# The official Falcon Screens acoustically transparent screen thread



## BIGmouthinDC

My current client became the first customer of the new Northern Virginia Home Theater Screen company - Falcon Screens. Those of you who follow the Dedicated Home Theater construction threads may be familiar with the Merrimont Trace project and the builder, Snickers1 (Rich). Instead of just DIYing his own screen he jumped into the fray and invested in a die to make his own aluminum frames and sourced all the other materials to make a competitive AT screen. He promises to have his Web site up later this week to answer questions about his screen.



Some pictures


Like a lot of screens Falcon uses the z-clip mounting brackets. Here they are on a minimalist screen wall frame.

 


You lay out the frame pieces and put it together.

 



One feature of his frames, is the Quick Connect corner brackets, they have cam levers that actually pull the frame corners tight together. They slip into channels from the sides and don't have to be pushed in from the ends. This simplifies assembly and locks the corners really tight.

 



After putting the frame together I pulled out a tape and as Rich held his breath, I measured the diagonals to check if the frame was square. Much to my surprise it was dead on. This hasn't always been the case with other frames I've assembled. I attribute this to the tightening nature of the Quick Connect clips. we added the AT fabric and hung the finished screen. Rich used the o-ring loop and post trampoline system for a quick assembly.

 

 


Some more pictures of the project and screen assembly here:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1464536/beam-and-pole-interruptus-not-bigmouthindc-and-nygiantsfan23-launch-another-avs-ht/0_40


----------



## Glenn Baumann

Is this a 4k very fine weave type of material?










Someone needs to really shake things up and bring a truly affordable fine weave 4k type screen to market!










I understand that these screens are a niche item but come on, let's get real... the pricing on these 4k screens is just ridiculous at the moment!










I wish Falcon success, but we shall see!











...Glenn


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Glenn Baumann*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23440349
> 
> 
> Is this a 4k very fine weave type of material?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone needs to really shake things up and bring a truly affordable fine weave 4k type screen to market!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I understand that these screens are a niche item but come on, let's get real... the pricing on these 4k screens is just ridiculous at the moment!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wish Falcon success, but we shall see!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...Glenn




It is a fine Weave


seen in this up close pic and is able to do 4k .

 



i think thou what you asking for is it the new 4 material the has no holes and can be viewed from any distance. i currently do not offer that. when i am able to test it and offer it to the public the issues you are speaking of will be addressed for sure. Falcon HD is a fine weave and can be viewed from 9 to 9 1/2 feet depending on the screen size obviously if you have a 140" wide screen and are trying to view it from 9ft i think you will more of issue seeing the entire screen sitting that close











I hope this helps

Rich


----------



## NYGIANTSFAN23

I received the package today, thanks a lot.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *NYGIANTSFAN23*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23455131
> 
> 
> I received the package today, thanks a lot.



your welcome. looking forward to see your theater all painted and carpeted


enjoy


Rich


----------



## snickers1

The FalconScreens website is up.

http://www.falconscreens.com 


please message me for available discounts



Rich


----------



## NGiovas




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23463614
> 
> 
> The FalconScreens website is up.
> 
> http://www.falconscreens.com
> 
> 
> please message me for available discounts
> 
> 
> 
> Rich


 

The site looks great Rich.  Curious, do you plan to sell curved screens?

 

Nick


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *NGiovas*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23463749
> 
> 
> The site looks great Rich.  Curious, do you plan to sell curved screens?
> 
> 
> Nick



Yes those will be coming in the near future


----------



## chriscmore

I see where a lot of the website source verbiage and formatting came from. You're welcome.


Cheers,

Chris


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *chriscmore*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23476217
> 
> 
> I see where a lot of the website source verbiage and formatting came from. You're welcome.
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chris



i dont see that .... a simple wordpress theme and that is really it



Thanks

Rich


----------



## StevenC56




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23483672
> 
> 
> i dont see that .... a simple wordpress theme and that is really it
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rich



I certainly can. You even chose the same screen sizes as Seymour Screen Excellence.


----------



## Tom Bley

Really? A lot of screen manufacturers have the same screen sizes.









I'm sure Seymour-Screen Excellence isn't afraid of a little competition?


----------



## NYGIANTSFAN23




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Tom Bley*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23523940
> 
> 
> Really? A lot of screen manufacturers have the same screen sizes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure Seymour-Screen Excellence isn't afraid of a little competition?



+1


----------



## dropzone7

A friend of mine works at a print shop and he made a vinyl banner for me that would be roughly the dimension of the screen I want. It had a shiny side and a flat white side. I hung it with the shiny side out first and immediately saw hotspotting. I turned it around to the flat side and was surprised at how good it looked. There is some texture to this material but at 10' seating distance which is the closest I would be sitting, it was not immediately visible unless you really looked for it. This is not accoustically transparent of course and I have no intention of trying to use it as a permanent solution but I was surprised how good it looks and it gives me hope that perhaps I won't see the weave of the material in an AT screen. I have spoken with Rich about the Falcon screen and it sounds like it is really well made. I'm just not sure about the screen fabric and would like to see some other installs before making a decision. Of course, I guess someone has to be the early adopter so maybe I will just have to take the plunge. I have narrowed my choices to either the Falcon or SeymourAV for sure.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dropzone7*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23529691
> 
> 
> A friend of mine works at a print shop and he made a vinyl banner for me that would be roughly the dimension of the screen I want. It had a shiny side and a flat white side. I hung it with the shiny side out first and immediately saw hotspotting. I turned it around to the flat side and was surprised at how good it looked. There is some texture to this material but at 10' seating distance which is the closest I would be sitting, it was not immediately visible unless you really looked for it. This is not accoustically transparent of course and I have no intention of trying to use it as a permanent solution but I was surprised how good it looks and it gives me hope that perhaps I won't see the weave of the material in an AT screen. I have spoken with Rich about the Falcon screen and it sounds like it is really well made. I'm just not sure about the screen fabric and would like to see some other installs before making a decision. Of course, I guess someone has to be the early adopter so maybe I will just have to take the plunge. I have narrowed my choices to either the Falcon or SeymourAV for sure.



So far there has been three installs from this forum one is mentioned at the top of thread, also the first was installed in my build , also a 110" 16:9 screen was installed this weekend in one other persons from this forum more to come on that install soon. I understand you wanting to see more real world test before making your decision. I think all of us that have built there own theater spent so much time on every detail. If you would like a sample of the Falcon HD material send me a PM with your address and will be happy to send a sample out to you.


Thanks

Rich


----------



## dropzone7




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23530386
> 
> 
> So far there has been three installs from this forum one is mentioned at the top of thread, also the first was installed in my build , also a 110" 16:9 screen was installed this weekend in one other persons from this forum more to come on that install soon. I understand you wanting to see more real world test before making your decision. I think all of us that have built there own theater spent so much time on every detail. If you would like a sample of the Falcon HD material send me a PM with your address and will be happy to send a sample out to you.
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rich




Rich,

Your room looks awesome! I don't have anything remotely close to that nice. Mine is just a spare bedroom that I turned into a batcave. I have jokingly thought of calling it the "Compromise Theater" because I sometimes wonder if it's even worth investing money in a room so unfit for a theater. It's been used as my theater room for the last six years or so but it's been more off than on lately and when I decided that I wanted an AT scope screen I pretty much had to abandon all of my equipment and start over. I don't have the space to spare for floorstanding speakers behind the screen and add to that the fact that there is a big honking window right on my screen wall, well it's the theater of compromise... This is what led me to inwall speakers and the idea of a wall in front of my wall to hold those speakers. I finally got around to building that this weekend.


----------



## dropzone7

Rich, I received the sample yesterday. Thanks for sending it out so quick. I did a little testing with it last night. I just taped this up against my current white screen surface which is a piece of vinyl on the flat, non-shiny side. For evaluating your material would it be better to have it against a black background or leave some space between it and the wall in the same way that an actual screen woudl be hung?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dropzone7*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23565730
> 
> 
> Rich, I received the sample yesterday. Thanks for sending it out so quick. I did a little testing with it last night. I just taped this up against my current white screen surface which is a piece of vinyl on the flat, non-shiny side. For evaluating your material would it be better to have it against a black background or leave some space between it and the wall in the same way that an actual screen woudl be hung?



Black background would be best, but if you put it directly on a dark wall that would be fine.


----------



## dropzone7




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23565747
> 
> 
> Black background would be best, but if you put it directly on a dark wall that would be fine.



Is the weave already at a tilt or would I mimic the tilted cut by tilting this sample at about 15 degress or does it really matter on a small piece like this?


In the little bit of time I spent looking at it last night, I did not notice the weave at my proposed 10' first row of seating. I really had to get about 6 or 7' from it to start to notice which is good.


I need to take down my vinyl screen and just place this sample against the black background of my screen wall because I'm so used to seeing how things look on that material. I want to reserve my comments until I rule out all possible interference. First impressions are that I'm seeing some color shift on the sample.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dropzone7*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23565793
> 
> 
> Is the weave already at a tilt or would I mimic the tilted cut by tilting this sample at about 15 degress or does it really matter on a small piece like this?
> 
> 
> In the little bit of time I spent looking at it last night, I did not notice the weave at my proposed 10' first row of seating. I really had to get about 6 or 7' from it to start to notice which is good.
> 
> 
> I need to take down my vinyl screen and just place this sample against the black background of my screen wall because I'm so used to seeing how things look on that material. I want to reserve my comments until I rule out all possible interference. First impressions are that I'm seeing some color shift on the sample.




The sample was cut on an angle so you will not need to tilt it. you should not be seeing any color shift it is Acoustically Transparent material so not only does the sound travel through it, you also get some light passing through so you may be seeing the light reflecting off your vinyl material.


----------



## dropzone7




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23565819
> 
> 
> The sample was cut on an angle so you will not need to tilt it. you should not be seeing any color shift it is Acoustically Transparent material so not only does the sound travel through it, you also get some light passing through so you may be seeing the light reflecting off your vinyl material.



That's what I was wondering. I will change things around tonight and see how things look.


----------



## dropzone7

Did a bit more viewing of this sample and I think you were right Rich. Having the sample directly against my ultra white vinyl material was causing some sort of reflection back through the sample and causing it look darker, slightly yellowed. Putting the sample against a dark background and totally removing the vinyl piece made a difference. There is still some push towards yellow or green I think but this may just be the difference in gain between the AT fabric and my vinyl which is really white and probably has more blue in it making my whites look brighter. Now I wish I had never used the vinyl as a temporary screen becuase it is addictively bright although inaccurate I'm sure. Whatever I end up with, the projector is going to have to be calibrated and tweaked to it regardless. I don't see the weave of the Falcon material being an issue even from my close seating distance. I would be interested to hear from someone currently using the Falcon material and if they had their projector calibrated, how did it go. Many thanks to Rich for answering my questions and getting the sample out so quickly. I will continue to evaluate this a while longer and maybe break out the old colorimeter.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dropzone7*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23574351
> 
> 
> Did a bit more viewing of this sample and I think you were right Rich. Having the sample directly against my ultra white vinyl material was causing some sort of reflection back through the sample and causing it look darker, slightly yellowed. Putting the sample against a dark background and totally removing the vinyl piece made a difference. There is still some push towards yellow or green I think but this may just be the difference in gain between the AT fabric and my vinyl which is really white and probably has more blue in it making my whites look brighter. Now I wish I had never used the vinyl as a temporary screen becuase it is addictively bright although inaccurate I'm sure. Whatever I end up with, the projector is going to have to be calibrated and tweaked to it regardless. I don't see the weave of the Falcon material being an issue even from my close seating distance. I would be interested to hear from someone currently using the Falcon material and if they had their projector calibrated, how did it go. Many thanks to Rich for answering my questions and getting the sample out so quickly. I will continue to evaluate this a while longer and maybe break out the old colorimeter.




yes the weave pattern in the material is very flat and smooth which helps with seating closer to the screen. Good luck with your testing or should i say adventure










Rich


----------



## dropzone7

I took these with my cell phone so not the best images especially in macro mode up close and personal. I could not see the tiny round holes at all until I took this picture. Pretty cool.


----------



## TheTotalPackage

I have to ask..... Why is pricing such a secret on these AT screens? Everyone says they cost a lot but never mention prices... any insight?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *TheTotalPackage*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23630313
> 
> 
> I have to ask..... Why is pricing such a secret on these AT screens? Everyone says they cost a lot but never mention prices... any insight?



no secrets the prices are on the actual falcon website i think there is a rule about posting prices on the open forum


Pm sent


Thanks

Rich


----------



## BIGmouthinDC

I forgot to update this thread with the final screen wall from NYGiantsFan23's project.


----------



## BrolicBeast


I'm lucky enough to live somewhat close enough to demo one of these screens.  I am excited to check out the performance aspects of the screen--particularly, brightness and seating distance/viewable weave threshold. It seems like a great product!


----------



## Glenn Baumann




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23739430
> 
> 
> I'm lucky enough to live somewhat close enough to demo one of these screens.  I am excited to check out the performance aspects of the screen--particularly, brightness and seating distance/viewable weave threshold. It seems like a great product!




"I am excited to check out the performance aspects of the screen--particularly, brightness and seating distance/viewable weave threshold. "



Please do come back here and post with your impressions and subjective review after you have checked it out!











...Glenn


----------



## Nighthawk26

I sent an Email via the website 2 days ago Rich and have yet to hear back.......


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Nighthawk26*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23744852
> 
> 
> I sent an Email via the website 2 days ago Rich and have yet to hear back.......



PM sent


Thanks

Rich


----------



## cbdhouses

good,Please do come back here and post with your impressions and subjective review after you have checked it out!


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cbdhouses*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23753434
> 
> 
> good,Please do come back here and post with your impressions and subjective review after you have checked it out!



we have scheduled a time first weekend of October, i am looking forward to his visit should be fun, hopefully seeing a completed Theater will only motivate BrolicBeast to get started on his build.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Is black backing recommended for /shipped with this screen? The En4k screen I had definitely needed it, even though my area behind the screen was black Linacoustic. The vertical support bars were easily seen as blacker areas than the rest of the screen. Installing the black backing eliminated this. I would assume this screen has about the same amount of light "blow through" as the En4k?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23764398
> 
> 
> Is black backing recommended for /shipped with this screen? The En4k screen I had definitely needed it, even though my area behind the screen was black Linacoustic. The vertical support bars were easily seen as blacker areas than the rest of the screen. Installing the black backing eliminated this. I would assume this screen has about the same amount of light "blow through" as the En4k?



Our screens do not have vertical support bars so as long as behind the screen is black linacoustic there should be no issue.

we currently do not offer black backing material.


Thanks

Rich


----------



## hifiaudio2

Does this screen have less blow through than other woven screens? Seems like not having the backing layer would hurt contrast. Putting it on improved perceived contrast on my En4k screen.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23764504
> 
> 
> Does this screen have less blow through than other woven screens? Seems like not having the backing layer would hurt contrast. Putting it on improved perceived contrast on my En4k screen.



No it would be very similar to other "woven" screens.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Ok. Well with no bars to show the difference and some gain to it, perhaps that will offset the need. Look forward to talking with you tonight.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23764611
> 
> 
> Ok. Well with no bars to show the difference and some gain to it, perhaps that will offset the need. Look forward to talking with you tonight.



sounds good


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/0_100#post_23764504
> 
> 
> Does this screen have less blow through than other woven screens? Seems like not having the backing layer would hurt contrast. Putting it on improved perceived contrast on my En4k screen.



What is "blow through"? Is that a technical term?


So check this out. I posted this in a different thread, but seems appropriate to post it here. My frequency response test of the AT screen:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *popalock*  /t/1484131/home-theater-of-the-month-popalocks-bassment-big-screen-bigger-subs/100_100#post_23762480
> 
> 
> For those interested, I recently had a chance to frame out the AT Screen, throw the L/C/R behind the screen and take some measurements. Here are the results...
> 
> 
> No Screen:
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/popalock85/media/NoScreenRawResponse_zpsc14da753.jpg.html
> 
> 
> No Screen vs Screen:
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/popalock85/media/NoScreenvsScreen_zps7041a5f8.jpg.html
> 
> 
> Here is the "no screen" response and the response after a quick EQ adjustment:
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/popalock85/media/NoScreenvsScreenafterEQ_zps7c6e79cd.jpg.html
> *Just like the screen isn't even there... Very very pleased with the results!*
> 
> 
> Here are all graphs combined for reference:
> http://smg.photobucket.com/user/popalock85/media/AllCombined_zps46b61897.jpg.html  [/URL
> 
> 
> This screen is awesome. No complaints anywhere. Well, I take that back. This screen is quite a bit more heavy that my last screen, which makes it almost impossible to manipulate by myself. Hence one of the reasons in delay of getting these measurements posted...I had to bug the wifey to come down to help me!


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BIGmouthinDC*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/0_100#post_23675170
> 
> 
> I forgot to update this thread with the final screen wall from NYGiantsFan23's project.



Man, that looks great Jeff.


Reminds me...I need to take a few updated of my room to post up.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Blow through is a term for the light that passes through the screen. This would reflect off of whatever is behind the screen. As for who coined the term? I don't know. Maybe I read it in the white paper on perf vs woven on Stewarts website.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BIGmouthinDC*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread#post_23675170
> 
> 
> I forgot to update this thread with the final screen wall from NYGiantsFan23's project.



I visited this amazing theater today--my mind is still blown. As far as the Falcon Screen goes, the PQ is stunning and the weave is NOT visible until you get around 3-4 feet from the screen--and if the light is dimmed, you won't see the weave period. To put this in perspective, the coating texture on my non-AT Stewart ST130 G3 is easier to see from 4 feet away than the weave in the Falcon Screen materiel. Anyone who has any concerns about the weave in AT screens need not worry if Falcon Screens in on their short list. One of my biggest concerns about going AT was light loss; however, I can definitely say that the picture was _very_ bright on the 130" screen being lit bu a JVC 4810 in normal lamp mode. This leads me to believe that as long as a buyer is careful about projector selection, although light loss through AT may be measurable by high-end meters, it won't impact screen brightness detrimentally--even at reasonably large screen sizes. In terms of the screen and sound quality, the above graphs posted by Popalock confirm what i heard today. With proper EQ, the AT screen is not an audible detractor. Great Screen!


----------



## coolgeek

I tried to get a sample from Rich, but he doesn't send it outside of the US.. does anyone have an old sample they could mail to me? I'll pay for shipping of course.. and if i like it, i can have a friend get it for me in the US then ship out to me...


It sucks not living in the US because so many great products come from there but usually don't sell overseas...


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *coolgeek*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23867997
> 
> 
> I tried to get a sample from Rich, but he doesn't send it outside of the US.. does anyone have an old sample they could mail to me? I'll pay for shipping of course.. and if i like it, i can have a friend get it for me in the US then ship out to me...
> 
> 
> It sucks not living in the US because so many great products come from there but usually don't sell overseas...



pm sent


----------



## hifiaudio2

I have ordered a large screen (160" wide, scope) from Rich. I liked the sample and it seemed on par with the Centerstage XD for brightness but with a MUCH less apparent weave. Obviously the weave is not as fine as the EN4k, but its a 1 gain screen instead of .77. It does seem to have a slightly different white "color" than the XD when both are side by side, but I can calibrate that out. Not sure which is more accurate anyway. Ill just let my spectro and Calman decide on what to do







.


----------



## BrolicBeast

Hi all, Rich was nice enough to let my fiance and I come check out his theater for another look at the Falcon Screen. What a gorgeous room its. The attention to detail is top-notch and the muted, industrial color scheme goes very well with the Home Theater theme. I have to echo my comments below--the screen really is quite the performer and the weave cannot be seen from normal viewing distances. Rich uses a Panasonic 8000 projector, which outputs plenty of light onto the screen. Light loss should not be a concern with AT Screens, as long as a projector (with the right lumen output) is selected. I continue to be thoroughly impressed by Falcon Screens, and I will be placing my order as soon as construction is completed in the new house! I've seen many screens in my day, from low-end to high-end. and Falcon Screens is up there with the best of them in terms of picture quality. Add to that, a quality weave with low-to-no visibility, and you've got yourself a winner!


My first experience with Falcon Screens is listed below:


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BrolicBeast*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23785206
> 
> 
> I visited this amazing theater today--my mind is still blown. As far as the Falcon Screen goes, the PQ is stunning and the weave is NOT visible until you get around 3-4 feet from the screen--and if the light is dimmed, you won't see the weave period. To put this in perspective, the coating texture on my non-AT Stewart ST130 G3 is easier to see from 4 feet away than the weave in the Falcon Screen materiel. Anyone who has any concerns about the weave in AT screens need not worry if Falcon Screens in on their short list. One of my biggest concerns about going AT was light loss; however, I can definitely say that the picture was _very_ bright on the 130" screen being lit bu a JVC 4810 in normal lamp mode. This leads me to believe that as long as a buyer is careful about projector selection, although light loss through AT may be measurable by high-end meters, it won't impact screen brightness detrimentally--even at reasonably large screen sizes. In terms of the screen and sound quality, the above graphs posted by Popalock confirm what i heard today. With proper EQ, the AT screen is not an audible detractor. Great Screen!


----------



## Diesel 48

Due to the fact that you have no black backing behind your screen are the cones of speakers visible? Does the light from the projector reflect off them at all? That would be one of my main concerns. Based on current feedback it probably is not that big of deal.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Diesel 48*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23886725
> 
> 
> Due to the fact that you have no black backing behind your screen are the cones of speakers visible? Does the light from the projector reflect off them at all? That would be one of my main concerns. Based on current feedback it probably is not that big of deal.



here is shot of the My speakers behind the screen they Dayton 12" and for those that are not familiar with them they have a very shinny cone

the only time they are seen is if i turn the lights on behind the screen in my case they are about 6" from the screen


----------



## Diesel 48

Awesome look! Planning on putting JTR Noesis, and dual opposed 18" subs behind which ever AT screen I decide on. Just wanted to make sure I did not see anything shiny if I decide to go with this screen.


----------



## popalock

Due to space constraints, my speakers are literally 2" from my screen. My speaker cones are a reflective copper color. That said, I have had 0 issues with any reflections behind the screen.


Nothing to worry about IMO.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Diesel 48*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23886789
> 
> 
> Awesome look! Planning on putting JTR Noesis, and dual opposed 18" subs behind which ever AT screen I decide on. Just wanted to make sure I did not see anything shiny if I decide to go with this screen.



It really wouldn't be that hard to make your own black backing either. All you would need to do is run down to your local fabric store and pick up some black speaker cloth and install it behind the screen.


----------



## Mike Garrett

AV Science is now a Falcon screen dealer. Rich, it was nice meeting you at CEDIA and welcome to the fold.


----------



## hifiaudio2

I just got mine up (about 161" wide scope) and must say that I am a fan. Very nice fit and finish and the screen texture is very good. With a bright sky or high IRE image on the screen I can see no texture at all past about 3-4 feet, which is really about the same as the EN4K under those same conditions. With my harsh screen lights on that show every single imperfection in a screen, its still about 80% as smooth looking as the EN4k and WAY, WAY smoother than the Centerstage XD. I let someone borrow my Spectro so I cannot get a ftL reading right now to see how much brighter it is than my EN4k screen was (even though I am also on a different copy of the same Sony 1000 projector, so that will be slightly different as well).


So far I give it a strong recommendation.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *AV Science Sales 5*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23925223
> 
> 
> AV Science is now a Falcon screen dealer. Rich, it was nice meeting you at CEDIA and welcome to the fold.



Thanks Mike! it was great meeting you and Fellow AVS'rs


----------



## hifiaudio2

And thank you Mac hs10 for suggesting the Falcon to me!


----------



## hifiaudio2

Watched the Croods tonight on it with company. Always makes you feel good when you can just barely hear the other guy's wife lean over and say something to him about how clear and amazing it looks right when it starts.


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *AV Science Sales 5*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/0_100#post_23925223
> 
> 
> AV Science is now a Falcon screen dealer. Rich, it was nice meeting you at CEDIA and welcome to the fold.



Outstanding news! Congrats on the partnership.


----------



## coolgeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *luangaoyiji*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_23931573
> 
> 
> great, I am excited to check out the performance aspects of the screen--particularly, brightness and seating distance/viewable weave threshold. It seems like a great product!thanks



From a side by side comparison with the xd material it appears that I can no longer see the weave at 7 feet but still have that feeling something is there until I move to 10 feet away at which point it's extremely smooth. The xd is at 10 feet when I started not to see the weave but about 12 feet when complete feeling of smoothness.


When watching stills of colorful images the falcon appears to have richer colors n higher contrast but when watching movies it seems like the xd is brighter. It's still a difficult call for me.... need to do more testing... btw I was using the sony hw50


----------



## audioguy

I have a question:


Background: I have ordered a Sony 600ES to replace my JVC RS55. My concern is that I am going to lose most of the increased brightness I have paid for by using an AT screen. I purchased an XD based upon the recommendations of another user but just learned about this product. Both screens (that for the JVC and for the Sony) are 120 x 51. I know that Stewart sells a higher gain screen but my bet is that it would be 5 times what I paid for my XD.


My JVC screen was the Stewart StudioTec 1.3 gain screen and while the XD claims a gain of 1.2, Mike Garrett of AVS says it is measured at less than 1, ---- which translates, if you do the math, to only a 10% increase in brightness of the Sony over the JVC. BAD investment.


What is the independently measured (not advertised) gain of the Falcon screen?? At least according to one observer who compared the XD side by side to the Falcon screen, the XD was a bit brighter. I have little concern over visible weave as I will be about 14 feet from the screen.


----------



## BrolicBeast




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *AV Science Sales 5*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/30#post_23925223
> 
> 
> AV Science is now a Falcon screen dealer. Rich, it was nice meeting you at CEDIA and welcome to the fold.



Awesome!!!!


----------



## BuckeyeAmps

Can I get input from those who have either purchased or seen a Falcon Screen in person? I am upgrading my Da-Lite 133" Cinema Vision screen to an AT screen (similar size, 133") and was informed of Falcon Screens. They look like a fantastic solution and I am near to pulling the trigger....but I wouldn't be doing my due diligence if I didn't ask for any and all opinions.


I have two rows of seats, my closest row being about 12' from the screen. Just wondering how the Falcon Screen will compare to some of the more reviewed/used AT screens, especially the "4k" AT screens.


Thanks!


----------



## hifiaudio2

I compared it to my EN4k screen in post about 8 or 9 posts back of this thread.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *BigCoolJesus*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24081470
> 
> 
> Can I get input from those who have either purchased or seen a Falcon Screen in person? I am upgrading my Da-Lite 133" Cinema Vision screen to an AT screen (similar size, 133") and was informed of Falcon Screens. They look like a fantastic solution and I am near to pulling the trigger....but I wouldn't be doing my due diligence if I didn't ask for any and all opinions.
> 
> 
> I have two rows of seats, my closest row being about 12' from the screen. Just wondering how the Falcon Screen will compare to some of the more reviewed/used AT screens, especially the "4k" AT screens.
> 
> 
> Thanks!



I just ordered my 120" screen from Rich and Falcon screens, I'm pretty excited about it and I'll definitely give some impression when I get it and put it up. I also have a good size 2'x2' piece of XD screen material and the Enlightor 4k material that I can compare it with.


----------



## shantoubana


The sample was cut on an angle so you will not need to tilt it. you should not be seeing any color shift it is Acoustically Transparent material so not only does the sound travel through it, you also get some light passing through so you may be seeing the light reflecting off your vinyl material.


----------



## rtarver

Jbrown15,


Any update on your install and your impression? I'm about to buy pj and screen myself. Talked myself into the jvc 46 and wonder about the ability to calibrate on this screen. It's about half the cost of an en4k, but appears to have a little lower spectral performance.


Russ


----------



## hifiaudio2

What does lower spectral performance mean?


----------



## rtarver

Guess that was my version of 'not quite as neutral' as an en4k. But that's my conclusion from reading every review I can find of the two. It's a moot point for me, since I'm trying to decide between the falcon and XD now. Ruled out the EN4K for budget reasons. Both frames appear to be of similar design and strength. And 'super black', 'infinite black', 'black hole black', etc are probably all pretty darn close when they're all made of velvet.


I think I have enough projector output, so gain being the same I would go for the most neutral screen. My eyes are much better than my ears these days.


Russ


----------



## Skylinestar

Can anyone post photos of how the screen material is attached to the frame?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Skylinestar*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24213065
> 
> 
> Can anyone post photos of how the screen material is attached to the frame?



here is a pic of one being installed by bigmouthinva in one of his theater builds

 



also the full install of one of our screens.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1464536/beam-and-pole-interruptus-not-bigmouthindc-and-nygiantsfan23-launch-the-rawlinsway-theater/300#post_23433355


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DavidK442*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24213550
> 
> 
> XD has a very noticeable weave. I personally wouldn't use it unless your closest viewing distance is 11 to 12 feet. From my 9.5' viewing distance it is completely unwatchable for me.
> 
> I do not have a sample of the Falcon material but from close up pictures it appears to be considerably better in this regard.
> 
> The biggest draw to XD seems to be from the DIY crowd because the fabric is available by itself.
> 
> Like most screens, I believe the new Falcon material only come packaged with a frame.



Actually we will supply to DIY upon request


David if you would like a sample of the Falcon fabric send me pm i will be happy to send you out a sample


Thanks

Rich


----------



## hifiaudio2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *rtarver*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/50_50#post_24212766
> 
> 
> Guess that was my version of 'not quite as neutral' as an en4k. But that's my conclusion from reading every review I can find of the two. It's a moot point for me, since I'm trying to decide between the falcon and XD now. Ruled out the EN4K for budget reasons. Both frames appear to be of similar design and strength. And 'super black', 'infinite black', 'black hole black', etc are probably all pretty darn close when they're all made of velvet.
> 
> 
> I think I have enough projector output, so gain being the same I would go for the most neutral screen. My eyes are much better than my ears these days.
> 
> 
> Russ



Well since I had huge screens (161" wide, scope) of both materials I can definitely say that the install of the Falcon was many times easier than the En4k. I did not care for the "friction fit" method of the En4k at all. Just the act of picking up the screen to put it into my aperture opening would cause the material to come loose and I would have to start over pushing the material back into the grooves. Both the grommet install method (which is also used by the XD screen) and the very nice corner brackets on the Falcon made install much easier.


Unless I just had tons of lumens to spare (which means your screen isn't large enough







), I would not choose En4k over Falcon. Yes the En4k is a bit smoother of a fabric, but the Falcon disappears as much as it needs to, and MUCH better than XD.


FYI my projector is the Sony 1000ES 4k unit, so if someone is wondering if the Falcon is "4k ready", it is. That is mostly marketing jargon for a screen, anyway, but just in case....


----------



## rtarver

Thanks for the impressions between the two. Skipping over AT properties and weave concerns with distance, do you have an impression on color accuracy between XD and Falcon?


My primary sitting distance is about 13', so I'm not too worried about weave, but would prefer to have a finer weave if budget allows.


Russ


----------



## hifiaudio2

The only way to say which is truly more neutral would be to measure both with a known good meter like a Jeti at minimum. The En4k has a slightly "grayer" look to the fabric, while the Falcon looks slightly warmer in color temperature than the XD does. I have no idea which is most accurate. None have any shift in color across the screen or from an angle, so that is what would cause the most harm.


Any could be calibrated with proper tools with a meter facing the screen so that it wouldn't really matter.


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/0_100#post_24213703
> 
> *Actually we will supply to DIY upon request*
> 
> 
> David if you would like a sample of the Falcon fabric send me pm i will be happy to send you out a sample
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rich



Nice!!!


----------



## rtarver

Hifiaudio2,


For calibration, would it be necessary to have a projector with a CMS or not? My plan is for the JVC DLA-46, which does not have a full CMS. Getting down to the wire on ordering and my learning curve is still steep.


Russ


----------



## hifiaudio2

It really all depends on how far you want to take it. It can really be a rabbit hole, too....


There are just so many levels of deciding how "perfect" you want things to be.


If your room is light controlled and you have neutral walls, and you want to be absolutely certain you are seeing the image as close as possible to the director's intent, you would want a meter, software, and a projector with a CMS at a minimum. Now, keep in mind, you can get a Lumagen mini for around $1100 that adds controls that are better than basically any projector. So you could buy that JVC and add a Lumagen, a meter, and Calman / Chromapure software and get "automated" calibration of both grayscale and color.


Now, the meter you buy also makes a difference. You can get Chromapure or Calman and a Colorimeter in the $500 - $600 range, or step up to an "entry level" Spectroradiometer like the i1Pro for around $900 for the meter plus software, I believe. Then there are more accurate meters above that that go for 8-10k, and then into the 35k range and above!. See what I mean about what level of "perfect" you want?


Of course for a few hundred you can just hire someone to calibrate for you. I would probably not pay just to have someone fix my grayscale, though. If you get a projector with a CMS or an outboard Lumagen then that makes more sense.


So like I said, it all depends!


Unless you are REALLY into this hobby, and assuming you are on a reasonable budget that the DLA-46 projector choice suggests, I would just calibrate the grayscale with something like this , and be happy. Assuming you are calibrating with the meter facing the screen, this would also eliminate any visible color shifting a screen could impart on the image and bring it back close to neutral. And if you ever get a projector with a CMS or buy a Lumagen, you can take the calibration further with the same hardware / software you just bought.


----------



## rtarver

Thanks Hifi,


That's the only thing that concerns me about the JVC projector; limited color control. You're pretty much stuck with their 3 options if I understand things correctly. Unless of course I decide to buy an external color processor.


Russ


----------



## hifiaudio2

I think you can at least get into a service menu and do a two point Grayscale correction. But I could be wrong... I haven't looked at the JVCs in a while.


----------



## RapalloAV

I really wish we could buy an AT fabric from someone with a higher gain closer to 1.3 (true measurement) for those of us with large screens 145" diag. or more.


----------



## BuckeyeAmps

Hey guys,


Received my screen today, delivered by FedEx Freight. Let me say this, Rich ensures there is no possibility of damage AT ALL










Still waiting on the new projector, so I can't give picture impressions but so far this screen gets an A+ for EVERY category. Construction, quality, directions, easy assembly. Cannot wait to get my projector and start watching movies again with this new setup!


----------



## damelon

I've had snickers over to my house a few times now.. the first time was just before he started his screen company, the last two were after. I have an SMX screen... in fact one of the last ones purchased here on AVS before the company started going belly-up. Anyway, Snickers hasn't brought material over to do a side-by-side but he seems to swear that the fabric he uses is similar if not the same as the one that Ruben/Sandman used for SMX. It would be interesting to find out, that is for sure.


At the same time, I've been to his place and have seen his screen and it looked great. I know he wants to upgrade his frame to using more of a black-black velvet, which I'm sure will be a future change for him. I also like the grommet installation of the material to the frame much better than the weird rubber friction connectors SMX used.


I'm glad to see you are getting re-sold through AVS!!! Congrats!


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *damelon*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/0_100#post_24225003
> 
> 
> I've had snickers over to my house a few times now.. the first time was just before he started his screen company, the last two were after. I have an SMX screen... in fact one of the last ones purchased here on AVS before the company started going belly-up. Anyway, Snickers hasn't brought material over to do a side-by-side but he seems to swear that the fabric he uses is similar if not the same as the one that Ruben/Sandman used for SMX. It would be interesting to find out, that is for sure.
> 
> 
> At the same time, I've been to his place and have seen his screen and it looked great. *I know he wants to upgrade his frame to using more of a black-black velvet*, which I'm sure will be a future change for him. I also like the grommet installation of the material to the frame much better than the weird rubber friction connectors SMX used.
> 
> 
> I'm glad to see you are getting re-sold through AVS!!! Congrats!



Whaaa? I can't imagine the velvet getting any better or darker that it currently is?!?


----------



## damelon




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *popalock*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24225125
> 
> 
> Whaaa? I can't imagine the velvet getting any better or darker that it currently is?!?



The two samples he did show me, one was a deeper black than the other. I just thought it was cool that he was so picky about it and was already looking for ways to improve his product.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *damelon*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24225175
> 
> 
> The two samples he did show me, one was a deeper black than the other. I just thought it was cool that he was so picky about it and was already looking for ways to improve his product.



what we currently use is extremly black but yes i am always looking to grow and improve i would not say changeing from the current material to a different velvet would be considered an actual imporvement to what we currently use

both materials are extremly black, the trades off are what we currently use seams be more durable less suspectiable to crush marks and does not leave any fuzz behind. Also when testing the other velvet material i did notice if you look at

it at certain angle you can see a tiny and mean tiny bit of the frame through it. this would probably not be a big deal because i can't imagine anyone ever flipping there screen around at weird angles but it was just something i observed.

I am very happy with what is currently used.. but seeing i was at the bacon race Theater and had helped with rehanging the screen after he had placed his new subs i took the opurtunity to check the SMX screen.


The material is from the naked eye is similar so i used my trusty zoom app on the iphone and zoomied to take pic of the weave pattern then later did the same on my screen and they where very different. both very smooth tight weaves but the Falcon material is defiantly different.


----------



## damelon




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24225534
> 
> 
> The material is from the naked eye is similar so i used my trusty zoom app on the iphone and zoomied to take pic of the weave pattern then later did the same on my screen and they where very different. both very smooth tight weaves but the Falcon material is defiantly different.



Ah, good to know. Gotta love digital technology!


----------



## RapalloAV




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DavidK442*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24217361
> 
> 
> Unfortunately "Highly reflective transparency" is an oxymoron...currently.



Would you like to explain.


When I mention a higher gain AT fabric, I'm only talking about a TRUE 1.3 gain.


----------



## coolgeek




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *RapalloAV*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24226787
> 
> 
> Would you like to explain.
> 
> 
> When I mention a higher gain AT fabric, I'm only talking about a TRUE 1.3 gain.



I have yet to see a true 1.0 gain.. I would indeed be great if there's a 1.3 gain out there...


----------



## hifiaudio2

Well you can always get a Stewart microperf Studiotek for a true ~1.2 gain for only $7k - 10k.


----------



## RapalloAV




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *coolgeek*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24227883
> 
> 
> I have yet to see a true 1.0 gain.. I would indeed be great if there's a 1.3 gain out there...



Yes very true, looks like all the screen manufacturers lie with the ratings of gain. They always up the gain when they are actually lower than specified!


----------



## RapalloAV




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24227892
> 
> 
> Well you can always get a Stewart microperf Studiotek for a true ~1.2 gain for only $7k - 10k.



Who wants micro perf these days?


----------



## hifiaudio2

Still popular and have some advantages. Still specified by many top designers. If cost were reasonable I would have gone microperf. But cost is nowhere near reasonable.


----------



## RapalloAV




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24228069
> 
> 
> Still popular and have some advantages. Still specified by many top designers. If cost were reasonable I would have gone microperf. But cost is nowhere near reasonable.



Micro per4f is no good if you want to sit close.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Yes that's true. I already sit less than a screen width away and am still over 12 feet back. Perf would work great for me. It's the value, though. Anyway, I have the Falcon and am very happy.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DavidK442*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/60#post_24213550
> 
> 
> XD has a very noticeable weave. I personally wouldn't use it unless your closest viewing distance is 11 to 12 feet. From my 9.5' viewing distance it is completely unwatchable for me.
> 
> I do not have a sample of the Falcon material but from close up pictures it appears to be considerably better in this regard.
> 
> The biggest draw to XD seems to be from the DIY crowd because the fabric is available by itself.
> 
> Like most screens, I believe the new Falcon material only comes packaged with a frame.



I picked up my screen yesterday and finally got it installed. I can say this when comparing it to the 2'x2' sample that I have of the XD material; I personally think that the XD material has a "finer" weave in the material of the Falcon screen material, but I don't think that's a good thing. Because for some reason the pattern from the weave is MUCH easier for me to see from a distance of 6ft. I would have guessed that because looking at both materials within 6" the XD's weave is finer that it should be the one that would be harder to see when you're only a few feet away.


But its just the opposite, I can see the weave from the XD material about 9ft. I have to be within 6ft to see the weave on the Falcon screen, 3ft might not seem like that much to some but too me its a BIG deal and I'm so happy I went with the Falcon screen over the XD screen material.


Add to the fact that the Falcon screen are cheaper then the SeymourAV screens with XD material I honestly think Falcon screens should be a no brainer to people considering an AT screen. When I get a little time I'll write up a little mini review along with a bunch of pictures that I've taken.


Oh and the corner quick connect fasteners that Rich provides with the Falcon screens are *AWESOME* and make assembling the frame a breeze!


----------



## COACH2369

Just curious.... How close are you guys sitting from your screens?


I am looking very closely at these screens and trying to decide if going AT is feasible in my system...


----------



## jjcook

I am currently viewing from about 8 feet (eyes-to-screen) from my 100" wide scope Falcon screen and do not detect any weave unless I'm looking for it in bright white scenes like snow; in general for brighter image areas I detect/interpret the holes in the weave as a slight darkening/muddying of solid color areas. At ~9 feet this effect mostly disappears for me (which is my intended viewing distance once the room is completed so not a problem). The weave pattern performance at this distance is much better than what my Seymour XD sample gives.


Overall I am very satisfied with the screen performance and build quality given my viewing distance constraint of max 9 feet. This is my first projector (JVC RS4910) and screen so I may not be experienced enough to be more picky about the right things, but I am critical of the image and again am completely satisfied.


Thanks to Rich for providing an affordable close viewing distance AT material and great and easy to assemble frame!


Jeff


----------



## COACH2369

Currently I am sitting about 9 feet from a 115" 2:35 screen, which I think is perfect in size.


If I go AT, then I am going to lose at least a foot, probably more.. Not sure how much farther I can push my first row back due to the surround placement either.


Might just have to stick with my current setup until I can overhaul the room since going smaller wouldn't be the best choice..


----------



## jjcook




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *COACH2369*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24277750
> 
> 
> Currently I am sitting about 9 feet from a 115" 2:35 screen, which I think is perfect in size.
> 
> 
> If I go AT, then I am going to lose at least a foot, probably more.. Not sure how much farther I can push my first row back due to the surround placement either.
> 
> 
> Might just have to stick with my current setup until I can overhaul the room since going smaller wouldn't be the best choice..



As far as viewing angle, for me I have found that for my 100" wide scope screen that the 9 foot viewing distance (50 degree FOV) is more comfortable than at 8 feet (55 degree FOV). Again I'm new to such a large image and the FOV difference is subtle but I feel more anchored to reality in my dark room during image pans (and thus less motion disorientation) with the narrower FOV.


----------



## COACH2369

Here is what I am thinking might be what I could do..


Since I will lose a foot to a foot and half, I could go with with a smaller screen. This might still seem "big enough" to me since I will be closer.


My second concern would be the placement of my speakers behind that screen....I don't want to take a step down on the audio side of things.


----------



## hifiaudio2

My eye are 12'4" away from a 161" wide scope screen. I love it and never feel too close.


My wife and guests love it, too. But everyone is different...


----------



## COACH2369




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24278834
> 
> 
> My eye are 12'4" away from a 161" wide scope screen. I love it and never feel too close.
> 
> 
> My wife and guests love it, too. But everyone is different...



AT screen?


Dang... That is a large screen either way.


What is the diagonal on it?


----------



## hifiaudio2

Yep its a Falcon. I think its something around 178" if you are looking for the diagonal size of a 2:40:1 scope image.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24279211
> 
> 
> Yep its a Falcon. I think its something around 178" if you are looking for the diagonal size of a 2:40:1 scope image.



this was not a big screen it was huge, i remember test fiitting this screen and thinking dang i was my personal room was bigger, glad you and your family are enjoying it!!!


----------



## COACH2369

Wow...so from a ratio standpoint,I might be able to go with something bigger than I have.


Do you see the material at all?


----------



## hifiaudio2

I do not see that material at all when watching video. I have to have the room lights on, and then really the lights that are directly above the screen, to really notice it. I was bothered by the XD material from the back of my room (25 ft), so this material is MUCH less apparent than the XD. I had the En4k material on a screen this size and sold it and bought the Falcon for the added gain (and came out a bit ahead financially on that exchange as well).


I have a few posts in this thread going into a bit more detail.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Coach you are in Knoxville? I am in Nashville. You are welcome to come check it out. I am sure Rich will send me some free masking panels when he makes them for being his TN demo room!


----------



## COACH2369

That is great to hear about the screen... I have browsed this thread and seems like all positive things about Falcon.


I am going to contact the main guy and ask his opinion on it too.


----------



## jbrown15

I went from a 112" diagonal 16:9 sitting at 13ft away to a 120" diagonal 16:9 at 11ft, and my wife and myself LOVE the bigger closer image. It did take a little to get use too, and I had to move my projector back a little. But it's awesome. And I feel the same as jjcook about the screen weave. From the large 2'x2' sample that I had on the SeymourAV XD material; I had to be 10-11ft away before I couldn't really see the weave anymore. With the Falcon screen material the weave disappears around 6ft.


I'm so happy that I switched to an AT screen, it just adds to the feel of a true home theater in my basement.


----------



## COACH2369

Had a chance to demo a Falcon Screen today at Hifiaudio2's house. All I can say is that is one LARGE screen....but very clear and didn't seem too big at all.


His room is amazing to begin with, but the screen was VERY impressive and I was ready to order one today when I left.


I just have some more homework to do to determine if my current projector can handle a larger size from the its current location. If it can, then I am hoping I can work the rest out.


My experiences with AT screens, prior to this demo, were very minimal.....but I was able to compare his screen to some samples of other screens and the Falcon shined over all the others!


----------



## jbrown15

Which projector do you have Coach?


----------



## COACH2369

I have a JVC RS-56


----------



## jbrown15

How big of a screen are you trying to go with?


----------



## COACH2369




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24311941
> 
> 
> How big of a screen are you trying to go with?



Rich recommended the 120" wide, 125" diagonal, 2:35.


Currently I have a 115" diagonal screen. My first row is 9 feet back from the screen. When I recline in my usual spot, I gain another 18 inches in distance.


The other "X Factor" is how close I can get the speakers to the wall. They measure about 14" in depth...


----------



## hifiaudio2

Don't forget to check out the site I mentioned about the baffle wall. Acousticfrontiers.com


----------



## COACH2369




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24312029
> 
> 
> Don't forget to check out the site I mentioned about the baffle wall. Acousticfrontiers.com



Will do..


Thanks again for allowing me to come over for a demo.


----------



## jbrown15

I think that might be pushing it a little but its hard for me to really say because I have a 16:9 screen. Mine is 120" diagonal and personally I wouldn't go any larger, I have a light controlled run and I think the size I went with is starting to push it a little as far as brightness goes. Of course keep in mind I do have 986hrs on the bulb of my RS45.


Right now it's plenty bright enough in normal mode for watching movies, and like this past Sunday when we had people over for Super Bowl I kicked it into high mode while we had some ambient lighting on.


----------



## COACH2369

I still have to determine the exact location of the screen. I could go smaller than 120 and the combination of the screen being closer along with the slight jump in size, might be impactful enough....


----------



## jjcook




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjcook*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24277952
> 
> 
> As far as viewing angle, for me I have found that for my 100" wide scope screen that the 9 foot viewing distance (50 degree FOV) is more comfortable than at 8 feet (55 degree FOV). Again I'm new to such a large image and the FOV difference is subtle but I feel more anchored to reality in my dark room during image pans (and thus less motion disorientation) with the narrower FOV.



Just watched the Dark Knight Rises tonight using the zoom method not a-lens. Although the spill over during IMAX scenes was annoying I loved the immersion; since the scene framing kept the spill as peripheral content only it worked well for me and didn't feel too big. I'll have to try out traditional 16:9 content at this size and see if it's not too big after all; the bug to upgrade the screen size and to add a four way masking system may be in my not too distant future!


----------



## ellisr63

PM'd


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjcook*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/90#post_24323515
> 
> 
> Just watched the Dark Knight Rises tonight using the zoom method not a-lens. Although the spill over during IMAX scenes was annoying I loved the immersion; since the scene framing kept the spill as peripheral content only it worked well for me and didn't feel too big. I'll have to try out traditional 16:9 content at this size and see if it's not too big after all; the bug to upgrade the screen size and to add a four way masking system may be in my not too distant future!



I'm at an 10' viewing distance. 100" wide (horizontal) 2.35:1 is the smallest I can go before I start saying "hey, that's not a real movie size!" to myself. I have gone as wide as 120" (again horizontal 2.35:1) and that's awesome, imo, but bad sources are unwatchable at that size.


But I do NOT have a woven screen, yet. Falcon has a sample in the mail to me, as do a couple other manufacturers, and I'll be making a selection next week (and plan to go 120" wide) -- and if I can sell my Stewart screen and frame, I'll be buying a whole new package. If I cannot sell the Stewart, I'll be getting just fabric, and need to figure out how to retrofit it to the Stewart frame.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24325009
> 
> 
> I'm at an 10' viewing distance. 100" wide (horizontal) 2.35:1 is the smallest I can go before I start saying "hey, that's not a real movie size!" to myself. I have gone as wide as 120" (again horizontal 2.35:1) and that's awesome, imo, but bad sources are unwatchable at that size.
> 
> 
> But I do NOT have a woven screen, yet. Falcon has a sample in the mail to me, as do a couple other manufacturers, and I'll be making a selection next week (and plan to go 120" wide) -- and if I can sell my Stewart screen and frame, I'll be buying a whole new package. If I cannot sell the Stewart, I'll be getting just fabric, and need to figure out how to retrofit it to the Stewart frame.



That is pretty close to my setup i think 120" is the prefect size from that seating distance.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24326427
> 
> 
> That is pretty close to my setup i think 120" is the prefect size from that seating distance.



Cool, and I assume you are using your own screen, and don't see distracting patterns










What kind of projector are you using? What's its calibrated light output in your setting? Black hole kind of room? (Okay maybe I should read your build thread!)


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24326859
> 
> 
> Cool, and I assume you are using your own screen, and don't see distracting patterns
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What kind of projector are you using? What's its calibrated light output in your setting? Black hole kind of room? (Okay maybe I should read your build thread!)



LOL ... yes the first prototype screen, panny AE8000 and Very dark room, I have not had the Panny Calorbrated but is in normal mode or eco mode what ever they call it.

I like the panny it is a light cannon


I have seen the Runco/ planner in BigmoouthinDC's theater and i love that projector when i decide to upgrade it will be a Runco and a Anamorphic lens for sure. $$$$$$


----------



## archiguy

Rich - As I'm getting a 'scope screen (110" wide), and have an A-lens, I need side masking panels for 16:9 content, preferably magnetic so I can quickly and easily "stick" them on and off. Are you making those to go with your screen yet? I'm weighing your screen against an EN4k right now and I know they make reasonably priced masking panels.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24333280
> 
> 
> Rich - As I'm getting a 'scope screen (110" wide), and have an A-lens, I need side masking panels for 16:9 content, preferably magnetic so I can quickly and easily "stick" them on and off. Are you making those to go with your screen yet? I'm weighing your screen against an EN4k right now and I know they make reasonably priced masking panels.



PM sent


Thank you

Rich


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24333280
> 
> 
> Rich - As I'm getting a 'scope screen (110" wide), and have an A-lens, I need side masking panels for 16:9 content, preferably magnetic so I can quickly and easily "stick" them on and off. Are you making those to go with your screen yet? I'm weighing your screen against an EN4k right now and I know they make reasonably priced masking panels.



Its a shame their 4K screens aren't more reasonably priced like you say their masking panels are!...lol


I've had my Falcon screen up and running for a few weeks now and LOVE it, I'm grabbing some masking panels as soon as Rich has them available.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24333280
> 
> 
> Rich - As I'm getting a 'scope screen (110" wide), and have an A-lens, I need side masking panels for 16:9 content, preferably magnetic so I can quickly and easily "stick" them on and off. Are you making those to go with your screen yet? I'm weighing your screen against an EN4k right now and I know they make reasonably priced masking panels.



Please let us know what your solution ends up being. I was curious about the EN4k screens until I learned they were more than twice the price of the Falcon, and lower gain.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24334798
> 
> 
> Please let us know what your solution ends up being. I was curious about the EN4k screens until I learned they were more than twice the price of the Falcon, and lower gain.



I personally feel the Falcon screen material is an excellent compromise between the EN4k and XD materials from SeymourAV. The weave is far less noticeable in my option then the XD material while still as bright. Yet miles ahead of the EN4k material as far as brightness goes.


Now I will say that I haven't compared all three at the same time as far as full screens, but I did have two 2'x2' pieces of the XD and EN4K screen materials.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24335115
> 
> 
> I personally feel the Falcon screen material is an excellent compromise between the EN4k and XD materials from SeymourAV. The weave is far less noticeable in my option then the XD material while still as bright. Yet miles ahead of the EN4k material as far as brightness goes.
> 
> 
> Now I will say that I haven't compared all three at the same time as far as full screens, but I did have two 2'x2' pieces of the XD and EN4K screen materials.



I feel like I am following you down the same path, getting those three screen sample and a few more. I would not be surprised if my conclusion is the same!


----------



## hifiaudio2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/100_50#post_24335115
> 
> 
> I personally feel the Falcon screen material is an excellent compromise between the EN4k and XD materials from SeymourAV. The weave is far less noticeable in my option then the XD material while still as bright. Yet miles ahead of the EN4k material as far as brightness goes.



My thoughts exactly.


----------



## nathan_h

Just got the sample today. I gotta say I'm impressed by that fact alone. Requested samples from Screen Innovations, Seymour, Falcon. Falcon is here, SI confirmed shipment, not sure about Seymour.


Of course, nothing will match Stewart's approach. First room I did about ten years ago, I request samples from them..... and three months later I get a big tube in the mail. I learned later they waited until they had the right scraps before sending it out. Plus side: The samples were a couple feet in size. Down side: The Da-lite samples arrived in weeks, rather than months, so it was strange.


----------



## archiguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24334798
> 
> 
> Please let us know what your solution ends up being. I was curious about the EN4k screens until I learned they were more than twice the price of the Falcon, and lower gain.



I am probably going with the Falcon screen. I've got a JVC 4810 projector, which isn't the world's brightest or most powerful - that's not what I got it for; otherwise I'd have gotten the Sony - but throws out a pretty nice picture with great contrast according to its acolytes. And I didn't want to suspend it in mid-air on a pole in front and above the second row of seats, which would mean I would have to mount it higher, which would mean it would be projecting "down" creating more distortion on the screen. Instead, I've got it in a closet directly behind the second row of seats (viewing distance *15.5'*) with the top of the projector even with the top of the screen, resulting in little vertical distortion for which to compensate.


As a result (because there are always tradeoffs), my throw distance is a relatively long *17.5'*. That's getting toward the maximum throw this projector is capable of without having to go to high lamp power which would result in more noise and less lamp life. Tradeoffs.


Ergo, I need an AT screen with higher gain than the EN4k to give me the "pop" I want from the projected image. I didn't see an affordable alternative - which made me sad - until Rich came through with the Falcon screen. So, in spite of the fact that it's not as smooth as the EN4k, that's where I'm going. My front row of seats is *9.5'* from the screen, and that should be far enough away for the weave pattern to "disappear". I don't anticipate any loss in image sharpness either, but admittedly, I won't really know. What I _do_ know is, based on relative gain, the image should be brighter. And that's important to me.


And, like jbrown, I'll also be waiting on Rich's masking panels. He promises they'll be more affordable than Seymore's as well. I love this guy!


I'll be starting my theater build thread in a few days. Check out _The RiverRat Theater™_, coming soon to a theater build forum near you!


----------



## zebracatzebra

For the next upgrade to my home theater I'm interested in a new projector (possibly Panasonic PT-AE8000U) and an acoustically transparent scope screen. I came across Falcon screens after reading about the beautiful Rawlinsway Theater and like what I've read about them so far. What do you guys think about this.... I currently sit 12 feet from a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen and am interested in the Falcon 110" wide 2.35:1 screen which is roughly the same height as my current screen, but almost 2 feet wider. My concern is my room is 120" wide and that screen would be 117", is that too close to the walls (for reason of both installation and performance)? Would I have better success with the 105" wide screen which would be 112" wide? Thanks in advance.


----------



## hifiaudio2

No problem on the performance.. .I would have something black and absorbing on the side walls though for that immediate light reflection .. looks like your treatments could server double duty.. although they look maroon, is that correct? I would prefer black by the screen to avoid perceptual coloration, but that is a minor issue.


How are you mounting the screen in front of the speakers?


How close would your seating be to the screen after that mounting?


----------



## zebracatzebra

Thanks for the tip. The wall treatments are dark gray but I wouldn't be opposed to going with something darker there if it would help. I plan on building a screen wall 2 feet from the wall. I would move the riser forward too and build some stands to put the speakers on behind the screen along with the sub. I have about 1-2 feet of play to move the seating back, so the first row would be at 10-11 feet from the screen.


----------



## hifiaudio2

That all sounds fine. And dark gray is fine, too. Just don't want a real color if avoidable.


I dont know the characteristics of those speakers, but many sound best a few feet off of the front wall, like it appears you have now. I would try to not move them back to the wall too much. This is possibly less of an issue if your entertainment leans more toward multichannel movies than 2 channel music. Not a huge issue either way, though. I am a fan of going as large with the screen as you are comfortable with and have a PJ that can light up, so I say go for it. cut a sheet or posterboard the size of the screen and put it up in front of your speakers to see how it feels.


----------



## pocoloco

You can get a Carada screen + frame and retro-fit a seymour AV AT screen for cheaper than this. That's what I did. If you can get carada to sell you just the frame without the material, it'd be even cheaper.


----------



## snickers1

Falcon also offers DIY material..... please pm me if interested in going that route.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pocoloco*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24442879
> 
> 
> You can get a Carada screen + frame and retro-fit a seymour AV AT screen for cheaper than this. That's what I did. If you can get carada to sell you just the frame without the material, it'd be even cheaper.



Or retrofit a Falcon screen, if you prefer their material.


What's the difference?


Falcon: not quite as bright, but more discrete weave. Good close up.


Seymour XD may be better for larger screens at more of a distance where you need gain and don't mind more weave since you are farther away, anyway.


But really it's worth trying both, and your choice of projector will matter more than anything else when it comes to what brightness you can generate.


----------



## pocoloco

Yes most definitely. I see Falcon as an all in one solution for a great frame and AT fabric, but you are paying for that convenience.


----------



## pocoloco

The biggest thing that stuck out about Falcon for me was the quality of the frame, it's very Carada like, hence why I brought it up. Any screen material can be fit onto any screen so the choice of material is very application specific. I didn't mean to come across as Seymour AV fabric is better than Falcon.


----------



## jbrown15

I have a large sample of the XD material (2'x2') and now own a Falcon screen. I honestly can't see any difference in brightness between the two, but I can tell you the the Falcon screen's weave is quite a bit less noticeable compared to the XD material.


----------



## hifiaudio2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/100_50#post_24443124
> 
> 
> I have a large sample of the XD material (2'x2') and now own a Falcon screen. I honestly can't see any difference in brightness between the two, but I can tell you the the Falcon screen's weave is quite a bit less noticeable compared to the XD material.



Same for me... have a Falcon screen and 2' x 2' XD sample.. same brightness, much less weave on Falcon.


----------



## zebracatzebra

Has anyone ever done a comparison with the Elite screens AcousticPro 1080P2 screen material (for example on model ER115WH1W-A1080P2)? I'm curious how it compares given its price is less than 50% of the competitors..


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *zebracatzebra*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24444097
> 
> 
> Has anyone ever done a comparison with the Elite screens AcousticPro 1080P2 screen material (for example on model ER115WH1W-A1080P2)? I'm curious how it compares given its price is less than 50% of the competitors..



Not cheaper than Falcon material (and this is not the place to talk about prices of the competition).


In terms of performance, here is a independent third party report. I have compared the Falcon, SR, both main Seymours. Based on that, the AcousticPro measures low (similar to EN4K, which is quite visibly lower gain than XD and Falcon).

http://www.accucalhd.com/documents/accucal_front_projection_screen_report.pdf 


Hopefully, when Jeff updates his survey, he will have a sample of the Falcon material. Based on seeing it, along with several he has evaluated, I predict:


1. the weave will be considered less visible than everything other than the EN4k

2. the gain will be similar but slightly lower than XD (which makes it much brighter than EN4k, and AcousticPro, etc)


----------



## snickers1

I am to happy announce the new Falcon Masking panels!!! Currently they are available for converting our 2:35 format screeens to 16:9. We are still working on masking panels for converting our 16:9 format screens to 2:35.


More to come!!!!


----------



## hifiaudio2

Great! PM me a price for some for my screen.


----------



## Wahoo_envy

Great news with the masking panels! Let me know how much for my 130 scope.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Wahoo_envy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24491261
> 
> 
> Great news with the masking panels! Let me know how much for my 130 scope.



but if you get these all work will stop again won't it ..







... will send you a pm later this week, your only an hour from me so we will work out something for ya.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24491325
> 
> 
> but if you get these all work will stop again won't it ..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ... will send you a pm later this week, your only an hour from me so we will work out something for ya.



I wish I only lived an hour from you!..lol


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24491391
> 
> 
> I wish I only lived an hour from you!..lol



oh your just a hope skip and a jump away


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24491397
> 
> 
> oh your just a hope skip and a jump away



LOL..maybe if you owned a 737..


----------



## jjcook




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/120#post_24491080
> 
> 
> I am to happy announce the new Falcon Masking panels!!! Currently they are available for converting our 2:35 format screeens to 16:9.



Impatiently waiting for more information and availability


----------



## jjcook




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjcook*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24492280
> 
> 
> Impatiently waiting for more information and availability



I now see info on the website for the panels and pricing. Nice!


----------



## popalock




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/100_100#post_24491080
> 
> 
> I am to happy announce the new Falcon Masking panels!!! Currently they are available for converting our 2:35 format screeens to 16:9. We are still working on masking panels for converting our 16:9 format screens to 2:35.
> 
> 
> More to come!!!!



Looking good buddy!


Are the masking panels acoustically transparent?


Hook us up with some more details pics man. How do they attach, etc...?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *popalock*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24494755
> 
> 
> Looking good buddy!
> 
> 
> Are the masking panels acoustically transparent?
> 
> 
> Hook us up with some more details pics man. How do they attach, etc...?




Thanks


Yes there accoustically transparent


They are made from a alumnium extrusion, you know how i am about making these strong









There is tabs onthe bottom that help with getting the proper alignment , then held in place on mostly friction and a couple magnets.


the ones for the 16:9 screens will be a little different, i may have to pay you visit for testing a 16:9 screen and getting a customers feed back and take.


i know it took a while with getting these into production but i went throught about 5 different designs and they all worked but i am just picky and wanted to make sure

they held up to same standards as our screens do. they had to be strong , they had be easy to use,and they had to look slick


----------



## Wahoo_envy

I took everything out of the room and progress is still at a snails pace. I have bought a new processor, UMIK-1, subs, amp and I have yet to use them. Good news is I'm ready to paint. So no hurry yet on the panels--probably a month out.


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Wahoo_envy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24496639
> 
> 
> I took everything out of the room and progress is still at a snails pace. I have bought a new processor, UMIK-1, subs, amp and I have yet to use them. Good news is I'm ready to paint. So no hurry yet on the panels--probably a month out.



can't wait to see the finished product


----------



## Glenn Baumann




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24494868
> 
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> Yes there accoustically transparent
> 
> 
> They are made from a alumnium extrusion, you know how i am about making these strong
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is tabs onthe bottom that help with getting the proper alignment , then held in place on mostly friction and a couple magnets.
> 
> 
> the ones for the 16:9 screens will be a little different, i may have to pay you visit for testing a 16:9 screen and getting a customers feed back and take.
> 
> 
> i know it took a while with getting these into production but i went throught about 5 different designs and they all worked but i am just picky and wanted to make sure
> 
> they held up to same standards as our screens do. they had to be strong , they had be easy to use,and they had to look slick




" they held up to same standards as our screens do. they had to be strong , they had be easy to use,and they had to look slick "



Nice... And relatively affordable to boot!










Keep up the great work Rich and I wish you great success!


...Glenn


----------



## Mike Garrett

Just got pricing on the masking panels. Pricing looks very reasonable.


----------



## archiguy

Glad to hear it! I'll be needing them, and the screen, soon.


> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*
> 
> LOL..maybe if you owned a 737..



Rumor has it there might be a 777 on the market soon. You just have to travel to a small, uninhabited island in the Indian Ocean to pick it up.


----------



## bigbadbob

Rich,

Received my sample piece in the mail. Did some very minor testing and when the time comes... You will have my order! Looks awesome. Great price. Will be soon. Thanks again. RG


----------



## jjslegacy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bigbadbob*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24527812
> 
> 
> Rich,
> 
> Received my sample piece in the mail. Did some very minor testing and when the time comes... You will have my order! Looks awesome. Great price. Will be soon. Thanks again. RG





Sounds like a familiar story. Got mine a while ago and just put in my order officially yesterday. Now scrambling to get the rest of the room done. Can't wait to see it in all its glory.


----------



## MALIX

Well thought I'd throw in my 2 cents. After ordering a sample of xd material and Falcon's I finalized my order from Rich yesterday. So far he has been easy to deal with and I am looking forward to getting the material. I will be building a DIY frame from 1X4 poplar. then using a pneumatic stapler to attach it to the frame. My screen will end up about 130 to maybe 135 wide. But i ordered a larger screen and will finalize the size with masking.


'll make sure to post back when it all gets set up..


For reference my build thread link is below..


----------



## jjcook

I haven't heard any mention of the masking panels since their introduction -- anyone take the leap yet?


----------



## jjslegacy

I went with them and my panels and screen will both be here Wednesday - scrambling to get the room ready


----------



## Chuck Miller

Congrats! Please post pictures and tell us your opinion of both the screen and the panels. Did you get a scope screen with panels to mask to 16:9?


----------



## jjslegacy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Chuck Miller*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24607088
> 
> 
> Congrats! Please post pictures and tell us your opinion of both the screen and the panels. Did you get a scope screen with panels to mask to 16:9?



She has arrived in the new packaging Rich is using.

 



It may be a bit before I get it all out of the box but yes it's a 138" diagonal 2.35 with the masking panels to make it 16.9.


----------



## hifiaudio2

No more 150lb crate? Rich you are going cheap on us! just kidding of course...


----------



## jjslegacy

*Waiting for Rich to tell me again the box is upside down*


I am quite glad the 150lb crate is gone and so is my father who always has to help me carry things to the basement lol. We are still recovering after the dual Submersives


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24613662
> 
> 
> No more 150lb crate? Rich you are going cheap on us! just kidding of course...



Believe it or not there is really is not much of a cost savings at all, it seemed that the crates where taking more of beaten. I guess fedex see's a big crate and thinks it is good time to play forklift hockey or something.


the new boxes also are easier to the customer it weighs less then half of the wooden crate, and your trash man is cussing you on trash day


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjslegacy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24613715
> 
> 
> *Waiting for Rich to tell me again the box is upside down*
> 
> 
> I am quite glad the 150lb crate is gone and so is my father who always has to help me carry things to the basement lol. We are still recovering after the dual Submersives



it appears FedEx and the customer pay no mind to the red stickers all the way around the box with the arrows pointing up LOL!!!!


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24613719
> 
> 
> Believe it or not there is really is not much of a cost savings at all, it seemed that the crates where taking more of beaten. I guess fedex see's a big crate and thinks it is good time to play forklift hockey or something.
> 
> 
> the new boxes also are easier to the customer it weighs less then half of the wooden crate, and your trash man is cussing you on trash day



I can definitely agree with that, my crate looked like it was dropped off the back of the Fedex truck!....lol


Of course I still need to cut it up to get rid of it.


----------



## 24Changer




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjslegacy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24613634
> 
> 
> She has arrived in the new packaging Rich is using.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It may be a bit before I get it all out of the box but yes it's a 137" diagonal 2.35 with the masking panels to make it 16.9.



I too hope to have a box identical sitting in front off me soon


----------



## jjslegacy

oops it's a 138" diagonal not 137 - I guess I should know the size of my own screen.


Probably why I also have the box upside down and Rich those are tiny arrows


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jjslegacy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/150#post_24613891
> 
> 
> oops it's a 138" diagonal not 137 - I guess I should know the size of my own screen.
> 
> 
> Probably why I also have the box upside down and Rich those are tiny arrows


----------



## JSKMDWK

+1


----------



## archiguy

Yes, anxiously awaiting the verdict. I'm finally getting ready to start finish work (insulation, flooring, drywall) on my HT room, which has been rough-framed and wired up for 7 or 8 months now. That means I'll be ordering my 110" screen w/ 16x9 masking panels in the next few weeks, along with the rest of my gear - disk players, DVR, subs, receiver, etc.


Excited!


----------



## MALIX

Well.. i havent had a chance to take pics yet but I have the screen up and set up the projector on cardboard boxes. I watched oblivion night before last and it looked FANTASTIC. I have a Sony Hw50es which has reality creation and the oppo 103d with darbee and the results are great.. No complaints on the screen. As far as I am concerned it does its job,which is to dissapear and let me enjoy the movie. Great deal on this material and I definitely recommend it. Rich was also very helpful and easy to work with.


----------



## Hockeypucks

I ordered a sample from Rich, Seymour and Carls shearweave but I'm still framing my theater. I'm going with a floor to ceiling 16:9 screen to make the most out of my 7ft ceilings. I'm liking what I've read so far and feel I'll be going with Falcon as well. Here's an image shot on a concrete wall with a terrible beige stucco. I'm quite happy with the image quality so hopefully a white screen will look good.


----------



## archiguy

Are the masking panels covered in black fabric? What kind / brand?


I'm getting to the point where I'm going to be covering the ceiling and walls around the screen in black fabric and thought it might be good to match it to the masking panels. Or not. I'm really not sure. But I do know I'm going to have to be making a lot of finish choices very soon, for better or worse. Drywall hanging in the theater room is starting Monday! Finally! After having the room rough framed now for 9 months...


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24732426
> 
> 
> Are the masking panels covered in black fabric? What kind / brand?
> 
> 
> I'm getting to the point where I'm going to be covering the ceiling and walls around the screen in black fabric and thought it might be good to match it to the masking panels. Or not. I'm really not sure. But I do know I'm going to have to be making a lot of finish choices very soon, for better or worse. Drywall hanging in the theater room is starting Monday! Finally! After having the room rough framed now for 9 months...



Yes they are covered in black acoustically transparent material, the inner edge of the masking panel is covered with the same velvet as the frame.

a screen using black Gom is always a great match.


----------



## johnmi


Hi All,

 

New to the forum, building my first HT. A very modest set-up compared to others, but never the less, something that will give us a lot of enjoyment. (I hope!) This is an interesting thread, I've read through all of it to see what everyone's input is on the different screen types. Jon at Seymour is sending me a sample of both the XD and UF material to check out up close, since my viewing distance will only be about 8-9ft. After reading this thread, it seems to me there are other choices for me to consider, (manufacturers) that offer just the material for DIY screens? I'm also interested in the new AT masking Snickers has mentioned above. I will be using 2:40.1 aspect ratio using the zoom method, so would like to mask to a 16:9 at times.

 

Can anyone suggest where I might get other samples to compare with the Seymour screen samples on their way?  

 

John


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnmi*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24746520
> 
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> 
> New to the forum, building my first HT. A very modest set-up compared to others, but never the less, something that will give us a lot of enjoyment. (I hope!) This is an interesting thread, I've read through all of it to see what everyone's input is on the different screen types. Jon at Seymour is sending me a sample of both the XD and UF material to check out up close, since my viewing distance will only be about 8-9ft. After reading this thread, it seems to me there are other choices for me to consider, (manufacturers) that offer just the material for DIY screens? I'm also interested in the new AT masking Snickers has mentioned above. I will be using 2:40.1 aspect ratio using the zoom method, so would like to mask to a 16:9 at times.
> 
> 
> Can anyone suggest where I might get other samples to compare with the Seymour screen samples on their way?
> 
> 
> John




John, just send me a pm with your address and we will be happy to send you out a sample of the Falcon material. We also offer our material for DIY.


----------



## johnmi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24746771
> 
> 
> 
> John, just send me a pm with your address and we will be happy to send you out a sample of the Falcon material. We also offer our material for DIY.


 

Perfect Rich, PM sent and thanks.


----------



## jbrown15




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnmi*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24746520
> 
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> 
> New to the forum, building my first HT. A very modest set-up compared to others, but never the less, something that will give us a lot of enjoyment. (I hope!) This is an interesting thread, I've read through all of it to see what everyone's input is on the different screen types. Jon at Seymour is sending me a sample of both the XD and UF material to check out up close, since my viewing distance will only be about 8-9ft. After reading this thread, it seems to me there are other choices for me to consider, (manufacturers) that offer just the material for DIY screens? I'm also interested in the new AT masking Snickers has mentioned above. I will be using 2:40.1 aspect ratio using the zoom method, so would like to mask to a 16:9 at times.
> 
> 
> Can anyone suggest where I might get other samples to compare with the Seymour screen samples on their way?
> 
> 
> John



Definitely get a Falcon screen sample, I know there was no way I could use the XD material at 9ft away. The Falcon screen material would be a perfect fit for you IMO.


----------



## Hockeypucks

I've ordered my screen and it's en route to my house now. Overall size is 140x80 for a 158" 16:9. I'll post pics when I can, still building theater but should be done in a few weeks.


----------



## johnmi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jbrown15*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24747473
> 
> 
> 
> Definitely get a Falcon screen sample, I know there was no way I could use the XD material at 9ft away. The Falcon screen material would be a perfect fit for you IMO.


 

Thanks for the info. Yea, Rich is sending me a sample. I was also concerned about seeing the patterns in the XD so was actually thinking the UF would be better for me. (despite its lower gain) Although, after reading this thead I've learned that the Falcon may do better than either of the others, so I'm really looking forward to checking out that sample when it arrives.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Johnmi I am in Nashville so if you ever want to come see a 161" wide Falcon screen you are welcome to come over.


----------



## johnmi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *hifiaudio2*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24751839
> 
> 
> Johnmi I am in Nashville so if you ever want to come see a 161" wide Falcon screen you are welcome to come over.


 

HiFi audio, Thanks for the invite I may take you up on it. So far, I've heard nothing but good things about the Falcon screens. I'm in the building process, so no immediate rush to get any one thing in particular so I'm doing alot of research. There's so much to all of this, I can't even guess how many pages of specs I've read in the last few weeks! (between screens and all the other nec. equipment)

 

Thanks again for the offer, much appreciated.

 

John


----------



## archiguy

Question for Rich or anyone who's bought the masking panels...


I'm going to have a 110" 'scope Falcon screen with Bronze Triads in the wall behind it. Are the masking panels completely acoustically transparent or will I need to have my receiver's Audyssey program re-calibrate the speakers for when the panels are deployed? Will the volume level for them have to be adjusted slightly upward to compensate for any acoustic damping the panels might inadvertently create? Would it make sense to have two different calibration points that would change (I'm assuming my receiver can do that), maybe with a macro command, when the aspect ratio was changed and that panels were added or removed?


Anybody tested for that?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24801348
> 
> 
> Question for Rich or anyone who's bought the masking panels...
> 
> 
> I'm going to have a 110" 'scope Falcon screen with Bronze Triads in the wall behind it. Are the masking panels completely acoustically transparent or will I need to have my receiver's Audyssey program re-calibrate the speakers for when the panels are deployed? Will the volume level for them have to be adjusted slightly upward to compensate for any acoustic damping the panels might inadvertently create? Would it make sense to have two different calibration points that would change (I'm assuming my receiver can do that), maybe with a macro command, when the aspect ratio was changed and that panels were added or removed?
> 
> 
> Anybody tested for that?




you will not need to recalarbrate your system to compensate for when you have the panels installed. In our testing they was only a .3db difference with the panels installed as apposed to without them installed.

this is assuming your entire speaker is covered by the panel.


----------



## archiguy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *snickers1*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24801773
> 
> 
> you will not need to recalarbrate your system to compensate for when you have the panels installed. In our testing they was only a .3db difference with the panels installed as apposed to without them installed.
> 
> this is assuming your entire speaker is covered by the panel.



You know, the edge of the masking panel might actually fall right down the middle of the L/R speakers. Is there a frame member on the sides that might cause an issue if that's the case?


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *archiguy*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24813520
> 
> 
> You know, the edge of the masking panel might actually fall right down the middle of the L/R speakers. Is there a frame member on the sides that might cause an issue if that's the case?



no the frame of the masking the panels is very thin only 1" wide


----------



## johnmi


Hi Rich, I received the sample you sent me and it looks great. Just sent you a PM. 

 

John


----------



## snickers1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnmi*  /t/1477759/the-official-falcon-screens-acoustically-transparent-screen-thread/180#post_24814355
> 
> 
> Hi Rich, I received the sample you sent me and it looks great. Just sent you a PM.
> 
> 
> John



Thanks John got it


----------



## johnmi

*AT screen material*

Well after a lot of comparing, I've decided to go with the Falcon screen material from Rich. 

At my seating distance of 9ft. it will be fine and much better than the others I checked out. (The XD and also the UF material) IMO, I found the gain to be very comparable to the XD material and noticeably higher gain than the UF material I tested against and a better PQ quality with the Falcon.

Now I just have to start thinking about building a good frame, not to mention the rest of the room!


----------



## Barrettmr

I have requested a sample as I am looking for a new AT screen (coming from a non AT fixed frame) and wanted to see if anyone was watching 3D on this Falcon fabric and if I should expect a different PQ compared to watching 3D on a non AT Screen?


Thanks!


----------



## hifiaudio2

Assuming a seating distance where the weave disappears, 3D will look identical, except a little dimmer assuming that your non AT screen had at least some gain.


----------



## johnmi

At 9ft, the Falcon screen material weave is not visible to me. This was one of two main concerns I had in choosing which material to use for our screen. Perhaps someone with better vision might see it closer? but even down to 6ft it looks good to us.

After many "tests" using different materials behind the 3 screen samples I was comparing, I concluded the gain of the Falcon was very comparable to the XD material. (Using ONLY our visual reference for comparison, no meters used) I studied the gain as best I could (again only from a visual reference) using different input signals, brightness settings and different movie scenes etc., since 3D is also a concern for me I really wanted to compare gain. I feel the Falcon was equally as bright as the XD and much brighter than the UF material. Secondly, I could clearly see the weave in the XD material at 9ft and even as close as about 5-6ft.

I'm in the process of building my first dedicated HT so I'm a newbie when it comes to HT screens. My testing is crude to say the least in comparison to technical methods of testing, but hopefully this will give a bit of useful info to others in the same boat as myself. IMO, the Falcon material beat the other two samples hands down. Thanks for all your help Rich! 

BTW hifiaudio2, I've just read through your build thread, fantastic job and a beautiful outcome on your theater room. Congrats!  

John


----------



## johnmi

Barrettmr said:


> I have requested a sample as I am looking for a new AT screen (coming from a non AT fixed frame) and wanted to see if anyone was watching 3D on this Falcon fabric and if I should expect a different PQ compared to watching 3D on a non AT Screen?
> 
> 
> Thanks!



Hi Barrettmr, 
I spent quite a bit of time deciding which material to use and just finally purchased Falcon material for a DIY AT screen. I can't say compared to a non-AT screen when it comes to 3D, but I can say that the Falcon material looked better than the other AT materials I compared it against. I "tested" three types (as I posted above) and the Falcon was the best looking PQ to me and I can't see the weave at 9ft. 3D is also important to us so I spent a lot of time comparing the gain as best I could. Again, I think the Falcon gain was as good or better than the other AT materials. Hope this helps.

John


----------



## Barrettmr

johnmi said:


> Hi Barrettmr,
> I spent quite a bit of time deciding which material to use and just finally purchased Falcon material for a DIY AT screen. I can't say compared to a non-AT screen when it comes to 3D, but I can say that the Falcon material looked better than the other AT materials I compared it against. I "tested" three types (as I posted above) and the Falcon was the best looking PQ to me and I can't see the weave at 9ft. 3D is also important to us so I spent a lot of time comparing the gain as best I could. Again, I think the Falcon gain was as good or better than the other AT materials. Hope this helps.
> 
> John



Great thanks for the quick reply, that makes me feel much better, I have the Epson 5020UB which has a good amount to light power for 3d so it sounds like I would have a good experience with this screen, I'm going from a 106" diagonal HDTV screen to this 120" to 130" AT screen, my first row is about 14' back so I think it should be a good fit!


----------



## johnmi

Barrettmr said:


> Great thanks for the quick reply, that makes me feel much better, I have the Epson 5020UB which has a good amount to light power for 3d so it sounds like I would have a good experience with this screen, I'm going from a 106" diagonal HDTV screen to this 120" to 130" AT screen, my first row is about 14' back so I think it should be a good fit!


Great. I'm glad the bit of info I offered may help you out. When you get your sample, you'll see what I'm talking about. Do you have other sample types to compare against?


----------



## Barrettmr

Well I took a good look at all the info on the website and read all the reviews here and decided to order now without the samples... I need to complete my remodel in about 2 week and after speaking with Rich I felt good about going for it :-O


I'll post back once I am done and share my experience with my setup!


----------



## onyxbfly

Hey Rich I see what you did there!!!! You, Sneaky Devil, LOL Thanks for taking care of my lady!!!


----------



## jbrown15

Barrettmr said:


> Well I took a good look at all the info on the website and read all the reviews here and decided to order now without the samples... I need to complete my remodel in about 2 week and after speaking with Rich I felt good about going for it :-O
> 
> 
> I'll post back once I am done and share my experience with my setup!


I had screen sample from Seymour of both the XD material and the EN4K material and some from Elunevision 4K audioweave material, I bought my Falcon screen sight unseen and have been extremely happy with the picture and build quality of it. Rich has been awesome to deal with and its always nice to support a fellow AVS member with his start up venture into the screen market. 


Next month I'm hosting a small speaker GTG with close to 20 forum members coming out, I can't wait to show off my Falcon screen! :grin:


----------



## snickers1

onyxbfly said:


> Hey Rich I see what you did there!!!! You, Sneaky Devil, LOL Thanks for taking care of my lady!!!



Your very Welcome!! it was my pleasure she was so excited to get this done for you was very happy help. 

enjoy 
Rich


----------



## snickers1

jbrown15 said:


> I had screen sample from Seymour of both the XD material and the EN4K material and some from Elunevision 4K audioweave material, I bought my Falcon screen sight unseen and have been extremely happy with the picture and build quality of it. Rich has been awesome to deal with and its always nice to support a fellow AVS member with his start up venture into the screen market.
> 
> 
> Next month I'm hosting a small speaker GTG with close to 20 forum members coming out, I can't wait to show off my Falcon screen! :grin:



Hey i was not invited LOL!!!! Can't waite to hear about the event send me some pics


----------



## jbrown15

snickers1 said:


> Hey i was not invited LOL!!!! Can't waite to hear about the event send me some pics



Yes you were, I said you can fly out with my masking panels!...lol :grin:


----------



## johnmi

snickers1 said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *johnmi*
> 
> Hi Rich, I received the sample you sent me and it looks great. Just sent you a PM.
> 
> John
> 
> 
> Thanks John got it


Hey Rich, I got my screen material all is great. Although at first sight I was nervous since the box had gotten crushed enroute! However once I checked it out, all is okay. No creases, just a little "smooshed". I have it laying out now to flatten it out. Very happy with the way it looks. Thanks again for getting it right out, now to build a frame.


----------



## snickers1

johnmi said:


> Hey Rich, I got my screen material all is great. Although at first sight I was nervous since the box had gotten crushed enroute! However once I checked it out, all is okay. No creases, just a little "smooshed". I have it laying out now to flatten it out. Very happy with the way it looks. Thanks again for getting it right out, now to build a frame.



Gotta love Fedex sometimes... if you have issue just send me email and we will take of it. 
Now the Fun begins building a Frame.


----------



## Barrettmr

*speaker colour behind the screen?*

So my Falcon screen will be here tomorrow, can't wait  but I do have one concern, this is my first AT screen and I'm having to use my excising Polk speakers behind it, my old screen was smaller and the speakers were in front of the non AT screen. Anyway when I pulled them out I found they have a silver finish on the front of the speakers and the speaker themselves have a silver cone - now I am concerned a very light scene in a movie will reflect off the speaker and make it visible through the screen? Anyone with this Falcon screen have any issues like that? I read in other posts the back wall behind the screen should be black, so should I have the speaker grill material over them. I just wanted some advice so didn't have to hang it then remove it to add speaker grills nor wanted to add those grills (which I guess will further impact the sound) if they aren't needed :-(


Thanks!


----------



## hifiaudio2

If its a reflective silver, vs some sort of matte, I would advise using the grills. Its doubtful they would impact the sound in a way you could tell if you blindly A/B'd them.


----------



## snickers1

so i took a sample screen we have to show folks what the screen looks like and how it goes together, i took a few silver z brackets and rested them against the back side of the screen and then turned the lights off in the room and took a bright mag light and shined it on the front side of the screen and i was unable to see the brackets through the screen. I then moved them back a few inches from the screen and same result. The z brackets are much more reflective the a silver speaker painted speaker i would think. 

hope this helps 
Rich


----------



## Barrettmr

@hifiaudio2 and Rich


Thanks for the info and advice, sounds like I should try without anything over the speakers first as there is a good chance I will not have an issue. From what I have seen the screen hangs on those Z brackets so it just lifts on and off correct?


Thanks again!


----------



## snickers1

Barrettmr said:


> @hifiaudio2 and Rich
> 
> 
> Thanks for the info and advice, sounds like I should try without anything over the speakers first as there is a good chance I will not have an issue. From what I have seen the screen hangs on those Z brackets so it just lifts on and off correct?
> 
> 
> Thanks again!


That is correct hangs just like a great big picture. very easy to hang and remove if need be. 

Thanks
Rich


----------



## Barrettmr

snickers1 said:


> That is correct hangs just like a great big picture. very easy to hang and remove if need be.
> 
> Thanks
> Rich


ok, last bit of info I think I need, do you know how much extra space is needed to lift the screen over and onto the fixing z bracket thing? My wood frame is recessed and the finished dimensions were going to be 1" gap between the top edge of the screen frame and the top of the wood frame its being fixed to, so now I am thinking will 1" be enough to raise it up to hook onto the bracket. I did a quick picture to help explain 


Thanks!


----------



## snickers1

Barrettmr said:


> ok, last bit of info I think I need, do you know how much extra space is needed to lift the screen over and onto the fixing z bracket thing? My wood frame is recessed and the finished dimensions were going to be 1" gap between the top edge of the screen frame and the top of the wood frame its being fixed to, so now I am thinking will 1" be enough to raise it up to hook onto the bracket. I did a quick picture to help explain
> 
> 
> Thanks!



1" will work perfectly, the lip that slides into the z bracket is a tad over 1/4" so if you leave 1/2 to 1" of room your set.

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## Barrettmr

Thanks, I'll carry on with the 1" gap then...


Also, the screen arrived about half an hour ago, when I looked at the box it looked visually bent in the middle, good old FedEx! It came off the truck on its side as in the picture, after unboxing it I couldn't see any major damage which is good but after un-bolting the frame from the shipping blocks and placing them on the flat floor, the main top and bottom parts are slightly bent like a banana shape rocking in the middle :-( I don't want to take the plastic off yet as I am still building and don't want any dust on them so will have to see in a few days.....seems like those shipping companies really don't care at all.


----------



## Barrettmr

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! I finally got my screen installed and watched ID4 and Avengers 3D and all I can say is WOW!!! This screen is amazing, build quality is superb and the AT screen fabric is perfect. The image is just amazing, so much better than my old Da-lite Cinema Vision and the 3D was jaw dropping. It was just like my first HT experience all over again 


Despite Fed Ex's best attempt at destroying it, I can report that the shipping packaging kept everything in perfect order, at first I was worried about some damage but once it was out of the packaging it turn out to be fine.


Thanks again for creating such a great screen at a great price, you totally exceeded my expectations!


Now I just need those masking panels, hope they will be available soon 


Mark.


----------



## snickers1

Barrettmr said:


> Thank you, thank you, thank you!!! I finally got my screen installed and watched ID4 and Avengers 3D and all I can say is WOW!!! This screen is amazing, build quality is superb and the AT screen fabric is perfect. The image is just amazing, so much better than my old Da-lite Cinema Vision and the 3D was jaw dropping. It was just like my first HT experience all over again
> 
> 
> Despite Fed Ex's best attempt at destroying it, I can report that the shipping packaging kept everything in perfect order, at first I was worried about some damage but once it was out of the packaging it turn out to be fine.
> 
> 
> Thanks again for creating such a great screen at a great price, you totally exceeded my expectations!
> 
> 
> Now I just need those masking panels, hope they will be available soon
> 
> 
> Mark.



Sweet!! Very happy that you are enjoying it, I sometimes think when you put a label on a box that says Fragile that is Fed Ex's queue to toss them around, This is why we pretty much try to over pack them.


----------



## awedio

snickers1,

Yesterday, I sent you email


----------



## snickers1

awedio said:


> snickers1,
> 
> Yesterday, I sent you email



PM sent 

Thanks
Rich


----------



## BamaboyTX77

Hi Rich! I have sent you a PM with some pictures. I have approximately 119" wall to wall space and I think the best fit is the 126.2" diagonal screen in 16:9. I am ready to purchase as soon as possible. Waiting on you response.


----------



## snickers1

BamaboyTX77 said:


> Hi Rich! I have sent you a PM with some pictures. I have approximately 119" wall to wall space and I think the best fit is the 126.2" diagonal screen in 16:9. I am ready to purchase as soon as possible. Waiting on you response.


you sent an email  .... was just working on the reply check your mail in a few minutes

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## BamaboyTX77

Thank you! I have sent you a response as well. A couple of follow-up questions and should be good to go after that!


----------



## BamaboyTX77

Just placed the order! Super excited. Will post pictures once i get it set up.


----------



## 24Changer

My 120" wide 2.35 Falcon screen has arrived, woo hoo!, thank you Rich!. It all appears to be in one piece after a quick inspection. Fed Ex was kind


----------



## JSKMDWK

I wanted to write and share my impressions of my recently installed 120” wide,130” diagonal, 2.35:1 Falcon Screen. The build quality of the frame rivals that of the Stewart Screen it was replacing. I’ve had the screen up for almost a month and am really enjoying the more immersive picture. We watched _Need for Speed_ and I loved the wider aspect ratio. I opted for the masking panels and they do a great job of giving a crisp sharp edge to 16x9 content without impact to the audio. I think having all of the front LCR speakers behind the screen,with the audio originating from the proper location in the image, greatly enhances the suspension of disbelief. Highly recommended.


----------



## msuduck17

*Falcon Screen Selection*

As I new I cannot PM Rich directly so I am posting here...

I just built a false wall that is 116 inch wide so I am looking at the FVHD095. I have an Epson 5010 with viewing distance = throw at 12 feet. It's not a dedicated home theater but I have full light control. Any feedback on screen selection?


----------



## jbrown15

msuduck17 said:


> As I new I cannot PM Rich directly so I am posting here...
> 
> I just built a false wall that is 116 inch wide so I am looking at the FVHD095. I have an Epson 5010 with viewing distance = throw at 12 feet. It's not a dedicated home theater but I have full light control. Any feedback on screen selection?


What kind of feed back are you looking for? I say the Falcon screen as pretty much as good as anything else around as for as picture quality goes, and can be had for an excellent price. You should try emailing Rich at Falcon directly.


----------



## Barrettmr

And all I would add to that is go as big as you can for sure 


I rebuilt my screen wall and went from 106" non AT to the 131" falcon AT and it was amazing....


----------



## Searl6542

So how does the audio sound from behind the falcon screen? Accucalahd.com rates it low. I have a denon x4000, so can I assume the audyssey feature will correct the speakers accordingly? Is it that much of a difference vs Seymour etc?


----------



## jbrown15

Searl6542 said:


> So how does the audio sound from behind the falcon screen? Accucalahd.com rates it low. I have a denon x4000, so can I assume the audyssey feature will correct the speakers accordingly? Is it that much of a difference vs Seymour etc?



I think popalock posted some measurements of the screen in place and measurements without the screen in place. And once you correct the EQ to account for the screen it's like it's not even there. 

I know it isn't an issue for me either.


----------



## Searl6542

jbrown15 said:


> I think popalock posted some measurements of the screen in place and measurements without the screen in place. And once you correct the EQ to account for the screen it's like it's not even there.
> 
> I know it isn't an issue for me either.


Ahh! You are correct! Thanks and sorry about asking what's already been discussed!


----------



## archiguy

I'm getting ready (finally!) to order my 110" (horiz.) 2:35 AT Falcon screen. Also need side masking panels for 16:9 HDTV content. Anybody know (Rich?) what the width dimension of those panels would be?


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> I'm getting ready (finally!) to order my 110" (horiz.) 2:35 AT Falcon screen. Also need side masking panels for 16:9 HDTV content. Anybody know (Rich?) what the width dimension of those panels would be?


they would be 13 1/2" wide 


Rich


----------



## archiguy

snickers1 said:


> they would be 13 1/2" wide
> 
> 
> Rich


That includes the frame? How are they attached to the screen?


----------



## jbrown15

archiguy said:


> That includes the frame? How are they attached to the screen?


As far as I remember, with magnets.


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> That includes the frame? How are they attached to the screen?


yes that includes the frame the overall width frame and all would be 13 1/2 "




jbrown15 said:


> As far as I remember, with magnets.


correct


----------



## RTK

I'll have to post some final screen shots but we recently finished up retrofitting my 100" Elite screen with Falcon AT material. For anyone considering this it definitely takes 2 people and a lot patience plus pliers/clamps. I was a little skeptical when we started but but the screen material ended up taught and without any wrinkles and looks great. Just be sure to have some plastic extra clips and strong fingers.


----------



## Keith AP

Thanks, Rick, for accomplishing this and posting pictures. I wasn't sure this could be done to a satisfactory result. I have a 115" Elite Lunette curved screen and am considering this too as an alternative.

The extra clips; was this due to breaking some or just needing additional holding power? Any other tips such as install pattern or corner technique?


----------



## RTK

Because of the Falcon AT screen material thickness, similar to CS XD, it doesn't compress or stretch much so its unlikely you will be able to put the clips in with just your hands. You will definitely need 2 people and strong fingers help. We used a C-clamp pliers with a small block of wood to protect outside of frame which I think you can see in one of the pictures. Several of the initial clips did bend under pressure. None broke but a few we replaced. Some of the initial clips held the screen and as we added clips and out techniques improved the screen stretched a tiny bit and flattened out nicely. I would recommend extra clips to help remove wrinkles during install process and keep the screen material firmly in place as you work around the frame. You can order extra clips from Elite. After screen was in place we cut off extra screen material, put back the black backing/center tension bar and screen went back up on the wall.


----------



## snickers1

We are now shipping screens with 3 new Fabrics:

Falcon Vision Horizon our new micro fine-weave material that provides solid screen performance from an acoustically transparent image.

Falcon Vision Platinum a White non AT material.

Falcon Vision Titanium a Gray non AT material.


----------



## archiguy

Rich, how does the new Horizon fabric differ from your "old" AT fabric? Finer weave, more gain? Something else...? And is it priced the same?


----------



## Chuck Miller

archiguy said:


> Rich, how does the new Horizon fabric differ from your "old" AT fabric? Finer weave, more gain? Something else...? And is it priced the same?


I'm not Rich, but all the info you are asking for is now on the Falcon Screens website, including pricing. Looks like a super product. Check it out!


----------



## jbrown15

snickers1 said:


> We are now shipping screens with 3 new Fabrics:
> 
> Falcon Vision Horizon our new micro fine-weave material that provides solid screen performance from an acoustically transparent image.
> 
> Falcon Vision Platinum a White non AT material.
> 
> Falcon Vision Titanium a Gray non AT material.


Well I'm glad you finally announced this Rich, I hated not being able to say anything!....lol
I should be ready to order my new screen in a week or so, maybe sooner.


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> Rich, how does the new Horizon fabric differ from your "old" AT fabric? Finer weave, more gain? Something else...? And is it priced the same?





Chuck Miller said:


> I'm not Rich, but all the info you are asking for is now on the Falcon Screens website, including pricing. Looks like a super product. Check it out!



The New Falcon Vison HD is a fine woven material that disappears from seating of 6' back, 
The new Horizon material is even finer it gives look of solid material but of coarse is Accoustically transparent you litterly can be inches away and not see the weave pattern,
we are not restricted to size ether we can use this material for all of our screen sizes.


----------



## archiguy

snickers1 said:


> The New Falcon Vison HD is a fine woven material that disappears from seating of 6' back,
> The new Horizon material is even finer it gives look of solid material but of coarse is Accoustically transparent you litterly can be inches away and not see the weave pattern,
> we are not restricted to size ether we can use this material for all of our screen sizes.


As I'm now in my 22nd month of construction (I swear, they built the Pyramids faster), and I would normally have ordered my screen months if not a year ago, this may be the only bit of good news I've had in awhile.


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> As I'm now in my 22nd month of construction (I swear, they built the Pyramids faster), and I would normally have ordered my screen months if not a year ago, this may be the only bit of good news I've had in awhile.


See even in the home theater construction world the sun the moon and the stars sometimes line up perfectly


----------



## Chuck Miller

snickers1 said:


> The New Falcon Vison HD is a fine woven material that disappears from seating of 6' back,
> The new Horizon material is even finer it gives look of solid material but of coarse is Accoustically transparent you litterly can be inches away and not see the weave pattern,
> we are not restricted to size ether we can use this material for all of our screen sizes.


Hi Rich,


I didn't understand at first that the Vision HD is a new material as well. So, how do the gains of the new materials compare with the "old" Vision HD? It appears the Horizon is just slightly less bright, but I'd like to understand how these compare to the old standard.


Thanks,


Chuck


----------



## snickers1

Chuck Miller said:


> Hi Rich,
> 
> 
> I didn't understand at first that the Vision HD is a new material as well. So, how do the gains of the new materials compare with the "old" Vision HD? It appears the Horizon is just slightly less bright, but I'd like to understand how these compare to the old standard.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> 
> Chuck


The Vision HD is not new that is the original fabric that we started with it is very smooth woven material but if you look very close to it you can the weave pattern
The new Horizon is fabric with really does not have noticable weave patern giveing it more of a solid screen look.
it is slightly less bright but with improved black levels. 

If you would like i can send of sample of each, just send me a quick pm with your address i will be happy send out both. 

Rich


----------



## awedio

So the Horizon is ready to ship?


----------



## snickers1

awedio said:


> So the Horizon is ready to ship?


Yep it sure is


----------



## awedio

Thx, will send you email.
Just gotta decide on size


----------



## popalock

snickers1 said:


> We are now shipping screens with 3 new Fabrics:
> 
> Falcon Vision Horizon our new micro fine-weave material that provides solid screen performance from an acoustically transparent image.
> 
> Falcon Vision Platinum a White non AT material.
> 
> Falcon Vision Titanium a Gray non AT material.


Any super high resolution extreme closeup shots of the old AT material vs the New?


----------



## jbrown15

popalock said:


> Any super high resolution extreme closeup shots of the old AT material vs the New?



You thinking about getting some of the new material shipped out to you?
I'm going to switch from a 16:9 to a 2.35:1 screen and I'm going with the new material


----------



## popalock

jbrown15 said:


> You thinking about getting some of the new material shipped out to you?
> I'm going to switch from a 16:9 to a 2.35:1 screen and I'm going with the new material


No sir... I just like pictures and want Rich to show a side by side of the two for comparison purposes. I thought the old material was great, so I'm looking for some perspective. 

As for as my situation...I'm looking at a 135" AT, tab tensioned, electronic screen from Elite for this current space. My layout won't accomodate a fixed screen, unless I want to reduce the size to something like 90" or so. 

Gotta shut up and work with the cards we are dealt with sometimes...


----------



## jbrown15

popalock said:


> No sir... I just like pictures and want Rich to show a side by side of the two for comparison purposes. I thought the old material was great, so I'm looking for some perspective.
> 
> As for as my situation...I'm looking at a 135" AT, tab tensioned, electronic screen from Elite for this current space. My layout won't accomodate a fixed screen, unless I want to reduce the size to something like 90" or so.
> 
> Gotta shut up and work with the cards we are dealt with sometimes...


How are those ported super sized monster subs coming along?


----------



## popalock

jbrown15 said:


> How are those ported super sized monster subs coming along?


Ha, one revised sketchup drawing at a time...

Wife is going out of town tonight, so I should have all of this coming week to work on them. 

Hoping to make some _actual_ progress soon.


----------



## snickers1

popalock said:


> Any super high resolution extreme closeup shots of the old AT material vs the New?


will have to get some posted for you i know your far away from us so you need to pic fix once in while 

here is shot of the new Horizon screen in action Gamecock24 took while at NC/SC General HT Chat Area and G2G Planning this past weekend.

pic was taken with an IPhone 6


----------



## beastaudio

jbrown15 said:


> Well I'm glad you finally announced this Rich, I hated not being able to say anything!....lol
> I should be ready to order my new screen in a week or so, maybe sooner.


You will love it, I am sure of that 



archiguy said:


> As I'm now in my 22nd month of construction (I swear, they built the Pyramids faster), and I would normally have ordered my screen months if not a year ago, this may be the only bit of good news I've had in awhile.


If you want to take a quick trip up the hill to see the screen in action I am in Asheville  I will also add you to the NC/SC g2g thread that Rich posted a link to above! 

I know my review is long overdue already, and thank you Rich for several things, number one getting the new Horizons material to me in time for the g2g, and two for being patient as you await some action pics of the new screen...As I have said, I don't have a killer digital camera by any means, but I can get some pretty decent screen captures regardless. I will have some decent ones up over the coming days!

The new material is the truth guys. You can be standing basically on top of the screen and not see a weave in the material. If you have any type of material projected onto it, it looks solid! Even in those high contrast bright white scenes in Art of Flight, I saw no crush, but a great amount of pop and dynamics to the color. I have seen the original material as well and this is certainly a step up. It is a little more elastic so it goes on the frame quite easily too  Any of you guys considering a new screen, this is the stuff for you without a doubt. I can't get enough of it


----------



## Frohlich

I was thinking about going to an AT screen from my regular screen and several folks from the JTR forum seem to like Falcon screens so they are at the top of my list.....specifically the new Horizon material Beast just installed. I will likely do something in the next few weeks. Do the Falcon screens come with a black backing or is that even an option with Falcon screens? Or does it make more sense to just paint the wall behind it black. Neither...both????


----------



## snickers1

Frohlich said:


> I was thinking about going to an AT screen from my regular screen and several folks from the JTR forum seem to like Falcon screens so they are at the top of my list.....specifically the new Horizon material Beast just installed. I will likely do something in the next few weeks. Do the Falcon screens come with a black backing or is that even an option with Falcon screens? Or does it make more sense to just paint the wall behind it black. Neither...both????


Black backing can can be added 99% of the folks just go with panting the wall behind the screen dark or black.


----------



## beastaudio

Frohlich said:


> I was thinking about going to an AT screen from my regular screen and several folks from the JTR forum seem to like Falcon screens so they are at the top of my list.....specifically the new Horizon material Beast just installed. I will likely do something in the next few weeks. Do the Falcon screens come with a black backing or is that even an option with Falcon screens? Or does it make more sense to just paint the wall behind it black. Neither...both????


Or treat the rear wall in full as I did. top to bottom, side to side with 1"linacoustic or the like, a layer of 4 mil plastic then another 1" thick layer of LA on top. I wrapped mine in speakercloth from Jo-ann and it does a GREAT job for absorption, as well as softens almost any light that makes it through the screen.


----------



## Frohlich

snickers1 said:


> Black backing can can be added 99% of the folks just go with panting the wall behind the screen dark or black.


Thank you Rich. What about masking panels for 16:9 screens...anything coming the next few weeks..months? That is something I would be very interested in.


----------



## snickers1

Frohlich said:


> Thank you Rich. What about masking panels for 16:9 screens...anything coming the next few weeks..months? That is something I would be very interested in.


working on them now ...will you keep you posted for sure 

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## jbrown15

Frohlich said:


> I was thinking about going to an AT screen from my regular screen and several folks from the JTR forum seem to like Falcon screens so they are at the top of my list.....specifically the new Horizon material Beast just installed. I will likely do something in the next few weeks. Do the Falcon screens come with a black backing or is that even an option with Falcon screens? Or does it make more sense to just paint the wall behind it black. Neither...both????



The wall behind my screen is just painted a dark brown and I've never had an issue.


----------



## Frohlich

Horizon screen order placed


----------



## jbrown15

Frohlich said:


> Horizon screen order placed



Well it's about bloody time!....LOL


----------



## snickers1

jbrown15 said:


> Well it's about bloody time!....LOL



LOL....How long did it take you on your first Screen order???


----------



## beastaudio

Frohlich said:


> Horizon screen order placed


BOOM. I guess V for Vendetta had it wrong. Remember remember the 6th of November....When Froh finally listened to Beast and went A-T....It is going to change your life. Get you a fine stack of around 20 titles that you will want to watch all over again. Trust me


----------



## jbrown15

snickers1 said:


> LOL....How long did it take you on your first Screen order???



About two weeks .....lol
I've been giving Frohlich a hard time about switching to an AT screen for about 10 months now!....lol


----------



## Frohlich

jbrown15 said:


> Well it's about bloody time!....LOL





beastaudio said:


> BOOM. I guess V for Vendetta had it wrong. Remember remember the 6th of November....When Froh finally listened to Beast and went A-T....It is going to change your life. Get you a fine stack of around 20 titles that you will want to watch all over again. Trust me


You are the two from the JTR forum that harassed me the most...I finally caved in to peer pressusre


----------



## beastaudio

Perfect timing however, with this new Horizons material just coming out! Call it providence... Does Rich do a zero day same as cash too? Haha


----------



## popalock

Frohlich said:


> Horizon screen order placed


I'm not 100% sure you fully understand the gravity of your decision. 

Your decision to upgrade is going to literally cost you thousands of dollars more, $10K isn't out of the question. 

Of course you already knew that though...


What size did you end up going with again? Seems like you could easily go scope and not loose any 16:9 size... Or just get a floor to ceiling 16:9 monster...lol


----------



## beastaudio

popalock said:


> I'm not 100% sure you fully understand the gravity of your decision.
> 
> Your decision to upgrade is going to literally cost you thousands of dollars more, $10K isn't out of the question.
> 
> Of course you already knew that though...
> 
> 
> What size did you end up going with again? Seems like you could easily go scope and not loose any 16:9 size... Or just get a floor to ceiling 16:9 monster...lol


And PopaDoha gets the winningest post of the day..... Maximize width or height, your choice, but make it matter.... I did, with 3 inches on either side of my 16:9 to the walls and less than that between the screen and the ceiling....Winning... You are about to do it sir


----------



## Frohlich

popalock said:


> I'm not 100% sure you fully understand the gravity of your decision.
> 
> Your decision to upgrade is going to literally cost you thousands of dollars more, $10K isn't out of the question.
> 
> Of course you already knew that though...
> 
> 
> What size did you end up going with again? Seems like you could easily go scope and not loose any 16:9 size... Or just get a floor to ceiling 16:9 monster...lol





beastaudio said:


> And PopaDoha gets the winningest post of the day..... Maximize width or height, your choice, but make it matter.... I did, with 3 inches on either side of my 16:9 to the walls and less than that between the screen and the ceiling....Winning... You are about to do it sir


You sums of beotches!!!! This is exactly the kind of behavior I expect from the likes of you. I go 126 16:9 (current screen is 110 16:9) and feel pretty good about it and then the AVS bullies come along and make me feel inadequate...much like my wife...my boss..pretty much everyone I know!!!! 

I could easily go larger to 132 or 137 but felt like that would be overkill in my room...maybe I should call Rich today and "tweak" my order.


----------



## popalock

Frohlich said:


> You sums of beotches!!!! This is exactly the kind of behavior I expect from the likes of you. I go 126 16:9 (current screen is 110 16:9) and feel pretty good about it and then the AVS bullies come along and make me feel inadequate...much like my wife...my boss..pretty much everyone I know!!!!
> 
> I could easily go larger to 132 or 137 but felt like that would be overkill in my room...*maybe I should call Rich today and "tweak" my order*.


Meh... it's whatever makes you happy man. 

I think I recall Rich working on some sort of special _*AVS Peer Pressure*_ pricing where he actually increases the price tremendously to combat all the internet bullying we do on here... Might need to confirm with him though.


----------



## Frohlich

popalock said:


> Meh... it's whatever makes you happy man.
> 
> I think I recall Rich working on some sort of special _*AVS Peer Pressure*_ pricing where he actually increases the price tremendously to combat all the internet bullying we do on here... Might need to confirm with him though.


There was a little method to my madness.

1)I didn't go scope because I mostly watch 16:9 content (video games, ball games, TV,etc..) and realistically probably less then ten percent of my time is used actually watching blu rays. Also, my projector does not have lens memory so manually adjusting it is way too much work from a lazy "Ameriken" like me.

2) I was afraid if I blew up the image too big it would look worse and worse on non-blu ray content.

3)Moving to an AT screen is already inherently going to bring the screen 2 feet closer to the seating position (from about 14 feet to about 12 feet). So combining the increase of 16 inches in size diagonally with the 2 feet closer in distance I felt would be a nice increase in "immersion" of the screen.


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> If you want to take a quick trip up the hill to see the screen in action I am in Asheville  I will also add you to the NC/SC g2g thread that Rich posted a link to above!
> 
> The new material is the truth guys. You can be standing basically on top of the screen and not see a weave in the material. If you have any type of material projected onto it, it looks solid! Even in those high contrast bright white scenes in Art of Flight, I saw no crush, but a great amount of pop and dynamics to the color. I have seen the original material as well and this is certainly a step up. It is a little more elastic so it goes on the frame quite easily too  Any of you guys considering a new screen, this is the stuff for you without a doubt. I can't get enough of it


Thanks for the invite. I love Asheville -- it's sort of an island of reason in a growing sea of insanity. 

Glad to hear about the Horizon fabric. Got my samples of that and the Vision yesterday. The Horizon appears to be more "white", the Vision almost a dingy gray in comparison. I would thus think the Horizon would be brighter.  

But improved contrast is the better metric and preferred goal isn't it? My JVC RS4810 projector (bought 15 months ago) is reputed to be pretty good in the contrast area. The Horizon is significantly more flexible as well (thinner?). Price for the Horizon is $200 more I see. I'm gambling it's worth it.

My theater is basically done now, except for acoustic treatments. I'll be placing my order for a 110" 2:35 Horizon screen plus masking panels in a week or two. What's the normal delivery time?


----------



## beastaudio

Frohlich said:


> You sums of beotches!!!! This is exactly the kind of behavior I expect from the likes of you. I go 126 16:9 (current screen is 110 16:9) and feel pretty good about it and then the AVS bullies come along and make me feel inadequate...much like my wife...my boss..pretty much everyone I know!!!!
> 
> I could easily go larger to 132 or 137 but felt like that would be overkill in my room...maybe I should call Rich today and "tweak" my order.


Haha, games never looked so good on a big 138  Honestly, just take into account your speaker placement. I was perfectly happy with 126 beforehand, but the vertical parts of the screen basically sat dead center where I wanted my mains, so it was either go bigger, or go smaller and have the speakers on the outside of the screen. I went bigger so I could fit everything within the constraints of the screen frame  I Think you are spot on with 16:9 too with your usage.



archiguy said:


> Thanks for the invite. I love Asheville -- it's sort of an island of reason in a growing sea of insanity.
> 
> Glad to hear about the Horizon fabric. Got my samples of that and the Vision yesterday. The Horizon appears to be more "white", the Vision almost a dingy gray in comparison. I would thus think the Horizon would be brighter.
> 
> But improved contrast is the better metric and preferred goal isn't it? My JVC RS4810 projector (bought 15 months ago) is reputed to be pretty good in the contrast area. The Horizon is significantly more flexible as well (thinner?). Price for the Horizon is $200 more I see. I'm gambling it's worth it.
> 
> My theater is basically done now, except for acoustic treatments. I'll be placing my order for a 110" 2:35 Horizon screen plus masking panels in a week or two. What's the normal delivery time?


I am sure rich will see this and answer but he has pretty quick turnaround time, depending on what you are ordering


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> Thanks for the invite. I love Asheville -- it's sort of an island of reason in a growing sea of insanity.
> 
> Glad to hear about the Horizon fabric. Got my samples of that and the Vision yesterday. The Horizon appears to be more "white", the Vision almost a dingy gray in comparison. I would thus think the Horizon would be brighter.
> 
> But improved contrast is the better metric and preferred goal isn't it? My JVC RS4810 projector (bought 15 months ago) is reputed to be pretty good in the contrast area. The Horizon is significantly more flexible as well (thinner?). Price for the Horizon is $200 more I see. I'm gambling it's worth it.
> 
> My theater is basically done now, except for acoustic treatments. I'll be placing my order for a 110" 2:35 Horizon screen plus masking panels in a week or two. What's the normal delivery time?



Horizon is little more neutral the HD, The advantage to Horizon is even though HD has a very smooth and tight weave, Horizon is even smoother, it is total different type of fabric all together, it will give that solid screen look and feel with the added beauty of being accoustically transparent.

Lead time on most screen is two weeks but we always try to get them out sooner and in most cases we do. 
looking forward to seeing pics of that 110" in your space.

Rich


----------



## Frohlich

beastaudio said:


> Haha, games never looked so good on a big 138  Honestly, just take into account your speaker placement. I was perfectly happy with 126 beforehand, but the vertical parts of the screen basically sat dead center where I wanted my mains, so it was either go bigger, or go smaller and have the speakers on the outside of the screen. I went bigger so I could fit everything within the constraints of the screen frame  I Think you are spot on with 16:9 too with your usage.


Beast, since you have the exact screen material I am switching to any thought about your projector having enough brightness for your new size screen. You have a JVC I think, and I have a Sony HW50. I didn't know if you start getting up in the 140 size , combined with a lower gain AT screen, might start causing a lack of brightness? I actually chose the 126 for very similar reasons you stated above. I played around with brining my LCR speaker on top of my subs and they actually sounded great at that width and height. So 126 is the smallest I could go and have all my speakers still layed out correctly. I could in theory go one or two sizes larger than 126 (132 or 138) in my room and the screen would still fit. The 150 size is too large as I would run out of space because I have low ceilings in my HT room (basement).


----------



## beastaudio

Frohlich said:


> Beast, since you have the exact screen material I am switching to any thought about your projector having enough brightness for your new size screen. You have a JVC I think, and I have a Sony HW50. I didn't know if you start getting up in the 140 size , combined with a lower gain AT screen, might start causing a lack of brightness? I actually chose the 126 for very similar reasons you stated above. I played around with brining my LCR speaker on top of my subs and they actually sounded great at that width and height. So 126 is the smallest I could go and have all my speakers still layed out correctly. I could in theory go one or two sizes larger than 126 (132 or 138) in my room and the screen would still fit. The 150 size is too large as I would run out of space because I have low ceilings in my HT room (basement).


Yep, I think you and I have about the same from wall then, or at least your alcove area. I love a very wide setup for my speakers. Honestly, I think it sounds best when I sit a little inside an equilateral triangle to them, but the couch can't live there as it is entirely too close  With that said, if you found a spot where your mains sound good and present a great stereo image, then you are headed down the right path. As I said, I only went bigger b/c I preferred a wider L/R placement.

Oh and brightness? Pshh with the 4910 which is comparable in brightness to the 50 you have, if not a little dimmer, from 16 feet which is two feet further back than I could place it for minimum throw, and I get all the brightness I need....In eco mode to boot  You won't have any issues for sure


----------



## Frohlich

beastaudio said:


> Yep, I think you and I have about the same from wall then, or at least your alcove area. I love a very wide setup for my speakers. Honestly, I think it sounds best when I sit a little inside an equilateral triangle to them, but the couch can't live there as it is entirely too close  With that said, if you found a spot where your mains sound good and present a great stereo image, then you are headed down the right path. As I said, I only went bigger b/c I preferred a wider L/R placement.
> 
> Oh and brightness? Pshh with the 4910 which is comparable in brightness to the 50 you have, if not a little dimmer, from 16 feet which is two feet further back than I could place it for minimum throw, and I get all the brightness I need....In eco mode to boot  You won't have any issues for sure


Thank you for your help and thoughts. The portion of my basement with the HT is around 14W 18L 7H. I am not a 2 channel guy like you are, I am 99% HT. I actually thought my JTR 212s sounded better closer together on top of the subs when I was tinkering yesterday than their current position. I think it also was because the tweeter was now closer to ear level..especially the center channel which I currently have below the screen. Keep in mind, I am going from what I thought I have read in various posts, that your Danley speakers throw a very large soundstage..larger than my speakers. At the current width, it almost seems like the soundstage wasn't big enough to cover the current spacing of my speakers


----------



## jbrown15

Rich how does the new Horizon material compare acoustically to the original AT screen material that I have with it being a tighter weave? I'll be placing my order next week Rich, I'm just in the process of selling my JTR speakers right now. Once that's taken care I'll be placing my order for a new scope screen and masking panels!  @brandon, how much eq work did you have to do to account for the screen?


----------



## beastaudio

Yes the fiddys definitely are a huge soundstage. broad and defined at the same time though. Instrument placement can be anywhere from dead center, to 2 feet left of the left speaker, to behind me in certain cases. It is remarkable honestly. If you are having thoughts that your current soundstage isn't wide enough, perhaps a little more placement experimentation would be warranted. As you are coming from basically having them corner loaded, perhaps a happy medium?


----------



## beastaudio

jbrown15 said:


> Rich how does the new Horizon material compare acoustically to the original AT screen material that I have with it being a tighter weave? I'll be placing my order next week Rich, I'm just in the process of selling my JTR speakers right now. Once that's taken care I'll be placing my order for a new scope screen and masking panels!  @brandon, how much eq work did you have to do to account for the screen?


None. Well, I don't eq period anymore anyways, but the top end rolloff isn't one bit noticeable. I will try and measure at some point to see the difference but with the material being thinner than the standard HD, it can guess it only gets better. Here is a graph I did of no screen, XD material and firehawk microperf a few years ago. You can clearly see the benefits of woven over Microperf, and my guess is this horizon will be somewhere between the XD and No screen at all. This was with the mic right up within a few inches of the screen material.


----------



## jbrown15

Well 115" wide scope screen with the new Horizontal material and masking panels is bought and pair for! 
Now the hard part begins, the two week wait! ....lol


Can wait to compare the new screen material to my only Falcon screen too!


----------



## Frohlich

jbrown15 said:


> Well 115" wide scope screen with the new Horizontal material and masking panels is bought and pair for!
> Now the hard part begins, the two week wait! ....lol
> 
> 
> Can wait to compare the new screen material to my only Falcon screen too!


Nice!!!


----------



## jjcook

Rich, I'm currently using in wall speakers with tweeter at best about 1" from the HD material, is there a specification for the min distance for the new Horizon material?


----------



## snickers1

jjcook said:


> Rich, I'm currently using in wall speakers with tweeter at best about 1" from the HD material, is there a specification for the min distance for the new Horizon material?


It is the Same 

Rich


----------



## beastaudio

I couple of screenshots of the new Horizon through a few movies I have managed to work through so far. Keep in mind these are iphone shots, but the crisp detail can even be seen a little through these. I am lovign the new material....It simply makes watching movies THAT much better from what I was used to.


----------



## beastaudio

And here is a comparison I did against the XD material. You can see in the first pic with no flash the difference between the weave quite clearly. The second one shows a little less of that, but the contrast between the two materials is still pretty evident.

Nice and Tight!


----------



## Frohlich

Thank you for the pics. I am getting excited as my Horizon screen should probably be here next week. 

BTW, it is sad that I can recognize most of the the blu ray movies (Godzilla and Art of Flight) from your screen shots within .5 seconds. I need to get a life


----------



## beastaudio

Haha. The gozilla shots weren't that good but on the night scene, it was great, I literally couldn't see the screen edge on any of the dark scenes on the top or bottom.


----------



## Frohlich

Just received my tracking number from Rich


----------



## rizki96

hi rich

very interested on horizon vision. Please check email. -yogi-


----------



## jbrown15

Frohlich said:


> Just received my tracking number from Rich



I'm hoping to get my tracking number next week.  hint hint Rich!...lol


----------



## snickers1

jbrown15 said:


> I'm hoping to get my tracking number next week.  hint hint Rich!...lol


HA!!! did you say you needed it that soon????? thought you had said something about needing 3 weeks to get ready for it  , you will probably see you tracking sometime on Monday


----------



## jbrown15

snickers1 said:


> HA!!! did you say you needed it that soon????? thought you had said something about needing 3 weeks to get ready for it  , you will probably see you tracking sometime on Monday



I guy can change his mind can't he?....lol


----------



## snickers1

Congrads to Joe (VACHief) for making home theater of the month: HT of the Month: Sleight of Hand


----------



## Frohlich

So I wanted to post my initial impressions of my new Falcon 16:9 Horizon AT screen which I ordered at 126 size.

Ordering/Customer service: Rich was very nice, professional, friendly and timely. He quoted me two weeks but got it out in 8 days. I would do business with Rich again in a heartbeat.

Size: Going from a 110 traditional screen to a 126 AT screen that is now 2 feet closer to my seats, the size increase in noticeable and impressive. Glad I went bigger.

AT material picture quality: One of my concerns all along was that moving from my Stewart Cima screen to any AT screen, was that the picture quality would suffer. I can say that this does not appear to be the case. The picture is very pleasant and I wouldn't know it was an AT screen from that standpoint unless you told me. I cannot see the weave at all from my seating position and can't really see it at all until I get right up on the screen. The one small area that I did notice that wasn't quite what my old screen was is the black level. My old screen was actually below 1.0 (gray material) and had pretty good blacks as result...at the expense of brightness. I know this screen is brighter than my old screen if you can believe that, even though it is AT. I actually took the lamp mode on my projector from high to low.

AT material sound quality: Having the speakers behind the screen for the first time is very nice. Makes watching movies much more seamless and this has been a huge upgrade to my system and pleasure derived from watching movies. I doubt I will ever go back to a non-AT screen (queue Jbrown and Beast saying "I told you so")


----------



## beastaudio

Frohlich said:


> AT material sound quality: Having the speakers behind the screen for the first time is very nice. Makes watching movies much more seamless and this has been a huge upgrade to my system and pleasure derived from watching movies. I doubt I will ever go back to a non-AT screen (queue Jbrown and Beast saying "I told you so")


No sir, I just push people to make decisions I know they won't regret. I take pride in your newfound enjoyment of this fantastic material, as well as your "re" enjoyment of many movies you will want to watch again with your new bigger format. You won't see any gloating from me good sir. 

:grin::grin::grin::grin:


----------



## Tom Bley

Frohlich said:


> So I wanted to post my initial impressions of my new Falcon 16:9 Horizon AT screen which I ordered at 126 size.
> 
> Ordering/Customer service: Rich was very nice, professional, friendly and timely. He quoted me two weeks but got it out in 8 days. I would do business with Rich again in a heartbeat.
> 
> Size: Going from a 110 traditional screen to a 126 AT screen that is now 2 feet closer to my seats, the size increase in noticeable and impressive. Glad I went bigger.
> 
> AT material picture quality: One of my concerns all along was that moving from my Stewart Cima screen to any AT screen, was that the picture quality would suffer. I can say that this does not appear to be the case. The picture is very pleasant and I wouldn't know it was an AT screen from that standpoint unless you told me. I cannot see the weave at all from my seating position and can't really see it at all until I get right up on the screen. The one small area that I did notice that wasn't quite what my old screen was is the black level. My old screen was actually below 1.0 (gray material) and had pretty good blacks as result...at the expense of brightness. I know this screen is brighter than my old screen if you can believe that, even though it is AT. I actually took the lamp mode on my projector from high to low.
> 
> AT material sound quality: Having the speakers behind the screen for the first time is very nice. Makes watching movies much more seamless and this has been a huge upgrade to my system and pleasure derived from watching movies. I doubt I will ever go back to a non-AT screen (queue Jbrown and Beast saying "I told you so")


Which screen surface did you get? Is horizon the 4k material?


----------



## Frohlich

Tom Bley said:


> Which screen surface did you get? Is horizon the 4k material?


Correct, the Horizon material is the new acoustically transparent material from Falcon. They also introduced two other new materials but those are not acoustically transparent.


----------



## Potatogod93

What makes a screen 4K? Excuse my ignorance but isn't that dependent on the source?


----------



## beastaudio

People are coming out with tighter weaves in the fabric that will allow the material to "properly" display the UHD and 4K material. The looser weaves could have potential negatives.


----------



## metalguy

beastaudio said:


> People are coming out with tighter weaves in the fabric that will allow the material to "properly" display the UHD and 4K material. The looser weaves could have potential negatives.


Are falcon screens made in the usa or a Chinese import like Silver Ticket or Elite Screens and then imported? do you make your own screen material, or are you more of a "mail order" and a warehouse? Just asking as I am not able to ascertain any of this information anywhere. 

I just want to completely understand your company. And I think others here would as well. I think with this information it will help me and others on where to send our money so the more information the better.


----------



## snickers1

metalguy said:


> Are falcon screens made in the usa or a Chinese import like Silver Ticket or Elite Screens and then imported? do you make your own screen material, or are you more of a "mail order" and a warehouse? Just asking as I am not able to ascertain any of this information anywhere.
> 
> I just want to completely understand your company. And I think others here would as well. I think with this information it will help me and others on where to send our money so the more information the better.



Falcon Screens was started when i built my own Theater i am a die hard DIY guy and i loved every minute of building my theater...ok minus hanging two layers of drywall 
I have always loved this hobby and the idea of building my own space then being done except for the occaisional upgrades of equipment ect.. was something that i did not want, I truly love this hobby so when it came time for me to choose my screen for my space my wife and i where discussing the different options and she took a look around the room and just kind of in a joking way said you built this whole theater and bar area on your own why can't you build your own screen? that set the seed. To make a long story short i started off coming up with a great Fabric the First being Falcon Vison HD, and then designed the Frame. I came up the design and then worked with a aluminium extruder here in the USA and with the help of there engineer we designed what is now the Falcon Screens Frame it is like no other in my opinion we use a very unigue and very strong corner bracket system that not only mimics a welded joint but also makes assembly very easy. The Frame the parts the Fabrics everything is made and built here in the USA. We do not import any of our materials. 

I started out as F-16 Fighting "Falcon" crew chief in the USAF and i loved that job more then anything and often look back on my time crewing jets and still miss it sometimes, the passion i had for that jet has carried over into my passion for this hobby and it helped when coming up with the company name . 

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## beastaudio

metalguy said:


> Are falcon screens made in the usa or a Chinese import like Silver Ticket or Elite Screens and then imported? do you make your own screen material, or are you more of a "mail order" and a warehouse? Just asking as I am not able to ascertain any of this information anywhere.
> 
> I just want to completely understand your company. And I think others here would as well. I think with this information it will help me and others on where to send our money so the more information the better.


Metal guy, I love metal too, kind of like the nice Aluminum frames that Falcon Screens offer...and the genre of music too 

My only affiliation to Falcon screens is I am their CIO, Chief Information Officer (Thanks Rich for the promotion  ) and an avid fan of the screen design and material itself. Our CEO will have to answer your questions further! EDIT: looks like he already answered your question!


----------



## 24Changer

snickers1 said:


> I started out as F-16 Fighting "Falcon" crew chief in the USAF and i loved that job more then anything and often look back on my time crewing jets and still miss it sometimes, the passion i had for that jet has carried over into my passion for this hobby and it helped when coming up with the company name .


 That really cool Rich, thanks for sharing.
Now, I haven't viewed an image on my own Falcon Screen yet, but the frame is top notch. Very sturdy and super easy to assemble.


----------



## metalguy

snickers1 said:


> Falcon Screens was started when i built my own Theater i am a die hard DIY guy and i loved every minute of building my theater...ok minus hanging two layers of drywall
> I have always loved this hobby and the idea of building my own space then being done except for the occasional upgrades of equipment ect.. was something that i did not want, I truly love this hobby so when it came time for me to choose my screen for my space my wife and i where discussing the different options and she took a look around the room and just kind of in a joking way said you built this whole theater and bar area on your own why can't you build your own screen? that set the seed. To make a long story short i started off coming up with a great Fabric the First being Falcon Vison HD, and then designed the Frame. I came up the design and then worked with a aluminium extruder here in the USA and with the help of there engineer we designed what is now the Falcon Screens Frame it is like no other in my opinion we use a very unigue and very strong corner bracket system that not only mimics a welded joint but also makes assembly very easy. The Frame the parts the Fabrics everything is made and built here in the USA. We do not import any of our materials.
> 
> I started out as F-16 Fighting "Falcon" crew chief in the USAF and i loved that job more then anything and often look back on my time crewing jets and still miss it sometimes, the passion i had for that jet has carried over into my passion for this hobby and it helped when coming up with the company name .
> 
> Thanks
> Rich


Thank you for your reply it was very informative. I get everything minus the screen you say you came up with that. Do you do what fashion designers do? What they do is each year certain materials comes out patterns fabrics and so on and they worth with whats out there. So do you work with what screens are out there or do you say i want a " weave like this with a gain like that or what" I have never heard of a small company designing their own screen so I am trying to understand it, compared to huge companies like Stewart and SI who charge thousands who i can see could have their own CAD team or what ever you use to design a screen how do you do it. 
And lastly how would you sell me on your stuff versus SI or Stewert. I thank you for your time and candor in this. Its very helpful. And so far you have gone to the top of my list.


----------



## snickers1

beastaudio said:


> Metal guy, I love metal too, kind of like the nice Aluminum frames that Falcon Screens offer...and the genre of music too
> 
> My only affiliation to Falcon screens is I am their CIO, Chief Information Officer (Thanks Rich for the promotion  ) and an avid fan of the screen design and material itself. Our CEO will have to answer your questions further! EDIT: looks like he already answered your question!


Someone is looking for a Christmas bonus LOL!!



24Changer said:


> That really cool Rich, thanks for sharing.
> Now, I haven't viewed an image on my own Falcon Screen yet, but the frame is top notch. Very sturdy and super easy to assemble.


thank you! looking forward to seeing the pics of when you have got your theater all wrapped up



metalguy said:


> Thank you for your reply it was very informative. I get everything minus the screen you say you came up with that. Do you do what fashion designers do? What they do is each year certain materials comes out patterns fabrics and so on and they worth with whats out there. So do you work with what screens are out there or do you say i want a " weave like this with a gain like that or what" I have never heard of a small company designing their own screen so I am trying to understand it, compared to huge companies like Stewart and SI who charge thousands who i can see could have their own CAD team or what ever you use to design a screen how do you do it.
> And lastly how would you sell me on your stuff versus SI or Stewert. I thank you for your time and candor in this. Its very helpful. And so far you have gone to the top of my list.


I don't think it is exactly like a fasion designer ... What i looked for in a fabric was certain charectoristics first how did a projected image appear on it, did the image pop, how where the black levels did it moire, how visable was the weave the pattern, how did it perform accoustically, etc.. As far as small company designing there screen as a whole sure it can be done i did it and the companies you mentioned where small at one time to. I don't have CAD experience but i worked with a engineer that did and that is how the frame was designed. 

What i wiil say about Falcon Screens is that along my journey of building my theater is i know what it feels like to try to get all your wants and dreams into your space
you try so very hard to get eveything you can out your budget, yes some people have larger budgets then others and yes the budget your start with usually grows, but why not get everything you wanted and not feel like you have to get one model down projector or Amp or receiver or what ever because you have to spend thousands from a huge company as you said. 

If you would like a sample of any of our materials please feel free to send me a PM i would be happy to send to them out to you.

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## metalguy

http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/manufactured-screens/69663-falcon-screens.html
Do you agree with this review Rich? What stood out to me was the guy saying it was more of a 1.1 gain versus 1.0. but you might not make that screen anymore anyways. Just wanted to see your thoughts on his review.


----------



## snickers1

metalguy said:


> http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/manufactured-screens/69663-falcon-screens.html
> Do you agree with this review Rich? What stood out to me was the guy saying it was more of a 1.1 gain versus 1.0. but you might not make that screen anymore anyways. Just wanted to see your thoughts on his review.


saying it "looked" like 1.0 versus 1.1 is fine.... 

"If I were on the market for an acoustically transparent screen today, I wouldn't hesitate to give Rich a call. The framing is as I stated above, extremely solid and the screen material is of high quality. And pricing seems to be on the low end for these types of screens. I highly recommend Falcon Screens." 

Seems like Fair review to me


----------



## popalock

Rich, your screen is heavy. 

Any chance of a carbon fiber version coming out down the road? 





Weight savings should help everything in my theater go faster...


----------



## snickers1

popalock said:


> Rich, your screen is heavy.
> 
> Any chance of a carbon fiber version coming our down the road?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Weight savings should help everything in my theater go faster...



LOL!! its not heavy at all 

but yes to make your theater go faster ...i plan on teaming up with Lamborghini and working on a new monocoque carbon fiber frame


----------



## Frohlich

snickers1 said:


> LOL!! its not heavy at all
> 
> but yes to make your theater go faster ...i plan on teaming up with Lamborghini and working on a new monocoque carbon fiber frame


Just posted my new Horizon screen on Ebay so I can get the new carbon fiber frame...with ...wait for it...wait for it...carbon fiber masking panels. YES!!!!!!


----------



## aroby

snickers1 said:


> What i wiil say about Falcon Screens is that along my journey of building my theater is i know what it feels like to try to get all your wants and dreams into your space
> you try so very hard to get eveything you can out your budget, yes some people have larger budgets then others and yes the budget your start with usually grows, but why not get everything you wanted and not feel like you have to get one model down projector or Amp or receiver or what ever because you have to spend thousands from a huge company as you said.
> 
> If you would like a sample of any of our materials please feel free to send me a PM i would be happy to send to them out to you.
> 
> Thanks
> Rich


I was originally contemplating building my own screen. I'd never heard of Falcon screens until the weekend when I was doing more research and based on all the positive comments in this thread, decided to go down this route. Plus I may be finished now in time for Xmas! Looking forward to receiving my screen - order was placed yesterday.

Anthony


----------



## beastaudio

Welcome to the club man! What material did you go with? The new Horizon?


----------



## aroby

beastaudio said:


> Welcome to the club man! What material did you go with? The new Horizon?


Yes. Seemed to be the no brainer choice.


----------



## Frohlich

New Horizon screen keeps impressing. Really enjoying the bigger size, the picture quality and the experience of having the speakers behind the AT screen. Had some company over today and the guys watched football and then watched expendable 3 and got a lot of compliments on the "theater" like experience of the screen. thanks again Rich


----------



## jbrown15

Frohlich said:


> New Horizon screen keeps impressing. Really enjoying the bigger size, the picture quality and the experience of having the speakers behind the AT screen. Had some company over today and the guys watched football and then watched expendable 3 and got a lot of compliments on the "theater" like experience of the screen. thanks again Rich



So do we get to see some pictures or what?


----------



## snickers1

Frohlich said:


> New Horizon screen keeps impressing. Really enjoying the bigger size, the picture quality and the experience of having the speakers behind the AT screen. Had some company over today and the guys watched football and then watched expendable 3 and got a lot of compliments on the "theater" like experience of the screen. thanks again Rich


Your very welcome, glad your enjoying you the theater and screen. 



jbrown15 said:


> So do we get to see some pictures or what?


 exactly


----------



## Frohlich

Ok, snapped some pictures today of my new Falcon Horizon AT screen. Here you go 



Naked:










Fully Dressed:


----------



## beastaudio

Do you vacuum everytime before you take pictures? Nice...


----------



## awedio

Last night, I made a deal with the "boss" about needing a new TV...

Out with the old (1 yr old) TV.. in with the new..

As they say in Texas, go *big* or go home.

Time for the Falcon Vision Horizon FVS160


----------



## Frohlich

beastaudio said:


> Do you vacuum everytime before you take pictures? Nice...


Ummm...yes!!! Us city folk like to keep a nice tidy house


----------



## awedio

email sent


----------



## archiguy

Frohlich said:


> Ok, snapped some pictures today of my new Falcon Horizon AT screen. Here you go
> 
> 
> 
> Naked:


That's some speaker array! I assume those are subs on the bottom? Better reinforce the floor! 

What are the blackish panels on the wall amongst all those speakers? Some kind of acoustic treatment panels? What's the composition?


----------



## Frohlich

archiguy said:


> That's some speaker array! I assume those are subs on the bottom? Better reinforce the floor!
> 
> What are the blackish panels on the wall amongst all those speakers? Some kind of acoustic treatment panels? What's the composition?


Correct, there are two bass traps (one in each corner) and the two panels on each side of the center channel are acoustic absorption panels. On the right wall are mixed panels of diffusion and absorption.

Yes, those are subs on the floor holding up the speakers. They are JTR S2 subs....actually all 9 (7.2 setup) of my speakers are JTR


----------



## archiguy

Frohlich said:


> Correct, there are two bass traps (one in each corner) and the two panels on each side of the center channel are acoustic absorption panels. On the right wall are mixed panels of diffusion and absorption.


Thanks, but what I was really asking is what is the composition of those panels? How are they made and what are they made of? Reason I'm asking is I'm going to have to put _some_thing on the front wall behind my Falcon Horizon screen and I'm not sure how to do it [inexpensively]. I have no more budget to buy Linacoustic or a similar product and no more time to build frames to hold it.

My plan right now is to use some GP "Stedi-R" light fiberboard (now called "regular fiberboard sheathing") on the wall behind the screen and around the 3 in-wall Triad Bronze speakers. I'll wrap them in some of that black velvet fabric from JoAnne's. It has an R-value of 1.32 and an STC of 26. It's light and relatively soft (you can break it apart with your hands).

I have (4) 4'x9' sheets of the stuff left over from construction, enough to cover that wall, and thought that might be a good use for it (otherwise it will just get thrown away). Plus, I won't have to build frames to hold it, as I think I can wrap them in fabric and staple them in the back and the material should have enough structural stability to hold the staples in. Then I'll mount them with impaling clips and hang the screen over top of it.

I know I need something on that back wall other than hard drywall - just trying to figure out a cheap-yet-effective way to do it.


----------



## Frohlich

archiguy said:


> Thanks, but what I was really asking is what is the composition of those panels? How are they made and what are they made of? Reason I'm asking is I'm going to have to put _some_thing on the front wall behind my Falcon Horizon screen and I'm not sure how to do it [inexpensively]. I have no more budget to buy Linacoustic or a similar product and no more time to build frames to hold it.
> 
> My plan right now is to use some GP "Stedi-R" light fiberboard (now called "regular fiberboard sheathing") on the wall behind the screen and around the 3 in-wall Triad Bronze speakers. I'll wrap them in some of that black velvet fabric from JoAnne's. It has an R-value of 1.32 and an STC of 26. It's light and relatively soft (you can break it apart with your hands).
> 
> I have (4) 4'x9' sheets of the stuff left over from construction, enough to cover that wall, and thought that might be a good use for it (otherwise it will just get thrown away). Plus, I won't have to build frames to hold it, as I think I can wrap them in fabric and staple them in the back and the material should have enough structural stability to hold the staples in. Then I'll mount them with impaling clips and hang the screen over top of it.
> 
> I know I need something on that back wall other than hard drywall - just trying to figure out a cheap-yet-effective way to do it.



Sorry about that, I misunderstood your question. Unfortunately I do not know the composition as I bought all four pieces from Acoustimac.com. When I looked at their web site real quick all I saw was "owens corning material".


----------



## archiguy

Frohlich said:


> Sorry about that, I misunderstood your question. Unfortunately I do not know the composition as I bought all four pieces from Acoustimac.com. When I looked at their web site real quick all I saw was "owens corning material".


Thanks. It's probably a Linacoustic-type duct liner material wrapped in fabric.


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> Thanks, but what I was really asking is what is the composition of those panels? How are they made and what are they made of? Reason I'm asking is I'm going to have to put _some_thing on the front wall behind my Falcon Horizon screen and I'm not sure how to do it [inexpensively]. I have no more budget to buy Linacoustic or a similar product and no more time to build frames to hold it.
> 
> My plan right now is to use some GP "Stedi-R" light fiberboard (now called "regular fiberboard sheathing") on the wall behind the screen and around the 3 in-wall Triad Bronze speakers. I'll wrap them in some of that black velvet fabric from JoAnne's. It has an R-value of 1.32 and an STC of 26. It's light and relatively soft (you can break it apart with your hands).
> 
> I have (4) 4'x9' sheets of the stuff left over from construction, enough to cover that wall, and thought that might be a good use for it (otherwise it will just get thrown away). Plus, I won't have to build frames to hold it, as I think I can wrap them in fabric and staple them in the back and the material should have enough structural stability to hold the staples in. Then I'll mount them with impaling clips and hang the screen over top of it.
> 
> I know I need something on that back wall other than hard drywall - just trying to figure out a cheap-yet-effective way to do it.


You can go floor to ceiling on your front wall with any material that is similar to linacoustic for pretty cheap. With LA being the more expensive version, I looked elsewhere and found several other options I could source from Asheville for about half the cost of what LA would have been. I used an erskine design where I layed a single layer of 1" down, with 4 mil plastic sheeting on top, then a second layer of 1" thick material on top of that, basically like a sandwich. 

I am not familiar with the velvet you referenced, but a better option is the jo-ann speaker cloth as it will allow anything behind it's absorption coefficient to not change at all. I screwed the entire setup right into the studs on the front wall and the difference in the time domain was drastic, and it looks relatively uniform to boot


----------



## P007

BigCoolJesus said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Received my screen today, delivered by FedEx Freight. Let me say this, Rich ensures there is no possibility of damage AT ALL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still waiting on the new projector, so I can't give picture impressions but so far this screen gets an A+ for EVERY category. Construction, quality, directions, easy assembly. Cannot wait to get my projector and start watching movies again with this new setup!


I love your minimalist setup for your speakers that are behind your screen. I want to do something similar in my room. Do you have a build thread on your minimalist setup? Also how do you mount the screen? Thanks again for your help.

Percy


----------



## blipszyc

Getting ready to place my order, and am leaning toward the HD - besides the tighter weave, is there anything else different between the HD and the Horizon material? Is one brighter than the other? Also, with the HD, how far away is the weave noticeable?

My last screen was a Seymour XD, so I'd be curious to hear how the HD compares.


----------



## jbrown15

blipszyc said:


> Getting ready to place my order, and am leaning toward the HD - besides the tighter weave, is there anything else different between the HD and the Horizon material? Is one brighter than the other? Also, with the HD, how far away is the weave noticeable?
> 
> My last screen was a Seymour XD, so I'd be curious to hear how the HD compares.



With the HD material I could see the weave from 6ft away, with Horizontal you need to be a foot away and even then its more me noticing the pixel structure of the projector then the screen material.


----------



## blipszyc

jbrown15 said:


> With the HD material I could see the weave from 6ft away, with Horizontal you need to be a foot away and even then its more me noticing the pixel structure of the projector then the screen material.



So is it just pixel structure? Are the frames continuous, or split into two for the longer members? How do the masks attach - magnets? If I order a screen now, will the CIW (horizontal) masks attach properly?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jbrown15

blipszyc said:


> So is it just pixel structure? Are the frames continuous, or split into two for the longer members? How do the masks attach - magnets? If I order a screen now, will the CIW (horizontal) masks attach properly?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Yes it's just the pixel structure from my projector. The Horizon material looks like a sold screen, I have to saw its pretty awesome and I'm so glad I upgraded to a scope screen and went with the new material. I think Rich has a real winner with the new screen material. 

I've been meaning to write a mini review and take a bunch of photos to compare the two screens. 

The frame itself is four separate frame rails and you just use these really slick locking brackets to assemble the frame. It's really easy to do. And the masking panels are basically magnetic like you thought.


----------



## jbrown15

So I got a nice little Christmas present from Rich to go with my new screen! 
The new badge looks really sharp!












Once again Rich thanks for everything and keep up the great work with making kicka$$ screens, I'm so glad I went with Falcon.


----------



## MiniHT

^^ That looks really cool man! I would love to hear more of your impressions on the new material, as well as the "old" screen material. I'm actually about ready to order a screen, and settled on Falcon a while ago. The last thing I want to do is regret saving a few bucks and get that "what if" feeling if I go with the original material. The difference in cost between the two seems like a no brainer.. but hey, if I can save a few bucks.. I'm all for it. How do most of you guys order your Falcon screen? Do you order directly from Rich or did you go through AVS? I just purchased by PJ from Mike at AVS and it couldn't have gone any smoother.


As for my situation.. if it helps.. The room is extremely small at ~840 cubes. I will be width limited at ~8.5ft so I think going with a 16x9 screen is the way to go. At about a 10'-10.5' throw I should be able to get about a 85-90"w screen. I have a makeshift screen up right now trying to figure my max screen width. Room will be completely light controlled, and will be completely covered in Joann's velvet. I'm planning on doing DIY masking panels as well, to really get the most out of my new JVC 4910. I'll measure with REW before determining the exact LP, but the viewing distance will end up between 8-9.5ft. Any thoughts? Do you think I'll be able to pick up the weave in either of these screens from this distance? Just trying to gather as much info as I can before I take the leap... as this is my very first PJ setup. It'll be nice to finally have a big picture to match the big sound of my JTR's. I'm sure you can relate, J.  Beautiful setup BTW.


----------



## beastaudio

Mini, 

You will want to go for the 4910 and Horizon combo at that seating distance I think. I did the same combo at 11 feet and couldn't be happier  Give that 4910 a shot at no masking panels. If you watch in total darkness then ok, but even if there is just a _little_ ambient light in the room, you likely won't even see the need for masking panels.


----------



## MiniHT

beastaudio said:


> Mini,
> 
> You will want to go for the 4910 and Horizon combo at that seating distance I think. I did the same combo at 11 feet and couldn't be happier  Give that 4910 a shot at no masking panels. If you watch in total darkness then ok, but even if there is just a _little_ ambient light in the room, you likely won't even see the need for masking panels.


Thanks for the quick reply Beast! I'll definitely give it a shot w/o the masking panels at first. Do most AT screen users paint/apply velvet behind the screen as well? I thought about getting some speaker cloth and just putting it on the backside of the screen but am a bit worried if it'll effect the upper end of my FR. I know I could just EQ it out.. but I don't like MCACC all that much and currently don't use it. Then again, I can't hear much above 15khz anyways... so I guess that wouldn't really matter? Do you mind if I ask where you got your screen from? Rich? AVS? 


Thanks again for the input!


----------



## beastaudio

MiniHT said:


> Thanks for the quick reply Beast! I'll definitely give it a shot w/o the masking panels at first. Do most AT screen users paint/apply velvet behind the screen as well? I thought about getting some speaker cloth and just putting it on the backside of the screen but am a bit worried if it'll effect the upper end of my FR. I know I could just EQ it out.. but I don't like MCACC all that much and currently don't use it. Then again, I can't hear much above 15khz anyways... so I guess that wouldn't really matter? Do you mind if I ask where you got your screen from? Rich? AVS?
> 
> 
> Thanks again for the input!


I got my screen straight from Rich, as he was just getting the new material in, and hadn't even built a screen out with it yet. I didn't apply anything else behind the material, and can't see any bleedthrough so I think you should also be OK there. I do however have speaker cloth floor to ceiling on the rear wall and side walls up to the screen edge covering some acoustic treatment.


----------



## MiniHT

beastaudio said:


> I got my screen straight from Rich, as he was just getting the new material in, and hadn't even built a screen out with it yet. I didn't apply anything else behind the material, and can't see any bleedthrough so I think you should also be OK there. I do however have speaker cloth floor to ceiling on the rear wall and side walls up to the screen edge covering some acoustic treatment.



Thanks for all the info, Beast. It is much appreciated!


----------



## jjcook

MiniHT said:


> the viewing distance will end up between 8-9.5ft. Any thoughts? Do you think I'll be able to pick up the weave in either of these screens from this distance?


I would also recommend the new Horizon material as well. I currently use the original Vision HD material and sit about 9ft eyes to screen on a 100" wide 2.35:1 lit up by a RS4910. On low lamp after 400 hours I am still getting about 16ftL brightness with iris at -8 and calibrated to D65, for the 16:9 image anyways.

At this distance I find the gap between threads on the Vision HD material is slightly visible by dirtying (dark dots) the image a bit in bright uniformly lit scenes. I've tried the new Horizon sample and it is a lot better and virtually texture free -- for your setup of 85-90" wide 16:9 I think the RS4910 should be able to light it up no problem.

I'm likely switching to the new material as well, but am still on the fence on whether I should up my screen size in height to a 2.05:1 screen to increase my 16:9 content size when watching blockbuster movies but otherwise to mask it off to the current 16:9 size (about 88" diagonal) for casual content. Other consideration is the Vision HD material is pretty robust to handle my infant & preschooler, the Horizon is a bit more just like a fabric where I might be more concerned about damage or dirty fingers.


----------



## beastaudio

jjcook said:


> I would also recommend the new Horizon material as well. I currently use the original Vision HD material and sit about 9ft eyes to screen on a 100" wide 2.35:1 lit up by a RS4910. On low lamp after 400 hours I am still getting about 16ftL brightness with iris at -8 and calibrated to D65, for the 16:9 image anyways.
> 
> At this distance I find the gap between threads on the Vision HD material is slightly visible by dirtying (dark dots) the image a bit in bright uniformly lit scenes. I've tried the new Horizon sample and it is a lot better and virtually texture free -- for your setup of 85-90" wide 16:9 I think the RS4910 should be able to light it up no problem.
> 
> I'm likely switching to the new material as well, but am still on the fence on whether I should up my screen size in height to a 2.05:1 screen to increase my 16:9 content size when watching blockbuster movies but otherwise to mask it off to the current 16:9 size (about 88" diagonal) for casual content. Other consideration is the Vision HD material is pretty robust to handle my infant & preschooler, the Horizon is a bit more just like a fabric where I might be more concerned about damage or dirty fingers.


No need to worry about the dirty fingers, you can simply toss the fabric in the washing machine on delicate


----------



## MiniHT

jjcook said:


> I would also recommend the new Horizon material as well. I currently use the original Vision HD material and sit about 9ft eyes to screen on a 100" wide 2.35:1 lit up by a RS4910. On low lamp after 400 hours I am still getting about 16ftL brightness with iris at -8 and calibrated to D65, for the 16:9 image anyways.
> 
> At this distance I find the gap between threads on the Vision HD material is slightly visible by dirtying (dark dots) the image a bit in bright uniformly lit scenes. I've tried the new Horizon sample and it is a lot better and virtually texture free -- for your setup of 85-90" wide 16:9 I think the RS4910 should be able to light it up no problem.
> 
> I'm likely switching to the new material as well, but am still on the fence on whether I should up my screen size in height to a 2.05:1 screen to increase my 16:9 content size when watching blockbuster movies but otherwise to mask it off to the current 16:9 size (about 88" diagonal) for casual content. Other consideration is the Vision HD material is pretty robust to handle my infant & preschooler, the Horizon is a bit more just like a fabric where I might be more concerned about damage or dirty fingers.



Thanks for all the info JJ, I appreciate it.


----------



## JSKMDWK

archiguy said:


> Thanks, but what I was really asking is what is the composition of those panels? How are they made and what are they made of? Reason I'm asking is I'm going to have to put _some_thing on the front wall behind my Falcon Horizon screen and I'm not sure how to do it [inexpensively]. I have no more budget to buy Linacoustic or a similar product and no more time to build frames to hold it.
> 
> My plan right now is to use some GP "Stedi-R" light fiberboard (now called "regular fiberboard sheathing") on the wall behind the screen and around the 3 in-wall Triad Bronze speakers. I'll wrap them in some of that black velvet fabric from JoAnne's. It has an R-value of 1.32 and an STC of 26. It's light and relatively soft (you can break it apart with your hands).
> 
> I have (4) 4'x9' sheets of the stuff left over from construction, enough to cover that wall, and thought that might be a good use for it (otherwise it will just get thrown away). Plus, I won't have to build frames to hold it, as I think I can wrap them in fabric and staple them in the back and the material should have enough structural stability to hold the staples in. Then I'll mount them with impaling clips and hang the screen over top of it.
> 
> I know I need something on that back wall other than hard drywall - just trying to figure out a cheap-yet-effective way to do it.


I did the 2" Linacoustic behind the screen and it worked great.


----------



## archiguy

Just learned that the type of horizontal expansion A-lens I'll be using for 'scope content is 1.35x, not 1.33x, and thus optimized for a 2.40:1 screen ratio. But on the Falcon website, I don't see a 2.40 screen offered, just 2.35.

Is this the case? Are you limited to the 2.35 aspect ratio for 'scope Falcon screens (Ill be buying the Horizon material)...?


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> Just learned that the type of horizontal expansion A-lens I'll be using for 'scope content is 1.35x, not 1.33x, and thus optimized for a 2.40:1 screen ratio. But on the Falcon website, I don't see a 2.40 screen offered, just 2.35.
> 
> Is this the case? Are you limited to the 2.35 aspect ratio for 'scope Falcon screens (Ill be buying the Horizon material)...?



just shoot me an email or pm we can do 2.40:1 for you.

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## rboster

Hi Rich: Looking forward to comparing the Vision Platinum screen material to my SMX Cinematte Plus (which I think was a gain of 1.35)....but I think there was some question as to those numbers generated by SMX. 

I have one of the 120 inch wide SMX pro curve scope screens, which uses a slot/groove in the screen frame to install or stretch the material. The frame uses a rubber/plastic "t" bar to push the material into the slot and hold it in place. So the material has to be able to stretch. 

I wonder if anyone here has compared the Falcon VP material to the SMX screen material? I know it's a long shot  


Thanks

Ron

PS: I am pairing it with the JVC DLA-X700R in a completely light controlled room.


----------



## Stretch002

Just checking to see if your online sample request form is a complete waste of time. I filled out a request more than a week ago and have yet to get a response of any kind. Please let me know if there's something else I need to to do as I'm very interested in whether an AT screen will work in my new theater. Im willing to pay for a sample and the shipping. I just need to see the material with my own eyes.

Sitting 9' away from a 100" screen.


----------



## snickers1

Stretch002 said:


> Just checking to see if your online sample request form is a complete waste of time. I filled out a request more than a week ago and have yet to get a response of any kind. Please let me know if there's something else I need to to do as I'm very interested in whether an AT screen will work in my new theater. Im willing to pay for a sample and the shipping. I just need to see the material with my own eyes.
> 
> Sitting 9' away from a 100" screen.


we have a bunch samples that went out last week and another stack going out tomorrow or Tuesday, sending you pm to make sure we you in the list.

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## Stretch002

Thank you Rich!
Very impressed that you responded so quickly to my post AND on a Sunday night. Amazing! I've sent you a PM with my mailing address. Thanks again for your help! I can't wait to see your material in person!!


----------



## MiniHT

I saw up on the Falcon site a few days ago that there was a longer lead time due to the Holidays (completely understandable).. I think it was 4-5weeks.. but I don't see it posted now. Anyone know what the average lead time usually is? I know I could just call.. I have a snow day today so I'm feeling a bit lazy.  Looking at the new Horizon 90"W 16x9 screen fwiw.. Thanks in advance.


----------



## snickers1

MiniHT said:


> I saw up on the Falcon site a few days ago that there was a longer lead time due to the Holidays (completely understandable).. I think it was 4-5weeks.. but I don't see it posted now. Anyone know what the average lead time usually is? I know I could just call.. I have a snow day today so I'm feeling a bit lazy.  Looking at the new Horizon 90"W 16x9 screen fwiw.. Thanks in advance.


just sent you a pm, we still have backlog but are looking be back to our normal lead time of 2 weeks by the 3rd week Feb at the latest.


----------



## MiniHT

snickers1 said:


> just sent you a pm, we still have backlog but are looking be back to our normal lead time of 2 weeks by the 3rd week Feb at the latest.



PM sent. Thanks for the quick reply, Rich.


----------



## sigma722

Just read up on the last 3-4 pages...

I had not heard that there was a new screen material until now. This is very exciting! My plan is to have my front row just at 9ft from the screen, so it's nice to know that there will be an option even better than the previous. I was already leaning towards just the HD material.

On the site I don't see pricing for DIY material for Horizon. Looking at the full screens prices, I'm guessing it's about twice as much per foot (EDIT: this may not be accurate since it looks like all of the screens have a $200 price diff, not just the 120" wide)? Seems worth it still. 

Do those prices include grommets if needed?


----------



## jbrown15

sigma722 said:


> Just read up on the last 3-4 pages...
> 
> I had not heard that there was a new screen material until now. This is very exciting! My plan is to have my front row just at 9ft from the screen, so it's nice to know that there will be an option even better than the previous. I was already leaning towards just the HD material.
> 
> On the site I don't see pricing for DIY material for Horizon. Looking at the full screens prices, I'm guessing it's about twice as much per foot (EDIT: this may not be accurate since it looks like all of the screens have a $200 price diff, not just the 120" wide)? Seems worth it still.
> 
> Do those prices include grommets if needed?


If you have your heart set on the Horizon material you have to buy it with a Falcon frame, Rich isn't offering the horizon material up for DIY.


----------



## sigma722

jbrown15 said:


> If you have your heart set on the Horizon material you have to buy it with a Falcon frame, Rich isn't offering the horizon material up for DIY.


Oof.

EDIT: I just realized I probably put a notification in your inbox for that reply.. lol, sorry about that.


----------



## Lee Weber

Hey guys, just got an Horizon Screen set-up last night and first impressions are very positive. Great frame and frame locking system, easy set-up and the picture looks like the pop of a non-AT screen from my 9ft seating distance.


----------



## beastaudio

Lee Weber said:


> Hey guys, just got an Horizon Screen set-up last night and first impressions are very positive. Great frame and frame locking system, easy set-up and the picture looks like the pop of a non-AT screen from my 9ft seating distance.


With as nice of a weave as the Horizon material is, it almost IS like a non-at screen! Glad you are liking it so far.


----------



## Black adder

Hope to have my horizon screen setup soon, I'm afraid I bit off more than I can chew with all the things I have going.


----------



## dropzone7

Curious if there are any plans for Falcon to offer a curved screen. I would be interested in a 2.35:1 AT screen with curve.


----------



## Viruscwu

dropzone7 said:


> Curious if there are any plans for Falcon to offer a curved screen. I would be interested in a 2.35:1 AT screen with curve.


I'm in the same boat. I'm hoping for a 2.3x:1 curved AT offering.


----------



## auburnu008

Just ordered a Horizon 150 2:35. Looking forward to getting it on the wall!


----------



## beastaudio

That's huge! Enjoy man! It's the best screen system out there for sure


----------



## Mike Garrett

dropzone7 said:


> Curious if there are any plans for Falcon to offer a curved screen. I would be interested in a 2.35:1 AT screen with curve.





Viruscwu said:


> I'm in the same boat. I'm hoping for a 2.3x:1 curved AT offering.


Rich and I have talked about this and he has been looking into doing this, but it requires an expensive piece of equipment to do this right. Rich would need to be able to make enough sales to justify the expense.


----------



## MiniHT

Well, I just received my Email confirmation on my Horizon screen. I'm the proud new owner of a monster 85"W screen..  All I have to work with in my small room and a 10ft. throw. I'm pairing it up with a JVC 4910.. I'm excited to see the results. Thanks Rich!


----------



## archiguy

Rich, can you do side masking panels for a 2:40 ratio screen? Or are they "standardized" for a 2:35 screen?


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> Rich, can you do side masking panels for a 2:40 ratio screen? Or are they "standardized" for a 2:35 screen?


They can be done for both.


Thanks 
Rich


----------



## Frohlich

snickers1 said:


> They can be done for both.
> 
> 
> Thanks
> Rich


What about 16:9 screens...still waiting


----------



## jjcook

MiniHT said:


> Well, I just received my Email confirmation on my Horizon screen. I'm the proud new owner of a monster 85"W screen..  All I have to work with in my small room and a 10ft. throw. I'm pairing it up with a JVC 4910.. I'm excited to see the results. Thanks Rich!


If you're limited by the throw distance and not the wall width for the screen, you can always go bigger and reflect the 4910 off the rear wall off a first surface mirror -- that is what I do with my 4910 in a room 10' deep and 12' wide for a 100" wide 2.35 screen with viewing distance of ~9 ft eyes to screen. If you're doing a 16:9 screen and most of your content is that ratio, then at 9' viewing distance an 85" wide 16:9 would be a good size.


----------



## MiniHT

jjcook said:


> If you're limited by the throw distance and not the wall width for the screen, you can always go bigger and reflect the 4910 off the rear wall off a first surface mirror -- that is what I do with my 4910 in a room 10' deep and 12' wide for a 100" wide 2.35 screen with viewing distance of ~9 ft eyes to screen. If you're doing a 16:9 screen and most of your content is that ratio, then at 9' viewing distance an 85" wide 16:9 would be a good size.



Wow, what a cool idea. I never thought to do that! I'm width limited for sure, which is the main reason I went 16:9 as well. The widest I could go would be 90", which would basically be wall to wall with an inch or two to spare. I'll admit that most of the content I watch is scope, but do have some 16:9 content as well. Fwiw, I will be sitting ~8ft from the screen. Wow.. 9' from a 100"W screen has got to be incredible!  Do you have to use keystone or something to get the image square? I would imagine firing the image to a mirror, you would have to angle the PJ to have the reflecting image clear the PJ to the side of it or above it. Wouldn't this cause the image to "stretch?" Hopefully that makes sense..


----------



## Barrettmr

Frohlich said:


> What about 16:9 screens...still waiting


I'm still really enjoying my falcon screen 9 months into ownership. I love my huge 16:9 screen as scope movies are a great size and my projector gives really good black bars (rather than grey) and I get a big wow factor from variable aspect movies and 3D on 16:9 is just amazing. However, now and then I would like the option to throw up mask's for my screen when watching scoped movies with a dark theme just to help with the contrast. So I too would like to know if these are still in the works and any idea on time frame 


Thanks!!


----------



## jjcook

MiniHT said:


> Wow, what a cool idea. I never thought to do that! I'm width limited for sure, which is the main reason I went 16:9 as well. The widest I could go would be 90", which would basically be wall to wall with an inch or two to spare. I'll admit that most of the content I watch is scope, but do have some 16:9 content as well. Fwiw, I will be sitting ~8ft from the screen. Wow.. 9' from a 100"W screen has got to be incredible!  Do you have to use keystone or something to get the image square? I would imagine firing the image to a mirror, you would have to angle the PJ to have the reflecting image clear the PJ to the side of it or above it. Wouldn't this cause the image to "stretch?" Hopefully that makes sense..


No keystone or other artifact, in fact a conversion lens or anamorphic lens has much more chance for distortion. If you are using enough lens shift and distance from projector to mirror, you can keep the projector level with mirror parallel to the wall; in my case to get the projector closer to my 9' ceiling I have the mirror tilted 5 degrees and the projector tilted 10 degrees to match (JVC manual says no more than 15 degree tilt, for cooling reasons).

If you just need a few more inches you can alternately turn the projector 90 degrees sideways and reflect off of a small mirror at 45 degrees in front of the projector.

Lastly, with the mirror you can use the motorized lens shift/zoom for CIH without any additional planning besides enough mirror area.


----------



## MiniHT

^^ Thanks for all the info JJ. Interesting stuff


----------



## MiniHT

Just got my tracking info  Thanks Rich! Time to see what this Horizon screen is all about..


----------



## simon_templar_32

Has anybody verified the 1.0 gain figure for the Horizon material? I note that Seymour and Stewart claim only .8 for their fine weave.


----------



## eng-399

I'm going to buy a Falcon screen pretty soon and wanted to know how to mount this. I've seen several pictures and read the install procedure on falcons web site and know it goes on with the French cleats but I'm seeing everyone having vertical 2 by 4's going from the ground to the top of the screen framing and some with a 2 by 4 frame going across the bottom. Why are guys doing this should I do that to. If I need to should I do this before the carpet gets installed. What did all you guys do? Mike


----------



## popalock

eng-399 said:


> I'm going to buy a Falcon screen pretty soon and wanted to know how to mount this. I've seen several pictures and read the install procedure on falcons web site and know it goes on with the French cleats but I'm seeing everyone having vertical 2 by 4's going from the ground to the top of the screen framing and some with a 2 by 4 frame going across the bottom. Why are guys doing this should I do that to. If I need to should I do this before the carpet gets installed. What did all you guys do? Mike


Minimalist Approach to Screen Wall


----------



## Barrettmr

eng-399 said:


> I'm going to buy a Falcon screen pretty soon and wanted to know how to mount this. I've seen several pictures and read the install procedure on falcons web site and know it goes on with the French cleats but I'm seeing everyone having vertical 2 by 4's going from the ground to the top of the screen framing and some with a 2 by 4 frame going across the bottom. Why are guys doing this should I do that to. If I need to should I do this before the carpet gets installed. What did all you guys do? Mike



I don't think you 'need' any framing along the bottom if that works for you. I do not as I have half wall framed out under my screen as it was a mod to my original screen wall design for my new Falcon Screen and don't have any issues. I do have framing down the sides and along the top to hang it from but used 3"x1" so its all really down to your personal design.


----------



## eng-399

Barrettmr said:


> I don't think you 'need' any framing along the bottom if that works for you. I do not as I have half wall framed out under my screen as it was a mod to my original screen wall design for my new Falcon Screen and don't have any issues. I do have framing down the sides and along the top to hang it from but used 3"x1" so its all really down to your personal design.



Thanks for the help I wasn't sure what to do. the carpet guy was out today measuring the room and I wanted everything in place once the carpet gets put down. Mike


----------



## johann777

eng-399 said:


> I'm going to buy a Falcon screen pretty soon and wanted to know how to mount this. I've seen several pictures and read the install procedure on falcons web site and know it goes on with the French cleats but I'm seeing everyone having vertical 2 by 4's going from the ground to the top of the screen framing and some with a 2 by 4 frame going across the bottom. Why are guys doing this should I do that to. If I need to should I do this before the carpet gets installed. What did all you guys do? Mike


I just put up my 150' falcon horizon screen right against the wall and it looks nice. I have a stage with columns on each side of it. You don't have to use a 2x4 frame if you don't want to.


----------



## eng-399

Thanks for all the replies guys it helps


----------



## eng-399

Woot woot just ordered and paid for my new 16.9-120" Falcon Vision Horizon screen very excited to see this in a few weeks! I ended up being 1 inch short height wise for the 130" due to my soffits and stage height but the 120 will be nice up there. Talked to Rich on the phone today about the screen and was very helpful! Can't wait to see it on my false wall!!!


----------



## rboster

Hello Falcon screen owners....

I own an SMX screen and would to replace the screen material. Has anyone Used the Falcon grommet system/material on their SMX frame channels? Jeff (bigmouthindc) suggested the idea. Thanks Jeff! Looking at the Falcon website and the instructions for screen material installation, the idea looks very promising. I heard nothng but fantastic things about Rich and the Falcon screens, so my fingers are crossed. 

Ron

Ps: yes, I did send an email to Rich too


----------



## snickers1

rboster said:


> Hello Falcon screen owners....
> 
> I own an SMX screen and would to replace the screen material. Has anyone Used the Falcon grommet system/material on their SMX frame channels? Jeff (bigmouthindc) suggested the idea. Thanks Jeff! Looking at the Falcon website and the instructions for screen material installation, the idea looks very promising. I heard nothng but fantastic things about Rich and the Falcon screens, so my fingers are crossed.
> 
> Ron
> 
> Ps: yes, I did send an email to Rich too



Hi Ron,

I will reply to your PM and we can explore the options for sure.


----------



## rboster

snickers1 said:


> Hi Ron,
> 
> I will reply to your PM and we can explore the options for sure.


Sounds great Rich. Looking forward in seeing what we can come up with. Love to be a part of the Falcon Family.

Thanks
Ron


----------



## KanosWRX

I just wanted to add to the thread and give my high recommendation for the Falcon Horizon Screen. I got a 150" diagonal 16:9 screen from Rich and couldn't be more happy with his service and the quality of his screen. You can get a screen of this quality at this price  Thanks Rich for all your help!!


----------



## RedLefty

Great thread and I'm certainly intrigued! Did our basement DIY theater a couple of years ago and Phase 1 for the screen has been smooth painted drywall with a matte gray. That has served us fine but I'm eager to go AT and hide the speakers behind the screen for the immersion effect and improved location of sound. We sit at about 12' from 120" picture today, and I think the screen will move up 2' with the AT setup. So our seating distance would decrease to 10'. I'm thinking about reducing screen size to 110" or so. Projector is the popular BenQ W1070.

I know Horizon is all the rage on this thread but I'm considering the Vision HD because I'll probably want to DIY the frame for budget purposes. I also think the higher gain may help as well.

So this was just a note to say thanks for the good discussion, I'm now thinking about an upgrade to Falcon products, and it's all you guys' fault. 

If I go Vision HD with a DIY frame I'll definitely photo log the process. Will probably be a poplar frame mounted on french cleats, a minimalist false wall with stretch velvet masking around the screen, and I'll add some bass traps to the front corners (maybe as simple as stacked rolls of insulation with a covering of velvet or speaker cloth).

Rock on.


----------



## COACH2369

I just purchased my first Falcon screen this week, which will also be my first AT screen.

Decided to go with the Horizon FVS120, which is 2:35. Only going to be about 9 feet back when it is all said and done.

Now I wait patiently for the screen to be shipped.


----------



## eng-399

My 120" AT falcon screen comes Friday woot woot rich sent me the tracking number


----------



## sigma722

RedLefty said:


> Great thread and I'm certainly intrigued! Did our basement DIY theater a couple of years ago and Phase 1 for the screen has been smooth painted drywall with a matte gray. That has served us fine but I'm eager to go AT and hide the speakers behind the screen for the immersion effect and improved location of sound. We sit at about 12' from 120" picture today, and I think the screen will move up 2' with the AT setup. So our seating distance would decrease to 10'. I'm thinking about reducing screen size to 110" or so. Projector is the popular BenQ W1070.
> 
> I know Horizon is all the rage on this thread but I'm considering the Vision HD because I'll probably want to DIY the frame for budget purposes. I also think the higher gain may help as well.
> 
> So this was just a note to say thanks for the good discussion, I'm now thinking about an upgrade to Falcon products, and it's all you guys' fault.
> 
> If I go Vision HD with a DIY frame I'll definitely photo log the process. Will probably be a poplar frame mounted on french cleats, a minimalist false wall with stretch velvet masking around the screen, and I'll add some bass traps to the front corners (maybe as simple as stacked rolls of insulation with a covering of velvet or speaker cloth).
> 
> Rock on.


Still can't believe they won't make horizen available to DIYers.. smh


----------



## Glenn Baumann

COACH2369 said:


> I just purchased my first Falcon screen this week, which will also be my first AT screen.
> 
> Decided to go with the Horizon FVS120, which is 2:35. Only going to be about 9 feet back when it is all said and done.
> 
> Now I wait patiently for the screen to be shipped.




COACH2369,

Would really like to hear your impressions of the screen once you have had some time to evaluate it! 

What screen and projector are you using now?


...Glenn


----------



## jbrown15

sigma722 said:


> Still can't believe they won't make horizen available to DIYers.. smh



What's so hard to believe about it? SeymourAV does the same thing with their premium screen material don't they?


----------



## sigma722

jbrown15 said:


> What's so hard to believe about it? SeymourAV does the same thing with their premium screen material don't they?


1) What screen does SeymourAV not sell for DIY? I don't see it on their site.

2) Just becaues two companies does it doesn't make me feel happy about it. I thought this company was started with DIYers in mind. Obviously the company can do what they want, but for me, it just stinks because I'm going to have to sit a little closer to my screen, so when this new one got announced, I was pumped (under the company-for-DIY assumption). Not till later (I think my last post in this thread), did I see that they aren't doing it for DIY. So I guess it isn't hard to believe, just frustrating to either have to settle for a slightly less quality screen, or be roped into paying way for for a solution that I'd have to redo some of my planning for, along with paying 4-7 (hard to guage since there isn't a price for screen by itself) times as much.

3) It sounds like they are a great company. I've spoken to rich off and on, and he is very friendly. Just a weird decision in my opinion.


----------



## jbrown15

sigma722 said:


> 1) What screen does SeymourAV not sell for DIY? I don't see it on their site.
> 
> 
> 
> 2) Just becaues two companies does it doesn't make me feel happy about it. I thought this company was started with DIYers in mind. Obviously the company can do what they want, but for me, it just stinks because I'm going to have to sit a little closer to my screen, so when this new one got announced, I was pumped (under the company-for-DIY assumption). Not till later (I think my last post in this thread), did I see that they aren't doing it for DIY. So I guess it isn't hard to believe, just frustrating to either have to settle for a slightly less quality screen, or be roped into paying way for for a solution that I'd have to redo some of my planning for, along with paying 4-7 (hard to guage since there isn't a price for screen by itself) times as much.
> 
> 
> 
> 3) It sounds like they are a great company. I've spoken to rich off and on, and he is very friendly. Just a weird decision in my opinion.



Last time I checked SeymourAV doesn't offer their Enlightor 4K screen material to the DIY market. Again why is it hard to see why Falcon wouldn't want to offer his premium screen material to the DIY crowd. It's a smart business decision to only offer it with his frames. Not too mention his premium screen solutions aren't even that expensive when you compare them to any other AT screen around.


----------



## sigma722

jbrown15 said:


> Last time I checked SeymourAV doesn't offer their Enlightor 4K screen material to the DIY market. Again why is it hard to see why Falcon wouldn't want to offer his premium screen material to the DIY crowd. It's a smart business decision to only offer it with his frames. Not too mention his premium screen solutions aren't even that expensive when you compare them to any other AT screen around.


Oh, Seymour Screen Excellence. I see.

It's not hard to see why they are doing it. Is it hard to see why I don't want to spend $1000+ on an unneccesary component?


----------



## COACH2369

Glenn Baumann said:


> COACH2369,
> 
> Would really like to hear your impressions of the screen once you have had some time to evaluate it!
> 
> What screen and projector are you using now?
> 
> 
> ...Glenn



I am currently using a JVS RS-56U with a Carada 110" screen.


----------



## Glenn Baumann

COACH2369 said:


> I am currently using a JVS RS-56U with a Carada 110" screen.


Being that you are using a JVC projector, I am especially interested in the subjective comparison of your prior screen to the new one!

Was your Carada the Brilliant White and was it a 16:9?


...Glenn


----------



## COACH2369

Glenn Baumann said:


> Being that you are using a JVC projector, I am especially interested in the subjective comparison of your prior screen to the new one!
> 
> Was your Carada the Brilliant White and was it a 16:9?
> 
> 
> ...Glenn


It was a 2:35, brilliant White.


----------



## chriscmore

jbrown15 said:


> Last time I checked SeymourAV doesn't offer their Enlightor 4K screen material to the DIY market. Again why is it hard to see why Falcon wouldn't want to offer his premium screen material to the DIY crowd. It's a smart business decision to only offer it with his frames. Not too mention his premium screen solutions aren't even that expensive when you compare them to any other AT screen around.


Seymour AV does not have the Enlightor-4K screen material in any form. It's a European material, for use in the Seymour-Screen Excellence line, available through CEDIA companies. Different companies, different products.

Cheers,
Chris


----------



## jbrown15

chriscmore said:


> Seymour AV does not have the Enlightor-4K screen material in any form. It's a European material, for use in the Seymour-Screen Excellence line, available through CEDIA companies. Different companies, different products.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Chris



Well you use to at least because I ordered a 2'x2' sample of the EN4K material from you before deciding to go with the Falcon screen. I'm sorry if I haven't kept up with the latest offerings from your company.


----------



## eng-399

My new 120'' Falcon screen showed up today and the box looks like its in good shape! Once carpet comes for the room this week I'll post the screen shot. Thanks rich and by the way send a thanks to @jbrown15 he was the first to tell me about your company about a year ago. Can't wait to get this up on the wall!!!! Mike


----------



## jbrown15

eng-399 said:


> My new 120'' Falcon screen showed up today and the box looks like its in good shape! Once carpet comes for the room this week I'll post the screen shot. Thanks rich and by the way send a thanks to @jbrown15 he was the first to tell me about your company about a year ago. Can't wait to get this up on the wall!!!! Mike



I hope you love your screen as much as I love mine!


----------



## eng-399

jbrown15 said:


> I hope you love your screen as much as I love mine!



Joe I cant wait!! trim guys are coming sat and Sunday to finish up. The carpet gets installed Tuesday and Wednesday the screen goes up and my 7 chairs will arrive from rtheaters. It's a big week for me the wife and kids. I had a HT room at my last house with fabric on the walls cherry trim it was pretty nice and once it was done we sold are house 6 months after completion.So it's been a long couple of years of waiting to get to this point. I'm super excited and I'm sure the screen is going to be great in the room!


----------



## COACH2369

My new screen shipped yesterday...

Very, VERY excited to get everything in place and installed.

It will be a nice upgrade in size over my previous screen and not to mention it is AT now.


----------



## eng-399

COACH2369 said:


> My new screen shipped yesterday...
> 
> 
> 
> Very, VERY excited to get everything in place and installed.
> 
> 
> 
> It will be a nice upgrade in size over my previous screen and not to mention it is AT now.



Congrats!!! I hope mine is going up tonight or in the morning. Trying to get the room ready.


----------



## jbrown15

COACH2369 said:


> My new screen shipped yesterday...
> 
> Very, VERY excited to get everything in place and installed.
> 
> It will be a nice upgrade in size over my previous screen and not to mention it is AT now.



Jeff you're going to love your Falcon screen!


----------



## eng-399

Anyone who is trying to decide on what AT screen to buy would be crazy not to buy the falcon screen with the new material it looks so good and customer service from rich is outstanding!!! Going to write a review later tonight about it but I couldn't be more happy with my new falcon screen up!!


----------



## COACH2369

eng-399 said:


> Anyone who is trying to decide on what AT screen to buy would be crazy not to buy the falcon screen with the new material it looks so good and customer service from rich is outstanding!!! Going to write a review later tonight about it but I couldn't be more happy with my new falcon screen up!!


Looks GREAT!

Mine is scheduled for delivery tomorrow...then a few more weeks until it will be installed.


----------



## sigma722

eng-399 said:


> Anyone who is trying to decide on what AT screen to buy would be crazy not to buy the falcon screen with the new material it looks so good and customer service from rich is outstanding!!! Going to write a review later tonight about it but I couldn't be more happy with my new falcon screen up!![/IMG]


Holy Bajeebus. How big is that screen? How far are you sitting from it? Looks fun.


----------



## eng-399

sigma722 said:


> Holy Bajeebus. How big is that screen? How far are you sitting from it? Looks fun.



The screen is the 16.9 120" falcon and the first row is 12 feet away and the back row is 18 feet away. One thing I wish I would of done differently is build my riser 12" inches high instead of 10"... I'm very happy with the screen and you have to get pretty close to it to see the weave. My family and the inlaws were all down there last nite watching a movie it was nice. The screen is big but when it's on and your in the first row it doesn't seem that big or distracting watching a movie. I actually like sitting in the first row it makes it feel like your there in the movie.


----------



## Barrettmr

eng-399 said:


> The screen is the 16.9 120" falcon and the first row is 12 feet away and the back row is 18 feet away. One thing I wish I would of done differently is build my riser 12" inches high instead of 10"... I'm very happy with the screen and you have to get pretty close to it to see the weave. My family and the inlaws were all down there last nite watching a movie it was nice. The screen is big but when it's on and your in the first row it doesn't seem that big or distracting watching a movie. I actually like sitting in the first row it makes it feel like your there in the movie.


Very nice! I did the same sort of thing with one of these screens and having the 16:9 at the maximum wall size gives me full room width scope as well as amazing full screen movie watching. Also makes 3D come alive and variable aspect ratio movies like the new TRON etc. work without any issues - best of both worlds


----------



## MiniHT

Barrettmr said:


> Very nice! I did the same sort of thing with one of these screens and having the 16:9 at the maximum wall size gives me full room width scope as well as amazing full screen movie watching. Also makes 3D come alive and variable aspect ratio movies like the new TRON etc. work without any issues - best of both worlds


Yep, I'm in the same situation. I'm width limited so I went with 16:9 to maximize both scope and full screen. I sit ~90" from an 85" wide Horizon screen and cannot see the weave at all. The picture is stunning. Thanks again, Rich!


----------



## COACH2369

We got my new Falcon screen mounted this evening.

Early indications are that this is an amazing screen!

I still have to move my projector back so I can fill the screen up, reset my Lumagen and will need to get it re-calibrated in the near future. We didn't have any audio going, so I couldn't judge how well it does passing that.

The only question I have is: 
Do you guys use any sort of black cloth right behind the screen? I have a black wall behind it and I couldn't see any of the beams from the false wall that was built. Just curious...

Thanks.


----------



## MiniHT

^^ I don't use it on the backside of the screen, if that's what you mean. I do have the whole wall behind the screen covered in velvet (whole room actually, soon) and I can tell you it made a big difference. In mid-high APL scenes I could actually see my speakers' shadow on the screen, due from the reflection off the back wall (eggshell color). I've heard of people using speaker cloth (which is AT) directly on the backside of the screen, but I didn't want to risk attenuating the upper frequencies anymore than I had to (I don't use EQ). I would even cover the speakers if they aren't a matte black like my JTR's... I even "sharpied" the speaker wire  Crazy, I know.


----------



## Barrettmr

COACH2369 said:


> We got my new Falcon screen mounted this evening.
> 
> Early indications are that this is an amazing screen!
> 
> I still have to move my projector back so I can fill the screen up, reset my Lumagen and will need to get it re-calibrated in the near future. We didn't have any audio going, so I couldn't judge how well it does passing that.
> 
> The only question I have is:
> Do you guys use any sort of black cloth right behind the screen? I have a black wall behind it and I couldn't see any of the beams from the false wall that was built. Just curious...
> 
> Thanks.


I had the same concerns when I purchased my Falcon screen which was my first AT screen and ended up painting the back wall matt black and I put four 2x4 black cloth sound panels around the speakers and have not had any issues at all. Before I upgraded my speakers I had Polk Monitors which have silver drivers and I did find at the end of the movie there was a slight reflection when the titles scrolled but since moving to the LSi in-walls which are all black no issues at all. These screens are just amazing


----------



## sampsdds

Just ordered the Falcon 120" Horizon 2.35:1. Cant wait till it arrives!


----------



## mikela

*Falcon Horizon 130" 2.35*

Hi Folks,

Any thoughts on how a JVC RS4910 will perform with a Falcon 130" wide 2.35 at about 20'-21' through an ISCO III? Based on this review it seems like I should be OK.

Mike


----------



## COACH2369

sampsdds said:


> Just ordered the Falcon 120" Horizon 2.35:1. Cant wait till it arrives!


This is the same screen that I just installed. Haven't had any time to fine tune it yet, but so far I am really liking it.


----------



## eng-399

I have the old Sony vw40 pearl projector a few years old and it looks great on my falcon screen! (Up grading soon) The jvc I bet would be really nice!


----------



## jbrown15

mikela said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> Any thoughts on how a JVC RS4910 will perform with a Falcon 130" wide 2.35 at about 20'-21' through an ISCO III? Based on this review it seems like I should be OK.
> 
> Mike


While I don't have a RS4910 my older RS45 still looks awesome on my Falcon screen Mike!


----------



## eng-399

Hey guys rich says that he recommends the front lcr being a minimum of 4 inches away from the screen does anyone here have there speakers closer? I'm trying to squeeze my center channel in there and it looks like I'll have maybe 3 inches from speaker to screen with my new center channel that I would like to put in there.


----------



## jjcook

eng-399 said:


> Hey guys rich says that he recommends the front lcr being a minimum of 4 inches away from the screen does anyone here have there speakers closer? I'm trying to squeeze my center channel in there and it looks like I'll have maybe 3 inches from speaker to screen with my new center channel that I would like to put in there.


I haven't measured (or listened to the difference) with/without the screen, but I have my Vision HD screen mounted directly on the wall just in front of my Triad in-wall speakers (~1" gap from material to tweeter?) and have no complaints


----------



## eng-399

I guess I'm good then. I give it a shot!


----------



## COACH2369

eng-399 said:


> Hey guys rich says that he recommends the front lcr being a minimum of 4 inches away from the screen does anyone here have there speakers closer? I'm trying to squeeze my center channel in there and it looks like I'll have maybe 3 inches from speaker to screen with my new center channel that I would like to put in there.


My screen is only an inch or so from my speakers. I haven't fired them up yet since I am still working on the wall, but I am hoping it will sound okay.

I have a JVS RS-56 and the early indications are that it will do a fine job.


----------



## 24Changer

eng-399 said:


> Hey guys rich says that he recommends the front lcr being a minimum of 4 inches away from the screen does anyone here have there speakers closer? I'm trying to squeeze my center channel in there and it looks like I'll have maybe 3 inches from speaker to screen with my new center channel that I would like to put in there.



My 1099's are either right @ 4 inches or closer. I haven't had a problem that I have noticed or even know what to look for. When Jeff from AccuCal calibrated everything he did not mention them being a problem.


----------



## sampsdds

COACH2369 said:


> This is the same screen that I just installed. Haven't had any time to fine tune it yet, but so far I am really liking it.



Good to hear...I am stoked! How long did it take to receive once the order was processed? I am like a kid waiting for Christmas morning


----------



## eng-399

I took my screen 2 and half weeks to get to my house. Which I thought was a good time frame. One Thing I like about falcon screens to is if you have any problems you can call him direct and get your answer. After sending him a pm about it first of course. Your not left in the dark with rich from falcon. He responds.


----------



## snickers1

sampsdds said:


> Good to hear...I am stoked! How long did it take to receive once the order was processed? I am like a kid waiting for Christmas morning


guess i will have the check the naughty or nice list to determine how soon it will ship


----------



## sampsdds

Oh I hope I have been good! :angel:

Thanks guys!


----------



## eng-399

sampsdds said:


> Oh I hope I have been good! :angel:
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks guys!



Lol


----------



## kmhvball

I installed my Falcon Screen on Monday, it is a 132" Wide, 2.35:1 ratio screen. I have a JVC-4910 projector. This is my first ever screen & projector, but the picture seems really nice. My front row is ~ 10' viewing distance, and I can't see any of the 'weave'. 

I built my own frame, with Falcon Screens providing the Screen Material & O-Rings and installing the Grommets. I ordered back in February, but just got around to it Monday, I e-mailed a question to Rich Monday morning and within 10 minutes he had responded... so, pleased with the Customer Service, even after the sale!


----------



## mikela

kmhvball said:


> I installed my Falcon Screen on Monday, it is a 132" Wide, 2.35:1 ratio screen. I have a JVC-4910 projector. This is my first ever screen & projector, but the picture seems really nice. My front row is ~ 10' viewing distance, and I can't see any of the 'weave'.


Hi Kevin,

Your setup is almost identical to what I have planned. What is your throw distance and how bright is it? I have a JVC RS4910 which will be at approximately 20' and am planning on a 130" wide 2.35 (Horizon). According to my calculations, I should be able to hit 16-17 foot-lamberts on high power. Are you able to measure?

Mike


----------



## kmhvball

mikela said:


> Hi Kevin,
> 
> Your setup is almost identical to what I have planned. What is your throw distance and how bright is it? I have a JVC RS4910 which will be at approximately 20' and am planning on a 130" wide 2.35 (Horizon). According to my calculations, I should be able to hit 16-17 foot-lamberts on high power. Are you able to measure?
> 
> Mike


Hi Mike,

Unfortunately, I am not able to measure brightness. I haven't measured the actual distance, but it is around 16' from lens to screen. I have also not had the projector calibrated, so, even if I could measure - it would be non-calibrated.

I believe Mike Garrett (user AV Science Sales 5) can do some calculations if interested.

Sorry I can't be of more help!


----------



## mikela

kmhvball said:


> Sorry I can't be of more help!


No worries. Perceptually, does it seem bright enough in both 16:9 and 2.35? I am assuming since you said this is your first projector that you are zooming for 2.35. BTW screen looks great in your theater...fits the room well!


----------



## kmhvball

mikela said:


> No worries. Perceptually, does it seem bright enough in both 16:9 and 2.35? I am assuming since you said this is your first projector that you are zooming for 2.35. BTW screen looks great in your theater...fits the room well!


I have only watched about 1/2 of one movie with my kids, and last night as I was doing work I 'watched' another movie. Both were in 2.35:1 aspect ratio and I am Zooming (no Lumagen/ A-Lens). I put on a 16:9 Image long enough to set the lens memory, but that was with lights on in the room, etc., so not a great picture. Although, I think the zoom brightness is likely lower? 

Having said that, my untrained/novice perception, is that it is bright enough for me.


----------



## mattowpe

Can anyone tell me how the Falcon's masking panels attach to the screen or screen wall? Are they magnetic or do they use some other method? And has anyone had first-hand experience with these panels and care to comment on how they've been to use? Thanks!


----------



## JSKMDWK

mattowpe said:


> Can anyone tell me how the Falcon's masking panels attach to the screen or screen wall? Are they magnetic or do they use some other method? And has anyone had first-hand experience with these panels and care to comment on how they've been to use? Thanks!


They are friction fit and have small sturdy plastic tabs at the top that fit between the screen frame and the screen material. I had a set and they ended up sitting in the corner most of the time since I switched between 2.35 and 16x9 so often.


----------



## jbrown15

mattowpe said:


> Can anyone tell me how the Falcon's masking panels attach to the screen or screen wall? Are they magnetic or do they use some other method? And has anyone had first-hand experience with these panels and care to comment on how they've been to use? Thanks!


My masking panels have two little tabs at the bottom that sit inside of the frame and then magnets up top to hold the panels in place. They work great and pop in and out in seconds. 


Here's a shot with the panels in place










And here's a shot with them out.










I love my Horizon screen and will actually be ordering another one as we've sold our house and this screen is staying with the house.


----------



## sampsdds

Just finished up with the adjustment and mounting of my Horizon 130 2.35 screen. It is absolutely stunning in its clarity. I feel like I'm watching a giant plasma! Weave is not noticeable to me at all even from a very close, 8ft seating distance. Very, very happy with the customer service provided by Rich and extremely pleased with the quality of this screen.

Edit: My screen size is actually the 120--still, an amazing product!


----------



## COACH2369

I was able to get the screen wall done in my room last week. 

My 120" Horizon 2:35 screen is the real deal. I was going through a variety of demo material and it handled it all perfectly. The calibration by ChadB is making it shine.

VERY VERY glad I made the plunge into the world of AT screens.

A game changer for sure.


----------



## hifiaudio2

Congrats!


----------



## JohnstownFlood

COACH2369 said:


> I was able to get the screen wall done in my room last week.
> 
> My 120" Horizon 2:35 screen is the real deal. I was going through a variety of demo material and it handled it all perfectly. The calibration by ChadB is making it shine.
> 
> VERY VERY glad I made the plunge into the world of AT screens.
> 
> A game changer for sure.


Hey Coach, or anyone else out there that has a 120" wide Falcon screen: how wide are your hangman brackets? I'm putting together my BIG style minimalist wall and realized that I should probably get that number first!

Thanks!


----------



## archiguy

Well, it's finally here. The last piece to my HT puzzle. My 120" 'scope Falcon Horizon screen is coming tomorrow! FedEx will be delivering the 40lb. box sometime within a nice, tight 7 hour window. 

I will be affixing 2" convoluted packing foam to the wall behind the screen to hopefully take care of any reflected sound bouncing back off the screen from my 3 Triad Bronze 4" in-wall loudspeakers. So I assume I'm going to have to block 2" out from the wall to attach the hanging brackets so the screen will clear the foam. Guess I need to find a couple of studs in the painted drywall to screw in the blocking, as I assume the screen is too heavy to use plastic expansion anchors for the brackets at the logical 1/3 or 1/4 spacing points in the frame.

One thing I've been wondering... does everyone just hang the screen like a picture from those brackets, letting the bottom just "float"? I would think any stray air currents, from people moving around to convection air currents from the HVAC ducts might cause the bottom of the screen to possibly wave in and out, maybe enough to be perceived. How do people handle that? Are there brackets for the bottom and/or sides as well?


----------



## JSKMDWK

I used the black felt wrapped 2x4s that came in the packaging with the screen. See images in my build thread.


----------



## archiguy

Thanks JS! It was hard to see the brackets or blocking from those pics though. 

So you attached the Linacoustic with 4" drywall screws and fender washers? My plan is to wrap .5" fiberboard sheathing (it's relatively soft so I figure it must have some acoustic properties - has an STP of 26) with black fabric stapled to the back and then just screw it into the drywall with short, black wide-thread drywall screws. It's not soft enough for impaling clips. I'll have to cut it into 4 pieces that will butt up against the side walls and the convoluted foam behind the screen. So, essentially, the screen will have the charcoal gray foam behind it and the fabric-wrapped fiberboard will surround the screen and cover the rest of the front wall. It's not a perfect solution from an acoustic standpoint, but I think it will be fine. And it was cheap! 

I've got (21) 2" deep pine frames, 16" x 24" or 48" long, that I'll stuff with rockwool insulation and wrap with fabric. Those will be the panels on the side walls to take care of first reflections and generally deaden the room a bit.


----------



## Barrettmr

archiguy said:


> Well, it's finally here. The last piece to my HT puzzle. My 120" 'scope Falcon Horizon screen is coming tomorrow! FedEx will be delivering the 40lb. box sometime within a nice, tight 7 hour window.
> 
> One thing I've been wondering... does everyone just hang the screen like a picture from those brackets, letting the bottom just "float"? I would think any stray air currents, from people moving around to convection air currents from the HVAC ducts might cause the bottom of the screen to possibly wave in and out, maybe enough to be perceived. How do people handle that? Are there brackets for the bottom and/or sides as well?


It's own weight keeps mine from moving - no need to fix the bottom or sides of the frame. You will see once you get yours hung


----------



## archiguy

Okay, screen arrived today! First thing I noticed is there were no black-velvet-wrapped 2x4's as JS, as well as the installation instructions, said. The frames were loose inside the single, long box, albeit wrapped up in bubble wrap. The fabric was not in a separate box, either, just wrapped up in a roll with thin foam in between layers. Guess Rich has "modified" his packing methods.

I notice on the instructions' second sheet there is a picture of a guy (Rich?) mounting the hangman brackets underneath and inside what looks to be some kind of wood blocking frame. Be nice to know what that is, why it's there, and should I do it as well?

As stated above, I will need to block out the hangman brackets a couple of inches to allow for the convoluted foam behind the screen. Probably screw a piece of .5" plywood to a section of 2x4. Sure would have been nice to have had those already-velvet-wrapped shipping pieces to use that were previously included in the packaging. I don't happen to have any velvet lying around.

You know what would be nice -- a YouTube video of the installation process. Almost everything needing to be assembled has one these days. Be easy enough to make and it would eliminate a lot of questions, I'm guessing.


----------



## eng-399

archiguy said:


> Okay, screen arrived today! First thing I noticed is there were no black-velvet-wrapped 2x4's as JS, as well as the installation instructions, said. The frames were loose inside the single, long box, albeit wrapped up in bubble wrap. The fabric was not in a separate box, either, just wrapped up in a roll with thin foam in between layers. Guess Rich has "modified" his packing methods.
> 
> I notice on the instructions' second sheet there is a picture of a guy (Rich?) mounting the hangman brackets underneath and inside what looks to be some kind of wood blocking frame. Be nice to know what that is, why it's there, and should I do it as well?
> 
> As stated above, I will need to block out the hangman brackets a couple of inches to allow for the convoluted foam behind the screen. Probably screw a piece of .5" plywood to a section of 2x4. Sure would have been nice to have had those already-velvet-wrapped shipping pieces to use that were previously included in the packaging. I don't happen to have any velvet lying around.
> 
> You know what would be nice -- a YouTube video of the installation process. Almost everything needing to be assembled has one these days. Be easy enough to make and it would eliminate a lot of questions, I'm guessing.



The screen is simple to put together as the directions are stated. First lay the 4 screen frames out. Attach 2 brackets that are the an L shape to each of the corners but don't over tighten them or else they will break. One will hold the screen together but Rich went Beyond that and included 2 for each corner of the frame. Once there all installed very carefully tighten each up nice and snug. Now the frame is together next lay down the plastic sheet and get your screen out and install all the rubber o rings through the holes of the screen to the screws that you will see on the back of the screen frame. Once every o ring is installed per the directions and the screen is a little tight to one side loosen up the bolts so that each o ring is centered with the screw. Then tighten them back up. Rich puts this all together before he ships them out via a phone call I had with him about my Falcon screen so the everything should be perfect once you get it together. The brackets are easy to install for hanging it to. I used drywall screws with a 6 foot level to make sure the 2 hanging brackets (not sure the right name for them) are level. Last lift up the screen with a buddy or your wife and hang it right on the bracket. Done. 
Pop in a movie it's show time!!!!
Enjoy your new screen I have the exact screen you have and love it!!!


----------



## eng-399

I accidentally quoted myself and was trying to edit what I was posting ignore this post sorry guys.


----------



## archiguy

eng, thanks, but I understand the process in theory. Still would have been nice to have a little video to look at. As I said above, nearly everything that requires assembly these days has one. It would simply act as a supplement to the written instructions. Rich can make one if he wants, or not. Just a suggestion. Some folks might find it helpful.

And again, my case is a little different and I have specific questions. One is about the wooden frame that appears in the photographs. Is that necessary? Might be, based on my earlier question about the screen moving if it's just floating there 2" off the wall as it will be in my case (Because: foam behind the screen. See above). 

I can see now that I've examined the frame that a wooden frame behind it would give the bottom and sides of the screen something to rest against. And it sure would have been nice to have had those velvet wrapped 2x4's that others have mentioned (including in the written instructions), as I'll need to block the hangman brackets off the wall. Looks like I'll have to cut my own and paint them black.

Whatever. I'll figure it out.


----------



## snickers1

archiguy said:


> eng, thanks, but I understand the process in theory. Still would have been nice to have a little video to look at. As I said above, nearly everything that requires assembly these days has one. It would simply act as a supplement to the written instructions. Rich can make one if he wants, or not. Just a suggestion. Some folks might find it helpful.
> 
> And again, my case is a little different and I have specific questions. One is about the wooden frame that appears in the photographs. Is that necessary? Might be, based on my earlier question about the screen moving if it's just floating there 2" off the wall as it will be in my case (Because: foam behind the screen. See above).
> 
> I can see now that I've examined the frame that a wooden frame behind it would give the bottom and sides of the screen something to rest against. And it sure would have been nice to have had those velvet wrapped 2x4's that others have mentioned (including in the written instructions), as I'll need to block the hangman brackets off the wall. Looks like I'll have to cut my own and paint them black.
> 
> Whatever. I'll figure it out.



during last website update this video was removed


----------



## archiguy

Hey thanks! That video was actually very helpful in terms of showing how much torque to apply to the corner bracket screws. Also that the tool will probably get stuck a few times.


----------



## eng-399

archiguy said:


> eng, thanks, but I understand the process in theory. Still would have been nice to have a little video to look at. As I said above, nearly everything that requires assembly these days has one. It would simply act as a supplement to the written instructions. Rich can make one if he wants, or not. Just a suggestion. Some folks might find it helpful.
> 
> And again, my case is a little different and I have specific questions. One is about the wooden frame that appears in the photographs. Is that necessary? Might be, based on my earlier question about the screen moving if it's just floating there 2" off the wall as it will be in my case (Because: foam behind the screen. See above).
> 
> I can see now that I've examined the frame that a wooden frame behind it would give the bottom and sides of the screen something to rest against. And it sure would have been nice to have had those velvet wrapped 2x4's that others have mentioned (including in the written instructions), as I'll need to block the hangman brackets off the wall. Looks like I'll have to cut my own and paint them black.
> 
> Whatever. I'll figure it out.



What I did to make the screen level is painted a 4/4 black and put it behind the screen on the ground it has a lot of weight to it. I also cut a 2/4 and screwed it to that bracing the screen to my sub box. Now the screen is level and I didn't have to drill anything into the carpeted floor. I'm also building frames that I'm in the middle of wrapping with AT fabric. Thought I would through this idea out to Ya.


----------



## archiguy

Okay, so I've assembled the frame. Went together pretty easily. Hung it on the wall on a piece of 5/4" wood blocking to see how it looks before attaching the Horizon fabric. So the top is 1" away from the wall. But there is a problem. It's perfectly balanced on the hangman's brackets, which are perfectly level. But the frame is warped, even though the individual aluminum extrusions are dead straight. The lower right corner is warped backward from the lower left corner by about an inch. To describe it a different way, the left side hangs straight down, it's distance from the wall is the same on the top as the bottom. But the right side angles back into the wall, touching it at the bottom, meaning the right frame member is slanting in 1" from top to bottom. 

It was perfectly flat on the floor as I put the corner brackets in and tightened them up. But I really don't know what's causing this warping now that it's hanging or how to fix it.

Anyone have any ideas?


----------



## SherazNJ

Hi guys,
I'm currently using Seymour XD. I have a 2.35 145" screen. I sit precisely 12 feet away from screen. Using Sony VPL600ES with high lamp. The issue is that I can see the weave when its a bright scene (like bright white light scene). So now thinking of switching to Falcon. 
Besides the weave issue, its a .8 gain. Falcon states 1.1 for Vision HD and 1.0 for Horizon. Has anyone tested if the gain is actually 1.1 for Falcon Vision and 1.0 for Horizon?
Also, they both have a 4K label next to it. Why one would consider Horizon over Vision?

I'm excited to see that there are more options available now. 
Thx a bunch.


----------



## beastaudio

SherazNJ said:


> Hi guys,
> I'm currently using Seymour XD. I have a 2.35 145" screen. I sit precisely 12 feet away from screen. Using Sony VPL600ES with high lamp. The issue is that I can see the weave when its a bright scene (like bright white light scene). So now thinking of switching to Falcon.
> Besides the weave issue, its a .8 gain. Falcon states 1.1 for Vision HD and 1.0 for Horizon. Has anyone tested if the gain is actually 1.1 for Falcon Vision and 1.0 for Horizon?
> Also, they both have a 4K label next to it. Why one would consider Horizon over Vision?
> 
> I'm excited to see that there are more options available now.
> Thx a bunch.


I haven't tested gain, but I will say this, if I want to see the weave on the Horizon material, with the sony 350es, I darn near have to walk all the way up to the screen to see it. I have enjoyed my horizon thoroughly so far.


----------



## SherazNJ

beastaudio said:


> I haven't tested gain, but I will say this, if I want to see the weave on the Horizon material, with the sony 350es, I darn near have to walk all the way up to the screen to see it. I have enjoyed my horizon thoroughly so far.


This is awesome. How do you find it in terms of Brightness as compared to Seymour XD? Seymour is a .8 gain and Horizon is 1 (or almost 1). So should be 20% brighter.

Waiting for Rich to reach out to me. I think I'm all set to go with Horizon. If all goes well, I"ll post the pics as well.


----------



## beastaudio

SherazNJ said:


> This is awesome. How do you find it in terms of Brightness as compared to Seymour XD? Seymour is a .8 gain and Horizon is 1 (or almost 1). So should be 20% brighter.
> 
> Waiting for Rich to reach out to me. I think I'm all set to go with Horizon. If all goes well, I"ll post the pics as well.


I've gone through enough PJ's recently that brightness is confusing to me, but putting the xd sample up next to the horizon, the horizon is a more "Pure" white than the XD. Brightness should not be an issue for you at all.


----------



## SherazNJ

beastaudio said:


> I've gone through enough PJ's recently that brightness is confusing to me, but putting the xd sample up next to the horizon, the horizon is a more "Pure" white than the XD. Brightness should not be an issue for you at all.


So it turned out that horizon material is not available without frame. I'm going for 140 inches. Price difference between vision hd and horizon is only 200.00 for 140 2.35 screen. If I didn't have the frame then it's a no bringer to select horizon. But since I have the frame, it become more questionable to choose. The difference between vision hd material only vs horizon with frame would be around 1000.00. Is it worth it to spend this much more to go for horizon? I still don't know what the major difference between the two? They both support 4k resolution. They both are AT material. Neither of them have weave visibility issue.


----------



## JSKMDWK

SherazNJ said:


> I still don't know what the major difference between the two?


I suggest you order samples of the materials and judge for yourself. I have had the Falcon Vision in a previous theater and was very happy with it. It is a more plastic coated material than the Horizon which is more like fabric/cloth material. The weave on the Horizon is very hard to notice until you are close to the screen.


----------



## SherazNJ

JSKMDWK said:


> I suggest you order samples of the materials and judge for yourself. I have had the Falcon Vision in a previous theater and was very happy with it. It is a more plastic coated material than the Horizon which is more like fabric/cloth material. The weave on the Horizon is very hard to notice until you are close to the screen.


Thx for the response. Samples are too small for me to judge. So in terms of display quality, you find them same? If I can't see the weave from the distance I'm watching movie (12 feet) then I'm fine with either. I assume you had no issue with weave with vision hd? What made you switch to horizon then?


----------



## jbrown15

SherazNJ said:


> Thx for the response. Samples are too small for me to judge. So in terms of display quality, you find them same? If I can't see the weave from the distance I'm watching movie (12 feet) then I'm fine with either. I assume you had no issue with weave with vision hd? What made you switch to horizon then?



Ask Rich for a 2'x2' sample of each. Might cost you a few bucks but it's worth it.


----------



## emanymton123

Any word on official masking panels for 16:9 screens? I sent a message through the Falcon website but never got a reply.


----------



## JSKMDWK

SherazNJ said:


> So in terms of display quality, you find them same? If I can't see the weave from the distance I'm watching movie (12 feet) then I'm fine with either. I assume you had no issue with weave with vision hd? What made you switch to horizon then?


I have not yet ordered my Horizon screen yet, only looked at samples. The weave on the Falcon HD gets noticeable when you get 6-9 feet from the screen, with the Horizon you can get much closer (seating distance) and not notice the weave. This is why I plan to make the switch for our new theater.


----------



## DSyme

emanymton123 said:


> Any word on official masking panels for 16:9 screens? I sent a message through the Falcon website but never got a reply.


I asked Rich this question yesterday and the answer was no.


----------



## deauxt

DSyme said:


> I asked Rich this question yesterday and the answer was no.


Any reason why this wouldn't be available like it is for the scope screens to convert to a 16:9 image? I'm very interested in the 137" Horizon in 16:9 and the panels would be a nice option/addition to consider.

Perhaps it has something to do with the logistics of shipping a 10' panel?


----------



## DSyme

deauxt said:


> Any reason why this wouldn't be available like it is for the scope screens to convert to a 16:9 image? I'm very interested in the 137" Horizon in 16:9 and the panels would be a nice option/addition to consider.
> 
> Perhaps it has something to do with the logistics of shipping a 10' panel?


 His website says "Coming Soon!!!  Horizontal masking panels for 16:9 format screens" so maybe he will update us when available or with any news.


----------



## JSKMDWK

deauxt said:


> I'm very interested in the 137" Horizon in 16:9 and the panels would be a nice option/addition to consider.


I would suggest getting the screen and deciding if you really want/need the panels. I used a Falcon Vision 120 and had the side masking panels to convert to 16x9. They ended up living in a closet because I just didn't use them that much. They looked cool before the movie, but once the lights went down (light controlled theater) it didn't make a difference. I also switched back and forth from 16x9 to 2.35:1 so often it was a chore to put them up and down.


----------



## deauxt

JSKMDWK said:


> I would suggest getting the screen and deciding if you really want/need the panels. I used a Falcon Vision 120 and had the side masking panels to convert to 16x9. They ended up living in a closet because I just didn't use them that much. They looked cool before the movie, but once the lights went down (light controlled theater) it didn't make a difference. I also switched back and forth from 16x9 to 2.35:1 so often it was a chore to put them up and down.


Oh ok, I appreciate the info.


----------



## snickers1

congrats to Rob Johnston for being Home Theater of the Month 
Great build and a great looking Theater featuring a 130" Falcon Screen with our new Horizon Material.

http://www.avsforum.com/ht-of-the-month-the-vortex-theater/


----------



## SherazNJ

Question related to the distance of speaker behind Horizon Screen: What's the optimum distance a speaker should be placed behind Horizon Screen?
Also, I have around 2 feet of space behind screen. If I find that my speakers are best around 2 feet away from screen, would it be ok? I"m trying to understand if it matters how far/close the speaker should be behind Horizon and what impact I'd get if I go beyond the range?
Thx


----------



## JSKMDWK

SherazNJ said:


> Question related to the distance of speaker behind Horizon Screen: What's the optimum distance a speaker should be placed behind Horizon Screen?
> Also, I have around 2 feet of space behind screen. If I find that my speakers are best around 2 feet away from screen, would it be ok? I"m trying to understand if it matters how far/close the speaker should be behind Horizon and what impact I'd get if I go beyond the range?
> Thx


Two feet is more than enough. I had my Sonance in-wall speakers about 4 inches behind the Falcon Vision HD screen (original AT material) and had no problem.
Stewart recommends 18" with a microperf screen, so no more than that should be needed.
The Horizon material can be thought of almost like a speaker grill, woven cloth material, so as long as you are not right up on it, shouldn't be a problem. The primary concern is comb filtering for high frequency drivers, so it could depend on what kind of speaker you are using, horn vs. dome tweeter, but probably won't be an issue. 
I'd suggest getting a large sample and trying it out.


----------



## SherazNJ

JSKMDWK said:


> Two feet is more than enough. I had my Sonance in-wall speakers about 4 inches behind the Falcon Vision HD screen (original AT material) and had no problem.
> Stewart recommends 18" with a microperf screen, so no more than that should be needed.
> The Horizon material can be thought of almost like a speaker grill, woven cloth material, so as long as you are not right up on it, shouldn't be a problem. The primary concern is comb filtering for high frequency drivers, so it could depend on what kind of speaker you are using, horn vs. dome tweeter, but probably won't be an issue.
> I'd suggest getting a large sample and trying it out.


Thx for your response. No need to order the sample. I have Horizon screen already . Its been placed as well. Currently my LCR is 5 1/2 inches behind screen. But at that point, I"m getting bad results for mid range after calibration and therefore thinking about moving the speakers to get a better response. Here is my center and right speakers response. as you can see that right after 220Hx, it just falls down about 10db with 80Hz (220-300). Plus all the frequencies from 300Hz and below and lower than I expected it. That may be the room correction doing it for the most part. I'll figure that part out.


----------



## thxman

I ordered a new 130" Wide 235:1 Falcon Vision HD for my new theater. The new screen will be paired with a new JVC RS600. This should be a nice upgrade to my 100" 1:85:1 Stewart StudioTek 130 (1st generation). 


*Proteus* – *HQ - High SPL & Low Fatigue - 9.4.4 Trinnov ł Alcons ł Seaton Theater*​


----------



## MiniHT

^^ Awesome! I'm sure you'll love the combo. I have my Horizon screen paired with an RS4910 in a bat cave. The image is absolutely amazing! Good luck with the build...


----------



## thxman

MiniHT said:


> ^^ Awesome! I'm sure you'll love the combo. I have my Horizon screen paired with an RS4910 in a bat cave. The image is absolutely amazing! Good luck with the build...


Thank you MiniHT!


----------



## mikela

thxman said:


> I ordered a new 130" Wide 235:1 Falcon Vision HD for my new theater. The new screen will be paired with a new JVC RS600. This should be a nice upgrade to my 100" 1:85:1 Stewart StudioTek 130 (1st generation).


I am also picking up an RS600 and have a 235:1 130" wide Horizon. Anyone know what screen setting should be used with the JVC Autocalibration software?


----------



## WarrenBerry

Well got the screen built.

Screen installation is super easy from Falcon Screens. Rich told me an idiot could get it together in 20 mins so naturally I spent about 30 at it. He didn't actually say that but the rest of the sentence is true.

The screen is different from other falcon screens in that this one uses splines around the frame of the screen instead of O-Rings. I am super impressed with it. The frame is rigid and sturdy. The brackets and the attaching hardware for the corners of the screen come together tight and square. From the front of the screen you are hard pressed to find the seam running in the fabric for the corners. Installation is done with a locking cam mounted on a 90 degree angle joiner that fits in the screen itself. Ill take a few photos.

Velvet around the screen is so black that unless I have a flash light I cannot see the difference between the screen border and the 3" gap I have between the walls on either side. Its that dark.

Mounting the fabric was easy as well. After unrolling the screen onto the provided the drop sheet, equipping the provided gloves,and following the instructions a friend of mine and I began to insert the temporary splines. We put a bit of tension on the screen while we did this but didn't reef on it. There is a little pucker in between places with the temporary splines. After the temporary came the permanent. When we installed these ones we tucked them brackets into the screen towards the outside. This tensioned the screen nice and tight and at the end there was zero pucker. From a distance of about 12" I cant see the screen weave anymore. I have better then 20/20. From sitting at the viewing position it looks like a piece of paper or a solid white colour.

Mounting the screen onto the 2x4 framing is a breeze as well. Supplied are two french cleats that prop the screen up. Falcon screens provides levels for the cleats so you know they're level.

All in all a well built and well thought out screen. I am happy I went with my purchase of a Falcon Screen.

Here is a photo of me putting in the temporary splines.


----------



## beastaudio

curious as to why the transition to splines? Or was this just a one-off


----------



## snickers1

beastaudio said:


> curious as to why the transition to splines? Or was this just a one-off


The Horizon Fabric is not as rigid as the HD Fabric so with the splines it insures the Fabric is properly tensioned and Flat. Only the Horizon Fabric uses the new system.


----------



## beastaudio

snickers1 said:


> The Horizon Fabric is not as rigid as the HD Fabric so with the splines it insures the Fabric is properly tensioned and Flat. Only the Horizon Fabric uses the new system.


Must be a new thing then? The one you sent me definitely uses the o-rings


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> Must be a new thing then? The one you sent me definitely uses the o-rings


Yep, o-rings & rubber bands for me too. And I have some minor puckering issues in a couple of places. Maybe this new system would have addressed that.


----------



## eng-399

archiguy said:


> Yep, o-rings for me too. And I have some minor puckering issues in a couple of places. Maybe this new system would have addressed that.



I have the same issue with one side of the screen. It's not a big deal and can only be seen when you walk up close to it. I wonder if that would fix the problem though. All my o-rings are centered to the screws on the back that they attach to.


----------



## archiguy

My screen also had some streaking on it. You can barely see it with the room lights on (the puckers too) and not at all when the image is projected on the screen, so I haven't thought it that big a deal. Rich said to throw the screen in the dryer on the "steam" cycle for 20 minutes and see if that didn't take those streaks away. They're not wrinkles though, more like slightly discolored streaks. Haven't wanted to take the screen down and put it back together in order to try it yet.

The puckers I sort of pulled out and smoothed as best I could. They're barely noticeable now.


----------



## COACH2369

O-rings for my screen as well.

I had some "wrinkling" which is barely noticeable and Rich gave me the same recommendation of throwing it in the dryer. I just didn't want to go through the hassle of taking the screen apart.

Overall, I am very pleased with my screen....O-rings and all.


----------



## COACH2369

A couple photos of the screen wall..


----------



## eng-399

Today was the first day I was able to get everything going with 3D in the room. My Sony HW40 projecting on the Falcon Horizon screen looked great. It had a great picture and the wife and kids loved it. Still love this Falcon Horizon screen.


----------



## sigma722

Would it be possible to get some pictures of the masking panels with higher light? Do we know the material that is used under the felt?

Thanks!


----------



## DekPM19

SherazNJ said:


> Thx for your response. No need to order the sample. I have Horizon screen already . Its been placed as well. Currently my LCR is 5 1/2 inches behind screen. But at that point, I"m getting bad results for mid range after calibration and therefore thinking about moving the speakers to get a better response. Here is my center and right speakers response. as you can see that right after 220Hx, it just falls down about 10db with 80Hz (220-300). Plus all the frequencies from 300Hz and below and lower than I expected it. That may be the room correction doing it for the most part. I'll figure that part out.


Did you get this figured out about how far back from the screen you need to be? 
Allen


----------



## smiddleton5401

SherazNJ said:


> Thx for your response. No need to order the sample. I have Horizon screen already . Its been placed as well. Currently my LCR is 5 1/2 inches behind screen. But at that point, I"m getting bad results for mid range after calibration and therefore thinking about moving the speakers to get a better response. Here is my center and right speakers response. as you can see that right after 220Hx, it just falls down about 10db with 80Hz (220-300). Plus all the frequencies from 300Hz and below and lower than I expected it. That may be the room correction doing it for the most part. I'll figure that part out.


Did you ever find out an end result? I am in the same boat with my choices - Thx


----------



## SherazNJ

smiddleton5401 said:


> Did you ever find out an end result? I am in the same boat with my choices - Thx


yes. I have been using the material for a while I like it very much. The issue with dip was the placement of speaker. Its still there but it has nothing to do with screen. The material has a very uniform display and doesn't any artifacts to the image. If only we can have AT screen with 1.3 gain though ;-)


----------



## smiddleton5401

SherazNJ said:


> yes. I have been using the material for a while I like it very much. The issue with dip was the placement of speaker. Its still there but it has nothing to do with screen. The material has a very uniform display and doesn't any artifacts to the image. If only we can have AT screen with 1.3 gain though ;-)


Do you mean the distance from the screen is the culprit, or the overall room characteristics? If it is the distance from the screen, did you make any test measurements at other distances to see if the loss was uniform or not? 


Thanks in advance, I am planning the distance from my in wall speakers now.


----------



## Ryanweather

I currently have a spandex screen that is nice, but it has a blur or fuzziness to it. Falcon screens just sent me a sample of the Vision HD and it looks great! Here's a comparison of the two attached. If you look closely you'll notice a distinct difference in sharpness and brightness; the Falcon Screen looks way better (top half of image), IMO. Does anyone know if the Vision HD is 4k compatible or do you have to buy the Horizon?


----------



## davisnub

any feedback on the falcon vision platinum vs titanium? I know this is an AT thread but there wasn't a falcon non at thread


----------



## hatlesschimp

I think I will go a Falcon AT for my HT. Looks good!


----------



## JSKMDWK

davisnub said:


> any feedback on the falcon vision platinum vs titanium? I know this is an AT thread but there wasn't a falcon non at thread


Contact the company and request samples so you can give them a try. The platinum is a white screen for a fully light controlled room. The titanium is a gray screen for moderately dark rooms.


----------



## krholmberg

Ryanweather said:


> I currently have a spandex screen that is nice, but it has a blur or fuzziness to it. Falcon screens just sent me a sample of the Vision HD and it looks great! Here's a comparison of the two attached. If you look closely you'll notice a distinct difference in sharpness and brightness; the Falcon Screen looks way better (top half of image), IMO. Does anyone know if the Vision HD is 4k compatible or do you have to buy the Horizon?


It definitely looks sharper. Is the grid pattern from the weave or the image?

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


----------



## brian6751

Placed my order with @Mike Garrett at AVS today. 120" diagonal 16:9 with horizon material. Thanks Mike for helping me find the best screen for my theater. Also thanks to @eng-99for answering my PM's regarding the screen. 

Now I have to hurry up and get this room done


----------



## eng-399

brian6751 said:


> Placed my order with @Mike Garrett at AVS today. 120" diagonal 16:9 with horizon material. Thanks Mike for helping me find the best screen for my theater. Also thanks to @eng-99for answering my PM's regarding the screen.
> 
> 
> 
> Now I have to hurry up and get this room done




Brian your going to love the screen! If your ever in the Chicago land area your more than welcome to come by and see it with my Sony hw-40 teamed up with it that I bought from Mike Garrett to. Great guys at AV Science and top notch customer service you can't go wrong. Rich the owner of Falcon screens is Also great to deal with to. Congrats on the new screen!


----------



## brian6751

I am pairing it with the Sony 40es as well. Cant wait. I would love to come see your setup. Maybe some day..


----------



## MiniHT

^^ Congrats man, you won't be disappointed! I have mine paired with a JVC RS4910 in a bat cave and couldn't be happier! I just finished watching The Revenant and couldn't pick my jaw up off the floor.. PQ was off the charts. Good luck with the rest of the room..


----------



## racer256

*curved*

Anyone have experience with Falcon AT fabric on curved screen?


----------



## Mike Garrett

Not specifically, I do have a curved screen with AT fabric. What is your question?


----------



## dsumo

brian6751 said:


> Placed my order with @Mike Garrett at AVS today. 120" diagonal 16:9 with horizon material. Thanks Mike for helping me find the best screen for my theater. Also thanks to @eng-99for answering my PM's regarding the screen.
> 
> Now I have to hurry up and get this room done


Hi all,
I am looking for Fixed, AT screen that would fit a 127" w and 82" tall wall (speakers go behind the screen). Projector is a Epson 5030U.

any help is appreciated.


----------



## thxman

I want to thank Rich at Falcon Screens and Mike (AVS) for the great screen. Moving from a 16:9 100" Stewart ST130 to 2.35:1 140+" Vision Horizon, I was worried about how the image would look. I am happy to report that the image is great and my speakers are not impacted by the screen material. I am super happy, thanks.


----------



## Mike Garrett

dsumo said:


> Hi all,
> I am looking for Fixed, AT screen that would fit a 127" w and 82" tall wall (speakers go behind the screen). Projector is a Epson 5030U.
> 
> any help is appreciated.


We would be happy to help you. Give us a call with your questions.


----------



## shete.prakash

brian6751 said:


> I am pairing it with the Sony 40es as well. Cant wait. I would love to come see your setup. Maybe some day..


Brian, Can you please post a pic of the screen in action. I too have a Sony vpl-hw40es and in the market for 140+ diagonal screen material. Any pics, screen pic review is appreciated

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


----------



## shete.prakash

eng-399 said:


> Brian your going to love the screen! If your ever in the Chicago land area your more than welcome to come by and see it with my Sony hw-40 teamed up with it that I bought from Mike Garrett to. Great guys at AV Science and top notch customer service you can't go wrong. Rich the owner of Falcon screens is Also great to deal with to. Congrats on the new screen!


Hi, Can you please post a pic of the screen in action. I too have a Sony vpl-hw40es and in the market for 140+ diagonal screen material. Any pics, screen pic review is appreciated.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


----------



## eng-399

shete.prakash said:


> Hi, Can you please post a pic of the screen in action. I too have a Sony vpl-hw40es and in the market for 140+ diagonal screen material. Any pics, screen pic review is appreciated.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk




These pictures were taken with my iphone6+ but here's a few.
















My iPhone camera doesn't capture what I really see in my room it's brighter and more clear again these are iPhone pictures I took. The colors from different movies and black levels are great IMO. I see every detail on the screen. I'm glad I bought this screen and have zero regrets. I've talked to Rich on the phone two times about the screen and he answered all my questions. I would recommend this screen to anyone. If you want to talk more about the screen and setup when you first get it send me a PM we can talk on the phone. I bought the Falcon Horizon 120" 16.9 screen.


----------



## brian6751

shete.prakash said:


> Brian, Can you please post a pic of the screen in action. I too have a Sony vpl-hw40es and in the market for 140+ diagonal screen material. Any pics, screen pic review is appreciated
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Sorry, Im still finishing the theater and don't have it up.


----------



## SeanCJ

I just fabricated a spandex screen (white mille over black mille) last weekend and unfortunately, I'm finding out that I don't care much for the slight fuzzy picture and what I consider a lack of brightness. I understand now how the low gain affects my projector's image. I'm now considering wrapping the screen in the Falcon material. So that the spandex is not a total loss, can I keep the black mille on the frame as the backing and wrap the Falcon over the top to stop light seeping through? Or, would the two layers cause issues with the AT property?
I'm running Klipsch THX Ultra II's behind the screen as LCR.
Thanks!


----------



## shete.prakash

Thanks eng-399

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


----------



## GreySkies

SeanCJ said:


> Or, would the two layers cause issues with the AT property?


I'd be worried about this. I painted everything black behind my Falcon screen.


----------



## SeanCJ

GreySkies said:


> I'd be worried about this. I painted everything black behind my Falcon screen.


I have a large 8'x7' opening to another room behind the screen. Nothing here to paint, hence the need for a second layer on the screen.


----------



## GreySkies

SeanCJ said:


> I have a large 8'x7' opening to another room behind the screen. Nothing here to paint, hence the need for a second layer on the screen.


Is it a dark-colored room? If so, probably no need for a second layer. I'd only worry if it were a white or other light-colored room that would reflect back to the screen.


----------



## racer256

Has anyone noticed negative effects from curving AT screen.


----------



## Mike Garrett

racer256 said:


> Has anyone noticed negative effects from curving AT screen.


If not using an A-lens, then do not use a curved screen.


----------



## racer256

I am using A-lens on flat screen and thinking going curved. Most have said not to make the move for various reasons. Some have stated "image issues"...?


----------



## archiguy

I also use an A-lens with a 120" Falcon flat screen. Throwing 17'. No problems with focus or convergence at the edges. Don't know why anyone would want a curved screen anyway. If you have a decent projector, it should be able to easily handle the potential distortion at the edges.


----------



## Mike Garrett

racer256 said:


> I am using A-lens on flat screen and thinking going curved. Most have said not to make the move for various reasons. Some have stated "image issues"...?





archiguy said:


> I also use an A-lens with a 120" Falcon flat screen. Throwing 17'. No problems with focus or convergence at the edges. Don't know why anyone would want a curved screen anyway. If you have a decent projector, it should be able to easily handle the potential distortion at the edges.


An A-lens produces pincushion on a flat screen. Does not matter what projector you use. The shorter the throw, the greater the pincushion. At longer throws, a flat screen works fine. At medium to short throws, a curved screen is often times a better option, though you can overscan if using a flat screen.


----------



## archiguy

Mike Garrett said:


> An A-lens produces pincushion on a flat screen. Does not matter what projector you use. The shorter the throw, the greater the pincushion. At longer throws, a flat screen works fine. At medium to short throws, a curved screen is often times a better option, though you can overscan if using a flat screen.


Where would the cutoff be in terms of throw distance, when the pincushion becomes noticeable and a curved screen would be warranted? You know, typically for a 120" screen -- that's probably about average size.


----------



## racer256

I don't Have any issues with pin cushioning since my throw distance is nice and long as well. Concerned with comments about reduced contrast since light bounces back onto screen due to curve.


----------



## racer256

Also, distortion was brought up by others due to lens optics being designed to project on flat screen, not curved.


----------



## racer256

Top Reasons for curved screen: reduced pin cushioning, increased light to viewer (less on walls, therefore theoretically increasing contrast ratio, although light reflecting back onto screen might counter this), enveloped experience (although probably minor)


----------



## ndabunka

Received the Falcon AT material today. It looks like it falls nicely between the two alternatives from their competitor. Tighter weave than the competition's heavier option and more open than their "stretchy" option with the weight right between both. Looking forward to IRL comparisons later tonight or Tuesday vs. my existing matt white


----------



## Davecraze

Hi guys, I am about to order a Falcon AT screen (likely 120" wide but still debating on size). What sort of times are you all experiencing from order to delivery? Thanks.


----------



## eng-399

Davecraze said:


> Hi guys, I am about to order a Falcon AT screen (likely 120" wide but still debating on size). What sort of times are you all experiencing from order to delivery? Thanks.




I think I waited two weeks because there was a back log of orders for Rich to fill. Send him a email and ask where you would be maybe there's only one or two orders in front of you or no one at all. He will email you back with in a day or call you.


----------



## Hawks07

Just curious, has anybody made masking panels for the 16:9 screens? I know it says on the website some is coming soon but may just give a try myself.


----------



## DougUSMC

Hey guys, has anyone heard from Rich lately? I sent him a PM a bit ago, looking for help on my selection, and haven't heard back. I know he's usually super helpful and responsive, but I also haven't seen him posting in this thread as much as usual.

Trying to get my order in and shipped before the holiday rush...


----------



## hatlesschimp

Can I get a falcon HD shipped to Australia?

Sent from my SM-N930F using Tapatalk


----------



## snickers1

DougUSMC said:


> Hey guys, has anyone heard from Rich lately? I sent him a PM a bit ago, looking for help on my selection, and haven't heard back. I know he's usually super helpful and responsive, but I also haven't seen him posting in this thread as much as usual.
> 
> Trying to get my order in and shipped before the holiday rush...



I am around ... I looked for your pm and did not see it, send me a quick pm with your email.

Thanks 
Rich


----------



## DougUSMC

snickers1 said:


> I am around ... I looked for your pm and did not see it, send me a quick pm with your email.
> 
> Thanks
> Rich




No worries, it was a couple of months ago. 

PM sent


----------



## mikela

DougUSMC said:


> No worries, it was a couple of months ago.
> 
> PM sent


I was gonna say, Rich has been super responsive recently to a couple of minor issues with my install. Top notch in my book!


----------



## DougUSMC

mikela said:


> I was gonna say, Rich has been super responsive recently to a couple of minor issues with my install. Top notch in my book!


When you're right, you're right!


He reached right out to me, we traded emails like crazy, and I submitted my order last night!


----------



## rossandwendy

@snickers1 Do you have an estimated date of when the masking panels for your 16:9 screens can be ordered?

Ross


----------



## rossandwendy

Thanks for the PM reply Rich. I also PM'd a request and my address for screen material samples. 

Cheers,
Ross


----------



## seplant

nathan_h said:


> Quote:Originally Posted by *zebracatzebra*
> 
> Has anyone ever done a comparison with the Elite screens AcousticPro 1080P2 screen material (for example on model ER115WH1W-A1080P2)? I'm curious how it compares given its price is less than 50% of the competitors..
> 
> 
> Not cheaper than Falcon material (and this is not the place to talk about prices of the competition).
> 
> In terms of performance, here is a independent third party report. I have compared the Falcon, SR, both main Seymours. Based on that, the AcousticPro measures low (similar to EN4K, which is quite visibly lower gain than XD and Falcon).
> 
> http://www.accucalhd.com/documents/accucal_front_projection_screen_report.pdf
> 
> Hopefully, when Jeff updates his survey, he will have a sample of the Falcon material. Based on seeing it, along with several he has evaluated, I predict:
> 
> 1. the weave will be considered less visible than everything other than the EN4k
> 2. the gain will be similar but slightly lower than XD (which makes it much brighter than EN4k, and AcousticPro, etc)



Sorry to quote such an old post, but I'm in the early stages of researching AT screens for a retrofit of my existing home theater. I scanned through this thread, and I noticed the quote above that referenced the report from Jeff Meier. I've had Jeff out a couple of times over the years to calibrate my system, so I trust his opinions. Jeff's report (dated April 2016) refers to the AT material from Falcon simply as "Falcon", and his report stated it was "not very competitive with other commercial screen weaves." Does anyone know which Falcon AT material was used in Jeff's testing and how the latest materials from Falcon compare in terms of audio loss and screen gain? Thanks.


----------



## jjcook

seplant said:


> Sorry to quote such an old post, but I'm in the early stages of researching AT screens for a retrofit of my existing home theater. I scanned through this thread, and I noticed the quote above that referenced the report from Jeff Meier. I've had Jeff out a couple of times over the years to calibrate my system, so I trust his opinions. Jeff's report (dated April 2016) refers to the AT material from Falcon simply as "Falcon", and his report stated it was "not very competitive with other commercial screen weaves." Does anyone know which Falcon AT material was used in Jeff's testing and how the latest materials from Falcon compare in terms of audio loss and screen gain? Thanks.


I'm fairly confident he is referring to the Vision HD AT material as he said it to be somewhat similar to shearweave fabric.


----------



## snickers1

Keep in mind falcon horizon has not been tested in this report.


----------



## ddigler

archiguy said:


> My screen also had some streaking on it. You can barely see it with the room lights on (the puckers too) and not at all when the image is projected on the screen, so I haven't thought it that big a deal. Rich said to throw the screen in the dryer on the "steam" cycle for 20 minutes and see if that didn't take those streaks away. They're not wrinkles though, more like slightly discolored streaks. Haven't wanted to take the screen down and put it back together in order to try it yet.


I just recieved, assembled, hung my new 140" diag (2.35) Horizon screen. I'm going to reserve my review thoughts until I get more screen time but for now I will say I absolutely love it paired with my Sony HW40es  I have zero 'puckers', install was easy and the screen just has an incredible picture. No weave but I def need more time with it b4 I 'review' it.

Regarding the above post, @archiguy or any other Horizon owners: do you see these 'streaks' on your screen? I have them exactly as described by Archi above. They are not wrinkles but rather a 'streak' that runs long ways across the screen and looks just a tad bit 'darker' than the rest of the screen. Curious if anyone has come up with a way to mitigate these or if it even warrants any effort as it may not impact image quality whatsoever? Thoughts?

Rich has offered to send me new material but I'm not sure it is warranted. I couldn't see the streaks at all through the first couple movies (but I hadn't noticed them and therefore wasn't looking). From here on out I will evaluate more closely to see if they are visible during showtime.


----------



## snickers1

ddigler said:


> I just recieved, assembled, hung my new 140" diag (2.35) Horizon screen. I'm going to reserve my review thoughts until I get more screen time but for now I will say I absolutely love it paired with my Sony HW40es  I have zero 'puckers', install was easy and the screen just has an incredible picture. No weave but I def need more time with it b4 I 'review' it.
> 
> Regarding the above post, @archiguy or any other Horizon owners: do you see these 'streaks' on your screen? I have them exactly as described by Archi above. They are not wrinkles but rather a 'streak' that runs long ways across the screen and looks just a tad bit 'darker' than the rest of the screen. Curious if anyone has come up with a way to mitigate these or if it even warrants any effort as it may not impact image quality whatsoever? Thoughts?
> 
> Rich has offered to send me new material but I'm not sure it is warranted. I couldn't see the streaks at all through the first couple movies (but I hadn't noticed them and therefore wasn't looking). From here on out I will evaluate more closely to see if they are visible during showtime.


Please keep me posted as there is always a chance that there was maybe a flaw when the fabric was manufactured, we do our best in inspecting the fabric on the cutting table , if you can send me pic via email i would like to see what is happening, again if need be we will are happy to replace the fabric if need be, 
want to ensure you love you screen and get tons of enjoyment out it. 

Thanks
Rich


----------



## ddigler

snickers1 said:


> Please keep me posted as there is always a chance that there was maybe a flaw when the fabric was manufactured, we do our best in inspecting the fabric on the cutting table , if you can send me pic via email i would like to see what is happening, again if need be we will are happy to replace the fabric if need be,
> want to ensure you love you screen and get tons of enjoyment out it.
> 
> Thanks
> Rich


I can already tell you I absolutely love this screen, Blown away by the pic quality and the splines allowed for an incredibly consistent, tight fit. Ok will fire you an email with pics...


----------



## eng-399

Has anyone used any type of black lights behind the Falcon Horizon screen to display there LCR and subs using this screen material. I'm looking for recommendations of what type of lighting to use brands links anything. @snickers1 have you heard anyone using lights behind any Horizon screens.
Thanks


----------



## snickers1

eng-399 said:


> Has anyone used any type of black lights behind the Falcon Horizon screen to display there LCR and subs using this screen material. I'm looking for recommendations of what type of lighting to use brands links anything. @snickers1 have you heard anyone using lights behind any Horizon screens.
> Thanks


I actually did it with mine i used track lighting and i think i found on Ebay blue bulbs. 
Here is pic of how it looked with Falcon HD, Horizon is a very different fabric there isn't really any holes in the fabric 
so when i made the change over to that i was unable to see the LCR. i guess if you could go with a brighter bulb it may work.


----------



## eng-399

Thanks Rich maybe I'll try some brighter bulbs and see how it turns out. I'm pretty much trying to light up the screen to show off my LCR and subs during party's when movies aren't playing. 

If anyone else has done it please post what you guys have used.


----------



## snickers1

eng-399 said:


> Thanks Rich maybe I'll try some brighter bulbs and see how it turns out. I'm pretty much trying to light up the screen to show off my LCR and subs during party's when movies aren't playing.
> 
> If anyone else has done it please post what you guys have used.



I still have the lights behind mine i can see the light through the screen for sure but it does not have have the same effect as the HD Fabric i would love to know if brighter lights would do the trick i actually miss the effect it, i remember it being a great conversational piece. People would come down and look at the screen and just go WOW


----------



## COACH2369

Are the masking panels you sell have AT material on them?

I assume they would, but wanted to ask to make sure before ordering....

EDIT: Answered my own question by looking at the website... 

Thanks.


----------



## beastaudio

eng-399 said:


> Thanks Rich maybe I'll try some brighter bulbs and see how it turns out. I'm pretty much trying to light up the screen to show off my LCR and subs during party's when movies aren't playing.
> 
> If anyone else has done it please post what you guys have used.


The horizon will not allow for it. I have two behind my screen and even with full-on white light, it doesn't get you there. You can look at the pics in my sig. for reference.


----------



## eng-399

beastaudio said:


> The horizon will not allow for it. I have two behind my screen and even with full-on white light, it doesn't get you there. You can look at the pics in my sig. for reference.




Thanks and if I do find a brighter light that will work I'll post what it is. The positive side to all of this is the weave is that tight.


----------



## beastaudio

eng-399 said:


> Thanks and if I do find a brighter light that will work I'll post what it is. The positive side to all of this is the weave is that tight.


For reference, the current lights behind the screen are the 60 watt equivalent phillips Hue color LED bulbs. Even with the standard 60 watt halogen, no dice there either.


----------



## sumik

snickers1 said:


> I still have the lights behind mine i can see the light through the screen for sure but it does not have have the same effect as the HD Fabric i would love to know if brighter lights would do the trick i actually miss the effect it, i remember it being a great conversational piece. People would come down and look at the screen and just go WOW


Are you guys still in business ?
Tried your fill out form on website few weeks ago never got any reply.
Tried your email address listed on website few days ago, never got any reply.
Trying to get samples of your transparent screens.


----------



## klimo

sumik said:


> Are you guys still in business ?
> Tried your fill out form on website few weeks ago never got any reply.
> Tried your email address listed on website few days ago, never got any reply.
> Trying to get samples of your transparent screens.


I exchanged emails with them about a month ago on a handful of questions. Quick and informative reply. Went back to our email thread a couple weeks ago to get samples, but never got a response back.

Went with Seymour AV instead.


----------



## sumik

Well if anyone has a spare Falcon Vision Horizon 24x24 sample they want to sell me I would be glad.


----------



## denap

*Quick connect corner clips....*

Hi all, I've got a Falcon AT screen that's a couple of years old now. My elastics fail every 6 mos or so and Rich has been great about sending replacements. The last time I lost a bunch the corner must have opened and the screen came off the wall.... long story short I've got 2 broken corner clips and I haven't been able to get through to Rich. Anyone have a replacement source for the clips and or the elastics?

TIA
-Tom


----------



## COACH2369

denap said:


> Hi all, I've got a Falcon AT screen that's a couple of years old now. My elastics fail every 6 mos or so and Rich has been great about sending replacements. The last time I lost a bunch the corner must have opened and the screen came off the wall.... long story short I've got 2 broken corner clips and I haven't been able to get through to Rich. Anyone have a replacement source for the clips and or the elastics?
> 
> TIA
> -Tom


Tom,
I will send you a PM.
Thanks.


----------



## archiguy

denap said:


> Hi all, I've got a Falcon AT screen that's a couple of years old now. My elastics fail every 6 mos or so and Rich has been great about sending replacements. The last time I lost a bunch the corner must have opened and the screen came off the wall.... long story short I've got 2 broken corner clips and I haven't been able to get through to Rich. Anyone have a replacement source for the clips and or the elastics?
> 
> TIA
> -Tom


Yep. My 120" 'scope screen has 12 broken elastic loops out of 15 along the top because... gravity, I guess. Don't know how many more are broken along the sides and bottom until I take it off the wall. So I'm glad Rich is sending replacements. As my screen is only 2 years old, it would seem there is a quality control problem with this particular brand of elastic. I'll send a PM to Rich, but need to get these replaced, STAT as I don't want the fabric to stretch out unevenly because of sagging.


----------



## archiguy

Okay, FWIW, I wrote to Rich Antonuccio a week ago via PM and e-mail about my broken elastic loops and, like denap above, have gotten no response. The last post Rich made in this thread, or anywhere else on AVS, was a year ago. It appears as though Falcon Screens is out of business, and has been for some time. I did hear from COACH2369 (thank you!) who replaced his screen & frame with a Seymour XD. He's happy with it and it appears to have a higher gain as well. As I can't afford to completely replace mine at this time, I'll be reaching out to Jon Seymour for help in correcting the problem.

Serves me right for trying to save a few bucks by supporting a new company with a sketchy owner. Live & learn. Just curious if anyone else on this thread who purchased a Falcon screen has any other information...?


----------



## sigma722

archiguy said:


> Okay, FWIW, I wrote to Rich Antonuccio a week ago via PM and e-mail about my broken elastic loops and, like denap above, have gotten no response. The last post Rich made in this thread, or anywhere else on AVS, was a year ago. It appears as though Falcon Screens is out of business, and has been for some time. I did hear from COACH2369 (thank you!) who replaced his screen & frame with a Seymour XD. He's happy with it and it appears to have a higher gain as well. As I can't afford to completely replace mine at this time, I'll be reaching out to Jon Seymour for help in correcting the problem.
> 
> Serves me right for trying to save a few bucks by supporting a new company with a sketchy owner. Live & learn. Just curious if anyone else on this thread who purchased a Falcon screen has any other information...?


At one point I believe someone had heard from Rich, and supposedly he was changing suppliers, but it's been so long with radio silence that I have to agree, doesn't look good.


----------



## archiguy

I'm wondering if the "elastic loops" he included with the screen are actually o-rings? And they don't seem to be simply rotting away like, say, rubber bands do over time. They all broke cleanly at one point and you can then stretch them without breaking them at another point. Almost like they started as rubber strings and then the ends were "welded" together to form a loop, and they broke at the weld-point. Maybe.

Just spitballing here, trying to find something to replace them with. But this thread is on life-support. Guess everyone else who bought a Falcon screen has moved on....


----------



## Craig Peer

sigma722 said:


> At one point I believe someone had heard from Rich, and supposedly he was changing suppliers, but it's been so long with radio silence that I have to agree, doesn't look good.


Falcon is definitely out of business.


----------



## COACH2369

archiguy said:


> I'm wondering if the "elastic loops" he included with the screen are actually o-rings? And they don't seem to be simply rotting away like, say, rubber bands do over time. They all broke cleanly at one point and you can then stretch them without breaking them at another point. Almost like they started as rubber strings and then the ends were "welded" together to form a loop, and they broke at the weld-point. Maybe.
> 
> Just spitballing here, trying to find something to replace them with. But this thread is on life-support. Guess everyone else who bought a Falcon screen has moved on....


Unfortunately, you are probably right.... I know I have and several others that I know have as well.


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> I'm wondering if the "elastic loops" he included with the screen are actually o-rings? And they don't seem to be simply rotting away like, say, rubber bands do over time. They all broke cleanly at one point and you can then stretch them without breaking them at another point. Almost like they started as rubber strings and then the ends were "welded" together to form a loop, and they broke at the weld-point. Maybe.
> 
> Just spitballing here, trying to find something to replace them with. But this thread is on life-support. Guess everyone else who bought a Falcon screen has moved on....


lowes has got to have some grommets that should work.


----------



## v8maro

Craig Peer said:


> sigma722 said:
> 
> 
> 
> At one point I believe someone had heard from Rich, and supposedly he was changing suppliers, but it's been so long with radio silence that I have to agree, doesn't look good.
> 
> 
> 
> Falcon is definitely out of business.
Click to expand...

Wow... I was going to try and order one today. Damn. Who should I consider instead??


----------



## Craig Peer

v8maro said:


> Wow... I was going to try and order one today. Damn. Who should I consider instead??


Seymour !


----------



## COACH2369

Craig Peer said:


> Seymour !


+2! Great screen options at the same price points as Falcon.

I highly recommend the XD material!


----------



## archiguy

Does anyone have a source for the o-rings (black elastic loops) Rich used for the Falcon screens? They're 1.25" diameter and 1/16" thick. Silicone, I think (could be wrong). I can't find them in Lowe's or Home Depot. Anybody have any suggestions?


----------



## chriscmore

We have custom made bands that might work, given the similarities of so many other aspects of the design. They don't age, crack or rot. Contact Jon and try a set out. If they don't work you can return them.

Cheers,
Chris


----------



## COACH2369

chriscmore said:


> We have custom made bands that might work, given the similarities of so many other aspects of the design. They don't age, crack or rot. Contact Jon and try a set out. If they don't work you can return them.
> 
> Cheers,
> Chris


Jon is great! He is the one who worked with me to make the change over to a Seymour XD screen from my Falcon. Very patient and thorough guy.. Definitely give him a call!


----------



## derek murray

archiguy said:


> Does anyone have a source for the o-rings (black elastic loops) ....


Would any of these work ? Use the filters for width and OD... Neoprene is pretty cheap.










https://www.mcmaster.com/#o-rings/=1alli31


----------



## archiguy

Turns out that the Falcon o-rings are 1-3/8" O.D. [outside diameter] (because apparently, that's how these things are labeled out in the world) x 1/16" thickness. So I went by my local Ace Hardware in Charlotte, Blackhawk Hardware -- the world's greatest hardware store, which is what Lowe's and Home Depot want to be when they grow up. There, I found an entire display with every kind and size of o-ring known to man. Except... wait for it... this _particular _size.  Thanks Rich! 

So I found something fractionally close in millimeters (slightly larger, or slightly smaller) which I hope will work. I bought every one they had in both sizes, a couple of dozen each, at a dollar a pop. So I guess I'm good. We'll see.

I took a picture of one of the Falcon o-rings with a quarter in the middle for scale and saved it to my computer. I'd post it, except I don't know how in the hell you post a picture onto an AVS thread if you haven't saved it to some file sharing service out there on the internets somewhere (so the "insert image" tag can use the URL). The one I used to use to use was Photobucket but it has apparently "kicked the bucket". Why does AVS make it so hard to post pictures from your own freaking computer?  If there's a simple way to do it that I've just never been able to figure out, I'd love to know how.


----------



## seplant

These o-rings might work: https://www.ebay.com/itm/35mm-x-1-5mm-Black-Flexible-Rubber-Seal-Oil-Filter-O-Ring-Gasket-20Pcs/310973363855?epid=1338337282&hash=item486774f68f:g:8XEAAOSwWcJZ5Jox


----------



## archiguy

seplant said:


> These o-rings might work: https://www.ebay.com/itm/35mm-x-1-5mm-Black-Flexible-Rubber-Seal-Oil-Filter-O-Ring-Gasket-20Pcs/310973363855?epid=1338337282&hash=item486774f68f:g:8XEAAOSwWcJZ5Jox


Not at $3.37 apiece they won't.  

I need a dozen, at least, and that's just what's broken off the top row. There may be more on the sides & bottom; won't know until I pull the screen off the wall and inspect it. Anyways, I think I'm good now.


----------



## seplant

archiguy said:


> Not at $3.37 apiece they won't.
> 
> I need a dozen, at least, and that's just what's broken off the top row. There may be more on the sides & bottom; won't know until I pull the screen off the wall and inspect it. Anyways, I think I'm good now.


That's for quantity 20. About 17 cents apiece. Even I can afford that!

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


----------



## archiguy

seplant said:


> That's for quantity 20. About 17 cents apiece. Even I can afford that!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk


Oh, I see it now, sorry.  Now I feel really bad for paying a buck each!


----------



## sigma722

archiguy said:


> If there's a simple way to do it that I've just never been able to figure out, I'd love to know how.


Below the quick reply box there is a section where it says "drag files here to attach".

Once you've submitted the reply, which uploads the image to AVS, you can open the image in a new tab to get the hyperlink, and then embed it into your post if you want to not have a "click on" picture attachment (via edit).


----------



## archiguy

Okay, thanks sigma, let's see if this works. This is the Falcon o-ring with a quarter inside it for scale. I just dragged and dropped the jpeg into that attachment box, which is the first time in my 16 year AVS membership I ever used it.

See? You _can _teach an old dog new tricks!


----------



## derek murray

McMaster-Carr has a bag of 60, 1-3/8" OD, 1/16" thick Neoprene o-rings for $13.30. Order them today and you'll typically have them, tomorrow.


----------



## archiguy

That brings up another interesting question. The o-rings referenced by sigma are made of rubber, or so their e-bay website says. The ones referenced by derek are made of neoprene. Still others are made of silicone. I guess the material you do *not *want is whatever Rich's rings were made of since they've been breaking like crazy. Wonder what the best material is for the use we're talking about, not as sealing gaskets but essentially as rubber bands designed to stretch & hold a fabric screen to its frame?


----------



## derek murray

archiguy said:


> ...not as sealing gaskets but essentially as rubber bands designed to stretch & hold a fabric screen to its frame?


If having to choose the stretchiest of the McMaster-Carr o-rings, the EPDM or Buna-N rubber ones appear to be the best. The Buna-N has better tear resistance... all this, according to the charts on this web site.

http://www.columbiaerd.com/materials.html


----------



## Frohlich

archiguy said:


> Okay, FWIW, I wrote to Rich Antonuccio a week ago via PM and e-mail about my broken elastic loops and, like denap above, have gotten no response. The last post Rich made in this thread, or anywhere else on AVS, was a year ago. It appears as though Falcon Screens is out of business, and has been for some time. I did hear from COACH2369 (thank you!) who replaced his screen & frame with a Seymour XD. He's happy with it and it appears to have a higher gain as well. As I can't afford to completely replace mine at this time, I'll be reaching out to Jon Seymour for help in correcting the problem.
> 
> Serves me right for trying to save a few bucks by supporting a new company with a sketchy owner. Live & learn. Just curious if anyone else on this thread who purchased a Falcon screen has any other information...?


I had the same Falcon Vision HD screen as Coach as we bought them around the same time. I also converted to Seymour XD and was able to keep my Falcon frame and just have a custom Seymour XD material cut to my exact size. The XD material is definitely brighter (higher gain) than my old Falcon Vision HD which helps in general and especially with HDR content.


----------



## archiguy

Frohlich said:


> I had the same Falcon Vision HD screen as Coach as we bought them around the same time. I also converted to Seymour XD and was able to keep my Falcon frame and just have a custom Seymour XD material cut to my exact size. The XD material is definitely brighter (higher gain) than my old Falcon Vision HD which helps in general and especially with HDR content.


Falcon called all three of it's screen material by the name "Vision" (Horizon, Platinum, Titanium). I have the "Horizon", which was a woven Acoustic Transparent. Is that what you had? I have received my Seymour samples and the "XD" material seems to be a stiffer, coarser weave than the Horizon; have no idea how they would compare as to gain. If it were actually, demonstrably brighter (higher gain), I would definitely think about replacing my Falcon screen. Has there been any third party, independent testing that compares them?


----------



## archiguy

derek murray said:


> If having to choose the stretchiest of the McMaster-Carr o-rings, the EPDM or Buna-N rubber ones appear to be the best. The Buna-N has better tear resistance... all this, according to the charts on this web site.
> 
> http://www.columbiaerd.com/materials.html


The Falcon o-rings were not terribly stretchy. I'm guessing maybe they were neoprene or silicone, but I really have no idea. The blue Seymore o-rings are much smaller, but very stretchy (Jon sent one with my screen material samples).

Perhaps I can get McMaster-Carr to send me some samples. Ironically, they're my wife's company's biggest client!


----------



## COACH2369

archiguy said:


> Falcon called all three of it's screen material by the name "Vision" (Horizon, Platinum, Titanium). I have the "Horizon", which was a woven Acoustic Transparent. Is that what you had? I have received my Seymour samples and the "XD" material seems to be a stiffer, coarser weave than the Horizon; have no idea how they would compare as to gain. If it were actually, demonstrably brighter (higher gain), I would definitely think about replacing my Falcon screen. Has there been any third party, independent testing that compares them?


The material Frohlich, Beastaudio and myself had was supposed to be the highest gain AT material Falcon offered. I was old that it was a 1.0 gain but after having numerous calibrations, it was obvious those numbers weren't accurate.

As soon as I put up the Seymour XD sample, I could tell an immediate difference with my eyes. The icing on the cake was when I made the switch and gained quite a bit of brightness. This allowed me to have a very watchable HDR calibration in low lamp mode. Something I couldn't get before..


----------



## Frohlich

archiguy said:


> Falcon called all three of it's screen material by the name "Vision" (Horizon, Platinum, Titanium). I have the "Horizon", which was a woven Acoustic Transparent. Is that what you had? I have received my Seymour samples and the "XD" material seems to be a stiffer, coarser weave than the Horizon; have no idea how they would compare as to gain. If it were actually, demonstrably brighter (higher gain), I would definitely think about replacing my Falcon screen. Has there been any third party, independent testing that compares them?



Their website is still up so I checked it. What we had was indeed the Vision HD. When I held up the XD sample material next to my Falcon screen you could tell easily the XD material had a higher gain when projecting an image....it was easily noticeable on any scene (i.e. you didn't have to look for a difference, it was easy to see). 

http://www.falconscreens.com/screens/

Falcon Vision HD™4k

FalconVisionHDFalcon Vision HD™ is the highest performing acoustically transparent (AT) screen available. No other AT screen fabric on the market can match Falcon Screens’ 1.1 gain for improved black levels, complimented by a perfectly smooth looking image and the appearance of a solid surface screen. High resolution projected images are not compromised as they are by screens with perforations or aggressive screen textures. The unique woven material is the first of its kind. For home theater enthusiasts wanting the completely immersive experience provided by shorter screen-to-viewing-location distances without visible screen texture – Falcon Vision HD is the only choice.



COACH2369 said:


> The material Frohlich, Beastaudio and myself had was supposed to be the highest gain AT material Falcon offered. I was old that it was a 1.0 gain but after having numerous calibrations, it was obvious those numbers weren't accurate.
> 
> As soon as I put up the Seymour XD sample, I could tell an immediate difference with my eyes. The icing on the cake was when I made the switch and gained quite a bit of brightness. This allowed me to have a very watchable HDR calibration in low lamp mode. Something I couldn't get before..


This. 

Coach and I basically have the same theater as we have owned the same speakers, same screens, etc.. Pretty sure our wives are concerned at this point


----------



## COACH2369

Frohlich said:


> Their website is still up so I checked it. What we had was indeed the Vision HD. When I held up the XD sample material next to my Falcon screen you could tell easily the XD material had a higher gain when projecting an image....it was easily noticeable on any scene (i.e. you didn't have to look for a difference, it was easy to see).
> 
> http://www.falconscreens.com/screens/
> 
> Falcon Vision HD™4k
> 
> FalconVisionHDFalcon Vision HD™ is the highest performing acoustically transparent (AT) screen available. No other AT screen fabric on the market can match Falcon Screens’ 1.1 gain for improved black levels, complimented by a perfectly smooth looking image and the appearance of a solid surface screen. High resolution projected images are not compromised as they are by screens with perforations or aggressive screen textures. The unique woven material is the first of its kind. For home theater enthusiasts wanting the completely immersive experience provided by shorter screen-to-viewing-location distances without visible screen texture – Falcon Vision HD is the only choice.
> 
> 
> 
> This.
> 
> Coach and I basically have the same theater as we have owned the same speakers, same screens, etc.. Pretty sure our wives are concerned at this point


We did draw the line with golf clubs...


----------



## eng-399

COACH2369 said:


> The material Frohlich, Beastaudio and myself had was supposed to be the highest gain AT material Falcon offered. I was old that it was a 1.0 gain but after having numerous calibrations, it was obvious those numbers weren't accurate.
> 
> 
> 
> As soon as I put up the Seymour XD sample, I could tell an immediate difference with my eyes. The icing on the cake was when I made the switch and gained quite a bit of brightness. This allowed me to have a very watchable HDR calibration in low lamp mode. Something I couldn't get before..




What screen do you have now? I have a Falcon Horizon screen and wondering what the next screen choice should be for me once I go 4K.


----------



## COACH2369

eng-399 said:


> What screen do you have now? I have a Falcon Horizon screen and wondering what the next screen choice should be for me once I go 4K.


I have a Seymour XD screen now. My seating area is about 9.5 feet back from the screen and I can't see the weave at all...even in super bright scenes. 

Great screen and well worth the upgrade, IMO.


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> Falcon called all three of it's screen material by the name "Vision" (Horizon, Platinum, Titanium). I have the "Horizon", which was a woven Acoustic Transparent. Is that what you had? I have received my Seymour samples and the "XD" material seems to be a stiffer, coarser weave than the Horizon; have no idea how they would compare as to gain. If it were actually, demonstrably brighter (higher gain), I would definitely think about replacing my Falcon screen. Has there been any third party, independent testing that compares them?





eng-399 said:


> What screen do you have now? I have a Falcon Horizon screen and wondering what the next screen choice should be for me once I go 4K.


I have benchmarked about a dozen different woven and perf materials against each other in the past year and through all the testing, it appears that the horizon material actually comes out around what would be a .8 or ever so slightly lower true gain. In the tests, the material was basically right on par with seymour's enlightor 4K material which is also considered a .8 gain material of similar weave. 

The next gain up would be the enlightor bright or "Neo" which would come in around a .9 gain and also has a similar weave and feel to it as the horizon and enlightor 4k.

The highest gain material I tested was indeed the XD when it came to woven screens, coming in at a true 1.0 gain. Microperf'd screens got up to 1.3 gain and were amazingly bright, but I don't want the deterioration in sound that comes along with MP screens.

Another super impressive screen material I got a great sample of was the new Screen Research material. it was quite nice and seemed to bench right in between the XD and the Bright/Neo materials so likely around a .95 gain.

Mike G. has also sent me a HUGE sample of avscience's V6 material so I am going to get to try that out soon enough. Right now im leaning towards either the XD, the enlightor NEO, or the screen research material, but they have not quite made their full "re" debut in the US so I don't know how difficult that might be to get them to get me something.


----------



## sigma722

beastaudio said:


> I have benchmarked about a dozen different woven and perf materials against each other in the past year and through all the testing, it appears that the horizon material actually comes out around what would be a .8 or ever so slightly lower true gain. In the tests, the material was basically right on par with seymour's enlightor 4K material which is also considered a .8 gain material of similar weave.
> 
> The next gain up would be the enlightor bright or "Neo" which would come in around a .9 gain and also has a similar weave and feel to it as the horizon and enlightor 4k.
> 
> The highest gain material I tested was indeed the XD when it came to woven screens, coming in at a true 1.0 gain. Microperf'd screens got up to 1.3 gain and were amazingly bright, but I don't want the deterioration in sound that comes along with MP screens.
> 
> Another super impressive screen material I got a great sample of was the new Screen Research material. it was quite nice and seemed to bench right in between the XD and the Bright/Neo materials so likely around a .95 gain.
> 
> Mike G. has also sent me a HUGE sample of avscience's V6 material so I am going to get to try that out soon enough. Right now im leaning towards either the XD, the enlightor NEO, or the screen research material, but they have not quite made their full "re" debut in the US so I don't know how difficult that might be to get them to get me something.


Since you didn't mention it I assume not, but have you by chance measured the Severtson SAT4K material, or seen it on a finished screen before? Kinda curious how it stacks up since it is advertised as 1.18 gain.


----------



## beastaudio

sigma722 said:


> Since you didn't mention it I assume not, but have you by chance measured the Severtson SAT4K material, or seen it on a finished screen before? Kinda curious how it stacks up since it is advertised as 1.18 gain.


Yes I have several of the severtson materials too and for the money, I don't see the benefit to be perfectly honest. The NEW 1.18 stacked up very similar to the XD material IIRC. I can re-check this evening if you'd like.


----------



## sigma722

beastaudio said:


> Yes I have several of the severtson materials too and for the money, I don't see the benefit to be perfectly honest. The NEW 1.18 stacked up very similar to the XD material IIRC. I can re-check this evening if you'd like.


Certainly curious if you don't mind. I'll be sitting about 10' from my screen which seems to be pretty close to the thresh hold of seeing the grain for xd, but seemingly you can't beat its gain!

Edit - might be worth noting that the price of sat4k dropped from what it was about a year+ ago, so not sure when you last priced it to say if it's worth it. It's roughly _only_ twice the cost of XD for similar size (~144-150" 2.35 ). Back in roughly may of 2015 it was more like 3x the cost of XD.


----------



## archiguy

The reason why I picked the Falcon Horizon material for my AT screen (I hope everyone here is talking about AT screens exclusively) was because the weave was relatively fine and reputed to be invisible from 9', which is where my first row of seats live. That was accurate. But the 1.0 gain was not, and I would prefer a woven, brighter screen.

The problem I see with the Seymour XD material is it appears to be a much coarser weave than the Falcon Horizon, as I mentioned above. I would be afraid it would still be visible at 9'.


----------



## beastaudio

sigma722 said:


> Certainly curious if you don't mind. I'll be sitting about 10' from my screen which seems to be pretty close to the thresh hold of seeing the grain for xd, but seemingly you can't beat its gain!
> 
> Edit - might be worth noting that the price of sat4k dropped from what it was about a year+ ago, so not sure when you last priced it to say if it's worth it. It's roughly _only_ twice the cost of XD for similar size (~144-150" 2.35 ). Back in roughly may of 2015 it was more like 3x the cost of XD.


I'll toss them up tonight when I get some time. I'll be in the HT tinkering most of the evening with speakers and such so once I get all that squared away, I'll tape it up there.


----------



## jjcook

I sit at ~8.5' eyes-to-screen and previously had the Falcon Vision HD material. Back in 2013 I chose it over the Seymour XD as the weave was much less noticeable at my viewing distance, neither Falcon nor Seymour had their finer weaves available at that time (except the expensive Enlightor4k). I sold my screen/frame last year to move to the V6 material but have held off as I'm now going all in with soundproofing etc.

Here is my stale thread on AT fabrics for close viewing distances, I'm looking forward to checking out the Seymour Neo and other new contenders when my build is ready:

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-sc...ance-manufactured-screen-fabrics-spandex.html


----------



## beastaudio

jjcook said:


> I sit at ~8.5' eyes-to-screen and previously had the Falcon Vision HD material. Back in 2013 I chose it over the Seymour XD as the weave was much less noticeable at my viewing distance, neither Falcon nor Seymour had their finer weaves available at that time (except the expensive Enlightor4k). I sold my screen/frame last year to move to the V6 material but have held off as I'm now going all in with soundproofing etc.
> 
> Here is my stale thread on AT fabrics for close viewing distances, I'm looking forward to checking out the Seymour Neo and other new contenders when my build is ready:
> 
> http://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-sc...ance-manufactured-screen-fabrics-spandex.html


Yep, definitely a few more out there for you to try out, for sure the NEO. the 1.18 is pretty solid too, and the Screen Research 4k material but again, who knows if you can even get that in the states just yet.


----------



## COACH2369

sigma722 said:


> Since you didn't mention it I assume not, but have you by chance measured the Severtson SAT4K material, or seen it on a finished screen before? Kinda curious how it stacks up since it is advertised as 1.18 gain.


I had the same Severtson samples before Beast did. Actually, I sent him my samples once I was done with them. Have to say, I agree 100% with what he said about them. Still thought the XD was better to my eyes.



sigma722 said:


> Certainly curious if you don't mind. I'll be sitting about 10' from my screen which seems to be pretty close to the thresh hold of seeing the grain for xd, but seemingly you can't beat its gain!
> 
> Edit - might be worth noting that the price of sat4k dropped from what it was about a year+ ago, so not sure when you last priced it to say if it's worth it. It's roughly _only_ twice the cost of XD for similar size (~144-150" 2.35 ). Back in roughly may of 2015 it was more like 3x the cost of XD.


I am sitting 9.5 feet back and the weave doesn't bother me at all, even in extremely bright scenes. Colors just pop and the additional gain really helped my overall video.


----------



## sigma722

COACH2369 said:


> I had the same Severtson samples before Beast did. Actually, I sent him my samples once I was done with them. Have to say, I agree 100% with what he said about them. Still thought the XD was better to my eyes.
> 
> I am sitting 9.5 feet back and the weave doesn't bother me at all, even in extremely bright scenes. Colors just pop and the additional gain really helped my overall video.


Good to know. Apparently I've demod the material in a couple of guy's house and never realized that's what they had. Looks like material is backordered on seymour av, so waiting to hear back to jon to see what kind of turnaround time we'll see once it's back in stock. Might be placing an order soon (albeit still too early probably  )


----------



## archiguy

derek murray said:


> Would any of these work ? Use the filters for width and OD... Neoprene is pretty cheap.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.mcmaster.com/#o-rings/=1alli31


I ordered a package ($13/100) of those, plus a package of the "Buna-N" ($7/100), which I gather is a kind of rubber. One or the other of those is bound to work.


----------



## beastaudio

Here are some screenshots. The v^ material is the left sample, XD is in the middle, and the severtson is on the right. The bottom sample is the severtson microperf 1.3 gain which goes to show you how much more real gain can be had with microperf vs. woven. Super scientific process here. Cell phone photos. The last two photos I removed the V6 material and moved the microperf to the left spot, xd still in middle, severtson on right.


----------



## sigma722

Super helpful. Agree from a gain perspective the severtson weave is not worth twice the money. The microperf is also super intersting. I have samples of all of these, just don't have the projector setup for testing, but I can do the grain check easily enough. Cons with micro perf is a slightly greater audio impact, and needing to have 6" spacing between driver and screen right? Can the audio impact be EQ'd around just like weaves can?


----------



## beastaudio

sigma722 said:


> Super helpful. Agree from a gain perspective the severtson weave is not worth twice the money. The microperf is also super intersting. I have samples of all of these, just don't have the projector setup for testing, but I can do the grain check easily enough. Cons with micro perf is a slightly greater audio impact, and needing to have 6" spacing between driver and screen right? Can the audio impact be EQ'd around just like weaves can?


You can, although whether it is beneficial to the sound or not will depend on the situation I guess. I tested the XD back when I had it originally against the firehawk microperf. These were the results:


----------



## Lygren

beastaudio said:


> Here are some screenshots. The v^ material is the left sample, XD is in the middle, and the severtson is on the right. The bottom sample is the severtson microperf 1.3 gain which goes to show you how much more real gain can be had with microperf vs. woven. Super scientific process here. Cell phone photos. The last two photos I removed the V6 material and moved the microperf to the left spot, xd still in middle, severtson on right.


Did you place black backing behind the other fabrics?


----------



## archiguy

Lygren, you know you can edit out the pictures if you're just going to make a short comment. No need to re-post them, as it just forces people to scroll past them again. That can be a real pain on mobile devices. Just a helpful hint.


----------



## Lygren

archiguy said:


> Lygren, you know you can edit out the pictures if you're just going to make a short comment. No need to re-post them, as it just forces people to scroll past them again. That can be a real pain on mobile devices. Just a helpful hint.


Done, completely agree...


----------



## beastaudio

Lygren said:


> Did you place black backing behind the other fabrics?


Didn't have anymore GOM laying around unfortunately. 'Tis why I said "Super Scientific Approach" in the comment. I understand fully that this skews the results somewhat but the different levels of gain and weave were the main objective, not benchmarking the gain overall.


----------



## Lygren

beastaudio said:


> Didn't have anymore GOM laying around unfortunately. 'Tis why I said "Super Scientific Approach" in the comment. I understand fully that this skews the results somewhat but the different levels of gain and weave were the main objective, not benchmarking the gain overall.




Gain is not properly comparable when you add a second reflective layer (i.e. the screen you have attached the samples to) on some while others (the v6) blocks it off completely I’m afraid (the v6 has integrated backing). I understand the non scientific angle completely, but in this case you would not be showcasing what would be the final result once installed - it would look completely - and I mean completely - different than what this comparison gives an impression of. Not trying to be a grumpy ol’ nagger here, but since gain is what you guys are discussing my comment is highly relevant in this case.

Also, as for AT, a drop of 3-4dB, let alone 5-7dB @ 70dB sweeps translates to the double @50dB (at least), killing off micro details as well as introducing overall ‘muffle’. AT as component is extremely critical, and in my humble opinion given far too little emphasis at times.... 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## beastaudio

Lygren said:


> Gain is not properly comparable when you add a second reflective layer (i.e. the screen you have attached the samples to) on some while others (the v6) blocks it off completely I’m afraid (the v6 has integrated backing). I understand the non scientific angle completely, but in this case you would not be showcasing what would be the final result once installed - it would look completely - and I mean completely - different than what this comparison gives an impression of. Not trying to be a grumpy ol’ nagger here, but since gain is what you guys are discussing my comment is highly relevant in this case.
> 
> Also, as for AT, a drop of 3-4dB, let alone 5-7dB @ 70dB sweeps translates to the double @50dB (at least), killing off micro details as well as introducing overall ‘muffle’. AT as component is extremely critical, and in my humble opinion given far too little emphasis at times....
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes I am aware of that and understand your concern, it was simply a quick toss up and go. Using black backing previously I found the same results however. I don't expect anyone to look at my pics as a benchmark of any sorts for expectations.

I also agree 100% on how little emphasis is given to the A-T materials. What say you about which are some of the best from an audio standpoint? I can't visit your site as it's blocked by our firmware but will be sure to check it out later this evening.


----------



## Lygren

beastaudio said:


> Yes I am aware of that and understand your concern, it was simply a quick toss up and go. Using black backing previously I found the same results however. I don't expect anyone to look at my pics as a benchmark of any sorts for expectations.
> 
> I also agree 100% on how little emphasis is given to the A-T materials. What say you about which are some of the best from an audio standpoint? I can't visit your site as it's blocked by our firmware but will be sure to check it out later this evening.


Sure, I have not tested these particular fabrics myself, so they might be so "thick" they do not add reflection by being placed on a second reflective surface and as such, nor appear darker by adding the black backing so I´ll moderate myself to stating; "normally there would be a difference"... 

As for AT, I have found there is a certain "threshold" for when and if blockage becomes a problem. My personal opinion is that this limit is quite low. Knitted "spandex" or similar fabrics, like we used for our 3. generation fabrics, are quite AT, often moreso than the more tightly woven fabrics. Problem using spandex or knits is reduced image sharpness... You can read till´ your eye gets sore about our tech on our webpages, comparing knits with ours ++, but in short, ours is a patented hybrid between weave and knits, basically trying to balance off the AT and gain by utilising the advantages of the weave / knit in the most optimal manner. We have, however, placed a great deal of emphasis on the AT, so the gain on the V6 is not crazy high (0.8 benchmarked vs. what we regard the best non-AT fabric out there; Stewart Studiotek 100). Still, benchmarked vs. other AT fabrics that claim 1.0 gain, the v6 ended up slightly higher gained, so it´s certainly not "bad".

Still, in these times of HDR I do agree that gain is highly relevant and we will certainly try our best to optimise the composition even further moving forward, but for now - and also for the foreseeable future - the V6 is the best we could come up with in such regards while still maintaining what we consider a critical AT performance... 

Good luck finding your next AT screen material!


----------



## archiguy

I know that Rich always said a black backer was unnecessary on the Falcon screen material. I would concur with that, as I don't have anything there but the screen material itself. However, I covered the back wall behind the screen with black velvet and my Triad in-wall loudspeakers are flat black as well, so I suppose it really wouldn't matter anyway.


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> I know that Rich always said a black backer was unnecessary on the Falcon screen material. I would concur with that, as I don't have anything there but the screen material itself. However, I covered the back wall behind the screen with black velvet and my Triad in-wall loudspeakers are flat black as well, so I suppose it really wouldn't matter anyway.


My screen hangs, phantom style in front of my LCR which have black fronts, and the subs which are actually a darker wood stain and satin finish and never once had an issue there. The Horizon is pretty tight weave-wise. The LCR are right up against the screen and it makes for a cool effect with the two phillips hue lights I have behind the screen to where you just barely see the outline of the speakers behind the material when no image is being projected. Soon as I turn the rear lights of for viewing, it all just disappears. Pretty cool. 

Speaking of which, when you gonna make the haul up the mountain for demo bud?!?! 2 hours, easy peasy.


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> Speaking of which, when you gonna make the haul up the mountain for demo bud?!?! 2 hours, easy peasy.


Hey thanks! You up in the Asheville area? Would love to meet some fellow A/V enthusiasts within driving distance. And consider this a reciprocal invitation to check out "The River Rat Theater" (I'm working on the artwork/title to hang over the door) here in Lake Wylie, about 30 minutes due west from Charlotte. Been meaning to start a thread in the dedicated HT forum for a couple of years now and have just not gotten around to it. My avatar's a picture of it though.


----------



## archiguy

archiguy said:


> I ordered a package ($13/100) of those, plus a package of the "Buna-N" ($7/100), which I gather is a kind of rubber. One or the other of those is bound to work.


So, McMaster-Carr was Johnny-on-the-spot with those two packages of o-rings, arrived yesterday. I can now confirm that the Buna-N o-rings (1-3/8" O.D. x 1/16" thickness) are a "dead ringer" for Rich's o-rings if anyone else needs some. They seem to have the same modulus of elasticity (stretchiness); the neoprene version was a little stiffer. Cheap too, at 7¢ each!


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> Hey thanks! You up in the Asheville area? Would love to meet some fellow A/V enthusiasts within driving distance. And consider this a reciprocal invitation to check out "The River Rat Theater" (I'm working on the artwork/title to hang over the door) here in Lake Wylie, about 30 minutes due west from Charlotte. Been meaning to start a thread in the dedicated HT forum for a couple of years now and have just not gotten around to it. My avatar's a picture of it though.


Yessir! Good ole A-town. If you find yourself up this way just shoot me a heads up and I'll be happy to accommodate. I'd love to check out the "River Rat Theater" next time I am down that way. I actually learned how to water ski on Wylie back when I was a kid  Fond memories there.


----------



## derek murray

archiguy said:


> ... McMaster-Carr was Johnny-on-the-spot with those two packages of o-rings


Excellent! 

If I place an order in the afternoon, my package will arrive the next morning... and that's shipping to Canada! Great company to deal with.


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> Yessir! Good ole A-town. If you find yourself up this way just shoot me a heads up and I'll be happy to accommodate. I'd love to check out the "River Rat Theater" next time I am down that way. I actually learned how to water ski on Wylie back when I was a kid  Fond memories there.


I've been up to your place. Sweet crib! Bummer that your theater was closed for renovations that day.  Love how you decorate for Christmas.


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> I've been up to your place. Sweet crib! Bummer that your theater was closed for renovations that day.  Love how you decorate for Christmas.


Yea, you love how it looks, but try being the only one that has to string all those lights on that tree every year. I'm hiring out next year.


----------



## COACH2369

beastaudio said:


> Yea, you love how it looks, but try being the only one that has to string all those lights on that tree every year. I'm hiring out next year.


It is amazing how much bigger your house looks with Christmas lights.


----------



## archiguy

COACH2369 said:


> It is amazing how much bigger your house looks with Christmas lights.


I hear it's bigger on the inside.


----------



## dlinsley

It was interesting to see such activity in this thread all of a sudden! I evaluated a bunch of the materials in September 2016 and came to the conclusion, visually by eye only, that Falcon Vision HD would work for me and that's what I purchased and have installed. After seeing the recent posts, I thought I'd get my meter out and take some readings as if I could get more light and better acoustics I'd be interested in swapping material.

My meter is a Basiccolor Discus, that has an aiming light, and I threw up a 100IRE test pattern from my Radiance in my low lamp SDR configuration (JVC RS600 with iris at -8). For each material, other than the in-place Falcon (128" 2.37:1 with black Knauff insulation ~ 16" behind it), I had Joann Royalty 3 velvet behind it to avoid reflection off of the Falcon screen. Each material was mounted one after the other in the center of the screen, with the DI disabled. Measurements in nits, with gain in parenthesis normalized to ST100 being a known quantity of 1.0:

Stewart ST100 (sample, 2011 I think): 36.8 (1.0)
Falcon Vision (Purchased November 2016): 34.3 (0.93)
V6 (sample from AVS in September 2016): 30.9 (0.84)
Seymour XD (24"x24" sample September 2016): 34.2 (0.93)

It's interesting how much brighter the ST100 looks even though it is < 10% brighter. I wish I didn't like AT so much 

Edit: I just checked the Accucal report, and my measurements for Falcon and XD are consistent with theirs and so V6 would not work for me for HDR until some future projector replacement. I may get a Svertson sample to evaluate.


----------



## beastaudio

That sounds about right. Most here I believe are talking in regards to the Horizon 4K material, which is a good bit lower in gain than the vision.


----------



## gdfein

Curious what happened with Falcon? A few pages back it becomes clear they are out of business but no discussion of why? The website says main but has read that way for sometime. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## beastaudio

gdfein said:


> Curious what happened with Falcon? A few pages back it becomes clear they are out of business but no discussion of why? The website says main but has read that way for sometime.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I have it on pretty good authority that the business was closed down due to personal issues of the owner. Good issues, actually, which is rare, but personal nonetheless...


----------



## gdfein

Thanks Beast. That’s a bummer. I was following some of the first builds that used Falcon screens gathering ideas for my own theater. Now that I’m in he market to buy a screen and recently returned to this thread to get caught up. 

Well as much as we all try to plan in this life, god has his own plan and just laughs at us. Wishing Rich the best. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## emanymton123

Had a slight mishap with my Falcon screen last week and need a new set of corner brackets. Anybody know where I could find replacements now that Falcon seems to be out of business?


----------



## SeaNile

emanymton123 said:


> Had a slight mishap with my Falcon screen last week and need a new set of corner brackets. Anybody know where I could find replacements now that Falcon seems to be out of business?


Ditto. I'll need new corner brackets too. They break very, very easily. 

What are the thoughts on screwing an eye hook into the top of the frame? Anyone done this with the Falcon product?


----------



## beastaudio

SeaNile said:


> Ditto. I'll need new corner brackets too. They break very, very easily.
> 
> What are the thoughts on screwing an eye hook into the top of the frame? Anyone done this with the Falcon product?


That's exactly how mine has been hanging for years now. I shuffled the grommett screws around to free up two on the top of the frame. Removed the screws and replaced with two eye hooks and I was rockin'. It takes to braces coming out of the side walls to get it to lay perfectly vertically, but that was simply done with two velvet-wrapped L brackets.


----------



## SparHeel

dlinsley said:


> It was interesting to see such activity in this thread all of a sudden! I evaluated a bunch of the materials...My meter is a Basiccolor Discus, that has an aiming light, and I threw up a 100IRE test pattern from my Radiance in my low lamp SDR configuration (JVC RS600 with iris at -8). For each material... I had Joann Royalty 3 velvet behind it to avoid reflection off of the Falcon screen... Measurements in nits, with gain in parenthesis normalized to ST100 being a known quantity of 1.0:
> 
> Stewart ST100 (sample, 2011 I think): 36.8 (1.0)
> Falcon Vision (Purchased November 2016): 34.3 (0.93)
> V6 (sample from AVS in September 2016): 30.9 (0.84)
> Seymour XD (24"x24" sample September 2016): 34.2 (0.93).


 @dlinsley, thanks for this valuable info and to @beastaudio and other posters for the legwork and info. If you set up your gain measuring rig again, do you think it might be helpful to check the gain of the Seymour XD _without_ the velvet backing?

The suggestion is based on an idea speculated in a faraway thread (by a poster who can choose to self identify - or not) that backing XD with a white AT material (in that case spandex) might result in both a higher gain and a lessening of weave visibility, or more accurately, might permit a closer viewing distance without weave visibility, and both without degrading picture quality! 

Both the higher gain and possible closer distance from MLP to screen seem intuitively correct. Whether the PQ would be enhanced, degraded, or unchanged seems less clear. There may be any number of official and unofficial viewpoints on this combo, but it seems to me that having an accurate gain measurement couldn't hurt. And, too, it seems likely that the backing material could be Falcon, spandex, or another white AT material without affecting the combo's gain very much. 

I've never seen this idea mentioned anywhere else other than that initial post, which BTW generated no responses, until recently @tatumjon posted two screenshots of his XD over white spandex over black spandex screen in Little Chris's build thread: post #47 http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-de...-small-home-theater-build-2.html#post55011586. I don't think tatumjon was trying to plow new ground, but rather simply stretched his XD over the spandex for expediency. The photos look good, but I don't put a lot of stock in screenshots. But, the fact that these don't look _bad_ says a lot.

Anyway, the gain measurement might be helpful, and the concept could provide an upgrade path for many AT screens if it's workable. Any thoughts?


----------



## chriscmore

Uncle Q said:


> @dlinsley, thanks for this valuable info and to @beastaudio and other posters for the legwork and info. If you set up your gain measuring rig again, do you think it might be helpful to check the gain of the Seymour XD _without_ the velvet backing?
> 
> The suggestion is based on an idea speculated in a faraway thread (by a poster who can choose to self identify - or not) that backing XD with a white AT material (in that case spandex) might result in both a higher gain and a lessening of weave visibility, or more accurately, might permit a closer viewing distance without weave visibility, and both without degrading picture quality!
> 
> Both the higher gain and possible closer distance from MLP to screen seem intuitively correct. Whether the PQ would be enhanced, degraded, or unchanged seems less clear. There may be any number of official and unofficial viewpoints on this combo, but it seems to me that having an accurate gain measurement couldn't hurt. And, too, it seems likely that the backing material could be Falcon, spandex, or another white AT material without affecting the combo's gain very much.
> 
> I've never seen this idea mentioned anywhere else other than that initial post, which BTW generated no responses, until recently @tatumjon posted two screenshots of his XD over white spandex over black spandex screen in Little Chris's build thread: post #47 http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-de...-small-home-theater-build-2.html#post55011586. I don't think tatumjon was trying to plow new ground, but rather simply stretched his XD over the spandex for expediency. The photos look good, but I don't put a lot of stock in screenshots. But, the fact that these don't look _bad_ says a lot.
> 
> Anyway, the gain measurement might be helpful, and the concept could provide an upgrade path for many AT screens if it's workable. Any thoughts?


Reflective secondary layers are never a good idea, as the secondary layer inevitably causes backlighting of the primary layer by design. This contamination will cause cross pixel light contamination and reduce detail and ANSI contrast ratio. It's easiest to see in a starfield pattern or put some computer text or spreadsheets up and note the reduction in detail, blurring, and reduction in high-detail contrast. Gain isn't worth those more fundamental image quality tradeoffs, and in fact a lower gain screen can advantageous. High output projectors with low gain screens are actually the trendline as they offer the best overall system configuration. Thankfully, we've seen fewer dual-reflective concoctions on AVS lately.

Cheers,
Chris


----------



## Lygren

Well, I guess this is an area I should comment, since we have actually patented the use of several layers in a matrix that actually improves both density, sharpness and AT. I do agree on Seymour AV´s general comment though; using more than one layer has several potential constraints - and for example - two layers of spandex with the same structural buildup, tensioned, is normally not a good idea. Light contamination for one, moiré caused by using two identical layers another.


----------



## bigbadbob

A couple questions:
1) is it impossible to get any Falcon Screens today? Is it completely shut down? If I waited to long, it's my fault and understand.
2) if I can't get a Falcon Screen; what's the best alternative (based on price/performance similar to Falcon) in a fixed, 120" AT screen?


Thanks,
RG


----------



## beastaudio

bigbadbob said:


> A couple questions:
> 1) is it impossible to get any Falcon Screens today? Is it completely shut down? If I waited to long, it's my fault and understand.
> 2) if I can't get a Falcon Screen; what's the best alternative (based on price/performance similar to Falcon) in a fixed, 120" AT screen?
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> RG


It would definitely appear that yes, it is too late for you bud. Unless you want to drive down to sunny/warm NC and pickup my falcon screen that is.... 

The next best option in the similar price range is seymour. Other options at more of a premium would be severtson, screen research, screen innovations, or DT screens v6 material with frame.


----------



## bigbadbob

beastaudio said:


> It would definitely appear that yes, it is too late for you bud. Unless you want to drive down to sunny/warm NC and pickup my falcon screen that is....
> 
> The next best option in the similar price range is seymour. Other options at more of a premium would be severtson, screen research, screen innovations, or DT screens v6 material with frame.


Thanks Beast. Would love to drive to NC; especially today with the weather here.


----------



## popalock

beastaudio said:


> It would definitely appear that yes, it is too late for you bud. Unless you want to drive down to sunny/warm NC and pickup my falcon screen that is....
> 
> The next best option in the similar price range is seymour. Other options at more of a premium would be severtson, screen research, screen innovations, or DT screens v6 material with frame.


 I gave my screen back to Rich before I left for Qatar a few years back... Worked out a deal to get a credit when I bought my next screen from him...:serious:


----------



## beastaudio

popalock said:


> I gave my screen back to Rich before I left for Qatar a few years back... Worked out a deal to get a credit when I bought my next screen from him...:serious:


EWWW Mannnn. Oye, you talked to Andrew about this midsummer night's g2g he's talking about?


----------



## popalock

beastaudio said:


> EWWW Mannnn. Oye, you talked to Andrew about this midsummer night's g2g he's talking about?


Heck yeah!


----------



## beastaudio

Hello folks! In the process of modifying my screen this weekend, I managed to snap two of the corner L-Brackets. I know several of you around here had the same issue at some point and didn't know if one of yall could point me in the direction of where you may have found some replacement brackets? Otherwise, if any of you have some laying around, I'd love to take them off your hands. I still have enough to keep my frame intact, but want to get some extras just to be safe.


----------



## Patriot666

I needed a couple replacement corner brackets when I assembled my screen a couple years ago. I'm glad I asked for replacements when I did! I had no idea Falcon went out of business until today! I have my screen up for sale, but I might just keep it and be super careful with the brackets when I reassemble it!


----------



## beastaudio

beastaudio said:


> Hello folks! In the process of modifying my screen this weekend, I managed to snap two of the corner L-Brackets. I know several of you around here had the same issue at some point and didn't know if one of yall could point me in the direction of where you may have found some replacement brackets? Otherwise, if any of you have some laying around, I'd love to take them off your hands. I still have enough to keep my frame intact, but want to get some extras just to be safe.





Patriot666 said:


> I needed a couple replacement corner brackets when I assembled my screen a couple years ago. I'm glad I asked for replacements when I did! I had no idea Falcon went out of business until today! I have my screen up for sale, but I might just keep it and be super careful with the brackets when I reassemble it!



The good news is a standard corner bracket and metal-tapping screw works wonderfully. I went ahead and went this route after looking around for the corner brackets to no avail. The screen is more rigid now than it ever was.


----------



## seplant

beastaudio said:


> The good news is a standard corner bracket and metal-tapping screw works wonderfully. I went ahead and went this route after looking around for the corner brackets to no avail. The screen is more rigid now than it ever was.


Would you mind posting a photo of the type of corner bracket you used?


----------



## beastaudio

seplant said:


> Would you mind posting a photo of the type of corner bracket you used?


It was something similar to this: https://www.lowes.com/pd/National-H...in-x-0-07-in-Zinc-Alloy-Flat-Brace/1000201719


----------



## Lee Weber

Does anyone have recommended cleaning method for a falcon screen? My buddy has one and it has a little smudge spot...


----------



## JSKMDWK

To clean a spot on a matte white (non-coated) screen use a clean, soft, non-abrasive cloth dampened in a mild detergent and water mixture to gently scrub the affected area. Cleaners such as solvents or bleach should not be used. Again, this is recommended only as a last resort.


----------



## Lee Weber

JSKMDWK said:


> To clean a spot on a matte white (non-coated) screen use a clean, soft, non-abrasive cloth dampened in a mild detergent and water mixture to gently scrub the affected area. Cleaners such as solvents or bleach should not be used. Again, this is recommended only as a last resort.


Is the acoustically transparent material coated? And thank you.


----------



## archiguy

Lee Weber said:


> Is the acoustically transparent material coated? And thank you.


Not that I know of. And that's part of the problem. The gain on the woven AT Falcon Screen is supposedly 1, but after buying an LG OLED a couple of years ago, the image seems dull & dark. I designed my dedicated theater from scratch & rolled it into the construction cost of the house. But if I had to do it all over again, I would have gotten a more highly reflective screen and ditched the idea of having the 3 main speakers behind the screen. Seemed like a good idea at the time. 

The neoprene gasket loops that were included in the screen kit to attach the screen to the frame hooks have almost all broken by this point. I ordered a pack of new, higher quality loops from McMaster Carr a few years ago and have been using those as replacements. I have not had the broken steel corner bracket issue.


----------



## dlinsley

I think the frames AVScience sell with v6/v7 material are the same as the old Falcon frames (photos of the back and brackets look identical to my AVS frame). I had a broken bracket (cracked while tightening those rotating grip things) and they mailed out another, so they may be able to sell you some if want a like for like replacement.

I measured the Falcon weave at 0.93 gain, with ST100 as reference, same as Seymour XD.


----------



## beastaudio

dlinsley said:


> I measured the Falcon weave at 0.93 gain, with ST100 as reference, same as Seymour XD.


That would be the original woven screen is my guess. the Falcon "Horizon" material was even lower, at like .8 gain or even less. Once HDR became a thing it was like fighting with one hand behind your back. I miss the extremely fine weave and zero hotspotting but the 1.3 gain MP does everything else so much better it's undeniably worth the move to a higher gain screen with anything over a 100" wide screen IMO.


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> That would be the original woven screen is my guess. the Falcon "Horizon" material was even lower, at like .8 gain or even less. Once HDR became a thing it was like fighting with one hand behind your back. I miss the extremely fine weave and zero hotspotting but the 1.3 gain MP does everything else so much better it's undeniably worth the move to a higher gain screen with anything over a 100" wide screen IMO.


I'm sorry; MP...? And is that a woven AT screen?


----------



## beastaudio

archiguy said:


> I'm sorry; MP...? And is that a woven AT screen?


Microperf. I am currently running the Severtson cinema white microperf 1.3


----------



## archiguy

beastaudio said:


> Microperf. I am currently running the Severtson cinema white microperf 1.3


Okay, thanks. The criticism I always heard of microperf screens was that you might be able to see a moire effect from the uniform spacing of the tiny holes. That's why I chose a woven screen.


----------



## mikela

archiguy said:


> Okay, thanks. The criticism I always heard of microperf screens was that you might be able to see a moire effect from the uniform spacing of the tiny holes. That's why I chose a woven screen.


The MP is placed at an angle to eliminate moire.


----------

