just here and we spent about an hour dealing with my infamous 60Hz hum issue, which manifested again recently (or at least I noticed it recently). I wouldn't want to use them regularly, but I'd like to thank the cheater plug society for lending themselves to the project







.


The problem apparently has been traced to my Duo video processor. Putting cheaters on my MC501s didn't solve it, nor did putting the cable box directly into the TV. But a cheater plug on the Duo (despite the fact it's already a 2-prong plug, though it has the one larger prong) did the trick. So after I shower, have lunch and clean up the place I'll get down to installing the new Furman, and while I'm at it put everything back as it was except for the cheater on the Duo and see what happens.


And yes, I'll plan to post a pic of the system reconfig at some point soon.


----------



## ddgtr

Charles, congrats on the Furman! Hopefully it's going to set things straight in terms of g.loops.


Let me tell you a bit of my experience, because it "might" not be your Duo! When I was troubleshooting my g.loop, a quick remedy that solved it was a cheater plug on my preamp. Well, the hum was gone, but as I was trying unplugging each cable one by one to make sure the preamp was indeed the culprit, it turned out that as ONLY the amp and the sub were left connected, the exact same hum came back!! !$$#@


In the end it was the sub, although a cheater plug on the preamp solved it. Go figure.


Good luck with it, and I'm looking forward to the pics.


----------



## prepress

Yes, there will be all kinds of ways to experiment, because both Furmans will be in the rack. I'm looking forward to the challenge. But cleaning up is more important because I have company tomorrow, so the reconfig comes second to that. But if I can do it today, I will!


----------



## prepress

Everything's back the way it was except for the cheater plug on my Duo. The 60Hz hum is back, though not quite as bad as initially. That means I'll have to lift the ground on the amps again or put the Jensen Iso-Max back on the coax line (and give up a couple of cable channels).


My options are cheater plugs or buying new power cords, namely PS Audios, since they have the removable ground pin. One thing leads to another







.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20087270
> 
> 
> I am pleased to report I got word today that the Furman SPR-20i has shipped (yesterday). I have a tracking number and can follow its exploits on its way to my place. A system reconfig is definitely in my future.



I'm returning the PS Audio AC5000 on Monday to pick the SPR-20i. Turns out, the Ac5000's peak load is 15 amps. I'm going to need a conditioner that can handle 20Amps once I go the five-monoblock route. How is this performing for you thus far? I know it's difficult to quantify power-conditioner performance, but any improved sound quality from your gear?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* /forum/post/20108864
> 
> 
> I'm returning the PS Audio AC5000 on Monday to pick the SPR-20i. Turns out, the Ac5000's peak load is 15 amps. I'm going to need a conditioner that can handle 20Amps once I go the five-monoblock route. How is this performing for you thus far? I know it's difficult to quantify power-conditioner performance, but any improved sound quality from your gear?



Hello there,


The Furman SPR-20i has some neat features, one of which is that it comes with two power cords, one with a 20A wall plug and another with a 15A wall plug. And I can get a visual on power consumption or line voltage. The one negative so far is that you can't dim the display, which is a bit bright.


As for performance, the SPR got its first real use last night when I had a friend over (along with her Air Force-bound daughter) and we went through about 2-1/2 hours of DVD/BD concert exerpts. Things sounded quite good, certainly not worse than with the Tripplite LCR2400 the Furman replaced. I've never heard my system directly from the wall so I can't comment there. A real test may be once I get to playing other sources to see if there's a discernible difference. I'd need to pull out my usual go-to stuff and play it for a better answer to your question; I'm so familiar with those pieces that I'd be more likely to hear anything different going on with them first. My main reasons for getting the SPR are practical rather than sonic: it's more versatile than the Tripplite, offers features similar to the Furman Elite-15PFi it's chained to, and the rack looks more dangerous with it (don't laugh). Whether it sounds better will perhaps depend upon listening over time, maybe a couple of weeks.


If you don't _need_ voltage regulation, there's the Furman Elite-20PFi for less money and with a 55A current reserve for power-hungry amps. But I remain pleased wth the SPR purchase. More as it develops.


----------



## prepress

As promised, here are photos of the new Furman in the rack. I moved the Elite-15PFi to the same rack as well. Sorry for the dust, but the room is still in transition plus it's an old building so it gathers dust quickly.




















Still need to do something with the previous amps. I'm thinking donate them to Goodwill or the Salvation Army.


----------



## hometheatergeek

Looks like you did a nice job of setting everything up. It is always a good thing to have clean power. Hope you will enjoy the new sound.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20112298
> 
> 
> Hello there,
> 
> 
> The Furman SPR-20i has some neat features, one of which is that it comes with two power cords, one with a 20A wall plug and another with a 15A wall plug. And I can get a visual on power consumption or line voltage. The one negative so far is that you can't dim the display, which is a bit bright.
> 
> 
> As for performance, the SPR got its first real use last night when I had a friend over (along with her Air Force-bound daughter) and we went through about 2-1/2 hours of DVD/BD concert exerpts. Things sounded quite good, certainly not worse than with the Tripplite LCR2400 the Furman replaced. I've never heard my system directly from the wall so I can't comment there. A real test may be once I get to playing other sources to see if there's a discernible difference. I'd need to pull out my usual go-to stuff and play it for a better answer to your question; I'm so familiar with those pieces that I'd be more likely to hear anything different going on with them first. My main reasons for getting the SPR are practical rather than sonic: it's more versatile than the Tripplite, offers features similar to the Furman Elite-15PFi it's chained to, and the rack looks more dangerous with it (don't laugh). Whether it sounds better will perhaps depend upon listening over time, maybe a couple of weeks.
> 
> 
> If you don't _need_ voltage regulation, there's the Furman Elite-20PFi for less money and with a 55A current reserve for power-hungry amps. But I remain pleased wth the SPR purchase. More as it develops.



Thanks for the breakdown man!!! Wow, that Furman certainly looks dangerous!!! That, plus the McIntosh gear right below--I had to take my hand off the mouse to make sure they didn't slice me through the computer. lol. I'll probably have to go with the SPR. Better to buy once, eh? (If such a thing as 'buy once' exists in the realm of home audio. lol)


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* 
Looks like you did a nice job of setting everything up. It is always a good thing to have clean power. Hope you will enjoy the new sound.








Al,


Yes, I want to think I'm good for a while equipment-wise, and I'd like to settle in and listen to music/watch DVDs. But as we know, one thing leads to another, and I'd still like to change out my Hooker console for something more equipment-friendly, though I don't feel any urgency on that.


The only real challenge now is what to do about the ground loop issue mentioned earlier. For now, I put the Iso-Max back on the coax line. And I'm not pleased with the cable mess behind the rack. But fixing that ties in to whether I get a new rack, because it means another reconfig, and I want power cords to be the right length for that. As is, I'd have to buy new ones if I relocate the SPR.


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* 
Thanks for the breakdown man!!! Wow, that Furman certainly looks dangerous!!! That, plus the McIntosh gear right below--I had to take my hand off the mouse to make sure they didn't slice me through the computer. lol. I'll probably have to go with the SPR. *Better to buy once, eh?* (If such a thing as 'buy once' exists in the realm of home audio. lol)
If I'd thought about it more and not been in a hurry (because I wanted my new TV to be delivered!), I wouldn't be in this place now. I resisted racks like Billy Bags because I thought they were too much money, plus the Hooker looked good. But here I am thinking of getting a BB rack, which renders the Hooker a waste of money if I do.


----------



## BrolicBeast

Quote:

Originally Posted by *prepress* 
If I'd thought about it more and not been in a hurry (because I wanted my new TV to be delivered!), I wouldn't be in this place now. I resisted racks like Billy Bags because I thought they were too much money, plus the Hooker looked good. But here I am thinking of getting a BB rack, which renders the Hooker a waste of money if I do.
Billy Baggs are so expensive for what they are. If you're going to spend that much, have you taken a look at the Salamander Chameleon line? Check it out here: Chameleon Awesomeness for Prepress!! They come fully assembled, and that dark glass adds a classy touch. They also have rack-mount versions, if you still have the rack-mounting hardware for your gear (although it does come with some if you go the rack-mount versions v. the shelved version).


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* 
Billy Baggs are so expensive for what they are. If you're going to spend that much, have you taken a look at the Salamander Chameleon line? Check it out here: Chameleon Awesomeness for Prepress!! They come fully assembled, and that dark glass adds a classy touch. They also have rack-mount versions, if you still have the rack-mounting hardware for your gear (although it does come with some if you go the rack-mount versions v. the shelved version).
They look sturdier than the Synergy series, which I like. The Chameleons look good, too. The main problem is that, I am pretty much limited to 60" as a maximum width for any cabinet I get. But I keep them under my hat just in case.


As for Billy Bags, they have some models which could be customized to fit the bill for me. I haven't heard back from them on what my modifications would cost, though. I think I'll follow up again.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20118974
> 
> 
> They look sturdier than the Synergy series, which I like. The Chameleons look good, too. The main problem is that, I am pretty much limited to 60" as a maximum width for any cabinet I get. But I keep them under my hat just in case.
> 
> 
> As for Billy Bags, they have some models which could be customized to fit the bill for me. I haven't heard back from them on what my modifications would cost, though. I think I'll follow up again.



True indeed--the BB's look like they could support a small skyscraper. lol. I didn't know they had customizable models though. Custom configuration>fixed configuration any day.


----------



## ddgtr

Congrats Charles, that rack is looking better and better!!!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* /forum/post/20120554
> 
> 
> True indeed--the BB's look like they could support a small skyscraper. lol. I didn't know they had customizable models though. Custom configuration>fixed configuration any day.



They will even build a rack to customer specs. And they do bear reasonable resemblance to the Sanus Euros I have already. If Sanus made a Euro wider than 40" at the same height as my current one this would be moot, as I'd have gotten that and case closed. The EFAV which is now off to the side holding computer-related stuff used to be my center stand.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20120628
> 
> 
> Congrats Charles, that rack is looking better and better!!!



Thanks. If I could tame the dust better, life here would be very good







.


----------



## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20118974
> 
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> As for Billy Bags, they have some models which could be customized to fit the bill for me. I haven't heard back from them on what my modifications would cost, though. I think I'll follow up again.




Charles, just a thought: you could probably have a custom one made locally for quite a bit less. Powder coated any color you want, and get top made, either granite, glass, quartz (lighter than granite) or wood. It looks like a good welder could make them without problems.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20121805
> 
> 
> Charles, just a thought: you could probably have a custom one made locally for quite a bit less. Powder coated any color you want, and get top made, either granite, glass, quartz (lighter than granite) or wood. It looks like a good welder could make them without problems.



This is not something I'd thought about. An interesting idea, one I should perhaps consider. And a bit of research certainly won't hurt in any case. Thanks.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* /forum/post/20113705
> 
> 
> Thanks for the breakdown man!!! Wow, that Furman certainly looks dangerous!!! That, plus the McIntosh gear right below--I had to take my hand off the mouse to make sure they didn't slice me through the computer. lol. I'll probably have to go with the SPR. Better to buy once, eh? (If such a thing as 'buy once' exists in the realm of home audio. lol)



I've been listening to music a bit more recently, and I won't swear to it, but it seems the noise floor is ever so slightly lower with the Furman compared to the Tripplite. I was more aware of decay and "afternotes" with the material I was playing, some solo guitar (Sharon Isbin). It seemed a bit more "in the room," as it were. I'm not talking huge differences, and it may be that I hadn't given music this kind of attention recently, but this is my impression. I'll play that again and turn it up a bit to see if the impressions hold. Either way, the SPR is a good unit. One you'll need, if you're going after those XPA-1s mentioned in your thread.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20101754
> 
> 
> Charles, congrats on the Furman! Hopefully it's going to set things straight in terms of g.loops.
> 
> 
> Let me tell you a bit of my experience, because it "might" not be your Duo! When I was troubleshooting my g.loop, a quick remedy that solved it was a cheater plug on my preamp. Well, the hum was gone, but as I was trying unplugging each cable one by one to make sure the preamp was indeed the culprit, it turned out that as ONLY the amp and the sub were left connected, the exact same hum came back!! !$$#@
> 
> 
> In the end it was the sub, although a cheater plug on the preamp solved it. Go figure.
> 
> 
> Good luck with it, and I'm looking forward to the pics.



That could make sense, as everything is connected to the preamp in some way.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20136551
> 
> 
> I've been listening to music a bit more recently, and I won't swear to it, but it seems the noise floor is ever so slightly lower with the Furman compared to the Tripplite. I was more aware of decay and "afternotes" with the material I was playing, some solo guitar (Sharon Isbin). It seemed a bit more "in the room," as it were. I'm not talking huge differences, and it may be that I hadn't given music this kind of attention recently, but this is my impression. I'll play that again and turn it up a bit to see if the impressions hold. Either way, the SPR is a good unit. One you'll need, if you're going after those XPA-1s mentioned in your thread.



Yeah, the notion I'm getting from these power-related upgrades is that, as far as their effect on sound goes, there is no one product that does _much_ to improve on the sound on it's own; the improvements are small in scale, but when used together, the incremental improvements tend to add up for an overall improvement that's noticable.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* /forum/post/20193209
> 
> 
> Yeah, the notion I'm getting from these power-related upgrades is that, as far as their effect on sound goes, there is no one product that does _much_ to improve on the sound on it's own; the improvements are small in scale, but when used together, the incremental improvements tend to add up for an overall improvement that's noticable.



I will now confirm my assessment that the SPR has lowered the noise floor a bit. It doesn't make highs higher or lows lower, but like any good power unit it will filter and regulate the power, and lower the noise floor, which means you can hear more of what's going on in your recordings.


It's also quieter than my Tripplite (which has now found a home with a friend). I put my ear near it and hear nothing.


----------



## prepress

Well, the ground loop situation has been resolved albeit in a stop-gap kind of way. I have cheater plugs on my Duo VP and on my Macs. That's gotten rid of it completely. Even the Jensen on the coax line didn't get rid of it alone; if I put my ear to the speakers it was still there.


So now, if I move ahead with replacing my A/V console and go for a Billy Bags stand as I was thinking, it would mean new power cords because of my planned reconfiguration. The WW Auroras are working fine, but as I said before I'm not crazy about the magenta jacket color. I'm very interested in the Kimber PK10s, and would even reconsider PS Audio cords because with them I wouldn't need the cheater plugs (I could just disconnect the ground pins). The Kimbers are quite flexible, the PSAs aren't. I could try a cheater plug on the preamp (which got rid of much of the problem back when my system was simpler) too.


I'll report on what I do about this, but it's not planned until July.


----------



## prepress

Unfortunately, it's time to send my OPPO BDP-83 off for repair. For 3 months now, it has been misbehaving. After turning on the player, I hit OPEN/CLOSE and the player begins to load a disc instead of the tray opening! On the third try the tray opens as it should; I put my disc in and from there the 83 performs properly. It doesn't matter whether it's via remote or manually, I get the same result. Now, if I start with OPEN/CLOSE rather than the power button the tray comes out right away as the unit powers up. Neither rebooting (unplugging then plugging back in) nor a firmware update solved the problem, as the 83 behaved the first time afterward, then went back to its wayward ways. I have my RMA number and plan to get the 83 off this week.


So if I want to watch DVDs or BDs I have my 09, connected to the main system, and my Marantz DV8400 is still connected, though not to the system; it plays through the TV. I will lose some convenience but I'm not destitute. Oh well.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20323462
> 
> 
> Unfortunately, it's time to send my OPPO BDP-83 off for repair. For 3 months now, it has been misbehaving. After turning on the player, I hit OPEN/CLOSE and the player begins to load a disc instead of the tray opening! On the third try the tray opens as it should; I put my disc in and from there the 83 performs properly. It doesn't matter whether it's via remote or manually, I get the same result. Now, if I start with OPEN/CLOSE rather than the power button the tray comes out right away as the unit powers up. Neither rebooting (unplugging then plugging back in) nor a firmware update solved the problem, as the 83 behaved the first time afterward, then went back to its wayward ways. I have my RMA number and plan to get the 83 off this week.
> 
> 
> So if I want to watch DVDs or BDs I have my 09, connected to the main system, and my Marantz DV8400 is still connected, though not to the system; it plays through the TV. I will lose some convenience but I'm not destitute. Oh well.



Sorry to hear about the malfunctioning Oppo. Even the best components are not immune to the wear and tear of regular use. I hope they hurry up and fix it so you can go back to enjoying your system. You will probably appreciate the system even more once you get it back, and hear what you've been missing for the time the Oppo was away.


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* 
Sorry to hear about the malfunctioning Oppo. Even the best components are not immune to the wear and tear of regular use. I hope they hurry up and fix it so you can go back to enjoying your system. You will probably appreciate the system even more once you get it back, and hear what you've been missing for the time the Oppo was away.
I like the convenience of watching discs straight through the TV rather than having to fire up the entire system; "quickie" viewing, I call it. But since I replaced the two pair of B&Ks (which I still need to do something with) with the Macs, firing up the system is easier, so it's not too bad. But since I'm not willing to reconfigure the 09 every time I want to watch something through a different route and the Marantz isn't a BD player, it will be a bit different.


Now I see the forecast calls for rain the next couple of days; I don't want to wrestle with the box in the rain, so I'll perhaps box the 83 today and at the earliest opportunity for good weather take it to FedEx.


----------



## prepress

Ok, I got the Oppo off this afternoon. It's on its way back via FedEx.


----------



## Franin

Ive said it in my thread Prepress but I wish it in yours Happy Easter my friend.


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles, I hope you have a Happy Easter!!


----------



## Waboman

Happy Easter, prepress.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/20348681
> 
> 
> Happy Easter, prepress.



The same to you Waboman.


----------



## prepress

We are hoping that everyone's Easter was a blessed one. No ODs on chocolate, extreme fatigue due to egg hunts and such.


Mine was quiet. I went to church in the AM, stopped for some groceries on the way home (shouldn't have gotten those potato chips) and tried to rest, as I had a headache by the afternoon. I did watch a DVD of Handel's _Messiah_, preceeded by Mets vs. Diamondbacks on TV. From there, I took it easy, because it felt like I was coming down with something, allergy or cold I don't know. I still have it. Being cautious, I'll skip exercise and take it easy tonight. Hey, maybe I'll watch something or listen to music. How's that for a novel idea?


----------



## Franin

Quote:

Originally Posted by *prepress*
We are hoping that everyone's Easter was a blessed one. No ODs on chocolate, extreme fatigue due to egg hunts and such.


Mine was quiet. I went to church in the AM, stopped for some groceries on the way home (shouldn't have gotten those potato chips) and tried to rest, as I had a headache by the afternoon. I did watch a DVD of Handel's Messiah, preceeded by Mets vs. Diamondbacks on TV. From there, I took it easy, because it felt like I was coming down with something, allergy or cold I don't know. I still have it. Being cautious, I'll skip exercise and take it easy tonight. Hey, maybe I'll watch something or listen to music. How's that for a novel idea?








Certainly is. We went to church in the morning but definitely no OD on chocolate I wasn't ready to chase after Kids buzzing on chocolate especially after the big lunch and the big dinner.


----------



## prepress

And I did watch and listen to stuff last night. Excerpts from Time-Life's _Singers and Songwriters_ CD set, Heart's _Dreamboat Annie_ LP, and ELP's 1977 performance at Montreal's Olympic Stadium (over 70,000 people!).


While I don't feel any different from last night as far as the allergy/cold goes, I got the news that Oppo has my BDP-83 and is working on it. Turnaround is usually 1-2 days, and they'll repair or replace as needed, update firmware, clean it and let me know when it's coming back. That sounds nice.


And as I say, at least make sure it's dark chocolate when the kids buzz. It's healthier.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> And I did watch and listen to stuff last night. Excerpts from Time-Life's Singers and Songwriters CD set, Heart's Dreamboat Annie LP, and ELP's 1977 performance at Montreal's Olympic Stadium (over 70,000 people!).
> 
> 
> While I don't feel any different from last night as far as the allergy/cold goes, I got the news that Oppo has my BDP-83 and is working on it. Turnaround is usually 1-2 days, and they'll repair or replace as needed, update firmware, clean it and let me know when it's coming back. That sounds nice.
> 
> 
> And as I say, at least make sure it's dark chocolate when the kids buzz. It's healthier.



Didnt know dark chocolate was healthier. Thanks for that prepress.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20362352
> 
> 
> Didnt know dark chocolate was healthier. Thanks for that prepress.



Yes, dark chocolate has flavonoids, which function like antioxidants. These are supposed to be beneficial to the heart and help with blood pressure. Of course, that doesn't mean you can get away with eating pounds at a time.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, dark chocolate has flavonoids, which function like antioxidants. These are supposed to be beneficial to the heart and help with blood presure. Of course, that doesn't mean you can get away with eating pounds at a time.



Oh now you tell me ( already eating enormous amount of dark chocolate )


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20362645
> 
> 
> Yes, dark chocolate has flavonoids, which function like antioxidants. These are supposed to be beneficial to the heart and help with blood pressure. Of course, that doesn't mean you can get away with eating pounds at a time.





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20362666
> 
> 
> Oh now you tell me ( already eating enormous amount of dark chocolate )



Ya gotta love the dark chocolate. It's medicinal.


----------



## prepress

Dark chocolate-covered nuts. That's the way to go. The cashews are especially dangerous. Man, they're good. Never have a big bag of those with you as a secondary activity.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Dark chocolate-covered nuts. That's the way to go. The cashews are especially dangerous. Man, they're good. Never have a big bag of those with you as a secondary activity.



You now are you purposely trying to make me hungry prepress?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20368156
> 
> 
> You now are you purposely trying to make me hungry prepress?



No. According to post #169, you're already taking care of it. Just don't grab a bag of them with your favorite movie







.


----------



## hometheatergeek

Hey Charles, sorry that you are a little under the weather. Maybe it is just being without the Oppo. She'll be back soon and you should be back to feeling better.







Have you bought any new BDs to try out once the player gets back?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/20369793
> 
> 
> Hey Charles, sorry that you are a little under the weather. Maybe it is just being without the Oppo. She'll be back soon and you should be back to feeling better.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Have you bought any new BDs to try out once the player gets back?



In fact, I just got an e-mail that the 83 is repaired and ready for return. I'm to receive another e-mail notification when it actually ships, along with a tracking number. Oddly enough, I haven't missed the Oppo that much. The convenience of it, sure, but playing the full system with the 09 makes up for it. I think I rediscovered some of my laserdiscs as a result, too. Dropping in a DVD/BD to play straight to the TV made me a bit lazy, I think.


I actually have BDs I haven't watched yet, or not all the way through. Never got around to them. The 83, like my 09, won't lack for anything to do for sure.


----------



## ldgibson76

Hello Prepress!


How's life my friend. I see that you were a little under the weather. That happens often when a beloved device like the Oppo BDP-83 has to be sent away for a repair/servicing!










Anyway, I just thought I'd stop by to say "Hello!"


----------



## prepress

Hello ld,


Yes, another cold, almost on the heels of the last one; I never really got rid of the cough from that one, though.


I'll be curious as to what was up with the 83. But I'd been neglecting the rest of my system in favor of the convenience I have with the 83 going to the TV. That should change, I think.


----------



## prepress

And another e-mail came in last night. The Oppo has shipped.


----------



## Franin





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> And another e-mail came in last night. The Oppo has shipped.



Good to hear prepress. Mine should arrive Monday.


----------



## prepress

On the home front, My OPPO 83 came back today, along with a report of what happened with it. Having confirmed the problem (when pressing OPEN on the first try, the player would try to load a disc instead of opening), Oppo repaired the loader frame (not sure what that is), updated the firmware and tested the player before returning it. And having unpacked and re-installed it, the 83 it behaved properly during the brief time I used it. More to come, as I use it again over the next few days.


I've decided that I don't want my Duo VP sitting on top of it any more, as I didn't realize the Duo puts out some heat through the vents underneath, more than through the top. A system reconfig is in order.


----------



## Bigham16

Glad you got it back and it is working. Was the repair under warranty or did you have to pay?



> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20399340
> 
> 
> On the home front, My OPPO 83 came back today, along with a report of what happened with it. Having confirmed the problem (when pressing OPEN on the first try, the player would try to load a disc instead of opening), Oppo repaired the loader frame (not sure what that is), updated the firmware and tested the player before returning it. And having unpacked and re-installed it, the 83 it behaved properly during the brief time I used it. More to come, as I use it again over the next few days.
> 
> 
> I've decided that I don't want my Duo VP sitting on top of it any more, as I didn't realize the Duo puts out some heat through the vents underneath, more than through the top. A system reconfig is in order.


----------



## hikarate

Glad to hear you are back up and running Prepress!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bigham16* /forum/post/20400886
> 
> 
> Glad you got it back and it is working. Was the repair under warranty or did you have to pay?



Under warranty, fortunately. I think it's a 2-year; I'll have to look. That being the case, it would expire in a couple of weeks.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hikarate* /forum/post/20401114
> 
> 
> Glad to hear you are back up and running Prepress!



Thanks. And I'm wondering whether the heat from the Duo contributed at all to the 83's failure. Reconfiguring won't be easy, however. A new main A/V rack would be helpful, something I'm looking into. I really prefer the heat-givers have their own shelves, plus the Duo needs to be near my computer for firmware updates.


I can hear money leaving my pocket. . .


----------



## Franin

Quote:

Originally Posted by *prepress* 
Thanks. And I'm wondering whether the heat from the Duo contributed at all to the 83's failure. Reconfiguring won't be easy, however. A new main A/V rack would be helpful, something I'm looking into. I really prefer the heat-givers have their own shelves, plus the Duo needs to be near my computer for firmware updates.


I can hear money leaving my pocket. . .
Have you looked at a server rack prepress?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20403678
> 
> 
> Have you looked at a server rack prepress?



It hadn't occurred to me Franin, and as I think of it now, I'm not sure it would work given my setup. I have those 501 monsters on the bottom of each outside rack (92 lb. each), and the left-hand rack may well have my record cleaning machine on the top shelf in the end. I don't know if my needs are compatible with a server rack. Still, It won't hurt to take another look so I can be sure. Sanus has one, and there are others.


I could just get an extension for the Duo's USB cable, too.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> It hadn't occurred to me Franin, and as I think of it now, I'm not sure it would work given my setup. I have those 501 monsters on the bottom of each outside rack (92 lb. each), and the left-hand rack may well have my record cleaning machine on the top shelf in the end. I don't know if my needs are compatible with a server rack. Still, It won't hurt to take another look so I can be sure. Sanus has one, and there are others.
> 
> 
> I could just get an extension for the Duo's USB cable, too.



Server racks shelves can hold quite a bit of weight. There is different sizes you can always 2x 28RU or one 42 RU. Depends on how much gear you have.


----------



## hikarate

Since Oppo support seemed to be very responsive, I would contact them and ask if they think it could have been heat related before you invest the time and money into a reconfig. Unless you are just itchin to get a new rack of course, in which case a reconfig sounds like a good idea


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hikarate* /forum/post/20404814
> 
> 
> Since Oppo support seemed to be very responsive, I would contact them and ask if they think it could have been heat related before you invest the time and money into a reconfig. Unless you are just itchin to get a new rack of course, in which case a reconfig sounds like a good idea



Did you read my mind? I was thinking of asking them what would cause the loader frame to malfunction. In fact, I sent an e-mail a minute or so ago. If it's heat-related (no guarantee heat's the cause), that seals the deal.


Even without that, I was thinking of a new rack for convenience reasons. My current console (see earlier pics) isn't equipment-friendly for the equipment I have and it's quite awkward to go in there to do anything. And as I mentioned in a previous post, I had to buy new interconnects for my preamp/amp connections because those I had wouldn't go through the console's rear slots well; indeed, one set was damaged in the attempt.


One way out is to put the Oppo inside the console, on the shelf currently occupied by the phono preamp's power supply. That doesn't solve the accessibility issue, but it gets the Oppo away from the Duo.


----------



## prepress

According to OPPO, the loader frame malfunction is generally due to the magnetic field being too high. The magnet's pull has been reduced; this is the one that holds the disc in place during playback.


I've asked if stacking with another component would matter, though I somehow doubt it. Perhaps we'll see.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> According to OPPO, the loader frame malfunction is generally due to the magnetic field being too high. The magnet's pull has been reduced; this is the one that holds the disc in place during playback.



I have to admit I didn't know that there was a magnetic field involved with blu ray players. I guess I'm still learning.


----------



## prepress

As you know, I am considering a new main A/V rack for my system, one that's more equipment-friendly. I've been in touch with Billy Bags, and ddgtr suggested I consult a welder, which might be cheaper; I haven't done that yet, because I'd like to hear what Billy Bags has to say first. I have attached two roughs of the front view which I put together.


The first one is a bit unusual, but the idea is to locate the "hub" components (preamp, VP, voltage regulator) more centrally in the system, hoping that will let me use shorter connections and thereby have less clutter. That will also locate the supplies for my VPI 16.5 record cleaning machine closer to the machine itself (which will likely sit on top of the Sanus Euro rack to that left side). The second is visually more appealing perhaps but doesn't even out the distances left and right as much I'd like. This could come down to looks vs. efficiency.

 

table2.pdf 43.9609375k . file

 

table3.pdf 41.712890625k . file


----------



## prepress

I've sent Billy Bags several ideas for a new rack, and have spoken on the phone with them as well. No response yet to my latest sketches, which were sent about 2 weeks ago.


More, despite the relative inconvenience of my current cabinet, I wouldn't lose that much sleep if I kept it. Still checking things out, just not as energetically.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20434091
> 
> 
> As you know, I am considering a new main A/V rack for my system, one that's more equipment-friendly. I've been in touch with Billy Bags, and ddgtr suggested I consult a welder, which might be cheaper; I haven't done that yet, because I'd like to hear what Billy Bags has to say first. I have attached two roughs of the front view which I put together.
> 
> 
> The first one is a bit unusual, but the idea is to locate the "hub" components (preamp, VP, voltage regulator) more centrally in the system, hoping that will let me use shorter connections and thereby have less clutter. That will also locate the supplies for my VPI 16.5 record cleaning machine closer to the machine itself (which will likely sit on top of the Sanus Euro rack to that left side). The second is visually more appealing perhaps but doesn't even out the distances left and right as much I'd like. This could come down to looks vs. efficiency.



Second one doesn't look too bad prepress. One thing though you might accommodate to what you have know but also think of the future thats where I messed up a few years back with the cabinet in my theatre room. You might end up getting a player that's built like a tank and you cannot fit it into the space. Just a thought


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20573383
> 
> 
> I've sent Billy Bags several ideas for a new rack, and have spoken on the phone with them as well. No response yet to my latest sketches, which were sent about 2 weeks ago.
> 
> 
> More, despite the relative inconvenience of my current cabinet, I wouldn't lose that much sleep if I kept it. Still checking things out, just not as energetically.



They must be busy or there service isnt there


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Franin* 
Second one doesn't look too bad prepress. One thing though you might accommodate to what you have know but also think of the future thats where I messed up a few years back with the cabinet in my theatre room. You might end up getting a player that's built like a tank and you cannot fit it into the space. Just a thought
I spent several hours coming up with alternatives, having thought about that. I don't plan any major upgrades, though I would have to reconfigure with a new rack in place. Below are the last ones I sent (front view only), and one they sent me based on an earlier idea I had; you'll need to rotate theirs.

 

table8x.pdf 62.6787109375k . file

 

table9x.pdf 58.4052734375k . file

 

FRIERSON_CUSTOM PRO 61_05_24_11_642.pdf 45.5146484375k . file


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> I spent several hours coming up with alternatives, having thought about that. I don't plan any major upgrades, though I would have to reconfigure with a new rack in place. Below are the last ones I sent (front view only), and one they sent me based on an earlier idea I had; you'll need to rotate theirs.



I actually don't mind the one they sent.


----------



## Waboman

You doing some upgrading and remodeling, prepress? Like Franin said earlier, get a cabinet that has room for expansion. You never know what new piece of must have gear awaits around the corner. I've pretty much filled my rack to capacity. Although I could probably cram another piece of two in there.







I like this cabinet that you posted. What are your thoughts?


----------



## BrolicBeast

Greetings Prepress!


Have you considered getting a small wood-working shop to build you a modular rack to your desired specifications? This way, you could stain it to a finish better than what you would get from a manufacturer's veneers. I've never used a wood-worker before, but I'm willing to bet that, as long as you know precisely what you want in terms of shelving (which you do, judging from the tables you posted), it should turn out looking great. Probably cheaper than Billy Bags as well.


----------



## prepress

I heard from Billy Bags Wednesday. Apparently they were waiting for me to indicate a preference of the sketches I sent, while I was waiting for feedback on those same sketches. Anyway, looking back at what I sent them, I'm less enthusiastic about most of them, and the process may be taking too long as my general enthusiasm for the idea of a new cabinet has waned. But I press on.


The sketch they sent is too wide, which is why things went back to the drawing board; I'm limited to a maximum width of 58", and that's a bit tight. I did come up with one more idea which is based on an earlier sketch. I'll send it to them and post it later (have to get ready for work now).


Going to a woodworker is another thing I hadn't thought of, as I wanted any new rack to at least resemble the Sanus Euros on the outside. But perhaps the place I got my bookcases (if they're still in business) would be worth checking out.


----------



## prepress

On another note, I had an equipment failure last night: HDMI cables can go bad, it seems. I was all set to watch the _Mahavishnu Orchestra Live at Montreaux_ DVD when I noted frequent video dropouts. I tried another DVD, Tineke Postma's _Live in Amsterdam_, same thing. If you've never heard of her, she's a jazz musician (tenor/soprano saxophone). Being the cool customer I usually am, I decided to try another HDMI. Problem solved.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/20575344
> 
> 
> You doing some upgrading and remodeling, prepress? Like Franin said earlier, get a cabinet that has room for expansion. You never know what new piece of must have gear awaits around the corner. I've pretty much filled my rack to capacity. Although I could probably cram another piece of two in there.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like this cabinet that you posted. What are your thoughts?



My latest concern is that the rack not be too specific to current equipment. If I wanted to rearrange equipment or acquire new/larger equipment, I'd be limited size-wise. Not a disaster, but not ideal either.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20585385
> 
> 
> On another note, I had an equipment failure last night: HDMI cables can go bad, it seems. I was all set to watch the _Mahavishnu Orchestra Live at Montreaux_ DVD when I noted frequent video dropouts. I tried another DVD, Tineke Postma's _Live in Amsterdam_, same thing. If you've never heard of her, she's a jazz musician (tenor/soprano saxophone). Being the cool customer I usually am, I decided to try another HDMI. Problem solved.



welcome to my world I had the same problem. Originally I bought cheap HDMI cables under 2m because I was told I should have no issue but I guess they were wrong. I had audio, video dropouts. I had issue with no pic in the beginning, audio pop etc. I replaced the 7 of them this time around with decent cables.


----------



## pcweber111

Regardless of what people say there are differences with cheap versus quality cables. I've found that out myself several times. I don't advocate spending more than what you feel comfortable spending but there's no harm in investing in a quality cable that won't result in video sync issues among other problems.


----------



## prepress

For my main player I use a Pioneer 09, with HDMI carrying video only. Once I replaced the cable it was fine. I forget what it cost, but it wasn't that expensive. I was using a 3ft., 28AWG Blue Jeans cable; all my other BJ cables are working fine. I replaced the troublemaker with a 4ft. Belkin, which is 24AWG and much less flexible.


I was thinking about Pangea HDMIs at one point. Not sure if I'll go there, but who knows? They're all 24AWG and, if they're as stiff as the Belkin, could be problematic. The silver-plated one (4%) costs more.


And here's that last rack idea, which is merely a variation on table #8, posted earlier. I'd be repeating myself mostly after this. The center section is a bit wider, at 13", so I can either put the cable box in there or leave it on the top shelf.

 

table12.pdf 42.037109375k . file


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Regardless of what people say there are differences with cheap versus quality cables. I've found that out myself several times.



I agree 100%


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20585433
> 
> 
> welcome to my world I had the same problem. Originally I bought cheap HDMI cables under 2m because I was told I should have no issue but I guess they were wrong. I had audio, video dropouts. I had issue with no pic in the beginning, audio pop etc. I replaced the 7 of them this time around with decent cables.



Which cables did you replace them with? I'm curious.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20615757
> 
> 
> Which cables did you replace them with? I'm curious.






Hi prepress sorry for the late reply I use these cables now:














> Quote:
> High Speed HDMI Cables with long length i-active technology
> 
> The EVS series of HDMI cables is an upgrade from the EVO series, comprising the same solid-core and flat cable geometry, but with superior silver plated conductors. In addition, the EVS range now supports the new High Speed with Ethernet standard up to 10m / 32′ to fully support the optional Ethernet and Audio Return Channel (ARC) over HDMI as well as achieving the maximum certified bandwidth of 10.2Gbps. New long length models, now up to 18m / 59′, deliver High Speed performance thanks to our unique implementation of the remarkable Redmere active technology. This technology corrects errors in the HDMI bitstream, without the need for an external power supply by utilizing an extremely low power design and its ability to harvest power from both the +5V line and TMDS cores within the HDMI signal. Combined with our all-new connector shell design, the EVS range offers one of the shortest mounting depths available, regardless of length, while maintaining a secure and robust connection.
> 
> High purity silver plated cores reduces digital jitter for improved picture & sound
> 
> Ethernet and Audio Return Channel supported on 0.5m / 1′7″ - 10m / 32′ models
> 
> Triple shield TMDS channels - 2 × mylar foil wrap layers, plus copper braid
> 
> Lightweight aluminium shell and premium Pearl PVC cable jacket
> 
> Full CEC support for remote control via HDMI with compatible hardware
> 
> All models support 3D and HD Audio formats
> 
> High Speed with Ethernet 0.5m / 1′7″ - 10m / 32′
> 
> High Speed on new 12m / 39′ - 18m / 59′ models
> 
> Redmere active cable technology employed on new 7m / 22′11″ - 18m / 59′ lengths
> 
> ATC certified
> 
> Official HDMI Adopter status
> 
> Kordz® IMMORTAL lifetime warranty
> 
> NOTE: All models support the full 10.2Gbps bandwidth for all specified audio and video modes except the EVS-HDMI-15P which supports up to 1080p/60 with 24 bit colour depth and x.v.Color.


----------



## prepress

There are some Pangeas with silver plating, as well as higher-priced models from other manufacturers. I'll ask the dangerous question: have you noticed a difference in video with these new HDMIs as opposed to what they replaced?


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> There are some Pangeas with silver plating, as well as higher-priced models from other manufacturers. I'll ask the dangerous question: have you noticed a difference in video with these new HDMIs as opposed to what they replaced?



No difference at all. Its mainly for stability carrying the signal and avoiding the blu screen due to handshake issues. I remember used to think it was the duo or the pre amp(before I had the duo) and all along it was my bloody cables. I even got rid of my sony bdp 350 because at times it didn't handshake properly.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin* /forum/post/20621389
> 
> 
> No difference at all. Its mainly for stability carrying the signal and avoiding the blu screen due to handshake issues. I remember used to think it was the duo or the pre amp(before I had the duo) and all along it was my bloody cables. I even got rid of my sony bdp 350 because at times it didn't handshake properly.



I noted the more expensive silver-coated cables have a greater percentage of silver coating. The Pangeas have 4%; I saw another (Audioquest I think) at 10%. I do experience audio dropouts and such with my cable TV sometimes, but that could be the source, not necessarily the cables. Then, the recent problem with video from my 09FD turned out to be an HDMI gone bad.


For the cable box, I might go to component for a while and see what happens.


----------



## prepress

Here is the latest Billy Bags design, again a tweak of my last design. We're talking square pillars and shelves now, and a cleaner look.


This one, with some special feet to get it off the floor a bit more (still not as much as I want), is more money than I was counting on. And with recent developments back home, I'm not sure I should pursue it. A couple of family members are ill, with an ex sister-in-law in hospice care and a sister-in-law battling cancer, and funds may have to be diverted to those so I'm reluctant to drop over $2200 on a new rack now.


I'm looking into Salamander and may contact a custom furniture place about something also. In any case, with any rack, I may have to forego the planned new, shorter power cords and use the ones I have now. Still considering possibilities on this, though I'm keeping an eye on what happens back home.

 

FRIERSON_CUSTOM 9834_06_27_11.PDF 108.6376953125k . file


----------



## ddgtr

Charles, I am sorry to hear about your family members and I truly hope things will turn around...


I checked out your schematics and I think you can have a local welder do it - some shops can even powder coat it in-house - for about a quarter of what Billy Bags wants.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/20653795
> 
> 
> Charles, I am sorry to hear about your family members and I truly hope things will turn around...
> 
> 
> I checked out your schematics and I think you can have a local welder do it - some shops can even powder coat it in-house - for about a quarter of what Billy Bags wants.



Since this is New York, a quarter is probably on the low end







, but it should be cheaper, yes. Then the only problem would be leveling, as the floor here is uneven. Furniture casters, perhaps similar to what I have propping up the front legs of my Hooker cabinet, may work.


Research will be paramount in going for a welder. I wouldn't want to just stab at a name in the yellow pages for this, and in a way it will be more work than the current tack, but worth considering. Meantime, I e-mailed Billy Bags this AM and advised them of the situation. They have standard models that could work with a few tweaks, and I'm sure it would cost less than the current design.


----------



## prepress

I think I have the more or less final idea for what I'd like this rack to look like. It's a variation on one of Billy Bags' standard designs. I might explore the welder or custom furniture maker option next. the pillars can be made square easily if that's simpler or cheaper.

 

table14-1in.pdf 41.359375k . file


----------



## prepress

Okay, Salamander is officially eliminated, as they don't do custom widths, though they do custom heights. Not wanting to move my side racks, and hoping to avoid new interconnects, I'm trying to keep this new one to 58" wide. The current space available i5 59.25" so it's tight.


I did begin a general search for welders in Brooklyn and found several. More detailed follow-up is needed, and maybe a visit to one or two. And I haven't tried Billy Bags with my last design (though the last e-mail I got wasn't from the person I'd been dealing with and it had a ring of finality to it).


----------



## prepress

And now, Billy Bags seems eliminated, as I submitted my final designs, which according to the rep cannot be done for the $2000 max figure I gave. In fact, it would be just over $3000! So unless something major occurs (such as suddenly finding more space for one of the pre-fab racks or I come into some money), Billy Bags is out, too. Too bad, because I like their products.


I am back to checking out a welder or woodworking place, either of which I'm sure can give me something under my budget. Or, inconvenient as it is, I could just keep my hooker console and save the money. Not sure right now, but I'll deal with it until a good opportunity comes or the idea of a new rack wears off.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/20866891
> 
> 
> And now, Billy Bags seems eliminated, as I submitted my final designs, which according to the rep cannot be done for the $2000 max figure I gave. In fact, it would be just over $3000! So unless something major occurs (such as suddenly finding more space for one of the pre-fab racks or I come into some money), Billy Bags is out, too. Too bad, because I like their products.
> 
> 
> I am back to checking out a welder or woodworking place, either of which I'm sure can give me something under my budget. Or, inconvenient as it is, I could just keep my hooker console and save the money. Not sure right now, but I'll deal with it until a good opportunity comes or the idea of a new rack wears off.



Greetings Prepress. Have you considered getting an out-of-state welder to make the rack for you and then ship it? It may take a trip to the mountains of PA or CT, but if you can find a welder in a sparsely populated area, they may be in less of an "assembly-line" mode and can sit down with you and build precisely what you want, for what may be a fraction of the cost.


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* 
Greetings Prepress. Have you considered getting an out-of-state welder to make the rack for you and then ship it? It may take a trip to the mountains of PA or CT, but if you can find a welder in a sparsely populated area, they may be in less of an "assembly-line" mode and can sit down with you and build precisely what you want, for what may be a fraction of the cost.
I hadn't thought of that. Searching by the local phone book is probably hit or miss, even local online. But out of state is another idea. I may do that. Glad I thought of it














!


Obviously, thanks. When I pick up the research again, I'll look out of NY as well as in. Not this weekend, of course, given the circumstances.


----------



## Bunga99

Quote:

Originally Posted by *prepress* 
Not this weekend, of course, given the circumstances.
Hope all is going well Prepress! Is your area under evacuation from Irene?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bunga99* /forum/post/20872445
> 
> 
> Hope all is going well Prepress! Is your area under evacuation from Irene?



Not my immediate area, no. I did note the high school across the street is an evacuation center, though. I was on call for the possibility of having to go into work today (I work at NYC Transit's print shop), but the call hasn't come. I doubt it would at this point. And interestingly, I think the shop is in an evacuation area itself.


It's supposed to get bad overnight into the AM, with the storm out of here maybe late afternoon tomorrow. It's begun raining, but nothing dramatic. I guess that could well change.


----------



## Bunga99

Hope you and yours are not severely impacted.


I was scheduled to go up to NJ early next week but just cancelled last minute. Hopefully my family and friends will be OK as well and hopefully the media/news is blowing this out of proportion.


Stay dry and safe!


Claude


----------



## prepress

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Bunga99* 
Hope you and yours are not severely impacted.


I was scheduled to go up to NJ early next week but just cancelled last minute. Hopefully my family and friends will be OK as well and hopefully the media/news is blowing this out of proportion.


Stay dry and safe!


Claude
Thanks. I figure that, just before bed, I'll shut down the A/V system. Even though it's protected with two Furmans, I think this is a good idea. Possibly I'll turn off the SPR 20i (which everything's plugged into) and unplug it from the Elite-15PF (done), or turn off and unplug the Elite also. The surges that can accompany power outtages are something I'd like to avoid if we have an outtage.


The computer's on another set of equipment (two Tripplites), and I'll deal with that perhaps the same way. But I'd like to figure out how to do it without the annoying noise the UPS in the voltage regulator makes.


----------



## Bunga99

Thats a really good idea to unplug everything. It's one thing if you get damage to your home and have the insurance take care of it but waiting months to get your gear back up and running when it could have been avoided cant be fun


----------



## prepress

I've turned everything back on, but my cable box isn't cooperating. At first, it gave me channel banners but only gray screen. Having rebooted, it's been "acquiring application information" for about 20 minutes. I wonder.


----------



## pcweber111

Yeah I had a surge hit my system awhile back and it killed my PS3 and a few other items. I knew too that I should have unplugged everything but I didn't. Luckily it didn't really do any real damage or I would have been quite annoyed.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111* /forum/post/20876664
> 
> 
> Yeah I had a surge hit my system awhile back and it killed my PS3 and a few other items. I knew too that I should have unplugged everything but I didn't. Luckily it didn't really do any real damage or I would have been quite annoyed.



The equipment that got zapped is replaceable, PC. Be glad for that, and that it (I hope) wasn't costly to do. Did you have any kind of power protection on it?


My cable box still reads "Alt." I wonder if I did something to it when I rebooted, maybe I forgot to turn it off before plugging it back in? I guess I have to consider a new box.


----------



## prepress

Update: I called Time Warner Cable regarding my recalcitrant box, and was told that sometimes, when a box has been disconnected for a while, it needs a signal from the office to resume functionality. That was the case here. So everything's running fine.


On the other hand, I went outside for the first time since Saturday afternoon, and saw that one of the large trees up the street was blown over. It didn't hit any buildings, but that part of the block's a mess.


----------



## Bunga99

Good to hear you are safe and dry Prepress! It seems that many were not so lucky.


----------



## prepress

I am now thinking about chucking my earlier ideas on a new main rack and considering this Salamander:

http://www.thesimpletvstandstore.com...-30-doors.aspx 


Yes, it's too wide for the current space I have, but I find I'm actually willing to explore making room for it. That would mean moving the speakers another 6" or so further apart, which gets problematic due to the limited space on the left. But as I say, I'm willing to see if I can figure out how to do it. If I come up with a workable layout, I may go for it. And I can save money if I get only the basic rack, not the doors and rear panels and such.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bunga99* /forum/post/20879807
> 
> 
> Good to hear you are safe and dry Prepress! It seems that many were not so lucky.



That's true, unfortunately. there was severe damage, mostly flooding, upstate. Here some businesses and homes took damage, but things could have been worse if Irene had been stronger.


----------



## hometheatergeek

Hi prepress, just stopping in to say Hi.










That is a nice stand you are considering.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hometheatergeek* /forum/post/21011708
> 
> 
> Hi prepress, just stopping in to say Hi.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That is a nice stand you are considering.



I think so too, HTG.


The full setup, as shown in the link, retails for about $1465. The rack alone is less than a grand, MSRP. It comes in different combinations with black or aluminum rods and black, walnut, cherry, or maple finishes. I'd like to see oak (since all the wood in my room is oak), but black works. It will take some serious maneuvering as to whether it will work in my room.


EDIT: maybe VERY serious maneuvering. If I spread out the Sanus racks and my speakers to accommodate the Synergy 30, I have no room to move the LP racks from behind the left side of the room, and tighter access to get to them. Uh-oh. Still, I remain undaunted so far.


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21008332
> 
> 
> I am now thinking about chucking my earlier ideas on a new main rack and considering this Salamander:
> 
> http://www.thesimpletvstandstore.com...-30-doors.aspx
> 
> 
> Yes, it's too wide for the current space I have, but I find I'm actually willing to explore making room for it. That would mean moving the speakers another 6" or so further apart, which gets problematic due to the limited space on the left. But as I say, I'm willing to see if I can figure out how to do it. If I come up with a workable layout, I may go for it. And I can save money if I get only the basic rack, not the doors and rear panels and such.



Hey Prepress. What's up, man?


That's the exact same stand I have. I also ordered it from the same place. Cheapest I could find. Plus no tax and free shipping. Can't beat that. What color you thinking about getting?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/21013581
> 
> 
> Hey Prepress. What's up, man?
> 
> 
> That's the exact same stand I have. I also ordered it from the same place. Cheapest I could find. Plus no tax and free shipping. Can't beat that. What color you thinking about getting?



Waboman, hello there!


Right now, I'm thinking black, though I'm not sure whether to get black or aluminum pillars; the aluminum ones might stand out too much and be a visual distraction. So, black/black or walnut/black are where I'd lean now. Cherry's reddish color doesn't work in here, and maple may be too light against everything else. The black/black combo is visually quieter, I think, especially when lights are low, as it disappears more against the TV screen. I need to pop over to your thread and take another look at your setup for some perspective.


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21014896
> 
> 
> Waboman, hello there!
> 
> 
> Right now, I'm thinking black, though I'm not sure whether to get black or aluminum pillars; the aluminum ones might stand out too much and be a visual distraction. So, black/black or walnut/black are where I'd lean now. Cherry's reddish color doesn't work in here, and maple may be too light against everything else. The black/black combo is visually quieter, I think, especially when lights are low, as it disappears more against the TV screen. I need to pop over to your thread and take another look at your setup for some perspective.



Hey Prepress.


I think the black/black is pretty sexy. But then again, the black w/ aluminum pillars looks really good too. It might compliment your components more. Tough decisions, amigo. So, which way are you leaning?


As I said in my thread, get the casters. It will make your life so much easier.


----------



## prepress

I am planning a minor room rearrangement. Will take a pic or two when it's complete (that is, if the camera still works).


And, I'm still considering how I could make the Salamander fit in here; this will be tricky. And how to get rid of the Hooker console, which is nice but is awkward with my equipment. Access is a challenge, rear access in particular.


----------



## prepress

I went to the annual VE HDTV shoot-out and saw the new Sharp/Pioneer Elite TV. What a good-looking set. There is a problem with the color (blue specifically) that if they get it solved, the Elite could be the TV to beat. Ridiculously good contrast ratio and black level. Being an LCD, the off-axis view suffers some, but the black bars were very black, very close to Kuro levels. If I were starting over and didn't have a 111FD but had the money I'd consider the Elite.


----------



## prepress

Also, this arrived today.











I was surprised it came on a Sunday, I didn't know FedEx delivered on Sundays. But I'll install it tomorrow and see if there's any difference over the BJC I use now. This Pangea will connect my Duo VP to the TV.


----------



## BrolicBeast

Maaaaan, those cables are looking fierce!!! Can't wait to hear your impressions of them!


----------



## prepress

Cables are often said to need to "break in," and these preliminary observations may change. But for now, this is what I see.


The Pangea 26L was installed yesterday afternoon as noted, between the Duo VP and the 111FD plasma. At first turn on, the picture on ESPN seemed a bit cleaner, though the sense of that diminished as time went on; whether there was a change in the signal (always possible) or the first impression was an illusion I don't know. There are changes in studios and cameras and camera angles during a broadcast, so even that could contribute. Still, roaming around channels, it's hard to say there's real improvement. I should also say I'm more sensitive with the ears than the eyes. I watched a bit of _The Blind Side_, and it looked about the same.


However, there _was_ a difference in sound, especially evident with good material. There's improvement in the upper registers with more detail; cleaner sound with more awareness of transients. The 26L is heavier gauge (26AWG) than the Blue Jeans cable (28AWG) and has a small amount of silver (1.5%). And keep in mind this is using the 111's sound system (18wpc). There you have it for now.


----------



## Waboman

Nice score on the cable. That Pangea cable looks like it means business. I'm not fond of the BJC HDMIs. But that's another story. When does your salamander stand arrive?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/21067930
> 
> 
> Nice score on the cable. That Pangea cable looks like it means business. I'm not fond of the BJC HDMIs. But that's another story. When does your salamander stand arrive?



The Pangea HD-26L is, I'm told, the replacement for the HD-24PC. Though a smaller gauge, the 26L is high-speed and supports 3D, ethernet, and the latest formats.


As is my custom with potential purchases, I am researching and analyzing whether or not a Salamander is viable here. The space available is 59"; I need at least 66" for this to work. That's a problem on the left side, where there's only 15" from the left speaker to the side rack with my computer stuff. Plus the LPs and LDs are behind the speaker. Space really is the final frontier. I don't want to do a major overhaul on the entire room for this, but if I work out a viable configuration, I will then probably order the Salamander and be done. Needless to say, I'll ask the store to deliver it assembled; there'd be NO room here to do that.


----------



## Waboman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21069942
> 
> 
> The Pangea HD-26L is, I'm told, the replacement for the HD-24PC. Though a smaller gauge, the 26L is high-speed and supports 3D, ethernet, and the latest formats.
> 
> 
> As is my custom with potential purchases, I am researching and analyzing whether or not a Salamander is viable here. The space available is 59"; I need at least 66" for this to work. That's a problem on the left side, where there's only 15" from the left speaker to the side rack with my computer stuff. Plus the LPs and LDs are behind the speaker. Space really is the final frontier. I don't want to do a major overhaul o the entire room for this, but if I work out a viable configuration, I will then probably order the Salamander and be done. Needless to say, I'll ask the store to deliver it installed; there'd be NO room here to do that.



Yeah, it seems there's never enough space to do what we want. I have a feeling you have a solution though. Good idea on having the stand delivered already assembled.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman* /forum/post/21074850
> 
> 
> Yeah, it seems there's never enough space to do what we want. I have a feeling you have a solution though. Good idea on having the stand delivered already assembled.



As you surmised, I meant "assembled," not "installed" (I just corrected the original post). There's still the option of having something built that fits the existing space, and I might use the ideas I sent Billy Bags as a basis.


Another factor, though, is that I got some bad news from home regarding my sister-in-law today, and the likelihood of a sudden (and extra) trip south early next year could impact what I would spend on this whole thing. I'll need to keep that in mind. At the least, I better not spend too much if I go ahead with the project.


----------



## prepress

I picked up one of these to use on my Duo VP, in order to get rid of the cheater plug I'm using now. I need to defeat the ground in order to combat the 60Hz hum, and this PS Audio Jewel AC will be a better fit with the detachable ground pin. I don't expect much improvement since the Duo's transformer cable will be the same, but I can at least retire the cheater plug.


----------



## prepress

There is another thought I had yesterday on the rack situation. The stand that held my previous TV is a Sanus Euro rack, the EFAV40, with an extra shelf. It currently holds my computer equipment. I've attached a photo (though not the best) in case you don't remember it.


Given all that's going on right now, here and at home, I could RE-re-purpose this rack to replace the Hooker console and avoid the expense entirely, then get another Euro audio rack like the ones I have now for the computer stuff. I'd save money, would have matching racks all around, have access to the rear of all the gear, and gain better access to the wall outlets my electronics are all plugged into, as the EFAV stand all but blocks it right now. The only drawback I see is that it doesn't fill the space between the side racks, being only 40" wide; there'd be about 10" between the EFAV and either side rack, and the TV would be obviously wider than the stand.


I'm thinking the Salamander option is too awkward logistically (though I still work with it some) and would require serious compromises to the room, so this Sanus could be the ticket. I'm working configurations to see how best to go in terms of any cables I'd need to replace, because I'd want the shortest possible runs. I still haven't gone to the woodworking folks about a custom rack yet, but am intrigued by the Sanus option right now.


----------



## hazerj

Sweet!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hazerj* /forum/post/21089201
> 
> 
> Sweet!



Thanks, hazerj.


----------



## roadster-s

Hey prepress, been reading your thread in regards to the humming issue. Do you have any light dimmers or gas filled lights on the same circuit(s) as your system?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roadster-s* /forum/post/21091657
> 
> 
> Hey prepress, been reading your thread in regards to the humming issue. Do you have any light dimmers or gas filled lights on the same circuit(s) as your system?



There aren't any dimmers or gas-filled lights, fortunately. It's strictly a grounding issue and the culprit is the cable feed introducing the hum. I got rid of it by using cheater plugs on my video processor and power amps. Either alone didn't do it completely. I'd like a more elegant solution, though, and I know of some higher-end cheater plugs; maybe I'll check those.


By the way, I took a look at your setup; it's very nice. I considered Emotiva amps, and even thought of getting an audition (I'm from Nashville, and usually go down for Christmas). Do you listen to your system with the speaker grills off, or was that just for the photo?


----------



## roadster-s




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21092395
> 
> 
> Do you listen to your system with the speaker grills off, or was that just for the photo?



Grills? what grills







They've actually been stored from day one. I know that they're acoustically transparent, but I never get tired of looking at these speaker's fine craftsmanship details.


I have my sat feed cable grounded on a water pipe inside the suspended ceiling. Don't know if it helps, just a precaution I took from day one. Good luck in taming those gremlins, we all seem to have come accross them one time or another.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roadster-s* /forum/post/21092941
> 
> 
> Grills? what grills
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They've actually been stored from day one. I know that they're acoustically transparent, but I never get tired of looking at these speaker's fine craftsmanship details.
> 
> 
> I have my sat feed cable grounded on a water pipe inside the suspended ceiling. Don't know if it helps, just a precaution I took from day one. Good luck in taming those gremlins, we all seem to have come accross them one time or another.



They're tamed, though not in the most elegant way. I tried several things before doing an extended troubleshoot with the Time Warner Cable guy and I found that lifting the ground on the VP and the amps in combination got rid of it.


I've also ordered a few more PS Audio Jewel ACs to use on various component sources, and some Conntek grounding plugs to replace the $0.59 cheater plugs I'm using now.


----------



## prepress

More of these arrived today, not 30 minutes ago. They will be going on source components. I plan to replace most cords with them eventually. The preamp has a captive cord, so no go there.


According to the Audio Advisor salesman, PS Audio has said nothing (at least to them) about discontinuing the Jewel ACs, though they have discontinued everything else in their PC line. Interesting.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21064976
> 
> 
> Cables are often said to need to "break in," and these preliminary observations may change. But for now, this is what I see.
> 
> 
> The Pangea 26L was installed yesterday afternoon as noted, between the Duo VP and the 111FD plasma. At first turn on, the picture on ESPN seemed a bit cleaner, though the sense of that diminished as time went on; whether there was a change in the signal (always possible) or the first impression was an illusion I don't know. There are changes in studios and cameras and camera angles during a broadcast, so even that could contribute. Still, roaming around channels, it's hard to say there's real improvement. I should also say I'm more sensitive with the ears than the eyes. I watched a bit of _The Blind Side_, and it looked about the same.
> 
> 
> However, there _was_ a difference in sound, especially evident with good material. There's improvement in the upper registers with more detail; cleaner sound with more awareness of transients. The 26L is heavier gauge (26AWG) than the Blue Jeans cable (28AWG) and has a small amount of silver (1.5%). And keep in mind this is using the 111's sound system (18wpc). There you have it for now.


*Update:* As the 26L has had some time in the setup, I AM beginning to notice some improvement in picture clarity. It's been most evident in recent football watching. And I also found out that the AA salesman's earlier statement about 26L replacing the 24PC isn't the case. So I may go for the heavier gauge. Problem is, they have none in 2m, they have no 26Ls in 1.5m; those are my preferred sizes, and it'll take about 2 months to get those in. Oh, well.


----------



## ddgtr

Charles, what is up!!


Congrats on the new cables and interesting finds on the audio/video quality differences.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr* /forum/post/21115755
> 
> 
> Charles, what is up!!
> 
> 
> Congrats on the new cables and interesting finds on the audio/video quality differences.



ddgtr, hello there. There's a definite improvement in sound on the TV, and is most noticeable with good-quality sources. The video is more subtle.


The Jewel AC is, of course, PS Audio's entry-level cable, and I think it would go fine on my sources. I could wish it were more flexible; the reason I didn't keep the AC-5 cords I had briefly is their stiffness; working with short lengths makes flexibility important. An idea I have, though I'm not doing it anytime soon, is to put Jewel ACs on my 501s and move the Wireworld Auroras to sources. I shouldn't get into spending a lot of money here because I do have family considerations to look at right now.


----------



## prepress

I also have three of these:

http://www.amazon.com/Conntek-30081-...459744&sr=1-16 


They should make for a more firm connection than the $.59 cheater plugs I have now.


----------



## jnnt29

Prepress, what an impressive set up you have. I'm looking forward to slowly upgrading where possible.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jnnt29* /forum/post/21149084
> 
> 
> Prepress, what an impressive set up you have. I'm looking forward to slowly upgrading where possible.



Thanks. I'm looking to get the setup squared away and then leave it for awhile. I'm not enough of a fanatic to run after every new thing (even when I CAN afford it), but I would like things to be a certain way. I'm hoping to get there soon.


----------



## prepress

The ground loop hum I thought was gone either wasn't, or came back. I noticed it last night. Now, it comes from the TV whenever the cable box input on my Duo VP is active. If I switch to another input, it goes away. I'm going to use one of those Jewel AC cables I have to lift the TV ground, and after that I'm not sure what to do.


Not having installed the Jewel, about 30 minutes ago I turned on the TV, cable box and Duo to check things out and . . . no hum. I don't know what gives, but no hum. The one difference is that the BD player was on last night and wasn't this morning. I guess I'll have to check it again later with the BD on.


UPDATE (11/9): The hum is present when the cable input on the Duo is active and any of the other video sources is on. The hum vanishes when I switch to the other source's input. Oh well.I may try lifting the TV's ground, but that'll be the last thing I try on this issue.


UPDATE (11/11): Last night the hum was present even without other video sources being on. Keep in mind, it's just audible at the listening/viewing position, about 10' away. I guess I'll lift the TV ground and if that doesn't get rid of the hum I'll just live with it, since it doesn't really interfere with enjoyment.


----------



## prepress

A significant event occurred earlier this week, as I bid farewell to my B&K M-200 monos. They are on their way to the brother of a former co-worker. Fortunately, they're going to someone who knows what to do with them. I now have some valuable floor space back.


I also moved some things around, and perhaps it shows in the photo. My place is still a mess, as it's clear I have too much in here. But the removal of the B&Ks is a good first step.











Next is probably the black TV stand under the air conditioner, which has the Furman boxes on top.


----------



## prepress

Another thought I've had. Instead of moving the existing Sanus Euro EFAV rack I have now, it's possible to leave it there and relocate my turntable setup (table, phono pramp and SDS) to it, and run a long interconnect to the preamp (about 5m to be safe; 4m would be tight). I'd need a new TV stand then, and could get another EFAV or whatever would work.


I have a new Euro audio rack to replace the EFAV with, but I could return that within the 30-day window; I wouldn't need it in the above scenario. I'm thinking.


----------



## prepress

The Euro audio rack went back yesterday. I won't be needing it anytime soon as I have yet to get rid of the Hooker console.


----------



## hometheatergeek

*Good Afternoon and a Very Merry Christmas Charles.*


Hope you are having a great Holiday weekend.


----------



## ddgtr

Merry Christmas, Charles!!


----------



## prepress

A day-late Merry Christmas to you too HTG and ddgtr. Also to everyone else.


I've spent Christmas down here in Missouri City, Texas, just outside Houston. My sister's here, and just before I arrived I found out my nephew was getting married the 24th. Needless to say the last few days were very busy, with not much sleep. I also got to meet my niece's husband for the first time, as well as their daughter (1.5 years) and she's...interesting.


No A/V news, except the BD player here wasn't set up properly and I did some adjustment on it. The PQ looks better now. When I get back to NY I will once again consider what to do about the TV console. I may go back to the Salamander Synergy despite its width, because I'm becoming uncomfortable with the spacing using the Euro A/V rack mentioned earlier. At only 40" wide, I'm concerned about the gap between it and the Euro audio racks looking awkward.


----------



## prepress

I haven't made a move on a new stand yet, as I am very deliberate about these things and am also limited for now by the excess stuff in my apartment, the living room in particular. But I am reasonably sure it will be one of these options:


1. Repurpose the 40" Sanus Euro EFAV holding my computer equipment, and live with the possible visual awkwardness of having a stand much narrower than the TV, with a 9.5" gap between the other Euros on either side.

2. Get a Salamander Synergy 30 and reconfig the system so the Mirage speakers flank the Synergy, with the Euros on the outside. This will move the Mirages closer to the setup suggested in the manual (6-8 ft. apart).

3. Get a Billy Bags 3003 rack (67" wide) and do the same as with the Salamander above.

4. Customize a Billy Bags Pro-54 to get proper shelf space.

5. Get any other BB rack that fits the available space and treat it as the Sanus EVAV above; the options are wider, though. http://www.billybags.com/selectionfr.html 

6. Get a custom-built stand from the people who made my bookcases.

7. Get a Quadraspire QAVX and do the same as the Salamander. The Quad holds 280kg per shelf.







http://www.quadraspire.com/ 


Billy Bags rack would be the most expensive option regardless of which one I chose, but at least the BBs more closely resemble the Euros. I am considering not just looks, but cost and "trouble factor" as well, meaning how much extra will I have to do to make things work. With the wider options the Sanus EFAV would have to be replaced by another single-width rack for access to the rear of the system.


We'll see what happens. I may even choose to live with things as is, though I'm not quite ready to do that.


----------



## BrolicBeast

As nice as the Quadraspires are, the Salamander Synergy might be a cost-effective (and easier) way to go too. I've seen some pretty attractive Synergies, and for the size rack you're looking for--they may be quite the catch.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast* /forum/post/21701432
> 
> 
> As nice as the Quadraspires are, the Salamander Synergy might be a cost-effective (and easier) way to go too. I've seen some pretty attractive Synergies, and for the size rack you're looking for--they may be quite the catch.



The Synergy, whether fully loaded or in a la carte mode, is the least expensive new rack option for sure. Of course, even the a la carte one weighs 170!


Space really _is_ the final frontier, it seems. Except for repurposing the EFAV (as above), all options require more space and that's problematic. At least I wouldn't have to stack anything with the wider racks, as each piece of gear could have its own shelf. A problem with my Oppo 83 (for which it was sent for repair a while back) may or may not have had to do with my Duo VP being stacked on top of it.


Maybe I could draw up a schematic of the room and play with layout possibilities. I've done that before. For now, I meaured it out and the wider racks mean the system gets uncomfortably close to the computer rack on the left side, making for more difficult access to the rear of the system and the LP cabinets behind it.


----------



## prepress

Ok. Given the rack options, all of which have their pluses and minuses, it's occurred to me that option 1 repurposing the Sanus EFAV makes the most sense for now. And, I could still go after the Salamander Synergy later if I want. But the Sanus move will allow me to go forward on several fronts, as I can begin resolving my power cord issues, I'll get to live with the layout for awhile to see if the gap between racks bothers me, and it will make it much easier to dust and clean in and around the system. So the next step is to do something about the Hooker cabinet. I'll make an attempt to donate it somewhere; failing that, I'll have it hauled away.


I'll need to get something to hold my computer-related setup, which will probably be another Sanus audio rack at this point. The only issue with that is whether I'll be able to cannibalize my current racks and save on buying additional shelves for the new one. Time to work on system configurations.


----------



## dharel

Hey prepress. Great setup. I enjoyed reading through this thread to date.


I noticed you're in Brooklyn. Where about? I'm on Long Island now, but grew up in Canarsie. Nice to see a fellow Brooklynite on the forums!!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dharel* /forum/post/21776196
> 
> 
> Hey prepress. Great setup. I enjoyed reading through this thread to date.
> 
> 
> I noticed you're in Brooklyn. Where about? I'm on Long Island now, but grew up in Canarsie. Nice to see a fellow Brooklynite on the forums!!



Hello dharel,


I live in Fort Greene now, having moved here from Prospect Heights back in 1996. But I'm originally from Nashville, TN. I came here for grad school (Pratt) and stuck around. I imagine Long Island is just as expensive, if not more so, as parts of Brooklyn are now.


I'm working on configurations for the all-Sanus setup, and however it may look, at least the racks will all match. Thanks for the visit and nice words. Older buildings get dusty very quickly, and having things more open will be a great incentive to dust more. The more I think about that, the more convinced I am I don't want any more closed racks. Even if I do go for the Salamander, it will probably be the a la carte version (no side panels or doors).


----------



## dharel




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress* /forum/post/21777051
> 
> 
> Hello dharel,
> 
> 
> I live in Fort Greene now, having moved here from Prospect Heights back in 1996. But I'm originally from Nashville, TN. I came here for grad school (Pratt) and stuck around. I imagine Long Island is just as expensive, if not more so, as parts of Brooklyn are now.
> 
> 
> I'm working on configurations for the all-Sanus setup, and however it may look, at least the racks will all match. Thanks for the visit and nice words. Older buildings get dusty very quickly, and having things more open will be a great incentive to dust more. The more I think about that, the more convinced I am I don't want any more closed racks. Even if I do go for the Salamander, it will probably be the a la carte version (no side panels or doors).



Yeah, Nassau County can be pretty $$$$. Haven't been to Fort Greene in quite some time, but I do remember I liked the area.


I know what you mean about dust, even in a house. Over time it has a very bad tendency to just settle on all my gear. I'm picky about who I let touch anything, so I'm the one usually stuck dusting every so often. Makes my wife happy!!!!!


----------



## prepress

I have ordered another Sanus Euro EFAB rack to use for the computer equipment. A friend says she wants the Hooker cabinet, and so once I get things arranged here the plan is for her to come over (with help) and take it away. Of course, I'll be expected to come and help her set her equipment up since I did it the first time.


The Quadraspire rack I had my eye on (the QAVX) isn't readily available in the US. It would be a special order and would take a while, according to the distributor (The Sound Organisation). It would be coming from England! Well, as I say, I'd have time to see how I like using the shorter Sanus EFAV (40").


Now, to begin clearing space in here.


----------



## prepress

I'm also now thinking about the small setup in my bedroom. Currently it's a Harmon Kardon receiver and an old (1992) California Audio Labs CD player. I have equipment that was displaced from my main setup (the Denon TU-800 tuner and Marantz DV8400 universal player). I also have a B&K Pro-10 preamp which was on loan forever and I finally got it back. I was thinking of getting a modest power amp to use with everything, perhaps a Marantz 7025.


If I'm sane I won't do it, but the 7025 could drive my main speakers should disaster strike. Really, I'm just killing time for things to move along in the main goal. Meantime, I did get this:











It will go on the TV. I may replace other cords with these when the new setup is final, as I'm thinking the PS Audio Jewels are stiffer than I'd like. I still need to get organized wit the friend who says she wants my Hooker TV console.


----------



## prepress

I must report that I'm getting cleaner, clearer sound on my 111 with the Stratus cord installed. More detail, especially with voices. I wasn't expecting that, but I'll take it. The sound's begun to smooth out a bit now, the transients and such are there but not as pronounced.


Plus, at least initially, the 60Hz hum due to the cable box is gone. Using an ISO-Max and a Viewsonic filter, channels left along with the hum. We'll see what happens as this new connection settles in.


----------



## prepress

The hum seems to come and go. Last time out it was absent. Keep in mind that this occurs when watching TV only. It goes away when I select another input on my Duo.


Meantime, I took advantage of a good deal and bought a pair of Wireworld Electra power cords to go on my 501s. This blows up my blue/green power cord scheme, but the deal was too good to ignore so I went for it. Still thinking about those Kimber PK10s, but for now that has to be put down.


----------



## prepress

Other news. The WW Electras have been in the setup for a few days and have only a few hours on them, but the system's sound is different. The top end has opened up noticeably, and it's an experience similar to what I heard when I first fired up the TV with the Stratus connected. What is more, the picture on the 111 is sharper now. Noticeably so, though I won't call it night and day. I've also gone back to HDMI from component on my cable box and I'm not sure that hasn't contributed a bit more, even though it's only 1 day for that change. i'll let things settle and see what happens.


I've replaced all my HDMIs with Pangea HD-26Ls and I like them. Watching a few episodes of _Hercules: The Legendary Journeys_ on DVD through my Oppo 83, I heard a cymbal during the main theme music over the closing credits which was buried in the mix before. More detail!


I'd really like to get the equipment rack resolved, but it will have to wait a bit longer, since I'm recovering from shoulder surgery and also still waiting on the friend who wants my Hooker console. She's yet to measure her space to see if the console will even fit. Oh, well.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22151375
> 
> 
> Watching a few episodes of _Hercules: The Legendary Journeys_ on DVD through my Oppo 83.



Man, I'm a huge Hercules Legendary Journeys fan! Season 5 was, without question, the most entertaining season of them all.


Are the Wire World cables available from any online source? Or are they dealer only?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22191403
> 
> 
> Man, I'm a huge Hercules Legendary Journeys fan! Season 5 was, without question, the most entertaining season of them all.
> 
> Are the Wire World cables available from any online source? Or are they dealer only?



The Cable Company sells Wireworld and just about everyone else. I've had good experience with them.

http://www.thecableco.com/category.aspx?cid=-1&mid=7104&gclid=CNDc7ZmXgrECFUlN4AodTwq3Cw 


Here's another link to authorized dealers from Wireworld's website.

http://www.easylocator.net/custom_report/report776/findwireworldonline 


I have _Hercules_ seasons one and two. I'm not sure I want to go for all of them, but I might check out season 5. The series ran six seasons if I remember correctly.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22191758
> 
> 
> The Cable Company sells Wireworld and just about everyone else. I've had good experience with them.
> http://www.thecableco.com/category.aspx?cid=-1&mid=7104&gclid=CNDc7ZmXgrECFUlN4AodTwq3Cw
> 
> Here's another link to authorized dealers from Wireworld's website.
> http://www.easylocator.net/custom_report/report776/findwireworldonline
> 
> I have _Hercules_ seasons one and two. I'm not sure I want to go for all of them, but I might check out season 5. The series ran six seasons if I remember correctly.



Thanks for that info....shortlybe using it shortly. Quick question: as a McIntosh owner, what are your thoughts on that organizations's MX121 processor? It seems to be the first decently priced processor, but I'd def like to hear the POV of a current McIntosh owner.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22192097
> 
> 
> Thanks for that info....shortlybe using it shortly. Quick question: as a McIntosh owner, what are your thoughts on that organizations's MX121 processor? It seems to be the first decently priced processor, but I'd def like to hear the POV of a current McIntosh owner.



Generally, one buys McIntosh for sound quality, build quality, resale value and, perhaps, "bling" factor. I have no complaints about my amps and SACD/CD player, looks or sound; both are awesome.


The MX121 is half the cost of the flagship 150, too, but still not cheap at 6K. If I had to have a tuner, a port for SiriusXM, a headphone jack, or front inputs, I'd look elsewhere. But if I were going to get a processor around this price range, the 121 might be it because it has all the basics and does everything _I'd_ need. I have a separate tuner, wouldn't use Audyssey in my space (despite the nice microphone). Some of the innards are borrowed from the Marantz AV7005 and modified, but the MX121 _isn't_ a Marantz clone by any means. The stuff that counts, such as audio boards, power supply, tank-like build, etc. are all McIntosh. I even thought about the 121 to use as a conventional preamp. I attached the MX121 brochure if you're curious.

MX121_New.pdf 1866k .pdf file


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22193324
> 
> 
> Generally, one buys McIntosh for sound quality, build quality, resale value and, perhaps, "bling" factor. I have no complaints about my amps and SACD/CD player, looks or sound; both are awesome.
> 
> The MX121 is half the cost of the flagship 150, too, but still not cheap at 6K. If I had to have a tuner, a port for SiriusXM, a headphone jack, or front inputs, I'd look elsewhere. But if I were going to get a processor around this price range, the 121 might be it because it has all the basics and does everything _I'd_ need. I have a separate tuner, wouldn't use Audyssey in my space (despite the nice microphone). Some of the innards are borrowed from the Marantz AV7005 and modified, but the MX121 _isn't_ a Marantz clone by any means. The stuff that counts, such as audio boards, power supply, tank-like build, etc. are all McIntosh. I even thought about the 121 to use as a conventional preamp. I attached the MX121 brochure if you're curious.
> MX121_New.pdf 1866k .pdf file



This is a great PreAmp....I think I may have found my long-term goal. 


BTW, I read in one of your previous posts that you're from NY. Which part? I'm from Queens (Jamaica).


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22199221
> 
> 
> This is a great PreAmp....I think I may have found my long-term goal.
> 
> BTW, I read in one of your previous posts that you're from NY. Which part? I'm from Queens (Jamaica).



Here's the _Home Theater_ review...
http://www.hometheater.com/content/dreaming-not-impossible-dream 


I live in Brooklyn, the Fort Greene section. Originally, though, I'm from Nashville, TN. I came here for grad school (Pratt) and am still here. Hadn't planned that, but God had other ideas, obviously.


----------



## prepress

Speaking of preamps, even though I haven't decided for sure to replace my current preamp, I seem to be in full research mode as if I will. Understand, I'm a 2-channel guy; that said, the latest contenders are these, in descending order according to price:


Audio Research LS27

McIntosh C50

McIntosh C2300

Bryston BP26 (with power supply)

McIntosh C48

Parasound JC 2

Parasound P7


The P7 is multichannel and has a built-in phono section, as do all the Macs. The LS27 and C2300 are tube units (that's right, I'm actually considering _tubes_). Let the winnowing process begin!


On another front, the friend who wants my Hooker cabinet informed me last night that her father has left earlier than planned. That means the equipment rack situation can move forward a bit. Both she and I have straightening up to do; my shoulder is still recovering from surgery so I'm a bit limited in what I can do as far as moving things around, but the first step is to deal with all the paper in here. It's a massive amount of sorting and shredding; to release some of my pent-up frustration with the continual stream maybe I'll _tear_ instead of _shred_. It's more satisfying.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22217564
> 
> 
> Speaking of preamps, even though I haven't decided for sure to replace my current preamp, I seem to be in full research mode as if I will. Understand, I'm a 2-channel guy; that said, the latest contenders are these, in descending order according to price:
> 
> Audio Research LS27
> 
> McIntosh C50
> 
> McIntosh C2300
> 
> Bryston BP26 (with power supply)
> 
> McIntosh C48
> 
> Parasound JC 2
> 
> Parasound P7
> 
> The P7 is multichannel and has a built-in phono section, as do all the Macs. The LS27 and C2300 are tube units (that's right, I'm actually considering _tubes_). Let the winnowing process begin!
> 
> On another front, the friend who wants my Hooker cabinet informed me last night that her father has left earlier than planned. That means the equipment rack situation can move forward a bit. Both she and I have straightening up to do; my shoulder is still recovering from surgery so I'm a bit limited in what I can do as far as moving things around, but the first step is to deal with all the paper in here. It's a massive amount of sorting and shredding; to release some of my pent-up frustration with the continual stream maybe I'll _tear_ instead of _shred_. It's more satisfying.



Those are awesome pre amps prepress, curious to see which one you will pick.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22245357
> 
> 
> Those are awesome pre amps prepress, curious to see which one you will pick.



Hello Franin,


It would be easier to decide something if my setup were the way I want it. As is, this is all theoretical. I'm beginning to think that, great as they are, the 2 tube units on that list aren't for me. I would surely have to buy a new equipment rack for the C2300, as it would have less than an inch of top clearance in my Sanus (the C50 would have only .375" top clearance, but I've been assured it generates next to no heat). The 3 Macs and the P7 have phono stages built in (the Macs are said to be quite good on that score; they all have the same phono stage). The JC 2 would almost certainly be followed by a Parasound JC 3 phono preamp, though I have an outboard phono preamp already; I'm sure the JC 3 is WAY better. But that would force a rack change also, or at least adding shelves to the existing racks. Based strictly on budget, I should get the P7. But again, none of this happens if I don't resolve the rack issue.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22246822
> 
> 
> Hello Franin,
> 
> It would be easier to decide something if my setup were the way I want it. As is, this is all theoretical. I'm beginning to think that, great as they are, the 2 tube units on that list aren't for me. I would surely have to buy a new equipment rack for the C2300, as it would have less than an inch of top clearance in my Sanus (the C50 would have only .375" top clearance, but I've been assured it generates next to no heat). The 3 Macs and the P7 have phono stages built in (the Macs are said to be quite good on that score; they all have the same phono stage). The JC 2 would almost certainly be followed by a Parasound JC 3 phono preamp, though I have an outboard phono preamp already; I'm sure the JC 3 is WAY better. But that would force a rack change also, or at least adding shelves to the existing racks. Based strictly on budget, I should get the P7. But again, none of this happens if I don't resolve the rack issue.



I've gone back a page to get updated on what's happening Charles regarding the rack issues, I think I have mentioned it awhile back, but have you ever looked at server racks? A good size one might able to fit all your equipment.


----------



## Franin

I've noticed you bought a furman? How do you find it?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22250602
> 
> 
> I've noticed you bought a furman? How do you find it?



I have two Furmans, actually. The SPR-20i voltage regulator, which most of the gear is plugged into, and it is plugged into a Elite-15PFi which is then plugged into the wall. This arrangement is so that I can take advantage of the 15PFi's 45A current reserve, but I don't think the amps are using it because the power consumption seems constant and I don't blast my music. The Furmans replaced a Tripplite LCR2400, and I am quite pleased with them. They offer automatic extreme voltage shutdown, connections for telephone, cable and satellite, plus the SPR has 20A capacity. They run VERY quiet, and don't run hot at all. I am pleased with them.


As for the server racks, I did notice Sanus has one, but wasn't sure it would work in my setup. I'd need at least 2, plus accommodation for a turntable and my TV (remember, this is only a one-bedroom apartment and I can't really put gear off to the side). Still, I didn't examine the Sanus closely, and maybe I'll give it another look, as Sanus has come out with new products recently.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22251305
> 
> 
> I have two Furmans, actually. The SPR-20i voltage regulator, which most of the gear is plugged into, and it is plugged into a Elite-15PFi which is then plugged into the wall. This arrangement is so that I can take advantage of the 15PFi's 45A current reserve, but I don't think the amps are using it because the power consumption seems constant and I don't blast my music. The Furmans replaced a Tripplite LCR2400, and I am quite pleased with them. They offer automatic extreme voltage shutdown, connections for telephone, cable and satellite, plus the SPR has 20A capacity. They run VERY quiet, and don't run hot at all. I am pleased with them.



I have the Furman 16Ei Premium SPR-Stable Power Regulator ( 240V ) I was told about the Elite series but never really looked into them. Thats a good arrangement you have there.


----------



## prepress

Franin,


It sounds like your SPR is an Australian equivalent of my SPR (except for the voltage). I hope you're finding yours to be as good as mine's been.


On another note, it may be time to stop doodling rack configurations on pieces of paper and actually construct a file I can play around with using to-scale pieces I can move around. Time, perhaps, to work on my InDesign skills.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22253076
> 
> 
> Franin,
> 
> It sounds like your SPR is an Australian equivalent of my SPR (except for the voltage). I hope you're finding yours to be as good as mine's been.
> 
> .



Touch wood!! mines been doing a good job.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22254619
> 
> 
> Touch wood!! mines been doing a good job.



Not to mention yours is bigger. Must be all that extra voltage.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22256054
> 
> 
> Not to mention yours is bigger. Must be all that extra voltage.



I thought there the same size . Just different models for different countries.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22256514
> 
> 
> I thought there the same size . Just different models for different countries.



Your model is a 220–240v version. My SPR 20i is a 120v model for the US and has smaller dimensions. Your unit is almost 6" tall; mine is about 4.25" (but it's 20A).


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22257316
> 
> 
> Your model is a 220–240v version. My SPR 20i is a 120v model for the US and has smaller dimensions. Your unit is almost 6" tall; mine is about 4.25" (but it's 20A).



Mine 16A if Im correct but i didn't realise the dimensions were different. Thanks for that prepress.


----------



## prepress

After seeing a post on another forum regarding a failed tube in the Mac C2300, I begin to lean away from tube units. I know that this is not a regular occurrence, but an occasional tube failure is always a possibility and that makes me uncomfortable. I'm not enough of an audiophile that I'd want to put up with that sort of thing, so if I do replace my ARC preamp, it will probably be with a C48, C50 or JC 2 (which is line stage only, so either my current Aragon or the JC 3 would be in play for phono). It's been those three from the beginning, really.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22262050
> 
> 
> After seeing a post on another forum regarding a failed tube in the Mac C2300, I begin to lean away from tube units. I know that this is not a regular occurrence, but an occasional tube failure is always a possibility and that makes me uncomfortable. I'm not enough of an audiophile that I'd want to put up with that sort of thing,



Don't blame you prepress. Apparently there are 6 tubes you will have to worry about, though im sure the sound will be phenomenal. How much will each tube cost? Im sure there not cheap.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/270#post_22264303
> 
> 
> Don't blame you prepress. Apparently there are 6 tubes you will have to worry about, though im sure the sound will be phenomenal. How much will each tube cost? Im sure there not cheap.



It depends upon which brand you want. I haven't found a price on the stock tubes, but most audiophile types are high on Gold Lion tubes, which would total about $270 for six of them. The type of tube apparently has a significant effect on sound and some are better than others. if I overruled myself and bought one of these, it would mean (based upon an average of 4 hours daily use, which is on the high side) replacing the tubes about every 5 years. With the ARC, the tubes are a bit more, but there are only two and they have shorter life spans, so that's $110 every three years.


My complaint with the 2300 is that there are two tubes which are serving no purpose which would nevertheless have to be replaced. There are two for the linestage, two each for the MM and MC phono inputs. I wouldn't use the MC input.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22264961
> 
> 
> It depends upon which brand you want. I haven't found a price on the stock tubes, but most audiophile types are high on Gold Lion tubes, which would total about $270 for six of them. The type of tube apparently has a significant effect on sound and some are better than others. if I overruled myself and bought one of these, it would mean (based upon an average of 4 hours daily use, which is on the high side) replacing the tubes about every 5 years. With the ARC, the tubes are a bit more, but there are only two and they have shorter life spans, so that's $110 every three years.
> 
> My complaint with the 2300 is that there are two tubes which are serving no purpose which would nevertheless have to be replaced. There are two for the linestage, two each for the MM and MC phono inputs. I wouldn't use the MC input.



$270 for six of them isnt too bad, but then again how good are they. But it will be annoying to replace tubes of an input you will never use.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22264969
> 
> 
> $270 for six of them isnt too bad, but then again how good are they. But it will be annoying to replace tubes of an input you will never use.



On the other hand, I could use the stock tubes as replacements, which means that three out of the five tube changes over the anticipated 20-year life of the component, I'm buying only four tubes. That would help.


Still, the first order of business is to deal with my room setup, beginning with a MASSIVE recycling effort.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22336385
> 
> 
> On the other hand, I could use the stock tubes as replacements, which means that three out of the five tube changes over the anticipated 20-year life of the component, I'm buying only four tubes. That would help.
> 
> Still, the first order of business is to deal with my room setup, beginning with a MASSIVE recycling effort.



How did you go with your MASSIVE recycling effort prepress?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22337437
> 
> 
> How did you go with your MASSIVE recycling effort prepress?



Nothing today, I had too much else to do. Just got home, in fact. Maybe a little at a time, or during my next vacation break. There's too much paper in here.


----------



## prepress

Reality has intruded on things in a big way, as it has a habit of doing. What started out as an equipment rack search and a hypothetical preamp search all but turned into an actual preamp search, and now will, perhaps, change again.


A friend of long acquaintance found herself in a deep financial quandry, and reached out to me for help (quite possibly she had nowhere else to go, based upon my knowledge of her general circumstances). I helped her with a loan of $3,000 last weekend. I know I won't get this back all at once or quickly, and there are repercussions to my audio (and perhaps other) plans.


Being $3K lighter in the wallet, my first thought was to get a C48 and be done, as it's the least expensive alternative and would give me what I want; $6000 for a C2300 makes less sense now, even if I audition and prefer it. But I could go forward with those auditions and if the C2300 really floats my boat, wait until my circumstances are more favorable and go for it (that could take a while). Or, all things considered, spending this kind of money doesn't make a lot of sense now, so I could go back to my original premise of replacing/upgrading my TV console. While this seems most sensible, there's no guarantee I'll follow through.


----------



## Scout's staff

Sounds like you made the right call helping someone out. We could all use some good karma once in a while. You still have a very nice system


----------



## pcweber111

I always have great respect for someone who is willing to do without to help those in need. You're a good man. The home theater stuff will work itself out.


----------



## prepress

Thanks for the kind words, guys. I've known this woman for twenty years, so there was no hesitation in helping; I just had to figure out how much. This is the same friend who wants my Hooker TV console, but told me the other day that, as much as she wants it, perhaps I should try to make it work with the system. I like it as a piece of furniture, but it's simply awkward with the kind of equipment I have, which was why I wanted to replace it to begin with.


First order of business is to clean up in here and then reassess. The preamp could wait (for now, anyway).


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22420816
> 
> 
> I always have great respect for someone who is willing to do without to help those in need. You're a good man. The home theater stuff will work itself out.



I agree.


----------



## prepress

The Parasound JC 2 is available factory-refurbished for about $500 off. That is _really_ tempting, and it's on my list. But getting it would be a near-automatic for the JC 3 phono preamp to compliment it, too (which was also available as a factory-refurb but apparently sold). Not sure I'd be comfortable dropping my checking account balance that much right now. Maybe if I stall enough, that JC 2 will sell and I'll be back to normal.


----------



## prepress

Something interesting last night.


Because it was so muggy, I had the air conditioner on. As I turned it off on my way to bed, I heard a click behind me, and thought nothing of it, just the Tripplite Smart 1500LCD voltage regulator on the computer stuff kicking in. But this AM, I noted that my Furman SPR-20i had gone into extreme voltage shutdown, and that was probably the click I heard; come to think of it, the sound _was_ different than the usual click of the Tripplite but I paid no real attention at the time. The SPR's red LED was on, verifying shut down. But, it's plugged into a Furman Elite-15PFi (which is plugged into the wall) and the Elite _didn't_ go into shutdown; it was still on. I sent an e-mail to Furman asking about this. None of the Tripplite equipment was affected, and it's plugged into the same duplex (a Smart 1500LCD plugged into a HT1210ISOCTR, which is plugged into the wall).


Con Ed was out in the street recently doing work, and that could be a factor. A few years ago they were out there and some things changed in here (pre-Furman). The A/C compressor kicked in a split-second before turn-off last night, so that's the moment this happened, but it is not typical. The A/C and my system are ostensibly on different lines though at opposite ends of the same room. This bears watching.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22445538
> 
> 
> Something interesting last night.
> 
> Because it was so muggy, I had the air conditioner on. As I turned it off on my way to bed, I heard a click behind me, and thought nothing of it, just the Tripplite Smart 1500LCD voltage regulator on the computer stuff kicking in. But this AM, I noted that my Furman SPR-20i had gone into extreme voltage shutdown, and that was probably the click I heard; come to think of it, the sound _was_ different than the usual click of the Tripplite but I paid no real attention at the time. The SPR's red LED was on, verifying shut down. But, it's plugged into a Furman Elite-15PFi (which is plugged into the wall) and the Elite _didn't_ go into shutdown; it was still on. I sent an e-mail to Furman asking about this.



Charles isnt the Furman SPR-20I meant to be plugged into the wall and the Elite -15PFI plugged into the SPR-20I ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22445627
> 
> 
> Charles isnt the Furman SPR-20I meant to be plugged into the wall and the Elite -15PFI plugged into the SPR-20I ?



Hypothetically, yes, but you can do it the other way also. Besides, Furman's guidelines are suggested, not mandatory. In fact, It was suggested to me to do it this way (by a Furman rep, though it was a while ago) so that I could take advantage of the Elite's 45A current reserve (though I'm not sure I need it.). I was told something similar by Tripplite and I had their LCR2400 plugged into an HT1210ISOCTR. The Elite is a 15A unit, whereas the SPR is a 20A unit. But since my system never plays above 4.7A, that's not an issue.


I suppose I could reverse things and put the SPR into the wall, and most of the components into the Elite; both are in the same rack and I do need the plugs available. I'd need a 20A-to-15A adapter plug if I wanted to keep the SPR where it is, then.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22446124
> 
> 
> Hypothetically, yes, but you can do it the other way also. Besides, Furman's guidelines are suggested, not mandatory. In fact, It was suggested to me to do it this way (by a Furman rep, though it was a while ago) so that I could take advantage of the Elite's 45A current reserve (though I'm not sure I need it.). I was told something similar by Tripplite and I had their LCR2400 plugged into an HT1210ISOCTR. The Elite is a 15A unit, whereas the SPR is a 20A unit. But since my system never plays above 4.7A, that's not an issue.
> 
> I suppose I could reverse things and put the SPR into the wall, and most of the components into the Elite; both are in the same rack and I do need the plugs available. I'd need a 20A-to-15A adapter plug if I wanted to keep the SPR where it is, then.



Oh ok. I'm going to look into getting the IT reference to plug into my power regulator it reduces hum. I can hear slight hum from 4 subwoofers and combined I can hear it easily.


----------



## prepress

An update on the shutdown issue:


Con Edison has been doing work on my block (to do transformer work I think, and replace some cables), and they suggested the over-voltage problems could be done with once they're finished. In the meantime, I see this morning the line is running 124-125V currently. Not a problem unless I need air conditioning.


The specs for the SPR and Elite 15PFi thresholds are different regarding the Extreme Voltage Shutdown feature. The SPR's is 135 +/- 5V, whereas the Elite's is 140 +/-3V. So the SPR is lower, probably explaining why it shuts down when the A/C compressor kicks in and not the Elite. Also, the Tripplite equipment my computer stuff runs on (again, same duplex) is similarly unaffected. Furman suggests troubleshooting further, starting with putting the SPR directly into the wall. I'm reluctant to do that because it's a reconfiguration hassle or will cost me to buy an adequate extension cord or 15A to 20A adapter. OR...run the SPR's power cord across the floor straight to the wall plug and connect via my Venom extension cord; no extra expense and a minor hassle only. Maybe I'll try that. Currently, the Elite is going to the wall via a Wireworld Stratus snaking behind my LP cabinets and connected to the wall via the Venom.


I've also noted that even though it's the same duplex, voltage between the two plugs varies. On the Tripplite setup, the Smart 1500LCD reads 124 and the HT1210 (which the 1500 is plugged into) reads 123 currently; the SPR reads 124 (the Elite has no readout). Sometimes the three units agree, sometimes not. At this _exact_ moment of typing they all read 124, but that won't last. And it didn't.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22515574
> 
> 
> An update on the shutdown issue:
> 
> Con Edison has been doing work on my block (to do transformer work I think, and replace some cables), and they suggested the over-voltage problems could be done with once they're finished. In the meantime, I see this morning the line is running 124-125V currently. Not a problem unless I need air conditioning.
> 
> The specs for the SPR and Elite 15PFi thresholds are different regarding the Extreme Voltage Shutdown feature. The SPR's is 135 +/- 5V, whereas the Elite's is 140 +/-3V. So the SPR is lower, probably explaining why it shuts down when the A/C compressor kicks in and not the Elite. Also, the Tripplite equipment my computer stuff runs on (again, same duplex) is similarly unaffected. Furman suggests troubleshooting further, starting with putting the SPR directly into the wall. I'm reluctant to do that because it's a reconfiguration hassle or will cost me to buy an adequate extension cord or 15A to 20A adapter. OR...run the SPR's power cord across the floor straight to the wall plug and connect via my Venom extension cord; no extra expense and a minor hassle only. Maybe I'll try that. Currently, the Elite is going to the wall via a Wireworld Stratus snaking behind my LP cabinets and connected to the wall via the Venom.
> 
> I've also noted that even though it's the same duplex, voltage between the two plugs varies. On the Tripplite setup, the Smart 1500LCD reads 124 and the HT1210 (which the 1500 is plugged into) reads 123 currently; the SPR reads 124 (the Elite has no readout). Sometimes the three units agree, sometimes not. At this _exact_ moment of typing they all read 124, but that won't last. And it didn't.



Have you ever considered the PS Audio? I was told good things about them but they can only handle so much. Im surprised that the Elite is able to handle slightly more than the SPR. I was going to go for the reference but was told it wont eliminate any hum.


How long before the works are finished?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22525391
> 
> 
> Have you ever considered the PS Audio? I was told good things about them but they can only handle so much. Im surprised that the Elite is able to handle slightly more than the SPR. I was going to go for the reference but was told it wont eliminate any hum.
> 
> How long before the works are finished?



I don't know, actually. I didn't think to ask. There's no one out there working now, but there's a small area up the street that doesn't look finished. Voltage is still running in the 123–126V range. This will be a problem when it's time for air conditioning. I suppose I could relocate the SPR and then extend it around the wall to the kitchen, which is presumably on another line; I did it once before, but that was pre-Furman.


----------



## Waboman

Hey there, prepress.


Here's hoping Sandy isn't too rough on you guys. Get out the sandbags and protect all that wonderful gear.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22532355
> 
> 
> Hey there, prepress.
> 
> Here's hoping Sandy isn't too rough on you guys. Get out the sandbags and protect all that wonderful gear.



Thanks, Waboman. The latest models have the center moving over central/southern New Jersey, which is bad for this area if it works that way; the costal flooding would be worse because of all that water being pushed into the harbor. Having to go to work on Monday, when the worst of it comes, will be NO fun. So I will be continuing my prayers for sure. In fact, I started yesterday.


----------



## Franin

Holy smoke I've only just learnt that you guys are expecting a hurricane. More important than anything stay safe prepress. My prayers are with you guys.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22533393
> 
> 
> Holy smoke I've only just learnt that you guys are expecting a hurricane. More important than anything stay safe prepress. My prayers are with you guys.



If public transportation is shut down (as it was with Irene) my only alternatives for getting to work would be to hope I can snag a cab or walk. It's about a 1-hour walk on a _good_ day, which neither Monday nor Tuesday will be. Lots to pray about.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22533511
> 
> 
> If public transportation is shut down (as it was with Irene) my only alternatives for getting to work would be to hope I can snag a cab or walk. It's about a 1-hour walk on a _good_ day, which neither Monday nor Tuesday will be. Lots to pray about.



Would you still have to go to work ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22533607
> 
> 
> Would you still have to go to work ?



Theoretically, yes, but I'm hoping to find out more. If the weather's as bad tomorrow and Tuesday as the forecasters all say, it could actually be dangerous to be out. And public transportation has begun to shut down. Subways started shutting down at 7:00PM, buses will start at 9:00PM tonight.


----------



## pcweber111

Well regardless be careful. Weather can be a tricky mistress. No need to risk it if you don't have to.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22535697
> 
> 
> Well regardless be careful. Weather can be a tricky mistress. No need to risk it if you don't have to.



Exactly


----------



## prepress

Well, last night I called the director, having sent an e-mail earlier to both he and the shop's manager. The unofficial suggestion was to stay home. Apparently something similar was being told to other workers too. I imagine those who, like me, rely on public transportation especially. A nearly 60-minute walk in what are unstable conditions would be unsafe, of course, and it'll be the same scenario tomorrow plus the weather is supposed to be worse then. This AM, other than a big gust a few minutes ago it's not been too bad.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22536531
> 
> 
> Well, last night I called the director, having sent an e-mail earlier to both he and the shop's manager. The unofficial suggestion was to stay home. Apparently something similar was being told to other workers too. I imagine those who, like me, rely on public transportation especially. A nearly 60-minute walk in what are unstable conditions would be unsafe, of course, and it'll be the same scenario tomorrow plus the weather is supposed to be worse then. This AM, other than a big gust a few minutes ago it's not been too bad.



Do you live near the water prepress? I heard on the news the people that live near the water could expect waves crashing into their homes


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22533607
> 
> 
> Would you still have to go to work ?





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22535481
> 
> 
> Theoretically, yes, but I'm hoping to find out more. If the weather's as bad tomorrow and Tuesday as the forecasters all say, it could actually be dangerous to be out. And public transportation has begun to shut down. Subways started shutting down at 7:00PM, buses will start at 9:00PM tonight.



Hey man, my father put it best as we discussed storm-prep strategies: "Never put yourself in danger for a job. Job's can replace you if you're injured or worse, but you cannot replace your health and well-being." My father is from the Caribbean island of Jamaica where Tropical Storms and hurricanes occur far more frequently, so when he offers storm advice, I make sure I listen. My family is up there in NY (Queens) too, praying that this storm does minimal damage.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300#post_22537086
> 
> 
> Hey man, my father put it best as we discussed storm-prep strategies: "Never put yourself in danger for a job. Job's can replace you if you're injured or worse, but you cannot replace your health and well-being." My father is from the Caribbean island of Jamaica where Tropical Storms and hurricanes occur far more frequently, so when he offers storm advice, I make sure I listen. My family is up there in NY (Queens) too, praying that this storm does minimal damage.



+1


----------



## prepress

Thanks for the well-wishes. I don't live very near the water, and am not in any evacuation zones, though I am just outside of the lower-level (less prone) zones. The high school across the street (Brooklyn Tech) is an evacuation center, in fact. From my apartment building it's about a half-hour walk to the Brooklyn Heights Promenade, which overlooks the harbor.


As I type the wind gusts are becoming more frequent, though the sustained winds aren't much higher than earlier, but they are getting higher. And the rain's not that heavy yet, more like a strong drizzle. That will all change, I suspect, in a couple of hours or so. I wanted some music, so I started playing some LPs; for how long I don't know. I figure if the power goes out while I'm listening it's easier to shut down the system. Having to take a CD or DVD out of a player is much more involved than simply taking the LP off the turntable. Besides, I just lubricated the spindle and want it to get some work. Andres Segovia, to be followed by Marcus Roberts.


Down in Battery Park (lower Manhattan) the talk was of surge which could reach farther inland than Irene did. In the same area last year, Irene left about a foot and a half of water at the promenade there; Sandy could leave a lot more than that and well beyond the promenade. Glad I don't live that close to water. As I said elsewhere, for me prayer, preparation and patience are key in situations like this. I continue to pray, trust preparation was adequate, and need patience to deal with whatever comes.


Brolic, how's DC doing?


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22537792
> 
> 
> Thanks for the well-wishes. I don't live very near the water, and am not in any evacuation zones, though I am just outside of the lower-level (less prone) zones. The high school across the street (Brooklyn Tech) is an evacuation center, in fact. From my apartment building it's about a half-hour walk to the Brooklyn Heights Promenade, which overlooks the harbor.
> 
> As I type the wind gusts are becoming more frequent, though the sustained winds aren't much higher than earlier, but they are getting higher. And the rain's not that heavy yet, more like a strong drizzle. That will all change, I suspect, in a couple of hours or so. I wanted some music, so I started playing some LPs; for how long I don't know. I figure if the power goes out while I'm listening it's easier to shut down the system. Having to take a CD or DVD out of a player is much more involved than simply taking the LP off the turntable. Besides, I just lubricated the spindle and want it to get some work. Andres Segovia, to be followed by Marcus Roberts.
> 
> Down in Battery Park (lower Manhattan) the talk was of surge which could reach farther inland than Irene did. In the same area last year, Irene left about a foot and a half of water at the promenade there; Sandy could leave a lot more than that and well beyond the promenade. Glad I don't live that close to water. As I said elsewhere, for me prayer, preparation and patience are key in situations like this. I continue to pray, trust preparation was adequate, and need patience to deal with whatever comes.
> 
> Brolic, how's DC doing?



Glad you're not too close to the water.From the live coverage on weather.com (the internet has become an invaluable news tool since i "cut the cord"), it looks like physical damage is already starting on the coastlines (gutters, shutters, etc.)


Down here in the DC area, there is a high likelihood of flooding in the city. Thankfully, I'm out of the city and in a DC suburb where the likelihood of flooding is a bit less severe. The wind speed will be dangerous for everyone down here though. The governon has shut down the Susquehanna bridge (effectively, shutting down the functionality of I-95, since that's a mandatory bridge on that highway for north and southbound travelers. The branches on the trees in my front and back yard seem a little shaky. They survived Irene last year, but they may be ready to call it quits with this storm. It looks like southern New Jersey is receiving the worst of this storm at the moment.


I'm hearing that NY's battery tunnel will likely flood tonight at 9pm (high tide) I hope Mr. Bloomberg shuts down key highways (if he hasn't already done so).


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22538088
> 
> 
> Glad you're not too close to the water.From the live coverage on weather.com (the internet has become an invaluable news tool since i "cut the cord"), it looks like physical damage is already starting on the coastlines (gutters, shutters, etc.)
> 
> Down here in the DC area, there is a high likelihood of flooding in the city. Thankfully, I'm out of the city and in a DC suburb where the likelihood of flooding is a bit less severe. The wind speed will be dangerous for everyone down here though. The governon has shut down the Susquehanna bridge (effectively, shutting down the functionality of I-95, since that's a mandatory bridge on that highway for north and southbound travelers. The branches on the trees in my front and back yard seem a little shaky. They survived Irene last year, but they may be ready to call it quits with this storm. It looks like southern New Jersey is receiving the worst of this storm at the moment.
> 
> I'm hearing that NY's battery tunnel will likely flood tonight at 9pm (high tide) I hope Mr. Bloomberg shuts down key highways (if he hasn't already done so).



Add Yes to my LP list above. How's that for diversity in one session?


The Lincoln Tunnel is the only tunnel open here. The last main bridge closed at 7:00PM. There are power outages, most of them in Queens and Staten Island; no surprise there, as many of their power lines are overhead. Con Ed may shut down some substations in lower Manhattan and south Brooklyn to protect their equipment.


Good that you're mostly out of the way of any serious flooding. As for those trees, I hope they're not too close to the house. Even small branches could do some damage if the wind's strong enough.


I just had a sick thought. I've had no complaint about my Mirage M-3si speakers, and have had them since 1993, but was wondering what getting some with deeper bass would do. The Mirages go down to 30Hz, more than respectable (24Hz if I had an anechoic chamber), but I was just thinking. Just thinking.


----------



## Franin

I heard the subway had shutdown power due floods? Stay safe.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22539832
> 
> 
> I heard the subway had shutdown power due floods? Stay safe.



Yes, the transportation system was shutdown on Sunday in order to protect the equipment. With the storm, seven East River subway tunnels are flooded. It's not clear when they'll be operational again. The MTA chairman is hopeful the buses will be back up and running sometime tomorrow. For me personally, my cable/high speed went down last night; it came back this AM.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22539858
> 
> 
> Yes, the transportation system was shutdown on Sunday in order to protect the equipment. With the storm, seven East River subway tunnels are flooded. It's not clear when they'll be operational again. The MTA chairman is hopeful the buses will be back up and running sometime tomorrow. For me personally, my cable/high speed went down last night; it came back this AM.



Well thats good news, hopefully.


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles, how's everything? Hopefully you're all right...


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22544384
> 
> 
> Hey Charles, how's everything? Hopefully you're all right...



+1 as ddtgr says is everything ok Charles, I saw the devastation on the news


----------



## prepress

i am okay, but tired. Yesterday was a long day for the first day back at work, and though last night I slept better than the night before, I haven't recovered fully.


Down the block a large tree was knocked over and took out a car as well as a significant part of the sidewalk. Up by my part of the block a few branches were taken off trees. All in all I am blessed.


----------



## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22549470
> 
> 
> i am okay, but tired. Yesterday was a long day for the first day back at work, and though last night I slept better than the night before, I haven't recovered fully.
> 
> Down the block a large tree was knocked over and took out a car as well as a significant part of the sidewalk. Up by my part of the block a few branches were taken off trees. All in all I am blessed.



Charles, it's really good to hear that...


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22550629
> 
> 
> Charles, it's really good to hear that...



Other than the cable/internet outage Monday evening into Tuesday morning and a few flickering lights (mostly Tuesday), I came through okay. I did buy food I don't usually buy in anticipation of possible power loss, and now have to eat it. Peanut butter!


I worked late two nights in a row and now have to go in tomorrow morning at 6:00AM! I'm hoping to get to bed extra early tonight.


----------



## Waboman

Hey there, prepress.


Glad to hear things are slowly returning to normal for you. Peanut butter rocks. I like to sneak a mini chocolate bar from my kids Halloween bag and dip it in the PB. Kinda like a homemade Reese's peanut butter cup.


----------



## prepress

NYC Transit's main HQ (lower Manhattan) was damaged by the storm, and as a result the servers are all down and the building is toxic. We at the print shop can't access work. There was no backup server, or if so it was damaged also. We are working staggered shifts at the print shop, and my hours are now 11A – 7P until things are back to normal; this could last three weeks or so I've heard.


I'll need to figure out how to squeeze in some tunes here and there. The system just sits there lately. Any DVD viewing has been through my Oppo 83 straight to the TV because it's faster. I watched the final battle sequence from _The Avengers_ Friday. It's _still_ good! The scene where the blonde waitress looks back at Captain America after he's stopped the aliens from blowing the bank up where she and others were cornered—there's something about that expression on her face that's powerful (touching?) to me; she actually makes me feel that.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22564600
> 
> 
> NYC Transit's main HQ (lower Manhattan) was damaged by the storm, and as a result the servers are all down and the building is toxic. We at the print shop can't access work. There was no backup server, or if so it was damaged also. We are working staggered shifts at the print shop, and my hours are now 11A – 7P until things are back to normal; this could last three weeks or so I've heard.



What were your regular hours Charles? Not a good time to walk to work


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22564760
> 
> 
> What were your regular hours Charles? Not a good time to walk to work



7AM to 3PM, which I've been put back on after only two days. It's been a wild time for sure. Yesterday they had us leave early due to the impending storm, so I didn't get a full day in; but I have so much comp time in the bank, it's no big deal to use some of it for the couple of hours I missed.


Tomorrow something different: jury duty.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22570097
> 
> 
> 7AM to 3PM, which I've been put back on after only two days. It's been a wild time for sure. Yesterday they had us leave early due to the impending storm, so I didn't get a full day in; but I have so much comp time in the bank, it's no big deal to use some of it for the couple of hours I missed.
> 
> Tomorrow something different: jury duty.



It's good to see they put you back on your regular time. I've never done Jury Duty before how's it like ? Is the case interesting ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22576543
> 
> 
> It's good to see they put you back on your regular time. I've never done Jury Duty before how's it like ? Is the case interesting ?



It's already over. I was selected to interview as a possible alternate on a civil case, but was excused since it involved a NYC Transit bus driver and I work for NYC Transit. I don't have to go back for at least 8 years. The laws have changed, apparently.


Last night I watched a bit of _The Avengers_, _Yes Live at Montreaux_, and an episode of _Justice League Unlimited_. Fun.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22577219
> 
> 
> It's already over. I was selected to interview as a possible alternate on a civil case, but was excused since it involved a NYC Transit bus driver and I work for NYC Transit. I don't have to go back for at least 8 years. The laws have changed, apparently.
> 
> Last night I watched a bit of _The Avengers_, _Yes Live at Montreaux_, and an episode of _Justice League Unlimited_. Fun.



How many times have you seen the Avengers now? I cant wait to see Justice League version but Batmans replacement will have a some big shoes to fill.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22577227
> 
> 
> How many times have you seen the Avengers now? I cant wait to see Justice League version but Batmans replacement will have a some big shoes to fill.



I was afraid someone would ask. I've watched the movie twice, once in theater and once at home. But I've watched the final battle perhaps 5 times. One of the priceless moments to me is the scene where, after Captain America has just saved the people trapped in the bank, the blond waitress looks back at Captain America as she's led away to safety by the firefighter. The expression on her face is absolutely poignant and powerful.


I've read there's a _Justice League_ movie coming. A big key will be who they get to play the roles. I don't think they can afford to go with complete unknowns; they'll need some moderately known names at least. And for Wonder Woman, they'll need someone who looks the part, i.e. athletic, with a bit of muscle perhaps. She _is_ an amazon, after all.


----------



## pcweber111

I don't have a good feeling about a Justice League movie. Marvel did it right by setting up the Avengers with prior movies of the main stars. Seems DC is rushing this a bit. We've had good Batman movies so far (although I've heard he'll be recast for any Justice League movie), one so-so Superman movie (not counting the old ones and can't speak for the new one yet) and a pretty sub-par Green Lantern movie. No Wonder Woman movie either(I can't believe they'd just introduce such an important character without her own set-up movie). I don't mind us not seeing Flash or Martian Manhunter yet (they're the equivalent of Black Widow and Hawkeye and can be introduced in another movie) but I don't know, they need to really get a WW and decent Green Lantern movie out. They're too important to just say "tada, here they are". Marvel has been kicking all sorts of ass with their movies so DC has it's hands full that's for sure.


As for the final scene fight scene in Avengers, personally I prefer the first helicarrier scene. It's not the team really working together mind you but I like seeing the Hulk make his appearance and fight with Thor. Speaking of, Thor 2? Yes please.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22578770
> 
> 
> I don't have a good feeling about a Justice League movie. Marvel did it right by setting up the Avengers with prior movies of the main stars. Seems DC is rushing this a bit. We've had good Batman movies so far (although I've heard he'll be recast for any Justice League movie), one so-so Superman movie (not counting the old ones and can't speak for the new one yet) and a pretty sub-par Green Lantern movie. No Wonder Woman movie either(I can't believe they'd just introduce such an important character without her own set-up movie). I don't mind us not seeing Flash or Martian Manhunter yet (they're the equivalent of Black Widow and Hawkeye and can be introduced in another movie) but I don't know, they need to really get a WW and decent Green Lantern movie out. They're too important to just say "tada, here they are". Marvel has been kicking all sorts of ass with their movies so DC has it's hands full that's for sure.
> 
> As for the final scene fight scene in Avengers, personally I prefer the first helicarrier scene. It's not the team really working together mind you but I like seeing the Hulk make his appearance and fight with Thor. Speaking of, Thor 2? Yes please.


_Thor 2_ is coming. As are _Iron Man 3_ and another Captain America. Of course, another _Avengers_ movie will happen.


As for _Justice League_, the three probable prinicpals (Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman) are very well known and may not need much set-up. But I agree, the purpose for the individual movies was to set up _Avengers_. Main DC characters are pretty well known, and arguably better known than some of Marvel's; they don't necessarily need a lot of setup. Will they go for the hard-core fans, or try for the broader audience (in which case they may well need to do some preliminary work [movies])? I'd think if lesser-known characters are involved, such as Martian Manhunter, _some_ backstory would be needed.


----------



## pcweber111

Yeah I agree the DC heroes are more iconic and thus don't necessarily need more back story before introduction but I'd feel a little cheated personally to not get a WW movie before hand. Plus this doesn't really even touch on the fact that up until now there's really been no connection between any of the super heroes in their movies outside of a mention of metropolis in Dark Knight Rising and I think that's it. It's not much to build on compared to Marvels efforts or the awesome animated JLA series. I'd personally take a good animated movie or a full length movie of the opening cinematic to that DC mmo. That was pure awesomeness.


----------



## prepress

Interesting article.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/11/opinion/sunday/why-listening-is-so-much-more-than-hearing.html?_r=0


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22579165
> 
> 
> Yeah I agree the DC heroes are more iconic and thus don't necessarily need more back story before introduction but I'd feel a little cheated personally to not get a WW movie before hand. Plus this doesn't really even touch on the fact that up until now there's really been no connection between any of the super heroes in their movies outside of a mention of metropolis in Dark Knight Rising and I think that's it. It's not much to build on compared to Marvels efforts or the awesome animated JLA series. I'd personally take a good animated movie or a full length movie of the opening cinematic to that DC mmo. That was pure awesomeness.



I would welcome a _Wonder Woman_ movie myself. But with their recent reboot of the entire comics line, some DC characters' storylines and histories aren't the same as before. Now, Wonder Woman isn't born from clay, she's the daughter of Hippolyta and Zeus. So that would need to be explained if her origin is part of the mix. Or they could do it like the recent animated movie, and just start on the island with the amazons. Of course, I don't remember the old TV series explaining anything, we just had WW here fighting Nazis.


I'd say DC also doesn't want to appear to copycat Marvel's approach, so they're in a bit of a spot. Still, even absent a systematic approach with "prequel" movies, a JLA movie could be pulled off.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22578392
> 
> 
> I was afraid someone would ask. I've watched the movie twice, once in theater and once at home. But I've watched the final battle perhaps 5 times. One of the priceless moments to me is the scene where, after Captain America has just saved the people trapped in the bank, the blond waitress looks back at Captain America as she's led away to safety by the firefighter. The expression on her face is absolutely poignant and powerful.
> 
> I've read there's a _Justice League_ movie coming. A big key will be who they get to play the roles. I don't think they can afford to go with complete unknowns; they'll need some moderately known names at least. And for Wonder Woman, they'll need someone who looks the part, i.e. athletic, with a bit of muscle perhaps. She _is_ an amazon, after all.



It will be intresting to see who plays Wonder Woman


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22578770
> 
> 
> I don't have a good feeling about a Justice League movie. Marvel did it right by setting up the Avengers with prior movies of the main stars. Seems DC is rushing this a bit. We've had good Batman movies so far (although I've heard he'll be recast for any Justice League movie), one so-so Superman movie (not counting the old ones and can't speak for the new one yet) and a pretty sub-par Green Lantern movie. No Wonder Woman movie either(I can't believe they'd just introduce such an important character without her own set-up movie). I don't mind us not seeing Flash or Martian Manhunter yet (they're the equivalent of Black Widow and Hawkeye and can be introduced in another movie) but I don't know, they need to really get a WW and decent Green Lantern movie out. They're too important to just say "tada, here they are". Marvel has been kicking all sorts of ass with their movies so DC has it's hands full that's for sure.



I have to agree with that, Wonder Woman needs her own movie as well as Green Latern needs a reboot (esp if Ryan Renolds become Batman)


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22578967
> 
> _Thor 2_ is coming. As are _Iron Man 3_ and another Captain America. Of course, another _Avengers_ movie will happen.



Im looking forward to these releases more than what DC is going to dish out.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22580133
> 
> 
> Im looking forward to these releases more than what DC is going to dish out.



You can be sure that Thanos teaser at the end of _Avengers_ will pick up in another movie. My first guess would be _Thor 2_, as the next _Avengers_ might be too far away.


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles,


Talking about Joshua Bell! My wife and I saw him on Sat night at the Mondavi Center, no mics, just him and the piano guy, it was absolutely amazing. We had great seats, too, only about 50 feet away...


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22581286
> 
> 
> Hey Charles,
> 
> Talking about Joshua Bell! My wife and I saw him on Sat night at the Mondavi Center, no mics, just him and the piano guy, it was absolutely amazing. We had great seats, too, only about 50 feet away...



Very good.







Congratulations on good seats _and_ a good performance as well. How big was the auditorium? Not too big I guess, if they could get away with no mics. Unamplified acoustic instruments. Nice.


I saw McCoy Tyner back on 10/27, along with Dave Holland, Jack DeJohnette and Grady Tate. Really good.


----------



## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22581792
> 
> 
> Very good.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Congratulations on good seats _and_ a good performance as well. How big was the auditorium? Not too big I guess, if they could get away with no mics. Unamplified acoustic instruments. Nice.
> 
> I saw McCoy Tyner back on 10/27, along with Dave Holland, Jack DeJohnette and Grady Tate. Really good.



Seats 1,800 people, but it was designed with acoustics in mind. Sounds phenomenal.


Those are great names, and McCoy's playing is insane. It's always nice to see these guys play...


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/330#post_22580761
> 
> 
> You can be sure that Thanos teaser at the end of _Avengers_ will pick up in another movie. My first guess would be _Thor 2_, as the next _Avengers_ might be too far away.



Well I will be definitley going to see whichever they bring out first and the rest in the movies, I never did with any of them apart from Avengers which I saw twice.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22583164
> 
> 
> Seats 1,800 people, but it was designed with acoustics in mind. Sounds phenomenal.
> 
> Those are great names, and McCoy's playing is insane. It's always nice to see these guys play...



Yes, it was my first time seeing McCoy Tyner. They did have to help him up and down the short staircase leading up to the stage, though.


The theater you saw Joshua Bell in sounds like a great place to hear music of many kinds. The sound may be worth going to see people you're less familiar with, even. Good sound can make up for lack of familiarity. As long as it's a type of music you like in general and the tickets aren't too steep.


----------



## BrolicBeast

You you guys are awesome for knowing about Thanos! Seeing that wicked grin during the credits for Avengers was absolutely spine-tingling...in a good way!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22588993
> 
> 
> You you guys are awesome for knowing about Thanos! Seeing that wicked grin during the credits for Avengers was absolutely spine-tingling...in a good way!



Someone mentioned that there was an Infinity Gauntlet on display during one scene in _Thor_. I suppose I'll have to watch _Thor_ again to see if I can find it. While Jim Starlin wasn't my favorite artist, he ws the right guy to draw Thanos. I remember reading _Captain Marvel_ and the battles those two had.


----------



## prepress

Just so you know how little progress I've made...

 


The setup is only slightly different. It's hard to see, but the top shelf on the left rack has only the Duo VP on it; the Oppo 83 is now inside the main cabinet. When I (finally) get around to it, I will move the Hooker console out and substitute my EFAV, seen partially to the left of the left speaker, in its place. I also have some 5" pillars to shorten each EFAB, as the shorter equipment will go on the outside racks and the EFAV will hold the taller stuff. Or if I really do keep the Hooker, the Duo will go inside (where the EDGE before it was) and the VPI SDS turntable conditioner (2nd shelf on the right rack) will go back in there as well. Then, one of the Furmans can go off to the new computer rack (another Sanus EFAB, seen partially at the bottom left and waiting to go) nearer the outlet.


Housekeeping hasn't been a priority with the events of the last two weeks, so excuse the mess.


----------



## Franin

How are you finding the Duo Charles? I wrote an email to DVDO asking if there will be anymore updates but they were not much help. I dont think Ken works with them anymore.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22593860
> 
> 
> How are you finding the Duo Charles? I wrote an email to DVDO asking if there will be anymore updates but they were not much help. I dont think Ken works with them anymore.



The Duo has been good for my modest needs, as a hub and as a processor to help out low-res sources. The Lumagen would be a bit better, but is more money; the model I'd use (XS) has a MSRP of $1,999 vs. the Duo's $1,299 and is more complex to set up. You have a bona-fide home theater whereas I have a stereo with video attached.


As for Duo updates, I didn't do the very last one, as I have no 3D capability (or interest) here, so the passthru feature wouldn't mean anything to me. The CMS is nice to have, even though I've not really explored it much. The Lumagen XS would be part of an "ultimate fantasy" system if I were to put one together (the higher-end XD is $2,999 but doesn't do anything I need over the XS, that I know of). But the Duo works for everything my simple tastes require.


----------



## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22592793
> 
> 
> Just so you know how little progress I've made...
> 
> 
> The setup is only slightly different. It's hard to see, but the top shelf on the left rack has only the Duo VP on it; the Oppo 83 is now inside the main cabinet. When I (finally) get around to it, I will move the Hooker console out and substitute my EFAV, seen partially to the left of the left speaker, in its place. I also have some 5" pillars to shorten each EFAB, as the shorter equipment will go on the outside racks and the EFAV will hold the taller stuff. Or if I really do keep the Hooker, the Duo will go inside (where the EDGE before it was) and the VPI SDS turntable conditioner (2nd shelf on the right rack) will go back in there as well. Then, one of the Furmans can go off to the new computer rack (another Sanus EFAB, seen partially at the bottom left and waiting to go) nearer the outlet.
> 
> Housekeeping hasn't been a priority with the events of the last two weeks, so excuse the mess.



Charles, the setup looks great!


The Elite looks good,, I'm really happy with mine and it still is an incredible display even after all these years.


When you get a chance, can you upgrade your first page to reflect the latest addition, perhaps add this pic? Those Macs need to be in plain view, LOL...


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22595139
> 
> 
> Charles, the setup looks great!
> 
> The Elite looks good,, I'm really happy with mine and it still is an incredible display even after all these years.
> 
> When you get a chance, can you upgrade your first page to reflect the latest addition, perhaps add this pic? Those Macs need to be in plain view, LOL...



I agree with Dan


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22595139
> 
> 
> Charles, the setup looks great!
> 
> The Elite looks good,, I'm really happy with mine and it still is an incredible display even after all these years.
> 
> When you get a chance, can you upgrade your first page to reflect the latest addition, perhaps add this pic? Those Macs need to be in plain view, LOL...





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22596324
> 
> 
> I agree with Dan



Actually, there is a photo in post 39 from the day they arrived that I could put up front which wouldn't do any damage as far as responses go, as no one quoted that post in its entirety. It may be odd from a continuity standpoint, as up until that post things are based on the B&Ks I had prior. On the other hand, it could be like the biblical book of Genesis, which gives a summary statement up front and then proceeds to detail the process. Or, update that post to reference #39. I'll think about this one. Meantime, I will go back and update the equipment list in post 39.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/30#post_19238017
> 
> 
> Gentlemen:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And about 10 minutes after the install guys left, FedEx showed up:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going to use the stock cords for a couple of days to get used to them, before swapping out for the Pangeas. If I don't hear an appreciable difference I'll send the Pangeas back and just get a longer cable to replace the one that's too short. Or just run it through the heavy-duty strip as I'm doing now, to get it to the LCR2400. More later.
> 
> 
> Thus, the initial equipment list changes. The McIntosh MC501s replace the B&K M-200 Sonatas, and the Pangea power cords will replace the stock cords on the 501s.



That's an awesome setup Charles. You have an amazing system, I love it.


----------



## prepress

Here's another one of the latest setup whilst I am again in straighten-up mode. That's my recycle basket on the lower right. Boy, does it get work!


----------



## Franin

You certainly have the gear Charles, top notch too.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22599245
> 
> 
> You certainly have the gear Charles, top notch too.



It works for me to be sure, though I'm having a bit of trouble with my turntable at the moment. For video I'm pleased, as I don't have room or desire for anything fancy in here. Still thinking about a preamp replacement, though real-world concerns will likely shelve that for a while.


----------



## pcweber111




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300_100#post_22589351
> 
> 
> Someone mentioned that there was an Infinity Gauntlet on display during one scene in _Thor_. I suppose I'll have to watch _Thor_ again to see if I can find it. While Jim Starlin wasn't my favorite artist, he ws the right guy to draw Thanos. I remember reading _Captain Marvel_ and the battles those two had.


 The Infinity Gauntlet was shown in the trophy room during the first Ice Giant "theft" scene.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22613345
> 
> The Infinity Gauntlet was shown in the trophy room during the first Ice Giant "theft" scene.



Aha. Of course, we're assuming that's what it is. Certainly looks like it. And, if a spoiler alert I saw means anything, the next _Thor_ won't necessarily be where we see Thanos. It could well be the next _Avengers_. The next Thor, titled _Thor: The Dark World_, has to do with dark elves and battles in Asgard and perhaps everywhere else.

http://screenrant.com/thor-2-synopsis/all/1/


----------



## Franin

I'm looking forward to Thor 2.


----------



## ddgtr

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone!!


----------



## pcweber111

Same from me, happy turkey day prepress!


----------



## prepress

Happy Thanksgiving to all, and let us be thankful for what we have, not getting caught up in what we don't have.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22615226
> 
> 
> Happy Thanksgiving to all, and let us be thankful for what we have, not getting caught up in what we don't have.



+1 hope you enjoyed your day with family and friends


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22617271
> 
> 
> +1 hope you enjoyed your day with family and friends



Thanks, Franin. I didn't go anywhere or do anything special, though. I took some quiet time to reflect, and also watched some football. And bought way too many tortilla chips! I'm supposed to be giving those up.


----------



## prepress

Though it was a brief session, I actually heard a McIntosh C2300 preamp yesterday. It was feeding a pair of MC601s and fed by a MCD1100. The speakers were Adam Audio (I forget the model). I didn't pay much attention to the cabling but did notice some balanced Kimber (Hero?) sticking out the C2300's rear going to the amps. It looks nicer in person than the photos I've seen. And the alphanumeric display is green, not blue; they must photoshop all those photos I see, in which the display is blue. The 2300 was warm to the touch, but not hot. It should definitely have more room than my rack can give it. The stock tubes were installed.


The track I heard was by the Fairfield Four, an a cappella gospel group. I know not to invest too much in what I heard, but the voices sounded pretty realistic, with a nice touch of dynamics and detail. Overall, it was a bit more neutral-sounding than I'm used to. The last time I heard Adam Audio speakers (at my 501 audition) I was turned off by how bright they sounded. But this time, though different material and a different system, things weren't too bad. These particular speakers have a built-in sub, so the 601s were driving only the mids and highs.


Leaving the store, however, I began developing a bit of a headache. Could this have been due to the sound of the system, perhaps the speakers? I can't blame the 2300. So, the 2300 is back on my radar a bit, I suppose.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22619423
> 
> 
> Though it was a brief session, I actually heard a McIntosh C2300 preamp yesterday. It was feeding a pair of MC601s and fed by a MCD1100. The speakers were Adam Audio (I forget the model). I didn't pay much attention to the cabling but did notice some balanced Kimber (Hero?) sticking out the C2300's rear going to the amps. It looks nicer in person than the photos I've seen. And the alphanumeric display is green, not blue; they must photoshop all those photos I see, in which the display is blue. The 2300 was warm to the touch, but not hot. It should definitely have more room than my rack can give it. The stock tubes were installed.
> 
> The track I heard was by the Fairfield Four, an a cappella gospel group. I know not to invest too much in what I heard, but the voices sounded pretty realistic, with a nice touch of dynamics and detail. Overall, it was a bit more neutral-sounding than I'm used to. The last time I heard Adam Audio speakers (at my 501 audition) I was turned off by how bright they sounded. But this time, though different material and a different system, things weren't too bad. These particular speakers have a built-in sub, so the 601s were driving only the mids and highs.
> 
> Leaving the store, however, I began developing a bit of a headache. Could this have been due to the sound of the system, perhaps the speakers? I can't blame the 2300. So, the 2300 is back on my radar a bit, I suppose.



You can never go wrong with McIntosh. Too expensive over here in Australia.


----------



## jnnt29




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22619423
> 
> 
> Though it was a brief session, I actually heard a McIntosh C2300 preamp yesterday. It was feeding a pair of MC601s and fed by a MCD1100. The speakers were Adam Audio (I forget the model). I didn't pay much attention to the cabling but did notice some balanced Kimber (Hero?) sticking out the C2300's rear going to the amps. It looks nicer in person than the photos I've seen. And the alphanumeric display is green, not blue; they must photoshop all those photos I see, in which the display is blue. The 2300 was warm to the touch, but not hot. It should definitely have more room than my rack can give it. The stock tubes were installed.
> 
> The track I heard was by the Fairfield Four, an a cappella gospel group. I know not to invest too much in what I heard, but the voices sounded pretty realistic, with a nice touch of dynamics and detail. Overall, it was a bit more neutral-sounding than I'm used to. The last time I heard Adam Audio speakers (at my 501 audition) I was turned off by how bright they sounded. But this time, though different material and a different system, things weren't too bad. These particular speakers have a built-in sub, so the 601s were driving only the mids and highs.
> 
> Leaving the store, however, I began developing a bit of a headache. Could this have been due to the sound of the system, perhaps the speakers? I can't blame the 2300. So, the 2300 is back on my radar a bit, I suppose.



I was in Atlanta last week and went into a Best Buy Magnolia store and was surprised to see they had a McIntosh Pre/Pro and amp set up with Martin Logan's. They were playing a beautiful jazz piece and it was so realistic. it was the first time I have heard the Mac's in person and all I can say is it was very impressive.


----------



## prepress

I have it on reliable authority that the C2300 does home theater well, also. You don't usually associate tubes with HT (I've never seen it), but I think this preamp could do music and HT equally well. The two Mac dealers I've spoken to don't have a C48 on display. Well, this isn't something I need to do anytime soon, so I'll take my time looking.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22617615
> 
> 
> ...I didn't go anywhere or do anything special, though. I took some quiet time to reflect...



Prepress, I am an introvert forced into temporary extroversion by loved ones around holiday times...and your Thanksgiving sounds like....Heaven!!!! If it were up to me, I'd liked to have spent the day off just watching movies and listening to music. I'm vegetarian, so I don't even consume the perfunctory avian segment of the Thanksgiving meal.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22613345
> 
> The Infinity Gauntlet was shown in the trophy room during the first Ice Giant "theft" scene.



Oh...my....goodness!!!!!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/360#post_22621514
> 
> 
> Prepress, I am an introvert forced into temporary extroversion by loved ones around holiday times...and your Thanksgiving sounds like....Heaven!!!! If it were up to me, I'd liked to have spent the day off just watching movies and listening to music. I'm vegetarian, so I don't even consume the perfunctory avian segment of the Thanksgiving meal.



So you don't get sleepy like everyone else.


----------



## prepress

Earlier I mentioned some turntable struggles (I know, it's got nothing to do with HT, but this section regards system configuration, so this counts!)










I decided it was time to replace the cartridge on my turntable, a VPI HW-19MkIV. The cartridge hadn't been changed since late '97. But I had a serious time getting the headshell off, even though the SME 309's headshell is detachable. The screw that holds the heashell in place is supposed to lift out with the supplied wrench. It didn't. At least, I couldn't get it to last Saturday. I spent a fruitless hour in the attempt. This past Friday i went back at it, this time being sure after some e-mails to SME, to maintain proper pressure on the headshell with the screw loosened. I finally got it off by removing the tonearm plate and turning it upside down so the screw would simply fall out. I took the headshell with the cartridge (a Grado Reference Platinum) to a dealer in Manhattan who will install the new cartridge (a Grado Reference Sonata 1). It should be ready to pick up around week's end.


Below is the aftermath of the battle. The tonearm plate is back in place but not screwed in. The little thing seeming to stick out from the tonearm head in the first photo is the headshell screw. The wrench is to the right in the second photo; you can see the screws for the TT plate there also. War is not neat.


----------



## pcweber111

Yeah it can get frustrating when you know what you need to do and can't do it because of some issue. Especially when you don't want to break what you're trying to fix! Fortunately for me my mother is an engineer by trade and she's able to take in whatever I need her to take a look at to work and have a tech in her shop fix any issues that might crop up (perks of being in charge I guess lol). I've had her fix circuit boards (caps, ics, resistors, etc.) for stuff I've owned. She even got my old PS3 working again after I received the YLOD (I ended up replacing it anyway and sold the one she fixed [old 40GB]). Hopefully they'll get it done for you without much effort.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22623796
> 
> 
> Yeah it can get frustrating when you know what you need to do and can't do it because of some issue. Especially when you don't want to break what you're trying to fix! Fortunately for me my mother is an engineer by trade and she's able to take in whatever I need her to take a look at to work and have a tech in her shop fix any issues that might crop up (perks of being in charge I guess lol). I've had her fix circuit boards (caps, ics, resistors, etc.) for stuff I've owned. She even got my old PS3 working again after I received the YLOD (I ended up replacing it anyway and sold the one she fixed [old 40GB]). Hopefully they'll get it done for you without much effort.



Well, I also gave them the tonearm manual and the alignment protractor. They should be able to do it right. I don't have the tools or, possibly, time to do it. Having a detachable headshell does make cartridge swapping easier. I'd have otherwise had to get the turntable into Manhattan (a tricky proposition) or pay installaton fees for someone to come to me to do it, and the going rate for that seems to be around $150/hour.


----------



## Franin

Hey prepress did you upgrade your Duo ?


----------



## prepress

Not yet. When I went to the DVDO website, the update wasn't listed for Macs, only PCs. I can wait, I'm fine for now.


Meantime, I got my turntable's cartridge replaced and need to put the headshell back on the tonearm. I got it a week ago. Another Grado, an upgrade, I guess, as I went for the Reference Sonata over the Reference Platinum ($600 vs. $350).


----------



## prepress

Okay, the headshell's back in place.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22719192
> 
> 
> Okay, the headshell's back in place.



Thats good news have you been playing any records recentley ?


----------



## Franin

Double post sorry


----------



## prepress

I'll have to play a few, as the first one I played last night had audible rumbling toward the end of the side. I don't know what that was, unless it's that this cartridge is more sensitive than the one it replaced, or has higher output. Nothing I can do with it now, as I'm to leave for the airport in about 4 hours.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/300_100#post_22726735
> 
> 
> I'll have to play a few, as the first one I played last night had audible rumbling toward the end of the side. I don't know what that was, unless it's that this cartridge is more sensitive than the one it replaced, or has higher output. Nothing I can do with it now, as I'm to leave for the airport in about 4 hours.



Where are you heading for Christmas ?


----------



## pcweber111

Prepress, I hope you have a wonderful Christmas and a Happy Holidays! Enjoy what's important and give those records a spin or two!


----------



## ohyeah32

Merry Christmas prepress!


----------



## prepress

I've been away for a while and spent some time in Nashville where, on a whim, I went to the one McIntosh dealer in town, HiFi Buys. And, for the first time, saw a C2300 _and_ C50 in the same room. So I got a demo. They weren't in the same system, however: the 2300 was paired with a MC275 and MCD301 (tube combo); the C50 was with a MCD500 and MC302 (solid state combo). The speakers (Revel floorstanders) and speaker cables were the same, though. The salseman had a mix CD on hand, and the main track used was a Lee Ritenour tune, _Night Rhythms_, from his _Festival_ album.


Both sounded good, but there were differences. To me, the tube combo was smoother but seemed a bit too polite. The SS combo was livelier and sharper, but there was what seemed to be a touch of hardness at one point in the track. On another tune (not sure what it was) the two systems sounded more alike. Frankly, what sounded better than either of them was the MCD500 with an MA6600 feeding a pair of B&W monitors. Not much bottom, but the rest was gorgeous. What I took away from this was that I understand why Mac and B&W are a popular combo, and why mixing tube and solid state is a good idea. I also took away a pair of Transparent MusicPlus interconnects, which I will try for my pre/power connection once they arrive.


Hope everyone's Christmas was a blessed one. Here comes 2013!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22729825
> 
> 
> Where are you heading for Christmas ?



Nashville, TN. Looking for peace and quiet. I just got back today, about 4 hours ago.


----------



## Franin

Good to see you back Charles, hope your Christmas was nice and relaxed like mine.


What's the plans for new year ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22755964
> 
> 
> Good to see you back Charles, hope your Christmas was nice and relaxed like mine.
> 
> What's the plans for new year ?



Frank,


Christmas was quiet. I was in an extended stay hotel during the time away, and watched some TV, read the paper, and did some Bible reading. Low-key all around.


As far as audio goes this year, I'd like to resolve my equipment rack and preamp quandaries then just enjoy the system, maybe have people over now and then (which would force me to be a better housekeeper). i still haven't decided definitively that I'll replace my current preamp, and the inability to get the kind of demo I want is part of the indecision.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22756560
> 
> 
> Frank,
> 
> Christms was quiet. I was in an extended stay hotel during the time away, and watched some TV, read the paper, and did some Bible reading. Low-key all around.



Sounds very relaxing Charles










> Quote:
> As far as audio goes this year, I'd like to resolve my equipment rack and preamp quandaries then just enjoy the system, maybe have people over now and then (which would force me to be a better housekeeper). i still haven't decided definitively that I'll replace my current preamp, and the inability to get the kind of demo I want is part of the indecision.



Yep this is the year that your equipment rack gets finally resolved and if you get your demo I'm curious to see what pre amp you will end up with.


----------



## hometheatergeek

Happy New Years Charles. I see you got a Grado for the TT. Nice choice. Hope you have a very good 2013.


----------



## pcweber111

Happy New Year man! Make this next year a great one and upgrade something!


----------



## prepress

Happy new year to all!


Upgrade something? If you only knew the dark thoughts that run abroad this day . . . thoughts of Spectral and VTL . . . and me starting to look at specs . . .


----------



## pcweber111

We need a true "like" button on posts lol.


----------



## prepress

UPS came last night and brought this, purchased while I was away for the holidays.

 


I intend to try it for the connection between preamp and power amp. Not that I'm that unhappy with the Audioquest King Cobra I'm using now, I just thought I'd change things up. With the TV console I have this will be a bit of an effort to swap out, but I'm hoping it will be worth it.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22780934
> 
> 
> UPS came last night and brought this, purchased while I was away for the holidays.
> 
> 
> I intend to try it for the connection between preamp and power amp. Not that I'm that unhappy with the Audioquest King Cobra I'm using now, I just thought I'd change things up. With the TV console I have this will be a bit of an effort to swap out, but I'm hoping it will be worth it.



Thats awesome Charles it nice when you get new gear, Im curious to read your opinion on the difference between the two.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22756560
> 
> 
> and did some Bible reading.



Great place to spend time! My goal this year is to go through the entire Bible in the next 365 days!!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22781376
> 
> 
> Thats awesome Charles it nice when you get new gear, Im curious to read your opinion on the difference between the two.



I have a go-to track to use when I get around to installing the Transparent and will be interested to see if there is a difference; a salesman at the store thinks the Transparent is an upgrade over the King Cobra. We'll see. I've noticed differences with interconnects when placed between the preamp and amps in the past, and got this on a whim. Well, that and feeling a bit guilty since I spent an hour in the store with demos of a couple of preamps.


But now, I'm having trouble with that new cartridge I got. It sits low when playing records which causes part of the undercarriage (for lack of a better term) to skim across the record surface. Not good. My previous cartridge didn't do this, so I don't know if I did something, the store installed it improperly, the cartridge is defective, or just not right for my tonearm (a SME 309). The cartridge is a Grado Reference Sonata, replacing a Reference Platinum, and I'd like to resolve this, obviously.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22781661
> 
> 
> Great place to spend time! My goal this year is to go through the entire Bible in the next 365 days!!



An excellent goal, to be sure. Actually, I teach Sunday school (adults) and so have done quite a bit of Bible reading as a result, and in a different way than before.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22782187
> 
> 
> and in a different way than before.



I believe I understand!


Nice equipment list, by the way!


----------



## prepress

The cartridge dilemma appears to have been solved. I reduced the tracking force and re-balanced the tonearm. The Grado Sonata and the Reference it replaced are supposed to have the same tracking force (1.5), so it didn't occur to me to try that at first. Because I had to remove and wrestle with the SME 309 arm to get the headshell off, I thought it best to re-install it from scratch, as some setup aspects were likely compromised. I could well have over-compensated with the VTF in doing so.


Anyway, all seems to be well. I'll find out for sure when I play a record.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22786514
> 
> 
> The cartridge dilemma appears to have been solved. I reduced the tracking force and re-balanced the tonearm. The Grado Sonata and the Reference it replaced are supposed to have the same tracking force (1.5), so it didn't occur to me to try that at first. Because I had to remove and wrestle with the SME 309 arm to get the headshell off, I thought it best to re-install it from scratch, as some setup aspects were likely compromised. I could well have over-compensated with the VTF in doing so.
> 
> Anyway, all seems to be well. I'll find out for sure when I play a record.



Good to see its solved , Charles.


----------



## prepress

^ ^ ^

And I played several sides to confirm, from the likes of The Mighty Groundhogs, Blood Sweat & Tears, Chicago, The Beatles, Heart, and Yes. All played with no cartridge issues. I did have to adjust the arm angle a bit, but that was it. Hooray!


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/390#post_22789546
> 
> 
> ^ ^ ^
> 
> And I played several sides to confirm, from the likes of The Mighty Groundhogs, Blood Sweat & Tears, Chicago, The Beatles, Heart, and Yes. All played with no cartridge issues. I did have to adjust the arm angle a bit, but that was it. Hooray!



That's good to hear Charles though im embarrassed to say I've never heard of The Mighty Groundhogs, Blood Sweat & Tears,


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22789554
> 
> 
> That's good to hear Charles though im embarrassed to say I've never heard of The Mighty Groundhogs, Blood Sweat & Tears,


_The Mighty Groundhogs_ LP was given to me way back in college. I've heard of the _Groundhogs_ once or twice but not the Mighty Groundhogs since then. I'm not even sure it's the same group.


Blood, Sweat & Tears was biggest in the late '60s and early-mid '70s. Famous songs include _Spinning Wheel, You've Made Me So Very Happy, And When I Die_, and _Go Down Gamblin'_. Their second album won a Grammy for Album of the Year; 1969, I think. Their music was a blend of jazz and rock.


----------



## prepress

It may be time for a reality check.


I was researching preamps (again) and came across the VTL TL6.5 Signature. Reading some very positive reviews I sent an e-mail to VTL, figuring I'd get one back at some point. What I got was a call from a sales rep from a local dealer following up; I'd purchased from the store, though not recently, so I was in the database. We had a very good conversation and I was stoked about the 6.5, even considering an audition strongly. The price I knew was $9500, a strain but doable if I made the proper financial adjustments.


However, more research showed that $9500 price is a 2007 price, and the unit isn't as new as I thought (VTL's website calls it "new"); it's at least 5-6 years old. I finally came across a Nov. 2012 price of $11,500. That's well beyond my capabilities, unless I want to go into debt or empty my checking account. I have some of those special offer checks the credit card companies often send, and I ACTUALLY thought about using one, which would give me interest-free payments through the end of the year. But there's a fee of 4% of the purchase/transfer amount for doing so. Add that to the tax and we're around $13,000.










The VTL would be an outstanding performer and killer with my MC501s, but the price of admission is simply too steep. There's a 5.5, but it has more tubes in it, including the power supply, whereas the 6.5 has only two plus a solid-state power supply. Here's where coming back to earth is important. I cannot, realistically, afford the 6.5, so I'd best move on. But that I did, even though briefly, consider how to swing the thing already knowing it would be unwise at best to buy it, is a bit scary. I _do_ know I'd better not audition it.


So I'm moving back to my humble preamp list and figuring out my equipment rack. A reconfig is going to be necessary, as the line voltage runs too high these days and my Furman SPR will shut down every time the air conditioner engages. It will mean snaking an extension around a corner to another room which is (I think) on a different line.


Ah, even a _semi_-hobbyist such as I can get caught up. Reality, please!


----------



## HFGuy

How much tube technology breakthroughs do you think happened in the last 5-6 years ?


----------



## ddgtr

Good idea Charles, do not audition that thing... It can be painful. The $13k is pretty steep, at least for some of us... Can it be had slightly used for less?


I've got a question for you, it's about the 501's. A friend of mine is contemplating getting a pair. He would either use them with Sonus Faber Elipsa, Stradivari or Revel Salon Ultima 2 speakers. Would you say that the 501's are fairly neutral or do they lean slightly towards the warm side? Are you still running the Audio Research preamp? I'll head over to Wabo's thread and ask him what his thinks also...


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HFGuy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22835177
> 
> 
> How much tube technology breakthroughs do you think happened in the last 5-6 years ?



As part of the Signature series, this 6.5 is a hybrid, one-box version of the top of the line 7.5 Signature (2 boxes). The solid-state power supply and its integration with the 2 line stage tubes is one of the things that helps make it special. And I saw no review that found fault with the unit. Everything i read, even without having heard it, left me convinced it has the sonic goods. But for the price I'll have to pass.


Here's one review.
http://www.stereophile.com/tubepreamps/607vtl/index.html


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22835431
> 
> 
> Good idea Charles, do not audition that thing... It can be painful. The $13k is pretty steep, at least for some of us... Can it be had slightly used for less?
> 
> 
> I've got a question for you, it's about the 501's. A friend of mine is contemplating getting a pair. He would either use them with Sonus Faber Elipsa, Stradivari or Revel Salon Ultima 2 speakers. Would you say that the 501's are fairly neutral or do they lean slightly towards the warm side? Are you still running the Audio Research preamp? I'll head over to Wabo's thread and ask him what his thinks also...



Hi there ddgtr,


Here's a link that may help:
http://www.stereophile.com/solidpoweramps/804mcintosh/index.html 


I would say they are first of all very musical, easy to listen to. The newer 601s are more neutral-sounding. And I do still have my Audio Research LS3 (which is solid state), and it works well with the 501s. I heard a pair of Revels while in Nashville, fed by a Mac amp and CD player, and thought they were good. I haven't heard any Sonus Fabers, but on another forum I saw some Mac/Sonus Faber combinations.


The 501s are very good amps. Speaking for myself, unless there is some practical reason to do so, I won't be replacing them.


----------



## ddgtr

Thanks Charles, you are very helpful as usual...


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22839974
> 
> 
> Thanks Charles, you are very helpful as usual...



Try this as well...
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505263_162-57564456/mcintosh-made-in-the-u.s.a/


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22835431
> 
> 
> Good idea Charles, do not audition that thing... It can be painful. The $13k is pretty steep, at least for some of us... Can it be had slightly used for less?



It occurred to me this AM that had it not been for last year's episodes with my former sister-in-law's house and a friend's need, that would be roughly $5200 more in my pocket and we would now be discussing my new VTL TL-6.5 Signature preamp. Interesting how life works.


----------



## prepress

I am adding this to my list.

 


The McIntosh C2500 is a nice-looking unit, more so than the C2300 which it's replacing. And that both it and the C48 have DACs eliminates one awkward point of comparison; I can move on to compare the two units more fairly. Waiting for more info on it and a shot of the back. It's due out in the spring.


And don't worry, I'm sure they'll get the guy trapped in there out before the unit goes into final production (kidding, of course).


----------



## ddgtr




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22850044
> 
> 
> It occurred to me this AM that had it not been for last year's episodes with my former sister-in-law's house and a friend's need, that would be roughly $5200 more in my pocket and we would now be discussing my new VTL TL-6.5 Signature preamp. Interesting how life works.



Yes, indeed...


There no price you can put on helping out someone in need. Especially nowadays and in today's society which is geared towards individualism and everyone for themselves you have done a gread deed, my friend... I am convinced it will come back to reward you in one way or another. Even knowing that someone is now able to rebound because of your help must provide you with great satisfaction and just a good feeling overall...


The C2500 looks great! I'm not very familiar with McInctosh, will this one have built in DACs?


----------



## Edgeria

It looks good man. Looks like you know what you are doing and have been around the block a time or two.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22858363
> 
> 
> Yes, indeed...
> 
> 
> There no price you can put on helping out someone in need. Especially nowadays and in today's society which is geared towards individualism and everyone for themselves you have done a gread deed, my friend... I am convinced it will come back to reward you in one way or another. Even knowing that someone is now able to rebound because of your help must provide you with great satisfaction and just a good feeling overall...
> 
> 
> The C2500 looks great! I'm not very familiar with McInctosh, will this one have built in DACs?



Yes. It's a replacement for the C2300 and is also a tube preamp. I think it looks better than the C2300, frankly, and will look forward to more info. Even though it's a tube unit, it could be fun. The built-in DAC (not modular, by the way) is 32/192, more than enough for me should I decide to use it if I buy the thing.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Edgeria*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22858428
> 
> 
> It looks good man. Looks like you know what you are doing and have been around the block a time or two.



Edgeria,


It's been a long block, too. A lot of research which goes on every time I come across something interesting.


Funny thing is, I'm not a hard-core audiophile but music is a big interest and I want equipment that will play it well. It could be argued that I should just keep what I have (which I haven't ruled out still), but I want to explore the alternatives within my reach. The retail on this C2500 is expected to be $6500, and should be _just_ within reach in a few months.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22857489
> 
> 
> I am adding this to my list.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The McIntosh C2500 is a nice-looking unit, more so than the C2300 which it's replacing. And that both it and the C48 have DACs eliminates one awkward point of comparison; I can move on to compare the two units more fairly. Waiting for more info on it and a shot of the back. It's due out in the spring.
> 
> 
> And don't worry, I'm sure they'll get the guy trapped in there out before the unit goes into final production (kidding, of course).




Thats a very nice looking unit Charles.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22862082
> 
> 
> Thats a very nice looking unit Charles.



It is, Franin, and it represents the most I think I dare spend. I did get a look at the back of the unit on another forum, and it seems to be a C50 with tubes, as the connections are the same, apparently. A closer look will be in order once the literature comes out.


As with the C50, I wouldn't use most of those extra features, so I'm a bit less crazy about the C2500 but still interested. I'm keeping an eye on the money, too, as the increase in Social Security taxes has put a crimp in the old wallet. There could well be some good deals on the C2300 now, if I want to go there, but am not sure. I am, however, attempting to target the first week of April for a resolution on the equipment rack since I'm scheduled to be off that week. That move can take me forward on what to do about a preamp.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22850044
> 
> 
> It occurred to me this AM that had it not been for last year's episodes with my former sister-in-law's house and a friend's need, that would be roughly $5200 more in my pocket and we would now be discussing my new VTL TL-6.5 Signature preamp. Interesting how life works.



Hey man, the blessings you have and/will receive for your kindness will outshine anything VTL makes. Btw, that new Mac you're eyeing looks very very nice. I'm sure its performance is just as stunning.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22864949
> 
> 
> Hey man, the blessings you have and/will receive for your kindness will outshine anything VTL makes. Btw, that new Mac you're eyeing looks very very nice. I'm sure its performance is just as stunning.



Yes, which is why I'm not that bent out of shape. It could be argued that in some ways the house thing was a waste of money, but there's no way helping my friend out was.


For the heck of it, and since I have a picture, there is the house I grew up in, now for sale:

 


I took that photo and two others of it while in Nashville for the holidays. The house has been painted (another coat would have been good) and work done inside. They did nothing to the fence or yard, though. The realtor's asking price is $85,000.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22865329
> 
> 
> Yes, which is why I'm not that bent out of shape. It could be argued that in some ways the house thing was a waste of money, but there's no way helping my friend out was.
> 
> 
> For the heck of it, and since I have a picture, there is the house I grew up in, now for sale:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I took that photo and two others of it while in Nashville for the holidays. The house has been painted (another coat would have been good) and work done inside. They did nothing to the fence or yard, though. The realtor's asking price is $85,000.



What's the average house price in the U.S.A ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22866687
> 
> 
> What's the average house price in the U.S.A ?



Don't know about nationally, but in Tennessee it's around $162,900. Hawaii is the most expensive, average price over $450,000. I can't see living in Hawaii; too far away.


----------



## pcweber111

I'm in Mckinney and my first house was 162 on the dot, funny. Second was quite a bit more but at least I don't have to worry about it anymore.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22870563
> 
> 
> Don't know about nationally, but in Tennessee it's around $162,900. Hawaii is the most expensive, average price over $450,000. I can't see living in Hawaii; too far away.



I was told that the housing market has gone bust over there, is that true ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22871748
> 
> 
> I was told that the housing market has gone bust over there, is that true ?



In NYC the market has begun to look up, more so for sellers and landlords, as rents and home prices are going up. Vacancy rates for rentals are down also. It's tough to find anything affordable.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22876700
> 
> 
> In NYC the market has begun to look up, more so for sellers and landlords, as rents and home prices are going up. Vacancy rates for rentals are down also. It's tough to find anything affordable.



At the moment over here its a buyers market.


----------



## prepress

I've finally put in the Transparent MusicLink Plus interconnect, and it is being broken in as I type. It's between my preamp and power amps. I have heard a difference in the main track I use for such evaluations, _The Strife Is O'er_ from my _For God and Country_ CD. It's an organ/brass CD, and the track in question has bass organ notes which are easy to pick out and follow. The Transparent did a better job with them than the Audioquest King Cobra did overall. I have heard other things I haven't noticed before playing the Booker T. & the MGs box set _Time is Tight_. It could also be that, in the case of the Booker T, I'm sitting closer to the speaker than usual (this is where the computer is). But I didn't hear the fuzz tone in the bass on one track before with the AQ.


So far I would say some improvement but nothing earth shaking. Here and there Steve Cropper's guitar sounds a tad more real. Time will tell; it's only the first listen.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22871249
> 
> 
> I'm in Mckinney and my first house was 162 on the dot, funny. Second was quite a bit more but at least I don't have to worry about it anymore.



Well, we'll hope you like where you are now. This 1BR I live in is officially overcrowded, and small, slow steps are being taken to "de-crowd" it. Everything's in a domino setup: for me to do one thing something else has to be done first. And, I'm having a terrible time keeping up with the influx of mail, which adds to the paper problem. However, I may be having company next weekend, so that's an incentive to get serious, at least about the paper. As long as we can see the coffee table minimum, it's good.


----------



## prepress

And I may be getting closer to some resolution of the whole preamp issue. In the next few weeks I will be going to a local dealer to have a direct comparison between the McIntosh C50 and C2300 _in the same system_. Since the C50 and C48 are the same as regards sound, if I prefer the C50 I'll get the C48 and have money left to get a new equipment rack, too. Unless the C50's looks overpower me.










If I prefer the 2300, that changes some things. It will have to be a _lot_ better, not just better (according to the salesman, the C2300 "kills" the C50). It means a commitment to tubes, reconfiguring my setup to accommodate the unit, and doing without the DAC (which I wasn't going to use unless needed) for any future system changes, or having to buy one separately if things get to the point where digital is the only option for new music.


At this point, I'm perhaps 75% decided to get a new preamp. What happens at this audition may push things to 100%. We'll see.


----------



## prepress

I realized some things during the night that put some perspective on this preamp deal.

*1.* Ultimately, I'm _not_ a tube person at heart. I'm not thrilled at the extra maintenance and cost of tube equipment. Even though tube failure is rare with signal tubes such as those in a preamp, it is possible, and that's on my mind. My ideal, which I can't afford, is the VTL TL-6.5 Signature, an $11,500 unit. A tube unit, yes, but with a solid-state power supply and only _two_ tubes versus the C2300's six. And for some odd reason, I sense slightly more acceptance of the coming C2500 over the 2300 even though it has the same six tubes; perhaps it's the somewhat sleeker design. The main reason I consider the 2300 at all is the overwhelmingly positive hype I've seen. And it still bothers me a bit at having to tube the MC phono stage, which I'll never use.

*2.* I'd prefer a line stage. McIntosh doesn't make one, unfortunately. The reason for a Mac preamp is I have Mac amps, so it's an obvious match. The non-Mac preamps on my short list are line stage affairs, as is the VTL. The ARC LS27, which I considered briefly, is also (again, only two tubes). I already have a phono preamp, though not state-of-the-art (Aragon 47k), which would be redundant with either Mac unit. Just as many prefer a separate DAC, so I prefer a separate phono stage. Still, perhaps it's not a deal-breaker; if the Mac's onboard phono is much better, then I guess I would use it and have to do something with my 47k.

*3.* The Parasound JC2 is still lurking. And now that the Halo line comes in black, the JC2 is much more appealing than before. I've seen photos, and I really like the look. I've also seen a couple of posts here and there regarding the positive pairing of Parasound preamp and Mac amp. I also don't think the one caveat about pairing it with lean-sounding equipment applies to my MC501s and Mirage M-3si speakers.


So _that_ quickly the waters have muddied. There are several dangers I see here. One, I go ahead with the audition and the 2300 indeed "kills" the C50, as the store salesman says, creating personal angst and confusion; two, I decide stubbornly to go for what I want (the VTL) despite the money, creating danger; three, I say to heck with it and get the JC2 (maybe the JC3 also) and live happily ever after; or four, I plunge into research all over again, eventually burn out on the whole thing and just stand pat. A lot changed overnight.


I begin to miss the simpler days of a receiver, turntable and speakers.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/420#post_22917125
> 
> 
> I realized some things during the night that put some perspective on this preamp deal.
> 
> *1.* Ultimately, I'm _not_ a tube person at heart. I'm not thrilled at the extra maintenance and cost of tube equipment. Even though tube failure is rare with signal tubes such as those in a preamp, it is possible, and that's on my mind. My ideal, which I can't afford, is the VTL TL-6.5 Signature, an $11,500 unit. A tube unit, yes, but with a solid-state power supply and only _two_ tubes versus the C2300's six. And for some odd reason, I sense slightly more acceptance of the coming C2500 over the 2300 even though it has the same six tubes; perhaps it's the somewhat sleeker design. The main reason I consider the 2300 at all is the overwhelmingly positive hype I've seen. And it still bothers me a bit at having to tube the MC phono stage, which I'll never use.
> 
> *2.* I'd prefer a line stage. McIntosh doesn't make one, unfortunately. The reason for a Mac preamp is I have Mac amps, so it's an obvious match. The non-Mac preamps on my short list are line stage affairs, as is the VTL. The ARC LS27, which I considered briefly, is also (again, only two tubes). I already have a phono preamp, though not state-of-the-art (Aragon 47k), which would be redundant with either Mac unit. Just as many prefer a separate DAC, so I prefer a separate phono stage. Still, perhaps it's not a deal-breaker; if the Mac's onboard phono is much better, then I guess I would use it and have to do something with my 47k.
> 
> *3.* The Parasound JC2 is still lurking. And now that the Halo line comes in black, the JC2 is much more appealing than before. I've seen photos, and I really like the look. I've also seen a couple of posts here and there regarding the positive pairing of Parasound preamp and Mac amp. I also don't think the one caveat about pairing it with lean-sounding equipment applies to my MC501s and Mirage M-3si speakers.
> 
> 
> So _that_ quickly the waters have muddied. There are several dangers I see here. One, I go ahead with the audition and the 2300 indeed "kills" the C50, as the store salesman says, creating personal angst and confusion; two, I decide stubbornly to go for what I want (the VTL) despite the money, creating danger; three, I say to heck with it and get the JC2 (maybe the JC3 also) and live happily ever after; or four, I plunge into research all over again, eventually burn out on the whole thing and just stand pat. A lot changed overnight.
> 
> 
> I begin to miss the simpler days of a receiver, turntable and speakers.



It will be interesting to see which way you will go. I do agree though with what you wrote above going with mac pre amp as you have mac amps.


----------



## ddgtr

Charles,


I feel you. I'm starting to think about auditioning a Pass xp-10 and xp-20 to see how they compare against my Odyssey, although financially I'm not even close...


I'm running a pair of tubes in the Odyssey, I've had it for at least 4 years and bought it used. I use it quite a bit, for movies too because of the bypass feature in the preamp. I have never had to change the tubes.


Last night I finished installing my friend's system: BW 800 diamonds, 601 mac monos and C48 preamp. That damn preamp gave me so much trouble with the bypass feature it drove me crazy. Turned out the only way to get it to work is to run a 1/8" trigger cable from the receiver to the bypass input on the C48.. WTF??? What's wrong with just assigning the input and switching to it? Someone really hurried up to get that model released on schedule. Oh, and no BNC input? We're talking audiophile gear here... Without the trigger cable sound still passes through, but you have to adjust both the preamp and the receiver volumes which is a royal PITFA...


Sound wise: I didn't have time to fine tune it, system sounds powerful and incredibly detailed but way too bright. May be the diamond tweets, maybe the room.


I'm also keeping a close eye on your journey to get a new preamp. It'll be interesting to see what you decide. Getting a couple of units in your room to demo would be ideal, it's probably the most accurate way to compare.


Good luck!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22918200
> 
> 
> Charles,
> 
> 
> I feel you. I'm starting to think about auditioning a Pass xp-10 and xp-20 to see how they compare against my Odyssey, although financially I'm not even close...
> 
> 
> I'm running a pair of tubes in the Odyssey, I've had it for at least 4 years and bought it used. I use it quite a bit, for movies too because of the bypass feature in the preamp. I have never had to change the tubes.
> 
> 
> Last night I finished installing my friend's system: BW 800 diamonds, 601 mac monos and C48 preamp. That damn preamp gave me so much trouble with the bypass feature it drove me crazy. Turned out the only way to get it to work is to run a 1/8" trigger cable from the receiver to the bypass input on the C48.. WTF??? What's wrong with just assigning the input and switching to it? Someone really hurried up to get that model released on schedule. Oh, and no BNC input? We're talking audiophile gear here... Without the trigger cable sound still passes through, but you have to adjust both the preamp and the receiver volumes which is a royal PITFA...
> 
> 
> Sound wise: I didn't have time to fine tune it, system sounds powerful and incredibly detailed but way too bright. May be the diamond tweets, maybe the room.
> 
> 
> I'm also keeping a close eye on your journey to get a new preamp. It'll be interesting to see what you decide. Getting a couple of units in your room to demo would be ideal, it's probably the most accurate way to compare.
> 
> 
> Good luck!



Well, the 601s are pretty neutral, so that may combine with those diamond tweeters to make an issue. On another forum someone described "warm" sound with the C48 in their system; so it may indeed be the combination of equipment. But if everything is new, nothing's broken in and the sound may smooth out after a while. And I've scanned some reviews of the XP-20; it's better than the XP-10, according to those. In fact, I might consider it if it had more RCA inputs.


I'll see what I do with this preamp thing. The equipment rack needs to be solved also; I have to get that going somehow.


----------



## prepress

I have a tentative date of 2/16 for my first audition, the C2300 and C50 in the same system. I have my usual track suspects for it:


• _The Strife is O'er_, Anthony Newman and the Chestnut Brass Co. (organ/brass); this has become my reference track for evaluating interconnects between preamp and power amp. The bass organ notes are telling.

• _Fanfare for the Common Man_, (Copeland), Atlanta Symphony Orchestra (brass/percussion); the exploding kettle drums on this version is a good dynamic test.

• _Hallucinations_, Eliane Elias (small jazz combo); she plays a mean piano and the acoustic bass moves along pretty well.


I need to come up with at least one other track, something with vocals; perhaps something by the Fairfield Four (a cappella gospel).


----------



## prepress

^ ^ ^

I made the appointment; it's indeed for tomorrow the 16th. And, add the Audio Research LS27 to the list. They'll all be in the same room, driving a pair of McIntosh MC601 monoblocks. i thought three preamps was a bit much and would have scheduled a second session, but the salesman thinks we can do it. Well, it _would_ save me a trip, so we'll see.


----------



## ddgtr

Better to do all 3 at one time. You should have enough time, especially if you're familiar with your recordings. What speakers are they going to use? So they didn't want to let you bring them home for an audition? That would have been perfect.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22967648
> 
> 
> Better to do all 3 at one time. You should have enough time, especially if you're familiar with your recordings. What speakers are they going to use? So they didn't want to let you bring them home for an audition? That would have been perfect.



I didn't think to ask; oh well.


What I'm thinking is to put the two tube units against each other and then compare the winner to the McIntosh C50. Then, it's classic tube vs. transistor. If there's no clear, strong preference, I likely get a C48 or move on to other choices. The difference between the C50 and C48 lies in features; they sound the same.


----------



## ddgtr

This makes sense.


I've been playing around with my buddy's C48 and I must say that I like the way it sounds. I will eventually take it home for a few days to listen to it in my system just because I'm curious as to how it compares against mine.


----------



## prepress

I had the big audition today, and am feeling a bit unsure about it right now, even though it ended with a purchase. As it turned out, I listened to only the tube units, the C2300 and ARC LS27. I used various familiar tracks:

_Wondrous Stories_, Yes (prog);
_My God Called Me This Morning_, Fairfield Four (a cappella gospel);
_Hallucinations_, Eliane Elias (jazz piano trio);
_The Golden Striker_, Modern Jazz Quartet (I’ve read where some don’t consider MJQ jazz);
_Fanfare for the Common Man_, Atlanta Symphony Orchestra (brass/percussion);
_Dust in the Wind_, Kansas (prog);
_Frankenstein_, Edgar Winter (rock);
_The Strife is O’er_, Anthony Newman & The Chestnut Brass Company (organ/brass/percussion).


The system was a Puccini dCS U-Clock and CD player, McIntosh 601s, Magnepan MG 20.7 speakers, Nordost cabling and power cords, MIT power cord on the preamp, and a Richard Gray power conditioner. The system was, frankly, bright and a bit of a challenge to listen to; I am sensitive to such things and was a bit ill as a result. Fortunately, my system at home doesn’t do that to me.


I listened to the 2300 first, then the LS27. For the most part, I preferred the LS27 but bought the 2300 demo unit for two reasons: it was more dynamic, probably due to its larger power supply, and I got a nice deal on it. I thought at the time these things offset the LS27’s advantages. The LS27 tamed the system brightness some and was easier to listen to; it has only two tubes; it’s a line stage; it fits into my rack as is; it looks (to me) more elegant and is less obtrusive. But its downfall was dynamism, as it didn’t have the punch the 2300 did on tracks like _Fanfare_ with its kettle drums. When they were whacked, you felt it more. And Jack DeJohnette’s drum solo during _Hallucinations_ had more punch. Chris Squire’s bass in _Wondrous Stories_ had more weight as well. I was able to pick it out in spots and follow it pretty well with both preamps, but it had more authority and was easier to follow on the 2300.


Despite all this, I’m feeling a bit unsure because, I think, ultimately I’m not getting what I want. I did indeed prefer the LS27’s overall sound in the demo system, but its comparatively light balance was its undoing. Otherwise, I’d have spent the money. Also, I’ve said before I liked the C2500’s look more than the 2300’s. But the deep discount that goes with a demo unit (and the last C2300 in the store, by the way) was hard to ignore. Still, part of me wants to cancel and get the 2500 instead, as it’s said to measure better than the 2300 and has preferable (to me) cosmetics. I have some time to do that if I want. But do I want to spend the additional $1135, which would just about pay for a new equipment rack if I choose/need to get one? I’ll see how I feel over the next day or two.


On tubes, the salseman has a C2300 himself, and has Gold Lions in there. He says they’re excellent, but perhaps a bit to the warm side, with Mullards and Tung-Sols being more neutral. I don’t believe I need more warmth in my system, so I’ll try the other, less expensive options first. I suppose the Magnepans were responsible for this brightness; the 601s are fairly neutral, too. And the 2300 (or maybe 2500 still) means a system reconfiguration, which I’ll need to come up with since having it creates an imbalance in the racks and kills setup symmetry, since the onboard phono stage is better than my Aragon 47k; no need to keep it in the rack.


Of course, things grind on.


----------



## audioguy

The Magges are anything but bright, so it had to be the room or setup (or something else).


I have no clue about your financial status but given what you already own, I assume you will not be living under a bridge anytime soon. Making decisions on price only (the deep discount you got) has been, for me, almost always regrettable and in no time at all, I'm looking for a "do over", and thinking "if only".


On the other hand, if you switch out gear a lot, then keep what you bought and make the change the next time you get the itch.


One more thing: I have YET to buy a piece of gear that sounded at home like it did in the store. It's all about the room. If you have a return option, stick it in your system, live with for a bit and it you can't stand the decision you made, return it.


Loved your selection of music for hardware evaluation.


----------



## oOOBillO0o




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/400_100#post_22974528
> 
> 
> I had the big audition today, and am feeling a bit unsure about it right now, even though it ended with a purchase. As it turned out, I listened to only the tube units, the C2300 and ARC LS27. I used various familiar tracks:
> 
> _Wondrous Stories_, Yes (prog);
> _My God Called Me This Morning_, Fairfield Four (a cappella gospel);
> _Hallucinations_, Eliane Elias (jazz piano trio);
> _The Golden Striker_, Modern Jazz Quartet (I’ve read where some don’t consider MJQ jazz);
> _Fanfare for the Common Man_, Atlanta Symphony Orchestra (brass/percussion);
> _Dust in the Wind_, Kansas (prog);
> _Frankenstein_, Edgar Winter (rock);
> _The Strife is O’er_, Anthony Newman & The Chestnut Brass Company (organ/brass/percussion).
> 
> 
> The system was a Puccini dCS U-Clock and CD player, McIntosh 601s, Magnepan MG 20.7 speakers, Nordost cabling and power cords, MIT power cord on the preamp, and a Richard Gray power conditioner. The system was, frankly, bright and a bit of a challenge to listen to; I am sensitive to such things and was a bit ill as a result. Fortunately, my system at home doesn’t do that to me.
> 
> 
> I listened to the 2300 first, then the LS27. For the most part, I preferred the LS27 but bought the 2300 demo unit for two reasons: it was more dynamic, probably due to its larger power supply, and I got a nice deal on it. I thought at the time these things offset the LS27’s advantages. The LS27 tamed the system brightness some and was easier to listen to; it has only two tubes; it’s a line stage; it fits into my rack as is; it looks (to me) more elegant ans is less obtrusive. But its downfall was dynamism, as it didn’t have the punch the 2300 did on tracks like Fanfare with its kettle drums. When they were whacked, you felt it more. And Jack DeJohnette’s drum solo during _Hallucinations_ had more punch. Chris Squire’s bass in _Wondrous Stories_ had more weight as well. I was able to pick it out in spots and follow it pretty well with both preamps, but it had more authority and was easier to follow on the 2300.
> 
> 
> Despite all this, I’m feeling a bit unsure because, I think, ultimately I’m not getting what I want. I did indeed prefer the LS27’s overall sound in the demo system, but its comparatively light balance was its undoing. Otherwise, I’d have spent the money. Also, I’ve said before I liked the C2500’s look more than the 2300’s. But the deep discount that goes with a demo unit (and the last C2300 in the store, by the way) was hard to ignore. Still, part of me wants to cancel and get the 2500 instead, as it’s said to measure better than the 2300 and has preferable (to me) cosmetics. I have some time to do that if I want. But do I want to spend the additional $1135, which would just about pay for a new equipment rack if I choose/need to get one? I’ll see how I feel over the next day or two.
> 
> 
> On tubes, the salseman has a C2300 himself, and has Gold Lions in there. He says they’re excellent, but perhaps a bit to the warm side, with Mullards and Tung-Sols being more neutral. I don’t believe I need more warmth in my system, so I’ll try the other, less expensive options first. I suppose the Magnepans were responsible for this brightness; the 601s are fairly neutral, too. And the 2300 (or maybe 2500 still) means a system reconfiguration, which I’ll need to come up with since having it creates an imbalance in the racks and kills setup symmetry, since the onboard phono stage is better than my Aragon 47k; no need to keep it in the rack.
> 
> 
> Of course, things grind on.



I hope they take trade-ups.. I am going to place my order for the C2500 as soon as my dealer gets the go-ahead and McIntosh starts shipping.


----------



## BrolicBeast

I enjoyed reading about your experience and appreciate you including your evaluation tracks. I learned about the Fairfield Four from my father a few months ago. He's not an audiophile--just a fan of great gospel acapella (way back to the days of The Heritage Singers' few acapella outings.). I played the FF4 in the system when he was visiting for Thanksgiving, and he was in bliss! Frankly, so was I. I'm going to look for your other eval tracks on my Sonos.


About this quote:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22974528
> 
> 
> Despite all this, I’m feeling a bit unsure because, I think, ultimately I’m not getting what I want...



Man, that one sentence says all you need to know about the retention v. returning battle. You will always wonder "what if?" for as long as you own it. You're better off getting the upgrade--maybe even doing an after-market Transformer mod. As Audioguy said, things always sound different at home....and even in different rooms. I spend much of this winter auditioning speakers, and had many opportunities to hear the same models in different environments and the differences were night and day. It might be a really good idea to consider getting the model you want--plus, for an additional 1.1k, it seems worth it in the long run, as opposed to making an all new purchase a year or two from now. Either way, congrats on a great step up and as an addition, you free up rack space-which is at a premium for us all these days!


----------



## ddgtr

Hey Charles, congrats on the purchase. I too enjoyed reading about your experience as all the "professional" reviews sound the same...


Just plug it into your system at home and see how you like it there. There's NOBODY that knows your system better than you do. If there are any shortcomings or advantages, you'll catch it right away.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22975767
> 
> 
> The Magges are anything but bright, so it had to be the room or setup (or something else).
> 
> 
> I have no clue about your financial status but given what you already own, I assume you will not be living under a bridge anytime soon. Making decisions on price only (the deep discount you got) has been, for me, almost always regrettable and in no time at all, I'm looking for a "do over", and thinking "if only".
> 
> 
> On the other hand, if you switch out gear a lot, then keep what you bought and make the change the next time you get the itch.
> 
> 
> One more thing: I have YET to buy a piece of gear that sounded at home like it did in the store. It's all about the room. If you have a return option, stick it in your system, live with for a bit and it you can't stand the decision you made, return it.
> 
> 
> Loved your selection of music for hardware evaluation.



Thanks, audioguy. Since everything in the room was unfamiliar, I thought the speakers were the issue, that plus neutral-sounding amps in the 601s. I heard the 2300/601 combo at another store back in November and that, too, was bright; those speakers were Adam Audio, whose history is in the pro market. Over the holidays down in Nashville I heard a C2300 feeding the all-tube McIntosh MC275 and driving a pair of Revel speakers. That combo was definitely NOT bright. It should be remembered too I guess, that the 2300 was running with the stock tubes, and a different type than the LS27.


And it's not that I didn't like the 2300; I did: _"Yes — detail more evident; Fairfield Four - lead vocal particularly real; Eliane — JD's drum whacks have authority, there's even one or two I don't recall hearing before"_ (from my notes). I think the 2300 will sound good in here, though not quite like at the store. I don't change gear much, though since July 2008—when I bought my plasma TV—I've bought 2 BD players, a tuner, SACD player, video processor, two power conditioners, interconnects and a turntable control unit; only the latter a necessity, as its predecessor died and was too old to repair. The interconnects were due to a poor choice in TV stands. Before that, since 1994 I'd bought only 3 pieces, one a replacement due to a failed component.


As for the C2300/C2500 issue, I'm reminding myself I'd have to shell out another $1135 to get a 2500. The LS27 would be another $2400, and I'm not going there, elegant looks notwithstanding. So the question is do I want the 2500's better measurements, which may or may not translate into better sound, and its cleaner (to me) cosmetics? I feel better about the 2300 now than I did when I posted the results, but I'll give it another day.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *oOOBillO0o*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22976121
> 
> 
> I hope they take trade-ups.. I am going to place my order for the C2500 as soon as my dealer gets the go-ahead and McIntosh starts shipping.



I _might_ risk contacting McIntosh to see if they believe the improved measurements will make a difference. I would have spent $500 more for the looks, but over $1100 is another story.


The dealer I went to said he could take my order for the 2500 now, if I want to go there. It isn't supposed to be out for another month and a half though.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22976230
> 
> 
> I enjoyed reading about your experience and appreciate you including your evaluation tracks. I learned about the Fairfield Four from my father a few months ago. He's not an audiophile--just a fan of great gospel acapella (way back to the days of The Heritage Singers' few acapella outings.). I played the FF4 in the system when he was visiting for Thanksgiving, and he was in bliss! Frankly, so was I. I'm going to look for your other eval tracks on my Sonos.
> 
> 
> About this quote:
> 
> Man, that one sentence says all you need to know about the retention v. returning battle. You will always wonder "what if?" for as long as you own it. You're better off getting the upgrade--maybe even doing an after-market Transformer mod. As Audioguy said, things always sound different at home....and even in different rooms. I spend much of this winter auditioning speakers, and had many opportunities to hear the same models in different environments and the differences were night and day. It might be a really good idea to consider getting the model you want--plus, for an additional 1.1k, it seems worth it in the long run, as opposed to making an all new purchase a year or two from now. Either way, congrats on a great step up and as an addition, you free up rack space-which is at a premium for us all these days!



It looks nicer in person than in most photos I've seen, though this one's flattering:

 


The main visual diference is the 2300 has four knobs on the front, whereas the 2500 has two, and the tubes for the 2500 are toward the front:

 


Those smaller two knobs were done away with on the 2500 and their function (trim adjustments) moved to the buttons below. Of course, it has the built-in DAC, controversial among purists. There is also the other side, which is I go after the 2500 and cough up the extra money, incurring the danger of reverse regret: I move to the 2500 and then lament spending more money when things are tight already and the 2300 is a classic, a very good preamp as is. And like most Mac gear, it's decidedly overbuilt at 29.5 pounds (the 2500 is one pound more). My checking account is a bit low now, and that's an inhibitor also. I will wait another day or so and see how I feel. As for sound, experience says it won't be the same as in the store, but the essential character will hold up.


The Fairfield Four came to my attention way back in the '90s when they were on _CBS This Morning_. The title of the album that song I used yesterday came from is _Standing in the Safety Zone_. And I figured if the vibraphone in the MJQ track didn't sound like milk bottles, things were good. it didn't.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *ddgtr*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_22976313
> 
> 
> Hey Charles, congrats on the purchase. I too enjoyed reading about your experience as all the "professional" reviews sound the same...
> 
> 
> Just plug it into your system at home and see how you like it there. There's NOBODY that knows your system better than you do. If there are any shortcomings or advantages, you'll catch it right away.



And since it's the demo unit, no break-in issues. I need to haul it on getting this place ready and having my stand strategy together. The store is holding it, waiting for my call to ship via UPS. I may ask for FedEx instead, as they'll deliver on Saturday. But since I seem to have to work Saturdays sometimes, maybe that's not good...


Tubes. I NEVER thought I'd go there.


----------



## prepress

I see the 2500 is up on Mac's website. At the best opportunity I will do a comparison of specs to be sure I'm staying with the 2300. At a glance the 2500 has a better S/N ratio and consumes a bit less power (50W vs. 75W), but I have to see something significant in order to lay out the extra money at this point.


----------



## prepress

I downloaded the C2500 manual and did a side-by-side with the C2300 according to specs, and while I haven't gone through the entire manual it seems as if there's nothing compelling to make me spend the extra for the 2500. Many of the specs are identical; there are a few which favor the 2500 and one that favors the 2300. I am running the specs by someone who works in electronics for a living, and unless he has something to say, I plan to have the C2300 shipped to me soon. And as I've also said, looks alone aren't enough of a reason to change considering the price differential.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23007758
> 
> 
> I downloaded the C2500 manual and did a side-by-side with the C2300 according to specs, and while I haven't gone through the entire manual it seems as if there's nothing compelling to make me spend the extra for the 2500. Many of the specs are identical; there are a few which favor the 2500 and one that favors the 2300. I am running the specs by someone who works in electronics for a living, and unless he has something to say, I plan to have the C2300 shipped to me soon. And as I've also said, looks alone aren't enough of a reason to change considering the price differential.



I heard from the A/V guy I passed the specs. He didn't appear to find anything compelling in them either. So I'll be sticking with the 2300. Now I have to catch up with the friend who says she wants my Hooker TV console so I can get that out of here. To make room for the C2300 in my system I need to change out the console for something more compatible. We move on.


----------



## prepress

I have ordered and received a set of 12" pillars to modify my Sanus Euro EFAV rack, to give the C2300 more room (and to see those green-glowing tube LEDs) should I choose. I'm also planning to get some Gold Lion tubes, but now I'm wondering whether to use them in the line stage only or in the MM phono section as well (2 each). I ordered 4; the second pair could be for back-up if I go outboard with the phono. The Parasound JC3 phono preamp is on my mind, and that's dangerous. I figure the onboard phono of the 2300 is as good or better than my Aragon 47k unit (the salesguy thinks it's better) so this may be something to try out once things are up and running. I've been doing thumbnail sketches of potential layouts with and without the outboard phono stage so as to be ready.


There is also a tentative date of 3/16 for the TV stand change to take place. I'm hoping then or the 23rd, worst case. My friend who wants the Hooker console has some guys and a van available, so that's good.

*UPDATE:* I called the store and asked them to ship the C2300 on Thursday, so I should get it Friday/Monday. Even though I'm not set up for it and it will be in the way, I decided not to wait. Perhaps I can force the issue this way. I also want to get the new tubes in it before I rack it.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23010429
> 
> 
> I heard from the A/V guy I passed the specs. He didn't appear to find anything compelling in them either. So I'll be sticking with the 2300. Now I have to catch up with the friend who says she wants my Hooker TV console so I can get that out of here. To make room for the C2300 in my system I need to change out the console for something more compatible. We move on.



Ive googled the C2300 and it looks amazing Charles. Im looking forward in reading your reviews once its installed in your system.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23027157
> 
> 
> I have ordered and received a set of 12" pillars to modify my Sanus Euro EFAV rack, to give the C2300 more room (and to see those green-glowing tube LEDs) should I choose. I'm also planning to get some Gold Lion tubes, but now I'm wondering whether to use them in the line stage only or in the MM phono section as well (2 each). I ordered 4; the second pair could be for back-up if I go outboard with the phono. The Parasound JC3 phono preamp is on my mind, and that's dangerous. I figure the onboard phono of the 2300 is as good or better than my Aragon 47k unit (the salesguy thinks it's better) so this may be something to try out once things are up and running. I've been doing thumbnail sketches of potential layouts with and without the outboard phono stage so as to be ready.
> 
> 
> There is also a tentative date of 3/16 for the TV stand change to take place. I'm hoping then or the 23rd, worst case. My friend who wants the Hooker console has some guys and a van available, so that's good.
> 
> *UPDATE:* I called the store and asked them to ship the C2300 on Thursday, so I should get it Friday/Monday. Even though I'm not set up for it and it will be in the way, I decided not to wait. Perhaps I can force the issue this way. I also want to get the new tubes in it before I rack it.



Thats awesome Charles like you I would also like to see those green-glowing tube Leds. You must be excited I know I would be


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23034118
> 
> 
> Thats awesome Charles like you I would also like to see those green-glowing tube Leds. You must be excited I know I would be



Getting there...










The C2300's faceplate has a lip on it that's taller than the C2300's body, so I'd have actually about .75" clearance under the shelf above. I've been assured that there should be no heat issues by someone who has that same setup (and his Salamander is closed on the sides to boot). So I could use the Euro rack as is (8" shelves standard), but that's a different configuration from using the 12" pillars, which would make the rack only 1" taller because I'd use 5" pillars on the shelf below. Of course, the Euro isn't as wide as the TV and there is some concern about that being awkward-looking. but I've been inspired by ddgtr's setup and will try the Euro for a while. Besides, I have Euro racks to either side so they'll all match. I can always go for the Salamander later. Meantime I'll see how I can configure things to get the outside racks as short as possible. I hope that the height of the Euro doesn't elevate the TV too high; the Euro as is runs 31" high, same as the Salamander; changing pillars adds only one inch.


One other thought is that with the Salamander that would put my speakers a bit too close to one another, as the Salamander is 66" wide and the manual for my speakers recommends 6–8' apart. The outside racks would then go outside the speakers; otherwise I think the speakers would be too far apart. The system will take up more real estate than it already does if I go for the Salamander anyway, because I'd have to spread things out to accommodate it so it's best I try what I have first. I hope to find/make time to do some to-scale layouts rather than thumbnails on paper scraps!


----------



## prepress

Well, the Thursday delivery didn't happen. I postponed it. The reason is that I'm depending upon the friend who wants my Hooker cabinet. Today (Saturday) was out because she has a prior commitment. Next Saturday (the 16th) would be tight in terms of her preparation, but she will try. The following Saturday may not be good for me in that it's the day before I teach Sunday school and may need the time for lesson preparation. I'm beginning to think I will give her a drop-dead date of the 30th and move on if the cabinet is still here.


Meantime, I've begun tube research, another consuming operation, to me anyway. Some confusing (to me) info is out there, but I do read consistently good things about Genalex Gold Lions. Many C2300 owners use them and rave about them. Depending on where you get them they can run around $40–45 each; the store I bought my 2300 from has them for $75 each (those may be NOS tubes, I don't know). Tube rolling is _not_ on my agenda, so I want to have a reserve of two or at most three brands on hand and be done. Preferably one brand, but the Gold Lions cost a bit more than others so I don't know if it's them. Mullards, another popular brand, sell for less than $20 each. These prices are for reissues, not originals.


I plug onward.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23059732
> 
> 
> Well, the Thursday delivery didn't happen. I postponed it. The reason is that I'm depending upon the friend who wants my Hooker cabinet. Today (Saturday) was out because she has a prior commitment. Next Saturday (the 16th) would be tight in terms of her preparation, but she will try. The following Saturday may not be good for me in that it's the day before I teach Sunday school and may need the time for lesson preparation. I'm beginning to think I will give her a drop-dead date of the 30th and move on if the cabinet is still here.
> 
> 
> Meantime, I've begun tube research, another consuming operation, to me anyway. Some confusing (to me) info is out there, but I do read consistently good things about Genalex Gold Lions. Many C2300 owners use them and rave about them. Depending on where you get them they can run around $40–45 each; the store I bought my 2300 from has them for $75 each (those may be NOS tubes, I don't know). Tube rolling is _not_ on my agenda, so I want to have a reserve of two or at most three brands on hand and be done. Preferably one brand, but the Gold Lions cost a bit more than others so I don't know if it's them. Mullards, another popular brand, sell for less than $20 each. These prices are for reissues, not originals.
> 
> 
> I plug onward.



They're holding the Macintosh for you Charles?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23059844
> 
> 
> They're holding the Macintosh for you Charles?



Yes, waiting for me to give the okay to ship. I have been trying unsuccessfully to coordinate everything. But since others are involved (and their schedules) it can be tricky. So I think I will move on come month's end if nothing resolves before that. I will call 1-800-GOT JUNK and have the Hooker hauled away (too bad, as it's a nice piece of furniture) or the Salvation Army to see if they'll take it and another, smaller stand I have here.


The C2300 would fit inside the Hooker, but it would not be a comfortable fit and a nightmare if cable adjustments or other maintenance issues required turning the unit around or otherwise maneuvering it within that shelf space.


----------



## prepress

Three preliminary layouts (to scale) for the system with the C2300 in the mix. The 2300 is tight in the shelf, but it fits.

system 1.pdf 75k .pdf file

system 2.pdf 73k .pdf file

system 3.pdf 75k .pdf file


----------



## audioguy

Prepress:


If you like "gospel" music acapella, I have two recommendations.


The first is by a group called Take 6. Awesome CD, and many of the cuts on it are amazing.


Here is the album.  


The next is by a group called Selah. The specific cut I recommend (to start) is "Were You There". If you are in a bad place and just need lifting up and being reminded of what HE has done for you, this is the music. If you are in a good place and want to remember what HE has done for you, you will be lifted up even higher. The sound stage is a broad as a football field.


If you don't like either or both, send them to me and I will pay for the cost of the CD's as well as shipping to me.:


----------



## prepress

Here's one more layout. this one's dangerous; you'll note I snuck in another piece, a Parasound JC3 phono preamp. The C2300 is said to have a good phono stage built in, but this crossed my mind. It balances out the system nicely, at least.

system 4.pdf 75k .pdf file


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23064369
> 
> 
> Three preliminary layouts (to scale) for the system with the C2300 in the mix. The 2300 is tight in the shelf, but it fits.
> 
> system 1.pdf 75k .pdf file
> 
> system 2.pdf 73k .pdf file
> 
> system 3.pdf 75k .pdf file



I like system 1 and System 2 Charles its got some breathing space for the C2300. Its already a tight fit on the 3 of them but even more on the third one. At least with the first 2 if you need to take the unit out your able to fit your arm through from the top and gently pull it out with effort ( due to weight ). The Third one if you need to pull that out will only be able to fit your hands on either side of the unit.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23064894
> 
> 
> Prepress:
> 
> 
> If you like "gospel" music acapella, I have two recommendations.
> 
> 
> The first is by a group called Take 6. Awesome CD, and many of the cuts on it are amazing.
> 
> 
> Here is the album.
> 
> 
> The next is by a group called Selah. The specific cut I recommend (to start) is "Were You There". If you are in a bad place and just need lifting up and being reminded of what HE has done for you, this is the music. If you are in a good place and want to remember what HE has done for you, you will be lifted up even higher. The sound stage is a broad as a football field.
> 
> 
> If you don't like either or both, send them to me and I will pay for the cost of the CD's as well as shipping to me.:



I've heard Take 6 do both gospel and pop/jazz stuff; they are good. I've heard _of_ Selah, who are supposed to be good also. Perhaps I'll check these out. Amazon hasn't seen me in a while, nor has any brick and mortar store. Thanks for the suggestions.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/450#post_23066205
> 
> 
> Here's one more layout. this one's dangerous; you'll note I snuck in another piece, a Parasound JC3 phono preamp. The C2300 is said to have a good phono stage built in, but this crossed my mind. It balances out the system nicely, at least.
> 
> system 4.pdf 75k .pdf file



In regards to the C2300 thats a very tight fit.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23066223
> 
> 
> In regards to the C2300 thats a very tight fit.



It is, only 3/4" above. It would also mean I wasted the money on the 12" pillars. I've been assured this isn't an issue, heat-wise, by a trusted member of another forum. Still, it'd be nice to see those LEDs. So, here's a variation on system 4 I just did:

system 5.pdf 75k .pdf file


It would be nice if I had another component about the same size as the C2300, but I don't. So it looks awkward to me in the layout, but in real life may not be so bad. I hope not.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23066315
> 
> 
> It is, only 3/4" above. It would also mean I wasted the money on the 12" pillars. I've been assured this isn't an issue, heat-wise, by a trusted member of another forum. Still, it'd be nice to see those LEDs. So, here's a variation on system 4 I just did:
> 
> system 5.pdf 75k .pdf file
> 
> 
> It would be nice if I had another component about the same size as the C2300, but I don't. So it looks awkward to me in the layout, but in real life may not be so bad. I hope not.



I think it looks fine Charles. Is the cabinet you are buying is made of wood ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23066340
> 
> 
> I think it looks fine Charles. Is the cabinet you are buying is made of wood ?



Actually I'm going to use (for now) the stand I had before, which held my 27" Sony XBR. And, at 108 lbs. the Sony was heavier than my Kuro. It's a Sanus Euro just like the other racks, but an EFAV.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23067977
> 
> 
> Actually I'm going to use (for now) the stand I had before, which held my 27" Sony XBR. And, at 108 lbs. the Sony was heavier than my Kuro. It's a Sanus Euro just like the other racks, but an EFAV.



Sorry what's a EFAV ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23071311
> 
> 
> Sorry what's a EFAV ?



The Sanus Euro EFAV40. It's a modular A/V stand. It's only 40" wide, but it will hold the TV and it matches the EFAB stands to either side of the TV holding most of my gear. I have a rather poor photo of it in a previous post, and for the sake of convenience I'll re-post it here, along with an EFAB photo, dust and all:

  


It's holding my computer gear but I'm going to repurpose it for the stereo and TV. These Sanus racks are the basis for those system config PDFs I drew up.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23072445
> 
> 
> The Sanus Euro EFAV40. It's a modular A/V stand. It's only 40" wide, but it will hold the TV and it matches the EFAB stands to either side of the TV holding most of my gear. I have a rather poor photo of it in a previous post, and for the sake of convenience I'll re-post it here, along with an EFAB photo, dust and all:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's holding my computer gear but I'm going to repurpose it for the stereo and TV. These Sanus racks are the basis for those system config PDFs I drew up.



Its the model of your racks, thanks Charles I thought it was an acryonmn.







The racks dont look too bad.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23074803
> 
> 
> Its the model of your racks, thanks Charles I thought it was an acryonmn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The racks dont look too bad.



They're nice and basic, not fancy, and they're modular. Standard pillars (which come with the shelves) are 8"; you can get 5", 12" or 18" pillars separately.


I also ordered some aftermarket tubes for the preamp, for which the estimated delivery is Friday. Even though I can't really set up the preamp yet, I may go ahead and have the store ship it. It'll be in the way, but I could install the tubes (replacing the stock ones) and be ready to go once the racks are all organized. I could just look at it, too.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23077452
> 
> 
> They're nice and basic, not fancy, and they're modular. Standard pillars (which come with the shelves) are 8"; you can get 5", 12" or 18" pillars separately.
> 
> 
> I also ordered some aftermarket tubes for the preamp, for which the estimated delivery is Friday. Even though I can't really set up the preamp yet, I may go ahead and have the store ship it. It'll be in the way, but I could install the tubes (replacing the stock ones) and be ready to go once the racks are all organized. I could just look at it, too.



How come do you want to replace the stock ones?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23083159
> 
> 
> How come do you want to replace the stock ones?



Having been influenced by the audio forum I visit, and confirmed even by the store salesman, this is a common thing among tube fans. The stock tubes in the C2300 are not bad, but aftermarket tubes offer improvement and variety. "Tube rolling," as it's called, is a way to experiment with different flavors of sound, since different manufacturers' tubes can have different effects upon the sound. Some have a nice balanced sound, where others may emphasize one frequency range over another. Tubes are also a major component in guitar amplifiers, and there's plenty out there on those and users' experiences with various tubes.


On that audio forum I mentioned, Genalex Gold Lion tubes are highly popular in Mac gear. They cost more than many other brands (around $44 each), but produce excellent sound. If I don't like the ones I ordered (which arrived yesterday) maybe I'll go there. I'm considering leaving the stock tubes in for now, also, and using the ones I bought as backups. Maybe I'll see how things sound when everything's in place.


I've also told the store to ship the 2300, even though I'm not set up for it yet. Things will get interesting in here, space-wise. I have to work today, but when I get home perhaps I can do some organizing. I'd like things to move on a bit.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23086852
> 
> 
> Having been influenced by the audio forum I visit, and confirmed even by the store salesman, this is a common thing among tube fans. The stock tubes in the C2300 are not bad, but aftermarket tubes offer improvement and variety. "Tube rolling," as it's called, is a way to experiment with different flavors of sound, since different manufacturers' tubes can have different effects upon the sound. Some have a nice balanced sound, where others may emphasize one frequency range over another. Tubes are also a major component in guitar amplifiers, and there's plenty out there on those and users' experiences with various tubes.
> 
> 
> On that audio forum I mentioned, Genalex Gold Lion tubes are highly popular in Mac gear. They cost more than many other brands (around $44 each), but produce excellent sound. If I don't like the ones I ordered (which arrived yesterday) maybe I'll go there. I'm considering leaving the stock tubes in for now, also, and using the ones I bought as backups. Maybe I'll see how things sound when everything's in place.
> 
> 
> I've also told the store to ship the 2300, even though I'm not set up for it yet. Things will get interesting in here, space-wise. I have to work today, but when I get home perhaps I can do some organizing. I'd like things to move on a bit.



Thanks for that Charles I wasn't aware of "Tube Rolling". I was under the impression that the stock tubes inside the actual unit was the better bet but I guess you learn something new.


----------



## prepress

Okay. The next step in the saga has come . . .

 


I wasn't actually ready for it, but decided to have it ship anyway. I hope to at least get it out of the box and plugged in to make sure it functions in the next day or two. I may even be able to actually install it this weekend, too. We'll see.


----------



## ddgtr

Congrats Charles,


Looking forward to more pics once you unbox it...


----------



## jnnt29

Congratulations on your new addition! Can't wait to see your impressions.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23099732
> 
> 
> Okay. The next step in the saga has come . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wasn't actually ready for it, but decided to have it ship anyway. I hope to at least get it out of the box and plugged in to make sure
> 
> it functions in the next day or two. I may even be able to actually install it this weekend, too. We'll see.



Its finally arrived Charles congratulations. Can't wait to see more pics of this beast.


----------



## prepress

Since pictures are popular . . .

 

 

 

 

 


To be continued . . .


----------



## jnnt29




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23105282
> 
> 
> Since pictures are popular . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To be continued . . .



That is a thing of beauty! Can't wait until you have it set up!


----------



## BrolicBeast

prepress, your equipment just gets better and better...congrats on that new addition! How does it sound in your system? I'm also looking forward to the additional pics alluded to in your "to be continued" caption.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23105282
> 
> 
> Since pictures are popular . . .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To be continued . . .



Now that is a beautiful piece of equipment Charles.


----------



## prepress

A message on my answering machine suggests my friend is coming over Saturday afternoon to get the Hooker console. I'll try and catch her tonight to confirm. If that isn't derailed, I could be fully functional this weekend or early next week. What that means is tomorrow evening I will dismantle the computer setup to switch out racks, then Saturday AM the stereo gets dismantled. Once she and her cohorts have left I'll put everything back together (with the C2300 in place). If need be, I'll reconfigure the outside racks at that point, re-rack then connect everything, and away we go.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23105651
> 
> 
> prepress, your equipment just gets better and better...congrats on that new addition! *How does it sound in your system?* I'm also looking forward to the additional pics alluded to in your "to be continued" caption.



Patience grasshopper, patience; it's not connected just yet . . . hoping to be in a position to answer the question early next week, though.


----------



## prepress

Murphy's law intruded in a big way Saturday. The friend didn't come to get the console, and as a result I have no stereo, since I took it partially apart in anticipation of making moves. At least I re-did the computer setup in the process.

 


Meantime, a lot of what I did had to be undone so I could move around (not to mention get into bed). I heard from her last night (finally), and either today or Tuesday she will bring her son to at least help me move some things around so I can set up the stereo with the C2300 in place. There apparently was some controversy with her father (in town to visit) about adding extra clutter to a small apartment (she hadn't yet rearranged to receive the console). If I still have it when her father leaves we will proceed, but I am no longer obligated to keep it. Besides, I'll have to move a cabinet I have nowhere to place, so it wouldn't be that convenient for me. Still, I went too far to set everything back the way it was. Things have to go forward now.


----------



## prepress

Happy Easter to all!


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23147699
> 
> 
> Happy Easter to all!



Happy Easter Charles


----------



## prepress

The friend was supposed to come either Palm Sunday or last Tuesday with her son to help me move stuff around. She did not come or call, and so I am going to move on. I will first attempt to donate the Hooker console; if that fails, despite it being a nice piece of furniture, I _will_ have it hauled away.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23154571
> 
> 
> The friend was supposed to come either Palm Sunday or last Tuesday with her son to help me move stuff around. She did not come or call, and so I am going to move on. I will first attempt to donate the Hooker console; if that fails, despite it being a nice piece of furniture, I _will_ have it hauled away.


*Update:* I called Project Hope yesterday about the Hooker; they were supposed to get back to me today on whether they could come get it. I didn't hear from them yet, so I called 1-800-GOT JUNK about 45 minutes ago. They are scheduled to come Saturday afternoon to take both the Hooker and an old CD player not getting much use. Things are grinding along. If this works out I could be set up this weekend.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23154571
> 
> 
> The friend was supposed to come either Palm Sunday or last Tuesday with her son to help me move stuff around. She did not come or call, and so I am going to move on. I will first attempt to donate the Hooker console; if that fails, despite it being a nice piece of furniture, I _will_ have it hauled away.



Did the friend end up apologising Charles for not calling you or coming to help?


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23161107
> 
> *Update:* I called Project Hope yesterday about the Hooker; they were supposed to get back to me today on whether they could come get it. I didn't hear from them yet, so I called 1-800-GOT JUNK about 45 minutes ago. They are scheduled to come Saturday afternoon to take both the Hooker and an old CD player not getting much use. Things are grinding along. If this works out I could be set up this weekend.



Lets hope it goes to plan


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23162282
> 
> 
> Did the friend end up apologising Charles for not calling you or coming to help?



I haven't heard from her, actually. Her life is a bit chaotic with her father in town and son also (he presumably left last Thursday, headed back to the Marines). I hope things are okay and will call soon if I don't hear from her.


----------



## prepress

After an unsuccessful attempt to donate the Hooker cabinet, i called 1-800 GOT JUNK and they came yesterday to take the Hooker cabinet and a few other small items. Here is the Hooker in all its dusty glory:

 



Here is how things looked when the GOT JUNK guys left (excellent service, by the way):

 



And here's where I left off last night:

 


I should have dusted behind & between these racks before beginning to install; perhaps I'll take care of that before continuing.


I also had some new tubes I wanted to install in the 2300 to replace the stock ones, but couldn't get the two screws on the top cover loose. I was told McIntosh units can be difficult to open. I may need to get a #2 philips screwdriver, as best results have been reported with those. I don't know if I have one, but a new or near-new head was stressed. And I didn't set up the right rack because I need a prop or two to level it better. So that's a task for either today after church or tomorrow.


----------



## BrolicBeast

That looks much better than the Hooker cabinet. I'm glad you finally got a solution, as I know you've been working toward replacing the Hooker for a year or so--if I remember correctly, the new main stand is the re-purposed computer stand? If that's the case, then it's amazing what can be right under our noses, but unnoticed until that "I can use this" epiphany occurs. Looking good man!


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/480#post_23066213
> 
> 
> I've heard Take 6 do both gospel and pop/jazz stuff; they are good. I've heard _of_ Selah, who are supposed to be good also. Perhaps I'll check these out. Amazon hasn't seen me in a while, nor has any brick and mortar store. Thanks for the suggestions.



The first Selah song you have to queue up is "You Are My Hiding Place." The harmony on the chorus is hair-raising in its richness and inspiration as well.


Edit: The song may be called "I Turn To You"...my memory ain't what it used to be.


----------



## prepress

The end of day two:

 


I'm going to relax now, maybe get after the paper mountain in here left when I moved the Hooker console out (and all the manuals, old 45s and other things which have nowhere to go at the moment).


Getting behind the racks to connect things is awkward, and it can be tiring. My low back was sore from yesterday's work, and it still is. I need to start doing some deadlifts at the gym.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23175395
> 
> 
> That looks much better than the Hooker cabinet. I'm glad you finally got a solution, as I know you've been working toward replacing the Hooker for a year or so--if I remember correctly, the new main stand is the re-purposed computer stand? If that's the case, then it's amazing what can be right under our noses, but unnoticed until that "I can use this" epiphany occurs. Looking good man!



Thanks for the encouragement, BB. Yes, the Sanus Euro was the computer stand. Before that, though, it held my previous TV. Unfortunately I was obsessed with having a stand as wide as the new TV. The Hooker was a somewhat hasty decision because it looked good and the Pioneer was sitting in the store waiting on me to get a stand. So I come back to the Sanus, and in the long run wasted the cost of the Hooker if I want to look at it that way.


I still didn't dust behind the racks today. I'm going to have to do that at some point now that it's exposed. I have an air filter which might mitigate the dust in here, but I have to figure out where to put it. And I need to do something with the empty shelf I'm going to have. I may shuffle things a bit, or use that shelf for those manuals, or magazines maybe.


----------



## jnnt29

Looks great! Can't wait to hear your impressions of the sound.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23175403
> 
> 
> The first Selah song you have to queue up is "You Are My Hiding Place." The harmony on the chorus is hair-raising in its richness and inspiration as well.
> 
> 
> Edit: The song may be called "I Turn To You"...my memory ain't what it used to be.



Kind Mr. Beast: On which of the Selah CD's did you find "You Are My Hiding Place"? I listened to it on YouTube!! L O V E the words and the music!!


----------



## prepress

At roughly 1:55pm, everything was connected. I think I got it this time. Several stops and starts with power cords, you understand. Forgetting I hadn't connected something.

 

 

 

 



I still have to dust behind everything, the left side in particular, and I haven't played anything yet. For now, I want to get something to eat. I'll try playing something later, if there's time. The configuration allows for some interconnects that are too short. It was quite difficult to get behind the racks comfortably, and not like the good old days when I could just spin components around and connect them; some equipment was smaller then. I may do a reconfig at some point, moving the Duo VP so I can use the leftover Pangea HDMI I have.


Mostly, I'm tired.


----------



## prepress

Before installing the C2300, I had planned to put in some aftermarket tubes to replace the stock ones, but found it difficult to get the lid off. In fact, I was beginning to strip the front screws a bit so I stopped that and finished the connections as described. Having finally connected everything, the 2300 was ready. I started with CDs. I was greeted rudely by a rather bright sound (the store demo was bright as well) and weak dynamics (the demo had dynamics up the gazoo). But I also had a more open presentation, with detail I hadn't heard (or noticed at least) before. On America's _Horse with no Name_ at one point, a guitar was coming from almost beside me, and I'm 9 feet away from the speakers!


But there was definitely a bright, hard sound to things which was puzzling. And distressing. "It sat unused for almost seven weeks" I reasoned, figuring maybe it needed to break in again. I have been giving it more time bit by bit, and yesterday I thought it sounded a bit better. It had a total of 4 hours on it as I started today, and I will say things have improved. The dynamics are better and things aren't quite as bright. Kettle drums in the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra's _Fanfare for the Common Man_ had more of the appropriate thunder and impact. And as the salesman pointed out, the 2300 sat for over a month unused, so the capacitors lost their charge. But as John Lee Hooker's _The Healer_ plays in the background, it's obvious things are not what they were Monday. That's a good thing. And to fair, I was playing a lot of 60s music, not the best-recorded stuff around.


It's a different sound than I'm used to, so I'll give it some time to adjust. The solid-state preamp I used before (Audio Research LS3) offered an overall tighter presentation, but with less of the dimensionality I sometimes hear with the tubes. Dare I say it, the 2300 offers more of a soundstage. Switching to blu-ray, _The Avengers_ sounded good right away; Issues I heard with CDs seemed to be missing. I need to get to the tuner, laserdisc (yes) and turntable to try those sources. I am feeling better about things than I did earlier in the week. I will probably change out the interconnects to what I used pre-2300. And when I'm feeling my oats, maybe revisit the tube switch.


----------



## Waboman

Hey there, prepress.


I didn't know you bought a C2300. A big congrats, amigo. That's awesome. Your system is really looking nice. Well done, sir.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23179752
> 
> 
> At roughly 1:55pm, everything was connected. I think I got it this time. Several stops and starts with power cords, you understand. Forgetting I hadn't connected something.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I still have to dust behind everything, the left side in particular, and I haven't played anything yet. For now, I want to get something to eat. I'll try playing something later, if there's time. The configuration allows for some interconnects that are too short. It was quite difficult to get behind the racks comfortably, and not like the good old days when I could just spin components around and connect them; some equipment was smaller then. I may do a reconfig at some point, moving the Duo VP so I can use the leftover Pangea HDMI I have.
> 
> 
> Mostly, I'm tired.



Looking very nice Charles


----------



## prepress

There is a big audio show in NYC this weekend. I won't be going to the show, but I did make it to Lyric Hifi's VIP open house last night, held in conjunction with the NY show (a regular open house was held during normal hours). It was the first time I'd done anything like this.


I spent most of the time in a demo of the McIntosh XRT1K speakers ($35,000/pair), part of a 5.1 setup driven by, of course, Mac electronics with Kaleidescape as the source. I heard and saw various demo material (via Runco projector) both with the full 5.1 and the 1Ks only in 2-channel mode, and I thought it sounded great. I also spent a bit of time with Simaudio monos driving some big Focals, with a dCS source. That sounded good too. The cure for what I experienced is lack of funds and to play some music today on what I have. If I were in the market and could afford them (and had room) I'd really consider the XRT1Ks, but the XR200 makes more sense in my space. Even those are $20,000/pair, so that's not happening either. as I said, lack of funds.


It was fun to listen, soak up the atmosphere and listen in on some of the conversations. There's another open house at Lyric today, but I still have cleaning/straightening up to do in here.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23198446
> 
> 
> Looking very nice Charles



Thanks, Franin. However, to my consternation, the right equipment rack is about 1.5" too far forward.







That's gong to bother me. It's a lot of work to fix that but I'm crazy enough to do it.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Waboman*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23198417
> 
> 
> Hey there, prepress.
> 
> 
> I didn't know you bought a C2300. A big congrats, amigo. That's awesome. Your system is really looking nice. Well done, sir.



And I'm not a tube person, despite this. Overwhelming positive reports and recommendations, plus a discount on the demo unit, helped. I'll give it some more time to get settled in before any significant moves (i.e., rolling tubes or getting rid of it). Meantime, I am going to try putting the pre-2300 interconnects back on the CD player (Kimber Hero); the ones I had on my BD player are there now. I hope the Kimbers are long enough.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23198774
> 
> 
> The cure for what I experienced is lack of funds and to play some music today on what I have.



Charles I bet when you played music on your system it put a smile on your face. You have an amazing system mate.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23198777
> 
> 
> Thanks, Franin. However, to my consternation, the right equipment rack is about 1.5" too far forward.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's gong to bother me. It's a lot of work to fix that but I'm crazy enough to do it.



Yeah im like that if something bothers me I have to fix it


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23198895
> 
> 
> Yeah im like that if something bothers me I have to fix it



I fixed it. Everything lines up better now. On to other things like straightening up, needed desperately.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23200262
> 
> 
> I fixed it. Everything lines up better now. On to other things like straightening up, needed desperately.



After you finish sit back, put on a nice album and relax


----------



## prepress

This is a better look at the main rack.

 


Whether it stays this way I don't know. For now, it stays. I'm not using one of my Pangea HD-26L HDMIs because it's too short to reach the Duo VP on the left rack from the Oppo 83 in the main rack. Those are no longer available in 2m, so an alternative would be the HD-24PCe. Otherwise it's repositioning of components and the accompanying hassles.


----------



## prepress

A few more sessions with the preamp, a couple of LPs and about an hour on the tuner. It sounds as if the phono tubes need to break in, as the sound is also without much bass impact.


I also notice that, in some cases, the midrange and highs are pushed forward, perhaps at the expense of the lower frequencies. I have my demo track from _Yes: Live at Montreaux_, the Rick Wakeman solo, and noticed that the transients and leading edges of notes were stronger than with my ARC LS3, almost to the point of obscuring the main notes themselves. On the other hand, the notes from the synths were nice and clear, better than with the LS3. I have decided to swap out the tubes but prefer the dealer do it. My attempt appeared to strip the screws a bit; they are over-torqued, to be sure, and I am wary of stripping them so they can't be gotten out. In the next few weeks I will do that. I have some tubes here, bought before the 2300 arrived. If I like them, I'm set. If they at least make an improvement, then it's the famed Gold Lions. If _that_ doesn't do it, then . . .


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23255252
> 
> 
> A few more sessions with the preamp, a couple of LPs and about an hour on the tuner. It sounds as if the phono tubes need to break in, as the sound is also without much bass impact.
> 
> 
> I also notice that, in some cases, the midrange and highs are pushed forward, perhaps at the expense of the lower frequencies. I have my demo track from _Yes: Live at Montreaux_, the Rick Wakeman solo, and noticed that the transients and leaing edges of notes were stronger than with my ARC LS3, almost to the point of obscuring the main notes themselves. On the other hand, the notes from the synths were nice and clear, better than with the LS3. I have decided to swap out the tubes but prefer the dealer do it. My attempt appeared to strip the screws a bit; they are over-torqued, to be sure, and I am wary of stripping them so they can't be gotten out. In the next few weeks I will do that. I have some tubes here, bought before the 2300 arrived. If I like them, I'm set. If they at least make an improvement, then it's the famed Gold Lions. If _that_ doesn't do it, then . . .



Transients? Highs pushed forward? You, my friend, are officially an audiophile.










On a serious note though, from your last few posts, I don't get the feeling that the new Mac Pre-amp is meeting your expectations. I hope the new tubes do the trick, man.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23255603
> 
> 
> Transients? Highs pushed forward? You, my friend, are officially an audiophile.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On a serious note though, from your last few posts, I don't get the feeling that the new Mac Pre-amp is meeting your expectations. I hope the new tubes do the trick, man.



Yeah, that does sound audiophile-ish, but it's what I noticed with a very familiar track and it was obvious. At the same time, detail in general is better. That, I'm happy about. I'm not a hobbyist, though. I merely have occasional interest.










Another thing is that this preamp is exposing bad recordings. The older sixties stuff I started out playing was pretty bright-sounding; it's mellowed some, but not enough to overcome the impression. And the more open sound contributes, too. Most folks replace the stock tubes, and I'm going down that road. I might try other interconnects on the preamp, but the ones I'm using cost a lot (to me, anyway). A dangerous thing to do, then, but perhaps curiosity will win. I do have some old interconnects here.


However, _The Avengers_ rocked!


----------



## prepress

As for the problem with my air conditioner being on the same line as my system, I bought this:

 


I haven't used it yet, as it's not warm enough to engage the A/C. It will carry the system around the corner to the opposite wall, which is supposed to be on a different line. I wanted yellow, but only the 3-plug head version was in stock. At least the color matches the Mac meters on my gear.


For all its advantages over the Tripplite LCR2400 it replaced, the Furman SPR-20i has a higher low-voltage threshold and a lower high-voltage one than the LCR. The A/C compressor kicking in didn't bother the Tripplite gear, nor does it bother the Furman Elite I have. But with the LCR2400, ConEd hadn't done their stuff on the lines outside then. The SPR is straight into the wall now, and the extension comes into play if the SPR still shuts down when the A/C engages. We'll test it when the weather is warmer consistently enough.


----------



## Franin

How much would it cost for the electrician to put a separate line for the air con?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23279519
> 
> 
> How much would it cost for the electrician to put a separate line for the air con?



Well, the problem there is that I rent, so running a separate line isn't an option. It would also involve going through the apartment below me and it's a mess all around. My previous apartment had a dedicated line for the A/C but there were other issues which led me to move. At least, the extension should work as there was a time previously when I ran an extension around the corner to the next room with the Tripplite LCR and don't recall any problems. But again, that was well before the latest ConEd work. I've yet to do that with the SPR in the 2 years I've had it.


A major difference with the two units is that the LCR didn't have automatic shutdown. It was strictly voltage regulation and line filtering. But when the A/C compressor would kick in, I did note the behavior of the indicators on the LCR, that they did at times register high voltage, sometimes low; sometimes they didn't register any change. That was after some previous ConEd work several years ago (not the latest that's created this new issue).


----------



## prepress

Today I expect to be off to the annual Value Electronics flat-panel shoot-out up in Scarsdale. I would be leaving in a few hours. For now, I'm going to grab some lunch.


I have heard about how good the latest Panasonic ZT plasmas are supposed to be. And the top-of-the-line Sony LED is supposed to be excellent as well; tentatively the XBR-X900A 4K Ultra High Definition set will be there. I don't know which models will be at the shoot-out, but I can expect Panasonic, Samsung and LG to be represented. Mind you, I still enjoy my PRO-111FD so I'm not in the market, but this experience will give me an idea of a potential replacement should my 111 ever bite the dust with no hope of repair at a reasonable cost. There are conflicting reports regarding Panasonic exiting the plasma business at some point, so that would bear watching. OLED would be its presumed successor. We'll see what the evening holds.


----------



## BrolicBeast

I look forward to hearing your report on the Sony 4K and Panasonic ZT models....I plan to get one of those for my upstairs media room. I've seen the Sony at the Magnolia Design Center in Columbia, but the content wasn't too impressive (I don't think it was 4K content).


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23304267
> 
> 
> I look forward to hearing your report on the Sony 4K and Panasonic ZT models....I plan to get one of those for my upstairs media room. I've seen the Sony at the Magnolia Design Center in Columbia, but the content wasn't too impressive (I don't think it was 4K content).



At the shoot-out, I was mildly amazed that there were no LG sets in the mix; I don't know why. The sets involved were: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Panasonic TC-P65VT60, Samsung PN64F8500, Sony XBR-X900A (4K, 55"), Panasonic TC-L47WT60, and Samsung UN46F8000. And for comparison, a 50" Pioneer Kuro KRP 600M; it wasn't officially part of the proceedings.


Frankly, all the plasmas were good. I didn't stay to see who actually won, but I bet it was the Panasonic VT set. It and the more expensive ZT are virtually identical in all respects. One difference is the ZT series has circuitry that allows it to adjust the black level based upon the amount of ambient light in the room, so when the lights were on it had deeper black than the VT set; with lights off it was hard to tell any difference. The Samsung would be great for someone who wants plasma but has a bright room. It has increased light output and was set at 40 ft-l, as opposed to the Panasonics' 30 ft-l. The Sony did have some motion resolution issues and, as is typical of LCD, suffered some when viewed off-axis. But it strutted its stuff when fed true 4K material, which Sony provided via a pre-loaded hard drive. You could see the difference in a split screen featuring 1080 vs. 4K comparison. Plus, it has a nice on-board sound system, a real selling point for me; that was one of the reasons I got my PRO-111. As for the Panasonic and Samsung LCDs, they had problems with grayscale and some dynamic range issues as I recall (I didn't take notes; I forgot paper or a pad). I didn't like their look.


There was one unofficial vote, not part of the results, on whether the Panasonics had equalled or surpassed the Kuro. Despite the 9.5-gen Kuro being 4 years old, I was hard-pressed to say yes, at least in an overall sense. Overall, I thought not, despite how good the Panasonics are. The Kuro is still the reference. On this question, I voted "no" and added, "but _very_ close."


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23307084
> 
> 
> At the shoot-out, I was mildly amazed that there were no LG sets in the mix; I don't know why. The sets involved were: Panasonic TC-P65ZT60, Panasonic TC-P65VT60, Samsung PN64F8500, Sony XBR-X900A (4K, 55"), Panasonic TC-L47WT60, and Samsung UN46F8000. And for comparison, a 50" Pioneer Kuro KRP 600M; it wasn't officially part of the proceedings.
> 
> 
> Frankly, all the plasmas were good. I didn't stay to see who actually won, but I bet it was the Panasonic VT set. It and the more expensive ZT are virtually identical in all respects. One difference is the ZT series has circuitry that allows it to adjust the black level based upon the amount of ambient light in the room, so when the lights were on it had deeper black than the VT set; with lights off it was hard to tell any difference. The Samsung would be great for someone who wants plasma but has a bright room. It has increased light output and was set at 40 ft-l, as opposed to the Panasonics' 30 ft-l. The Sony did have some motion resolution issues and, as is typical of LCD, suffered some when viewed off-axis. But it strutted its stuff when fed true 4K material, which Sony provided via a pre-loaded hard drive. You could see the difference in a split screen featuring 1080 vs. 4K comparison. Plus, it has a nice on-board sound system, a real selling point for me; that was one of the reasons I got my PRO-111. As for the Panasonic and Samsung LCDs, they had problems with grayscale and some dynamic range issues as I recall (I didn't take notes; I forgot paper or a pad). I didn't like their look.
> 
> 
> There was one unofficial vote, not part of the results, on whether the Panasonics had equalled or surpassed the Kuro. Despite the 9.5-gen Kuro being 4 years old, I was hard-pressed to say yes, at least in an overall sense. Overall, I thought not, despite how good the Panasonics are. The Kuro is still the reference. On this question, I voted "no" and added, "but _very_ close."



Great write-up Prepress. I am surprised that the Panasonics did not out-perform the Kuro. I'm a long-time Panasonic fan (I still have a 50PX77U in use, circa 2007). Ah, so the Sony 900 really flexed its stuff, huh? It sounds like the differences between the ZT and VT series really are minimal. Do you recall how the Sony's 1080p image performed against the VT?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/510#post_23310606
> 
> 
> Great write-up Prepress. I am surprised that the Panasonics did not out-perform the Kuro. I'm a long-time Panasonic fan (I still have a 50PX77U in use, circa 2007). Ah, so the Sony 900 really flexed its stuff, huh? It sounds like the differences between the ZT and VT series really are minimal. Do you recall how the Sony's 1080p image performed against the VT?



I thought the Sony had a nice, crisp picture, but compared to the plasmas had a bit of a yellowish tint as we watched _Lawrence of Arabia_. It looked much better, I thought, than the other two LCDs though. The Panasonics had better color than the Sony, and with a black screen the Sony had a bluish tint which was evident even dead-on; it was more pronounced off axis.


The difference between the Kuro and the VT and ZT plasmas was rather subtle; I could certainly live with either one, even now. I wasn't the only one who shared this sentiment, either. I don't know how the final votes went. But it seemed to be that in an overall sense, the Kuro was still better, but that next year's Panasonics would likey equal or better it if the level of improvement is anything like the current models have over last year's. The Samsung, from what I understood, loses a bit of picture quality if you turn the brightness down; it really does sound like a better choice for a bright room.


----------



## Franin

Thanks for that Charles, how much improvement did you see 4K over 1080p? Would you say night and day difference?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23313336
> 
> 
> Thanks for that Charles, how much improvement did you see 4K over 1080p? Would you say night and day difference?



Depending upon the material, yes. At least, the difference was obvious. One side-by-side shot of a newspaper page showed it well. I was too far away to actually read the copy, but the 4K side was obviously cleaner and clearer.


----------



## prepress

I forgot to mention Rob Sabin of _Home Theater_ magazine was at the shoot-out, so I wouldn't be surprised to see some sort of write-up in an upcoming issue. Larry Weber, plasma's inventor, was there also.


And as an aside, there were some KILLER homemade cookies as part of the refreshments. One of the VE owner's daughters made them.


----------



## prepress

Okay. Yesterday I took the C2300 in to the store to let them change out the stock tubes in there. I did something I hadn't planned, as instead of using the ones I'd already bought, at the salesman's suggestion I ended up with Amperex NOS (new old stock) tubes. Amperex is/was a North American Philips company. I also plan to get a spare set of screws for the 2300's top cover, since one of the screws is indeed stripped. And it was my concern over this which led me to take it to the store in the first place. The torque on the screws was tremendous, definitely over-tightened by McIntosh's factory, but now I'll be able to roll tubes myself. A friend drove me there and back; she also got some DVDs and lunch for her trouble.


Getting everything reconnected, I played a few songs and watched part of _The Best of Both Worlds_, the Star Trek: TNG 2-part cliffhanger which is out on Blu-ray. It looks and sounds great, by the way. The sound was immediately more open and perhaps more detailed than the stock tubes. The Amperex lower frequencies seemed a bit stronger out of the box than with the stock tubes, but they probably need a few more hours to settle in; I've heard maybe 20–30 in general. There was a clarity to the sound that gave things a more "in the room" quality as well. On _A Horse with No Name_, sound stretched outside the speaker boundaries (again). I'm hoping the low frequencies will fill in more and the sound smooth out after a while. Onward!


By the way, I bought Selah's _Press On_ and _Greatest Hits_ by Take 6. I haven't played them yet.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23332329
> 
> 
> 
> By the way, I bought Selah's _Press On_ and _Greatest Hits_ by Take 6. I haven't played them yet.



I will be anxious to hear your thoughts. I have some "non-religious" friends who love both of these CD's but for those of faith, they are extra special.


----------



## pcweber111

Charles I got to see the new Sony at a local Best Buy and I was underwhelmed. I'm sure I probably saw the same demo as you but BB had the demo in the worst area possible (harsh lighting) and the tv wasn't calibrated one bit. Saying that it was impressive and you can get close and still see plenty of detail but it being an LCD turned me off. I want to see a 4K plasma or OLED.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23348648
> 
> 
> Charles I got to see the new Sony at a local Best Buy and I was underwhelmed. I'm sure I probably saw the same demo as you but BB had the demo in the worst area possible (harsh lighting) and the tv wasn't calibrated one bit. Saying that it was impressive and you can get close and still see plenty of detail but it being an LCD turned me off. I want to see a 4K plasma or OLED.



The Sony 4K I saw was professionally calibrated and in proper lighting, a nice movie-dark room. And the color (on non-4K material, anyway) was exposed, being as it was next to a Panasonic VT plasma. The Sony had a bit of a yellowish tint to the color by comparison on _Lawrence of Arabia_. And it didn't do as well as the other sets on some of the technical tests the calibrators ran. In fact, I would take either of the Panasonic plasmas over that Sony any time. Or the Samsung plasma, if my room was somewhat bright.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23314594
> 
> 
> I forgot to mention Rob Sabin of _Home Theater_ magazine was at the shoot-out, so I wouldn't be surprised to see some sort of write-up in an upcoming issue. Larry Weber, plasma's inventor, was there also.
> 
> 
> And as an aside, there were some KILLER homemade cookies as part of the refreshments. One of the VE owner's daughters made them.



Here is the _Home Theater_ write-up of the event.
http://www.hometheater.com/content/value-electronics-hdtv-shootout-and-then-there-were-three


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23333217
> 
> 
> I will be anxious to hear your thoughts. I have some "non-religious" friends who love both of these CD's but for those of faith, they are extra special.



I played Selah last night, and I like the voices. As for the songs, the traditional hymns were best to me. Traditional hymns have strong theological/doctrinal content, whereas "praise" songs like _Oh Draw Me Lord_ don't do much for me generally. Russ Taff's guest turn on _Were You there_ was a highlight, as was _Amazing Grace_.


----------



## prepress

Call me impatient, I suppose, but not being pleased with the sound on the moving-magnet phono section, I re-installed my phono preamp and am using the 2300 as a line stage. What an improvement on the sound! The MM tubes probably needed their 20-30 hours of break-in apart form the line stage tubes, but I decided to make this move anyway. I will stay with this configuration, I think. And the tubes in there, which are better than the stock tubes, have begun to _thump_ when called for. _The Avengers_ was thumping more than previously, for sure. The overall sound filled in some more. I'm getting happier.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23377105
> 
> 
> Call me impatient, I suppose, but not being pleased with the sound on the moving-magnet phono section, I re-installed my phono preamp and am using the 2300 as a line stage. What an improvement on the sound! The MM tubes probably needed their 20-30 hours of break-in apart form the line stage tubes, but I decided to make this move anyway. I will stay with this configuration, I think. And the tubes in there, which are better than the stock tubes, have begun to _thump_ when called for. _The Avengers_ was thumping more than previously, for sure. The overall sound filled in some more. I'm getting happier.



This a perfect example of that rare moment when all things align and *BOOM*--a pleasant surprise is born! I'm glad you found a config that wholly satisfying!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23378346
> 
> 
> This a perfect example of that rare moment when all things align and *BOOM*--a pleasant surprise is born! I'm glad you found a config that wholly satisfying!



I still have the JJ ECC803s Gold Pin tubes I bought before the C2300 arrived, and perhaps will try them at some point. This is the description from Tube Depot:

_This tube provides a forward sounding, full-bodied low end response with a weighty, dynamic midrange easily compared to the Telefunken ECC803s. Its high end response is controlled yet warm with a very pleasant depth of field that extends the full sonic landscape. This tube is perfect as the first gain stage in most HiFi audio equipment. Especially useful for taming brittle digital sources such as MP3, CD and DVD players.
_

Some CDs sound a bit hard at the top end, especially older stuff not recorded well. And because of the improvement I have now, I'm curious. Changing tubes is a pain, as I have to disconnect the preamp and pull it from the rack to do that. Still, if curiosity wins, I will.


On another note, the power problem I was having with my system shutting down whenever the air conditioner's compressor kicked in has been solved, it seems. When the system was reconfigured, I plugged my Furman Elite–15 PFi into the SPR voltage regulator; it had been the other way around. The SPR now goes into the wall. The A/C has engaged twice with no problem. The problem seems to have been the SPR being plugged into one of the Elite's power factor plugs, those with the current reserve. I'm keeping the extension cord I got, but it doesn't appear I'll need it. Still, one never knows.


----------



## prepress

The VE shootout is on YouTube. Check out the Q & A session at about 17:50 in. I asked a question!

http://www.youtube.com/user/HDTVShootout


----------



## BrolicBeast

Hey prepress, here's the link to the Q/A section: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcXcsN37v1I 


The original link goes to an opening of a previous shootout.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23388199
> 
> 
> Hey prepress, here's the link to the Q/A section: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcXcsN37v1I
> 
> 
> The original link goes to an opening of a previous shootout.



Your link goes directly to the Q & A. Mine goes to the main page and the Q & A has to be selected underneath that introductory video (2nd from the left), as well as other excerpts. I gave the general page so folks could look at other stuff besides that. But yes, there are not only 2013 videos but previous years on that page, too.


----------



## prepress

Well, I took the plunge and rolled tubes in my C2300 to the JJ ECC803s tubes I bought prior to the 2300's arrival. There aren't many hours on them, but so far so good. It takes 20–30 hours for tubes to break in, and at that point you pretty much have what they will sound like. We'll see. The Amperex tubes sounded really nice, but I want to see if the JJs have more thump to them. If so, they stay in.


I am still considering a Marantz MM-7025 power amp to supplant the Harmon-Kardon receiver on the small second system in the bedroom. It doesn't get much use these days, but may during the summer. I can pair it with the Marantz DV8400 and Denon TU-800 displaced from the main system, along with the old B&K PRO-10MC preamp. Plus, at 140wpc, the Marantz will drive my Mirages if need be, or see use with L/R surrounds if I ever got crazy on the main setup; unlikely in this apartment, but who knows?


----------



## prepress

I did something last night that may have improved the chances I'll keep the McIntosh C2300 in the mix here. I was watching _Jeff Beck Live at Ronnie Scott's_ last night, and was again aware that the low frequencies were lacking _thump_. It's not good when you can't enjoy what you're watching because you're too aware of what's missing. Despite the other marvelous things this pre does, it still lacked in the bottom frequencies to my ears and in my system. I was actually beginning to consider trading it in or selling it for something else.


Then the idea struck to try the tone controls. So I went into the menu and turned the bass up from 0 to 2dB (the range is +/- 12dB). TRANSFORMATION. Things filled in, weight increased, and with no apparent damage to the mids or highs. I knew this was supposed to be a pretty sophisticated implementation, but I was quite impressed. On to _Yes Live at Montreaux_. Same thing. In fact, this sounds like what I get from my ARC LS3, except better due to the more open sound. The +2 is more than enough.


The tubes also need another 10-15 hours to be broken in more fully, but this is great! I'll throw on _Avengers_ excerpts to see what's happening there next. The purist part of me feels a bit strange about having to resort to the tone controls, but I won't argue with what it's done to the sound.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23430387
> 
> 
> I did something last night that may have improved the chances I'll keep the McIntosh C2300 in the mix here. I was watching _Jeff Beck Live at Ronnie Scott's_ last night, and was again aware that the low frequencies were lacking _thump_. It's not good when you can't enjoy what you're watching because you're too aware of what's missing. Despite the other marvelous things this pre does, it still lacked in the bottom frequencies to my ears and in my system. I was actually beginning to consider trading it in or selling it for something else.
> 
> 
> Then the idea struck to try the tone controls. So I went into the menu and turned the bass up from 0 to 2dB (the range is +/- 12dB). TRANSFORMATION. Things filled in, weight increased, and with no apparent damage to the mids or highs. I knew this was supposed to be a pretty sophisticated implementation, but I was quite impressed. On to _Yes Live at Montreaux_. Same thing. In fact, this sounds like what I get from my ARC LS3, except better due to the more open sound. The +2 is more than enough.
> 
> 
> The tubes also need another 10-15 hours to be broken in more fully, but this is great! I'll throw on _Avengers_ excerpts to see what's happening there next. The purist part of me feels a bit strange about having to resort to the tone controls, but I won't argue with what it's done to the sound.



Hey prepress, I'm glad that you're one step closer to complete satisfaction. There's nothing wrong with tone controls if they improve the sound. For lack of a better analogy, if a man's wife gets artificial implants in her chest area--sure, she wasn't born with them, but does that make them any less....errr....useful? The answer is a resounding no! (provided her doctor did a good job







). i'm very happy that the tone control has improved your enjoyment of your music--and, even better, you're getting that improvement even before the break-in period is over! You can only go upward from here.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23430387
> 
> 
> I did something last night that may have improved the chances I'll keep the McIntosh C2300 in the mix here. I was watching _Jeff Beck Live at Ronnie Scott's_ last night, and was again aware that the low frequencies were lacking _thump_. It's not good when you can't enjoy what you're watching because you're too aware of what's missing. Despite the other marvelous things this pre does, it still lacked in the bottom frequencies to my ears and in my system. I was actually beginning to consider trading it in or selling it for something else.
> 
> 
> Then the idea struck to try the tone controls. So I went into the menu and turned the bass up from 0 to 2dB (the range is +/- 12dB). TRANSFORMATION. Things filled in, weight increased, and with no apparent damage to the mids or highs. I knew this was supposed to be a pretty sophisticated implementation, but I was quite impressed. On to _Yes Live at Montreaux_. Same thing. In fact, this sounds like what I get from my ARC LS3, except better due to the more open sound. The +2 is more than enough.
> 
> 
> The tubes also need another 10-15 hours to be broken in more fully, but this is great! I'll throw on _Avengers_ excerpts to see what's happening there next. The purist part of me feels a bit strange about having to resort to the tone controls, but I won't argue with what it's done to the sound.



At the end of the day its all about the sound Charles


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23436969
> 
> 
> At the end of the day its all about the sound Charles



True. And the sound is better now. Listening to a local college radio station (WKCR, Columbia University) I was impressed with how clean it was. And satisfyingly full. That same station is on now, playing some jazz. The bass is nicely articulate. I like it.


Last night as promised, I stuck _The Avengers_ BD in the player for the umpteenth time; it's now one of my test discs on this journey. Serious _thump_ when called for. And _thud_, too.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23436626
> 
> 
> Hey prepress, I'm glad that you're one step closer to complete satisfaction. There's nothing wrong with tone controls if they improve the sound. For lack of a better analogy, if a man's wife gets artificial implants in her chest area--sure, she wasn't born with them, but does that make them any less....errr....useful? The answer is a resounding no! (provided her doctor did a good job
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ). i'm very happy that the tone control has improved your enjoyment of your music--and, even better, you're getting that improvement even before the break-in period is over! You can only go upward from here.



Upward would be nice. Maybe not upward the way you've gone, since I'd need a house and more money!!! That's an incredible setup you have going.


But I am enjoying the increase in detail, the ease of listening . . . the same bass I mentioned in my reply to Franin sounds very real. I can hear the vibration and resonances of the strings as they're plucked. Acoustic bass is a nice thing. And to my delight, the visual "bling" of the C2300 isn't a distraction when watching BDs/DVDs/LDs as I thought at first. Maybe I'm getting used to it.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23442165
> 
> 
> True. And the sound is better now. Listening to a local college radio station (WKCR, Columbia University) I was impressed with how clean it was. And satisfyingly full. That same station is on now, playing some jazz. The bass is nicely articulate. I like it.
> 
> 
> Last night as promised, I stuck _The Avengers_ BD in the player for the umpteenth time; it's now one of my test discs on this journey. Serious _thump_ when called for. And _thud_, too.



Which is your demo scene in Avengers Charles ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23458653
> 
> 
> Which is your demo scene in Avengers Charles ?



The battle in Manhattan in general, and more specifically the scene where Iron Man attempts to destroy the portal, then the one where he flies by the Widow blasting Chitauri before landing to help out Captain America. In each there is a deep loud _boom_ when IM fires his repulsors, and the sound conveys power and impact. It needs to sound impressive, and has.


The Rick Wakeman solo in _Yes: Live at Montreaux_ was somewhat thin on the lower register with the previous tubes and settings. Now, the sound is fuller. I haven't tried LPs yet, and haven't played music in a couple of days, in fact. But things have been great sound-wise with the change in tubes and settings on the 2300.


----------



## prepress

I'm not sure this is a good thing, but I've begun to think about new speakers, especially since following BrolicBeast's foray into Legacy Focus SEs and the overall quality of them.


I don't actually need new speakers, as my Mirage M-3si pair is still going strong; this idea is simply the result of exposure. I am already looking at Brystons, Legacies, Def Techs, Revels and Mirages; I can't afford the McIntosh XR200s; I don't have $20K lying around. And the Mirage OMD-28s depend greatly on reflections to achieve their effect, and my room doesn't have a bare wall for them to work with, so I'd be concerned about them.


So the list is the Bryston Model T, Legacy Focus (HD and SE), Signature SE, Def Tech Mythos ST, Mirage OMD-28, Golden Ear Triton Two, and the Revel Salon2. I am curious about these yet feel no urgency to replace my current Mirages. This whole notion could well fade if I don't feed it too much, or just listen more to what I have rather than moon over what others buy or what's available that's conceivable for me financially. But when I had the same ideas about a preamp I ended up getting one, though that took almost 2 years. As for potential cuts from the list, the Legacy Focus HD and SE are heavier than I'm comfortable with, as are the Revels. Legacy's Focus SE is just under 10K; I also wonder about image height with the Signatures and Triton Twos, as the drivers would be about 6" lower than my current speakers (which cut across the middle of my TV screen perfectly; the M-3si's high image and driver config is perfect for the illusion of sound coming from the TV). And the Salon2s are around 9K. This is a 1BR apartment, after all, and practical considerations as well as cost come into play.


I will entertain this fantasy with caution. I will continue to listen to my current system. We will see.


----------



## audioguy

I would like to toss in one more speaker for you to "think about" and that would be a pair of Seaton Catalyst 8-C's or 12-C's plus two of his SubMersive subs. Total cost with the 8-C's and dual subs would be about $10,000. The speakers (and subs) are powered (2400 watts for each of the subs) and the speakers are internally tri-amped at 1000 watts each speaker. Should you consider the 12-C's, the price goes up by $2000 and the 12-C amps are tri-amped at 2000 watts per channel. And, I believe, they are try-it- to buy it but you may need to check with Mark to validate that.


I have owned a lot of very expensive and excellent speakers, and these will keep up with those that cost 2 to 3 times their price.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23505262
> 
> 
> I would like to toss in one more speaker for you to "think about" and that would be a pair of Seaton Catalyst 8-C's or 12-C's plus two of his SubMersive subs. Total cost with the 8-C's and dual subs would be about $10,000. The speakers (and subs) are powered (2400 watts for each of the subs) and the speakers are internally tri-amped at 1000 watts each speaker. Should you consider the 12-C's, the price goes up by $2000 and the 12-C amps are tri-amped at 2000 watts per channel. And, I believe, they are try-it- to buy it but you may need to check with Mark to validate that.
> 
> 
> I have owned a lot of very expensive and excellent speakers, and these will keep up with those that cost 2 to 3 times their price.



The website is under renovation so I went to the forum. I was a bit amazed that the Catalyst 12C, with two 12" woofers in it, goes down to only 50Hz. I guess they want you to use a sub with them. I'm not necessarily a fan of powered speakers, which is why it's preferable that I get speakers that are full-range or, if powered, can be driven full-range by an amplifier. Thus with the Def Techs, the Mythos is the current preference because it states clearly in the manual you can do that; not so with the BP series, so I have an e-mail in to Def Tech.


Because replacing my current speakers isn't a true plan, I can look around casually. Last night I played the tuner and ran a DVD and didn't feel as if I was missing much. On some bass notes which are softer, where it sounds as if the bass disappears for that moment, I did wonder if another few hertz would solve that or is it the source. I never thought of that before, and I've had the Mirages for 20 years and change. I do suspect the source, because when the notes are there they have weight; now and then I _feel_ them as much as hear them.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23505871
> 
> 
> The website is under renovation so I went to the forum. I was a bit amazed that the Catalyst 12C, with two 12" woofers in it, goes down to only 50Hz. I guess they want you to use a sub with them..



At the most recent Axpona he had a modified DSP program that ran them full range but if you don't like active speakers then that won't matter!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23508442
> 
> 
> At the most recent Axpona he had a modified DSP program that ran them full range but if you don't like active speakers then that won't matter!



I'll need to dig up a manual if one's available to see if they can be driven without plugging in. I have a weird feeling about using my amps to drive only part of the speaker, given their power and cost. And the extra outlets that would be required for powered speakers carries its own issues given my circumstances, both real and potential.


I'll also have to decide that I _am_ going to replace my speakers. It's still a hypothetical, casual "what if" at this point. Last night's listening/viewing session didn't make it any more likely to become "I want to."


But the Seatons look good, and to the extent you can judge from YouTube, sound good.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23509429
> 
> 
> I'll need to dig up a manual if one's available to see if they can be driven without plugging in. I have a weird feeling about using my amps to drive only part of the speaker, given their power and cost. And the extra outlets that would be required for powered speakers carries its own issues given my circumstances, both real and potential.
> 
> 
> I'll also have to decide that I _am_ going to replace my speakers. It's still a hypothetical, casual "what if" at this point. Last night's listening/viewing session didn't make it any more likely to become "I want to."
> 
> 
> But the Seatons look good, and to the extent you can judge from YouTube, sound good.



Your not happy with your current speakers Charles?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23525496
> 
> 
> Your not happy with your current speakers Charles?



Actually I mostly am, Frank, but it's often the case (and the risk) that frequent exposure to the forums and magazines can raise one's curiosity and influence thinking. It's mainly an idle thought right now, and I have no plans to make a move to replace my Mirages, but I am aware a seed has been planted.


One thought is that my speakers are 20 years old and maybe I should update them before I retire, when I probably won't be able to afford it. Retirement is at least 7–8 years away, Lord willing, but large discretionary purchases need to be looked at carefully this close to it. It would be foolish to empty my bank account on anything (hence my somewhat reluctant rejection of the McIntosh XR200s), but even spending the equivalent of a year's worth of groceries (the Def Tech Mythos) or 6 months (Golden Ear) needs thought. However, I have downloaded manuals and looked at some specs.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/540#post_23526257
> 
> 
> Actually I mostly am, Frank, but it's often the case (and the risk) that frequent exposure to the forums and magazines can raise one's curiosity and influence thinking. It's mainly an idle thought right now, and I have no plans to make a move to replace my Mirages, but I am aware a seed has been planted.
> 
> 
> One thought is that my speakers are 20 years old and maybe I should update them before I retire, when I probably won't be able to afford it. Retirement is at least 7–8 years away, Lord willing, but large discretionary purchases need to be looked at carefully this close to it. It would be foolish to empty my bank account on anything (hence my somewhat reluctant rejection of the McIntosh XR200s), but even spending the equivalent of a year's worth of groceries (the Def Tech Mythos) or 6 months (Golden Ear) needs thought. However, I have downloaded manuals and looked at some specs.



Well I guess you still have plenty of time to decide and time to do a bit of research if you do decide to upgrade.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23537055
> 
> 
> Well I guess you still have plenty of time to decide and time to do a bit of research if you do decide to upgrade.



True. But I'd probably opt for sooner rather than later if I make the change.


Another factor is my strong consideration to upgrade the small system in my (also small) bedroom. Currently it runs on a Harman Kardon receiver (70wpc). It sounds good with the Sound Dynamics speakers it drives, but I'm leaning toward replacing the HK with a Marantz MM7025, a 140wpc stereo power amp. The Marantz would drive my M-3sis in a pinch (the Marantz also does 170wpc into 6 ohms; the M-3sis need 100-300w to run well and are 6 ohms). If I take that step with the idea that the Marantz would drive whatever speaker I have in my main system at that point, then that speaker would have to be 8 or 6 ohms; the Marantz apparently doesn't do 4 ohms (no specs offered for it), which would eliminate Legacy and any other 4-ohm speakers.


So I'll need to think carefully on this if I really go forward to replace the Mirages. Def Tech bipolars would be one choice, Golden Ear another.


----------



## BrolicBeast


Hey man, I would suggest that if a receiver limits your future speaker selection, it's probably not a good choice.  Your ears should be the only factor in narrowing down choices--with the 7025, its very existence would exclude a third of potential speaker choices.  I'd also suggest keeping the bedroom system as-is and funneling the funds you would have spent into upgrades for your main system (a new Harmony remote, perhaps?)  I'm sure the HK is more than what's needed to fill the bedroom at normal listening volumes--especially since reference volume and bedrooms don't generally mix well


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23540222
> 
> 
> Hey man, I would suggest that if a receiver limits your future speaker selection, it's probably not a good choice.  Your ears should be the only factor in narrowing down choices--with the 7025, its very existence would exclude a third of potential speaker choices.  I'd also suggest keeping the bedroom system as-is and funneling the funds you would have spent into upgrades for your main system (a new Harmony remote, perhaps?)  I'm sure the HK is more than what's needed to fill the bedroom at normal listening volumes--especially since reference volume and bedrooms don't generally mix well



True, the impedance of the Marantz power amp would restrict any speaker upgrades in the main system to the 6–8 ohm variety. Bryston and Legacy would be disqualified in that case, but there are plenty of choices in the Marantz's range. Still, you're right; the HK receiver is _more_ than enough in the bedroom and from that standpoint upgrading is unnecessary. I was thinking more long-term, and also (mainly, really) to utilize a preamp, universal player and tuner that are currently sitting around doing nothing, and the separate power amp would do well in that regard. It would also be available to drive the main system if my MC501s needed repair or if I indeed must downsize down the road, a quite possible event. OR, if I somehow had room and desire for a 5-channel setup.


But you have me re-evaluating the whole idea. I'd still like to do it, but maybe I'll consider things a bit more . . .


----------



## prepress

I have come to the idea of putting my Audio Research preamp back into the system, alongside the C2300. I would then perform some comparisons to settle once and for all which I prefer, using my CD player. With the tubes broken in more fully, the C2300 preamp has sounded much better than at the beginning. But while I've been more satisfied, there's still the nagging idea that the solid-state LS3 might yet have a bit more _thump_ to it.


I'd like to do this with the least amount of hassle. Placing the LS3 is no problem; the trick is figuring out the connections. I'll have to see if I have any more Kimber Hero available (I don't think so). If not, I'm not going to buy anything just for the sake of this experiment, I'll just have to put up with the hassle. I do have a pair of AQ Black Mamba II which sounds similar, but has perhaps a _tiny bit_ more bottom end based on experience with it and the Hero connecting preamp to power amps. But no comparisons until I work out the connection scheme. I'd like to be able to connect and disconnect at the CD player, not the preamp (I'll have to move the preamp/power amp connections of course, but that's less hassle than the WBT-terminated Hero ICs). I do have 2 pair of AQ King Cobra I'm not using; perhaps that's the way to go if there's no Hero available.


The other danger is if I discover in the process that I prefer the King Cobra to the Hero, and by no small margin.


----------



## Franin

I changed all my audio interconnects to AQ King Cobra. I had bettercables but since I bought the Marantz I decided to change interconnects and Hdmi cables to AQ.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548190
> 
> 
> I changed all my audio interconnects to AQ King Cobra. I had bettercables but since I bought the Marantz I decided to change interconnects and Hdmi cables to AQ.



I was using the King Cobra for my preamp/power amp connection before. I have two pair because I was bi-amping. The sound had more weight than the Hero and Black Mamba II. I think it's heavier gauge than either as well, and the PSC+ copper is another difference.


You say you had better cables before. What prompted the change?


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548575
> 
> 
> I was using the King Cobra for my preamp/power amp connection before. I have two pair because I was bi-amping. The sound had more weight than the Hero and Black Mamba II. I think it's heavier gauge than either as well, and the PSC+ copper is another difference.
> 
> 
> You say you had better cables before. What prompted the change?



I turned 40 Charles and I just wanted a change a guess. The salesman did a good deal on them too.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548575
> 
> 
> 
> I was using the King Cobra for my preamp/power amp connection before. I have two pair because I was bi-amping. The sound had more weight than the Hero and Black Mamba II. I think it's heavier gauge than either as well, and the PSC+ copper is another difference.
> 
> 
> You say you had better cables before. What prompted the change?


 

I think he meant *Better Cables* as in the manufacturer of the Silver Serpent. I would be very curious to hear the differences between the King Cobra and the Silver Serpent interconnects.  I currently have AQ Diamonback XLR's connecting my Oppo 105 to the 8801. The King Cobra is one step up in the line, I think. I'm still loving my Black Mamba for my Sonos system (Which I am jamming to as I type this....Man of Steel soundtrack again!) 

 

Have you started the A/V comparison yet between the AR and the Mac?  If so, any impressions? The good thing about this comparison is that you can sell the loser of the face-off.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548882
> 
> 
> I think he meant _Better Cables_ as in the manufacturer of the Silver Serpent. I would be very curious to hear the differences between the King Cobra and the Silver Serpent interconnects.  I currently have AQ Diamonback XLR's connecting my Oppo 105 to the 8801. The King Cobra is one step up in the line, I think. I'm still loving my Black Mamba for my Sonos system (Which I am jamming to as I type this....Man of Steel soundtrack again!)
> 
> 
> Have you started the A/V comparison yet between the AR and the Mac?  If so, any impressions? The good thing about this comparison is that you can sell the loser of the face-off.



Not yet. I did put the LS3 in place, but needed to figure out how best to configure things. I haven't gone through the extra cables yet, either. I took a picture, but I haven't dusted in so long I'd be embarrassed to post it.


I don't think I have any more Kimber Hero, so it'll be the KC I use, with one pair connected to each preamp so I can swap at just the CD end. Both will sound good, it's a matter of whether there's a noticeable difference in dynamics or some other compelling feature. If not, the LS3 will remain as a back-up. If the LS3 seems better, then I trade in or sell the 2300 and probably go for a solid-state Mac.


Yes, the King Cobra is a step up from Diamondback, which would actually look better in my system due to its blue jacket. I think about stuff like that.


This comparison idea wouldn't have worked when the tubes (and maybe the unit itself) were still breaking in.


----------



## prepress

Okay, I got out my leftover cable box, and there is indeed no more Kimber Hero. There are, however, two pairs of AQ King Cobra and three of Black Mamba II (a 1m pair included), as well as Tara Labs Quantum 4 (older stuff from the early 90s).


I don't know how fast I'll get to this, as next Sunday is my turn to teach in our Sunday school, so lesson prep will have priority over my little face-off. However, I'll at least set things up and most likely with the King Cobra. Perhaps it's too expensive at $350/2m pair to sit idle, so I guess I'll use it. If I redo the bedroom system I'll use the Black Mamba II in there. Either AQ set will be more efficient to move around than the WBT connectors on the Hero.


I'll also need to let the LS3 break in a bit, since it's been unplugged for so long. The capacitors probably need a few hours to re-energize, so I'll start there. Once I get used to the sound again then I could go back to the C2300, and then back and forth for a few tracks.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548882
> 
> 
> I think he meant _Better Cables_ as in the manufacturer of the Silver Serpent. I would be very curious to hear the differences between the King Cobra and the Silver Serpent interconnects.



That's correct BB, though I never did an audio comparison between the two.


----------



## prepress

Okay. Since "bettercables" wasn't italicized, capitalized or otherwise distinguished in the text of Franin's reply I thought he meant a better cable than the KC. Thanks for the clarification. I think I might be curious about that comparison too, Franin, should you ever decide to do it.


I've made my connections and the LS3 is on (by itself) as I type. I also decided to stick with the Hero IC, since that's what I've always used on the CD player. However, my barking knee suggests I might look for a way to minimize my time scrunching behind the rack, and that may be where the King Cobra comes in. I could connect a pair to each preamp and swap at the amp terminals, and since the amps are on the outside racks that's a bit less time in awkward positions.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23551032
> 
> 
> Okay. Since "bettercables" wasn't italicized, capitalized or otherwise distinguished in the text of Franin's reply I thought he meant a better cable than the KC. Thanks for the clarification. I think I might be curious about that comparison too, Franin, should you ever decide to do it.



Sorry Charles I should of been more clearer. I don't think Im going to do a comparison as Im going to sell them.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23551410
> 
> 
> Sorry Charles I should of been more clearer. I don't think Im going to do a comparison as Im going to sell them.



Proceeds from that sale will help pay for the additional King Cobras, too.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23551616
> 
> 
> Proceeds from that sale will help pay for the additional King Cobras, too.



Certainly will


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23548640
> 
> 
> I turned 40 Charles and I just wanted a change a guess. The salesman did a good deal on them too.


 

Totally understand.  I'll be approaching a similar threshold in a couple of years and i already am planning how I'm going to reward myself for making it through another decade









 


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23551032
> 
> 
> I could connect a pair to each preamp and swap at the amp terminals, and since the amps are on the outside racks that's a bit less time in awkward positions.


 

Looks to be a sound plan.  Cable work should be kept as stress-free as possible since they are inherently a hassle to deal with.  Anytime I have to troubleshoot cabling, I need two bottles or Martinelli's before diving into the eagle's nest of cables back there


----------



## prepress

I began my comparison between the C2300 and my Audio Research LS3 yesterday. The plan was to do this three times, playing selected tracks on each. The comparison was cut short by the C2300's failure (perhaps a fuse—I'll need to check), but I almost completed the first round. I am not a full-blown audiophile, so the descriptions may seem incomplete.


I used tracks from _Wondrous Stories_, a prog-rock anthology: _Wondrous Stories_, Yes; _Living in the Past_, Jethro Tull; _Crime of the Century_, Supertramp; _Frankenstein_, Edgar Winter. Along with these were _Fanfare for the Common Man_, Atlanta Symphony Orchestra; and _Slow_, Rumer.


First up was the LS3. There was a "hash," "glare," or sense of hardness over the highs with the prog stuff. It seemed the highs were emphasized a bit too much. I suspect the recording has something to do with this, and the LS3 brought out more of what the recording has already. _Crime_ and _Frankenstein_ had good dynamics. The kettle drum in _Fanfare_ had appropriate impact as well, and the aforementioned issues with the highs were less evident, same with _Frankenstein_. With _Slow_, I was almost unaware there was a midrange, as the highs and (to a lesser extent) the lows seemed most evident.


On to the C2300. _Wondrous_ and _Living_ were smoother (though not smooth; again, the recording is partly responsible for the glare. I chose less-than-perfect recordings deliberately). _Crime_ had good dynamics also, about the same as the LS3. The preamp failed during this track, so the comparison stopped.


Overall, the C2300 was sounding better. It should be noted I was using JJ ECC803s gold pin tubes in the line stage, and the bass was set to +3dB. The LS3 has no tone controls. Once I get the 2300's problems resolved, I plan to pick this up again. I'd probably gotten used to the LS3's sound, but hearing it now after 3 months and living with the 2300 in its place I'm more aware of the hard-sounding highs I heard yesterday.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23553773
> 
> 
> Looks to be a sound plan.  Cable work should be kept as stress-free as possible since they are inherently a hassle to deal with.  Anytime I have to troubleshoot cabling, I need two bottles or Martinelli's before diving into the eagle's nest of cables back there



I won't give mine even _that_ credit. How about "vulture's nest"? Mine is, anyway.


I ended up using the Transparent ICs and Hero anyway. That's what I've been listening to all this time, so I stayed with it. Perhaps I'll work the King Cobra in for round two or three.


----------



## prepress

So I called my dealer, who suggested the C2300's problem might be a blown fuse. Home Depot has them; he could order it from McIntosh as well. I took the fuse out of the C2300, but it looks perfectly fine. An e-mail went off to McIntosh, who responded today, suggesting I take it to the dealer. So as soon as I can round up transportation the C2300 goes back into the box, to the store and, quite possibly, to McIntosh.


Fortunately, the LS3 is here. I won't be without. This will give the LS3 an opportunity to "break in" again; I suspect some of the brightness (which I don't remember hearing previously) is due to it having been unplugged for several months.


----------



## BrolicBeast


It's way too early for the C2300 to be failing, but then again--since it was a demo unit, it probably got quite a bit of use (which is the only acceptable excuse that McIntosh can give you).  Considering it happened *during* your comparison testing, could this be a sign? Has the LS3 ever failed you in the past? One thing is, I'm glad it failed during testing, as opposed to failing as you sat down, eagerly awaiting a listening session.  I'm also glad you have the LS3 as backup while this gets sorted out.  It pays to have options!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23565360
> 
> 
> It's way too early for the C2300 to be failing, but then again--since it was a demo unit, it probably got quite a bit of use (which is the only acceptable excuse that McIntosh can give you).  Considering it happened _during_ your comparison testing, could this be a sign? Has the LS3 ever failed you in the past? One thing is, I'm glad it failed during testing, as opposed to failing as you sat down, eagerly awaiting a listening session.  I'm also glad you have the LS3 as backup while this gets sorted out.  It pays to have options!



The unit was in operation for about a year, the dealer said. It's not impossible for any gear to have failure, but I agree it's a bit odd. It played through two songs just fine and then partway through the third, poof. Still, it's under warranty, so it should cost no more than the price of transportation to fix. I began thinking that if the MC501 amps went, I'd have no options; that's where that Marantz MM7025 would come in. I also have an even older B&K Pro-10MC preamp, which would work with the 7025 (am I thinking about tweaking that bedroom system again?) if I got it. I have Sunday school work to do, so this isn't the most convenient time for an unscheduled errand like this. It _could_ wait, but the weather's supposed to be nice tomorrow, so I wanted to take it in then. So I bear down on the SS lesson.


The LS3 went in for repair once, but that was way back in the late 90s. I forget what the issue was. Other than that, never had a problem.


----------



## prepress

Today I called a car service and hauled the C2300 in to the store, Lyric Hi-Fi on the upper east side of Manhattan. I packed it in its original box (it pays to keep those when possible) and called a car service, then off I went. The service center the store uses is in Manhattan also; that should help on the turnaround time. It is agreed generally that the problem is related to the power supply. We'll see what's what.


I intend to connect the most used sources to the LS3 in the meantime. It needs to recharge its juices after being unplugged so long, so here's an opportunity for that. And because I've been on other threads I have another of those "seeds" to contend with; the idea of changing out my ICs to King Cobra, per Franin. The Hero with WBT 114 connectors costs $59 more for a 2m pair than the KC; ultraplate RCAs are $39 less than the KC. The WBT version used to cost what the RCAs do now. In my setup some of the Hero ICs (all 1.5m) strained to make it to the 2300's terminals. Unless I want to mix brands or try creative system configs, a longer IC or two more will help.


Anyway, this is the rack with the LS3 in and the 2300 out; the ugly magenta thing on the top of the rack is the Wireworld Aurora PC used on the 2300.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23569613
> 
> 
> Today I called a car service and hauled the C2300 in to the store, Lyric Hi-Fi on the upper east side of Manhattan. I packed it in its original box (it pays to keep those when possible) and called a car service, then off I went. The service center the store uses is in Manhattan also; that should help on the turnaround time. It is agreed generally that the problem is related to the power supply. We'll see what's what.



Well hopefully its a quick turnaround for you Charles.


> Quote:
> I intend to connect the most used sources to the LS3 in the meantime. It needs to recharge its juices after being unplugged so long, so here's an opportunity for that. And because I've been on other threads I have another of those "seeds" to contend with; the idea of changing out my ICs to King Cobra, per Franin.



Happy to plant the seed for you Charles


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23571074
> 
> 
> Happy to plant the seed for you Charles



Before the 2300, except for my BD player (Black Mamba II) all sources were Hero to the LS3. I've never used King Cobra on sources. I do remember preferring the KC for pre/power connections over the others. It'd be easier and cheaper to make do with what I have rather than spend on new ICs. I could stick with Hero and get one 2m pair so the CD player IC isn't straining to get to the preamp, or just use the BM II on a source or two. The Hero seems more flexible than the KC, which is a plus for it.


----------



## Franin

I found also the connection on the KC had a solid fit compared to my previous cables which you could wiggle around.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23573042
> 
> 
> I found also the connection on the KC had a solid fit compared to my previous cables which you could wiggle around.



Trying to influence me, eh?


The WBT 0144 connectors on the Hero I have lock in well. But they're not available on the standard-version Hero anymore.


----------



## prepress

All set to play something on the system Wednesday and . . . the hum is back.


It's not in the signal path, so I'm thinking I need only use a different plug for the LS3. It's plugged into my Elite-15PFi; the 2300 was plugged into the SPR. I hope it's that simple.


----------



## Franin

Nothing is worse than trying to sort out hum. Good luck Charles.


----------



## prepress

This was odd.


The hum was back a bit louder than before, I think. Well, I thought, perhaps I should plug the LS3 in the way the 2300 was plugged in, so I moved it from the Furman Elite to the Furman SPR. Still got hum. So I lifted the ground with one of my Conntek adapters (those things are so cool); no hum.


When both preamps were plugged in there was no hum (the 2300 didn't have its ground lifted), so I don't get why there should be hum if the only difference in the setup was the removal of the 2300. It does change the lay of the power cords, maybe that has something to do with it; I don't know. Plus, the LS3 has a captive cord and the 2300 had a WW Aurora on it. But the hum is gone, at least for now.


Anyway, I later played two DVDs, _Green Lantern: The Animated Series_ and one of my reference discs (_Yes Live at Montreaux_), and noted that, again, with the Yes disc the sound favored the upper end to the point of seeming somewhat harsh (I didn't notice on the GL disc). But with that came more detail and articulation than I remember previously. There is a difference: before I used AQ Black Mamba II on my BD player, whereas I'm now using Kimber Hero. And again, the LS3 lay dormant for over three months; could it need to break in some more? Could it be that the Kimber/2300 combo is a nicer balance of sound? Maybe.


No hum interfered while playing discs, so that was good.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/570#post_23591241
> 
> 
> This was odd.
> 
> 
> The hum was back a bit louder than before, I think. Well, I thought, perhaps I should plug the LS3 in the way the 2300 was plugged in, so I moved it from the Furman Elite to the Furman SPR. Still got hum. So I lifted the ground with one of my Conntek adapters (those things are so cool); no hum.
> 
> 
> When both preamps were plugged in there was no hum (the 2300 didn't have its ground lifted), so I don't get why there should be hum if the only difference in the setup was the removal of the 2300. It does change the lay of the power cords, maybe that has something to do with it; I don't know. Plus, the LS3 has a captive cord and the 2300 had a WW Aurora on it. But the hum is gone, at least for now.
> 
> 
> Anyway, I later played two DVDs, _Green Lantern: The Animated Series_ and one of my reference discs (_Yes Live at Montreaux_), and noted that, again, with the Yes disc the sound favored the upper end to the point of seeming somewhat harsh (I didn't notice on the GL disc). But with that came more detail and articulation than I remember previously. There is a difference: before I used AQ Black Mamba II on my BD player, whereas I'm now using Kimber Hero. And again, the LS3 lay dormant for over three months; could it need to break in some more? Could it be that the Kimber/2300 combo is a nicer balance of sound? Maybe.
> 
> 
> No hum interfered while playing discs, so that was good.



Good to hear the hum issue was solved. Any news on the C2300 Charles?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23593777
> 
> 
> Good to hear the hum issue was solved. Any news on the C2300 Charles?



No, nothing yet. I was going to give it a couple of weeks before inquiring. So I'll get in touch next week if I hear nothing this week. The service center picks up from the store twice a week I was told, but I don't know when last week it was picked up.


Because of the results with the Hero IC on the BD player, maybe I'll see what the King Cobra does with it. I say "maybe"; that could be dangerous. It's sheer curiosity anyway.


----------



## prepress

Preliminary result: The KC has stronger bottom end than the Hero. But this is only on one disc (Yes again; it's one of my go-to DVDs), and I'll need to find time for another sample or two.


----------



## prepress

I just checked in with Lyric Hi-fi a couple of minutes ago, and was told my 2300 came back from repair about a half-hour ago. The store will ship it to me. My salesman is on vacation and there's no info available on what the problem was, perhaps something will be in the box.


I'm considering a reconfiguration also, a small one to perhaps redistribute gear so I can make better use of the shelves in the middle rack.


----------



## prepress

UPDATE: The C2300 arrived today. I almost missed UPS due to working late. As it was, I ran into the driver a few doors up from me (he'd already been to my building). He put the box on his hand truck and brought it back to my building. That was nice.


I got it upstairs, and after some dark chocolate-covered cashews dealt with my attack of the nibbles, I opened the box. Everything looks fine. But there's no paperwork inside, so I don't know what was wrong specifically or what the repair guys did. But I unboxed it and plugged it in, and it comes on just fine. I think now might be the time to do that reconfig I was thinking about, especially since it's clear I'm not going to go to the gym now.


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23625941
> 
> 
> UPDATE: The C2300 arrived today. I almost missed UPS due to working late. As it was, I ran into the driver a few doors up from me (he'd already been to my building). He put the box on his hand truck and brought it back to my building. That was nice.
> 
> 
> I got it upstairs, and after some dark chocolate-covered cashews dealt with my attack of the nibbles, I opened the box. Everything looks fine. But there's no paperwork inside, so I don't know what was wrong specifically or what the repair guys did. But I unboxed it and plugged it in, and it comes on just fine. I think now might be the time to do that reconfig I was thinking about, especially since it's clear I'm not going to go to the gym now.



Good to see you got it back Charles. It would of been nice to let you know what was wrong with it. So far all good now ?


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23631685
> 
> 
> Good to see you got it back Charles. It would of been nice to let you know what was wrong with it. So far all good now ?



Whatever it was probably related to the power supply. The 2300's plugged in and working so far. It sounded pretty good on first play. We'll see going forward if I'm going to keep it. The 2300 may still not be as dynamic as the LS3, but it's more open.


----------



## prepress

This makes me choke up when I hear it. If you want to hear the national anthem played right, check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlfI2AcI4nA&list=PL0127CCA8A0880ADB&index=15 


I have the DVD, and the whole concert is great.


----------



## jnnt29




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23641979
> 
> 
> This makes me choke up when I hear it. If you want to hear the national anthem played right, check this out.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlfI2AcI4nA&list=PL0127CCA8A0880ADB&index=15
> 
> 
> I have the DVD, and the whole concert is great.



Outstanding!!


----------



## Franin




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23641979
> 
> 
> This makes me choke up when I hear it. If you want to hear the national anthem played right, check this out.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlfI2AcI4nA&list=PL0127CCA8A0880ADB&index=15
> 
> 
> I have the DVD, and the whole concert is great.



Sounds very nice Charles. Being that I'm not American every time I hear the American anthem always takes me back to Poltergeist the movie, the beginning bit.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Franin*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23644236
> 
> 
> Sounds very nice Charles. Being that I'm not American every time I hear the American anthem always takes me back to Poltergeist the movie, the beginning bit.


_That_ is a long time ago, 1982 I think. I saw the movie way back when. I remember Craig T. Nelson and JoBeth Williams were the husband and wife. I don't go to many movies these days.


----------



## pcweber111

JoBeth Williams....mmmhmm....the fact that it seemed like she never wore a pair of pants in that movie made it all the better.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23646052
> 
> 
> JoBeth Williams....mmmhmm....the fact that it seemed like she never wore a pair of pants in that movie made it all the better.



They're _heeeeeere . . ._


----------



## prepress

Your new Batman.

http://variety.com/2013/film/news/ben-affleck-is-the-new-batman-1200586881/


----------



## jnnt29




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23659658
> 
> 
> Your new Batman.
> 
> http://variety.com/2013/film/news/ben-affleck-is-the-new-batman-1200586881/



Not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing. How is the 2300 working since its return? JT


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jnnt29*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23659832
> 
> 
> Not sure if this is a good thing or a bad thing. How is the 2300 working since its return? JT



Hello there, JT.


After using it with AQ King Cobra interconnects for DVDs and a few CDs I've put my Kimber Hero back in. The 2300 is functioning as if nothing was ever wrong. I still don't know what was fixed, but the 2300 is doing fine. I still think my Audio Research LS3 is more dynamic in the low frequencies, but the 2300 kicks butt too. Plus, it offers a more open sound that I like.


I've had a thought to step up and move to all KC ICs, per Franin, or (ouch) consider going to Transparent MusicLink Plus. I have a pair between the 2300 and the 501s, and in a head-to-head as my pre/power connection the MLP outdid the KC in low frequency work; the improvement was noticeable if not earth-shaking. But the 2m pair of MLP cost $480, versus $350 for the KC. I've also begun to contemplate Transparent MusicWave Plus speaker cables as a change from the Kimber 8TC I use now. But that's $1790 for two 4 ft. pair with bananas! Kimber 12TC would be the other option, at around $900. Plus, I want to have my PRO-111 plasma re-calibrated this year. It still looks good, but I think after four years it's time. That's going to be $400–500, I would think; my plan is October–November for that.


As for Ben Affleck, I think he can do whatever he wants after _Argo_. He can _look_ like Bruce Wayne, at least.


----------



## jnnt29

Sounds like your dance card is full for a while with the comparisons and the calibration. I'm glad you back up and running.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jnnt29*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23660449
> 
> 
> Sounds like your dance card is full for a while with the comparisons and the calibration. I'm glad you back up and running.



I am too. Last night I was watching a gospel DVD, one of the Bill Gaither series. At one point I turned the volume up so the person I was on the phone with could hear a couple of songs. The system sounded AWESOME!!! It was UNBELIEVABLE how good the sound was. The C2300's volume goes up to 100; I had it at 56 at this point. No pain to the ears, it wasn't too loud or hard to listen to; just natural, beautiful sound. I may have to visit the upper volume range more often. But at very high volume, around 75, it can get noisy.


----------



## prepress

I have scheduled a re-calibration of my PRO-111FD plasma for November 2, to be performed by Kevin Miller. He did my first calibration way back in November 2008, also the first Saturday of the month, so it's an anniversary of sorts. The set still looks great, but has probably drifted a bit, so I'll have him check it out and then copy the settings to the 111's other HDMI inputs. This is in case I ever ditch my Duo VP or it's out for repair.


Meantime, there is a rumble in my brain regarding the possibility of changing my speakers pre-retirement, which continues. I have been checking in on the Legacy thread and Brolic's as well. I downloaded manuals for the Focus SE, HD, and Signature SE; I even found a price list. There are still Def Techs and Brystons out there, too. There are practical concerns, such as having a small room, which would perhaps render either Focus overkill, along with the prospect of having to schlep them up stairs (177 and 172 lbs shipping weight, plus I have a bad back and am not getting younger) or having to move them around at all once I'm older (the same thought occurs with my 92-lb Mac 501s); and then there's cost. I may be too close to retiring to jump on a large discretionary item like this; that would make the Def Techs more agreeable wallet-wise. And there are other, non-audio expenses looming.


And then there's the fact that I like what I have, overall. No, the Mirages won't go as deep in the bass as anything on my list, but they are great loudspeakers, as the original _Stereophile_ review indicates:

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/1192mirage/ 


Last night I was watching some DVDs and noted how the image hung in space between the speakers. NOTHING seemed to be coming _from_ the speakers. It made me wonder if I really want to replace them (I don't _need_ to, obviously), and should I just back off the whole thought before it turns into something more . . . sinister.


----------



## jnnt29

That ever present bug is always there for me as well. Can my system sound better? The answer is always yes, but like you say do I needed to? The fun is in the hunt and trying to piece together new equipment and experiment with their sound. I'm looking for speakers on a budget. Trying find some second hand treasures on Craigslist.


I bet the Pioneer will look great after the tune up. The legacy's though look to be outstanding speakers. Good luck with your decision. I can't wait to see how your adventure goes. JT


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jnnt29*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23709980
> 
> 
> That ever present bug is always there for me as well. Can my system sound better? The answer is always yes, but like you say do I needed to? The fun is in the hunt and trying to piece together new equipment and experiment with their sound. I'm looking for speakers on a budget. Trying find some second hand treasures on Craigslist.
> 
> 
> I bet the Pioneer will look great after the tune up. The legacy's though look to be outstanding speakers. Good luck with your decision. I can't wait to see how your adventure goes. JT



The idea was to retire in 7 or 8 years, so there's a bit of time on the speaker front. But if I'm going to do it, sooner rather than later is best. I also have only one placement option for _any_ speakers because of the room and equipment, and my setup may favor the Mirage bipolar concept; even though not ideally placed, they still deliver well. They're less room-dependent than a box speaker. That favors the bipolar Def Techs. Further, the Focus HD is less expensive than the SE by about $1800. The top-of-the-line Def Tech is about _$4K_ less. And though not bipolar, the Def Tech Mythos ST is intriguing due to practical concerns, starting with its form factor.


The original idea is to change speaker cables; that's either the Transparents or Kimbers as mentioned above. The Legacys feature internal wiring by Kimber, at least the Focus SE does. That would argue for keeping my 8TC or going for the 12TC in case I do go Legacy. Besides, one of the videos on Legacy's site showed the speakers being connected with some Kimber. The interest in Legacy came as a direct result of Brolic's experience with the Focus SE.


What this all grows out of is my preamp. Having the Mac C2300 in my system has given the whole system a boost. The sound is more open, the midrange especially, but the ARC LS3 is a bit more dynamic and weighty. It's that dynamics factor that has led to the cable/speaker replacement idea, never mind that the C2300 is plenty satisfying. This speaks to your comments, and needs to be thought through carefully. I don't _need_ to do _any_ of this. And lest we forget, 30Hz (from my Mirage M-3sis) is quite respectable low-frequency output.


To make things interesting (?), Value Electronics, host of the annual HDTV shootout (and where I bought my TV and main BDP), is a Def Tech dealer. I also know of a Legacy dealer in New Haven, CT which carries Def Tech; the possibility of a direct comparison! But I'll leave _that_ alone for now.


Be careful with Craigslist. From what I hear, everything there isn't always what it seems.


----------



## prepress

The logic of a preemptive speaker replacement made sense at one point, but during a brief session Saturday listening to a local college station playing old R&B from the 50's, I considered how good the sound was, and now question the replacement theory I started with. I'd be giving up a working, well-liked known for an unknown. I really like the M-3sis. And as time moves on toward that theoretical retirement, money is a bigger and bigger factor regarding a potential replacement. The replacement speaker itself is a secondary question right now.


So I wonder what anyone else's perspective might be, especially if they've done anything like it before, what their rationale may have been. I am a bit torn. Do I keep the M-3sis and take my chances, or move to replace what isn't broken? There's an element of fear here, I understand, and it isn't necessarily logical to be afraid of what hasn't happened or might happen. I've contacted Mirage to see if there's a dealer/service center in the area who could do preventive maintenance or just inspect them. If so, the results may go a long way toward my decision; if not, that could go a long way too.


----------



## oOOBillO0o

Changing the foundation of one's system is a big one, and if you took as long as you did for that pre-amp, I'm gonna go get some popcorn and brb.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *oOOBillO0o*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23745195
> 
> 
> Changing the foundation of one's system is a big one, and if you took as long as you did for that pre-amp, I'm gonna go get some popcorn and brb.



Well, that morphed from its original theme; it didn't start out as a determined preamp replacement idea; it was a "what if" that turned into an "I want." This is a more practical/theoretical concept. The virtue of a preemptive strike to replace what is a fairly old, but still functioning well, speaker. I have an e-mail out to Mirage on whether a dealer or service center in the area would take a look at them for preventive maintenance or fix a potential problem if found. That answer will figure quite a bit into what I decide.


So, you get out to other forums, I see.


----------



## oOOBillO0o

Been lurking here since 1999, finally absorbed enough to learn how to post, 9years later. But to enjoy this, I post to several forums, each has their own memebers that bring something to the table.


Speakers really require a good room, start there, then speakers, then perhaps an amp. You can't go wrong with the "Blue Meter co".. Especially, with their current line.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *oOOBillO0o*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23745817
> 
> 
> Been lurking here since 1999, finally absorbed enough to learn how to post, 9years later. But to enjoy this, I post to several forums, each has their own memebers that bring something to the table.
> 
> 
> Speakers really require a good room, start there, then speakers, then perhaps an amp. You can't go wrong with the "Blue Meter co".. Especially, with their current line.



For now, I'm still weighing the merit/demerit of doing this. What I might replace the Mirages with is not the issue yet. But I do have a _very_ short list.


I don't have a good room really, and there is only _one_ placement option for _any_ speaker in here. The Mirages, with their bipolar design, are less room-dependent than a typical box speaker, so Definitive Technology has a leg up on that score. But there are practical concerns such as the weight of their 7000sc and the 11Hz (yes, 11Hz) low frequencies may be too much in a 1BR apartment with only a 14 x 18.5 living room.


----------



## prepress

I e-mailed Mirage on Tuesday regarding service centers or techs in my area who could take a look at my M-3sis; I haven't heard back yet. There are several dealers in the area however, so if I don't hear from Mirage anytime soon maybe I'll contact one of them.


Meantime, I continue considering whether there's sufficient logical/practical merit in replacing the Mirages; it has nothing to do with dissatisfaction. The one option I haven't dwelt on much is the McIntosh XR200, the only speaker I'd replace the M-3sis with outright, not as a preemptive measure. This is where things get dicey.


At $22K retail I can't afford the XR200, meaning I can't buy them without going into debt or raiding my emergency fund (the 3-6 mos. of cash we should all have on hand minimum). If I were obsessive enough I _could_ buy them, though. It would mean making an advance payment on a credit card, effectively increasing its limit temporarily, buying the speakers on that card, then either taking the next two years to pay off the remainder or going into my emergency fund for, say, half the remainder, thereby reducing the debt time from two years to about one and a half, maybe less. The only positives in these scenarios are that I'd have the XR200s and I'd save on the interest (quite a bit in the second scenario); the downside is I would be more vulnerable to any unexpected financial emergency.


Obviously, neither scenario is ideal or wise. The fact that I can even concoct the scheme is scary. But I'm going to start saving in case I do replace the M-3sis, regardless of why, with anything beyond the Def Techs.


----------



## prepress

I received this response from Mirage yesterday:

_Hi Charles,

Unfortunately there isn't any particular service I can refer you to for a general diagnostic or otherwise, but realistically if your speakers are in good working condition, you shouldn't have to replace any parts. Parts are potentially still available for the speaker in case any drivers are blown or there is a crossover failure. Do the surrounds appear to be cracking or do they look okay?_


I've never tried to adjust the grilles (which are not designed to be removable, I think) and don't know if they can be pulled down to inspect drivers. But they must be if it's possible to replace surrounds. I'll have to check into this, I guess.


After playing the _Wynton Marsalis & Eric Clapton Play the Blues_ DVD (Jazz at Lincoln Center), I am leaning strongly toward no immediate moves on the Mirages at the very least.


----------



## prepress

I never put this one up. It's a recent photo of the center rack reconfig after the 2300 returned to the system. With it on the right side, there's more convenient access for connections. I've stacked the BD players and had a shelf free for the power supply of my phono preamp. And again, apologies for the dust.


I have done something which should help me get my place straightened up: I invited someone over! Actually, she invited herself over a little bit, too. That's in 3 weeks. I have that long to get the place ship-shape.


----------



## hyghwayman




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600_100#post_23780255
> 
> 
> I never put this one up. It's a recent photo of the center rack reconfig after the 2300 returned to the system. With it on the right side, there's more convenient access for connections. I've stacked the BD players and had a shelf free for the power supply of my phono preamp. And again, apologies for the dust.
> 
> 
> I have done something which should help me get my place straightened up: I invited someone over! Actually, she invited herself over a little bit, too. That's in 3 weeks. I have that long to get the place ship-shape.



Having guest over is a real good motivator and a lot of FUN


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hyghwayman*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/600#post_23780987
> 
> 
> Having guest over is a real good motivator and a lot of FUN



And it's times like this when you realize how much stuff accumulates, paper in particular. I have way too much for a 1BR apartment, plus a filing system that isn't working well. There's plenty of recycling to do so after my break here, I should get back to it. i got very distracted watching football earlier (South Alabama–Tennessee in particular, then Iowa–Minnesota plus some _Star Trek: TNG_)


----------



## prepress

I have received instructions from Mirage on how to remove the M-3si grille socks, as well as the drivers and crossovers. I don't have time to do it right now, but will investigate. In the crossover's case I would need a soldering iron if it were to be replaced, which I don't have. The plot thickens a bit.


----------



## BrolicBeast

Uh Oh....are the Mirages are starting to fail?


....Legacy....Legacy.....Legacy.....Legacy.....Legacy.....(perpetual chanting).


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23789992
> 
> 
> Uh Oh....are the Mirages are starting to fail?
> 
> 
> ....Legacy....Legacy.....Legacy.....Legacy.....Legacy.....(perpetual chanting).



Noooo . . . . . . but I should be able to check them for any obvious signs of degradation. Remember, I had the idea of a preemptive replacement because i was concerned they might quit after I've retired, at which time I might not be able to afford a suitable replacement. However, not being given a spirit of fear, I backed off that for now.


But, they _are_ 20.5 years old, and would be pushing 30 when I retire (if all goes well). As part of my evaluation of the idea of replacement, I can check them out. If I see any sign of trouble (such as driver surrounds cracking), I can look for replacement parts, which might be available still, or go ahead and replace them anyway. If not, I'll ride them until they drop or I get tired of them. If a _crossover_ goes, I'm going to replace them and not bother with it.


There is a Legacy dealer in New Haven CT, an _eight-hour_ round trip; they're a Def Tech dealer too. But I'd need to be serious about the Legacys to go that far away. Then there's Value Electronics, home of the HDTV Shootout, and a Def tech dealer. The nearest Bryston dealer is in Wisconsin, though he's sold some Model Ts into NY (twenty-year warranty!). If I inspect the M-3si drivers and all is well, new speakers will continue to be moot. If not, there's a decision to be made.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23791654
> 
> 
> Noooo . . . . . . but I should be able to check them for any obvious signs of degradation. Remember, I had the idea of a preemptive replacement because i was concerned they might quit after I've retired, at which time I might not be able to afford a suitable replacement. However, not being given a spirit of fear, I backed off that for now.
> 
> 
> But, they _are_ 20.5 years old, and would be pushing 30 when I retire (if all goes well). As part of my evaluation of the idea of replacement, I can check them out. If I see any sign of trouble (such as driver surrounds cracking), I can look for replacement parts, which might be available still, or go ahead and replace them anyway. If not, I'll ride them until they drop or I get tired of them. If a _crossover_ goes, I'm going to replace them and not bother with it.
> 
> 
> There is a Legacy dealer in New Haven CT, an _eight-hour_ round trip; they're a Def Tech dealer too. But I'd need to be serious about the Legacys to go that far away. Then there's Value Electronics, home of the HDTV Shootout, and a Def tech dealer. The nearest Bryston dealer is in Wisconsin, though he's sold some Model Ts into NY (twenty-year warranty!). If I inspect the M-3si drivers and all is well, new speakers will continue to be moot. If not, there's a decision to be made.



I think Dennis (DMark1) lives around 2 hours away from you. Drop him a PM...he's got Focus SE and Signature SE models, as well as a Whisper XD pair. Your ears shall thank you










I'd say 20.5 years shows how well the Mirages were made. You should be mighty proud!


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23791654
> 
> 
> However, not being given a spirit of fear,



2 Tim 1:7


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23792125
> 
> 
> I think Dennis (DMark1) lives around 2 hours away from you. Drop him a PM...he's got Focus SE and Signature SE models, as well as a Whisper XD pair. Your ears shall thank you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd say 20.5 years shows how well the Mirages were made. You should be mighty proud!



The eight hours is due to public transportation (Metro North). An all-day deal. We will see what the M-3si inspection brings. Meantime, I still have good sound. And the 30Hz is plenty in this room; much lower might be crazy, I don't know.


I should check into how to get to Lancaster just in case. Also, I could get those Mac XR200s at half-price if I could get to Vestal, NY, near Binghamton. But there's no public transportation that way; maybe Greyhound goes there? Still premature, but the info may be helpful.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23792888
> 
> 
> 2 Tim 1:7



And in an audio-related vein, a "sound" mind.


----------



## audioguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23793524
> 
> 
> And in an audio-related vein, a "sound" mind.


And "power" which all audio systems require😙


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audioguy*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23799104
> 
> 
> And "power" which all audio systems require😙



Well, I don't "love" music; I like it, though. It's that which prompts one to get a system with ample power to play and enjoy it well.


I have some time off scheduled in a couple of weeks; if all goes well, that might be the time to inspect the M-3sis.


----------



## prepress

Time to clean up . . .


Currently there are three brands of power cords in my setup: WW Stratus is on the CD, main BDP, Furman SPR-20i (via adapter) and the TV; WW Aurora is on the C2300; and WW Electras are on the 501s; all are 5.2. There are PS Audio Jewel ACs on the LD player, tuner, Oppo BDP, VPI SDS, the Duo VP and the Furman Elite. Finally, I have a Shunyata Venom extension cord connecting everything to the wall. The extension is necessary due to the room layout. I plan to replace the Jewel ACs on the LD and tuner with WW Stratus, thus sources will be uniform (except for the TT, which is a captive cord). My Aragon IPS (power supply for the phono preamp) is using the stock cord also.


It's the power setup that I'm most concerned with. I have nothing against the Jewels, but the two Furmans are on adjacent shelves and I don't like the 2m Jewel connecting them; I want something shorter. I could move the 1m Jewel from the Oppo to the Furman Elite and put the Oppo's stock cord back on (which I just thought of), but the stock cord is too long also. The Oppo doesn't play through the system, so I'm not concerned about uniformity.


The biggest question is how to handle the power conditioner connections. There is a 3m Stratus on the SPR which the Venom then takes to the wall. I am thinking of a 3m Venom or Venom HC to replace the Stratus. The concern there is that the cord would be useless or create clutter in a future setup where an extension or long cord isn't needed. The other option is the 12AWG, 25 ft. extension cord I have which would allow me to get a better power cord for the SPR. The problem there is that the 25 ft. is WAY too long for my current needs and would create its own clutter. The idea is to _shorten_ power cord runs, not make them longer.


Transparent also makes power cords, the Performance and High Performance PowerLink in particular. I could get a custom Performance (5m) and run it all the way to the wall. Or a 3m High Performance, and keep the Venom in place. Now that's _four_ brands of cord! Whatever I decide on the SPR will be duplicated on the Elite in a 1m version.


There is also the matter of speaker cables. I would like shorter runs on my speaker cable. The choices are Kimber 12TC (Hero IC is currently on all sources) and Transparent MusicWave Plus (MusicLink Plus IC connects pre and power amps). We're talking about two 4 ft. pair of either. The Transparent would be $1790, the Kimber about half that. I don't necessarily like the color of the Kimber's jacket, but at $900 less I could learn to live with it (by the way, anyone who has experience with both is welcome to chime in).


For whatever reason I obsess with these things. If anyone has an idea which will clear through my clutter, whether philosophical or practical, feel free. There are too many expenses (plane tickets for one) coming up for me to spend a lot of money, but I am set to resolve this and want the most sensible way. I've thought of one as I've typed, but will sit with it for a day or two. These things work out if I sit with them long enough.


----------



## prepress

I'm in the midst of a massive clean-up effort, so I don't yet have a pristine photo, but here's two "before" photos of the mishmash behind the system I'm talking about, from two angles.

 

 


This isn't about improved sound, I want to organize things better and get some shorter cables back there where possible. None of the power cord alternatives is that expensive; the most expensive one is $595 for a 2m cord. I have velcro strips to bundle the interconnects, which will help also. This is probably a long-term project, but I want to start it this year, then after the dust settles from holiday expenses, resume. I have much straightening, cleaning and dusting to do in the meantime.


----------



## pcweber111

Yeah I wanted to take a dust rag to those shelves lol. I love cable management and as I am doing a reorg myself this weekend I will share in your pain and suffering. The end result though should be a cleaner looking rear end and easier to manage. If you show your after shots I'll show some before and after as well.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pcweber111*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23851735
> 
> 
> Yeah I wanted to take a dust rag to those shelves lol. I love cable management and as I am doing a reorg myself this weekend I will share in your pain and suffering. The end result though should be a cleaner looking rear end and easier to manage. If you show your after shots I'll show some before and after as well.



It's beginning to look like this won't be a simple rearranging and then replacing one or two cords. It could end up as an _entire_ power cord overhaul. I've gotten some suggestions from Caelin Gabriel, head of Shunyata Reseach, and that's the direction this is pointing in, if I _really_ want to do it right. But I'll tell you, if I get things to look even _close_ to fabulous, I'll be planning to post pics!


----------



## prepress

Last night a friend from church came over. She had expressed an interest in doing so a while ago, and "cornered" me on it last month, so we set up yesterday. She arrived, and I gave her a tour of the system. We (I) ordered burgers and sweet-potato fries from a nearby burger joint (NOT a chain, by the way), we brought them back here and I put on some music to eat burgers by, an Antonio Carlos Jobim anthology. Her mouth hung open at the sound. She hadn't heard anything like that before. She was amazed.


After burgers (there was key lime cheesecake later, too), we came back to the living room and I played VJ with tracks from _Eric Clapton and Steve Winwood Live from Madison Square Garden_, _Marcus Miller In Concert_, _How Great Thou Art_ from the Bill Gaither _Homecoming_ series, and _Ivete Sangalo MTV Ao Vivo_ (a Brazilian pop singer, if you didn't know). There was even a video from an animation tournament on laserdisc, _Oral Hygiene_ (you wouldn't believe it if I told you, so I won't; suffice it to say the lead character is a skeleton head wearing oversized tennis shoes). She raved about the sound of everything, and laughed at _Oral Hygiene_. She had a good time and it was obvious. I did, too.


Then, on another forum, another exchange with Mr. Gabriel, the gist of which is if I like the sound of my system (I sure did last night), I don't need to sweat any tweaks to it. I could leave it as is for sure, and it's confirmed even more that any moves regarding power cords have nothing to do with sound, only aesthetics and efficiency. It's best if I could have a custom-length power cord run to the wall, but a 5m Venom HC would cost probably more than I'd be comfortable spending at the moment, plus it would be of no other use if the system changed. But the best power cord should be on the power distribution equipment, according to Mr. Gabriel, and that makes some sense to me.


I have a bit of clarity going forward.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23856601
> 
> 
> Last night a friend from church came over. She had expressed an interest in doing so a while ago, and "cornered" me on it last month, so we set up yesterday. She arrived, and I gave her a tour of the system. We (I) ordered burgers and sweet-potato fries from a nearby burger joint (NOT a chain, by the way), we brought them back here and I put on some music to eat burgers by, an Antonio Carlos Jobim anthology. Her mouth hung open at the sound. She hadn't heard anything like that before. She was amazed.
> 
> 
> After burgers (there was key lime cheesecake later, too), we came back to the living room and I played VJ with tracks from _Eric Clapton and Steve Winwood Live from Madison Square Garden_, _Marcus Miller In Concert_, _How Great Thou Art_ from the Bill Gaither _Homecoming_ series, and _Ivete Sangalo MTV Ao Vivo_ (a Brazilian pop singer, if you didn't know). There was even a video from an animation tournament on laserdisc, _Oral Hygiene_ (you wouldn't believe it if I told you, so I won't; suffice it to say the lead character is a skeleton head wearing oversized tennis shoes). She raved about the sound of everything, and laughed at _Oral Hygiene_. She had a good time and it was obvious. I did, too.
> 
> 
> Then, on another forum, another exchange with Mr. Gabriel, the gist of which is if I like the sound of my system (I sure did last night), I don't need to sweat any tweaks to it. I could leave it as is for sure, and it's confirmed even more that any moves regarding power cords have nothing to do with sound, only aesthetics and efficiency. It's best if I could have a custom-length power cord run to the wall, but a 5m Venom HC would cost probably more than I'd be comfortable spending at the moment, plus it would be of no other use if the system changed. But the best power cord should be on the power distribution equipment, according to Mr. Gabriel, and that makes some sense to me.
> 
> 
> I have a bit of clarity going forward.



Sharing our systems is such a joy; however, sharing our systems with those who have never before heard what a properly tuned setup can do for music....now that's a remarkable experience!


----------



## pcweber111

Indeed. I've had friends and girlfriends remark how amazing full size speakers sound with a good amp and good source. People get so used to overly compressed audio playing on substandard headphones or radios that they never experience what music can sound like. It's a nice feeling to have them comment on how good it sounds.


----------



## prepress

Yes. Both the Saturday experience and the exchange with Caelin Gabriel were perspective-setters. I could just put a shorter WW Stratus on the Furman Elite and call it a day; my power distribution connections would then be consistent. And because of the sound I was getting on Saturday, I know I don't need to go for any really expensive cords either. So in terms of cleaning up clutter, I could just go for shorter WW Stratus cables all around.


I also know that if I want a heavier gauge cord for the Furman SPR, in performance terms it's ideal to go to the wall, unless I have an extension cord of the same gauge. Whatever's on the SPR will go on the Elite also. That could be a Kimber PK10; a 16 ft. cord would be around $530.


Then, there's speaker cable. Almost certainly Kimber 12TC; if not, then the 8TC I use now. Two pairs of 4 ft. each. As much as the Transparent cables intrigue me, I can't see spending almost $1800 for two pair of those. Not now, anyway.


----------



## prepress

I don't know how much it will complicate things, but my printer is misbehaving. Not only did I get a message that my toner cartridge is low, but there was another suggesting something was broken. I'll need to check that. I was able to print out a couple of copies of my Sunday school lesson and take them to a nearby Office Max to have more copies made.


A new printer is an unforeseen expense. The cartridges ran $200 the last time I got one. I don't know if this printer is still supported, even. I got it back in 2003, at a cost of $999. It's a Xanté AW1200 (genuine PostScript!). I can't get another one so I'd look at Xerox, my next choice. The 3600 seems comparable.


The power cord may be researched and planned for still, then wait until the printer and Christmas travel plans get set. If I'm not comfortable with my checking account balance after that, then I'll go least expensive on the power cords or wait until next year—just like Cub fans often have to. And Met fans.


----------



## prepress

UPDATE: I called Xanté (the manufacturer of my AW1200 printer), and they do have some toner cartridges left for it. So I ordered one. The broken piece message appeared only that once, and didn't stop the printer from printing the last couple of times I used it. So I'm going to see if the new cartridge solves not only the low toner issue, but defeats the error message I got previously. And, whether the uniform splotches at the top of each sheet go away. If this works, I will proceed with my power cord/speaker cable machinations. If not, then I've blown $229 and will need to get a printer anyway. I should know soon, as I paid an extra $10 for 2-day delivery.


----------



## BrolicBeast


$239 for a toner cartridge?  You must have one industrial-strength, heavy-duty plotter in that place o' yours!


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23892462
> 
> 
> $239 for a toner cartridge?  You must have one industrial-strength, heavy-duty plotter in that place o' yours!



$199 plus 2-day shipping. Actually, it's $227.71. And Xanté is a high-end printer company, with all their printers offering true Adobe PostScript. They're aimed at the graphic arts industry. The AW1200 was more for the home or small office user. The printer cost about a grand back in the day, and I've had it since 2003. I think when the cartridge goes I'll be moving on, perhaps a Xerox. But for now, I'm hoping the new cartridge will keep me happy.


Speaking of Southern belles, Xanté is based in Alabama.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23892725
> 
> 
> 
> $199 plus 2-day shipping. Actually, it's $227.71. And Xanté is a high-end printer company, with all their printers offering true Adobe PostScript. They're aimed at the graphic arts industry. The AW1200 was more for the home or small office user. The printer cost about a grand back in the day, and I've had it since 2003. I think when the cartridge goes I'll be moving on, perhaps a Xerox. But for now, I'm hoping the new cartridge will keep me happy.
> 
> 
> Speaking of Southern belles, Xanté is based in Alabama.


 Monstrous!  I think I recall you previously mentioning that you work in the graphics industry--looks  like that beast has the bite to back up the bark of its price-tag!


----------



## prepress

Here's a good one.


Kevin Miller was scheduled to come by on Saturday at about 10:30 to do a re-calibration on my PRO-111FD plasma. This was moved up from the afternoon due to another appointment he had in Connecticut. Today, I find out there's a possibility (though not big at this point) I'll have to go into work on Saturday. I was going to alert Kevin and let him know about this, to see if we want to re-schedule or let it be until tomorrow afternoon, when I should know for sure about Saturday.


Lo and behold, I got home a short while ago and have a message from Kevin. His Connecticut appointment cancelled, and so he can come in the afternoon on Saturday around 3:30–4:00PM! That should let me go to work if necessary and get back in time for him. I don't believe in coincidence, and this isn't one for sure. It's great!


On the down side, I missed UPS, so no printer cartridge today.


----------



## prepress

Kevin Miller came yesterday to do a touch-up re-calibration of my PRO-111 plasma. The reds were running a bit too strong, which I'd begun to notice mostly on all-black screens. The black level was up a bit, which I _hadn't_ noticed. Both were taken care of. He also calibrated another input, so I now have 3 ISF-calibrated HDMI inputs. So if my Duo VP ever dies or I decide to get rid of it, I'm set. I also updated the software on my BDP-09, and am now running the latest version. I'm set for a while, it seems. Skin tones are good, some pictures are a tad crisper, it looks like as well.


On the other hand, I got another error on my Xanté printer this AM as I tried to print out my Sunday school article. I didn't get the new toner cartridge yet, but I'm now all but certain the printer is the issue. So I'm planning to look into the Xerox 3600, and return the cartridge unopened once it arrives. An expensive few days. I bought my plane tickets for Christmas vacation, paid my rent and for an ISF calibration, now there's a new printer in the mix. No expensive power cords for me, I think. I'll buy carefully.


----------



## prepress

This AM, I got another error code on the Xanté, different from the last one. Instead of three flashes then a delay, I got two with a delay. It's settled. I plan to call the company to return the cartridge (I never opened the box) and go after another printer, probably the Xerox mentioned earlier. That affects the power cord plans.


As for power cords, I see Audio Advisor has a supply of PS Audio Jewel ACs; apparently PS Audio discovered them in the warehouse and they're being sold off at ridiculous prices. I think I'll put Wireworlds on all my sources, though. The tuner and LD player have Jewel ACs now. And most of the cords are too long, at 2m. I'd hate to replace them all with shorter versions of the same thing, but this is about organizing things better.


----------



## prepress

^ ^ ^ ^

Okay. Making sense of the manual, it appears that if there is a printer error (as opposed to the cartridge only), the green LED should be flashing. It doesn't. That suggests the problem is back to the cartridge. Being weary of the back and forth, I'll just take my chances and replace the cartridge.


Back to working out the power cord issue, then. I'm also wondering should I reconfigure so I can use shorer interconnects or HDMIs too. But that means buying the same thing all over again, and that's not desirable!


----------



## prepress

I sent out e-mails looking for price info on custom power cord lengths to Kimber, Transparent, Wireworld and Shunyata. The idea is for a 5m and a 1m. I haven't heard from Transparent yet, and WW didn't give any prices but they do have a power cord extender, which means I could chain two together and use cable I already have if I want. My wallet would like that best.


The Shunyata Venom HCs are more expensive than I thought they'd be at the custom lengths. A custom length Venom 3 at 1m costs double the standard 1.5m. The two Kimbers would be acceptable, but they now come in black; the green jackets are done. I'd still like to hear from Transparent before doing anything, but maybe cooler heads prevail and I get the WW extender with a stock 2m cord and chain it to the 3m I have already. Thus I eliminate the Shunyata extension. I also use the 1m cord to connect the two Furmans I have. That solves the power problem there. Plus, what use would I really have going forward for a 5m power cable under other system circumstances? I don't see one.


----------



## Geoff4RFC

5M power cord sounds like big bucks. I use Emotiva power cords with my three amps, they do the job well enough and look nice doing it










They are reasonably priced and they show you exactly what they're made of, unfortunately, 4M is the largest they make

http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/interconnects/products/xiec


----------



## audiofan1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/640_40#post_23966154
> 
> 
> I sent out e-mails looking for price info on custom power cord lengths to Kimber, Transparent, Wireworld and Shunyata. The idea is for a 5m and a 1m. I haven't heard from Transparent yet, and WW didn't give any prices but they do have a power cord extender, which means I could chain two together and use cable I already have if I want. My wallet would like that best.
> 
> 
> The Shunyata Venom HCs are more expensive than I thought they'd be at the custom lengths. A custom length Venom 3 at 1m costs double the standard 1.5m. The two Kimbers would be acceptable, but they now come in black; the green jackets are done. I'd still like to hear from Transparent before doing anything, but maybe cooler heads prevail and I get the WW extender with a stock 2m cord and chain it to the 3m I have already. Thus I eliminate the Shunyata extension. I also use the 1m cord to connect the two Furmans I have. That solves the power problem there. Plus, what use would I really have going forward for a 5m power cable under other system circumstances? I don't see one.



I was using a complete PS Audio Perfectwave loom from the AC3 to the AC12 but during last years upgrade and now using three conditioners I needed a long 4m run for my new sub and thought I'd give the Pangea AC9 and I also powered the conditioner from the wall with the AC9SE 2m they are both 7awg cables well made and the have worked well considering the length and price they where a steal.









http://www.audioadvisor.com/


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *audiofan1*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23967409
> 
> 
> I was using a complete PS Audio Perfectwave loom from the AC3 to the AC12 but during last years upgrade and now using three conditioners I needed a long 4m run for my new sub and thought I'd give the Pangea AC9 and I also powered the conditioner from the wall with the AC9SE 2m they are both 7awg cables well made and the have worked well considering the length and price they where a steal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.audioadvisor.com/



I found the AC9 much too stiff; it even took a chunk out of a receptacle on my voltage regulator at the time. There's a photo posted earlier in the thread. Other than that, I think it would have worked for me. I do use Pangea HDMI cables and am pleased.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/630#post_23966245
> 
> 
> 5M power cord sounds like big bucks. I use Emotiva power cords with my three amps, they do the job well enough and look nice doing it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They are reasonably priced and they show you exactly what they're made of, unfortunately, 4M is the largest they make
> 
> http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/interconnects/products/xiec



They look nice. Odd there's no 3m cord; I wonder why Emotiva skipped that length.


Prices I have for 5m custom cords so far: Shunyata Venom HC: $776; Kimber PK10: $530; both are 10AWG. A regular Venom at 3m is $416, but the custom 1m is $300 versus $150 for a standard 1.5m.


I think, if I'm going to change anything, it would be to get a standard 1m Wireworld Stratus to connect the Furmans and call it a day; that's the least expensive option. According to WW, the new Series 7 cords are like buying one model up in the 5.2 series. Thus, in their view the Series 7 Stratus is as good or better than the Aurora 5.2 series. They also say with their cables longer is better because of the way their cables are designed to filter line noise. But longer defeats my purposes. Plus, I have no complaints about noise in the sound I get at this point.


----------



## prepress

The first serious shot in the cable battle has been fired. I just ordered two 4ft. pair of Kimber 12TC speaker cables with banana terminations, and a 0.6m Pangea AC-14 power cord for the cable box. The cable box sits on the shelf above my Furman SPR-20i, and it's crazy for there to be a 6ft. cord on there. The 12TC replaces 6-foot runs of 8TC which, with the current configuration, are much too long.


I've bundled some of the interconnects and the HDMIs with velcro strips, also. A small improvement only, but an improvement. I'll take it. It's all about letting me see what's going on behind the system for now.


And away we go.


----------



## Geoff4RFC

Dang man, I feel pretty cheap. You're getting the good stuff. I just sprang $5 for a coaxial interconnect.....1M


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_23985064
> 
> 
> Dang man, I feel pretty cheap. You're getting the good stuff. I just sprang $5 for a coaxial interconnect.....1M



I thought that if I'm going to make the change I may as well move up. Sound-wise, I don't expect much difference with the 12TC. The additional 4 conductors per terminal are said to yield an incremental improvement over 8TC. And the heavier gauge (aggregate 8AWG vs. 9AWG) is helpful if one has power-hungry speakers or large woofers that need taming. Now that I think about it, that sounds like prep for a potential speaker change . . .


But again, this isn't about performance; it's more about taming the mass of cable clutter behind the system and visual balance. The 8TC looks like chicken wire connecting the large speakers and amps; the heftier cable will look better and I hope the clear/white dielectric will aid that look also, though I'll miss the 8TC's black/blue color scheme. It matches the HDMIs I use.


----------



## Geoff4RFC




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_23985767
> 
> 
> Now that I think about it, that sounds like prep for a potential speaker change . . ..



LOL! The rabbit hole is deep and wide


----------



## jnnt29




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/650_50#post_23986226
> 
> 
> LOL! The rabbit hole is deep and wide



Help I've fallen and I can't get up! Lol


----------



## Geoff4RFC




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jnnt29*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_23986267
> 
> 
> Help I've fallen and I can't get up! Lol



And you won't get up either my brother!!!!!!! Alice's rabbit hole had a bottom though very deep. Unfortunately, H.T. and 2ch rabbit holes have no bottom


----------



## prepress

Actually, the hole is as deep as I (or you guys) make it.


As for the speaker upgrade business, it did occur that the Legacy Focus SE review I saw on Audioholics had a scene of some Kimber 12VS connected to it. No intent here, just saying.


----------



## Geoff4RFC




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_23987168
> 
> 
> Actually, the hole is as deep as I (or you guys) make it..



LOL, who are you trying to kid my friend? You have been tumbling down your abyss for how long now? Dare I say it..........you are in it for life


----------



## prepress

I've been looking at my cable clutter and wondering what I might do to clean it up without spending tons of money. The value of living at or (better) beneath one's means is a good long-term strategy I've been reminded of recently. As I've said, the easiest move is get a 1m WW Stratus for the Furman Elite and be done, then just do the best with what I have. But the curiosity over Venom HC and Kimber PK10 is still with me. And I wonder about plugging everything I can into the Elite being better than half into the Elite and half into the SPR. I think I need to do some layout charts and see!


I'm REALLY thinking that once I resolve the cable clutter I'm done, unless something needs replacing. At some point, you should enjoy your system.


----------



## Geoff4RFC

Happy Thanksgiving


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_24006464
> 
> 
> Happy Thanksgiving



The same to you. And to everybody! There is much to be grateful for this day.


P.S. A Wireworld Series 7 Stratus power cord is on the way.


----------



## prepress

Four 1m Pangea HL-26L HDMI cables are on the way.


----------



## prepress

. . . So are two 4-ft. pair of Kimber 12TC and a C7 Pangea AC-14 power cord.


----------



## prepress

Kimber and Pangea are in the house







. Will open boxes later, as I am heading out shortly. I may not get to set anything up tonight since I owe a phone call or two. We'll see.


----------



## prepress

The Wireworld Stratus Series 7 power cable came today. This 1m cable replaced a 2m PS Audio Jewel, which connected the Furmans. We're moving along slowly in our great cable cleanup.


With very little time on them, the 12TC speaker cables are a bit more open than the 8TC. A good sign.


----------



## pcweber111

Come on man, pics!


----------



## prepress

Here is the 12TC on the right speaker. As you see, it's heftier than the 8TC. I prefer the colored jacket of the 8TC, but according to Kimber removing the color doping improves the sound. I don't know about that, but I have noted a more open sound.

 



Here is the rear of the right rack. Compared to previous photos, it looks less cluttered.

 


I still need to dust, and perhaps I should do so as I make these changes (and BEFORE I post pictures). It seems a losing battle here







. Or i could disconnect everything in the rear of the system, dust, then re-attach. That would be a pain, considering how often I'd have to do it.


----------



## prepress

^ ^ ^

Looking at those photos, I _really_ wish they came in black . . . or blue . . .


----------



## Geoff4RFC

Pre, much congratulations on your new Kimbers!!!!


I just picked up some new cable myself but a DIY. Check it out, I've got some pics of the project I made for my center channel. Soon, I'll start a new project for my rears.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_24084782
> 
> 
> Pre, much congratulations on your new Kimbers!!!!
> 
> 
> I just picked up some new cable myself but a DIY. Check it out, I've got some pics of the project I made for my center channel. Soon, I'll start a new project for my rears.



It must be nice to have the skill and time to put your own cables together. They look well done. i would expect them to sound good based on looks alone.


The brick wall behind the system in some of the photos makes me wonder if you've thought about any treatment for that wall, or does it sound okay as is? Some speakers like reflective surfaces, perhaps yours do also?


----------



## Geoff4RFC




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *prepress*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_24086337
> 
> 
> It must be nice to have the skill and time to put your own cables together. They look well done. i would expect them to sound good based on looks alone.
> 
> 
> The brick wall behind the system in some of the photos makes me wonder if you've thought about any treatment for that wall, or does it sound okay as is? Some speakers like reflective surfaces, perhaps yours do also?



Thanks on the cables!


The brick wall was loved by many







I miss that room. My next house will be my own. That room with the brick wall was very naturally acoustic. Popcorn ceiling, deep pile carpet, the walls were 8" slats with half inch wide/1/4 inch deep grooves. It was 15.5 W X 26.5 D. My set up never sounded so good. My Polk Audio RTiA9's, all four of them blasted through that space, my dual Epik Empires pounded the bass in that room. I had knocked stuff off the wall just showing off.............yeah, I miss that room. I would have done some room treatments had we stayed there with some panels strategically placed.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/660#post_24087641
> 
> 
> Thanks on the cables!
> 
> 
> The brick wall was loved by many
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I miss that room. My next house will be my own. That room with the brick wall was very naturally acoustic. Popcorn ceiling, deep pile carpet, the walls were 8" slats with half inch wide/1/4 inch deep grooves. It was 15.5 W X 26.5 D. My set up never sounded so good. My Polk Audio RTiA9's, all four of them blasted through that space, my dual Epik Empires pounded the bass in that room. I had knocked stuff off the wall just showing off.............yeah, I miss that room. I would have done some room treatments had we stayed there with some panels strategically placed.



Living in an apartment, I don't want to blow the place away (the building is 100 years old). Or myself, for that matter. I think my speakers are actually enough for the environment I'm in. With a relatively small room, I don't see the need for bass much lower than I have; maybe 25Hz max. The 30Hz I get now can, depending upon the program material, rock the place sufficiently. I'd need about 20Hz at least to get the deepest organ notes reasonably well, but until a speaker change becomes more practical I think I'll pass.


----------



## Geoff4RFC

Merry Christmas brother


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## prepress

Merry Christmas to all!


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## prepress

It's been an interesting time the past week. I watched the Weather Channel and saw the crazy weather all over the country with Gemini, the winter storm of last week. I watched with some concern that the southern part of it would spin up strong, even dangerous storms over the weekend. I would be flying into the path of this by flying into Nashville 12/19. Sure enough, the nasty weather was to hit Nashville Saturday the 21st.


I was at an extended stay hotel, on the first floor, watching weather updates during the day Saturday. I finally turned off the TV after the New Mexico Bowl, won by Colorado State in a real interesting game, especially at the end. At about 8:45 I hear what sounded like a tornado siren. I went out to the front lobby but saw no one behind the counter. The siren stopped. I went back to my room.


A couple of minutes later, the sirens start again. I go out to the front desk; the clerk is there. Yes, he hears the siren and is monitoring the storm's progress on radar. He has it up on the display at the front desk, in fact. The storm is currently in downtown Nashville; the hotel is northeast of there. It should get to us in about 15 minues, he said. If need be he will take necessary action. Not being reassured much by that, I went back to my room and gathered some essentials should I need to bolt quickly. I turned on the TV for another update. A brief image of what looked like high wind reports, then the screen went black. The sirens start again as a stark message appears:


EMERGENCY ALERT SYSTEM

TORNADO WARNING

SEEK SHELTER IMMEDIATELY


I go into the hallway and sit down on the floor, waiting. I try calling a friend, whom I first had to convince this was a potentially serious circumstance. After a short talk, I wait for . . . whatever. Others are in the hallway, not seeming to take things as seriously as I. The rain starts, the wind picks up. It rains REALLY hard for a bit along with gusts. A bit of lightning and thunder. That's over in about 15 minutes or so. The rain slacks off some but is still steady. The tornado warning is cancelled at 9:15, but a tornado watch continues until midnight. I decide to stay up until then just in case. Other than an occasional flash of lightning not much more happens. Ultimately, there was an inch of rain, 40 mph gusts, about 9300 people who lost power, and some flooding in parts of the city.


In Texas to visit my sister, it's gotten progressively warmer each day, and tomorrow should approach normal temps for this area (low/mid 60s; it was 47 when I arrived Monday). I couldn't get her to agree to a record cleaning machine for Christmas, so I'm getting her a Pro-Ject record cleaning brush and some Nitty Gritty sleeves to replace the paper ones. A minor victory, as she's not a gadget person at all. I wanted to go by a store selling Shunyata and Kimber power cords to make some comparison, but it's appointment only; not for a power cord, I thought. Plus, I'm leaving town soon and don't want to wait for the guy to call back. Oh well.


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## prepress

In my battle against cable clutter, I've had an idea. I hooked up my VPI 'table directly to the C2300 originally, but abandoned that due to the fact that I was impatient to break in the tubes and knew I'd use the line stage far more than the phono section. Plus, I had to fill in empty shelves on my racks, right? So the phono preamp went back in.


Now, it occurs that if I put the phono into the 2300 I will be able to eliminate one power cord and one pair of interconnects since the phono preamp would be eliminated. Plus, I could even take out two shelves. Time to do some sample reconfig diagrams before unplugging or pulling things out of the system. I've already had one friend voice displeasure at removing shelves; she likes the balance of the system as is and thinks it will make the TV stand out too much.


Back to the drawing board, as it were.


----------



## prepress

Here are a couple of system layouts, the first as the setup is now, the second with the Aragon 47k phono and its IPS power supply out of the mix. The turntable would then be connected to the C2300's phono input. That would mean the hassle of disconnecting the 2300 and re-tubing the phono section.

systembase.pdf 77k .pdf file
systemw-ophono.pdf 73k .pdf file


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## prepress

I just received a Shunyata Venom 3s power cord, which I intend to put on the TV. On it, there's a tag that says, "Caution. The drain wire in this cord is not terminated to any of the terminals in the connector." Does anyone know what that means?


----------



## prepress

A Wireworld Stratus 7 just arrived.


----------



## Geoff4RFC

Wow, sounds like you have some projects going on!! Don't know what to say about the power cord dilemma, but I'd like to see that and your Stratus 7


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Geoff4RFC*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/690#post_24303779
> 
> 
> Wow, sounds like you have some projects going on!! Don't know what to say about the power cord dilemma, but I'd like to see that and your Stratus 7



Not much of a shot, but here's the Wireworld:

 



Unrelated to cable clutter, I bought some latex gloves Saturday and have ordered a couple pair of tubes. I plan to swap out the ones in the preamp line stage and try some others. That gives me a little tube library of four brands. The C2300 has a phono section too, but using the line stage only helps me fill a rack space with my old phono preamp (which isn't that bad) and saves using up good tubes faster. It would be several years before I'd need to change them, but I bought some at the dealer's (weak-willed, that) and they cost more than what I'm using, so they should go in there.


----------



## prepress

A bump in the road . . .


For a few months my MCD301 SACD/CD player had been having a problem with its tray. It had difficulty closing; it opened just fine. When closing the tray would hesitate or stutter as it closed. Sometimes it behaved, seemingly dependent upon whether I pressed the upper or lower part of the open/close button. But the problem became more pronounced as time went on and, in the last few days, it began to manifest when the tray opened as well.


A reply to an e-mail sent to McIntosh suggested that perhaps the glass front had shifted, and that the tray being skewed to one side or the other in its slot was indicative of this. With an appropriate screwdriver, i could take off the aluminum endcaps and adjust the glass; if that didn't work the unit would need service. The tray was indeed skewed to the left, but I don't have the appropriate screwdriver and my attempts to loosen the overly-tightened, recessed screws holding the endcaps in place resulted in some scratches inside the wells where the screws are, and maybe a bit of stripping of the screws. That was the last of _that_ try. The nearby hardware store didn't have a screwdriver that would work either, so I decided to take the unit in for repair, which I returned home from about 25 minutes ago. The store will take a look at the 301 in case it's something they can handle, but it will likely go back to McIntosh. I should hear from the store with an estimate in a few days.


Possible culprits are the glass shifting, a defective drive belt, an off-track gear, or (the ultimate nightmare) a bad drive; that would be over $800 to replace.


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## prepress

Last night, I had the urge to pull out an LP or two, being in the mood for some classic rock. My 301 is out for repair (no word yet) so I rely on other sources for now, though I could re-insert my Marantz DV8400 into the system temporarily.


I pulled out _Led Zeppelin II_ and _Close to the Edge_ and played them. I was mildly surprised to hear musical information and detail I hadn't heard before, and in the case of _Close to the Edge_, information I don't recall hearing from the standard CD. In both cases I heard deeper into the mix. This is all coming from a 22 year-old turntable with a relatively new cartridge (1 year, but _very_ lightly used) going through a 20 year-old phono preamp to the 2300's line stage with JJ ECC803s gold pins. Makes me wonder if this is the cartridge, the 2300, or the combination.


----------



## prepress

The Venom 3s power cord has been running on the Kuro for a while, and the sound seems to have opened up a bit. I like what I hear. I'll need to try it with some familiar DVDs, but there's more dimension to the sound now. The WW Stratus cord taken from the TV has had a similar effect on my tuner after I replaced the PS Audio Jewel with it. That's been listening to NPR primarily, but I heard a difference. Not huge, but noticeable.


This does nothing for my cable clutter, but it's nice to notice an improvement.


----------



## prepress

My McIntosh MCD301 SACD/CD player went off to the store for repair back on 2/8. It's not back yet. I called the store Monday, and was told McIntosh has it. There is an authorized repair shop in Manhattan, but the store feels more comfortable sending devices with transports and such back to Mac itself.


Earlier this week, I decided to re-instal my previous CD player, the Marantz DV8400 universal player.

 


I played it for the first time last night; some '50s and '60s tunes. It sounded okay, perhaps a bit muffled. It hasn't been used in three years, so it may need to break in all over again. It's also a 24/96 machine, versus the 24/192 MCD301. I don't know how long I'll have it in the setup, because I don't know how long the 301 will be away. We do what we need to do.


----------



## kevon27

"It hasn't been used in three years, so it may need to break in all over again"

I can't believe you actually said something like that.. Really.. Break in a digital device that you've used for many times. Huh???? Audiophilia, such a strange thing.


----------



## prepress




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kevon27*  /t/1277716/the-prepress-system/690#post_24453729
> 
> 
> "It hasn't been used in three years, so it may need to break in all over again"
> 
> I can't believe you actually said something like that.. Really.. Break in a digital device that you've used for many times. Huh???? Audiophilia, such a strange thing.



Off-the-cuff speculation on my part . . . who knows what happens to the circuits when nothing passes through them for that long. Nevertheless, things _did_ sound a bit better today, though nothing dramatic. It's a new power cord too, plus the player's never been used with the current electronics. As for the digital aspect, I'm using the 8400's analog output to a traditional preamp via RCA interconnects, same as I did for six years until the Mac replaced it.


I don't consider myself an audiophile, at least in terms of pursuit of it as a hobby; it's more an interest. That's why most of my system changes these days are small, cosmetic or practical ones. Not saying that couldn't change, but it isn't a goal at this point.


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## prepress

Another shot of the rack with the 8400. I have given up on dusting. It's about clutter control for now.


Also, I've moved the Duo VP to the center rack. It's there under the C2300 preamp. I've put shorter HDMI cables on the components; not sure I'll leave it there.


----------



## prepress

No news on the MCD301 yet. Today is 6 weeks.


McIntosh would contact my dealer, who in turn would contact me with the findings and cost for the repair. I think I might shoot an e-mail off to Mac to try and get a rough idea. I heard they are 3–4 weeks behind on repairs, so that probably accounts for the lag. But the delay holds up other things I may want to do potentially, such as a back-up for my 501s (probably that Marantz MM7025 I noted a while back) and maybe a new phono preamp if I'm really adventurous and am willing to commit to vinyl for the long haul; I'd thought that if my turntable went down in the next 5 years I'd replace it; after that, I'd let it go and downsize accordingly (that's 4 shelves out of my rack, not to mention the LPs) as at that point I'm only 5 years from retiring and would begin making moves toward that.


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## prepress

A while back, I swapped out the tubes in the C2300's line stage and went with NOS (new old stock, for the non-tube folks) Amperex tubes, made in Holland originally. They've been in the 2300 for over a month now.


I must report that the sound of my system is more open and transparent, though I lost a bit of bass, perhaps. These Amperexes are not as warm-sounding as the JJs they replaced, but things have opened up a bit. The sound is still nice and full, but a bit of _thump_ seems missing. Still, when I watched _The Avengers_ BD recently, the Soundgarden track over the end credits was more open and detailed (makes sense) but the bottom end had more _thump_. I wasn't expecting that. Maybe I just notice it because of the overall more open sound. Anyway, i think I will leave these Amperex tubes in until my MCD301 gets back so those two can get acquainted. But who knows?


It's clean-up time again. The friend from church who was here back in October (see the earlier post) wants to come over again. She's given up cheesecake for Lent, so if her statement about "key lime" is not a joke, I have until at least Easter to get the place right. And that's about how long it will take, too.


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## prepress

My hope is to retire in ten years, and thus I've done yet more thinking.


My MCD301 has been out for repair (since Feb. 8!!!). The worst-case scenario, as I understand it, is that the drive needs replacing, which would cost over $800. After some thought, it might be a good idea to start saving money against the possibility of repair or replacement of other components, including speakers.


The Mirages had their 21st birthday recently; my turntable is approaching 22. While I'm thinking that if my turntable goes down in the next 5 years I'd replace it, after that I'm inclined to let it go and downsize. That would clear four shelves (current configuration), not to mention the space gained by getting rid of my LPs. But speakers would _have_ to be replaced. There won't be a lot of money to work with regardless of what I can save (NY is expensive), but I'm hoping to have reasonable alternatives when the time comes. So in a way, I _have_ decided to replace my M-3sis. Just not now.


The other factor is a probable need to relocate upon retiring, so spending a bunch of money on speakers would be unwise. At this point, I keep an eye on Def Tech, Mirage's OMD-28, Focus Signature SE, Bryston Model T, (I may have to think Middle T by the time I'd have to buy something, though), and the Axiom LFR1100. I'll surely want something with comparable specs to my M-3sis. My Mirages perform so well I can't imagine just dumping them, and listening to ELP's _Tarkus_ last night, though with a substitute CD player, confirms that notion. However, I don't think I will try to fix them if they go down.


So, this is where I am.


----------



## prepress

My current system configuration is a bit different than the one on the first page. Everything except the cable box (which I don't own) is here. Brands are in bold:

*VPI* HW-19 Mk. IV turntable, SDS speed controller, HW-16.5 record cleaner;
*Grado* Reference Sonata 1 MM phono cartridge;
*SME* 309 tonearm;
*Van den Hul* MC D-501 Hybrid tonearm cable;
*Pioneer Elite* DVL-91 combi-player, PRO-111FD plasma, BDP-09FD blu-ray;
*Magnum Dynalab* MD 90 tuner;
*Oppo* BDP-83 blu-ray;
*Pangea* HD-26L HDMI cables, 20A-15A adapter;
*MIT* AVT s-video cable;
*DVDO* iScan Duo video processor;
*McIntosh* MCD301 SACD/CD player, C2300 preamp, MC501 monoblock power amps;
*Amperex* 12AX7 tubes;
*Aragon* 47k phono pramp, IPS power supply;
*Kimber* Hero interconnects, 12TC speaker cable;
*Transparent* MusicLink Plus interconnect;
*Mirage* M-3si speakers;
*Wireworld* Stratus, Aurora, Electra power cords;
*PS Audio* Jewel AC power cords;
*Shunyata* Venom extension, Venom 3s power cords;
*Conntek* AC adaptors;
*Furman* Elite-15 PFi power conditioner, SPR-20i voltage regulator;
*Sanus* Euro furniture


The idea of a new phono preamp is kicking around in my head now, though out of curiosity not need. And I MUST replace my printer (not part of the system, but it's the avatar I'm using). I should be hearing shortly on the damages to my SACD player, still out for repair. I contacted McIntosh and was told they'd contact the store either Friday past or today. That may or may not impact what I do. I want to be more about tweaks than upgrades, as I start to think more about being a better steward of my money.


----------



## prepress

I heard from the store this afternoon. The repair for my MCD301 is $176. Mac had to replace a few parts as I understand it, but nothing major. So after I gave my OK, the store will call McIntosh back, who will ship the unit back to the store, who will then contact me.


----------



## prepress

Another update: taking advantage of a Music Direct sale, I ordered 3 pair of Audioquest King Cobra interconnects. They will combine with the two I have already and replace the Kimber Hero I use now for all my source/preamp connections. Experience with the two as my pre/power connection showed the KC to have a fuller sound, with a bit more bottom end. The cables should arrive Tues./Wed. next week.


Oh, yes, and I DID replace my printer. That arrived yesterday. A Xerox B&W, which I've yet to set up.


----------



## prepress

Yesterday afternoon I went to the John Varvatos store in downtown Manhattan. I knew there was audio equipment and LPs in there. Also JV is a Mac fan.


I bought a couple of LPs, _Inner Secrets_ by Santana and _Moving Waves_ by Focus. The Santana is an original 1st pressing, sealed, unplayed mint copy, and sounded like it. No noise, clicks or pops. I got it beacuse I wanted the original version of _One Chain (Don't Make No Prison)_; mine was lost in a fire a long time ago and the copy I later bought has the disco-fied version of this track; I always preferred the original. The Focus LP isn't sealed but is marked as unplayed. I don't know. It's a bit noisy in the early going on the one side I played, and even skipped once during _Hocus Pocus_.


But the bigger event: I was confronted with the McIntosh XR200s, my main fantasy speaker. This is the first time I've seen them in person. They weren't playing; they stood there looking good, if a bit smaller than photos and measurements suggest. They're part of Mac's Soho 1 collection, which was on display. More, Varvatos actually sells this system and the other gear in the store as well (vintage Marantz, Sansui and a few other things). My mind began to swirl, and a brief chat with the sales clerk had it swirling a bit more. Could I actually save the money to get them? If I pull out the plastic could I manage the payments without relegating myself to peanut butter sandwiches, beans and rice and cereal for the next two years? If I want to retire in 10 years and I'd be tied up for two, maybe three years does this even make sense (rhetorical question)? I don't think it does, but starting to save more does in any case. The consideration of possibilities continues.


By the way, of the components in the Soho 1 collection the clerk said the biggest seller is the MT10 turntable.


----------



## prepress

To be continued . . .


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## prepress

The store called today. The 301 is in! The bill is $200, mostly labor. I've asked the store to ship it to me and it may well arrive tomorrow via UPS.


----------



## prepress

Ok, I indeed reconfigured my system yesterday (aftermath photos attached; the job is not quite complete, plus I once again forgot to dust). Part of that reconfiguration was moving the line stage Amperex tubes into the MM phono section on the C2300, and inserting the other pair of Amperexes I have into the line stage, where they'll break in faster. The Aragon 47k has been removed from the system, and all source/preamp connections are now AQ King Cobra, except for the VPI turntable. On each outside rack, the two 5" shelves were removed in favor of one 8" shelf. On the inside rack the cable box and Duo VP swapped places.


I noted first with the VPI connected directly to the 2300, that the 2300's ground connection and the Van den Hul phono cables aren't a great match; the spades on the tonearm cable are too small to go around the 2300's hefty terminal. I stick one spade of each leg into the hole and that seems to be good enough. The screw is turned tightly.


Preliminary findings are that the 2300's MM stage is as good as the Aragon, even with its IPS power supply. I've played only one record so far, and need to play more familiar ones to test things further; I hadn't played Santana's _Festival_ in a long time. One other thing from last night is that, though I had to turn up the volume more than with the line stage the bass was strong, as strong as the line stage's; with the MM phono it was flat (0), whereas with the line stage it's set to +3. I'll leave it set at 0 for phono and see what happens.


Also the 301 is back and reinstalled. The tray made a scraping noise opening and closing but moved smoothly. I'll have to inquire about the sound with the store or McIntosh. It sounded fine playing a Jimmy Smith CD last night.


----------



## prepress

I inquired of McIntosh about this scraping noise with the 301. The initial suspicion is the unit was jostled during shipping.

Yesterday, I received a reply from John Messemer of McIntosh, who thinks the 301 was jostled during transit also. Attached to the e-mail are instructions on how to open the unit and adjust the screws on either side of the CD tray. I'm planning to attempt it this weekend.


----------



## prepress

Ok, I just finished with the 301. It's back on its shelf with disc 5 of Instrumentals Complete playing. As I begin to type the theme from _Bonanza_ is playing, about to transition into the theme from _Exodus_.


First, the instructions McIntosh sent seem to be for an older build of the 301, as getting the top cover off is the same as for the C2300; two screws at the front and the two on the back of the top plate come out, then one side panel is removed. The screws weren't "nailed" in place as they were on the 2300, though.


It was a simple matter to adjust the screws on either side of the CD tray, and by eye at least the tray is now dead center in the slot. I tested it before and after placing the 301 back on its shelf. It sounds about the same as it did before. The scraping noise is gone. Now that it's back in place I'll probably play another disc or two to see if anything changes, and keep an eye on it over the next few days. I just heard a bit of distortion, like static, come from the left speaker (my computer is right next to it). Not sure what that is, unless it's in the recording and I happened to be close enough to hear it.


Anyway, the tray is working properly as of right now. The theme from _Love Story_ is playing.


----------



## prepress

I have just come back from the commencement service of the New York Theological Seminary, held at Riverside Church in Manhattan. One of my former Sunday school students invited me to come; she received her MA in Pastoral Care and Counseling, a nice achievement. There was also one other person from my church who received this degree, whom I don't know that well and didn't know was a seminary student. The ceremony began on time and ended a bit earlier than I expected, but it was still a 1:45 affair.


A major highlight was the church organ. I didn't actually see it because of where I sat, only from behind, but it looked and sounded like a monster (in a good sense). It was told me that it has _four_ rows of foot pedals. The sound was clean, clear, warm, smooth, any audiophile jargon you want to use. Bravo to the organist (Christopher Johnson), and the church's sound system and acoustics. My mother, who played organ and sometimes piano for the senior choir at church, would have liked the music greatly. Few things stir my spirit like the sound of a major-class organ playing classic hymns. I stuck around until the postlude was finished, even though the ceremony was over.


Inspired by what I was hearing, I had a real urge to come home and play some organ music. I haven't played any in a while, and have yet to on my stereo as constituted currently. The thought occurred that if the sound isn't satisfying, it could nudge me onto the path of a speaker replacement—even though my Mirages are working and sounding fine. The lowest organ notes (20Hz, I believe) are beyond them, but again, as long as things are satisfying replacing speakers will be put off for a while longer. This is a test I plan to do, but not now; I need to go to the gym and then run a couple of errands. I hope to get to it while the glow of that organ is with me; it'll probably wear off in a couple of days.


----------



## prepress

Ok, yesterday the Amperex tubes were removed from the C2300 preamp and I put the Mullards in both the line stage and MM inputs; I'd ordered a second pair. They have 3 hours on them (I'll stop counting once I get past 25 hours, as usual). I listened a bit to NPR, and used my usual video test discs, _The Avengers_ BD and _Yes: Live at Montreaux_ DVD.


Preliminary impressions out of the box: the Amperexes will not see the inside of the 2300 again, except as a last resort. Good as the Amperexes are, the Mullards, to my ears, blow them away. The Mullards have more gain, and play louder at the same volume. The sound is richer and fuller, and the low end is powerful. The Mullards are more dynamic, a bit warmer, and less "polite." They're good HT tubes, I'd say. I might even consider turning _down_ the bass a little.


I plan to move on to see if this trend continues with LPs, LDs, and CDs next. The Mullards, like their predecessors, will get at least a month in the 2300 before any final decisions are made, but at this point I'm inclined to leave them in place.


----------



## prepress

Updated system configuration:

*VPI* HW-19 Mk. IV turntable, SDS speed controller, HW-16.5 record cleaner;
*Grado* Reference Sonata 1 MM phono cartridge;
*SME* 309 tonearm;
*Van den Hul* MC D-501 Hybrid tonearm cable;
*Pioneer Elite* DVL-91 combi-player, PRO-111FD plasma, BDP-09FD blu-ray;
*Magnum Dynalab* MD 90 tuner;
*Day-Sequerra* FM Urban antenna
*Oppo* BDP-83 blu-ray;
*Pangea* HD-26L HDMI cables, 20A-15A adapter;
*MIT* AVT s-video cable;
*DVDO* iScan Duo video processor;
*McIntosh* MCD301 SACD/CD player, C2300 preamp, MC501 monoblock power amps;
*Mullard* new production 12AX7 tubes (for C2300);
*Kimber* 12TC speaker cable;
*Audioquest* King Cobra interconnects (sources);
*Transparent* MusicLink Plus interconnect (pre/power);
*Mirage* M-3si speakers;
*Wireworld* Stratus, Aurora, Electra power cords;
*PS Audio* Jewel AC power cords;
*Shunyata* Venom extension, Venom 3s power cords;
*Conntek* AC adaptors;
*Furman* Elite-15 PFi power conditioner, SPR-20i voltage regulator;
*Sanus* Euro equipment racks

Waiting on a new antenna for the tuner (it's backordered). I have a longer coax cable which will give me more freedom in placing the antenna when it arrives. I'd like to try pulling in a few more stations.


----------



## prepress

I picked this up earlier in the month: _The Complete Atlantic Studio Recordings of the Modern Jazz Quartet 1956–64_, a 7-CD set. Since the Mullard tubes in my preamp were still breaking in, Milt Jackson's vibes sounded a bit like milk bottles at first; eventually they smoothed out and were more tuneful. Nice.

These Mullard tubes continue to be a delight with BDs and DVDs. I like them.


----------



## prepress

Heard from Audio Advisor. The antenna (Magnum dynalab SR-100) is still backordered. I'm a bit surprised. Oh well, perhaps I'll get a chance to try something with the one I have in the meantime.


----------



## prepress

Having decided to take a splurge, I've ordered a Samsung 24" TV, their UN24H4000 LED LCD. It's edge-lit, but at this size I'm not too concerned. And it has a component input, so I can pair it with my Marantz DV8400 for DVDs. This will go into the bedroom, where I'll be sitting or lying only 3 to 4 feet away from the screen, so 24" is plenty. I'm figuring that, even at such a short distance, 720p won't matter.


----------



## prepress

I have done a potentially bad thing, but have also mitigated it, I hope.

At church, I invited a friend to the NY Audio Show. This is the same woman I had over back in October (see earlier in the thread). She is a self-described "gadget girl" and seemed excited about going. I have now, assuming she is pleased by the show's website, committed to going. She said she was all in already, but I wanted her to look at the site to confirm. I told her that her job will be to act as my wife and tell me I can't have whatever I might look at a bit too hard. Fortunately, most of the brands there are unfamiliar and I may tend to not go to those rooms.

UPDATE: She's changed her mind and will take a pass. We still have plans to get together, but I must decide if I want to hit the show earlier, go another day (Sunday, probably) or take a pass as well. It _could_ be dangerous to go, for several reasons.

I also note that Audio Classics will be there, selling Legacy and _Vintage McIntosh_. I hope that means nothing too recent (MR88, anyone?). This is one of the reasons it could be dangerous.


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## prepress

Got an e-mail from Audio Advisor. The SR-200 has shipped! Should be here Saturday.


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## prepress

Okay, I got back from the New York Audio Show last night, and it's my first time going. I was curious. I came away impressed with several things, and I've been stoked (too much, unfortunately). At least I stuck to my planned targets. Mostly.

The room I spent the most time in was VPI's main room (they had two). Both Harry and Matt Weisfeld were there, with Matt's girlfriend working the door. All were available to answer questions. They were demoing their new Classic Prime turntable, which comes with a new production 3D tonearm. It replaces the Classic II, essentially, and will retail for $3500. It doesn't have the same style as the Classics, though. It has an outboard motor, a Classic platter, and the configuration bears some resemblance to the HRX. The amp is an upcoming VPI integrated, which is a remake of an old Scott tube unit. The Prime has most of the performance of the Classic 3 for less money. By the way, VPI won't be offering the Classic 3 in Rosewood much longer—get yours now if you want it.

The Prime is an amazing unit. The design would have to grow on me, but it sounded great. You know you're in trouble when you just sit and listen to the music, forgetting what else you're doing.

I was impressed with the Legacy Aeris and Focus SE, in the Legacy and Audio Classics rooms respectively. If they weren't so heavy. . .Audio Classics was using a MCD500, and it crossed my mind. . .The power came from their own amp; Audio Classics makes their own tube amp, a large chassis, reminiscent of a Marantz. And they used a C2300, so some familiarity there.

The Stereo Exchange room was another good-sounder (Totem/Transparent/Devialet). I'm thinking more about going over to all Transparent cables (interconnects), despite not being displeased with my AQ King Cobra (I even have one pair still in the box). The Totems were from the Element series (Fire) and went pretty low for what were stand-mounted speakers. The speaker cable was simple Transparent MusicWave, bi-wire configuration. According to the SE guy, I'd have to go to MusicWave Plus to better my Kimber 12TC.

I also liked the Nola Metro Grand Reference. I didn't stay in the room long, just long enough to know I liked their sound character. Not bright, musical, easy to listen to.

So coming out of the show, I felt as if I might go for the Transparent cables and maybe a new VPI down the road. If the logistics worked, maybe I'd get some Legacys. I'm past curious; I'm intrigued. Maybe it'll pass later. But I must be realistic on what I can really afford to do, and whether I should do _anything_. Perhaps today I'll get a chance to play music and see if that counters my current mindset. The Legacys stuck with me a bit, too. I can't afford the Aeris, and the Focus would be a big stretch, plus the practical considerations of something so heavy (about 145 lbs. per speaker).

I did pick up a copy of Yes' _Fragile_ from Acoustic Sounds, only to get home and find I already have one. An unnecessary expenditure of $30. This is what happens when you buy impulsively.


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## prepress

Last Sunday I made a return trip to the NY Audio Show and spent much time in the three rooms of primary interest to me: VPI, Legacy, and Audio Classics. I have new appreciation for the Focus SE and the VPI turntables. I went to other rooms and was impressed by several. Martin-Logan had two rooms: an HT room and a 2-channel high-end setup with Krell amplification. The HT room was cool, except I think the room was too small for two subs; bass was too boomy. The high-end 2 channel room also had 2 subs but was a bit larger, and there was less "boom." Actually the sound was good, until someone requested a Nine-Inch Nails CD. I'm not a NIN fan, and the system revealed how poorly the CD was recorded. It sounded harsh and hashy compared to the other material being played; it didn't sound clean. The Naim/Focal room sounded just _gorgeous_, but I couldn't begin to afford what was in there. Naim's new Statement amps and Focal Grande Utopias combine for over $300K!

Having come away from all the goodies, I am giving thought to a new turntable and new speakers, though not this year. Again, the Focus SE is back on the radar, but the $10,500 is a bit steep. The Bryston Model T (not at the show) has all the promise of being a good fit in my room, plus they weigh less. And there are now dealers for both speakers in NYC, so that helps. 

Curiosity is dangerous, as I'm developing a tendency to want to try almost every piece of new gear I come across that is or might be within financial reach which appeals to me. For example, my Pioneer Elite 09 BDP is chugging along just fine, and I like the Wolfson DACs. The coming BDP 88 uses ESS Sabre DACs, which the Oppos use also. Some reviews hint at the Oppo's detailed but slightly lean sound; not sure if I'd like that. I have an Oppo BDP-83 that I've never hooked into the stereo so I don't know what it sounds like, but I could see getting the new Pioneer 88 and relegating the Oppo 83 to bedroom duty if I ever get that mini-system set up in there. I even bought a 24" LCD to go in it (720p, though). I wonder how all this curiosity will play out.


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## audiofan1

Thanks for the report


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Thanks for the report


You're welcome. By the way, I _did_ exchange the Yes LP on Sunday for something else, a jazz set called _All Night Long_, with Donald Byrd, Hank Mobley, Kenny Burrell and others. Haven't played it yet.


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> You're welcome. By the way, I _did_ exchange the Yes LP on Sunday for something else, a jazz set called _All Night Long_, with Donald Byrd, Hank Mobley, Kenny Burrell and others. Haven't played it yet.



Hmm! let me know what you think of it, about three years ago a co-worker got me interested in Donald Byrd and I ended up buying "Street Lady" which I love to this day. I'm betting your in for some good music.


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Hmm! let me know what you think of it, about three years ago a co-worker got me interested in Donald Byrd and I ended up buying "Street Lady" which I love to this day. I'm betting your in for some good music.


I finally played the album Wednesday, and will say I did indeed enjoy it. Donald Byrd was an excellent trumpet player, in fact everybody on the LP was good: Jerome Richardson (flute, sax), Kenny Burrell (guitar), Hank Mobley (tenor sax), Mal Waldron (piano), Doug Watkins (bass), and Art Taylor (drums). Solos were fluid, the grooves were tight, the music was easy to listen to. _All Night Long_, the title track, takes up all of side one yet is not boring. The only thing is that since I haven't been playing vinyl much lately, the tubes in my preamp's phono section aren't broken in yet. I'm sure things will sound even better once they do, or I could just re-insert my phono preamp. And on good-quality 180g vinyl, with no pops or clicks, I say great ether way!


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## audiofan1

glad to hear it ! you know the funny thing with me and vinyl is every time I get ready to get back into it, I end up upgrading something else ! its a perpetual cycle but one day


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## prepress

Here's a thought. Given my recent experience at the NY Audio Show, I have begun to consider the Legacy Focus SE speakers (again) as potential replacements for my Mirages, should I decide on doing that next year. The Legacys join the Bryston Model T on the list, for a grand total of two. Even though the Golden Ear Triton Ones are less money and I've read good things about them (_Sound & Vision_ and _TAS_ gave very positive reviews), I'm still leery of speakers that need to be plugged in.

Most recorded music does't go as low in the bass as any of these speakers, so maybe that aspect of the question is a wash, but I'd think the lower a speaker goes, the more dynamic potential. I'm not reproducing thunderstorms here, but maybe some low organ now and then, or _Fanfare for the Common Man_ on repeat is possible.


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## audiofan1

Looks like you got your work cut out for you! better get started with some demos (if possible), I'd add at least 5 to the list in that price range. I don't envy you at all as the main speakers are the most critical link in a setup but great start with the Focus and Bryston


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Looks like you got your work cut out for you! better get started with some demos (if possible), I'd add at least 5 to the list in that price range. I don't envy you at all as the main speakers are the most critical link in a setup but great start with the Focus and Bryston


The new Def Techs Mythos ST-Ls are in the mix, peripherally. They too have gotten good press. I have an opportunity to go hear a demo with them as part of a major HT setup next week if I want to go. They'd be paired with Sharp's newest 4K panel and Krell amplification. The Def Techs are the same price as the Golden Ear, same need to plug them in. The form factor is quite apartment-friendly.

I do wonder about ground loops with plug-in speakers; I understand that can be a problem sometimes. I have struggled with ground loop issues here, mainly because of the cable feed.


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## audiofan1

The Revel F208's have gotten to pretty good reviews as well if the plugs become to much of a bother they kept me from the likes of Martin logans when I considered them.


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## MJV29

I have the Legacy Focus SE and the Marquis center and all I can say is wow! They are phenomenal! What I can hear in movies is unbelievable! I had the Definitive Technology BP7002's (which were great) and the Legacy's are in another league! Just my two cents. I haven't heard the newer Definitive Technology speakers or the Bryston's.


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## prepress

MJV29 said:


> I have the Legacy Focus SE and the Marquis center and all I can say is wow! They are phenomenal! What I can hear in movies is unbelievable! I had the Definitive Technology BP7002's (which were great) and the Legacy's are in another league! Just my two cents. I haven't heard the newer Definitive Technology speakers or the Bryston's.


I'm in Texas for Christmas (hope everyone had a nice one) and, having been off the forums, I got some much-needed peace from considering the speaker possibilities and a dose of reality.

I cannot, realistically, afford the Legacys. It would mean a couple years of debt probably, and that's scary. The Brystons could be a year and a half. I'd need to figure that out, but debt is never good. Plus, I'll be helping a friend out financially, so I may shelve the speaker thing for now.


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## prepress

prepress said:


> I'm in Texas for Christmas (hope everyone had a nice one) and, having been off the forums, I got some much-needed peace from considering the speaker possibilities and a dose of reality.
> 
> I cannot, realistically, afford the Legacys. It would mean a couple years of debt probably, and that's scary. The Brystons could be a year and a half. I'd need to figure that out, but debt is never good. Plus, I'll be helping a friend out financially, so I may shelve the speaker thing for now.


It's official: I AM helping out a friend financially, as she's in difficult circumstances and is living above her means, due to higher rent and several medical bills. We are of long acquaintance, 23 years and change.

And the ardor over speakers has quieted down quite a bit. What I have is really good. I'm sure either speaker would be equally or even more satisfying, but I hit a sweet spot with the Mirages and am reluctant to let them go without sufficient cause. Plus, I'm not so sure that the Focus SE wouldn't be overkill for my relatively small room. I _have_ been told that the Brystons are not an issue in smaller rooms, this from someone who owns them and in a room slightly smaller than mine.

So the idea of new speakers is on vacation. I may still upgrade a power cord or two, but that's it as far as I'm concerned. For now.


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> It's official: I AM helping out a friend financially, as she's in difficult circumstances and is living above her means, due to higher rent and several medical bills. We are of long acquaintance, 23 years and change.
> 
> And the ardor over speakers has quieted down quite a bit. What I have is really good. I'm sure either speaker would be equally or even more satisfying, but I hit a sweet spot with the Mirages and am reluctant to let them go without sufficient cause. Plus, I'm not so sure that the Focus SE wouldn't be overkill for my relatively small room. I _have_ been told that the Brystons are not an issue in smaller rooms, this from someone who owns them and in a room slightly smaller than mine.
> 
> So the idea of new speakers is on vacation. I may still upgrade a power cord or two, but that's it as far as I'm concerned. For now.


Sounds like a plan  always good to hear about people taking care of friends as I for one know they are indeed hard to find


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Sounds like a plan  always good to hear about people taking care of friends as I for one know they are indeed hard to find


We don't think alike and so see some things differently, which on occasion leads to disagreements and some frustration, but we must have SOMETHING going on or we wouldn't have lasted this long. So I'm pleased to help. And I agree: friends are hard to find and can be hard to keep as well.

As I said elsewhere, emptying my checking account or raiding my emergency fund significantly doesn't constitute being able to afford something. The Focus SEs would run almost $12K with tax and delivery, assuming the standard $150/hr. rate for AV installations; the Brystons about $8.5K. The alternative is debt, and I'm not crazy about that either.


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> We don't think alike and so see some things differently, which on occasion leads to disagreements and some frustration, but we must have SOMETHING going on or we wouldn't have lasted this long. So I'm pleased to help. And I agree: friends are hard to find and can be hard to keep as well.
> 
> As I said elsewhere, emptying my checking account or raiding my emergency fund significantly doesn't constitute being able to afford something. The Focus SEs would run almost $12K with tax and delivery, assuming the standard $150/hr. rate for AV installations; the Brystons about $8.5K. The alternative is debt, and I'm not crazy about that either.


Yeah tell me about it no sense in plundering oneself as contentment may sound better than any upgrade. I've found myself recently with the upgrade bug but took a different approach and evaluated each change so as to not entertain me buying something simply because I feel I need it due to idiosyncrasies, this in turn caused me to make well informed choices the biggest may be replacing my Oppo 105 with a Sony 6200 bluray player (which does have sacd and a few other niceties) I'm swapping pre/pro's as well and if the gamble pays off it promises good sound and a few dollars saved


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Yeah tell me about it no sense in plundering oneself as contentment may sound better than any upgrade. I've found myself recently with the upgrade bug but took a different approach and evaluated each change so as to not entertain me buying something simply because I feel I need it due to idiosyncrasies, this in turn caused me to make well informed choices the biggest may be replacing my Oppo 105 with a Sony 6200 bluray player (which does have sacd and a few other niceties) I'm swapping pre/pro's as well and if the gamble pays off it promises good sound and a few dollars saved


Saving money! Always good. I had an unexpected occurrence today and I'm trying to justify it by saying it's not a regular thing and I saved money. My favorite flavor of Edy's frozen yogurt, Chocolate Fudge Brownie, showed up in the supermarket today; it hadn't been around in over a year. But there it was! And on a twofer! Not having had or seen it for so long, I pounced and got two cartons (after a brief bit of angst)! I haven't had any yet, but I'm planning to get into it tomorrow.

But, why are the moves above a gamble, unless you're not familiar (or haven't any hands-on experience) with the Sony or pre/pro you're getting back?


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Saving money! Always good. I had an unexpected occurrence today and I'm trying to justify it by saying it's not a regular thing and I saved money. My favorite flavor of Edy's frozen yogurt, Chocolate Fudge Brownie, showed up in the supermarket today; it hadn't been around in over a year. But there it was! And on a twofer! Not having had or seen it for so long, I pounced and got two cartons (after a brief bit of angst)! I haven't had any yet, but I'm planning to get into it tomorrow.
> 
> But, why are the moves above a gamble, unless you're not familiar (or haven't any hands-on experience) with the Sony or pre/pro you're getting back?



Good find indeed! I'm hoping the new Marantz 8802 will fill in the gap between two units as the 8801 came very close to doing so, selling the 105 is the gamble as it helps to fund the new purchase. The new 8802 just may get the job done but I do plan on a new Oppo when the next gen is released but hoping the Sony fills the gap till then but that's if it makes for a good transport. Oh my what have I done!


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Good find indeed! I'm hoping the new Marantz 8802 will fill in the gap between two units as the 8801 came very close to doing so, selling the 105 is the gamble as it helps to fund the new purchase. The new 8802 just may get the job done but I do plan on a new Oppo when the next gen is released but hoping the Sony fills the gap till then but that's if it makes for a good transport. Oh my what have I done!


Taken a calculated risk. Let's hope it pans out to your liking.


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Taken a calculated risk. Let's hope it pans out to your liking.


I had to send the SonyS6200 back as it had to much vibration for me but did have great video performance! I did get lucky and find a new in the box Marantz UD5007 to use as a transport (which basically its all it is due to only having an pair of rca's and hdmi out) very good construction and video is very,very impressive I'm very pleased with this unexpected addition as I'm not feeling half the loss of the 105's video performance, so thus far half the gamble has paid off! As I'm typing this the 8802 is due to arrive today and will find out if indeed the risk is to my liking.


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> I had to send the SonyS6200 back as it had to much vibration for me but did have great video performance! I did get lucky and find a new in the box Marantz UD5007 to use as a transport (which basically its all it is due to only having an pair of rca's and hdmi out) very good construction and video is very,very impressive I'm very pleased with this unexpected addition as I'm not feeling half the loss of the 105's video performance, so thus far half the gamble has paid off! As I'm typing this the 8802 is due to arrive today and will find out if indeed the risk is to my liking.


Okay, a month later, how are things sounding and looking?


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Okay, a month later, how are things sounding and looking?


Hey prepress

The gamble has paid off more than expected and has kicked things up several notches across the board Marantz has pretty much eliminated jitter in the 8802 (wish I knew what they did) I'm using a Pangea hdmi cable which worked well with the 8801 due to a nice sound over lesser hdmi cables and this sound for 2/ch vs my Oppo 105 via XLR to the 8801 has a deeper extended bass along with a more powerful presentation this was a shocker and as the 8802 settled it only got better. This compelled me to do some cable and conditioner testing , once I feel my setup has gone to a new level of fidelity I do my best to extract its full potential, here's what i'm testing out this week.

Shunyata Defender plugged into a Cable Pro Noise trapper Revelation II powerstip (no surge or conditioning built in with an upgraded IEC inlet) the strip on its own showed my power from my 20 A dedicated lines where better than I thought and inserting the Defender did set the sound back a bit (blunting the highs) the stip on its own is just incredible but its been 2 days and will need more time before making a final decision.
I did purchase a WireWorld Matrix 2 outlet extender but sent it back this along with a WW Elecktra 7 cable for the 8802 (nice but sent it back as well)

This test is against a PS Audio Dectet and Quintet (subs) with my amps direct to a PS Audio Soloist Premier inwall conditrioner /surge protector with all PS Audio PW cables AC3 to AC12 and two Pangea AC9 &AC9se, I'll update next week as to what is staying or going back.

Oh and I do have my on the WW Starlight 7 hdmi cable but will wait till the dust settles


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## prepress

Dust . . . that's my problem too. I've just about surrendered.


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## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Dust . . . that's my problem too. I've just about surrendered.



I keep an air purifier in the room and try to dust the gear twice a week once at a minimum. There's no getting around the fact electronics love dust!


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## prepress

Not sure what this was.

Thursday, I was listening to a CD, part of the Time-Life series _AM Gold_. On some of the songs I heard what sounded like distortion in the bass, and from the right channel only, it seemed. I didn't get up to check that, as I was too busy trying to decide if this was some previously unheard detail or true distortion; I'm still not sure. I wondered if perhaps the right woofer or its cone was having a problem. Listening sessions are so rare for me these days, maybe the supposed "distortion" (a kind of grainy yet detailed fuzziness) is in the recording and not something to be concerned with. Either way, I don't remember hearing it before.

More listening is needed. The other frequencies seemed unaffected, so it may be nothing. If this is a speaker problem, my search would be on, as I decided a while back I would not attempt to have my Mirages repaired should they fail. They're 22 years old and counting; I've gotten my money's worth in spades. My short list is already set: Bryston Model T, Legacy Signature SE, and (despite my reluctance on powered speakers) the Golden Ear Triton One, with perhaps the latest Def Tech Mythos in there also (the most stylish of the bunch insofar as blending into the room goes).


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## shivaji

An easy way to tell if the distortion is on the disc is to listen to it with headphones, if you have them. If you hear distortion on the phones, you will know it is the disc.


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## prepress

shivaji said:


> An easy way to tell if the distortion is on the disc is to listen to it with headphones, if you have them. If you hear distortion on the phones, you will know it is the disc.


Turns out it's the disc. I haven't heard that problem since. It's the way the bass on the _AM Gold_ CD is recorded.


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## prepress

Until now I didn't think interconnects made much of a difference unless they were at the pre/power connection. An experiment changed my mind.

I've been a bit disappointed with the sound of my McIntosh C2300 preamp on the video side with the audio for DVDs and BDs, even to the point I'm considering getting the solid-state C48 instead. In trying to get more out of my C2300, looking for greater weight to the sound such as I had with my previous preamp (a solid-state ARC LS3), I replaced the AudioQuest King Cobra IC on my BD player with Kimber Hero, which had been replaced by the KC before. The tubes in the 2300 are Mullards (new production), which I hadn't tried the Kimber with previously. the BD player is a Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD.

When I fired up the 09 with the Hero ICs, it made noticeable improvement in the weight of the sound, it filled in things a bit more and sounds more like what I was getting from my ARC LS3. On two of the three DVDs I tried, it wasn't a subtle change; those two are _Yes Live at Montreaux 2003_ and _Eric Clapton and Steve Winwood Live at Madison Square Garden_. The main tracks were _Heart of the Sunrise_ and _Awaken_ (Yes), with _Them Changes_ (Clapton/Winwood).

I may go back to Hero ICs for all my sources now. Oddly, I thought the sound with Hero was less full in the bass when used as a pre/power connection. The KC was _slightly_ better, but it was replaced by Transparent MusicLink Plus two years ago. As for the Hero on my BD player, I'll spend more time with it to see if things change or not.


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## prepress

I think I have a problem.

As another tweak, trying to get more impact out of the sound of my tubed C2300 preamp with DVDs, I took my one pair of Transparent MusicLink Plus interconnect off the pre/power connection and put them on the Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD; I put a pair of AQ King Cobras on the pre/power connection. What I heard with my usual reference DVDs was as close to the LS3's (my previous preamp) sound I've yet gotten as far as low-end response (and yes, more dynamic impact). Transparent advertises this IC (now simply "Plus") as having more impact in the low frequencies than regular MusicLink "due to heavier solid OFHC conductors and more substantial gold plated connectors and more effective network design." After trying it out, I believe it! In fact, the difference was quite noticeable vs. the Kimber Hero. Granted, this is a 2m cable rather than the 1m of the Hero, but _STILL!_ I turned the bass trim back down to zero from +3 as a result.

There were still things I remember hearing with my Audio Research LS3 (which is solid-state) I don't hear now, even with the Transparent, which I'll attribute to either the 2300's presentation or the tubes in it, currently Mullards; I think it's the former.

My next move is to put the MLP back on the pre/power connection, reinstall the Kimber Hero on the 09 and either try another tube (back to the JJs, or get to the Gold Lions I haven't used) or get a 1m Transparent Plus to use in place of the Kimber Hero. But the Transparent Plus is $400 for 1m, rather steep for a test. A 2m pair is $530. If I go Transparent Plus, I'd better be _sure_ that's what I want. The regular MusicLink, a step down from Plus, is $200 for 1m. I was considering replacing the C2300 with a solid-state unit, now I have something else to think about.


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## prepress

Update on the above. ^ ^ ^

As it turns out, I needed to make some changes in the way I played the Moody Blues disc, though there was no problem before.

Having the Pioneer 09 output set to "2 Channel" already, I went into the speaker setup and found that the L/R, center and surrounds were all set to "Large." I turned off everything but the L/R setting and tried the disc again. No changes I could hear. Then it hit me that the Pioneer's "DTS Downmix" feature is set to "2 Channel"; I'd been selecting Dolby Digital 2.0 in the disc's menu. So I set the disc to play at DTS 5.0, which meant the player would downmix to two channels. _Immediately_, the sound was both louder and fuller, with even more bottom. The musical details I wasn't hearing before were more audible, though perhaps still not _quite_ up to the LS3. But I think I could live with that. _And_ the hall ambience is back; it sounds like the Moodies are playing in a concert hall again (which the Royal Albert Hall is).

So I intend to put things back the way they were, with the Transparent ICs doing preamp-to-power amp duty and re-installing the Kimber Hero on the Pioneer. I may put those JJ tubes back into the 2300 just to see what happens. Either way, I'm going to pull the second pair of Mullards out of the MM section to keep as backups and re-insert the stock tubes there. This means the return of the Aragon (nice movie title) phono stage to the system. That would mean I'd need five pairs of Transparent ICs if I go that route. The question is would it be Plus or MusicLink, assuming the Kimber Hero and +3 on the bass trim of my 2300 doesn't cut it anymore.


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## prepress

This is strange. I have a DVDO iScan Duo VP, which I've been using for a few years. Four sources plug into it (cable box, LD, two BD players). The system is plugged into two Furman units: the Elite-15PFi and the SPR-20i; the Elite is plugged into the SPR, so everything is either plugged into the Elite or into the SPR directly. Last night I'd removed the C2300 preamp from my setup to change out tubes. Having done that, I put the 2300 back. But when I plugged it in, I lost my cable feed immediately. I had a blank blue screen with no sound. No pops or noises, it just . . . happened.

I'd been watching the news and was listening to what was going on. Normally nothing is on when I plug/unplug anything, but I was engaged with the news. Whether turning things off would have mattered, I don't know for sure. Now, the Duo doesn't recognize the cable box and back-up BD inputs (or others). I get the dreaded red LED, which means no signal. Oddly, the inputs with the main BD and LD players don't have a problem. I rebooted the VP, the back-up BDP and the cable box. No joy.

I may try a few more things, but I'm thinking about replacing the Duo if I can't resolve things soon rather than try getting it fixed because replacing it is quicker. Though discontinued, it's still available. BUT, there's the Lumagen Radiance 2124/2144. _Much_ more money, but it would offer 4K upscaling in case my Kuro dies and I go for a 4K TV. It's supposed to be better than the Duo, but not over 2X plus as good I don't think. And a bigger learning curve

What I wonder is what happened exactly. It seems to have been some sort of surge or feedback which tweaked the Duo VP when the 2300 was plugged in. I might have not plugged the 2300 into the same outlet it was in before; maybe the caps I put on the unused connections of the 2300 made a difference; I don't know. But the "PF" in the Elite-15PFi name stands for "Power Factor," and there are four outlets which carry a 45A current reserve for amplifiers. Two are occupied by my 501s. I probably plugged the preamp into one of those rather than back into one of the A/V outlets, which is where I think it was at first. So lacking any other explanation, I believe this is the most reasonable scenario.

I remember a couple years back I had the SPR plugged into one of the Elite's PF outlets, and whenever the air conditioner's compressor kicked in, the system was shut down due to a line surge. Plugging the Elite into the SPR instead solved the problem.


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## prepress

Decision made, after a bit of angst. I've ordered another Duo VP.

I'd considered the Lumagen Radiance 2144 because of the 4K upscaling, which would future-proof me if my Kuro went down and I bought a 4K TV (a 55" flat OLED would be the ideal, and they're on the way from LG), plus it has more options for tweaking a TV's picture; it _is_ better than the Duo overall. But again, I didn't think the improvements were enough (based upon my research) to justify the much greater expense. And this time of year is a bad time for such a large discretionary expenditure, what with the holidays coming and other things I want/need to do.

The Duo is more than sufficient for my current needs and system. I got it at a _tremendous_ discount also, so that made it easier. It's _much_ simpler to operate than the Lumagen and I'm already familiar with it, so I took the chance and sprung. Of course, if the Kuro _does_ die and I get a 4K set the Duo's useless (unless everything's set to pass through with no processing), but that's a chance I'm taking.


----------



## prepress

The Duo arrived a while back, is in place, and functioning. It's a different version than the previous one, as this new one has ISF capability. It tends to be a bit more emphatic about HDCP messages, too. That's annoying. They go away, at least.

I've also taken a plunge and put in some new interconnects, replacing the Kimber Hero on my 09 BD player and SACD player with Transparent Audio Plus ICs. A difference has been made. The sound is smother than with the Kimbers, that's the main difference. The Plus ICs are, I believe, a heavier gauge than the Kimbers which might account for the occasional details on some familiar CDs I didn't notice before. They're supposed to be good at noise rejection, too. Anyway, I like them. I don't know if I'll get more for the less-important sources (LD, TT, tuner), but if so it may not be anytime soon.


----------



## prepress

Yesterday I put in two new power cords, a Wireworld Electra 7 on my preamp and a Stratus 7 on my 09 BD player. They replaced a WW Aurora 5.2 and Stratus 5.2 respectively.

There was an improvement in sound. Using extremely familiar material, cymbals sounded more natural and crisp, and there was an overall tighter presentation. I was also more ware of dynamics, as the weight of the sound was more obvious. The WW Aurora is silver-coated OFC; the Electra is OCC; maybe that accounts for it. I prefer all-copper, I think.

I was mildly amazed at the improvement, but not surprised necessarily; when I replaced Aurora 5.2s with Electra 5.2s on my amps a while back there was an improvement. Not night and day (to me), but enough to notice.


----------



## prepress

On Saturday I moved the whole system forward about 7 inches, to give me better access to the rear. The photo is dark, but you can still see the increased space behind the system. Now to continue setting everything up. And maybe learning how to lightening things up with the camera.


----------



## prepress

Last night I heard this amazing twelve year-old playing Monk with the Jazz at Lincoln Center Orchestra. He KILLED it.

https://search.yahoo.com/search?ei=utf-8&fr=aaplw&p=joey+alexander+jazz+pianist


----------



## prepress

I've been having a problem with IEC connectors not fitting snugly. I've attached photos of the problem and the current solution. The first photo shows two Wireworld Stratus cords (the blue ones) drooping at the IEC connection. The other two show my current solution of velcro strips, normally used for interconnects. Where the power cord has enough slack, I can manipulate it into a good position then use the strip to bind the cord to either the shelf pillars (photo 2) or the rack's cable management system (photo 3).

Does anyone have these issues with IEC connectors? I remember reading in _The Absolute Sound_ a while back when one person wrote in about this very issue.


----------



## prepress

Though the new _Star Wars_ movie is imminent, I have more interest in these right now, though not due until next year:

http://batmanvsuperman.dccomics.com


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Though the new _Star Wars_ movie is imminent, I have more interest in these right now, though not due until next year:
> 
> http://batmanvsuperman.dccomics.com
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVdV-lxRPFo


Yeah! I hear ya on that. I'm still debating going out to the theater vs waiting for it on Bluray. Superman vs. Batman and the new Cap look like fun

On another note , did you find a solution for the cables fitting snugly?


----------



## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Yeah! I hear ya on that. I'm still debating going out to the theater vs waiting for it on Bluray. Superman vs. Batman and the new Cap look like fun
> 
> On another note , did you find a solution for the cables fitting snugly?


There are excellent adapters made by VooDoo Cable. They grip like a vise, as I understand it from a reliable source. The fanciest go for about $150; the basic one for $69 or so. But before I go there, I'm sticking with my current approach for now. It's working.


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> There are excellent adapters made by VooDoo Cable. They grip like a vise, as I understand it from a reliable source. The fanciest go for about $150; the basic one for $69 or so. But before I go there, I'm sticking with my current approach for now. It's working.


 I can think of better things to do with a $150 bucks as well Glad a solution presented itself so that way you can get back to enjoying some tunes!


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## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> I can think of better things to do with a $150 bucks as well Glad a solution presented itself so that way you can get back to enjoying some tunes!


And I have some to play. Plus, there's a new record store—yes, _record store_—in my neighborhood, only a couple of blocks away. That's dangerous. Maybe when I get back from vacation I'll check it out.


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> And I have some to play. Plus, there's a new record store—yes, _record store_—in my neighborhood, only a couple of blocks away. That's dangerous. Maybe when I get back from vacation I'll check it out.


 Couple of blocks! that would be a problem for me but I sure miss the days when they were around like that. I order everything on-line these days but miss the trips to the music store.


----------



## prepress

I saw _The Force Awakens_ Tuesday, while in Nashville ($5 plus tax!). I thought, why not?

To take it in best, I should see it a second time probably. I thought it was good.


----------



## prepress

Okay, the two attached adapters are on the way.

Though my current solution works, it bothers me to see and know how loosely they fit (I know, I shouldn't go behind the system). The Pangea adapters in use aren't gripping firmly, hence these two VooDoo adapters. Less than $100 for both, so we'll see how they do. The C7 is for the LD player, the 15A to 20A is for my Furman SPR.


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## prepress

Okay, the adapters arrived and are installed. The C7 doesn't appear to be that much better than the Pangea it replaces. To truly test this though, I may need to remove the velcro tie holding the power cord up.

The 15A–20A adapter is another story. _Much_ better grip than the Pangea. there's almost no movement when I try tweaking it. Very nice.


----------



## prepress

I decided that, since my LD player's IEC is grounded, I'd order a polarized C7 from VooDoo to try there. The connectors are the same as the non-polarized version, I'm sure, but the polarized casing has a different shape, as many know. Perhaps that'll make a difference.

I could put the PS Audio Jewel C7 back on the LD, also. But I want to give the adapter route another chance.


----------



## prepress

Well, the polarized C7 came, and it doesn't do much better than the non-polarized one. Oh well.

Meantime, I've installed the famous Gold Lion tubes in the line section of my C2300. I put in 2:37 on them yesterday, and the system is running as I type.

I don't think I'll be doing much more with this preamp. Either the GLs, once broken in, will nail it, or I may well move on to something else and sell/trade the 2300; its successor would be McIntosh's new C52 at this point. The C47 would be a lower-cost option, though I'd be giving up some features. Still, first up is to see how these Gokd Lions perform.


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## prepress

Bummer. The C2300 failed last night. I had turned it on via the power button, only to have it cut off after a split second. The LED stand-by went off as well. Tried rebooting the unit by unplugging then re-plugging it. No success.

I have an e-mail off to McIntosh; we'll see what happens. This is much like what happened about three years ago, with the power cutting out, except the unit was in operation then, not being turned on as last night.


----------



## prepress

Wednesday I took the 2300 to a repair center, on East 31st in Manhattan. It seems most of the high-end stores I'm aware of send their repairs there (Park Ave. Audio, Stereo Exchange, and Lyric Hifi all do). Yesterday, the service center called, and it's not good. The microprocessor board is pretty much shot, the result of electromagnetics most likely. This time of year is bad as the air can be dry and static electricity can be a problem; it's a big one here, and the 2300 _has_ been zapped in the past.

They've replaced the board and are running tests and will let me know what's what. Cost for the board is $840 without anything else; all added up, I could be looking at close to $1300.

Moral: use the remote. I usually do, even if in front of the 2300. Now, I'll be SURE to, especially during the colder months when static is a problem.


----------



## Bigham16

I like the new cables! Yes, very dangerous to a have a record store only a few blocks away. I would be getting into a lot of trouble.



prepress said:


> And I have some to play. Plus, there's a new record store—yes, _record store_—in my neighborhood, only a couple of blocks away. That's dangerous. Maybe when I get back from vacation I'll check it out.


----------



## prepress

The C2300 returned to its spot on 4/5. Cost was $1300, including $10 for gas for my friend who drove me to pick up the preamp.

I got it set up, connected and plugged it in. Nothing. Going around the back, i saw the power cord IEC had drooped enough to lose connection. I reseated it, and still nothing. then, I reseated both the cord _and_ the velcro strip, and voila! Success. But I was bummed out by the episode.

Still kicking around options on this. I realize that as a bit of a perfectionist/completist, I don't like the _idea_ or _look_ of the drooping power cords whether they lose connection or not. I'm recovering from the 2300's repair cost, but am thinking about what to do going forward. Velcro strips are on the most egregious culprits, and it's working. Not the most elegant solution, though.


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## prepress

Haven't been here in a while. The power cord droop saga continues, but I've found that photographic tape, which leaves no residue, helps. I'd hate to replace all the cords with new ones. I may experiment, though. I'm considering Transparent and Kimber cords mostly, since that's what I use for interconnects. There's also Pangea, the latest of which are said to have a "death grip" on the IEC. The Wireworld cords i have now aren't flexible horizontally; that would help with their positioning to ease any droop due to the weight of the power cord. I took the preamp cord and routed it around the right rear pillar of its shelf, and that's improved things a bit. With the LD player, there's still droop, but the IEC connection seems stable.

Another discovery is that, surprise, there are differences in how interconnects affect sound sometimes. I've discovered this since going to a McIntosh C2300 tube preamp, currently with JJ ECC803G tubes. With Kimber Hero ICs, the upper end had a nice bite to the brass, for example, on the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra's _Copland: Appalachian Spring_ CD (Telarc). But when I put Transparent Plus ICs on, that bite was not as pronounced; still satisfying, though. However, on some brightly recorded 60's pop CDs, the Kimber was a bit too bright; the Transparent had a better handle on this, though the sound was still bright (that's the way the CDs are, unfortunately). With my previous preamp I didn't notice this kind of thing too much, as the few differences I heard were quite unremarkable. But then, I didn't have Transparent Plus IC when I was using my previous preamp; I had Audioquest King Cobra along with the Kimber Hero.


----------



## audiofan1

Back to having fun I see! Since switching over to Morrow Audio cables (speaker & interconnects) around 5 years ago (replacing mostly AQ) I've only found they strike the right musical balance in my setup. I have two Pangea's ones an AC9 and the other an AC9 SE , they don't hold as well as the PS Audio powercables I have everywhere else on the components themselves but both about the same at the wall.


----------



## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Back to having fun I see! Since switching over to Morrow Audio cables (speaker & interconnects) around 5 years ago (replacing mostly AQ) I've only found they strike the right musical balance in my setup. I have two Pangea's ones an AC9 and the other an AC9 SE , they don't hold as well as the PS Audio powercables I have everywhere else on the components themselves but both about the same at the wall.


Since I just dropped a bunch of money for jazz concerts, I'm going to lay off the audio stuff some. I did buy another set of tubes to try in my preamp, Telefunken Black Diamonds. Put them in Saturday and began listening Sunday. I haven't had them in long enough to make any definitive conclusions, but in the four hours they've played so far with my usual reference DVDs/BDs, they're not as warm as the JJ tubes. They're more open with good bottom end, thought maybe not _quite_ as much as the JJ tubes. I wonder what will happen when I break out the brighter-sounding '60s CDs. I'm cautiously optimistic for now.

As for power cords, I may just try living with what I have for now. Nothing's losing connection, and the tape has improved things. The PS Audio cables have a good grip, but that would mean an overhaul. The Wireworlds are different colors, making it easier to distinguish what's what in the mess behind the system. I attached a photo (need to dust back there, obviously; it's been a while).


----------



## prepress

And today, this arrived. The Magnum Dynalab MD102 FM tuner. It's a factory refurb with a faceplate converted from silver to black. It replaces a MD90, also by Magnum Dynalab. So far so good. NPR sounds nice. The 102 is supposed to be better at pulling in stations, and living in New York with the multipath mayhem potential, that could be a plus.


----------



## prepress

Well, I did it. Yes, they're working on a 4K player, but I still did it. The last one in the store, and at a great price.


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> Well, I did it. Yes, they're working on a 4K player, but I still did it. The last one in the store, and at a great price.


Very nice Do let us know how it sounds


----------



## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> Very nice Do let us know how it sounds


In a very brief comparison and listening normally (not casually or critically) the 88 held its own against my McIntosh MCD301 SACD player. I was using Copland's "Fanfare for the Common Man" by the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra as the test track. The two players sounded pretty much identical; the 88's audio output was set to 192 kHz to match the 301. Critical listening may reveal something new, but this is a nice result.

Now for the bad news. The 88 doesn't appear to be compatible with my iScan Duo VP. The biggest issues are that if I switch from the 88 to another source then back to the 88 the Duo loses the signal and must be re-booted. Also, with the 88’s aspect ration set to "16:9 Normal” it adds its own black bars to 4:3 material; the Duo sees this as a 16:9 signal apparently, and I’m unable to get gray sidebars. If I use “16:9 Full” and then change the AR to “4:3” on the Duo, the gray sidebars don’t cover the black sidebars fully. Though my Kuro is well broken in, I’m still wary of using black sidebars for any length of time.

I’ve been through the settings on both the 88 and the Duo and had no success so far with these issues. The only way around this is to disconnect the 88 from the Duo and go straight to the TV, which is a kludge and inconvenient, but I get the gray sidebars as I should on 4:3 material. I’m going to check the 88’s firmware and update it if necessary, though I don’t know if that will help.

A smaller (though still annoying) issue is that the 88’s remote activates my 09 and vice-versa, but I’m hoping I can move the 09 or else remove it from the system; I’d intended to use it as a secondary/backup player, retiring my Oppo 83.

I'm reaching out to Value Electronics (the vendor) and Pioneer to see if they have any ideas. I registered the 88 with Pioneer before the problems emerged, unfortunately, so I don't know if returning the unit is an option. I'd rather not if I can help it, anyway.


----------



## prepress

And to start something else, I replaced the Wireworld Electra power cord on my preamp with first a Shunyata Venom 3s and now a 1m Transparent Audio High Performance Power Cord, the second from the bottom of their line. What a difference! The bass is more extended, and with some additional detail. That was a pleasant surprise. I got the HPPC out of curiosity, but didn't expect the improvement I heard. The Shunyata Venom 3s cord also gripped better than the WW, but the low frequencies weren't as strong. The HPPC fixed that.

I'm no longer a semi-skeptic on these things. In some cases even the power cord can change the sound of a system/component.


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> In a very brief comparison and listening normally (not casually or critically) the 88 held its own against my McIntosh MCD301 SACD player. I was using Copland's "Fanfare for the Common Man" by the Atlanta Symphony Orchestra as the test track. The two players sounded pretty much identical; the 88's audio output was set to 192 kHz to match the 301. Critical listening may reveal something new, but this is a nice result.
> 
> Now for the bad news. The 88 doesn't appear to be compatible with my iScan Duo VP. The biggest issues are that if I switch from the 88 to another source then back to the 88 the Duo loses the signal and must be re-booted. Also, with the 88’s aspect ration set to "16:9 Normal” it adds its own black bars to 4:3 material; the Duo sees this as a 16:9 signal apparently, and I’m unable to get gray sidebars. If I use “16:9 Full” and then change the AR to “4:3” on the Duo, the gray sidebars don’t cover the black sidebars fully. Though my Kuro is well broken in, I’m still wary of using black sidebars for any length of time.
> 
> I’ve been through the settings on both the 88 and the Duo and had no success so far with these issues. The only way around this is to disconnect the 88 from the Duo and go straight to the TV, which is a kludge and inconvenient, but I get the gray sidebars as I should on 4:3 material. I’m going to check the 88’s firmware and update it if necessary, though I don’t know if that will help.
> 
> A smaller (though still annoying) issue is that the 88’s remote activates my 09 and vice-versa, but I’m hoping I can move the 09 or else remove it from the system; I’d intended to use it as a secondary/backup player, retiring my Oppo 83.
> 
> I'm reaching out to Value Electronics (the vendor) and Pioneer to see if they have any ideas. I registered the 88 with Pioneer before the problems emerged, unfortunately, so I don't know if returning the unit is an option. I'd rather not if I can help it, anyway.


Good to hear on the music side of things and that would be great if you can find fixes for the video side as well. Was the intent to replace the 09 and Oppo 83 or just a new music player? If nothing avails it self with a fix perhaps Oppo's pending newer models that loom just around the corner may be the ticket or even an 105 which I can attest to as being a great player.

And Happy Thanksgiving to you and yours


----------



## audiofan1

prepress said:


> And to start something else, I replaced the Wireworld Electra power cord on my preamp with first a Shunyata Venom 3s and now a 1m Transparent Audio High Performance Power Cord, the second from the bottom of their line. What a difference! The bass is more extended, and with some additional detail. That was a pleasant surprise. I got the HPPC out of curiosity, but didn't expect the improvement I heard. The Shunyata Venom 3s cord also gripped better than the WW, but the low frequencies weren't as strong. The HPPC fixed that.
> 
> I'm no longer a semi-skeptic on these things. In some cases even the power cord can change the sound of a system/component.


 I may have to give transparent a shot. I did try an WW Electra 7 as well on my Marantz 8802 but favored the PS Audio AC3 and mostly do to the bass as well. I have primarily all PS Audio cables with AC3's on the lower powered stuff with an AC10 on thier Dectect Power conditioner and AC12 on my 2/ch amp and achieved a pretty synergistic blend with that setup. I also added a Pangea AC9se to my surround amp to try over an AC3 but will replace later down the road as its not as good in that application as the one it replaced.

Who's a good vendor for Transparent cables?


----------



## prepress

audiofan1 said:


> I may have to give transparent a shot. I did try an WW Electra 7 as well on my Marantz 8802 but favored the PS Audio AC3 and mostly do to the bass as well. I have primarily all PS Audio cables with AC3's on the lower powered stuff with an AC10 on thier Dectect Power conditioner and AC12 on my 2/ch amp and achieved a pretty synergistic blend with that setup. I also added a Pangea AC9se to my surround amp to try over an AC3 but will replace later down the road as its not as good in that application as the one it replaced.
> 
> Who's a good vendor for Transparent cables?


Transparent has their own online store. My contact with them has been positive. Be warned, their upper end cords are very expensive. The cord I got is from Stereo Exchange here in NYC. Retail is $250 for 1m. For me, I won't go beyond the Plus level, which is the next up.


----------



## audiofan1

When I revisit cables I'll give one a shot. I need to get some diffusion panels for the rear of the room first as I've wanting to try some for awhile. 

Thanks


----------



## prepress

And a quick update. After some adjustments to the settings on both the Duo and the 88 (one Duo adjustment suggested by another AVSer), the Duo no longer loses signal from the 88 when I switch to another input then back to the 88. Progress!


----------



## prepress

Update: the 88 is now connected to the 111FD and is set to output 1080p. This was prompted by the Duo losing the cable box after I switched away from it and back. This will be the setup going forward. And listening to DVD concerts and other familiar video material, I find that the 88 did sound a bit lighter in the low frequencies; the 09 is better in that regard. I read a review of the Oppo 105 that made the same point about that unit; I believe it and the 88 share the same DAC. Re-setting the 88's output to 48kHz actually improved the low frequencies, though.

As for the Transparent cord, I'm thinking more about all HPPCs for the sources, with perhaps Kimber PK10 Ascents for the amps. The low-end improvement was enough to start that idea. It's $320 for a 2m cord, so this won't be an all-in-one-swoop thing.


----------



## prepress

The swoop has begun, however. These are on my amps currently.


----------



## prepress

. . . and the swoop is complete, as I now have Transparent HPPCs on all sources (except for the LD player), preamp and power amps. The reason I'm skipping the LD player is that it's seldom used, requires a C7 IEC (a $70 upcharge) and won't be replaced if it dies. I have a C7 PS Audio Jewel AC that I put on the LD and will be content with that for now. The grip with the IEC adapters I've tried is weak, though they don't lose the connection often (and the visual of the sagging connector was annoying). The PS Audio cord grips like a vise, and it has a nylon braided jacket (though a different pattern); the visual resemblance helps my sense of continuity.

I'm not beyond getting another HPPC for the LD player though, and I know that. But my sense of completeness should be at bay for at least a little while. If I went for a C7 HPPC there'd be nothing else to do with the cord if the LD player did, in fact, die.


----------



## prepress

Went off the deep end a while back and got a pair of Transparent Super interconnects. A 2m pair cost $960 (ouch). I put that on my preamp/power amp connection. I noted that the Super is thicker than the Plus it replaced.

Did it make a difference? Well, yes. Not night and day, but with my _very_ familiar test tracks I heard a few more details in the mix. Would I go all Supers in my setup? No, too much money. But I could see putting them on my primary sources (SACD and BD) at some point.

I also bought a 12ft Shunyata Venom HC extension cord and a regular Venom Extension HC (both 10AWG!) for my Furman SPR-20i. Much better connection, firmer grip. Now, I want to replace the Wireworld cord on my Furman Elite-15 PFi and the PCs will be complete. Not sure with what, but it need be only 1m.


----------



## prepress

I have taken a plunge. I'll be boxing up my McIntosh MCD301 SACD player and shipping it off shortly. It's a trade in towards THIS . . .


----------



## prepress

And here it is on the shelf. Haven't played it yet, that comes today, I hope.


----------



## prepress

Having had some time with the MCD500, it's better than the MCD301 it replaced. Familiar recordings sound a bit more real, there are details here and there I don't remember hearing before, and the disc tray mechanism is supposed to be better than its predecessor. Good.

Wireworld power cords have all been replaced by Transparent ones. They grip better. The cord on my Furman SPR-20i was replaced with a Shunyata Venom HC. Also a better grip.

Another change is the addition of an isolation platform, a Gingko Cloud 11, for my turntable. A too-dark photo is attached. So far, I've not had a problem with footfalls using the Gingko; I've tried not to (even unconsciously) be careful when walking around the room, as the purpose of the platform is to be able to do that without disturbing the tonearm. I think I've staved off buying another turntable for a while. But on the periphery of my mind is replacing my Sanus Euro racks with Salamander Synergy ones, which I believe would be sturdier and less susceptible to vibrations. A suspended floor (or whatever it's called) is the main culprit, but the sturdier rack for the TT would be nice.

The idea of an OLED pops into my head now and then. My PRO-111FD is still going strong, so justifying a new TV is hard, but if I make the move it would be between the Sony AE1 and LG E7 (the 55" versions; that's all I can fit in here, and given the space that's plenty).

Since the time is getting closer when I'll have to make a decision about retiring, big-ticket purchases will have to be over with fairly soon. I'd given myself until this year for any more, but the MCD500 purchase may have tilted things toward shutting down sooner rather than later. And December 31 will come sooner than I think, certainly. I'll see, I guess.


----------



## prepress

Once again, I use my paltry photo skills. Just received the latest update to the system. A Shunyata Venom HC power cord for my Furman Elite-15PFi. Thus, my sense of completeness and continuity (compulsiveness, perhaps) is satisfied. The 1.75m length is too long, as I needed only 1m, but the sale price was ridiculous, so I went for it.

I'd like to wind down on unnecessary purchases like this. The idea is this is the last year for such things audio-wise. But we'll see.


----------



## BrolicBeast

prepress said:


> Once again, I use my paltry photo skills. Just received the latest update to the system. A Shunyata Venom HC power cord for my Furman Elite-15PFi. Thus, my sense of completeness and continuity (compulsiveness, perhaps) is satisfied. The 1.75m length is too long, as I needed only 1m, but the sale price was ridiculous, so I went for it.
> 
> I'd like to wind down on unnecessary purchases like this. The idea is this is the last year for such things audio-wise. But we'll see.



Nice....let's see that bad-boy installed!!!


----------



## prepress

BrolicBeast said:


> Nice....let's see that bad-boy installed!!!


Once I've dusted, I'll take a proper picture. It's *bad* back there now.


----------



## prepress

Looks like I have a problem . . .

This AM I happened to notice that the standby LED on my Pioneer Elite DVL-91 LD player wasn't on. I just used it a couple of weeks ago and it was fine. I went around to the back, and there was some play with the IEC connector. This is a PS Audio Jewel AC C7 cord, and the PS Audios are known for solid grip. I was a bit surprised, and tried reseating the IEC connector to no avail.

Well, I put the original PC that came with the player back on, it's gripping just fine, and _still_ no standby LED. I'm thinking now the power supply may be dead, or the fuse is blown (perhaps occurring when turning the conditioner back on after installing the new Venom HC). This is an old player, almost 20 years old. I don't know if it can be repaired. I have an older, non-Elite LD player I could press into service; that's in the bedroom closet. Worst case, I'll replace the LDs I can with DVDs/BDs and move on. I may make a couple of inquiries on repair possibilities first. Bummer, because I like the player.


----------



## prepress

I called Technetron Electronic in Manhattan regarding my DVL-91. They say they can service it. Cost will be an up-front $80 for an estimate; repair should take about a week. These are the same folks who repaired my McIntosh C2300 two years ago. Hoping for the best, as I'm not quite ready to give the player up if not necessary.


----------



## prepress

Overdue update:

The DVL-91 was indeed repaired, at a cost of $700 (!), $600 of it labor. Apparently the unit was a bear to take apart and re-assemble for the job. The problem was a dead power supply. I thought I'd repair it this once, but if it goes down again I won't try getting it fixed, it's out of here. I have a non-Elite Pioneer LD player I could set up, or just chuck both units and my LDs, though some aren't available on DVD or BD.

On another note, I've discovered I can use different taps on my MC501 monoblocks and change the sound. Learning about this on another forum, I gave it a whirl. If you're unfamiliar with these McIntosh amps, they come with three sets of taps: 2 ohm, 4 ohm, and 8 ohm. I'd been using the 4-ohm taps for the mids/highs and the 2-ohm ones for bass; my speakers are 6 ohm. But I tried the 8-ohm taps for bass, and it lasted for one track, as the bass was much too heavy. Yesterday, I tried the 4-ohm taps for bass and 2-ohm taps for higs. The bass had more weight and impact, in fact I got a mild headache listening to the big drums in _Fanfare for the Common Man_. But the mids/highs seemed muted, not quite as sharp. That impression melted away some with subsequent CDs, DVDs and BDs. When I came back around to _Fanfare_, it sounded better. The mids/highs sounded cleaner and the overly heavy bass from the first time was replaced by a solid but not as distorted bass. Maybe I'll give that another chance, but I'm not sure yet.

I think I really want to put both connections on the 4-ohm taps, as I think that will put everything in balance. It means also having one pair of speaker cables re-terminated with spades on the amp end. That's more trouble, since I'll have to take it somewhere to have the re-termination done, but it beats buying a new pair just for the termination.


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## prepress

Okay, as a birthday present to myself I completed an upgrade to the power cords on my monoblock power amps. I was able to trade in, through Transparent's upgrade program, the High Performance power cords i was using; the credit went toward the Premium power cords, next up the line. Tomorrow I'll connect them and start listening, especially since I'll be stuck at home until FedEx comes.


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## prepress

Self-control is a key issue for me suddenly. Why? it starts with the fact that my Pioneer Elite BDP-88FD is on the fritz. The tray won't open. The unit doesn't respond to the remote or the open/close button, and rebooting the player (unplug then re-plug) worked only the first time I tried it. There's a service center in Manhattan that can fix it probably (they fixed my 20-year old LD player, also Pioneer Elite), but it would be more of a hassle to get it there than shipping it off someplace, as they're cash only so I have to lug it to them somehow to pay in person for the estimate, come back when it's ready to pay the final cost, then lug it home again.

In my laziness it's actually occurred to me to just move on and replace the 88FD with Pioneer's new 4K player, the UDP-LX500. I went to the Value Electronics website to be sure they still carry Pioneer Elite (they do) and the price listed is about what others are listing. But my relationship with the store could net me a bit of an additional discount. Unfortunately(!), in checking out the LX500, I noted, to my excitement, disappointment and great concern, *the new Sony A9G OLEDs* are due out next month, with the 55" version at a price _within reach_ under normal circumstances. I'm tempted, and I'm trying to settle down. A forum like AVS isn't going to help _that_, but I want to vent.

I can tell I'm going to start mental machinations over how to approach this. Meantime, I still have my BDP-09FD; the first move is to pray, then disconnect the 88FD, put my 09FD back in and play plenty of BDs and DVDs to remind me of what I have (a "cold shower" approach), even as my brain wants to work out a scenario where I can swing both new player and new TV despite having tight finances and a _still very good_ TV in my PRO-111FD that hasn't given me any trouble. I'm not sure I care about 4K that much, it's the larger screen for me. But I'd take the 4K!


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## prepress

An update: I have replaced the Pioneer Elite BDP-88FD in my system with my 09FD and have boxed up the 88 for repair. But listening to the 09 has been amazing! The rich, full sound is great. The 88's tonal balance is a bit thinner. As I recall, a couple of reviews on the Oppo players made that same point about them; both they and the 88 use ESS Sabre DACs, while the 09FD uses Wolfson DACs. Though the 88's sound is enjoyable, I much prefer the weight of the 09's bottom end.

This poses a dilemma. Right now, I'm not so sure I'd put the 88 back into the system! It is possible the 88's video processing is better; I'd have to do a comparison. And then there's the LX500, a true 4K player, which I'm curious about. I don't have a 4K TV (though the Sony A9G OLED is intriguing), and the LX500 could be a kind of "gateway drug" to a new TV, despite my PRO-111FD plasma still kicking butt after almost 10 years. Not sure what will happen with all this now, but money _is_ tight.


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## prepress

It isn't audio-related, but my air conditioner misbehaved. On 6/24, only the fan worked; none of the other buttons on the control panel responded. On 6/25, it was working. On 6/26 only the fan worked. On 6/27 I called the service center and made an appointment for Monday, 7/1. I had only the fan going up until that day, but the AM of 7/1, the A/C was working (figures). I didn't cancel the appointment, and that afternoon the service guy arrived, checked things out, and told me I needed a new control board.

Checking in with the office, a replacement control board couldn't be obtained, as the unit is 23 years old. So no option other than to take my chances or replace it. I chose the latter. And on 7/19, the new unit was delivered and installed. The old one was de-installed and taken away. The total cost for all this, including the initial service call, was $1,164.96. That put a dent in any audio plans for the immediate future, even casting doubt on a possible trip south in October. But given my issues with hot weather, proper air conditioning is a priority. Once I regroup, I may return to looking at power cords and (maybe) a new TV and equipment racks. For now, I'm trying to stay cool and healthy.

A picture of the new beast (a Friedrich) is attached. It's 15,500 BTUs; my other A/C, also Friedrich, was 12,000 BTUs. A bit of overkill possibly, but this was the only unit I saw that would fit my 42" window. The other photos are of the aftermath, as I had to clear a path to the window. I have a lot of work ahead to put the room back together. Right now, I can't play my system because I can't access it.


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## BrolicBeast

Wait a minute, wait a minute—whyyyyy did that cost $1,964.96? I’m from NY where only the new, big fancy rich folk houses have central air conditioning, so i grew up with these window units. When one died, we would buy one, and I would just extend the wings, carefully push into position, close the window, and boom. No more than the cost for the A/C itself—a few hundred bucks, at most. This endeavor should not have cost you nearly as much as it did! 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


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## prepress

BrolicBeast said:


> Wait a minute, wait a minute—whyyyyy did that cost $1,964.96? I’m from NY where only the new, big fancy rich folk houses have central air conditioning, so i grew up with these window units. When one died, we would buy one, and I would just extend the wings, carefully push into position, close the window, and boom. No more than the cost for the A/C itself—a few hundred bucks, at most. This endeavor should not have cost you nearly as much as it did!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


MAJOR typo on my part! Good catch. It's *$1,164.96*, actually. I fixed it just now.

What's NOT a typo is that I still haven't put my room back together after the installation, almost a month later. Haven't played the system in over a month; it looks worse now, arguably.


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## prepress

I have a question and wonder if there’s any theory or perspective out there that can help.

I have begun considering a “last fling” purchase as I near retirement, and it’s the idea of a new TV, despite my pleasure with my current one. I have a Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD Kuro plasma now. I’m looking at a 55” OLED with new Salamander Synergy equipment racks, or (as of yesterday) maybe foregoing the racks and getting a 65” OLED. My decision now seems to relate to my Mirage speakers.

Currently my speakers are about 10’ apart, with my Kuro in the center, across the room’s short dimension (no other real set-up option). They are toed-in slightly and about 4’ from the rear wall, which has a media cabinet (LP, CD) behind each speaker. As my Mirages are bipolar, it would likely help if the rear wall was blank, but that’s not an option. My seating distance is about 9’ from the plane of the speakers, 9.5’ from the screen. The soundstage is appropriately wide, but quite shallow; this hasn’t bothered me much before, but I’m suddenly aware of it now (go figure). If I replace my TV with the 55” OLED, I’ll be able to put the speakers closer together by about 8” because the 55” OLED is the same width as my Kuro _sans_ speakers (48”). The 65” OLED is the same width as my Kuro _with_ the speakers (57”).

My question is whether that 8” is enough to make a difference in soundstage depth, at least in theory. I might also increase the toe-in angle to see if that helps.


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## prepress

Two updates:

I moved my speakers forward about 2" and increased toe-in by roughly the same amount. The center image is still strong of course, perhaps slightly stronger, and (on what little I've played so far) slightly _in front_ of the TV, not just appearing to come _from_ the TV. I'd think this would improve if I see my way clear to get a Sony 55" A9G, which would allow me to reduce the distance between my speakers by 8".

Now, the other news. Using Transparent's Upgrade program, I ordered another Transparent Premium power cord last week and picked it up yesterday. It will go on my preamp. Since the HPPC cord wa a big improvement when put there, I'm curious as to whether the Premium, with its noise filtering module, might do more. I'll find out at the first best opportunity.


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## prepress

Went to the NY Audio Show earlier this month, and came away with my head full of "last fling" possibilities, to refer to an earlier post. Not just a TV, but also a turntable, speakers, power cords, interconnects, even select accessories are swimming around in my head now. Nothing would happen this year and only one, or two at most, of these areas would see action.

In the Value Electronics room I saw the 77" Sony A9G, which didn't look that big in a room smaller than mine. _Aquaman_ was playing through a Panasonic player. The picture seemed soft to me, which makes me think that this was an upscaled BD, not a 4K disc; perhaps the room lighting was a factor as well. Either way, it looks much sharper on my 50" Kuro. If the number and size of pixels is the same across the screen sizes, doesn't that mean in theory that the smaller screen would yield the sharper picture? Or are the pixels not the same size? I have no plans to buy 4K discs so my BDs would get upscaled by the TV (or player).

I've begun researching the turntable and speaker options. The Panasonic rep in the VE room had good info on the SL 1200G direct-drive turntable on display. I contacted SOTA turntables but never heard from them. I contacted Ohm acoustics, because their speakers are quite impressive and are omnidirectional, so that's a nice segue from my Mirages. They got back to me and I have a clearer picture of their offerings. There are some set-up issues possibly, and I'd have to spend more than I'd like for the particular model most fitting (the Walsh 5000, at almost $7200 tax included) or give up a bit of bass and get the 3000, which goes down to 32Hz, versus 26Hz for the 5000 and 30Hz for my Mirages

Research continues. Who knows, this may all blow over and I stay put! Probably not.


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## prepress

Ok, I am now researching turntables actively, and a TV. I'm looking primarily at a SOTA Sapphire, maybe a Nova, for the TT; I'd cannibalize my VPI and have my SME 309 tonearm put on the new table to mitigate cost (it doesn't come with an arm). The cartridge is 7 years old, but I don't play records tha much, so I'm thinking to get by with it for a few more months, then replace it.

Here are the front runners:
https://sotaturntables.com/product-category/heritage-series/

The TV is a Sony A9G; the question is whether a 55" or 65" set. Both my nephew and a friend from church are suggesting I go for the 65". The 65" fits in the same space as my PRO-111FD does, (good) as it's just as wide, though 2" taller. My concern is whether 9 feet is too close to a 65" screen. Still working with that one.


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## jnnt29

prepress said:


> Ok, I am now researching turntables actively, and a TV. I'm looking primarily at a SOTA Sapphire, maybe a Nova, for the TT; I'd cannibalize my VPI and have my SME 309 tonearm put on the new table to mitigate cost (it doesn't come with an arm). The cartridge is 7 years old, but I don't play records tha much, so I'm thinking to get by with it for a few more months, then replace it.
> 
> Here are the front runners:
> https://sotaturntables.com/product-category/heritage-series/
> 
> The TV is a Sony A9G; the question is whether a 55" or 65" set. Both my nephew and a friend from church are suggesting I go for the 65". The 65" fits in the same space as my PRO-111FD does, (good) as it's just as wide, though 2" taller. My concern is whether 9 feet is too close to a 65" screen. Still working with that one.


I would go with the 65”. I have one and sit about that distance with no issues.


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## prepress

Well, I went for the turntable, and it arrived last week. But the dust cover was left out; it's due to arrive tomorrow. Meantime, attached is a photo of the boxes when they came in.

As for the TV, it's on hold as I spent the money on the turntable. Besides, my PRO-111FD still looks good. At times I think it's just the right size; but depending upon what I'm watching it looks a bit small sometimes.


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## prepress

First photos of the table. The arm, cartridge, and spindle "washer" from the VPI are on it. The dust cover needs to go on, and I may need a mat, as it's not clear that the stylus actually touches the record. The 309 is set as low as I can set it.

If anyone has a low-cost, relatively thick solution I'd like to hear it just in case. Will plan to try playing something tomorrow.


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## prepress

Here is the finished and installed turntable with new cartridge. I have played some records, though not a lot, and they sound really good.

What is crazy, though, is the fact that I saw a YouTube presentation by a McIntosh rep, and behind him in the rack was a Pro-Ject Xtension 10. A tinge of buyer's remorse crept over me, as I'd wanted that Pro-Ject. Am I weird?

I would have had to go up the range to an Xtension 12 to get a detachable headshell on the tonearm (my preference); we're talking another $2–2.5K, perhaps, for the combo. That, and the SOTA's reputation for an outstanding suspension system, led me to the SOTA.


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## prepress

prepress said:


> *The shadow knows...*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At the request of several members, I'm taking a stab at starting a thread for my system. I have only a 2-channel setup which handles both video and audio, in a room that's 14' x 18'5" or so. The system is in a state of flux as I begin, but I hope the final config will be in place in the next couple of weeks or so. I should also point out that I don't quite have the hang of embedding photos. So with that caveat, the equipment is as follows (subject to change very soon):
> 
> *Analog*
> 
> VPI HW-19 MkIV/SME 309/Grado Reference Platinum
> 
> Magnum Dynalab MD-90
> 
> Day-Sequerra antenna
> *Digital*
> 
> McIntosh MCD301
> 
> Scientific Atlanta Explorer 4250HDC (TW Cable)
> *Video*
> 
> Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD
> 
> Oppo BDP-83
> 
> Pioneer Elite DVL-91
> 
> DVDO iScan Duo
> 
> Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD
> *Preamp*
> 
> Audio Research LS3
> 
> Aragon 47K
> *Power amp*
> 
> B&K M-200 Sonata monoblocks (2 pair)
> *Speakers*
> 
> Mirage M3-si
> *Power*
> 
> Tripplite LCR2400
> 
> Triplite HT1210ISOCTR
> 
> VPI SDS
> *Cables*
> 
> Kimber Hero, AQ Black Mamba II
> 
> Kimber 8TC
> *Furniture*
> 
> Sanus Euro
> 
> Hooker Entertainment console
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For the story of the system, read on. How it is here isn't what it will be . . .


This is the system now:

*Analog*
_SOTA Sapphire, Grado Sonata3 Timbre Series
Magnum Dynalab MD-90
Day-Sequerra antenna_
*Digital*
_McIntosh MCD500_
*Video*
_Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD
Oppo BDP-83
Pioneer Elite DVL-91
DVDO iScan Duo
Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD_
*Preamp*
_McIntosh C2300_
*Power amp*
_McIntosh MC501 monoblocks_
*Speakers*
_Mirage M3-si_
*Power*
_Furman SPR-20i, Elite-15PFi_
*Cables*
_IC: Transparent Plus, Kimber Hero
PC: Transparent High Performance, Premium, Shunyata Venom HC, Venom 14, PS Audio Jewel
SC: Kimber 12TC_
*Furniture*
Sanus Euro


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## prepress

I forgot the video cables: Pangea HDMI, MIT S-video


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## prepress

And on Wednesday, I'm off to check out (and buy in all likelihood) a Sony A9G. Still a question of the 55" or 65" set. I have reasons to like both. The 55" gives me more flexibility with my setup, but the 65" is the recommended size by almost everyone I mention this to. With the 55" I can move my speakers 8" closer together and thereby improve the imaging perhaps; I could buy a 4K player; or I could resume with replacing a power cord or two in my system. I could even replace my main rack with a Salamander Synergy (depending upon price), a better-looking piece.

With the 65" I get a more immersive experience and won't be buying anything else, probably. I'd be spared having to empty and move my equipment racks, then refill them, _in addition_ to moving my speakers in, to get the aforementioned 8" of space mentioned above. Instead, I could set my current BD player to Source Direct and just let things rip.


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## prepress

Ok, yesterday I purchased the Sony 55" A9G. The TV has to be ordered, as there were none in stock.

Today I'm having a two-pronged attack of "buyer's remorse." On the one hand, I'm asking myself _"why did you buy this?"_ The new A9H was on display (no A9G on display until next week) and didn't look good on DVDs and that has me concerned. The TV was out of the box and not yet calibrated. Moving to a blu-ray things looked better; indeed, when the "Custom" picture mode was chosen things looked WAY better. I'm hoping that will hold true for DVD as well, especially with "Custom" engaged (I didn't think to engage Custom for the DVD). Then, my Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD still stuns on blu-ray and is excellent with standard def, hence the "what did I do?" feeling.

The other yip is _"why didn't I get the 65" version?"_, this despite having some sound practical reasons not to. The smaller 55" will allow me to move my speakers about 8" closer together, and thereby improve imaging in theory. But even with my Mirage speakers 8 ft 9in. apart (inside edge to inside edge), I still have a strong center image. There's little front-to-back depth, but that center is solid. I've lived with that for a while now.

I need to resolve this, pronto.


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## Waboman

prepress said:


> Ok, yesterday I purchased the Sony 55" A9G. The TV has to be ordered, as there were none in stock.
> 
> Today I'm having a two-pronged attack of "buyer's remorse." On the one hand, I'm asking myself _"why did you buy this?"_ The new* A9H* was on display (no A9G on display until next week) and didn't look good on DVDs and that has me concerned. The TV was out of the box and not yet calibrated. Moving to a blu-ray things looked better; indeed, when the "Custom" picture mode was chosen things looked WAY better. I'm hoping that will hold true for DVD as well, especially with "Custom" engaged (I didn't think to engage Custom for the DVD). Then, my Pioneer Elite PRO-111FD still stuns on blu-ray and is excellent with standard def, hence the "what did I do?" feeling.
> 
> The other yip is _"why didn't I get the 65" version?"_, this despite having some sound practical reasons not to. The smaller 55" will allow me to move my speakers about 8" closer together, and thereby improve imaging in theory. But even with my Mirage speakers 8 ft 9in. apart (inside edge to inside edge), I still have a strong center image. There's little front-to-back depth, but that center is solid. I've lived with that for a while now.
> 
> I need to resolve this, pronto.


There is no A9H and never will be. There's an A8H. Congrats on the new tv. She's a beauty.


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## prepress

Waboman said:


> There is no A9H and never will be. There's an A8H. Congrats on the new tv. She's a beauty.


Ok, I might have the number wrong. Good catch. There was supposed to be an A9H but it was cancelled from what I've seen. It has the same processor as the A9G, so I used it as a guide even though I saw the A9G last year at Best Buy. Now, I'm thinking I should pivot and get the 65" version, if Robert at VE will allow. I would have gotten a Pioneer LX500 disc player if they were available, but they're not in production anymore so that money's freed up to go for the larger screen. I'll plan to contact them today about that.

As for my previous post concerning speaker placement, I'm willing to let it stand, which would be necessary with the larger TV. One reason for getting the 55" A9G was so I could move the speakers closer together. I'm prepared to let that go. And there's no _guarantee_ the imaging would improve; I was going on theory.

More to come, I guess.


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## prepress

Since I don't see a way to edit my last post, I'll make a new one. I called VE and they'll alert me when the A9G is in and on display. I'll go back with some DVDs to evaluate the actual set I've bought. If it handles the DVDs well, then I let the purchase stand, or maybe go for the 65" set. If the A9G _doesn't_ do the job, then I will skip the TV and go for the Salamander equipment racks. Another possibility is the Marantz SA-KI Ruby SACD player, which the store carries also. I have a McIntosh MCD500 SACD player which is great, but I'm not a real fan of ESS Sabre DACs (which the 500 has) so this may be a chance to make a move.


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## prepress

I returned to VE yesterday and made a change. I opted for the 65" A9G instead of the 55" version, with full calibration. In particular, the SDR calibration will be of help for standard definition content. Tentative delivery is for the day after Thanksgiving.

I auditioned the 77" model, as it was on display. The 65" will be sharper, and to a greater degree than the 55" would be vs. the 65" as I understand it. The 77" set's pixels are larger and further apart than on the 65", but most of my test discs were good. The one exception is my _Yes Live at Montreaux_ DVD; shots of Rick Wakeman's keyboards looked like white hash. Calibration will fix that, or mitigate it significantly, I'd think.

I'm not a fan of the Sony's design, but that will be offset a bit by the larger size; I think the 65" set will have more visual weight than the 55" set, even when it's not on. We'll see.


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## prepress

A step closer. The A9G passed the QC tests; next is the pro calibration and eventual delivery. I'm a bit melancholy about giving up my PRO-111FD, but am beginning to develop a sense of anticipation for the new TV.

Meantime, I have a new antenna for the tuner, a Magnum Dynalab ST-2. I haven't connected it yet, but I expect it to be better than the Day-Sequerra it will replace. The MD's omnidirectional, so that should help pull in another station or two. We'll see.


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## prepress

UPDATE: The A9G was delivered 3 weeks ago, and I will say it's taken a bit of getting used to, going from 50" to 65". But even with non-4K material (which is all I have for now) the picture's quite good.

An emerging issue is audio dropouts, which I've seen mentioned on the owner's forum. I have some tests in ind to try. First, because there is sometimes pixelation in the video simultaneous with the audio drop-out, I'll reboot my cable box; there's a three-consecutive trick I used earlier this year to clear another problem related to pixelation of certain stations. If that doesn't work, then I'll play discs through my BD player that's set for both audio and video feed to the TV via HDMI (using a single cable). If THAT doesn't solve things then I'll take a look at the "Timer" feature (if I can find it); I think it's supposed to be set to "Off."

If none of that works, I guess I contact Sony. Meantime, I'll reach out to VE to see if Robert has any ideas.


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## prepress

prepress said:


> UPDATE: The A9G was delivered 3 weeks ago, and I will say it's taken a bit of getting used to, going from 50" to 65". But even with non-4K material (which is all I have for now) the picture's quite good.
> 
> An emerging issue is audio dropouts, which I've seen mentioned on the owner's forum. I have some tests in ind to try. First, because there is sometimes pixelation in the video simultaneous with the audio drop-out, I'll reboot my cable box; there's a three-consecutive trick I used earlier this year to clear another problem related to pixelation of certain stations. If that doesn't work, then I'll play discs through my BD player that's set for both audio and video feed to the TV via HDMI (using a single cable). If THAT doesn't solve things then I'll take a look at the "Timer" feature (if I can find it); I think it's supposed to be set to "Off."
> 
> If none of that works, I guess I contact Sony. Meantime, I'll reach out to VE to see if Robert has any ideas.


I forgot, a Furman IT-Reference 15i is on the way, due to be delivered tomorrow!


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## prepress

Here is the new Furman in the rack beside its older brother, the SPR-20i. The IT-Reference is on the bottom right.


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## prepress

I have purchased new power cords recently, 3 more Transparent Premiums. I installed them 2 weeks ago and have had a few hours with them in the system. These went on source components, my blu-ray, SACD, and tuner. I attached pictures. So 3 of my 5 source components have these on them now; the turntable has a captive cord, and I don't see putting one of these on my LD player, as Transparent doesn't offer the Premiums with C7 connectors, and the adapter I have doesn't fit the IEC connection solidly. Plus, the LD player gets little use and I've said I wouldn't repair it at this point if it broke down again (over $700 for a repair a couple of years ago).

I wasn't sure how much (if any) difference there would be, but in the few hours the system's been used, I did hear improvement. The overall sound is cleaner, and there's even a detail now and then I didn't hear before due probably to the lower noise floor; maybe the heavier gauge plays a role as well. I was able to again take advantage of Transparent's upgrade program and saved $672 in the process.


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## prepress

A new pic. This is the system as it is now. I think I'm done for the forseeable future. there are some power cord upgrades, but that's it. A couple of Shunyata Venom V10 NRs for the two Furmans. My system is sounding even better, I'm assuming it's due to more noise filtering in the Furmans.


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## prepress

And i also have some Transparent interconnects on order, two pairs of Super, which will replace two pairs of Transparent Plus; under Transparent's Trade-Up program, I get a credit on the Super using the Plus as a trade-in. One pair of the new ICs will go on my blu-ray player, the other on my SACD player. I'd like to think I'm done buying for the foreseeable future.


----------

