# 3D Displayer - VIP Product



## Billbofet

Just wanted to start a thread for this specific VIP product.


I have seen a ton of information on the 3D Gamer and Theater product, but this is the unit I am most interested in.


If there is anyone out there that has received this unit yet, please post your impressions within this thread. Thought it would be a neater way to track the info vs. farming it out of the 3D Gamer thread.


Thanks in advance.


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## Billbofet

Attached is a .pdf document I got from Jonathan regarding this product:


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## jadeezra

This is the product I'm going with. At 299 I could care less if it doesnt work on direct tv. I'm in this thing for the blu ray's and video games. Its a steal imo.


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## donyoop




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20191442
> 
> 
> Attached is a .pdf document I got from Jonathan regarding this product:



The question has been: what are they doing to support 60 Hz displays? The plot thickens... The pdf says 720 progressive output that is field interleaved??










Don


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## Billbofet

My understanding is that this product would basically work on all things PS3 - games, BD movies, Vudu, and PSN 3D rentals.


If that is the case, and others have good luck with the IR/emitter glasses, this one looks like a winner for me.


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## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20192493
> 
> 
> My understanding is that this product would basically work on all things PS3 - games, BD movies, Vudu, and PSN 3D rentals.
> 
> 
> If that is the case, and others have good luck with the IR/emitter glasses, this one looks like a winner for me.



The Gamer does what you mention. This unit does blu-ray 3d as well.


A third unit, the Theater, handles cable/sat 3d.


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## Loppan




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *donyoop* /forum/post/20192180
> 
> 
> The question has been: what are they doing to support 60 Hz displays? The plot thickens... The pdf says 720 progressive output that is field interleaved??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don




This is what I would like to know aswell, every time I see someone who ask about this there is no answer to it. Also, is it limited to 720p, I thought I heard 1080p from the beginning?



/Henrik


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## walford

From the data sheet it appears that the unit will accept 1080p/24 frame packing 3D format from a 3D BR player or from a PS3 and can output it at either 720p/60 or 720p/120 using field interleaved format. It does not appear that the unit supports output using any 1080p 3D display formats. If using a standard 60Hz LCD or Plasma 2D TV I am not sure if using 720p/60 frame interleaved format will provide an acceptable 3D experience.


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## space123321




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *walford* /forum/post/20193933
> 
> 
> From the data sheet it appears that the unit will accept 1080p/24 frame packing 3D format from a 3D BR player or from a PS3 and can output it at either 720p/60 or 720p/120 using field interleaved format. It does not appear that the unit supports output using any 1080p 3D display formats. If using a standard 60Hz LCD or Plasma 2D TV I am not sure if using 720p/60 frame interleaved format will provide an acceptable 3D experience.



I am confussed - what is field interleaved format? If this the old field sequential format? I have an hd66 and want to ensure that it will be the same experience as my 3dtv (frame by frame, not line by line...) thanks!


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## walford

AFAIK Field Interleaved, Frame Sequential, Page Flipping, and possibly full SbS format and in some cases Over and Under format are all the same or very close to the same since they consist of sequential full frames alternating left an right eye content. None of thes format should be confused with the HDMI 1.4a 1080p packed double frame 3D format or the HDMI 1.4a 3D 1080i Side-by-Side 1/2 R format.

Maybe one of you who has used some or all of these formats can provide knowledge of whch of these are the same and/or which of these are certainly not the same.


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## Billbofet

Also wondering if this unit does SBS format and if the IR glasses with emitter are universal. Meaning, would any IR/emitter combo work?


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## perfectdark

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Billbofet* 
Also wondering if this unit does SBS format and if the IR glasses with emitter are universal. Meaning, would any IR/emitter combo work?
don't know about your emitter question. But the Displayer Does NOT do SBS


here is the low down


3D-Gamer --> 720p frame packed (a.k.a PS3 games and Hulu only)


3D-Displayer ---> 720p / 1080p frame packed (a.k.a bluray movies) and PS3 games


3D-Theatre ---> All files (SBS & TB) bluray movies, PS3 games, Xbox360 games, Sat/Cable .... (only thing it doesn't support is 1080p 60 @ SBS)


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## cyclejim

The gamer also does psn movies in 3d as well as vudu movies in 3d.


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## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cyclejim* /forum/post/20198138
> 
> 
> The gamer also does psn movies in 3d as well as vudu movies in 3d.



The 3D Gamer requires a display with a 120mhz refresh rate. This is why I am honing in on the Displayer for my 60mhz projector.


Thanks


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## cyclejim




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20198276
> 
> 
> The 3D Gamer requires a display with a 120mhz refresh rate. This is why I am honing in on the Displayer for my 60mhz projector.
> 
> 
> Thanks



No problem, my intention was to correct the post above that did not indicate these capabilities on the gamer.


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## Billbofet

Can't believe noone has received or chimed in on this unit yet.


This must be a little bit behind the Theater as far as shipment and release.


I am checking the threads hourly in hopes of getting some intel on this product!!!


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## hoogs




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20205710
> 
> 
> Can't believe noone has received or chimed in on this unit yet.
> 
> 
> This must be a little bit behind the Theater as far as shipment and release.
> 
> 
> I am checking the threads hourly in hopes of getting some intel on this product!!!



First shipment of the Displayer is going out the first week of April.


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## wanab

I ordered mine on the 24th. It is now "awaiting shipment".Too bad it costs $335.95 US funds.... but maybe I can keep my Mitz hd1000 720P and NOT have to buy that Acer... as I'm drooling over my remotes.................... If it gives that FULL BLURAY 3D performance as what I read about.


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## Billbofet

wanab - really interested in your feedback. I have both a Mits HD1000 and HC3800 which are essentially the same save the resolution difference.


Curious to see how the glasses/emitter work for you. Keep me updated.


Thanks,

Bill


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## cybereality

I call BS on this product. How is is supposed to convert regular 2D displays to 3D? Doesn't make any sense. And even if it does work, 30Hz per eye is garbage.


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## wanab

time will tell.....


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cybereality* /forum/post/20208676
> 
> 
> I call BS on this product. How is is supposed to convert regular 2D displays to 3D? Doesn't make any sense. And even if it does work, 30Hz per eye is garbage.



VIP Displayer takes input from 3D bluray and PS3 and converts to 120hz frame sequential for 3D DLP ready projectors, and 60hz frame sequential (30 frames per eye) for non-3D projectors--but an IR emitter and corresponding 60-120hz capable glasses are necessary. Yes there might be slight flicker. According to other threads reviewing the VIP Theatre (which is a step up model to the Displayer), it works very well with minimum flicker and it's not as bad as you would think. We'll see.


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## defiancecp




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cybereality* /forum/post/20208676
> 
> 
> ...30Hz per eye is garbage.



And you know this, having used some 30hz per eye product...? No? Oh. Ok then.


Maybe it won't work very well, maybe it will. So far feedback has been generally positive from the users that have tried it. We'll see in april when it gets more widespread distribution.


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## 12GAGE

Honestly, I think that most will be very surprised at how well 3D works at 60 HZ. While I am sure some people will be more effected by the flicker, my eyes adjusted in a matter of seconds. In addition, I think if VIP's product is compatible with the active glasses from Monster then the image quality can be further improved. It is just one of those things that you have the experience. Overall, I have been very pleased with the system; in fact it has been just as pleasing as my 3D experience with the Panasonic VT25 unit.


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## jem454




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *defiancecp* /forum/post/20211023
> 
> 
> And you know this, having used some 30hz per eye product...? No? Oh. Ok then.
> 
> 
> Maybe it won't work very well, maybe it will. So far feedback has been generally positive from the users that have tried it. We'll see in april when it gets more widespread distribution.



Actually Cyber knows 3d very well. Yes believe it or not many of us have used some 30hz per eye product. Shutterglasses have been around for many, many years. Now I wouldnt call 30hz per eye garbage at all, actually the 3d effect is very good, but it is harder on the eyes without a doubt.


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## Billbofet

Another question for the 3D experts out there.


My Mits HC3800 outputs 1080p/24fps at 48 frames per second.


Can I assume from this I would get true 1080p/24fps frame packed output displayed if I am using the Displayer and PS3 for 3D blu's? If so, would that take care of the "flicker" or help to reduce?


Thanks in advance,

Bill


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## defiancecp

Quote:

Originally Posted by *jem454* 
Actually Cyber knows 3d very well. Yes believe it or not many of us have used some 30hz per eye product. Shutterglasses have been around for many, many years. Now I wouldnt call 30hz per eye garbage at all, actually the 3d effect is very good, but it is harder on the eyes without a doubt.
My apologies then. But he called the validity of his experience into question by calling it garbage in spite of many with the product reporting a reasonable experience, so it was not an unreasonable assumption that he had no such experience.


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## walford

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Billbofet* 
Another question for the 3D experts out there.


My Mits HC3800 outputs 1080p/24fps at 48 frames per second.


Can I assume from this I would get true 1080p/24fps frame packed output displayed if I am using the Displayer and PS3 for 3D blu's? If so, would that take care of the "flicker" or help to reduce?


Thanks in advance,

Bill
I see nothing in the following specs for your PJ to indicate that it will handle 3D content or any 3D data format which are required to support DLP-Link and DLP-Link glasses.

http://www.mitsubishi-presentations....rs/HC3800.html


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## Billbofet

Quote:

Originally Posted by *walford* 
I see nothing in the following specs for your PJ to indicate that it will handle 3D content or any 3D data format which are required to support DLP-Link and DLP-Link glasses.

http://www.mitsubishi-presentations....rs/HC3800.html
You are correct. That is why I am interested in this product. It has the ability to make non-3D displays output a 3D picture. I would also have to use the IR glasses/emitter as my pj does not have DLP link.


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## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cybereality* /forum/post/20208676
> 
> 
> I call BS on this product. How is is supposed to convert regular 2D displays to 3D? Doesn't make any sense. And even if it does work, 30Hz per eye is garbage.



Brilliant post, its nice to know we won't be seeing you around these threads then. Go have fun with whatever works for you. I will be glad to use what I have, without having to be a computer genius to figure it out.


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## Bill

For this price it should have 2D to 3D conversion. Also I assume it doesn't output 1080i.


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Bill* /forum/post/20215622
> 
> 
> For this price it should have 2D to 3D conversion. Also I assume it doesn't output 1080i.



I'm not sure what you mean by 2D to 3D conversion? What the previous threads were referencing was using a 2D 60hz projector to watch 3D via a 3D signal that is converted from 120hz (60 frames per eye) to 60hz (30 frames per eye) using the VIP module. 2D to 3D conversion does exist and is software based to tranform a 2D image into a 3D image--it's not what the VIP does. This also requires shutterglasses hooked to an IR emitter that will also do 30hz per eye.


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## donyoop




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *cybereality* /forum/post/20208676
> 
> 
> I call BS on this product. How is is supposed to convert regular 2D displays to 3D? Doesn't make any sense. And even if it does work, 30Hz per eye is garbage.



Here is a thread from last fall with a possible explanation on how 60 Hz LCD could support 3D and have minimal ambient flicker. It would be nice to see Ken H eat crow on this as well (this goes back to the good ole days in the HD programming forum).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1283347 


I have an Epson 6100 LCD FP with Directv & PS3. I'm anxiously waiting for more 60 Hz impressions before committing the extra funds to theater vs. displayer.


Don


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## dan webster

I am also waiting for reviews. I have an epson 8700 it should be plenty bright enough in dynamic mode for 3d.So besides the vip displayer i would need their emitter and what kind of glasses?


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## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dan webster* /forum/post/20216025
> 
> 
> I am also waiting for reviews. I have an epson 8700 it should be plenty bright enough in dynamic mode for 3d.So besides the vip displayer i would need their emitter and what kind of glasses?



You would need the IR glasses vs. the DLP Link glasses. They (IR) pair with the emitter.


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## dan webster

Thanks I hope this really works . I hope we get some reviews soon.


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## mikael10

Hello,


I have been testing the 3d-displayer over the weekend. The 3d effect is awesome, but the picture is way to dark.


I have a Planar PD8150 with a anamorphic lens. The projector has only 120 hours behind.


So a projector with 1000 lumens is useless with the 3d-displayer.


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## tomsell99




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mikael10* /forum/post/20217806
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> I have been testing the 3d-displayer over the weekend. The 3d effect is awesome, but the picture is way to dark.
> 
> 
> I have a Planar PD8150 with a anamorphic lens. The projector has only 120 hours behind.
> 
> 
> So a projector with 1000 lumens is useless with the 3d-displayer.




that is not the news i wanted to hear!!!!









Ive currently got a sony vpl hw10 with same brightness so looks like its going to be too dull for watching 3d!!


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mikael10* /forum/post/20217806
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> I have been testing the 3d-displayer over the weekend. The 3d effect is awesome, but the picture is way to dark.



Not surprising since 2D projectors were not made for adjusting 3D brightness like the new 720p 3d projectors. That said, it's an obstacle to be overcome, not to be defeated by







. Most 2D use is in low lamp or eco mode and Cinema settings. These can be changed of course to normal modes and TV setting for example.


Several ways to increase brightness: Create a user mode just for 3D with brightness and contrast turned up plus change in gamma. Change your zoom to reduce the image size. Get a brighter screen (Dalite ,HP for example).


I'm wondering if you tried ways to increase the brightness?


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## tomsell99

If i was to order would i need to just order 3D-displayer package and the IR emitter glasses with emitter is that correct?

I am guessing you either buy the emitter glasses or the DLP Link glasses which i think cant be used with the sony!!! and most importantly how and what do i connect the IR emitter glasses to??


This is the email they have sent me:


3D-Theatre will work with your projector. Here is what you would need:

We will have 3D Theatre/3D-Displayer in stock in the first week of April.

3D-Theatre: $499.00 (Games, Movies, Satellite/Cable & Internet and 60Hz/120Hz TV/projector)

3D-Displayer: $299.00 (Games and Movies & 60Hz/120Hz TV/projector)

IR emitter glasses with emitter: $129.00

DLP Link glasses: $70.00

Shipping via USPS Priority Mail: $29.99 (International) & $9.99 (Domestic)

Do please select what unit/glasses you are looking to purchase


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *tomsell99* /forum/post/20218619
> 
> 
> If i was to order would i need to just order 3D-displayer package and the IR emitter glasses with emitter is that correct?
> 
> I am guessing you either buy the emitter glasses or the DLP Link glasses which i think cant be used with the sony!!! and most importantly how and what do i connect the IR emitter glasses to??



Yes. The IR emitter connects to the VIP module. The glasses receive the IR signal and sync the shutters--they are not connected with anything directly. If you have a 3D ready dlp projector (e.g. 120hz frame sequential capable), then you can use the DLPlink glasses. The DLPlink glasses depend on a white flash from the projector to sync the 3D signal to the glasses. If you are using a 2D projector in 60hz mode for 3D, then you need the IR emitter and glasses from VIP--but they also work with 120hz projectors as well. Since 2D projectors do not produce a white flash image to sync dlplink glasses, they cannot be used.


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## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *threed123* /forum/post/20218402
> 
> 
> Not surprising since 2D projectors were not made for adjusting 3D brightness like the new 720p 3d projectors. That said, it's an obstacle to be overcome, not to be defeated by
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . Most 2D use is in low lamp or eco mode and Cinema settings. These can be changed of course to normal modes and TV setting for example.
> 
> 
> Several ways to increase brightness: Create a user mode just for 3D with brightness and contrast turned up plus change in gamma. Change your zoom to reduce the image size. Get a brighter screen (Dalite ,HP for example).
> 
> 
> I'm wondering if you tried ways to increase the brightness?




I agree. I always assumed that I would have to have a special setting for 3D content that would have increased brightness, contrast, color temp, etc...

I do this now for when I play video games as well.


If someone is testing or using the Displayer through the PS3, I would recommend setting the reference (I think that's what it's called) to Limited vs. Expanded. When I was using Expanded and watching Netflix it was black crush city. Perhaps this will help with the VIP products as well.


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## Mikenificent1




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mikael10* /forum/post/20217806
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> I have been testing the 3d-displayer over the weekend. The 3d effect is awesome, but the picture is way to dark.
> 
> 
> I have a Planar PD8150 with a anamorphic lens. The projector has only 120 hours behind.
> 
> 
> So a projector with 1000 lumens is useless with the 3d-displayer.



The Planar 8150 doesn't produce anywhere near 1000 lumens @ D65 even right out of the box (more like 600), so that is not necessarily the case! You also don't mention what screen size you are running.


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## tomsell99

Oh thanks for that! it all makes sense now!!









One other question,sorry to be pain!!! but would i have to order one emitter per single pair of glasses or would it sync all glasses being worn?


Thanks, Tom.


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## threed123

One emitter supports multiple glasses. Extra glasses are $99. That said, some have had problems with the distance between IR and glasses working properly because the emitter cord is too short. Apparently VIP is working on a solution to this.


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## defiancecp

ultimate 3d heaven has a generic 3-pin vesa extension cable for really cheap. Can't remember the price, but I think it was like $10.


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *defiancecp* /forum/post/20219591
> 
> 
> ultimate 3d heaven has a generic 3-pin vesa extension cable for really cheap. Can't remember the price, but I think it was like $10.



Excellent solution. thanks since I'm getting the emitter and glasses very soon.


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## Skiiermike

What makes the displayer and the theater different?


Why does one play satellite 3D and the other doesn't?


Thanks


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## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Skiiermike* /forum/post/20220989
> 
> 
> What makes the displayer and the theater different?
> 
> 
> Why does one play satellite 3D and the other doesn't?
> 
> 
> Thanks



I believe the main difference is the Theater does side by side and top over bottom format which several tv broadcasts use.


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## Skiiermike

Thanks for the quick response. Its there a minimum response time that will be required for this to work? I think my TV is 4ms which isn't that fast by todays standards.


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## THE DU3C3

Is there a list of supported IR emitters that will work with this device? I have a JVC emitter that I am hoping will work with the VIP unit.


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *THE DU3C3* /forum/post/20222910
> 
> 
> Is there a list of supported IR emitters that will work with this device? I have a JVC emitter that I am hoping will work with the VIP unit.



You'll need to check with Jonathan of VIP. I think the issue is having an emitter and glasses that do 60 hz as well as 120hz, so you can use a regular 60hz TV to watch 3D--that is the advantage of this unit.


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## sanderdvd

I own a JVC RS20 and was thinking about selling it but now I ve seen this thread I m going to wait. I think my RS20 is 60Hz capable. How can 2x30Hz look ok without getting a headache?


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## old corps

Quote:

Originally Posted by *sanderdvd* 
I own a JVC RS20 and was thinking about selling it but now I ve seen this thread I m going to wait. I think my RS20 is 60Hz capable. How can 2x30Hz look ok without getting a headache?
That's what I'm wondering.........










Viewsonic Pr08100 here.



Ed


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## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *sanderdvd* 
I own a JVC RS20 and was thinking about selling it but now I ve seen this thread I m going to wait. I think my RS20 is 60Hz capable. How can 2x30Hz look ok without getting a headache?
Well, that's the real question, isn't it? We've had a review of the 3d Theatre with an Optoma HD66, but no real word yet on 60hz performance. More units have been ordered, we should be hearing soon.


In the meantime, will it work if someone with a Displayer or Theatre & a 3d display tries runnning it at 60hz to check the flicker? Or is that not possible with 3d displays?


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## Canary_Jules

Quote:

Originally Posted by *sanderdvd* 
I own a JVC RS20 and was thinking about selling it but now I ve seen this thread I m going to wait. I think my RS20 is 60Hz capable. How can 2x30Hz look ok without getting a headache?
Also, does the RS20 have the lumens to produce a decent 3d image? I know that with approaching 800 hours on my HD750 bulb I could do with some more lumens real soon as the iris is open to 4. I'm running in low lamp mode so can go to high mode but will have to recalibrate as it changes colour space etc. How much does the VIP tech dim the image? Will I have to buy a high power screen to make the VIP work? (Actually, I'm already thinking of this as a long term solution to dimming bulbs).


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## chriscic

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Canary_Jules* 
Also, does the RS20 have the lumens to produce a decent 3d image?
I've got an RS1 and am wondering the same things. Frankly for ~$430 with glasses I wouldn't be all that super demanding in terms of brightness and flicker, but obviously I still need some level of enjoyable picture quality to bother.


An alternative is to just go with the Acer 5360 and Nvidia 3D Vision combo for ~$700. Picture quality is certain to be superior, but besides expense I also would have to roll out another projector just for 3d-watching.


Finally I'm also wondering if you go exclusively through an HTPC if it might be possible to jut go with the less expensive gamer version as PCs are flexible and maybe you could just send the right 3D format for the Gamer in movies as well. The software would have to support though and I'm guessing there's nothing on the PC-side that does, at least right now.


At the end of the day, if 3D-VIP has a strong return policy and thinks my system might somehow be workable, I'll probably give it a try.


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## HokeySmoke

This product states that it can work with all 60Hz displays. This on its face cannot be true, because many 60Hz displays are not frame-locked to the source. That is, the internal clock is not connected to the HDMI input, and it essentially free runs. This doesn't cause noticeable issues in 2D due to the fact that the internal clock is set very close to the source's, but it is still not the same. Since the glasses use a sync derived from the external box, that sync will not always be synchronized with the image on your screen. What's worse is that it will drift over time, by as much as one frame. This means the worst case drift would cause your left eye and right eye to be backwards, and it cannot be compensated for because it is continually drifting.


I suggest that the manufacturer publish a list of known frame-locked displays to head off this issue as these boxes get out to users.


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## defiancecp

Well, if it's a 60hz, though, it will still be locked to a certain timing in relation to the input, so if the sync timing delay is adjustable, that could possibly still work. Obviously that wouldn't cover things like 120hz frame interpolation, but those aren't really 60hz displays either...


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## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *defiancecp* /forum/post/20236365
> 
> 
> Well, if it's a 60hz, though, it will still be locked to a certain timing in relation to the input, so if the sync timing delay is adjustable, that could possibly still work. Obviously that wouldn't cover things like 120hz frame interpolation, but those aren't really 60hz displays either...



No, there is no relation between input and display if they are not frame locked. It will drift continuously.


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## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/20236397
> 
> 
> No, there is no relation between input and display if they are not frame locked. It will drift continuously.



Hmm. Could it be they have thought of this and they do a signal pause every 60 frames (similar to the white flash for DLPlink), that essentially resets the signal to the TV thus causing the electronics to constantly restart the frame every 60hz keeping the display in sync. Hey, I'm way over my head here...







but it will be interesting to see how this all works.


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## defiancecp




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/20236397
> 
> 
> No, there is no relation between input and display if they are not frame locked. It will drift continuously.



Really? Can you provide an example and/or documentation? That doesn't seem inline with any display tech I'm aware of...


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## walford

With the number of clock pins that there are in the HDMI interface connector it is certainly hard for me to how the signal could possibly not be synced. Also since the HDMI protocol is a handshaking protocol where the the correct timing acknowledgment of every tranmission is required the transmission would simply stop if the handshake response is not received in the correct time interval.

http://www.interfacebus.com/HDMI_Pinout_Bus.html


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## HokeySmoke

Go to page 19 of the following document. It's just one example that I found quickly.

http://www.curtpalme.com/docs/Theate...ser_manual.pdf 


Note that the default is "free run". This means that the output clock is not set the same as the input clock. If the clocks are different, then they will drift. This is the nature of clocks and why you would want to frame lock in the first place. It is not a given that the output clock is synchronized with the input clock. In fact it is often easier for them not to be.


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## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *walford* /forum/post/20238074
> 
> 
> With the number of clock pins that there are in the HDMI interface connector it is certainly hard for me to how the signal could possibly not be synced. Also since the HDMI protocol is a handshaking protocol where the the correct timing acknowledgment of every tranmission is required the transmission would simply stop if the handshake response is not received in the correct time interval.
> 
> http://www.interfacebus.com/HDMI_Pinout_Bus.html



HDMI stays synced. That's not where the problem lies. It's the display processor (scaler) where the input and output clocks may not be synchronized. If you look at the controls for professional displays where frame locking artifacts would show up (such as tiled displays for a video wall), you will usually see in those controls one that enables/disables frame locking.


----------



## walford

I Interpret the text on page 19 which is quoted below to indicate that Free Sync mode is one of the modes by which the user can establish the sync timeline.

"

These settings enables to adjust the output sync:

Free Run – Establishes a precise output timeline

Vadjust 1:1 – Forces the output timeline to be frame locked to the input by inserting or deleting entire lines of output video

Vjam – Maintains frame lock by truncating final line of

"

I don't interpret it to mean that there is NO synce signal timeline established.


----------



## defiancecp

what *displays* (not processors) are not frame locked when they get a 60hz signal? I'm sure there are some that don't frame lock at some refresh rates, but 60hz? The only reason a display shouldn't frame lock is if the frequency of the input mode, when converted to the display frequency, would cause tearing. In which case it may be preferable to tolerate the juddering associated with locking to the display's refresh rate.


If any TV has that issue with a 60hz signal, though, something's seriously wrong


----------



## HokeySmoke

The reason I pointed to a processor is that it was easiest to find publicly available info. Display manufacturers do not in general provide information on their products inner working. Here's a study, done a long time ago (back when 60Hz 3D was considered fashionable), that shows not all projectors were able to synchronize to the incoming signal at 60Hz. I do not think that they thought anything was seriously wrong when they designed them for 2D.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sourc...XSdetw&cad=rja


----------



## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *defiancecp* /forum/post/20238196
> 
> 
> ...The only reason a display shouldn't frame lock is if the frequency of the input mode, when converted to the display frequency, would cause tearing...



If you double buffer then you won't get tearing. It is a common practice when you have a display processor capable of frame rate conversion that you set it to free run for all modes. You do get an occasional dropped or repeated frame, but the frequency of occurrence is so low that it is normally undetectable to the user. However, this would be disastrous for sequential 3D.


----------



## Billbofet

Me just want know if movie pop out at me real good










I do appreciate the doctoral thesis we got going on in the thread here though. Thanks to this, I just solved pi - in my head - at 60Hz...


----------



## old corps




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20239421
> 
> 
> Me just want know if movie pop out at me real good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I do appreciate the doctoral thesis we got going on in the thread here though. Thanks to this, I just solved pi - in my head - at 60Hz...



Me too!





















LOL


Ed


----------



## threed123

My hope is it will work with this new technology. At 30hz per eye, this should be easier on the brain now:







I wonder if this is the same Jonathan as VIP-Jonathon


----------



## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *threed123* /forum/post/20240633
> 
> 
> My hope is it will work with this new technology. At 30hz per eye, this should be easier on the brain now:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wonder if this is the same Jonathan as VIP-Jonathon



That technology only works if you have a beard and comes with one major side effect - it freaks people the hell out!!!!!


----------



## bdoyledimou

I saw a link to purchase these in Canada, and i can't find it anymore.. can someone share?


----------



## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bdoyledimou* /forum/post/20244696
> 
> 
> I saw a link to purchase these in Canada, and i can't find it anymore.. can someone share?



Here you go........

http://www.consignia.ca/ 


Look in the right column, down the page under new products.


----------



## roachman313

This might be a dumb question but I want to make sure that I understand this correctly.


If I order one of these and get an Acer 5360, would my emitter for my Mitsubishi 3DC-1000 be able to plug into the unit so that I could use the glasses that I already have? I don't want to spend more money on glasses if I don't have to.


This is getting to be an expensive hobby but I love it so.


----------



## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roachman313* /forum/post/20245632
> 
> 
> This might be a dumb question but I want to make sure that I understand this correctly.
> 
> 
> If I order one of these and get an Acer 5360, would my emitter for my Mitsubishi 3DC-1000 be able to plug into the unit so that I could use the glasses that I already have? I don't want to spend more money on glasses if I don't have to.
> 
> 
> This is getting to be an expensive hobby but I love it so.



No, the Acer is built for nvidia 3D vision glasses and emitter or DLPlink glasses.


----------



## roachman313

So I cannot plug the emitter into the VIP Displayer and use the glasses with that? If that does not work, would that set-up work with the Optoma?


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roachman313* /forum/post/20245655
> 
> 
> So I cannot plug the emitter into the VIP Displayer and use the glasses with that? If that does not work, would that set-up work with the Optoma?



The Displayer should work with NO emitter on the 5360. The 5360 is 3d ready, which means the pj will generate the dlp link "flashes". You should be able to just use the Displayer & DLP link glasses.


----------



## Billbofet

I am so anxious to hear feedback on a 60Hz projector, I have been prepping myself with all the available free 3D content on PS3, I'm picking up Tron Legacy on blu - 3D version, and I'm even starting to see if I can get .mkv's to stream over PS3 media center (seems to work - boo yah!!).


No real point to my post other than to show my excitement is building and building for this product.


Using a Mitsubishi HC3800 DLP projector on a 100" Elite Screen, so I'll need to go the IR/emitter route.


----------



## threed123

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Billbofet* 
Using a Mitsubishi HC3800 DLP projector on a 100" Elite Screen, so I'll need to go the IR/emitter route.
Yup, me too. I have an ACER H5360 for 720p 3D, but my main projector is a Mits HC3800 on a 144" screen. Can you say "baby IMAX"







. If the Mits works (with the emitter and glasses), then I'm in for some real 1080p 3D action.


----------



## bdoyledimou

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Chezbrgr2* 
Here you go........

http://www.consignia.ca/ 


Look in the right column, down the page under new products.
Thanks Chzbrgr2


----------



## roachman313

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
The Displayer should work with NO emitter on the 5360. The 5360 is 3d ready, which means the pj will generate the dlp link "flashes". You should be able to just use the Displayer & DLP link glasses.
I know that it will work with the DLP link glasses. I do not want to spend any more money on glasses so if I hook the emitter which I already have to the VIP Displayer, will the glasses that I already have work on it or not?


----------



## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roachman313* /forum/post/20246809
> 
> 
> I know that it will work with the DLP link glasses. I do not want to spend any more money on glasses so if I hook the emitter which I already have to the VIP Displayer, will the glasses that I already have work on it or not?



The VIP is built for 60 and 120hz glasses, so despite the emitter, your glasses would have to work at 60hz. The 3DC-1000 does 60hz checkerboard for some Mits 1080p dlp models, so it might actually work.


----------



## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *threed123* /forum/post/20246652
> 
> 
> Yup, me too. I have an ACER H5360 for 720p 3D, but my main projector is a Mits HC3800 on a 144" screen. Can you say "baby IMAX"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> . If the Mits works (with the emitter and glasses), then I'm in for some real 1080p 3D action.



I hear yah. I check this thread about 10 times/day to see if anyone actually has their Displayer yet. I assume it will perform as well as the Theater as far as PS3 games and 3D blu's, I just need a few more cases on those loving it at 60Hz.


One thing that rarely comes up, and a huge reason for my interest, is how 30 frames/eye will be for gaming. I realize the issues on film and such, but games seem to run at either 30 or 60 fps, so I assume less issue with flicker and fatigue. I'm holding off on games like Killzone 3, GT5, Sly Cooper, even Avatar, but if I end up with a Displayer, the floodgates of gaming will open.


Can't wait to hear your feedback on the Mits.


Thanks again!!

Bill


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *roachman313* /forum/post/20246809
> 
> 
> I know that it will work with the DLP link glasses. I do not want to spend any more money on glasses so if I hook the emitter which I already have to the VIP Displayer, will the glasses that I already have work on it or not?



Ahh... sorry, misunderstood your post.


What Threed said is correct: the emitter may work, but even if it does it may be limited to 60hz (whereas if you went with the dlp link on your 3d-ready pj, you would get 120).


Best way I guess is to try & see if you get satisfactory results.


----------



## disolitude

Will either of these 2 products work with Nvidia 3DTV play? Ps3 and 360 3D gaming is pretty limited to say the least, but Nvidias driver works great with a slew of kickass games...


----------



## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *disolitude* /forum/post/20252033
> 
> 
> Will either of these 2 products work with Nvidia 3DTV play? Ps3 and 360 3D gaming is pretty limited to say the least, but Nvidias driver works great with a slew of kickass games...



That would assume you have a PC--right? So why would need the VIP then? Or maybe I misunderstood your question.


----------



## disolitude

Even if you use a computer this adapter may be useful as one may not have a 3d capable display. I currently have Acer h5360 which is 3d capable but only 720p. If this adapter works with NVIDIA 3d TV play one could get a 2d 1080p projector and not spend 4000 dollars


----------



## hoogs

So if I stream a half-sbs movie file through PS3, the Displayer will not play it? I would have to get the theater in that case?


----------



## threed123




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *disolitude* /forum/post/20254607
> 
> 
> Even if you use a computer this adapter may be useful as one may not have a 3d capable display. I currently have Acer h5360 which is 3d capable but only 720p. If this adapter works with NVIDIA 3d TV play one could get a 2d 1080p projector and not spend 4000 dollars



Yup, I misunderstood. I have a PC and an ACER as well, and also a Mits 3800 for 1080p which I'm looking forward to using as well.


----------



## Aumann

so does this VIP-Displayer also work for LCD's? All I hear talk about is projectors. I have a Samsung LNA650 which is 60hz input and 120hz display I think. Will the VIP-Displayer work with my tv?


----------



## LVNeptune

Yes, I confirmed with John...It will work for 3D Displayer and Theatre only, gamer does not work with LCD.


----------



## netvlada

Theatre vip 3d will output on plasma or lcd 720 or 1080.


----------



## protovision




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Aumann* /forum/post/20263974
> 
> 
> so does this VIP-Displayer also work for LCD's? All I hear talk about is projectors. I have a Samsung LNA650 which is 60hz input and 120hz display I think. Will the VIP-Displayer work with my tv?



I have the same TV, so I guess this mean that the VIP products would only work @ 60hz? (the 120hz is via AMP, and not an accepted input I believe)


Also, anyone know which product would allow me to play mkv SBS from a HTPC? Do i need to get the full VIP-Theater, or will VIP-Displayer + PC software(?) be all I need for my 24/60hz projector and 60hz LCD tv?


----------



## Jazar

I also have an LNA650 and would be interested in how this would perform on my TV.


----------



## DW718

can't wait to see reviews of this on a 60hz LCD I really want to pick one up in a couple weeks


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *wanab* /forum/post/20207394
> 
> 
> I ordered mine on the 24th. It is now "awaiting shipment".Too bad it costs $335.95 US funds.... but maybe I can keep my Mitz hd1000 720P and NOT have to buy that Acer... as I'm drooling over my remotes.................... If it gives that FULL BLURAY 3D performance as what I read about.



where are you getting it cost 335.95

its 299.00 + 129 for the glasses and emitter + 15 for a wall charger and 9.99 for shipping in the us?

thats more than 335.95


----------



## kat_xk8

is this really an affordable alternative

because adding everything up

about halfway to a decent 3d tv


----------



## kat_xk8

has anyone ordered one? if so how does one order it and is there a money back guarantee if doesnt work

then again paypal has buyer protection which is nice


----------



## kat_xk8

Jonathan sent me this video for the vip theatre

http://www.youtube.com/user/Chezbrgr.../0/8hk9bQhcwr0


----------



## Chezbrgr2

Try this Link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hk9bQhcwr0


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20271297
> 
> 
> is this really an affordable alternative
> 
> because adding everything up
> 
> about halfway to a decent 3d tv



It is if you plan on front projection & have an older projector.


I have an optoma hd70... decent, bright 720p dlp. About the only one on the market with horiz. keystone correction, which I need with my setup, but it doesn't do 3d.


So I could spend:

$600-$800 on a comparible 3d ready projector (plus whatever it takes to ceiling mount instead of wall mount in my rental house, probably embedding conduit to run the cables & redoing the ceiling)

$300 for a 3dXL or the Viewsonic unit (which may not support future pj upgrades)

+say $300 on DLP glasses.

=$1200+


Or pick up one of the VIP units, which should work with my existing displays, & any future purchases as well. I purchased the Theatre with the ir emitter & plan to eventually get 3 sets of glasses total = ~$830.


----------



## Billbofet




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20271518
> 
> 
> It is if you plan on front projection & have an older projector.
> 
> 
> I have an optoma hd70... decent, bright 720p dlp. About the only one on the market with horiz. keystone correction, which I need with my setup, but it doesn't do 3d.
> 
> 
> So I could spend:
> 
> $600-$800 on a comparible 3d ready projector (plus whatever it takes to ceiling mount instead of wall mount in my rental house, probably embedding conduit to run the cables & redoing the ceiling)
> 
> $300 for a 3dXL or the Viewsonic unit (which may not support future pj upgrades)
> 
> +say $300 on DLP glasses.
> 
> =$1200+
> 
> 
> Or pick up one of the VIP units, which should work with my existing displays, & any future purchases as well. I purchased the Theatre with the ir emitter & plan to eventually get 3 sets of glasses total = ~$830.



+1 on your comment.


I already have a 1080p projector that I am more than happy with. I don't want to buy a new pj just for 3D.


Plus, to me at least, 3D isn't even worth bothering on anything less that a 100" screen - but that's just me.


----------



## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Billbofet* /forum/post/20271550
> 
> 
> +1 on your comment.
> 
> 
> I already have a 1080p projector that I am more than happy with. I don't want to buy a new pj just for 3D.
> 
> 
> Plus, to me at least, 3D isn't even worth bothering on anything less that a 100" screen - but that's just me.



Amen Brother!


----------



## perfectdark




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20271297
> 
> 
> is this really an affordable alternative
> 
> because adding everything up
> 
> about halfway to a decent 3d tv



You are correct.. almost HALF the price of a 3D tV ... Exactly HALF THE PRICE ... you just proved a good point in favour of buying the 3D-Displayer


----------



## jadeezra

Well consignia just sent me a link with tracking numbers saying it has shipped ups. I ordered the displayer with upgraded shipping.


----------



## chriscic




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> It is if you plan on front projection & have an older projector.
> 
> 
> I have an optoma hd70... decent, bright 720p dlp. About the only one on the market with horiz. keystone correction, which I need with my setup, but it doesn't do 3d.
> 
> 
> So I could spend:
> 
> $600-$800 on a comparible 3d ready projector (plus whatever it takes to ceiling mount instead of wall mount in my rental house, probably embedding conduit to run the cables & redoing the ceiling)
> 
> $300 for a 3dXL or the Viewsonic unit (which may not support future pj upgrades)
> 
> +say $300 on DLP glasses.
> 
> =$1200+
> 
> 
> Or pick up one of the VIP units, which should work with my existing displays, & any future purchases as well. I purchased the Theatre with the ir emitter & plan to eventually get 3 sets of glasses total = ~$830.



A h5360 with 3 nvidia glasses will run you about $820. My guess (hope I am wrong) is that will substantially outperform the 3d displayer with your pj and most folks existing pjs. Of course you now have to futz with another pj, but you're likely going to be getting a better pic in return, and the $ are very close.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *chriscic* /forum/post/20272462
> 
> 
> A h5360 with 3 nvidia glasses will run you about $820. My guess (hope I am wrong) is that will substantially outperform the 3d displayer with your pj and most folks existing pjs. Of course you now have to futz with another pj, but you're likely going to be getting a better pic in return, and the $ are very close.



It won't be a better pic for me if it doesn't provide horizontal keystone correction (which it doesn't). I realize keystone adjustment isn't ideal, but it's what I need for the current layout of my room.


And again, if I upgrade the pj later, I can take the VIP unit with the change, even if it is another HDMI 1.3 pj.


----------



## HokeySmoke

Unlike vertical keystone correction, horizontal keystone correction requires a frame buffer (it needs to store an entire frame to figure out how to scale it), and this means at least one additional frame of delay. Please let us know how well synchronized the glasses are to your display, as I have yet to hear of any delay adjustment capability.


If it's exactly one frame delayed then you can probably just hit the "switch eyes" button to fix it.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/20272645
> 
> 
> Unlike vertical keystone correction, horizontal keystone correction requires a frame buffer (it needs to store an entire frame to figure out how to scale it), and this means at least one additional frame of delay. Please let us know how well synchronized the glasses are to your display, as I have yet to hear of any delay adjustment capability.
> 
> 
> If it's exactly one frame delayed then you can probably just hit the "switch eyes" button to fix it.



Will do...


----------



## jadeezra

Scheduled to be here monday!!!! The soap opera is finally over! YES!!!!!!!!!


----------



## DW718




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jadeezra* /forum/post/20272708
> 
> 
> Scheduled to be here monday!!!! The soap opera is finally over! YES!!!!!!!!!



are you hooking it up to a projector or a HDTV ?


----------



## jadeezra

pj hd66


----------



## Grandmaster

All I want is a product that will take HDMI 1.4 output (720p only if needs be) from PS3 and allow me to run it on my 120Hz 3D Vision monitor. Does the 3D Displayer do this?


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* 
All I want is a product that will take HDMI 1.4 output (720p only if needs be) from PS3 and allow me to run it on my 120Hz 3D Vision monitor. Does the 3D Displayer do this?
Here is the thread link to the User Manual, it shows HDMI1.4a is converted to HDMI 1.3 and the switch setting for PS3.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=247 


Also, you might want to confirm any doubts with Jonathan at VIP, he is always glad to help.


----------



## DW718

any of you guys want to hook up your displayer to a LCD TV when it gets in just for kicks ? im curious to see how it performs


----------



## Grandmaster




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20274941
> 
> 
> Here is the thread link to the User Manual, it shows HDMI1.4a is converted to HDMI 1.3 and the switch setting for PS3.
> 
> http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=247
> 
> 
> Also, you might want to confirm any doubts with Jonathan at VIP, he is always glad to help.



I think what is confusing me is the spec - field interleaved? Sounds a lot like interlacing to me... surely my 3D Vision monitor would require frame sequential?


----------



## HokeySmoke

"Field Interleaved" is wrong (maybe a bad translation). It should be "Field Sequential" or "Frame Sequential". Field Interleaved is what the XPol monitors do and use passive glasses.


----------



## SgtVideo

Went ahead and ordered the Display model from Consignia with two sets of IR glasses with emitter for now. Would have bought more but had to add an additional $27 due to USD/CAD exchange rate. Will get the rest here later. ETA for shipping will be week of April 18th.


$559.97 Canadian is $586.14 US.


Anyone know what type batteries these use?


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20281872
> 
> 
> Anyone know what type batteries these use?



According to this forum, they use CR2032 batteries.


But I'm not sure if they're talking about the dlp link version, or the ir.


----------



## walford

A few posts furthur down in the link is a post stating they are talking about the DLP Link glasses.


----------



## joeblow

Interesting product. I see a lot of projector and DLP discussion, but would this product work well with my arrangement for games and movies?

60" Sony SXRD XBR2 (LCoS rear projection tech)
Onkyo 604 receiver (HDMI v1.1)

PS3 Blu-ray/game player


Are the included glasses for DLP tech only?


----------



## Big Brad

Joe, it's my understanding that there are two types of glasses being offered for use with this product: DLP-Link glasses for use with DLP devices only, and LCD shutter glasses compatible with 60Hz and 120Hz displays of any kind (LCD, Plasma, projectors). What I'm uncertain of is if the 60Hz/120Hz glasses can also be used with DLP displays. My guess is yes as the glasses don't sync with the display but instead to the attached IR emitter. But my knowledge of DLP-Link tech is minimal.


I wish I had an extra $400 laying around at the moment. I really want to pick up the Displayer and the emitter/glasses kit and perhaps an extra set of glasses for guests. You only need one kidney to function, right?


----------



## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20283161
> 
> 
> Joe, it's my understanding that there are two types of glasses being offered for use with this product: DLP-Link glasses for use with DLP devices only, and LCD shutter glasses compatible with 60Hz and 120Hz displays of any kind (LCD, Plasma, projectors). What I'm uncertain of is if the 60Hz/120Hz glasses can also be used with DLP displays. My guess is yes as the glasses don't sync with the display but instead to the attached IR emitter.



The 60hz/120hz Glasses they sell do work for both, DLP/LCD


I have tested on both formats and can confirm this. I have the Theatre unit so I'm not commenting on the Displayer, but on the glasses I can.


----------



## Jazar

Chez, you said you tried this on a LN52A850? How was it? I have an A650.


----------



## joeblow

Well I don't have LCD, Plasma, DLP or a projector. My question above was whether this product works for my rear projection LCoS screen? Including the non-DLP glasses?


----------



## bigjaymofo

Reciever my Displayer today w/glasses and IR emitter. Running it on an infocus X10. 3D effect is very good but picture is WAY too dark. Going to play around with the projector picture setting to see if it can be improved.


Anyone else having sync problems with the glasses? emitter has to be about a foot away from the glasses or they lose sync. Any suggestions?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bigjaymofo* /forum/post/20295285
> 
> 
> Reciever my Displayer today w/glasses and IR emitter. Running it on an infocus X10. 3D effect is very good but picture is WAY too dark. Going to play around with the projector picture setting to see if it can be improved.
> 
> 
> Anyone else having sync problems with the glasses? emitter has to be about a foot away from the glasses or they lose sync. Any suggestions?



If you have a DC volt meter at best you can confirm the CR2032 batteries are at least 3V.


As far as testing an IR emitter at home you would at least need a IR type security camera to see if the emitter has enough intensity at design distance.


Thats all I can think of at the moment since it appears they only work at extreme close range.


----------



## kat_xk8

I don't have a projector I have a 47" 1080p tv


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20281872
> 
> 
> Went ahead and ordered the Display model from Consignia with two sets of IR glasses with emitter for now. Would have bought more but had to add an additional $27 due to USD/CAD exchange rate. Will get the rest here later. ETA for shipping will be week of April 18th.
> 
> 
> $559.97 Canadian is $586.14 US.
> 
> 
> Anyone know what type batteries these use?



Consignia? Who's consignia?


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20271518
> 
> 
> It is if you plan on front projection & have an older projector.
> 
> 
> I have an optoma hd70... decent, bright 720p dlp. About the only one on the market with horiz. keystone correction, which I need with my setup, but it doesn't do 3d.
> 
> 
> So I could spend:
> 
> $600-$800 on a comparible 3d ready projector (plus whatever it takes to ceiling mount instead of wall mount in my rental house, probably embedding conduit to run the cables & redoing the ceiling)
> 
> $300 for a 3dXL or the Viewsonic unit (which may not support future pj upgrades)
> 
> +say $300 on DLP glasses.
> 
> =$1200+
> 
> 
> Or pick up one of the VIP units, which should work with my existing displays, & any future purchases as well. I purchased the Theatre with the ir emitter & plan to eventually get 3 sets of glasses total = ~$830.




Ok I'm talking TVs not projectors - I've seen 3d TVs starting at 899


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* 
Consignia? Who's consignia?
Right here:

http://www.consignia.ca/categories/3...6-Accessories/


----------



## Chezbrgr2

Quote:

Originally Posted by *bigjaymofo* 
Reciever my Displayer today w/glasses and IR emitter. Running it on an infocus X10. 3D effect is very good but picture is WAY too dark. Going to play around with the projector picture setting to see if it can be improved.


Anyone else having sync problems with the glasses? emitter has to be about a foot away from the glasses or they lose sync. Any suggestions?
If the displayer is like the Theatre unit, then I would power the main unit with a .5v usb wall adaptor, like for an Ipod or cellphone.


At first I had that problem and that cured it, if you are using the USB power from say a PS3, the PS3 USB does not put enough power out to give you the 13-15 ft I am getting, as far as range.










Hope that helps


----------



## Brian Hampton

Quote:

Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* 
Ok I'm talking TVs not projectors - I've seen 3d TVs starting at 899
Yeah,... I have too. The price is almost too close. Then again,... These products make all your display work with 3D which is where most of the value comes in. If I bought a 3D Flat panel for $900 or so ,... when it has a problem I'm back to zip. I have a feeling with no moving parts these VIP products will simply never malfunction.


So,... if you don't need or want a "new" display then there's a lot of value to the VIP products.


----------



## bigjaymofo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20295682
> 
> 
> If you have a DC volt meter at best you can confirm the CR2032 batteries are at least 3V.
> 
> 
> As far as testing an IR emitter at home you would at least need a IR type security camera to see if the emitter has enough intensity at design distance.
> 
> 
> Thats all I can think of at the moment since it appears they only work at extreme close range.





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Chezbrgr2* /forum/post/20297623
> 
> 
> If the displayer is like the Theatre unit, then I would power the main unit with a .5v usb wall adaptor, like for an Ipod or cellphone.
> 
> 
> At first I had that problem and that cured it, if you are using the USB power from say a PS3, the PS3 USB does not put enough power out to give you the 13-15 ft I am getting, as far as range.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hope that helps



Many thanks! I figured it out and i feel kinda dumb. I have a projector setup and had the emitter position behind where I sit. Didn't realize that the emitter has to be facing the glasses. Syncs up really fast now.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bigjaymofo* /forum/post/20301177
> 
> 
> Many thanks! I figured it out and i feel kinda dumb. I have a projector setup and had the emitter position behind where I sit. Didn't realize that the emitter has to be facing the glasses. Syncs up really fast now.



Give it a good workout and let us know your impressions.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20297799
> 
> 
> Yeah,... I have too. The price is almost too close. Then again,... These products make all your display work with 3D which is where most of the value comes in. If I bought a 3D Flat panel for $900 or so ,... when it has a problem I'm back to zip. I have a feeling with no moving parts these VIP products will simply never malfunction.
> 
> 
> So,... if you don't need or want a "new" display then there's a lot of value to the VIP products.



Also... how many sets of glasses do 3d-ready TVs typically include? That should be factored into the calculations.


The 3D Theatre alone is $500... I bought the emitter & 1 set of glasses for starters, bringing the total to ~$630.


----------



## DW718

anybody get it in yet ?


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20297603
> 
> 
> Right here:
> 
> http://www.consignia.ca/categories/3...6-Accessories/



Ok it's 299 with VIP 3d why 319 with consignia


----------



## wanab









I got my Displayer all hooked up.Here is my impressions. Have MitzHD1000 which is a 60hz projector.Have glasses powered by usb to Panny 110 bd player. Sync no problem from 12' away. No instructions what so ever on how to set up Displayer. Left #1 pin down all others up as way it came. Needed to go back and forth in dvi/vga switch on emitter to get proper color. Works pretty good,brightness down but turned video adjustments all to max on Mitz,still a little dim but bearable. Bulb has 2300hr. Have a HUGE amount of flicker as others w/60hz pj have reported. I should say I have that Acer 5360 on order from C/C. That better help with the flicker since that is 120hz or this is a no go. I'll even then try out the DLP link with X102's. Not as good as the demo of Avatar on that Panasonic display at BB. The worst is the flicker.Quite hard to get used to. Need definately a dark enviroment or flicker will drive ya nuts.Will let all know more when Acer 120hz pj comes hopefully next week. Maybe some one can help me out with the set up on the Displayer pin settings or whatever to get rid othe that flicker.


----------



## dfergie




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *wanab* /forum/post/20306629
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got my Displayer all hooked up.Here is my impressions. Have MitzHD1000 which is a 60hz projector.Have glasses powered by usb to Panny 110 bd player. Sync no problem from 12' away. No instructions what so ever on how to set up Displayer. Left #1 pin down all others up as way it came. Needed to go back and forth in dvi/vga switch on emitter to get proper color. Works pretty good,brightness down but turned video adjustments all to max on Mitz,still a little dim but bearable. Bulb has 2300hr. Have a HUGE amount of flicker as others w/60hz pj have reported. The worst is the flicker.Quite hard to get used to. Need definately a dark enviroment or flicker will drive ya nuts.. Maybe some one can help me out with the set up on the Displayer pin settings or whatever to get rid othe that flicker.



Look in the Theater thread a page or 2 back and try those settings... I'm going to try the Theater with a HC1500 & 3800 but with a lot less hours than 2300...


----------



## Joel802

I placed an order for a 3d Displayer and a 3d Theatre last week. I am looking forward to trying them out in my home. I have an Epson 8100 projector, a Moviemate 72 projector, a Samsung LED DLP 3d ready tv, another Samsung DLP tv that is 5 yrs old, my father in laws 32" Vizio LCD, and a HP DVI-D monitor. I will test all of those displays with a Panasonic 300 3d player, an Xbox 360 and a Playstation 3. I am sure the results will be all over the place. I will not be able to test cable 3d as I have not subscribed to it. U-verse charges an additional $10 a month for 3d.


I will use the VIP 3d glasses with emitter, Xpand X102 DLP link glasses, Samsung SSG-1000 glasses with emitter, and the Samsung SSG-2100 glasses with a Mitsubishi emitter. Hopefully these will work as it will add more robust options to an already great option.


I definately think once this product is circulated we should compile our findings in a nice neat thread. Compatibility with display, glasses, emitters etc.


With any luck I will get my units in the next couple of weeks and I will be on my way to enjoying 3d on all of my displays.


Cheers,

Joel


----------



## kopkiwi

Got an Optoma HD66 on the way here in NZ. Will pick up the 3D Displayer once the NZD improves a little, has been going up for a month now. Hopefully hits 82 cents in the next weeks.


Hoping the HD66 is nice and bright.


----------



## clapple

Hopefully, some one here will be able to help me. I would love to order a 3D VIP; but I am not sure it will work with my tv set. A Sony KDL-52XBR5. I have missed placed the owner's manual. So I am not sure about the specs for the 60/120 requirement. Tried e-mail to the 3D VIP company; but I guess I am not getting my question across. This unit would be a whole lot cheaper than buying a new set. But I would like to know for sure that it will work, with my TV.


----------



## walford

link to the xbr4/xbr5 User's manual

http://www.docs.sony.com/release/KDL40XBR4.pdf


----------



## clapple




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *walford* /forum/post/20311303
> 
> 
> link to the xbr4/xbr5 User's manual
> 
> http://www.docs.sony.com/release/KDL40XBR4.pdf



Thanks walford. Seems like my guess was correct. No 60/120Hz.

Looks like the only way for me to get into 3D would be a new TV.


----------



## Soundmaster10.2

Quote:

Originally Posted by *clapple* 
Thanks walford. Seems like my guess was correct. No 60/120Hz.

Looks like the only way for me to get into 3D would be a new TV.








Looks like 60hz is supported to me.


From page 16:

Quote:

For best picture quality, it is recommended to use signals (boldface), in the above chart with a 60hz vertical frequency from a personal computer. In plug and play, signals with 60hz vertical frequency will be detected automatically.


----------



## Big Brad

All televisions sold in the United States MUST be able to accept a 60Hz signal.


----------



## clapple




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Soundmaster10.2* /forum/post/20312248
> 
> 
> Looks like 60hz is supported to me.
> 
> 
> From page 16:



I hope so! A poster on the "satelliteguys" forum is going to try it, When he gets his 3D VIP delivered.


----------



## baddog66

i received my vip 3d displayer from consignia yesterday and i'm connected to an optoma hd66 and a ps3.when i try to play a 3d blu-ray (ie.avatar 3d,hubble 3d,etc.),i get a yellowish/greenish tint to brighter colours.i've tried ps3 and projector colour changes but nothing i've tried helps.the colour tints look like they're a result of the 3d process.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I'm very excited about the 3D Displayer and can't wait till I can order one.


I have known for a long time that my projector (Sony VPL-VW60) can not do 120Hz but only just read up on how it can and does display at 96Hz.


Quote Like the VPL-VW50, the VW60 changes its refresh rate to 96Hz and employs a "4:4 pulldown" (each frame is repeated four times) when you give it a 1080p/24 signal. I love this feature. This removes the odd judder inherent in all 24-frame-per-second content when displayed at 60Hz (thanks to 3:2 pulldown). The result is a smoother image, but without the overly smooth, artificial look that can occur when a display interpolates frames (which some 120Hz displays are now doing).


Anyways... I have no idea of 3D Blu Rays do anything with regards to 24fps. Most movies claim to do the 24fps thingie resulting in my projector displaying 96Hz. If this means I can get 48Hz/eye then ..... I'm even more interested and excited about the 3D VIP products!!!



-Brian


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20313922
> 
> 
> I'm very excited about the 3D Displayer and can't wait till I can order one.
> 
> 
> I have known for a long time that my projector (Sony VPL-VW60) can not do 120Hz but only just read up on how it can and does display at 96Hz.
> 
> 
> Quote “Like the VPL-VW50, the VW60 changes its refresh rate to 96Hz and employs a "4:4 pulldown" (each frame is repeated four times) when you give it a 1080p/24 signal. I love this feature. This removes the odd judder inherent in all 24-frame-per-second content when displayed at 60Hz (thanks to 3:2 pulldown). The result is a smoother image, but without the overly smooth, artificial look that can occur when a display interpolates frames (which some 120Hz displays are now doing).”
> 
> 
> Anyways... I have no idea of 3D Blu Rays do anything with regards to 24fps. Most movies claim to do the 24fps thingie resulting in my projector displaying 96Hz. If this means I can get 48Hz/eye then ..... I'm even more interested and excited about the 3D VIP products!!!
> 
> 
> 
> -Brian



You won't, at least not at this point. The VIP unit/emitter combo only support 60/120hz, they're not variable. I hope this is a feature they add later, as my pj will support 85hz.


----------



## kat_xk8

Anyone try it with a tv not a projector ?


----------



## kopkiwi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *baddog66* /forum/post/20313901
> 
> 
> i received my vip 3d displayer from consignia yesterday and i'm connected to an optoma hd66 and a ps3.when i try to play a 3d blu-ray (ie.avatar 3d,hubble 3d,etc.),i get a yellowish/greenish tint to brighter colours.i've tried ps3 and projector colour changes but nothing i've tried helps.the colour tints look like they're a result of the 3d process.



Aw man. I was going to be buying this combo. I don't want it to look like this


----------



## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *baddog66* /forum/post/20313901
> 
> 
> i received my vip 3d displayer from consignia yesterday and i'm connected to an optoma hd66 and a ps3.when i try to play a 3d blu-ray (ie.avatar 3d,hubble 3d,etc.),i get a yellowish/greenish tint to brighter colours.i've tried ps3 and projector colour changes but nothing i've tried helps.the colour tints look like they're a result of the 3d process.



We need to know more about your hookup, sounds like a setting is not right, what kind of glasses are you using?


I do not have the displayer, I have the Theatre, and on some dlp's I got color shift until I reversed the polarity on my glasses , then everything was just fine!


----------



## wanab

Push the dvi/vga button on emitter . That worked for me on my Mitz1000.


----------



## Chezbrgr2




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *wanab* /forum/post/20316275
> 
> 
> Push the dvi/vga button on emitter . That worked for me on my Mitz1000.



Yea, thats what I meant!







Not enough Coffee yet! Thanks


----------



## baddog66

i'm using the vip dlp link glasses.i don't use an emitter for my glasses.if i understand this correctly,i have dlp link through the projector?.i changed some of the original ps3 settings for better colour on my projector when i first got it.i'm still trying different settings and combinations of these.i tried one under video settings-bd/dvd video output format (hdmi) to rgb and it did help but then the colours would suddenly return on scene changes or the the whole scene would change to one colour and start flashing.when this did work though,i was impressed.i have had a couple of other signal issues that i've managed to find work arounds for now and would like to figure out the picture first.there are setting changes to try still and i'm hoping,like Chezbrgr2 said,that i'm just missing something.any suggestions,let me know.i'll keep posting with my results.


----------



## kopkiwi

Make sure you keep us up to date mate? Have you contacted VIP directly? They are pretty quick at responding.


----------



## baddog66




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *baddog66* /forum/post/20317209
> 
> 
> i'm using the vip dlp link glasses.i don't use an emitter for my glasses.if i understand this correctly,i have dlp link through the projector?.i changed some of the original ps3 settings for better colour on my projector when i first got it.i'm still trying different settings and combinations of these.i tried one under video settings-bd/dvd video output format (hdmi) to rgb and it did help but then the colours would suddenly return on scene changes or the the whole scene would change to one colour and start flashing.when this did work though,i was impressed.i have had a couple of other signal issues that i've managed to find work arounds for now and would like to figure out the picture first.there are setting changes to try still and i'm hoping,like Chezbrgr2 said,that i'm just missing something.any suggestions,let me know.i'll keep posting with my results.



have now set the projector's colour space setting to rgb and am now only seeing the sometimes green,sometimes yellow colour on white lab coats,waterfalls and such as well as clouds or distant reflections.it really cleaned up the picture directly in front though and almost makes me ignore the rest of the picture.i should say that the 3d effect has always been there and, with this adjustment,avatar 3d is starting to look like avatar 3d.


----------



## baddog66




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kopkiwi* /forum/post/20318003
> 
> 
> Make sure you keep us up to date mate? Have you contacted VIP directly? They are pretty quick at responding.



did e-mail them,however being the weekend and all the interest in their products,i figure they're swamped.will try them again in a few days if no response.


----------



## kopkiwi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *baddog66* /forum/post/20318067
> 
> 
> did e-mail them,however being the weekend and all the interest in their products,i figure they're swamped.will try them again in a few days if no response.



I sent an Email on Thursday, got a reply by Firday (last week)


So fingers crossed you get a quick responce.


----------



## LVNeptune

I am kind of pissed off right now.


After I spent over $1200 ordering different products from VIP and immediately after sending the money not getting a response for almost a week (6 days), he says my units aren't shipping until the end of NEXT week.


----------



## kopkiwi




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *LVNeptune* /forum/post/20319896
> 
> 
> I am kind of pissed off right now.
> 
> 
> After I spent over $1200 ordering different products from VIP and immediately after sending the money not getting a response for almost a week (6 days), he says my units aren't shipping until the end of NEXT week.



Yeah no stock until the end of April. Thought it said that on their website?


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Jazar* /forum/post/20283751
> 
> 
> Chez, you said you tried this on a LN52A850? How was it? I have an A650.



I also have a Samsung A650 and ordered the VIP 3D Displayer with the Active Shutter Glasses + IR Emmiter from Consignia.


I just noticed these glasses are listed for Projectors - can anyone confirm they will work with a 120Hz LCD TV please?

EDIT: I just got a speedy email back from Consignia, saying "_Yes they are designed to give 3D on TV's as well as projectors so you should be good._"


I would love to hear comments from users who has a similar setup. Thanks!


----------



## kat_xk8

Is this converter only for a projector ?


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20326814
> 
> 
> Is this converter only for a projector ?


 No , but it seems most popular with those with projectors.


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *DaverJ* 
I also have a Samsung A650 and ordered the VIP 3D Displayer with the Active Shutter Glasses + IR Emmiter from Consignia.


I just noticed these glasses are listed for Projectors - can anyone confirm they will work with a 120Hz LCD TV please?

EDIT: I just got a speedy email back from Consignia, saying "_Yes they are designed to give 3D on TV's as well as projectors so you should be good._"


I would love to hear comments from users who has a similar setup. Thanks!
Keep in mind that although the TV will refresh 60p at 120hz it may not accept 120Hz at its input. You might need to use the 60hz option on the VIP Theater.


----------



## DaverJ

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Ronomy* 
Keep in mind that although the TV will refresh 60p at 120hz it may not accept 120Hz at its input. You might need to use the 60hz option on the VIP Theater.
Thanks for the heads up, an excellent point that I didn't think of.


I ordered the VIP Displayer - I'm hoping there's some sort of auto-detect if my TV accepts 120Hz input (which now I think is very doubtful).


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *DaverJ* 
Thanks for the heads up, an excellent point that I didn't think of.


I ordered the VIP Displayer - I'm hoping there's some sort of auto-detect if my TV accepts 120Hz input (which now I think is very doubtful).
I think its the same as with the Theater. Dip switch 1 is down for 60hz and up for 120hz. Don't know for sure as i am still waiting for mine too.


----------



## baddog66

2 evenings working on 3d blu-ray picture quality with my 3d displayer,ps3 and optoma hd66 (setting changes,cable swapping,etc.).as previously posted avatar 3d best picture but still colour issue.hubble 3d - there it is again.more noticeable in actual space shots (star & solar system creation video - amazing regardless).imax 3d under the sea - flashing & changing colour video makes it unviewable until it flashes on the proper sync for a second or two & there it is.have a free ice age 3d i tried briefly and the colour issue was there still (concentrated in the center of the video -lots of white scenes in this video).waiting for a response to my e-mail to vip support.3rd evening it's wives night out & my two bfam are here with beer & ps3 killzone3 3d (glasses on/game on).to be cont.


----------



## westmonk

Has anybody tried the Displayer or 3D Theater with Optoma HD65?


----------



## jet2233




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *baddog66* /forum/post/20329583
> 
> 
> 2 evenings working on 3d blu-ray picture quality with my 3d displayer,ps3 and optoma hd66 (setting changes,cable swapping,etc.).as previously posted avatar 3d best picture but still colour issue.hubble 3d - there it is again.more noticeable in actual space shots (star & solar system creation video - amazing regardless).imax 3d under the sea - flashing & changing colour video makes it unviewable until it flashes on the the proper sync for a second or two & there it is.have a free ice age 3d i tried briefly and the colour issue was there still (concentrated in the center of the video -lots of white scenes in this video).waiting for a response to my e-mail to vip support.3rd evening it's wives night out & my two bfam are here with beer & ps3 killzone3 3d (glasses on/game on).to be cont.




What kind of screen are you using and is there alot of pop out on avatar like in the theater?


----------



## kat_xk8

Most popular with projector ? Not looking for popular looking for does it work or not with an LCD and 3d blu ray player


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20333289
> 
> 
> Most popular with projector ? Not looking for popular looking for does it work or not with an LCD and 3d blu ray player



If you look at the post carefully, you'll see he pointed you to this link, which outlines the unit's capabilities:

http://www.consignia.ca/products/VIP-3D%2dDisplayer-DLP-Projector-{47}-TV-Adapter-Converter-for-3D-Gaming-&-Blu%2dRay-Movies.html 


Yes, I use it with my Samsung lcd tv.


----------



## baddog66




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jet2233* /forum/post/20331004
> 
> 
> What kind of screen are you using and is there alot of pop out on avatar like in the theater?



i have a 106" elite i bought from futureshop online.not sure of all the specs.(ie.gain).at the time i just wanted a screen and bought the one i could get the fastest.although it's been awhile since i saw avatar in the theater,yes the pop out is there and it's like watching a movie at a theater (3d & 2d).i was e-mailed today from jonathan regarding my colour issues when watching a blu-ray 3d.he suggested some setting changes, which i had tried previously,and stated he would work with tech. support for the cause & a solution.i figure i'll do another 15th run through on setting changes again anyways.played a ps3 game (killzone3) for the first time last night with some friends.







- still seeing rockets & tracers flying past my head.no colour or picture issues at all.stayed till midnight & couldn't get the controller away from them.looks like a party at my place this weekend.


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20333527
> 
> 
> If you look at the post carefully, you'll see he pointed you to this link, which outlines the unit's capabilities:
> 
> http://www.consignia.ca/products/VIP-3D%2dDisplayer-DLP-Projector-{47}-TV-Adapter-Converter-for-3D-Gaming-&-Blu%2dRay-Movies.html
> 
> 
> Yes, I use it with my Samsung lcd tv.



Ok bit capabilities aren't user reviews of capabilities though


----------



## DaverJ

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
I use it with my Samsung lcd tv.
How's it working for you? Is flicker an issue?


----------



## tory40

I new to 3d and am still trying to wrap my head around all of the technology, but (assuming the output settings are not locked) could this possibly be used in combination with a 3D TV to produce 1080p @60hz/eye. In other words, this would send my 3DTV a [email protected] signal, like a blue-ray player, then the 3DTV would do its thing and display a watchable signal?


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DaverJ* /forum/post/20339167
> 
> 
> How's it working for you? Is flicker an issue?



Flicker is noticable (for me) on both my 60hz lcd tv and my 60hz dlp pj in a lit room. It is not noticable at all (or barely so, if I'm looking for it) on the projector when I view in a darkened room. It is always more noticable on the tv than on the pj.


I think this is due to 1) persistence of vision (not as much "off time" with the projected image) and 2) brightness.


I found the vga setting on the emitter provided less flicker on the lcd tv, but at the expense of image brightness (and probably color depth).


I'll be honest, if I intended to view 3d solely on an lcd flat screen, I might consider investing in a 3d-ready tv. But the Theatre is perfect for my projector setup.


----------



## 3Den




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20340562
> 
> 
> Flicker is noticable (for me) on both my 60hz lcd tv and my 60hz dlp pj in a lit room. It is not noticable at all (or barely so, if I'm looking for it) on the projector when I view in a darkened room. It is always more noticable on the tv than on the pj.
> 
> 
> I think this is due to 1) persistence of vision (not as much "off time" with the projected image) and 2) brightness.
> 
> 
> I found the vga setting on the emitter provided less flicker on the lcd tv, but at the expense of image brightness (and probably color depth).
> 
> 
> I'll be honest, if I intended to view 3d solely on an lcd flat screen, I might consider investing in a 3d-ready tv. But the Theatre is perfect for my projector setup.



Thanks for sharing these information. I´m also interested in the 3D Displayer/Theatre in combination with an LED LCD.

Was the flicker on the 60Hz LCD very strong or just noticeable?

And to the glasses: Have you used the IR glasses or the RF glasses? RF glasses are said to perform better on 60Hz projectors/TV´s (there is no difference at 120Hz).


Is there any other who can give feedback respective the 3D performance on a LCD?


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *3Den* /forum/post/20341231
> 
> 
> Thanks for sharing these information. I´m also interested in the 3D Displayer/Theatre in combination with an LED LCD.
> 
> Was the flicker on the 60Hz LCD very strong or just noticeable?
> 
> And to the glasses: Have you used the IR glasses or the RF glasses? RF glasses are said to perform better on 60Hz projectors/TV´s (there is no difference at 120Hz).
> 
> 
> Is there any other who can give feedback respective the 3D performance on a LCD?



I'm using the ir glasses.


Here's the synopsis:

- Bright scenes reveal more flicker than dark scenes.

- Watch in a light-controlled room or at night and you won't be disappointed either way.


----------



## DaverJ

 I picked up this USB wall unit to use with the VIP Displayer.


It's output is rated at DC 4.5v-9.5V Max 800mA. Will this work with the Displayer?


----------



## NormieTrice

Looking for some clarification. I have a PS3 and an Optoma HD20 setup with an A/V receiver. I also have a pair of Ultra Clears DLP-LINK glasses (have a Mits DLP). Will the 3D Displayer work with my HD20 and Ultra Clears?


----------



## kat_xk8

Thank u so much for the tv review

Is the fkicker that bad ?

Jonathan did say room must be dark

So are the colors off and 1080p is wiped away

I want to order yet still hesitant

Leaning toward saving up for 3d tv


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20340562
> 
> 
> Flicker is noticable (for me) on both my 60hz lcd tv and my 60hz dlp pj in a lit room. It is not noticable at all (or barely so, if I'm looking for it) on the projector when I view in a darkened room. It is always more noticable on the tv than on the pj.
> 
> 
> I think this is due to 1) persistence of vision (not as much "off time" with the projected image) and 2) brightness.
> 
> 
> I found the vga setting on the emitter provided less flicker on the lcd tv, but at the expense of image brightness (and probably color depth).
> 
> 
> I'll be honest, if I intended to view 3d solely on an lcd flat screen, I might consider investing in a 3d-ready tv. But the Theatre is perfect for my projector setup.



I have LCD tv only and may order next week

IRS not perfect but is it good enough to enjoy or cutting it to close - is the 3d noticeable enough because I too look for stuff


----------



## kat_xk8

Wlamart has a 42 inch 3d tv for 686 and 47 inch 898

What's amazing - 2 pairs come in box

What's amazing the real 3d glasses from movie theater that one can take home - they work on this tv - talk about saving money on glasses

Internet aps - displays 3d tv channels


Those glasses are the deal maker for me

1080p 3d output - wow

For not much more


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* 
Wlamart has a 42 inch 3d tv for 686 and 47 inch 898

What's amazing - 2 pairs come in box

What's amazing the real 3d glasses from movie theater that one can take home - they work on this tv - talk about saving money on glasses

Internet aps - displays 3d tv channels


Those glasses are the deal maker for me

1080p 3d output - wow

For not much more
If it uses the polarized glasses as you say, it's one of the passive sets... horizontal resolution will be cut in half. Might want to check it out in-store before you buy, to make sure you're happy with the picture quality.


----------



## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20347164
> 
> 
> If it uses the polarized glasses as you say, it's one of the passive sets... horizontal resolution will be cut in half. Might want to check it out in-store before you buy, to make sure you're happy with the picture quality.



At 720p the Displayer is also half resolution, and unfortunately we cannot check it out in a store before buying it; so I'm not sure how to compare the two.


----------



## Big Brad




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> If it uses the polarized glasses as you say, it's one of the passive sets... horizontal resolution will be cut in half. Might want to check it out in-store before you buy, to make sure you're happy with the picture quality.



You also can't sit that close to them either or else the horizontal lines become visible. When I first say one at Wal-Mart, I thought something was wrong. I took a few steps back and the 3D just popped into the picture. For the resolution to be cut in half, it looked pretty darn good. But this was likely in torch mode as well.


I'm not downing VIP products at all, I myself am interested in the Displayer. However, one has to wonder how much exposure the product will get without being readily available. If they can get it into a retail chain, the interest in the product would grow 10-fold.


----------



## kat_xk8

I went to Walmart - saw tron in 3d - no ghosting - these glasses were the real 3d from movie theaters - looks like sun glasses - my gosh this looked awesome and no flicker or ghosting - 42 inch looked stunning


I brought tangled from home

It was amazing

The pic came off the screen using those glasses


I saw for myself


The flexibilty of glasses

No battery - lack of huge expense on glasses

I havd at least 5 of those glasses


The 42 inch is no slouch except if ur room is big


For the price of the displayer which may not work or theater for a tv that does

The glasses part - no batteries !!!


If ur wal mart has a demo - bring in ur own movie if u havd a 3d one


I already have a vizio - love my 32 inch


Assurance is what did it for me


----------



## kat_xk8

I loved it !!!! Wal mart just got these in

I love VIP idea - yet the price is so close to one of these vizios which is the brand I want - if 42 inch demo was this amazing - the 47 inch


The cost of glasses - hmm what cost

I did remember seeing a story on the news

You might want to take those 3d glasses home


I love the pic


Tron looked identical to theater I saw it in yet smaller but the affects - identical


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20347369
> 
> 
> I loved it !!!! Wal mart just got these in
> 
> I love VIP idea - yet the price is so close to one of these vizios which is the brand I want - if 42 inch demo was this amazing - the 47 inch
> 
> 
> The cost of glasses - hmm what cost
> 
> I did remember seeing a story on the news
> 
> You might want to take those 3d glasses home
> 
> 
> I love the pic
> 
> 
> Tron looked identical to theater I saw it in yet smaller but the affects - identical



Sounds like you found a solution that works for you; let us know how it works with your setup.


Enjoy!


----------



## Ronomy

I probably wouldn't buy a VIP converter for a small flat panel. I would go buy a new 3D flat panel. What i don't want to do is buy a new projector so the 3D Theater in my case I hope will make me happy until a glasses free solution comes out and or I need a new projector. So if you have a 3D ready projector or TV and or don't want to buy a new 3D projector then the VIP products I hope will satisfy most people.


----------



## johnsmith808

The more affordable ways to get into the 3d game the better!


----------



## kat_xk8

Thing is more affordable is better yet a new tv for not much more than the theater - and glasses that work - VIP is new -yet so so unproven and too many hiccups I was thinking I'm not far off from a new tv - my parents need a tv - they will get my 47 inch and I will havd two vizios


----------



## Big Brad

While it may be feasible to buy a new TV instead of plunking down for the Theatre, it's not feasible if you have a projector that costs more than $2,000. Honestly, the 3D experience on a 50-inch TV is nowhere near that of a projector throwing a 100-inch image. The immersion at that screen size is insane.


The real value of the VIP products lies in being able to transform virtually any display into a 3D display. I don't know of anyone that would want to replace their Kuro with with a Vizio, affordable or not.


----------



## walford

kat-xk8,

What make and model numbers are the new passive models at Walmart?


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20348045
> 
> 
> While it may be feasible to buy a new TV instead of plunking down for the Theatre, it's not feasible if you have a projector that costs more than $2,000. Honestly, the 3D experience on a 50-inch TV is nowhere near that of a projector throwing a 100-inch image. The immersion at that screen size is insane.
> 
> 
> The real value of the VIP products lies in being able to transform virtually any display into a 3D display. I don't know of anyone that would want to replace their Kuro with with a Vizio, affordable or not.



I DONT HAVE A PROJECTOR!!!!

i have never owned a projector not even a slide projector

not everyone has a projector and have even stated that many times in this thread, i see your point and agree going down in size is not a good thing but from situation i have so many uncertainties about this converters and the limitiations - i appreciate the input but you were preaching to wrong choir lol or i was never in that choir lol


----------



## 3Den




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20348045
> 
> 
> The real value of the VIP products lies in being able to transform virtually any display into a 3D display. I don't know of anyone that would want to replace their Kuro with with a Vizio, affordable or not.



Exactly. I don´t want to replace my RGB-LED X4500 just becauase of 3D. However 3D is a nice gimmick, so the VIP products are perfect for me if the performance on my display is good enough.


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *walford* /forum/post/20348336
> 
> 
> kat-xk8,
> 
> What make and model numbers are the new passive models at Walmart?



passive?

wow in the box comes with one premium glasses and one well not so premium but they eqaul the real 3d glasses from theaters not named imax lol

http://www.vizio.com/via-hdtvs/e3d420vx.html 
http://www.vizio.com/via-hdtvs/e3d470vx.html 
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Vizio-E3D4...ndingMethod=rr 
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Vizio-M470...ndingMethod=rr


----------



## kat_xk8

im not replacing a projector however i have read feedback with people who have the product and used it - its not as great as vip wants us to think and when asking j onathan to be completely honest - no emails

i got emails when it came to pricing etc anything sales related but when confronting about user feedback - nothing - and even told another user to not comment until buying another pair of glasses before commenting


sure its great if it does whats advertised - but it doesnt - perhaps better for projector but this is an apples and oranges discussion as the arguments seem to be in context of a projector - i have a 47 inch 1080p 60hz tv that i will give to my parents whos tv went caput during a electrical storm


win win for my situation i dont have a theater room - 0 room for a screen projector so for me the vizio works not just for me but for my parents as well


sure its a great alternative for those with projectors

not so much for ones with tvs

and the glasses


i can use glasses i got from the movie theater which i know of at least 5 pairs plus the 2 in the box ill get


bottom line


i would have to pay more the converter itself for the glasses to to equal the count i already have


the converter is great if works as advetised

problem is only i could watch the content and dont want to have to keep spending money on glasses


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/20347307
> 
> 
> At 720p the Displayer is also half resolution, and unfortunately we cannot check it out in a store before buying it; so I'm not sure how to compare the two.



Is this true? I thought it is still 720P but frame sequential at either 60/120 Hz.

Can someone else chime in on this. Unfortunately we don't have icester to chime in who could give a second opimion.


----------



## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20349139
> 
> 
> Is this true? I thought it is still 720P but frame sequential at either 60/120 Hz.
> 
> Can someone else chime in on this. Unfortunately we don't have icester to chime in who could give a second opimion.



If you mean 1080p then please see this post on the Theater thread from Jonathan at VIP: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...8#post20322478 


The Displayer is unlikely to have more capabilities than the Theater.


Since these are evolutionary products based on one aimed at supporting DLP 720p 120Hz projectors, it makes sense that they are designed for 720p output only. Besides, 1080p120 is not currently practical with HDMI. Also, 720p60 is much more universally accepted through HDMI than 1080p60.


----------



## walford

Hockey,

When yuu consider the frame rate they are the fixel transfer rates are about the same since 1080i/60 contains 30 frames per second of content and 720/60 contains 60 frames per second of cotnent.

VIP displayer outputs 720p frame sequential at either 60 or 120 frames per second. On a standard 60Hz TV this results in 30fps per eye of content which casues flicker.

It is true that a 720p fixed pixel TV has about 1/2 the number of pixels of a 1080p fixed pixel TV.

Kat...,

Your TV is called a Passive 3D TV since instead of using Active Shutter glases it uses glasses with polarized passive len glasses.


----------



## Big Brad




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20348660
> 
> 
> I DONT HAVE A PROJECTOR!!!!
> 
> i have never owned a projector not even a slide projector
> 
> not everyone has a projector and have even stated that many times in this thread, i see your point and agree going down in size is not a good thing but from situation i have so many uncertainties about this converters and the limitiations - i appreciate the input but you were preaching to wrong choir lol or i was never in that choir lol



I never implied that you had a projector, nor am I preaching any type of message but more so an opinion. For me, Vizio has never been synonymous with superb quality. They're cheap and the picture quality is decent, but for those of us with higher-end displays, buying a lesser quality television just for 3D is not an option. I'd buy the Displayer for use on my LG Plasma before I'd buy the Vizio.


----------



## johnsmith808

I have a feeling that when the dust settles, the best (price/performance) way to get into the 3d projector game will be to get one of the VIP products and pair it with a 720p 3d-ready projector, even if you already own a 60hz pj. If you factor in the cost of the 120/60hz glasses and emitter, that will get you really close to getting a new 720-3d pj plus cheap dlp link glasses if you are buying 4 or more glasses. It may cost a little more, but the 3d quality will be significantly better with no side-effects.


----------



## Ronomy

In my setup I don't want to buy a new higher end 3D projector. A JVC RS40 would set me back $4k plus extra for the glasses and emitter. For me spending $800 to get 3D is awesome. Believe me I will post my findings when I get the Theater unit with RF glasses hopefully by next week.


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20349433
> 
> 
> I never implied that you had a projector, nor am I preaching any type of message but more so an opinion. For me, Vizio has never been synonymous with superb quality. They're cheap and the picture quality is decent, but for those of us with higher-end displays, buying a lesser quality television just for 3D is not an option. I'd buy the Displayer for use on my LG Plasma before I'd buy the Vizio.



Lesser ? I have a vizio in my bedroom and love it !!!

This will be my 2nd vizio

Affordable - meets my needs and addresses them

The vizio 3d works !!!! I saw it myself and the affordability of glasses - the displayer is not flawless - has flickering and ghosting - I can't afford higher end displays - I can afford this


Also I'm giving my parents my 47 inch as my dad was out of work for 2 years and recently started new job -they couldnt afford new tv however I wont pay 3,000 for a tv I don't need -


I love the vizio

Am a repeat customer

The 3d looks great


It's not less for me

The displayer simply is too much of a risk and already has confirmed ghosting and flickering


Vizio is affordable - and doable for me and my family


----------



## kat_xk8




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20347164
> 
> 
> If it uses the polarized glasses as you say, it's one of the passive sets... horizontal resolution will be cut in half. Might want to check it out in-store before you buy, to make sure you're happy with the picture quality.



I'm no tech person

I went to wal mart

I love it - it's 3d / looks no different then theaters except smaller

I saw a demo at SAMs for higher end

Color is great the 3d is not acceptable for me - looks 2d - no depth


The vizio is flexible and not forced to use brands glasses


I'm not happy I'm thrilled and jubilant how well tron looked


----------



## Big Brad

Kat, while I empathize with you, why do you keep posting in this thread? It's obvious you have little to no interest in what VIP has to offer. You've stated your opinion and I think we all understand your logic, but it may be time to move on. This thread is no place to discuss Vizio's passive 3D sets.


If you were to conduct a direct comparison of both the Vizio set and one of VIP's products, then I can understand, but I don't think further discussion on Vizio's offerings belong in this thread.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20351607
> 
> 
> Kat, while I empathize with you, why do you keep posting in this thread? It's obvious you have little to no interest in what VIP has to offer. You've stated your opinion and I think we all understand your logic, but it may be time to move on. This thread is no place to discuss Vizio's passive 3D sets.
> 
> 
> If you were to conduct a direct comparison of both the Vizio set and one of VIP's products, then I can understand, but I don't think further discussion on Vizio's offerings belong in this thread.



Exactly!


----------



## Jazar




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Big Brad* /forum/post/20351607
> 
> 
> I don't think further discussion on Vizio's offerings belong in this thread.



Agreed. You are sounding like a viral marketer.


----------



## cyclejim

Kat- I think you have made your point, after joining in April 2011 and making all 23 of your posts in this thread.







^^^^^^


----------



## LVNeptune




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/20347369
> 
> 
> I loved it !!!! Wal mart just got these in
> 
> I love VIP idea - yet the price is so close to one of these vizios which is the brand I want - if 42 inch demo was this amazing - the 47 inch
> 
> 
> The cost of glasses - hmm what cost
> 
> I did remember seeing a story on the news
> 
> You might want to take those 3d glasses home
> 
> 
> I love the pic
> 
> 
> Tron looked identical to theater I saw it in yet smaller but the affects - identical



The polarized lenses cause headaches on more people since it's not doing active shuttering, glasses with active shutters cause less headaches because they are shuttering.


Now, I was at Best Buy and they had the new LG with the "no battery glasses" which are polarized, one of the glasses was broken from someone poking it (lol). It was "ok" 3D, nothing to what I am used to, didn't really pop off the screen. It added a small amount of depth than to what I am used to, to each their own. I wouldn't recommend polarized to anyone.


----------



## SgtVideo

Talked to Jay today at Consignia, sounded like he was getting an express shipment in by Wednesday of this week from VIP. So hopefully the next batch of orders will be going out this week.


Also went ahead and upgraded to the VIP/Monster RF glasses as well. Consignia's price was the best out there at this time.


The Monster design appears to have a lot more tweaks to improve any ghosting and reception issues.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20354675
> 
> 
> Talked to Jay today at Consignia, sounded like he was getting an express shipment in by Wednesday of this week from VIP. So hopefully the next batch of orders will be going out this week.
> 
> 
> Also went ahead and upgraded to the VIP/Monster RF glasses as well. Consignia's price was the best out there at this time.
> 
> 
> The Monster design appears to have a lot more tweaks to improve any ghosting and reception issues.



Jonathan told me they are the exact same glasses! Monster doesn't make them BTW.


----------



## kat_xk8

Ok I'm not a marketer but this isn't a VIP hosted forum









I first joined in April because Jonathan pointed it out in an email in April and that's when I joined geez - but I'm not willing to take a 500.00 risk if not more when I have mostly projector comments - I can't try this out - but geez this is for the converter to be used with non VIP displays and sources









But speculation into what should work isn't what works - I want feed back from actual users - and I could care less of ur opnions of me as I'm here for product only - get that


----------



## johnsmith808

Ignorance is bliss.


----------



## Big Brad




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *kat_xk8* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Ok I'm not a marketer but this isn't a VIP hosted forum
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I first joined in April because Jonathan pointed it out in an email in April and that's when I joined geez - but I'm not willing to take a 500.00 risk if not more when I have mostly projector comments - I can't try this out - but geez this is for the converter to be used with non VIP displays and sources
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But speculation into what should work isn't what works - I want feed back from actual users - and I could care less of ur opnions of me as I'm here for product only - get that



So far you haven't posted much of anything other than stating you wouldn't spend the money on the VIP unit yet nearly every post you make states that you are going to buy the Vizio. Your posts have nothing to do with what works or what doesn't work with VIP products.


This isn't a VIP hosted forum, but this is the VIP Displayer thread. There are Vizio threads where your discussion of their passive 3D televisions belong.


----------



## THE DU3C3




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20355781
> 
> 
> Jonathan told me they are the exact same glasses! Monster doesn't make them BTW.



I wonder if the VIP RF glasses will be multi-functional (IR or RF) like the Monster glasses. It would be sweet to be able to use these on my 3D plasma as well as my non-3D projector. Would definitely eliminate the need for multi pairs of different brands of glasses.


----------



## widerscreen

has anyone tried this on the pan AE4000?


I have 4 pair of the panasonic glasses with the BDT 100 Bluray 3-d player withthe AE 400 PJ what would I need to make this work for the 3-D?


any advise would be helpful


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *widerscreen* /forum/post/20368080
> 
> 
> has anyone tried this on the pan AE4000?
> 
> 
> I have 4 pair of the panasonic glasses with the BDT 100 Bluray 3-d player withthe AE 400 PJ what would I need to make this work for the 3-D?
> 
> 
> any advise would be helpful



The Panny is not a 120hz projector, so the Displayer would run at 60 hz. You will need to get the VIP emitter & glasses as well, your existing glasses won't sync to 60hz.


Check the VIP Theatre thread also; some people with certain Panny models were having trouble with the frame creation feature (I'm not too familiar with your model or if it would be affected).


----------



## THE DU3C3

Just got my RF emitter kit yesterday and I've been using the glasses tuning utility but I can't get rid of the ghosting. I can get rid of the flicker by compromising brightness, but I can't live with the amount of ghosting. I'm using a Panasonic PT-AE1000 projector and I'm not willing to ditch 1080P for a 720P 3D ready projector. If anyone is interested I would sell the whole kit for just below full retail. I have the Displayer, RF emitter, and 2 pairs of RF glasses. Just send me a PM.


----------



## jyv1214

DU3C3


have you tried contacting jonathan at vip?

he might have some things you could try.

I'm beginning to think the lcd projectors just are not compatible with the vip products.

I'm having identical issues with my epson 8100.


----------



## THE DU3C3




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jyv1214* /forum/post/20382442
> 
> 
> DU3C3
> 
> 
> have you tried contacting jonathan at vip?
> 
> he might have some things you could try.
> 
> I'm beginning to think the lcd projectors just are not compatible with the vip products.
> 
> I'm having identical issues with my epson 8100.



I haven't contacted Jonathan, but I don't think there is much that can be done to correct it. With all of the adjustments that are available on the RF glasses I still could not get it dialed in to my liking. I think the VIP products are great but I think they're better suited for the 3D ready projectors.


----------



## mkoss

Well tried out my displayer last night using my BDP-BX57 3D player

using Optoma HD7100 and Hitachi PJ-TX100 both 60 Hz projectors. Couldn't get any picture to other. Just blank screen. All 3 LED's were on but no output to projectors. Even set BX57 to 720P with no luck since default is 1080P 24 HZ.

Also switch 1 was down for 60 hz operation.


Will try 120 Hz 3D acer tonight.


BX57--> VIP Displayer> 1.3 HDMI switch --> projector.


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20408138
> 
> 
> ...Couldn't get any picture to other. Just blank screen. All 3 LED's were on but no output to projectors. Even set BX57 to 720P with no luck since default is 1080P 24 HZ.
> 
> Also switch 1 was down for 60 hz operation.



I was having the same problem with my setup. It would display in 480i mode, but once the PS3 went into "Automatic" HDMI mode, the screen would blank and not come back until it went back to 480i.
*

The problem turned out to be the USB power I was feeding the Displayer.* I was using this one from Monoprice for Razr-brand cell phones. It was enough to power the Displayer lights and display 480i mode, but once an HD signal went through, the screen would black out.

I switched USB power cable with the wife's Motorola cell phone charger, and then it worked. (As a bonus, that monoprice one charges the wife's phone fine.)


Hope this helps someone!


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DaverJ* /forum/post/20408194
> 
> 
> I was having the same problem with my setup. It would display in 480i mode, but once the PS3 went into "Automatic" HDMI mode, the screen would blank and not come back until it went back to 480i.
> *
> 
> The problem turned out to be the USB power I was feeding the Displayer.* I was using this one from Monoprice for Razr-brand cell phones. It was enough to power the Displayer lights and display 480i mode, but once an HD signal went through, the screen would black out.
> 
> I switched USB power cable with the wife's Motorola cell phone charger, and then it worked. (As a bonus, that monoprice one charges the wife's phone fine.)
> 
> 
> Hope this helps someone!



I thought this might be the problem, since the charger from my old blackberry is only rated for 5vdc at .7 amps. I have another 5vdc supply but need an usb adapter to interface to it for the VIP.


----------



## mkoss

Daver J


What's the current rating on the charger that works? Should be listed on the unit.


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20408263
> 
> 
> What's the current rating on the charger that works? Should be listed on the unit.



The one that doesn't work: output 4.5-9.5V, Max 800mA (generic, sticker on the side that says F-V3/V3I, which I believe refers to the RAZR phones)
The one that *does* work: 5.0V, 550mA (Motorola-branded)


Good luck!


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *DaverJ* /forum/post/20408322
> 
> 
> The one that doesn't work: output 4.5-9.5V, Max 800mA (generic, sticker on the side that says F-V3/V3I, which I believe refers to the RAZR phones)
> The one that *does* work: 5.0V, 550mA (Motorola-branded)
> 
> 
> Good luck!



Now I'm confused. The one your using is rated for less current than the one I have. which is 5.0 vdc at .7 Amps. Will try another supply to be sure. Actually the emitter has a connector compatible with the higher current unit I have which might work back feeding to the displayer. May just work. Since the vesa feeds 5.0 vdc to the emitter there's no reason to believe it won't work getting power via the back door. Just hope wire sizes don't cause line drop to the unit.


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20408409
> 
> 
> Now I'm confused. The one your using is rated for less current than the one I have. which is 5.0 vdc at .7 Amps. Will try another supply to be sure. Actually the emitter has a connector compatible with the higher current unit I have which might work back feeding to the displayer. May just work. Since the vesa feeds 5.0 vdc to the emitter there's no reason to believe it won't work getting power via the back door. Just hope wire sizes don't cause line drop to the unit.



Yeah, it's strange... and a follow-up - the Motorola one that was working will only work for while. After about 3 to 5 minutes it cuts off!










I have a Griffin UBS PowerBrick that I use to charge an iPod Touch... it's rated at 5.2V 1000mA. I played for about 15 minutes will no problems.


So please disregard my previous post. It looks like the cheap generic charger for RAZR phones doesn't work at all, the Motorola phone charger will only work for a few minutes, and as far as I can tell, the Griffin USB charger seems to work with no problems.


Sorry for the confusion - hope this update helps!


----------



## mkoss

That makes sense now. Looks like I need at least a 1 amp capability.


----------



## mkoss

Well rather than go the back door approach I have another 5 vdc supply I spliced the USB connector from the other supply onto. It has 2 amp capability. Will see if that solves the problem tonight.


----------



## mkoss

Well having a 5vdc supply capable of 2 amps did not solve my 720P 60 hz viewing option. The displayer would show all 3 LED's active but no image to the HD7100. Set Sony to various resolutions to 480i and 720P still no image. If I broke the link the link light would go off. There was no option for 1080i from the Sony. I will try the acer 3D pj tonight.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *THE DU3C3* /forum/post/20382132
> 
> 
> Just got my RF emitter kit yesterday and I've been using the glasses tuning utility but I can't get rid of the ghosting. I can get rid of the flicker by compromising brightness, but I can't live with the amount of ghosting. I'm using a Panasonic PT-AE1000 projector and I'm not willing to ditch 1080P for a 720P 3D ready projector. If anyone is interested I would sell the whole kit for just below full retail. I have the Displayer, RF emitter, and 2 pairs of RF glasses. Just send me a PM.



This is what worked for me. As you are playing 3D look for a scene with a 3D effect. Something that is supposed to be closer to you and everything in the background is far away. You will see a double image if the frames are not in sync with the glasses. That is the extreme of ghosting. Pause on that scene. Use one eye through one glasses lens and first drop duty cycle to about 60%. Then adjust delay so that the double image is gone. Then increase duty cycle if you can then back to delay to max out brightness. If 60% duty cycle doesn't eliminate ghosting then lower it to 50%. When you get it right the 3D will have fabulous depth and the image will be clear.


On my screen 50% duty cycle seems to be equivalent to what the technology claims the loss in light levels should be with shutter glasses. They say light output should be 16% of what it is with 2D images. That's what 50-60% duty cycle looks like when i compare it to an ND8 filter which is 3 F-stops. Makes sense really. You lose 50% when the shutters turn on then 20% maybe with the tint in the glasses. Reduce the remaining 30% by half and you're at 15% light throughput.


I struggled my first night too but when you get the hang of it it works. I am still having a problem with my setup but Jonathan is helping me out as much as he can. I may have a frame lock problem with my RS1. More testing to come tonight. When its aligned it looks amazing!


Ron


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They say light output should be 16% of what it is with 2D images. That's what 50-60% duty cycle looks like when i compare it to an ND8 filter which is 3 F-stops. Makes sense really. You lose 50% when the shutters turn on then 20% maybe with the tint in the glasses. Reduce the remaining 30% by half and you're at 15% light throughput.



15% light output? Yikes! I wanted a 3D-VIP product for my projector right up till when I read that. That is not going to work for me.


I guess I can continue to collect the 3D Blus and look for a 3D HDTV whenever it's time to replace my projector.


Thanks


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20415685
> 
> 
> 15% light output? Yikes! I wanted a 3D-VIP product for my projector right up till when I read that. That is not going to work for me.
> 
> 
> I guess I can continue to collect the 3D Blus and look for a 3D HDTV whenever it's time to replace my projector.
> 
> 
> Thanks



Same loss of light output on an RS40, RS50 and RS60!


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> Same loss of light output on an RS40, RS50 and RS60!



That's fine. I'll forget the 3D projector for now. A direct view set can have much higher output so when I buy my next display maybe I'll go with direct view.


Still, I hope that isn't true losing 85% of brightness to enable 3D. That's crazy.


----------



## thebard

Article on 3dvision blog:

http://3dvision-blog.com/all-3d-glas...-much-exactly/ 


Keep in mind 3d brightness is cut in half right off the bat regardless of glasses, because each eye only gets half the signal. And even with a direct view set, the ratio of light loss will be comparible... true, it starts off brighter, but your 2d viewing is always going to be brighter than 3d.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20416120
> 
> 
> That's fine. I'll forget the 3D projector for now. A direct view set can have much higher output so when I buy my next display maybe I'll go with direct view.
> 
> 
> Still, I hope that isn't true losing 85% of brightness to enable 3D. That's crazy.



I said the same thing...I called it NUTS that we would lose 84%! The fine people on this forum corrected me.










Displays with a fast refresh like Plasma don't lose as much. They can run near 100% duty cycle. I think DLP is also good closer to 100%. LCD and LCoS not so good. I think I can get by with 60% duty cycle and still have a great image. My RS1 doesn't frame lock but VIP is working on a possible solution. They have solved three other projectors with no frame lock by working with the manufacturer to get a firmware update. They also have other ideas that my solve this on all displays.


So for you people having ghosting issues stay tuned. There may be a fix in the future. I am in a holding pattern for now.


Ron


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20416308
> 
> 
> .. true, it starts off brighter, but your 2d viewing is always going to be brighter than 3d.



Well,... sure but that can be irrelevant.


The 3D Displayer would have let me watch 3D on my projector but my projector puts out about 10 Foot Lamberts when the bulb is new.


Direct view sets are so much brighter a loss of light output is less of an issue because the resulting light output is still watchable.


Still,.... I wish I had a 3D Displayer to test on my pj or I wish I knew someone who had one so I could check it out. I'll admit, I'm still interested even though the loss of light output makes it look like it wouldn't work for my setup.





-Brian


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20416815
> 
> 
> Well,... sure but that can be irrelevant.
> 
> 
> The 3D Displayer would have let me watch 3D on my projector but my projector puts out about 10 Foot Lamberts when the bulb is new.
> 
> 
> Direct view sets are so much brighter a loss of light output is less of an issue because the resulting light output is still watchable.
> 
> 
> Still,.... I wish I had a 3D Displayer to test on my pj or I wish I knew someone who had one so I could check it out. I'll admit, I'm still interested even though the loss of light output makes it look like it wouldn't work for my setup.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -Brian



My projector is in the 10ft-L now with 2D (old bulb). Too dim in 3D. New bulb I get 20ft-L using high lamp on my Draper M2500 high gain screen. It should look better with the new lamp. Will still be down around the 4ft-L range but that is about what we see in theaters I am told.


Although watching it that dim after a while it's not so bad. My eyes adapt to it.


These are the same levels posted in the new RS40/RS50 reviews in the magazines.


If I had a 1.0 gain screen I would be around what you have for brightness levels too.


----------



## mkoss

I had good luck running the displayer with the 3D acer last night. Had one unexplained drop out with just snow showing no picture but toggled HDMI switch and stopped the BX 57 and restarted getting the picture back. Don't like the IR glasses. Too susceptible to loss of sync when either moving my head or picking up a glass to drink. Watched some of cloudy with chance of meatballs.


Will try a different 60 hz PJ tonight.


----------



## mkoss

VIP displayer worked well with the Epson EX 70. The flicker was more apparent during bright scenes but the 3D was good without ghosting. This is a very bright projector even in eco mode. So both 120 hz and 60 hz operation can be done.


----------



## Donnacha

hi, did you try your Hitachi PJ? I have a PJ tx300 and would be keen to know if this products works on the PJ range?


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Donnacha* /forum/post/20425444
> 
> 
> hi, did you try your Hitachi PJ? I have a PJ tx300 and would be keen to know if this products works on the PJ range?



Does the 300 have a dvi input or HDMI input? I got the tx 100 to work by using my optoma scaler for my HD7100 in between it and the displayer. If yours is newer it may be OK if it has a HDMI input like my epson. I noticed some ghosting with the tx100 that I didn't notice with the ex 70. I'm going to test the ex 70 again in the same spot in the movie to double check. The tx 100 is older so it's response most likely is slower than the epson and newer LCD's.


----------



## Donnacha

thanks, my 300 has got a HDMI input, so hopefully that may be more acceptable to the VIP. I'm getting tempted by this gadget by what I'm reading !


----------



## johnsmith808

Anyone using this with IR glasses and emitter have the left/right sync reversed? I thought that this was only a dlp link issue, but I'm getting this with IR as well. Have to unplug the usb power and plug back in until the sync is correct.


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* 
Anyone using this with IR glasses and emitter have the left/right sync reversed? I thought that this was only a dlp link issue, but I'm getting this with IR as well. Have to unplug the usb power and plug back in until the sync is correct.
Yes I did last night while auditioning my optoma HD7100 as a 60 hz 3D display.

I had to sometimes hit the vga/dvi button and L/R button when I put the glasses down and got up to do something. I had to do this several times.

The flicker was minimal with this PJ. Also a little ghosting of far away scenes.

Surprised since this is DLP.


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* 
Anyone using this with IR glasses and emitter have the left/right sync reversed? I thought that this was only a dlp link issue, but I'm getting this with IR as well. Have to unplug the usb power and plug back in until the sync is correct.
You shouldn't have to unplug to resync... the ir emitter has a polarity button on top.


Since I switched to the rf emitter, I've had no problems with L/R sync; as long as I load a disc or start a cable feed from the beginning, I can rewind, ffwd, pause, and polarity remains correct. The only time I ever have it go out of sync is when I use the "resume play" on my blu-ray player. YMMV.


----------



## johnsmith808

Thanks for your replies. I am using an emitter not from vip. It doesn't have a sync button. I'm only running 120hz so I didn't need the glasses that do 60hz.


Whenever I switch to a new 3d movie I need to sync it again. Sometimes it gets reversed but often the emitter needs to be woken up again. Once it works, it's great as long as I don't switch to a new movie or game.


----------



## walford

That synce signal to the glasses is synched to the image being sent to the the display by the VIP unit. Just because you have a 120Hz TV does not mean that that the TV will properly accept 120 HZ sequential video from the VIP unit. In fact almost all standard US 2D TVs will properly sync and only accept 60Hz sequential video. Many 120Hz 2D TVs designed to only accept 60Hz video can be out of sync since they will only accept/process every other frame when sent sequenntial content at 120 fps.


----------



## johnsmith808

I am using an Acer H5360 which is a 3d ready dlp projector, running 720p120hz. It works very well once it is synced. Just need to unplug the power to the displayer until it's right. I heard that some emitters come with a sync polarity button, which the one I have does not have.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/20437119
> 
> 
> I am using an Acer H5360 which is a 3d ready dlp projector, running 720p120hz. It works very well once it is synced. Just need to unplug the power to the displayer until it's right. I heard that some emitters come with a sync polarity button, which the one I have does not have.



I thought I read both the IR and RF glasses that VIP sells have sync polarity. I know the RF glasses do.


----------



## johnsmith808

I got my emitter from Ultimate 3d Heaven. It doesn't have a sync button.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/20437227
> 
> 
> I got my emitter from Ultimate 3d Heaven. It doesn't have a sync button.



Check p. 19 in the Acer projector manual. There's an option on the "Image" menu for inverting the L/R sync for 3d.


Alternately, you can try hitting the "resync" button on the remote until it is correct.


----------



## johnsmith808

The problem I think is in the displayer and not the pj. I actually have 3d set to "off"on the Acer so the option to change the 3d sync is grayed out. The Acer doesn't even know it's doing 3d.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/20438772
> 
> 
> The problem I think is in the displayer and not the pj. I actually have 3d set to "off"on the Acer so the option to change the 3d sync is grayed out. The Acer doesn't even know it's doing 3d.



Still could be the projector flipping eye frames. DLP link glasses should sync with the projectors Vsync not the HDMI video signal coming into the Displayer like it is now.


----------



## walford

Since the DLP-Link (right or left lens)glasses sync signal is sent by the DLP-screen White flash between actual frame displays of the TV or PJ not having the 3D mode set to on on a DLP 3D display normally prevents any lens change sync signals from being displayed on the screen and therfore no chages in lens sync signals are being received by the glasses,


----------



## mkoss

I have had to resync too many times with these glasses whether its turning my head , pausing, or just loss of sync for no reason to my liking. Can't wait to get the RF glasses. One thing I noticed is you kind of get used to the flicker issue durin bright scenes as you do more watching at 60 HZ. I do like having 60/120 hz option for viewing.


----------



## johnsmith808

I tried turning on dlp link mode on the Acer and then changing sync. Still didn't work. I'm almost 100% positive that the displayer is the problem. I'm using the ir emitter plugged into the displayer so that's where the 3d sync is coming from.


I found an easy solution. I plugged the usb power from the displayer into a usb to to an X10 automation plug. Now with a remote control I can turn the power to the displayer off and on. Works great!


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/20441059
> 
> 
> I tried turning on dlp link mode on the Acer and then changing sync. Still didn't work. I'm almost 100% positive that the displayer is the problem. I'm using the ir emitter plugged into the displayer so that's where the 3d sync is coming from.
> 
> 
> I found an easy solution. I plugged the usb power from the displayer into a usb to to an X10 automation plug. Now with a remote control I can turn the power to the displayer off and on. Works great!



Not the displayer! What you are doing in the acer is sending a frame change to DLP link glasses which you don't have. The Displayer is syncing to the incoming video but the acer isn't. It is but sometimes it swaps frames.


----------



## walford

The 3D sync signal coming from the IR emitter has absolutly no effect on DLP-Link glasses since they are synced using a White light sync signal coming from the DLP screen itself betweem frames and they can not receive and process the Infrared sync signals coming from the emitter. If the DC power supplied to the VIP unit via the USB port is not sufficient the emitter will not ouput any sync signals to IR glasses which you have apparently found out.


----------



## yunti

Does anyone know what other glasses can I use apart from DLP link glasses with the VIP displayer?


I would like to use it to connect my ps3 to my acer H5360 projector. I'm not keen on using DLP link glasses as I find using DLP link definately seems to compromise the picture and raises black levels a great deal.


Is there a 3 pin VESA connection on the displayer so I could use other glasses using an emitter eg like this?

http://www.amazon.com/3DTV-Rechargea.../dp/B004E5H0TQ


----------



## johnsmith808

Yes! The displayer has the 3 pin connecter. I got the emitter and glasses from Ultimate 3d Heaven. It's a $40 emitter and the glasses are $50 our less, depending on how much you buy.


I tried dlp link and noticed the poor contrast. With the emitter and ir glasses, the contrast is significantly better. Read my above posts about this.


----------



## yunti




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Yes! The displayer has the 3 pin connecter. I got the emitter and glasses from Ultimate 3d Heaven. It's a $40 emitter and the glasses are $50 our less, depending on how much you buy.
> 
> 
> I tried dlp link and noticed the poor contrast. With the emitter and ir glasses, the contrast is significantly better. Read my above posts about this.



Thanks that's good news it has the 3 pin connector. Can I ask where did you order it from, it doesn't seem to be available yet on the 3d VIP website?


----------



## Brian Hampton

Hey,


A heads up for 3d-VIP buyers. CurtPalme dot com now sells them cheaper than cosigna. What I don't understand is they claim the money goes directly to cosigna so I can't see why it costs less but whatever. Costs less is GOOD!


the 3d displayer is $20 less from Curtpalme dot com.


-Brian


----------



## johnsmith808

If anyone is interested, I am selling my Displayer for $275 shipped. It's in perfect condition. I selling it because I don't need the non-3d display compatibility, but need side by side 3d. Here it is on Videogon:

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.p...-vip-Displayer


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *johnsmith808* /forum/post/20450257
> 
> 
> If anyone is interested, I am selling my Displayer for $275 shipped. It's in perfect condition. I selling it because I don't need the non-3d display compatibility, but need side by side 3d. Here it is on Videogon:
> 
> http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.p...-vip-Displayer



Why not just return it to the vendor for a refund/credit towards what you do need?


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h* /forum/post/20454220
> 
> 
> Why not just return it to the vendor for a refund/credit towards what you do need?



15% re-stocking fee... that would be my guess. Comes in at $254 or so.


----------



## nathan_h

Interesting. A vendor who does credit a return of an almost unused product within 30 days at full price towards a higher priced product. Okay.


----------



## yunti




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Hey,
> 
> 
> A heads up for 3d-VIP buyers. CurtPalme dot com now sells them cheaper than cosigna. What I don't understand is they claim the money goes directly to cosigna so I can't see why it costs less but whatever. Costs less is GOOD!
> 
> 
> the 3d displayer is $20 less from Curtpalme dot com.
> 
> 
> -Brian



Perfect thanks


----------



## johnsmith808

I don't want to return it because am satisfied with the product. I just have different needs now.


----------



## johnsmith808

I have lowered the price for the displayer.

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.p...-vip-Displayer 


You can buy a couple of 3d blurays with the money saved!


----------



## nunofcp

Hello

Does anybody knows if the displayer can play mkv 3D files?


----------



## nathan_h

You need the ViP Theater, according to the web site specs.


----------



## axdenied

Hey guys,


Is it possible to hook the 3D-Displayer to an ATI 6870 Video Card on a Desktop computer ? The videocard supports stereoscopic 3D (i.e.: HDMI 1.4a) and that product also has an HDMI 1.4a input.


What I wanted to do was hook the video card to the model using the input slot, then output it to either a TV or an LCD computer screen (both support HDMI).


Is such a thing possible ? Will I then be able to play desktop games that support Nvidia's 3D display ?


Thanks


----------



## SgtVideo

Just received the Displayer yesterday. My first test was on a Samsung HL61A750 DLP rear projection set.


Most of my grief occurred with the RF glasses. In spite of the documentation, which was not included, had to download it from Monster. Pressing the power button on the glasses to report state of charge did not work. Sometimes the LED would light and then it wouldn't. Plugged the glasses in for charging, sometimes the LED would heartbeat for about 4 minutes and then go out. Press button on glasses to get charge report, no status blinks. Geez


When trying to go through Menu sections using the Jstick on the transmitter, some LED indications matched the Docs, some didn't.


Spent about 2.5 hours and finally got communication to glasses and shuttering. Did several transmitter resets and after all the Joysticking and button pushing between glasses and transmitter they started working. Unfortunately, Im not sure what was the right combination with all the discrepansies I was experiencing. Was it me? I sure don't know but if the results don't match the docs then I wonder.


Anyway, ran Tron 3D 60Hz and had plenty of ghosts but after taking a chance with the fine tuning was able to remove the ghosting with the Delay adjustment. Using the Delay and Duty Cycle adjustments will change perceived brightness levels and they seem to have some interaction between them. So you might have to go back and forth between those two modes when tweaking.


For this session I had an acceptable picture and I estimated a brightness reduction of about 20%.


Outside of the difficulty with the RF glasses setup I am satisfied with the performance on this particular set. It was hard to tell if the glasses switch was working or not and the joystick on the transmitter seemed really cheesy. BTW both pairs of glasses acted the same and would not give any indications by holding down the power button. Would like comments from other users to see if their buttons are working "intermittently". I tried charging both pairs and the LED would heartbeat for about 4 minutes then go out.

Holding down the power button would tell you nothing.


My next move will be to try it on the AE4000 projector.


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* 
Just received the Displayer yesterday. My first test was on a Samsung HL61A750 DLP rear projection set.


Most of my grief occurred with the RF glasses. In spite of the documentation, which was not included, had to download it from Monster. Pressing the power button on the glasses to report state of charge did not work. Sometimes the LED would light and then it wouldn't. Plugged the glasses in for charging, sometimes the LED would heartbeat for about 4 minutes and then go out. Press button on glasses to get charge report, no status blinks. Geez


When trying to go through Menu sections using the Jstick on the transmitter, some LED indications matched the Docs, some didn't.


Spent about 2.5 hours and finally got communication to glasses and shuttering. Did several transmitter resets and after all the Joysticking and button pushing between glasses and transmitter they started working. Unfortunately, Im not sure what was the right combination with all the discrepansies I was experiencing. Was it me? I sure don't know but if the results don't match the docs then I wonder.


Anyway, ran Tron 3D 60Hz and had plenty of ghosts but after taking a chance with the fine tuning was able to remove the ghosting with the Delay adjustment. Using the Delay and Duty Cycle adjustments will change perceived brightness levels and they seem to have some interaction between them. So you might have to go back and forth between those two modes when tweaking.


For this session I had an acceptable picture and I estimated a brightness reduction of about 20%.


Outside of the difficulty with the RF glasses setup I am satisfied with the performance on this particular set. It was hard to tell if the glasses switch was working or not and the joystick on the transmitter seemed really cheesy. BTW both pairs of glasses acted the same and would not give any indications by holding down the power button. Would like comments from other users to see if their buttons are working "intermittently". I tried charging both pairs and the LED would heartbeat for about 4 minutes then go out.

Holding down the power button would tell you nothing.


My next move will be to try it on the AE4000 projector.
PM me your email address. I will send you the directions and the software utility for a pc/laptop to adjust the glasses via the USB port on the emitter.


Ron


----------



## SgtVideo

Just got done testing Tron 3D with the Displayer on the Panasonic AE4000. Boy was I surprised!


Had trouble getting the glasses to power up again today...seems you have press the #@! out of the power buttons on these two pairs of glasses to get them to come on.

Will see about getting them replaced later.


Now that I'm familiar with the Delay and Duty cycle adjustments, I was able to tune up the AE4000 in short order. Best picture was with 0 Delay and about 2.5 LEDs of Duty cyle. No ghosting, slight flicker and I expected some at 60Hz.


I performed this afternoon in a fairly bright room, sun low in the west and partly cloudy skies. Even though I have a Carada 2.35 (92") 1.3 screen, went ahead and used my 92" 16x9 Da_Lite High Power pull down. Used the AE4000 on low-power lamp mode and have plenty of brightness to spare in 3D mode. Will try it on the Carada another day.


The 3D depth was even more pronounced than I remember from the Real 3D theatrical showing I saw, wife even agreed, so I know it wasn't just me.


Will see later how dark room flicker works out. After testing it out earlier on the Samsung DLP rear proj. set, things really popped and became more immersive with the AE4000.


I'll add to my posts later if I discover any thing else of significance.


VIP Displayer with the AE4000 is a keeper!.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20470176
> 
> 
> Just got done testing Tron 3D with the Displayer on the Panasonic AE4000. Boy was I surprised!
> 
> 
> Had trouble getting the glasses to power up again today...seems you have press the #@! out of the power buttons on these two pairs of glasses to get them to come on.
> 
> Will see about getting them replaced later.
> 
> 
> Now that I'm familiar with the Delay and Duty cycle adjustments, I was able to tune up the AE4000 in short order. Best picture was with 0 Delay and about 2.5 LEDs of Duty cyle. No ghosting, slight flicker and I expected some at 60Hz.
> 
> 
> I performed this afternoon in a fairly bright room, sun low in the west and partly cloudy skies. Even though I have a Carada 2.35 (92") 1.3 screen, went ahead and used my 92" 16x9 Da_Lite High Power pull down. Used the AE4000 on low-power lamp mode and have plenty of brightness to spare in 3D mode. Will try it on the Carada another day.
> 
> 
> The 3D depth was even more pronounced than I remember from the Real 3D theatrical showing I saw, wife even agreed, so I know it wasn't just me.
> 
> 
> Will see later how dark room flicker works out. After testing it out earlier on the Samsung DLP rear proj. set, things really popped and became more immersive with the AE4000.
> 
> 
> I'll add to my posts later if I discover any thing else of significance.
> 
> 
> VIP Displayer with the AE4000 is a keeper!.



I have received messages from other users that the RF glasses take pretty hard pressure to make the power switch, so I guess that is the norm. Hope that little switch holds up over time.

*Panasonic AE4000*

Watched Tron 3D entirely at night on the Carada 92" 1.3 gain screen. For 60hz I thought flicker was very minimal. If I was going to rate it as an interference level I would give it 10% and that would be on bright white scenes. Most of the time I didn't notice it unless it was a white background.


There were a few scenes where one individual would ghost in the scene but I have to wonder if that was a product of the DVD transfer or an artifact of the Sony 3D player. Tron 3D is the only movie I have on hand to test at the moment.


Overall the best picture was using the Da_Lite High Power, which I believe the current production is 2.4 gain. The Carada 1.3 gain screen did a satisfactory job as well using low-power mode from the AE4000. In my setup I'm projecting more light since it's only a 92" screen compared to most users projecting to much larger versions. I made an interchangeable system where I can attach the Carada in front of the Samsung DLP or pull down the Da_Lite in front of the Samsung or Carada. So it's easy to make quick comparisons.


----------



## mkoss

I've been doing viewing on my 120 hz H5360 and several of my 60 Hz PJ's with both sets of glasses. What I found is that it is a must in my experience to have the delay capability of the RF glasses for 60 HZ viewing in order to get rid of ghosting. On the other hand if all you have is 120 hz display then I think the IR's are acceptable. I did not see any ghosting in either Cloudy with the Chance of Meatballs or Resident Evil using the IR glasses at 120 HZ but considerable at 60 HZ. The CCM movie is excellent for adjusting the delay since it has a number of scenes one can freeze frame to make the adjustments for the near and far 3D affects with the RF glasses.


----------



## nathan_h

Once you got it dialed in, was there any image quality loss at 60hz versus 120?


----------



## mkoss

Once dialed in there was loss of brightness and less flicker in bright scenes but more 3D depth and quality. In my opinion a definite plus for 60 Hz viewing.


----------



## mkoss

If you don't want these adjustment hastles and don't own a 60 HZ PJ then invest in the 3D 120 hz. PJ's. One thing I noticed is that while I prefer my Opoma HD7100 for 2D viewing I found the H5360 not as sharp but for 3D viewing

the H5360 came to life.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20471850
> 
> 
> Once dialed in there was loss of brightness and less flicker in bright scenes but more 3D depth and quality. In my opinion a definite plus for 60 Hz viewing.



So you are saying 60hz was better than 120hz?



> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20471874
> 
> 
> If you don't want these adjustment hastles and don't own a 60 HZ PJ then invest in the 3D 120 hz. PJ's. One thing I noticed is that while I prefer my Opoma HD7100 for 2D viewing I found the H5360 not as sharp but for 3D viewing
> 
> the H5360 came to life.



Or in this post I think you are saying the opposite: That 120hz looks better for 3D?


----------



## mkoss

60 hz is not better than 120 hz because of the adjustment issues and flicker.

However if all you have is 60 hz then I was saying to go with the RF glasses which makes 60 HZ 3D acceptable to good depending on your display. If you don't have a pj then invest in a 120 hz 3D pj to simplify issues you might have with your viewing experience.


----------



## nathan_h

Ah I see. Already have a 60hz pj, and when I upgrade, it will be to a model that has 3d built in. So I see this device as a way to tide me over for a couple of years until the next inevitable upgrade


----------



## john barlow

Quote:

Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* 
I have received messages from other users that the RF glasses take pretty hard pressure to make the power switch, so I guess that is the norm. Hope that little switch holds up over time.

*Panasonic AE4000*

Watched Tron 3D entirely at night on the Carada 92" 1.3 gain screen. For 60hz I thought flicker was very minimal. If I was going to rate it as an interference level I would give it 10% and that would be on bright white scenes. Most of the time I didn't notice it unless it was a white background.


There were a few scenes where one individual would ghost in the scene but I have to wonder if that was a product of the DVD transfer or an artifact of the Sony 3D player. Tron 3D is the only movie I have on hand to test at the moment.


Overall the best picture was using the Da_Lite High Power, which I believe the current production is 2.4 gain. The Carada 1.3 gain screen did a satisfactory job as well using low-power mode from the AE4000. In my setup I'm projecting more light since it's only a 92" screen compared to most users projecting to much larger versions. I made an interchangeable system where I can attach the Carada in front of the Samsung DLP or pull down the Da_Lite in front of the Samsung or Carada. So it's easy to make quick comparisons.
If you don't mind my asking, what receiver and Blu Ray player are you using?


----------



## SgtVideo

One major item I overlooked in my testing is if you Output HDMI from the Displayer to a 1.3 version AVR you will only have 2-channel audio. VIP needs to figure out why the multi-channel is not passing through. Their sales brochure doesn't mention this.


If you place the VIP product after a 1.4 version HDMI AVR you will probably be fine. In my case I'm limited to 2-channel until this is fixed with switching HDMI via AVR.


Instead I went ahead and removed my HDMI from the AVR and ran it to a Monoprice HDMI switcher. Added digital coax from my 3D Blu-Ray to restore multichannel audio to the AVR.


Interestingly it appeared my Samsung DLP had some improved clarity by taking the AVR HDMI switching out of the food chain. Certainly a decent amount of cable no longer involved by wiring this way.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *john barlow* /forum/post/20474866
> 
> 
> If you don't mind my asking, what receiver and Blu Ray player are you using?



The AVR is a Yamaha RX-V863 and Sony S580 3D Blu-ray.


----------



## SgtVideo

For those interested in progress on the VIP product audio multi-channel firmware fix, it might be ready by Friday:


"I should have the firmware for this by either tomorrow or Friday.

Cheers!"




VIDEO INNOVATION PRODUCTS

Jonathan Alexander

4521 PGA Blvd., #338

Palm Beach Gardens, FL 33418 USA

(561) 262-0980
[email protected]


----------



## tlogan6797




> Quote:
> VIP Displayer with the AE4000 is a keeper!



Thanks Sarge!


I thought the THEATER was required for BR? Since I have the AE4000 and a Mits 65" I'm hoping to eliminate the Mits from the theater (not that my theater is complete yet) to simplify the screen setup and only have to use a fixed AT screen.


----------



## DaverJ




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *tlogan6797* /forum/post/20489129
> 
> 
> I thought the THEATER was required for BR?



Nope, the Displayer works with Blu-ray.


The Theater is required for broadcast or internet 3D. And a couple Xbox 360 games.


----------



## tlogan6797

Sorry....I had it backwards. Thanks for the correction.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jyv1214* /forum/post/20382442
> 
> 
> DU3C3
> 
> 
> have you tried contacting jonathan at vip?
> 
> he might have some things you could try.
> 
> I'm beginning to think the lcd projectors just are not compatible with the vip products.
> 
> I'm having identical issues with my epson 8100.



I bought this unit of duc3 and im glad to say it works fine on my epson 8350. Was able to tune so theres no ghosting. Another recommendation here


----------



## darockk

The polarity switch function on the rf glasses is a royal pain to activate.

Its so easy to accidentally change the duty cycle or delay when you're trying to push the joystick in. Or maybe my joystick is faulty???


Does anyone have issues with the rf glasses temporarily losing signal every now and then? Ive noticed it dropping out for 1 or so from time to time. Now that i think of it, its Possibly each time when it exits fine tuning mode im not sure.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20498466
> 
> 
> The polarity switch function on the rf glasses is a royal pain to activate.
> 
> Its so easy to accidentally change the duty cycle or delay when you're trying to push the joystick in. Or maybe my joystick is faulty???
> 
> 
> Does anyone have issues with the rf glasses temporarily losing signal every now and then? Ive noticed it dropping out for 1 or so from time to time. Now that i think of it, its Possibly each time when it exits fine tuning mode im not sure.



Yes, the polarity is a pain to activate. Fortunately, sync is 100% correct if the glasses are on when I load a blu-ray, & it stays correct through pause, ffwd, etc; it only reverses if I use the "resume play" function on my player. In that case, I find it's easier to just eject & reload, then it corrects.


The rf does drop out momentarily when the transceiver exits fine tuning mode, but that doesn't bother me... I got the settings the way I like & then I just don't mess with it.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20498466
> 
> 
> The polarity switch function on the rf glasses is a royal pain to activate.
> 
> Its so easy to accidentally change the duty cycle or delay when you're trying to push the joystick in. Or maybe my joystick is faulty???
> 
> 
> Does anyone have issues with the rf glasses temporarily losing signal every now and then? Ive noticed it dropping out for 1 or so from time to time. Now that i think of it, its Possibly each time when it exits fine tuning mode im not sure.



What projector are you using, is it 60 hz?


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *darockk* 
Does anyone have issues with the rf glasses temporarily losing signal every now and then? Ive noticed it dropping out for 1 or so from time to time. Now that i think of it, its Possibly each time when it exits fine tuning mode im not sure.
That is exactly what it is. This behavior is normal and is explained in the manual on page 4:

Quote:

In any mode, the normal mode of operation resumes after 60 seconds of inactivity.
The temporary signal loss is the tranceiver "clicking" back into normal operating mode after being in fine-tune mode.


----------



## darockk

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
Yes, the polarity is a pain to activate. Fortunately, sync is 100% correct if the glasses are on when I load a blu-ray, & it stays correct through pause, ffwd, etc; it only reverses if I use the "resume play" function on my player. In that case, I find it's easier to just eject & reload, then it corrects.


The rf does drop out momentarily when the transceiver exits fine tuning mode, but that doesn't bother me... I got the settings the way I like & then I just don't mess with it.
Ah thanks for that tip, ill give that a try. For some reason shrek 1 3d is reversed but skrek 4 3d isnt. Or maybe its the way i loaded the disc without turning the ps3 off..will take more notice next time. I hate using the polarity switcher.


Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
What projector are you using, is it 60 hz?
Yes 60hz epson 8350

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
That is exactly what it is. This behavior is normal and is explained in the manual on page 4:




The temporary signal loss is the tranceiver "clicking" back into normal operating mode after being in fine-tune mode.
Ah i must have missed that part of the manual cheers, at least theres nothing wrong with my glasses.




I just tried the displayer on my 50 inch kuro and the 3d effect is actually more pronounced than the epson 8350. It looks just like a samsung 3d plasma. I guess thats the advantage plasma holds over lcd when viewing 3d movies.


----------



## mkoss

Yes 60hz epson 8350


I just tried the displayer on my 50 inch kuro and the 3d effect is actually more pronounced than the epson 8350. It looks just like a samsung 3d plasma. I guess thats the advantage plasma holds over lcd when viewing 3d movies.[/quote]


You could possibly have drift issues due to sync over time. You need to watch the movie once adjusted and see if ghosting appears and there is loss of depth and even need to flip the glasses over to get proper 3D. I have a 3D H5360 i can use as a point of reference so I can tell when something is amiss.


----------



## darockk

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
Yes 60hz epson 8350


I just tried the displayer on my 50 inch kuro and the 3d effect is actually more pronounced than the epson 8350. It looks just like a samsung 3d plasma. I guess thats the advantage plasma holds over lcd when viewing 3d movies.
You could possibly have drift issues due to sync over time. You need to watch the movie once adjusted and see if ghosting appears and there is loss of depth and even need to flip the glasses over to get proper 3D. I have a 3D H5360 i can use as a point of reference so I can tell when something is amiss.[/quote]


What are drift issues? Im pretty sure ive got the glasses set up as best as possible and the results are stunning on the plasma and while still very good on the epson 8350, its not as good as the plasma. Ive got no ghosting on either display and i dont change the settings between displays. I reckon the difference is due to the superior black and colour levels that plasma has, just seems to give that extra bit of depth.


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronomy View Post

Great! You mentioned you have a 2amp supply so not an issue. Plus you are seeing the same issues I see. The VIP box is supposed to be getting its sync timing from the frame rate it is sending to the projector. If the projector doesn't lock to that then you have drift and eventually a dropped frame. So it can't be the VIP box that is drifting. If the VIP had its own timing rate then I would say yes but it doesn't. The sync pulse is pulled directly from the frame rate sent to the display.

Well we talked about disabling 24fps. Guess what I went into the menu and this was disabled already and I enabled it. Somehow I may have disasbled this from previous viewings in searching through the menus. I put the Hitachi PJ-TX 100 back in the system for viewing and adjusted for viewing with Resident Evil. I decided once the RF glasses were fine tuned I was going to avoid any changing and try to get through the entire movie. Viewing was looking like it was stable for quite a long time. When I usually take a break I put it to pause which I did a couple times but noticed I may be getting drift due to this. Instead I started to stop play and then restart which then looked like it was syncing up properly. Bottom line is it looks like this PJ is working satisfactorily with the displayer with 3 others to be retested. The reason I went back to this PJ is in Cloudy with the Chance of Meatballs I thought it had worked good and didn't understand the change from one viewing to another. For an older LCD this unit is good and I don't see motion blur.


----------



## darockk

can anyone tell me where or if its possible to buy the infra red emitter part that is required if I wished to use the RF glasses on a 3dtv? I believe you put this infront of the 3dtv's infra red port and then the IR signal is converted to RF. I thought it came bundled with this set but now i realise that its only in the higher spec package (as far as Monster's offerings are concerned)


edit: it comes bundled in the monster set for $279, but just wondering if it comes bundled from VIP?


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *darockk* 
can anyone tell me where or if its possible to buy the infra red emitter part that is required if I wished to use the RF glasses on a 3dtv? I believe you put this infront of the 3dtv's infra red port and then the IR signal is converted to RF. I thought it came bundled with this set but now i realise that its only in the higher spec package (as far as Monster's offerings are concerned)
If you bought the Bit Cauldron RF set, I think it should have been included...


----------



## darockk

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
If you bought the Bit Cauldron RF set, I think it should have been included...


Hmm can someone else confirm this? I bought the set off a forum member, perhaps it wasnt sent to me.


----------



## Ronomy

The version that comes from VIP doesn't come with it!


----------



## darockk

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Ronomy* 
The version that comes from VIP doesn't come with it!
thats what i thought! damn...so here i was thinking VIP set @ $199 was way cheaper than the monster branded set @ RRP $279, but it doesnt include the IR receiver part!


where can i buy this part separately?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20506428
> 
> 
> thats what i thought! damn...so here i was thinking VIP set @ $199 was way cheaper than the monster branded set @ RRP $279, but it doesnt include the IR receiver part!
> 
> 
> where can i buy this part separately?



Try the Monster support# (877 800-8989) and see if the BC010 IR sensor is available from them.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20506428
> 
> 
> thats what i thought! damn...so here i was thinking VIP set @ $199 was way cheaper than the monster branded set @ RRP $279, but it doesnt include the IR receiver part!
> 
> 
> where can i buy this part separately?



Bummer! I did post about this in the Monster 3D thread. That's part of the price difference.


----------



## Skiiermike




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20506428
> 
> 
> thats what i thought! damn...so here i was thinking VIP set @ $199 was way cheaper than the monster branded set @ RRP $279, but it doesnt include the IR receiver part!
> 
> 
> where can i buy this part separately?




Ok so now you have me worried.


I ordered the Theater and the RF kit. Am I going to need anything else or is everything there that I will need? I thought the RF transmitter plugged into the Theater.


And yes I do know that this is the displayer thread but it will be the same problem.


Thanks


----------



## mkoss

I have tried several ways to charge the RF glasses including with a seperate blackberry supply but they don't seem to hold a charge. I neeed to hardwire power from my BR USB port during viewing to get them to work. Any one else have this problem. They look like they are charging but when I try to turn them on, they won't come up until I hardwire USB power with the supplied connector.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Skiiermike* /forum/post/20508977
> 
> 
> Ok so now you have me worried.
> 
> 
> I ordered the Theater and the RF kit. Am I going to need anything else or is everything there that I will need? I thought the RF transmitter plugged into the Theater.
> 
> 
> And yes I do know that this is the displayer thread but it will be the same problem.
> 
> 
> Thanks



The rf tranceiver hooks up to the VIP unit. The IR receiver is used to get sync from a 3d-ready tv with an ir emitter & no vesa output.


----------



## mkoss

On the good side I used the displayer with my Optoma HD7100 last night with good results. Had a polarity inversion in the beginning but long periods of viewing did not result in any drift causing ghosting or inversion. Did get inversions a couple times throughout viewing when I stopped and restarted but not during chapter skipping or continuos viewing. Kept the same settings as the night before when viewing with the Hitachi PJ-TX100. The HD7100 has over 1200 hours on the bulb so not as bright as the 100 viewing. Because Resident Evil has many dark scenes it took some getting used too even with a screen with gain. But the 7100 seemed to resolve more subtle 3D scenes than the 100 although overall the 100 was still good. Just had a flakey response of the glasses near the end with total loss of 3D and sporadic back and forth on the glasses which I couldn't explain except for maybe momentary loss of power/sync due to being hard wired. Stopped and started a couple times to resolve.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Skiiermike* /forum/post/20508977
> 
> 
> Ok so now you have me worried.
> 
> 
> I ordered the Theater and the RF kit. Am I going to need anything else or is everything there that I will need? I thought the RF transmitter plugged into the Theater.
> 
> 
> And yes I do know that this is the displayer thread but it will be the same problem.
> 
> 
> Thanks




You will have everything you need to get it to work on, however you may not be able to use the 'universal' aspect of these RF glasses which is a feature heavily marketed by Monster. What i want to do is also use the RF glasses on an existing 3d tv, because im not happy with samsung's included IR glasses. For that you need the infra red receiver. This will convert the samsung 3dtv's IR signal into monster's RF signal. It comes included in the monster kit, but not in the VIP kit.




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20509237
> 
> 
> I have tried several ways to charge the RF glasses including with a seperate blackberry supply but they don't seem to hold a charge. I neeed to hardwire power from my BR USB port during viewing to get them to work. Any one else have this problem. They look like they are charging but when I try to turn them on, they won't come up until I hardwire USB power with the supplied connector.



when you can get them to turn on, what happens when you press the power button, how much charge does it say you have?


i think im having the same problem. when i received the glasses they wouldnt turn on at all. so i had to watch the movie with it plugged in. after the movie there was 6 blinking lights which was probably right as it wasnt a long charge, but then the next day it went down to 12 fast blinking lights. I left it over night to charge on a HTC phone charger. This morning i couldnt even turn the glasses on. So it looks like the HTC charger didnt work, even though i thought it was charging due to the blinking lights.


After reading the manual again, i found that the problem with these glasses is that there is no indication (to my knowledge) of what the LED should be doing when it is charging. It is easy to confuse the blinking LED that that occurs when it is searching for the emitter. This does not mean it's charging.


the manual says "If the glasses are powered off but charging, the LED will display a slow 'heartbeat' signal when the glasses are fully charged" .


As you can see, the wording is not very clear as to what the light should be doing WHILST charging.


Also does anyone know what the heart beat signal looks like?

ive seen the LED in a state of slowly dimming,then slowly getting bright. is this it?

If so, then it means my glasses are not reaching full charge becasue even after the heartbeat signal, im only gettign the 6 medium blinking lights, not the 2 long lights as stated in the manual as indicating a full charge.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20510346
> 
> 
> You will have everything you need to get it to work on, however you may not be able to use the 'universal' aspect of these RF glasses which is a feature heavily marketed by Monster. What i want to do is also use the RF glasses on an existing 3d tv, because im not happy with samsung's included IR glasses. For that you need the infra red receiver. This will convert the samsung 3dtv's IR signal into monster's RF signal. It comes included in the monster kit, but not in the VIP kit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when you can get them to turn on, what happens when you press the power button, how much charge does it say you have?
> 
> 
> i think im having the same problem. when i received the glasses they wouldnt turn on at all. so i had to watch the movie with it plugged in. after the movie there was 6 blinking lights which was probably right as it wasnt a long charge, but then the next day it went down to 12 fast blinking lights. I left it over night to charge on a HTC phone charger. This morning i couldnt even turn the glasses on. So it looks like the HTC charger didnt work, even though i thought it was charging due to the blinking lights.
> 
> 
> After reading the manual again, i found that the problem with these glasses is that there is no indication (to my knowledge) of what the LED should be doing when it is charging. It is easy to confuse the blinking LED that that occurs when it is searching for the emitter. This does not mean it's charging.
> 
> 
> the manual says "If the glasses are powered off but charging, the LED will display a slow 'heartbeat' signal when the glasses are fully charged" .
> 
> 
> As you can see, the wording is not very clear as to what the light should be doing WHILST charging.
> 
> 
> Also does anyone know what the heart beat signal looks like?
> 
> ive seen the LED in a state of slowly dimming,then slowly getting bright. is this it?
> 
> If so, then it means my glasses are not reaching full charge becasue even after the heartbeat signal, im only gettign the 6 medium blinking lights, not the 2 long lights as stated in the manual as indicating a full charge.



What they should have is either another LED or a bi-color LED used for charging. When the battery is charged they could display the other color such as green or blue when fully charged. I've done battery chargers so this is not that difficult. Lots of these chargers drive multiple LEDs.


----------



## SgtVideo




darockk said:


> You will have everything you need to get it to work on, however you may not be able to use the 'universal' aspect of these RF glasses which is a feature heavily marketed by Monster. What i want to do is also use the RF glasses on an existing 3d tv, because im not happy with samsung's included IR glasses. For that you need the infra red receiver. This will convert the samsung 3dtv's IR signal into monster's RF signal. It comes included in the monster kit, but not in the VIP kit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> when you can get them to turn on, what happens when you press the power button, how much charge does it say you have?
> 
> 
> i think im having the same problem. when i received the glasses they wouldnt turn on at all. so i had to watch the movie with it plugged in. after the movie there was 6 blinking lights which was probably right as it wasnt a long charge, but then the next day it went down to 12 fast blinking lights. I left it over night to charge on a HTC phone charger. This morning i couldnt even turn the glasses on. So it looks like the HTC charger didnt work, even though i thought it was charging due to the blinking lights.
> 
> 
> After reading the manual again, i found that the problem with these glasses is that there is no indication (to my knowledge) of what the LED should be doing when it is charging. It is easy to confuse the blinking LED that that occurs when it is searching for the emitter. This does not mean it's charging.
> 
> 
> the manual says "If the glasses are powered off but charging, the LED will display a slow 'heartbeat' signal when the glasses are fully charged" .
> 
> 
> As you can see, the wording is not very clear as to what the light should be doing WHILST charging.
> 
> 
> Also does anyone know what the heart beat signal looks like?
> 
> ive seen the LED in a state of slowly dimming,then slowly getting bright. is this it?
> 
> *With the glasses OFF to me that is correct for full charge.*
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know what to make of the discrepancies in the number of blinks either, seems to provide more confusion than help. Plus I wish they used a slide switch instead, the amount of pressure required to engage this switch makes me wonder how long it will last.


----------



## SgtVideo

Received the beta version 1.3 for the firmware upgrade for the Displayer this evening and successfully upgraded it from 1.0 to 1.3. Tomorrow morning I will recable my system and see if 5.1 audio and normal video remain intact. All required files were packaged and the instruction set needs to followed exactly to avoid possible firmware corruption. The steps are in numerical order.


If all goes well, I will get the OK from Jonathan to upload the files to the Displayer thread. Their website isn't ready for upgrades like this so I'm volunteering my efforts.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20514882
> 
> 
> Received the beta version 1.3 for the firmware upgrade for the Displayer this evening and successfully upgraded it from 1.0 to 1.3. Tomorrow morning I will recable my system and see if 5.1 audio and normal video remain intact. All required files were packaged and the instruction set needs to followed exactly to avoid possible firmware corruption. The steps are in numerical order.
> 
> 
> If all goes well, I will get the OK from Jonathan to upload the files to the Displayer thread. Their website isn't ready for upgrades like this so I'm volunteering my efforts.



thanks for that, im getting sick of the stereo only sound so would be good to get the firmware update. Can you also ask Jonathan if there's a firmware update so we can play side by side 3d too, becasue im assuming that what the extra $200 for the theatre model go towards











i also wish there was a way to manually turn off the glasses.


e.g yesterday i was watching Tron 3d with the wife and she went to be early but i couldnt turn off her glasses unless i unplug the power of the rf unit and wait 5 minutes. so i had to just leave the glasses running. sounds very primitive to me.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20515250
> 
> 
> thanks for that, im getting sick of the stereo only sound so would be good to get the firmware update. Can you also ask Jonathan if there's a firmware update so we can play side by side 3d too, becasue im assuming that what the extra $200 for the theatre model go towards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Ha...I'm sure he'll jump right on that!*
> 
> 
> i also wish there was a way to manually turn off the glasses.
> 
> 
> e.g yesterday i was watching Tron 3d with the wife and she went to be early but i couldnt turn off her glasses unless i unplug the power of the rf unit and wait 5 minutes. so i had to just leave the glasses running. sounds very primitive to me.



He is working with Bit Cauldron on some refinements, the charge status is not that helpful and personally I would prefer a slide switch to power ON/OFF the glasses.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20510585
> 
> 
> What they should have is either another LED or a bi-color LED used for charging. When the battery is charged they could display the other color such as green or blue when fully charged. I've done battery chargers so this is not that difficult. Lots of these chargers drive multiple LEDs.



I mentioned your comment about that to Jonathan yesterday when we talked about some glasses issues.


----------



## SgtVideo

I am happy to report successful testing of firmware version 1.3.


Unfortunately the file size exceeds the 500k limit for uploading to this forum.

PM me which version (Displayer/Theater) you need and I will send them to you direct from my email account.


I also recommend you copy & paste the instructions from this thread to perform the upgrade.


A couple problems I encountered and they were on MY end, was a setting in the Sony BD player was preventing 5.1 to the AVR. In my case I discovered in the audio setting "BD audio Mix setting ON", don't know why that was enabled but after setting it to OFF all was fine. So if you run across a multichannel problem...check those settings!


Also, as mentioned in Jonathan's instructions below, you may notice facial discolorations, adjust Duty Cycle settings to clean those up. I initially had 1.5 bars and increase to 2.5 bars and got normal facial color on the Samsung DLP.


Another interesting thing is my display is reporting that I'm receiving 1080p/24/3D. In my Tron 3D the preview scenes like from Pirates of the Carribbean show up 720/60 but the main movie changes to 1080P/24. Let us know if you get the same results.

*INSTRUCTIONS:*

From Jonathan,


Gents,


One of you was successfully able to upgrade the firmware on the Displayer and get 5.1 Audio support. You may notice a discolouration in the image after having re-booted the system. This only means that you will need to adjust the duty cycle on the RF glasses to the new settings. You might have to increase the bar from 1 - 1.5 to 2.5 or so! I have included this in the instructions below.



HENCE, THE ABOVE IS GOOD TO GO! DO PLEASE MAKE SURE THAT THE INSTRUCTIONS CONTAINED BELOW ARE FORWARDED ALONG, WHEN YOU DO DISTRIBUTE IT AROUND.



Thanks for your cooperation and all the best.


I am providing you with the following zip files:


1- 3DDisplayer_upgrade_VER13_BETA


2- 3DTheatre_upgrade_VER13_BETA


3- VIP DRIVER




Please note that the Displayer upgrade is for 3D-Displayer and Theatre is for 3D-Theatre. The same Driver (3rd attachment) will function for both upgrades.




Do please remove any/all previous VIP firmware upgrade files from your computer to avoid confusion. THIS IS A BETA VERSION and your support in confirming its proper functionality is appreciated before making it public.




CAUTION:


1- Do not unplug the converter while you are in the process of upgrading your firmware.


2- Do not install Displayer firmware on 3D-Theatre or vice versa. The results may corrupt the whole firmware.




In order to install the new firmware to upgrade your converter to support 5.1 AUDIO format, please follow the said steps:


1- Extract VIP DRIVER and save contents to a VIP DRIVER FOLDER on your computer


2- Extract 3D Theatre or 3D Displayer and save contents to a 3D THEATRE or 3D DISPLAYER FOLDER on your computer


3- Install VIP DRIVER file by executing USBXpressInstaler


4- Connect your converter box to the computer via a USB cable


5- Make sure the POWER light goes on


6- Go to 3D THEATRE or 3D DISPLAYER folder and execute the VIP_Theatre_unreleased _V13_BETA_.exe or VIP_Displayer_unreleased_V13_BETA_.exe


7- You will then be asked to confirm update. Hit OK


8- Update shall commence and at the end you will receive a message that the update was successfully loaded.


9- Your new version should be 1.3


You are now ready to remove the converter and plug it to your setup to test 5.1 AUDIO support.


Do please make sure you turn your player off and restart the whole system.


Do please go to your player audio menu and reset it to HDMI - AUTOMATIC and you should see the following:




AUDIO OUTPUT FORMATS:




1- Dolby Digital 5.1 ch


2- DTS 5.1 ch


3- AAC


4- Stereo 2 ch 44.1 KHz


5- Stereo 2 ch 88.2 KHz


6- Stereo 2 ch 176.4 KHz


7- Sterio 2 ch 48 KHz



You may notice a discolouration in the image. If you do, please readjust the duty cycle on your glasses to get the correct colouration. As a hint, if you were running it around 1 - 1.5 bars, you may have to now increase it to 2.5 bars.



If you are successful (as we have been) in upgrading and testing with the said results, you may post it for others to access and upgrade. Do please make sure that the entire email with instructions and cautions is listed to avoid undesired outcomes. Any questions, please email me.



All the best and cheers!


----------



## SgtVideo

Was able to have adequate file space at: www.curtpalme.com 


So you can do direct downloads of the VIP Theater/Displayer firmware update if desired.


They are located at this link:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=52


----------



## mkoss

Looks like my Epson EX70 is working with the displayer as well. Just needed to adjust the RF glasses and viewed for about an hour without any drift. That's 3 60 hz PJ's working now. One to go. Also looks like the RF glasses charged this time. I didn't need to supply them power while viewing. By the way CC has a sale on a bunch of 3D movies this week.


----------



## mkoss

Had problems with the RF glasses again. Had to plug them in again for them to work. Either the battery is poor at holding a charge or the units not turning off after use. The way the LED's work it's difficult to get a point of reference.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20525003
> 
> 
> Had problems with the RF glasses again. Had to plug them in again for them to work. Either the battery is poor at holding a charge or the units not turning off after use. The way the LED's work it's difficult to get a point of reference.



They take 3 hours to fully charge according to the manual. The LED shows a slow heart beat pulse which is a pulse that starts out dim and gets bright and back to dim slowly. That's when it is fully charged. They blink when no signal from the emitter for 5 minutes then turn off. At least that is what I have seen so far. I have not tried to figure out what % of charge they have left. The manual covers that.


----------



## mkoss

The night before I had charged them prior to using them. So they had a fresh charge. I used the glasses last night thinking they would be fine since I charged them the night before. Eventually I will get to the bottom of this. I believe you had a problem with your first pair. Wish I new what they are using as a charger chip. If I new the battery type then I could narrow it down although that still leaves quite a few possibilities.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20525201
> 
> 
> The night before I had charged them prior to using them. So they had a fresh charge. I used the glasses last night thinking they would be fine since I charged them the night before. Eventually I will get to the bottom of this. I believe you had a problem with your first pair. Wish I new what they are using as a charger chip. If I new the battery type then I could narrow it down although that still leaves quite a few possibilities.



They just didn't have a good charge the first night. So far they have been fine on one charge but i haven't watched a lot. I probably have a few hours use on the charge so far. They do lose some charge when sitting. My second pair i plugged in after several days and they didn't show a heart beat so they needed to be topped off so to speak.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20525201
> 
> 
> The night before I had charged them prior to using them. So they had a fresh charge. I used the glasses last night thinking they would be fine since I charged them the night before. Eventually I will get to the bottom of this. I believe you had a problem with your first pair. Wish I new what they are using as a charger chip. If I new the battery type then I could narrow it down although that still leaves quite a few possibilities.



Battery is Lithium-Polymer like used for RC models, it is spec'd for Zigbee and Bluetooth equipment.


Battery# 402040P


Specs are shown on the internet but no vendors for purchasing as yet...well maybe except Monster or Bit Cauldron.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20525003
> 
> 
> Had problems with the RF glasses again. Had to plug them in again for them to work. Either the battery is poor at holding a charge or the units not turning off after use. The way the LED's work it's difficult to get a point of reference.



If you're charging them via a PC USB port you might check Device Manager's power management settings for the USB ports and see if the operating system has permission to shut them off on each hub.


IF it is a USB wall type charger and other devices charge fine from it then I dunno.


Just a thought.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20526649
> 
> 
> If you're charging them via a PC USB port you might check Device Manager's power management settings for the USB ports and see if the operating system has permission to shut them off on each hub.
> 
> 
> IF it is a USB wall type charger and other devices charge fine from it then I dunno.
> 
> 
> Just a thought.



I'm using a seperate charger for them. Still having a problem. Had them charging yesterday for well over 3 hours(forgot to take them off the charger).

Interesting thing is no slow haeartbeat of LED when I took offf charger. Had to plug them in to the USB port of the player to get them to turn on again when I started viewing.


On a different note used with my Sharp XV-12000MkII last night. Did get some drifting. Had to readjust several times. The drift was slow enough to be tolerable. One point to make here is that I needed to insert my HD3000 scaler in between the displayer and 3 of my 60 Hz PJ's to get an image. If it was not in the loop I had no video. These all have DVI video connectors which shouldn't cause a problem of and by itself. The 3D was outstanding in the Sharp once synced properly. This is the only PJ that had a drift problem out of my 60 Hz pj's(need to double check others one more time). Stopping and restarting didn't resolve the drift. I needed to pause and readjust,somewhat of a pain. But as I said before the drift was slow enough to be tolerable. However in the beginning it seemed to stay in sync for quite a while only later to need more frequent adjustment.

Used Resident Evil as the 3D source.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20528342
> 
> 
> I'm using a seperate charger for them. Still having a problem. Had them charging yesterday for well over 3 hours(forgot to take them off the charger).
> 
> Interesting thing is no slow haeartbeat of LED when I took offf charger. Had to plug them in to the USB port of the player to get them to turn on again when I started viewing.
> 
> 
> On a different note used with my Sharp XV-12000MkII last night. Did get some drifting. Had to readjust several times. The drift was slow enough to be tolerable. One point to make here is that I needed to insert my HD3000 scaler in between the displayer and 3 of my 60 Hz PJ's to get an image. If it was not in the loop I had no video. These all have DVI video connectors which shouldn't cause a problem of and by itself. The 3D was outstanding in the Sharp once synced properly. This is the only PJ that had a drift problem out of my 60 Hz pj's(need to double check others one more time). Stopping and restarting didn't resolve the drift. I needed to pause and readjust,somewhat of a pain. But as I said before the drift was slow enough to be tolerable. However in the beginning it seemed to stay in sync for quite a while only later to need more frequent adjustment.
> 
> Used Resident Evil as the 3D source.



I wonder how good a job someone did in attaching that battery.


In the right earpiece, it takes a very fine phillips or blade screw driver that makes a good engagement. Just one screw holds on the cover on the R side, see if there is a good connection with the ribbon cable to the battery.


I don't know if that will create a warranty issue, doesn't sound right what you describe.


After 2 hours both pairs of my glasses show slow heartbeat, if I leave them on longer it is still the same.


----------



## darockk

ive got one faulty pair of glasses. only charges for around 5-10 minutes before it says its full. status says 10% battery life remaining. So only lasts 2 hours of use and then totally dies just sitting on the shelf over the next day.


emailing jonathan but not sure if ill get a reply, he's a hard person to contact.


----------



## mkoss

I have the same problem with the glasses. I need to contact them as well. They look like their charging fine but when you go to use them I need to plug them into the BR player usb port to get them to work. Either the battery is bad or its not charging properly as indicated. You need to monitor the charge current in order to do it properly based on the battery type.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20528342
> 
> 
> I'm using a seperate charger for them. Still having a problem. Had them charging yesterday for well over 3 hours(forgot to take them off the charger).
> 
> Interesting thing is no slow haeartbeat of LED when I took offf charger. Had to plug them in to the USB port of the player to get them to turn on again when I started viewing.
> 
> 
> On a different note used with my Sharp XV-12000MkII last night. Did get some drifting. Had to readjust several times. The drift was slow enough to be tolerable. One point to make here is that I needed to insert my HD3000 scaler in between the displayer and 3 of my 60 Hz PJ's to get an image. If it was not in the loop I had no video. These all have DVI video connectors which shouldn't cause a problem of and by itself. The 3D was outstanding in the Sharp once synced properly. This is the only PJ that had a drift problem out of my 60 Hz pj's(need to double check others one more time). Stopping and restarting didn't resolve the drift. I needed to pause and readjust,somewhat of a pain. But as I said before the drift was slow enough to be tolerable. However in the beginning it seemed to stay in sync for quite a while only later to need more frequent adjustment.
> 
> Used Resident Evil as the 3D source.



Is the charge circuit drawing enough power to keep the power supply on? These high efficiency power supplies shut down into a stand by state if not drawing enough current. Just a thought!


----------



## mkoss

SNO-402040P 3.7V 270mAh


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20535063
> 
> 
> SNO-402040P 3.7V 270mAh


----------



## mkoss

Mike,


Yes, we know how to recharge Li-ion batteries.


After full charge, the battey will ducharge in couple hours?



Best Regards,

Jiro Nakauchi




> Jiro,

>

> They give an indication they are charging but when their used later they do not turn

on unless I supply USB power via the cable. The emitter is not powered before and after a

viewing. It is turned off. They have never worked unless I use the cable except for a

short time. They are not retaining a charge. I'm asking again are you monitoring charge

current as well as voltage. Lithium technology requires charge current to be monitored

and controlled during the initial charge phase with switching to a constant voltage mode

while monitoring the current to top them off. When the charge current drops to a low

value the charge is terminated. There should be a back up timer as well to terminate for

safety reasons Is this how your doing it or are you just monitoring voltage? Also the

switch does not have a good feel as to how much pressure to apply in turning it on. Only

when I supply power and the emitter is on do they come on with 3 quick led indications.

>

> Mike

>


I never get a straight answer as to how they are charging the battery. It's frustrating. They always give an answer that side steps my problem. I've sent abnout 4 e-mails already with no resolution.


----------



## mkoss

Here's the 2 previous e-mails. He never tells me he is also monitoring current. If they don't monitor and control current they will not charge properly.


Do you monitor and control charging current and monitor voltage to know when battery is fully charged and when to terminate?


Yes, we monitor the voltage.




Ø With the glasses plugged into the USB port of the player I get 3 quick flashes.


Does this mean your glasses never worked with batteries?




Best Regards,


Jiro Nakauchi


Mike,


Does this mean that the batteries do charge after connecting to micro USB

cable with 5V supply for 3-4 hours?

However, if you do not use the glasses and leave it off for more than couple

hours, then the battery are dead?


Please remember that glasses can be powered on (consuming power) with LED

off as long as the Emitter is connected to a VESA port with 5V supply and

sync signal. The glasses will not turn off (standby mode) unless it does

not detect Emitter (with valid sync signal) for more than 5 minutes.


Best Regards,

Jiro Nakauchi



To: [email protected] 

Subject: RE: Re: james mentz: Battery charging


Jiro,


have only worked a very short time on batteries. If I charge and let stand

it's like I never charge them when I go to use them . You say you monitor

voltage but do you also monitor charge current?


Mike


----------



## Ronomy

Did you see this? I happen to be using an old LG phone charger to charge my glasses. This guy tried an old blackberry charger and his glasses work now.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post20213580


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20535063
> 
> 
> SNO-402040P 3.7V 270mAh


----------



## SgtVideo




mkoss said:


> Mike,
> 
> 
> Yes, we know how to recharge Li-ion batteries.
> 
> 
> After full charge, the battey will ducharge in couple hours?
> 
> 
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> Jiro Nakauchi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Mike,
> 
> 
> I don't understand this reps response pointed to Li-Ion batteries, we are using Li-Polymer batteries in the RF glasses. Li-Ion have higher internal resistance so I would think design charge curves would be far different.
> 
> 
> Have to wonder if those folks know what they're using.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Hi,


I plan to order the Displayer and RF glasses at the end of the month.


I'm confused though about what additional stuff I need. I think I have iphone power plugs and extra USB cables to power the Displayer but does the Displayer "need" to be plugged in? Something I read said it's only if it doesn't get enough power from the HDMI connection.


Does the RF emitter also need power from USB via something that's not supplied?


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
I have the same problem with the glasses. I need to contact them as well. They look like their charging fine but when you go to use them I need to plug them into the BR player usb port to get them to work. Either the battery is bad or its not charging properly as indicated. You need to monitor the charge current in order to do it properly based on the battery type.
I can now say "me too" on one of my glasses. It was charged two days previously, pressed button to power up and nuttin.


Went ahead and placed both pair on a USB 2.5A 4-port charger for 24 hours.

Before going to bed both units were doing slow heartbeat. Got up this a.m. and the dead one had no LED flashing, the other one that works was still doing heartbeat.


Pulled the battery and checked it with a Fluke multimeter, only read 2.94vdc.

Specs show it to be 3.7v. Either the battery isn't taking charge or whatever they are using for a charge controller is defective.


Went ahead and plugged battery back in glasses and got 3 blinks then off.

Hooked up USB power and heartbeat began.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I've read old blackberry chargers and the secret to charging the glasses.










I guess I'll have to go look for one of those.


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* 
I've read old blackberry chargers and the secret to charging the glasses.










I guess I'll have to go look for one of those.


-Brian
I saw that as well but can't visualize that as the long time solution.

Those were for Li-Ion batteries for Blackberrys and these are Li-Po. Best analogy I can come up with it's like charging Ni-Mh in an old Nicad charger.


Also, these charged fine with my current methods and now one isn't, so something else is amiss.


You should see some of info on RC aircraft forums on charging Li-Po batteries they are in a class of their own. Computer programmable chargers and cell balancers needed...eek!


----------



## mkoss

I'm going to consult some people I work with to find out more on the difference in charging Lithium Polymer vs's Lithium Ion batteries.


----------



## zombie10k




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20539936
> 
> 
> Did you see this? I happen to be using an old LG phone charger to charge my glasses. This guy tried an old blackberry charger and his glasses work now.
> 
> http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post20213580



I use the 3D vision glasses with my RS50 use a blackberry charger. Seems to work ok, I haven't had much luck getting them to last off the PC USB charging.


I thought I was the only one having charging issues. it's a shame they don't use the same coin battery as the Xpand 103's, it would be easier. Where can we get batteries once these are cooked?


----------



## SgtVideo

Not sure how much this will help because some of us still experience inconsistent status results on battery charging. Here's a change in their battery status check documentation forwarded to VIP:

*"We found an error in our documentation. When fully charged, three long LED blinks will be observed instead of two.


The battery charge indicator is observed after the initial power on LED blink.


Blink activity after power-on blink Battery Charge State


Three long blinks after initial power on LED blink Battery is 50% or


more charged, 20 hours or more remaining.


Six medium blinks after initial power on LED blink Battery is 10% or


more charged, 4 hours or more remaining


Twelve fast blinks after initial power on LED blink Battery charge is


less than 10% or less, risk of glasses needing to be wired to charger before end of a long movie or double feature


Power on indicator never occurs Battery is so discharged that glasses need


to be charged before further operation."*


----------



## Brian Hampton

I will order the displayer with RF glasses soon. I am concerned of course about a lot of possible problems.


Does my pj have the frame lock problem?? I have no way to know without trying it.

Will the flicker bother me?? I don't think so

Will the image be too dim? Most likely but I have no other choice for 3D with my current pj.

And now... Is there any way to charge the glasses?


Someone should post a good review of the Displayer.


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20550649
> 
> 
> I will order the displayer with RF glasses soon. I am concerned of course about a lot of possible problems.
> 
> 
> Does my pj have the frame lock problem?? I have no way to know without trying it.
> 
> Will the flicker bother me?? I don't think so
> 
> Will the image be too dim? Most likely but I have no other choice for 3D with my current pj.
> 
> And now... Is there any way to charge the glasses?
> 
> 
> Someone should post a good review of the Displayer.
> 
> 
> -Brian



What brand projector are you using?


I didn't mind the 60hz flicker and finding the balance point on duty cycle relative to brightness may produce the tolerable medium.


Since I don't have a 120hz capable unit I can't make mention if there is discernible flicker at that frequency.


I used the Displayer on the Panasonic AE4000 with a Carada 88"/2.35 screen at 1.3g and I was fine with the brightness levels. Running it also on a Da-Lite High Power 92"/1.78/2.3g even better at Eco lamp mode for both. My Samsung LED DLP rear projection was equally happy. I'm satisfied that I accomplished what I hoped with this conversion for both displays.


If you are running a much larger screen and don't mind shrinking it some just for 3D you could gain back some FL for brighter image.


After tuning the RF glasses it is really only the bright white scenes that might be an annoyance but brief lived at least to my 63 year old eyes.


As far as the battery charging issue there are mixed results and we really don't know how many in the overall market are not having the charge problem.


I've emailed Jonathan about a possible battery substitution that may have taken place in production in that maybe Li-Ion was replaced by Li-Poly at some point. If Li-Ion was the original design then maybe Li-Po is not compatible with the current design. That is pure conjecture on my part until confirmed. Be assured he is in communication with Bit Cauldron on this subject.


In any event please repost your projector model I'm just too lazy today to go thread hunting if you've mentioned it in the past.


G'day


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20553365
> 
> 
> What brand projector are you using?
> 
> 
> I didn't mind the 60hz flicker and finding the balance point on duty cycle relative to brightness may produce the tolerable medium.
> 
> 
> Since I don't have a 120hz capable unit I can't make mention if there is discernible flicker at that frequency.
> 
> 
> I used the Displayer on the Panasonic AE4000 with a Carada 88"/2.35 screen at 1.3g and I was fine with the brightness levels. Running it also on a Da-Lite High Power 92"/1.78/2.3g even better at Eco lamp mode for both. My Samsung LED DLP rear projection was equally happy. I'm satisfied that I accomplished what I hoped with this conversion for both displays.
> 
> 
> If you are running a much larger screen and don't mind shrinking it some just for 3D you could gain back some FL for brighter image.
> 
> 
> After tuning the RF glasses it is really only the bright white scenes that might be an annoyance but brief lived at least to my 63 year old eyes.
> 
> 
> As far as the battery charging issue there are mixed results and we really don't know how many in the overall market are not having the charge problem.
> 
> 
> I've emailed Jonathan about a possible battery substitution that may have taken place in production in that maybe Li-Ion was replaced by Li-Poly at some point. If Li-Ion was the original design then maybe Li-Po is not compatible with the current design. That is pure conjecture on my part until confirmed. Be assured he is in communication with Bit Cauldron on this subject.
> 
> 
> In any event please repost your projector model I'm just too lazy today to go thread hunting if you've mentioned it in the past.
> 
> 
> G'day



The charge curves are the same for both. Where they might deviate is at the voltage top offpoint which could vary where the battery is charged as constant voltage but charge current is monitored and used as a termination

value once it drops to a low level. A LI ion rated voltage is 3.6 and the battery used is 3.7 so they are close. If this is not done correctly the recharge will be inadequate. I'm going to monitor a charge cycle when I get a chance since Bit Cauldron won't share how they are doing the charging.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20550649
> 
> 
> I will order the displayer with RF glasses soon. I am concerned of course about a lot of possible problems.
> 
> 
> Does my pj have the frame lock problem?? I have no way to know without trying it.
> 
> Will the flicker bother me?? I don't think so
> 
> Will the image be too dim? Most likely but I have no other choice for 3D with my current pj.
> 
> And now... Is there any way to charge the glasses?
> 
> 
> Someone should post a good review of the Displayer.
> 
> 
> -Brian



Hi Brian,


I stopped by CurtPalme site and saw that you mentioned your projector is a Sony VPL-VW60.


Looked at the specs on ProjectorCentral. They don't show the V-Sync range but I'm guessing that probably tops out at 85hz which would be fine for 60Hz. Does support 1080P/60.


My concern would be since the unit is rated 900 Lumens using a screen size of 82"/1.0g as an example the image brightness is 16 FL at 10.5'. It indeed may be too dim as you stated.


Whether frame lock would also be a problem is an unknown for now. I'd review this with Jonathan before ordering to avoid any disappointment. Wish

I could offer a better response.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Yeah,... I do have an 82 inch 1.0 gain screen.


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo

Well I tried to watch Resident Evil tonight, had to retune glasses since I had them set for projector and was going to use them on a Samsung DLP. While retuning the pair I was wearing had shutter failure on the right eye, the pair the wife was wearing were functioning normally but she did see a glitch before mine crapped out.


Charged both during the day if that means anything.


Oh well, down to one set of glasses for now..Sheesh!


MTBF is 2.5 hours for this set.


Will take out the battery today and allow the glasses to go completely dead and reinstall it. Hopefully whatever caused the lockup on the right side will clear. Only thing I can think of for now to clear this glitch. When installing a battery that has been removed the glasses do give 3 blinks when it is attached, so they are never really completely off.


----------



## mkoss

Last night I was able to use the glasses without plugging in. Although the night before I had to. When I hit the power button I got no indicator at all. But tried them and once the movie started they worked. Sorry to hear about failures which makes me worry. At best inconsistent in holding a charge/charging properly. Has me in a quandry as to heading down the path of a polarity rotator and passive glasses with theses failures of active glasses.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20555092
> 
> 
> Last night I was able to use the glasses without plugging in. Although the night before I had to. When I hit the power button I got no indicator at all. But tried them and once the movie started they worked. Sorry to hear about failures which makes me worry. At best inconsistent in holding a charge/charging properly. Has me in a quandry as to heading down the path of a polarity rotator and passive glasses with theses failures of active glasses.



I received an email today from [email protected] that they are sending me a new pair out Monday.


As early adopters I think we will see refinements that will appear from those of us who report and work with them on these issues. Our feedback is being forwarded to Bit Cauldron.


Even though somewhat inconvenient they are putting forth a good faith effort to make things right.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20518927
> 
> 
> I am happy to report successful testing of firmware version 1.3.
> 
> 
> Unfortunately the file size exceeds the 500k limit for uploading to this forum.
> 
> PM me which version (Displayer/Theater) you need and I will send them to you direct from my email account.
> 
> 
> I also recommend you copy & paste the instructions from this thread to perform the upgrade.
> 
> 
> A couple problems I encountered and they were on MY end, was a setting in the Sony BD player was preventing 5.1 to the AVR. In my case I discovered in the audio setting "BD audio Mix setting ON", don't know why that was enabled but after setting it to OFF all was fine. So if you run across a multichannel problem...check those settings!
> 
> 
> Also, as mentioned in Jonathan's instructions below, you may notice facial discolorations, adjust Duty Cycle settings to clean those up. I initially had 1.5 bars and increase to 2.5 bars and got normal facial color on the Samsung DLP.
> 
> 
> Another interesting thing is my display is reporting that I'm receiving 1080p/24/3D. In my Tron 3D the preview scenes like from Pirates of the Carribbean show up 720/60 but the main movie changes to 1080P/24. Let us know if you get the same results.
> 
> *INSTRUCTIONS:*
> 
> From Jonathan,
> 
> 
> Gents,
> 
> 
> One of you was successfully able to upgrade the firmware on the Displayer and get 5.1 Audio support. You may notice a discolouration in the image after having re-booted the system. This only means that you will need to adjust the duty cycle on the RF glasses to the new settings. You might have to increase the bar from 1 - 1.5 to 2.5 or so! I have included this in the instructions below.
> 
> 
> 
> HENCE, THE ABOVE IS GOOD TO GO! DO PLEASE MAKE SURE THAT THE INSTRUCTIONS CONTAINED BELOW ARE FORWARDED ALONG, WHEN YOU DO DISTRIBUTE IT AROUND.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for your cooperation and all the best.
> 
> 
> I am providing you with the following zip files:
> 
> 
> 1- 3DDisplayer_upgrade_VER13_BETA
> 
> 
> 2- 3DTheatre_upgrade_VER13_BETA
> 
> 
> 3- VIP DRIVER
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please note that the Displayer upgrade is for 3D-Displayer and Theatre is for 3D-Theatre. The same Driver (3rd attachment) will function for both upgrades.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do please remove any/all previous VIP firmware upgrade files from your computer to avoid confusion. THIS IS A BETA VERSION and your support in confirming its proper functionality is appreciated before making it public.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CAUTION:
> 
> 
> 1- Do not unplug the converter while you are in the process of upgrading your firmware.
> 
> 
> 2- Do not install Displayer firmware on 3D-Theatre or vice versa. The results may corrupt the whole firmware.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In order to install the new firmware to upgrade your converter to support 5.1 AUDIO format, please follow the said steps:
> 
> 
> 1- Extract VIP DRIVER and save contents to a VIP DRIVER FOLDER on your computer
> 
> 
> 2- Extract 3D Theatre or 3D Displayer and save contents to a 3D THEATRE or 3D DISPLAYER FOLDER on your computer
> 
> 
> 3- Install VIP DRIVER file by executing USBXpressInstaler
> 
> 
> 4- Connect your converter box to the computer via a USB cable
> 
> 
> 5- Make sure the POWER light goes on
> 
> 
> 6- Go to 3D THEATRE or 3D DISPLAYER folder and execute the VIP_Theatre_unreleased _V13_BETA_.exe or VIP_Displayer_unreleased_V13_BETA_.exe
> 
> 
> 7- You will then be asked to confirm update. Hit OK
> 
> 
> 8- Update shall commence and at the end you will receive a message that the update was successfully loaded.
> 
> 
> 9- Your new version should be 1.3
> 
> 
> You are now ready to remove the converter and plug it to your setup to test 5.1 AUDIO support.
> 
> 
> Do please make sure you turn your player off and restart the whole system.
> 
> 
> Do please go to your player audio menu and reset it to HDMI - AUTOMATIC and you should see the following:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AUDIO OUTPUT FORMATS:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1- Dolby Digital 5.1 ch
> 
> 
> 2- DTS 5.1 ch
> 
> 
> 3- AAC
> 
> 
> 4- Stereo 2 ch 44.1 KHz
> 
> 
> 5- Stereo 2 ch 88.2 KHz
> 
> 
> 6- Stereo 2 ch 176.4 KHz
> 
> 
> 7- Sterio 2 ch 48 KHz
> 
> 
> 
> You may notice a discolouration in the image. If you do, please readjust the duty cycle on your glasses to get the correct colouration. As a hint, if you were running it around 1 - 1.5 bars, you may have to now increase it to 2.5 bars.
> 
> 
> 
> If you are successful (as we have been) in upgrading and testing with the said results, you may post it for others to access and upgrade. Do please make sure that the entire email with instructions and cautions is listed to avoid undesired outcomes. Any questions, please email me.
> 
> 
> 
> All the best and cheers!





i performed this firmware update to version 1.3. it appears to have been loaded successfully as I got the exact message "successfully load image"


I then entered the sound settings on the playstation 3, and ran the automatic audio detect feature. It displayed the following audio modes:


1- Dolby Digital 5.1 ch


2- DTS 5.1 ch


3- AAC


4- Linear PCM 2 ch 44.1 KHz


5- Linear PCM 2 ch 88.2 KHz


6- Linear PCM 2 ch 176.4 KHz


7- Linear PCM 2 ch 48 KHz




BUT when i go to play a movie, im only getting sound out of the left and right speakers, nothing from the centre or surrounds. the PS3 says it is outputting 5.1 PCM but only gettin stereo sound from speakers. Tried changing audio track to 5.1 dobly or 5.1 DTS using various DVD's and blu ray that have these tracks, but still nothing. By the way this is for normal blu rays and DVD's, not even 3D blu ray's.


I dont think this firmware update is working at all.

Just to test my setup, i ran my PS3 direct to the receiver (removing the VIP), re-ran the audio setup on the PS3 and it then listed linear 5.1 PCM at various frequencies, linear 7.1 PCM at various frequencies as well as the modes listed above.


Played some test discs and im definitely getting audio from all 5 speakers. Nothing wrong with my PS3, speakers or receiver.


The VIP is only passing audio to the left and right speakers. Nothing has been fixed at all in my case, even though the PS3 now lists DTS 5.1 and dolby 5.1.


Also even if this was working the way it should, i thought the firmware was meant to allow 5.1 PCM audio so we can utilise DTS HD MA and Dolby TRUE HD tracks? whats the point of the firmware if it's only limited to the lossy 5.1 audio?


Can someone please forward this ifo to Jonathan seeign that I can never get in contact with him. still waiting on reply about my RF glasses battery issues.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Still sounds like it could be a settings problem with your AVR.


If you go back and test with the VIP and then remove it and do not re-configure the PS3 or change any settings then maybe you could determine what's happening.


-Brian


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20558887
> 
> 
> Still sounds like it could be a settings problem with your AVR.
> 
> 
> If you go back and test with the VIP and then remove it and do not re-configure the PS3 or change any settings then maybe you could determine what's happening.
> 
> 
> -Brian




Im a bit confused. Prior the firmware update, was the vip passing through the audio unchanged for 2d blu rays?, was the vip stereo output issue only for 3d blu rays, but not for normal 2d blu rays?


Anyways If i remove the vip and not re-configure the audio settings, i have the same problem as with the vip being in the sequence -getting stereo only sound. Rerunning the ps3 audio settings will fix it after it detects 5.1 pcm


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20558689
> 
> 
> i performed this firmware update to version 1.3. it appears to have been loaded successfully as I got the exact message "successfully load image"
> 
> 
> I then entered the sound settings on the playstation 3, and ran the automatic audio detect feature. It displayed the following audio modes:
> 
> 
> 1- Dolby Digital 5.1 ch
> 
> 
> 2- DTS 5.1 ch
> 
> 
> 3- AAC
> 
> 
> 4- Linear PCM 2 ch 44.1 KHz
> 
> 
> 5- Linear PCM 2 ch 88.2 KHz
> 
> 
> 6- Linear PCM 2 ch 176.4 KHz
> 
> 
> 7- Linear PCM 2 ch 48 KHz
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BUT when i go to play a movie, im only getting sound out of the left and right speakers, nothing from the centre or surrounds. the PS3 says it is outputting 5.1 PCM but only gettin stereo sound from speakers. Tried changing audio track to 5.1 dobly or 5.1 DTS using various DVD's and blu ray that have these tracks, but still nothing. By the way this is for normal blu rays and DVD's, not even 3D blu ray's.
> 
> 
> I dont think this firmware update is working at all.
> 
> Just to test my setup, i ran my PS3 direct to the receiver (removing the VIP), re-ran the audio setup on the PS3 and it then listed linear 5.1 PCM at various frequencies, linear 7.1 PCM at various frequencies as well as the modes listed above.
> 
> 
> Played some test discs and im definitely getting audio from all 5 speakers. Nothing wrong with my PS3, speakers or receiver.
> 
> 
> The VIP is only passing audio to the left and right speakers. Nothing has been fixed at all in my case, even though the PS3 now lists DTS 5.1 and dolby 5.1.
> 
> 
> Also even if this was working the way it should, i thought the firmware was meant to allow 5.1 PCM audio so we can utilise DTS HD MA and Dolby TRUE HD tracks? whats the point of the firmware if it's only limited to the lossy 5.1 audio?
> 
> 
> Can someone please forward this ifo to Jonathan seeign that I can never get in contact with him. still waiting on reply about my RF glasses battery issues.




I've never been a PS3 owner so can't help in regards to the vagaries of that setup. But I know this firmware upgrade works, at least for 5.1. But I went ahead and installed it after my AVR because I just expanded it to 7.1. Hopefully some other PS3 owners can chime in on this.


Now initially I thought it wasn't working until I found a setting in the Sony Blu-Ray audio settings that inhibit it to 2-channel.


Well you've already tried placing the PS3 before your AVR, so you've answered one question I had.


Did you also try setting the PS3 to output Bitstream instead of PCM over HDMI?


So what is your AVR reporting on it's display when the PS3 says it is outputing 5.1 when playing the movie with VIP installed?


If you have no luck with it today send an email of what you just posted to:

[email protected] 


I managed to get someone there unexpectedly Saturday and got a response on my glasses issue.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20558987
> 
> 
> Im a bit confused. Prior the firmware update, was the vip passing through the audio unchanged for 2d blu rays?, was the vip stereo output issue only for 3d blu rays, but not for normal 2d blu rays?
> 
> 
> Anyways If i remove the vip and not re-configure the audio settings, i have the same problem as with the vip being in the sequence -getting stereo only sound. Rerunning the ps3 audio settings will fix it after it detects 5.1 pcm



Prior to firmware upgrade which was v1.0, the firmware only allowed 2-channel stereo out and this was only noticeable if you installed the VIP between your playback device and AVR.


The firmware upgrade v1.3 only enabled 5.1 multichannel, because of current memory limitation 7.1 is not available on the current models.


There are a lot of threads in the PS3 section with owners having confusion getting their audio right, so you might want to revisit that area and maybe make a discovery you aren't aware of.


----------



## SgtVideo

Originally Posted by *darockk*

i performed this firmware update to version 1.3. it appears to have been loaded successfully as I got the exact message "successfully load image"


I then entered the sound settings on the playstation 3, and ran the automatic audio detect feature. It displayed the following audio modes:


1- Dolby Digital 5.1 ch


2- DTS 5.1 ch


3- AAC


4- Linear PCM 2 ch 44.1 KHz


5- Linear PCM 2 ch 88.2 KHz


6- Linear PCM 2 ch 176.4 KHz


7- Linear PCM 2 ch 48 KHz



Another thing I'd like to see you try darockk, if you haven't been successful as yet, is to go into the PS3 audio settings and "uncheck" all those 2 channel references in 4-7 and retest. Basically your disabling 2 channel on the PS3, so now maybe it will default to 5.1.


----------



## mkoss

I had a chance to look a little at the battery charging yesterday. Measured no charge on initial measurement. Plugged in and took about a half hour to complete charging. Measured termination voltage of 3.68 VDC. Used for couple hours last night with no issue with having to plug in. Looked briefly at circuit board but didn't spend a lot of time with it. Did notice a small buck regulator on board probably associated with charging as well circuit operation. The battery pack is on the right ear piece with the circuit board on the left ear piece. Connected with a 2 wire flex circuit which didn't have Kelvin connections for monitoring the battery voltage. Need to look closer but didn't think they were monitoring battery charge current. Looked today at battery voltage. Dropped to 3.61 volts which says it was holding a charge.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20559928
> 
> 
> I had a chance to look a little at the battery charging yesterday. Measured no charge on initial measurement. Plugged in and took about a half hour to complete charging. Measured termination voltage of 3.68 VDC. Used for couple hours last night with no issue with having to plug in. Looked briefly at circuit board but didn't spend a lot of time with it. Did notice a small buck regulator on board probably associated with charging as well circuit operation. The battery pack is on the right ear piece with the circuit board on the left ear piece. Connected with a 2 wire flex circuit which didn't have Kelvin connections for monitoring the battery voltage. Need to look closer but didn't think they were monitoring battery charge current. Looked today at battery voltage. Dropped to 3.61 volts which says it was holding a charge.



Are you saying the battery went from 0V state of charge to 3.68V SOC in 30 minutes?


Your 3.61-3.68 puts in pretty close to 100%.


Definitely beats my 2.94V in 20+ hours which is about 80% SOC. I haven't tried measuring my second pair.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20559047
> 
> 
> I've never been a PS3 owner so can't help in regards to the vagaries of that setup. But I know this firmware upgrade works, at least for 5.1. But I went ahead and installed it after my AVR because I just expanded it to 7.1. Hopefully some other PS3 owners can chime in on this.
> 
> 
> Now initially I thought it wasn't working until I found a setting in the Sony Blu-Ray audio settings that inhibit it to 2-channel.
> 
> 
> Well you've already tried placing the PS3 before your AVR, so you've answered one question I had.
> 
> 
> Did you also try setting the PS3 to output Bitstream instead of PCM over HDMI?
> 
> 
> So what is your AVR reporting on it's display when the PS3 says it is outputing 5.1 when playing the movie with VIP installed?
> 
> 
> If you have no luck with it today send an email of what you just posted to:
> 
> [email protected]
> 
> 
> I managed to get someone there unexpectedly Saturday and got a response on my glasses issue.




Ive got an old FAT PS3 so cannot output bitstream.


I must admit im not too familiar with setting the modes on the receiver and how it all works.


My pioneer vsx 919 simply says "PURE DIRECT" on the display, and then changes to "PCM DIRECT" when it detects the audio input from the ps3. Thats what ive always left the setting on. Now that I think of it, it did only say 'STEREO' prior to the 1.3 firmware update. So it has changed something for sure.


Even though im only getting audio from 2 speakers, i can hear the sound difference when i switch between lossy 5.1 audio to lossless HD audio tracks.


So this means im getting 2 channel PCM, becasue that is the highest possible PCM that the PS3 lists when I run the auto detect wizard, is this correct?


So is the PS3 supposed to list 5 channel PCM for me to get this to work on the old PS3? It is listing pretty much the exact same audios that are listed in the VIP firmware update instructions.(except it says 2 channel PCM instead of 2 channel stereo) Sadly, the VIP firmware doesnt make the PS3 list any 5.1 PCM


I think i will have to put the VIP after the receiver and see how i go.


thanks very much for the replies


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20560256
> 
> 
> Are you saying the battery went from 0V state of charge to 3.68V SOC in 30 minutes?
> 
> 
> Your 3.61-3.68 puts in pretty close to 100%.
> 
> 
> Definitely beats my 2.94V in 20+ hours which is about 80% SOC. I haven't tried measuring my second pair.



I was surprised it charged this fast but if their only monitoring voltage and not current and are not using a current regulation mode it's conceivable it took a charge this fast but certainly not what should be done. Knowing what I know now the next charge cycle I will monitor more closely. I will also take a closer look at the charging circuit. Were you checking it at all during charging?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20560472
> 
> 
> I was surprised it charged this fast but if their only monitoring voltage and not current and are not using a current regulation mode it's conceivable it took a charge this fast but certainly not what should be done. Knowing what I know now the next charge cycle I will monitor more closely. I will also take a closer look at the charging circuit. Were you checking it at all during charging?



No I didn't. I just measured that one at the end of 20+ hours. When my replacement pair of glasses arrive I will measure that battery before/after.

My measurements were made with battery out of circuit. It's a little difficult getting probes on those little connectors for me.


We might be spinning our wheels anyway as VIP is making some revisions or recommendations to Bit Cauldron on the charging problem and status method of reporting. One of the recommendations posted in this forum regarding just having the LED change color on charge complete, instead of the confusing blink crap is on the table to my understanding.


I still haven't received an answer whether the Li-Po battery was a later substitution in production runs. That statement from their Rep made me wonder about that.


----------



## darockk

update on the PS3 mulitchannel audio issues,


If i place the VIP AFTER the receiver, the 5 channel PCM audio is passed through fine, so everything seems to work for *2D* blu rays -


HOWEVER I cannot seem to get a 3D blu ray to work properly when placing the VIP in this sequence (PS3 > AVR > VIP > Projector)


As soon as dsc loads to the 3D signal being sent, the screen just goes blank.


Cloudy with a chance of meatballs 3D loads fine and i can play the 2d version fine with 5 channel PCM, but as soon as i select the 3D verison, the screen just goes loses signal (VIP signal LED turns off) and i have to restart the PS3.


back to square one it seems, have to put sequence back to PS3 > VIP > RECEIVER > Projector in order to at least watch 3D albeit with only 2 channel audio.


Currently have my AVR set to PRO LOGIC mode so i can get audio from 5 channels, but i assume this is not the native 5 channel track rather than a converted 2 channel track?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20560391
> 
> 
> Ive got an old FAT PS3 so cannot output bitstream.
> 
> 
> I must admit im not too familiar with setting the modes on the receiver and how it all works.
> 
> 
> My pioneer vsx 919 simply says "PURE DIRECT" on the display, and then changes to "PCM DIRECT" when it detects the audio input from the ps3. Thats what ive always left the setting on. Now that I think of it, it did only say 'STEREO' prior to the 1.3 firmware update. So it has changed something for sure.
> 
> 
> Even though im only getting audio from 2 speakers, i can hear the sound difference when i switch between lossy 5.1 audio to lossless HD audio tracks.
> 
> 
> So this means im getting 2 channel PCM, becasue that is the highest possible PCM that the PS3 lists when I run the auto detect wizard, is this correct?
> 
> 
> So is the PS3 supposed to list 5 channel PCM for me to get this to work on the old PS3? It is listing pretty much the exact same audios that are listed in the VIP firmware update instructions.(except it says 2 channel PCM instead of 2 channel stereo) Sadly, the VIP firmware doesnt make the PS3 list any 5.1 PCM
> 
> 
> I think i will have to put the VIP after the receiver and see how i go.
> 
> 
> thanks very much for the replies




"So this means im getting 2 channel PCM, becasue that is the highest possible PCM that the PS3 lists when I run the auto detect wizard, is this correct?"


I believe one of your earlier posts you showed 5.1 in as item #1 in the listing.



If you can get bitstream working on the PS3 it should pass the unprocessed audio through the VIP on to the AVR for proper decoding.



According to PS3s online manual there is a "bitstream" setting.

*BD / DVD Audio Output Format (HDMI)*

Set the audio output format to use when playing a BD or DVD containing audio recorded in Dolby Digital or DTS format. This setting is used when an audio output device is connected to the system via an HDMI cable.


Bitstream Set to output audio with the original digital signal prioritized.

Linear PCM Set to output audio by converting the digital signal to Linear PCM format.


Hint

If [Bitstream] is selected, some portions of the audio content may not be output.

*If optical output is used:

BD Audio Output Format (Optical Digital)*

Set the audio output format to use when playing a BD containing audio recorded in Dolby Digital or DTS format. This setting is used when an audio output device is connected to the system via a digital optical cable.


Bitstream (Direct) Set to output audio with the original digital signal prioritized.

Bitstream (Mix) Set to output audio that has been mixed with sound effects such as button sounds and then converted to bitstream format.

Linear PCM Set to output audio by converting the digital signal to Linear PCM format.


Hints

If [Bitstream (Direct)] is selected, some portions of the audio content may not be output.

If [Bitstream (Mix)] is selected, audio will be output in Bitstream (Direct) while Blu-ray 3D content is being played.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20561897
> 
> 
> update on the PS3 mulitchannel audio issues,
> 
> 
> If i place the VIP AFTER the receiver, the 5 channel PCM audio is passed through fine, so everything seems to work for *2D* blu rays -
> 
> 
> HOWEVER I cannot seem to get a 3D blu ray to work properly when placing the VIP in this sequence (PS3 > AVR > VIP > Projector)
> 
> 
> As soon as dsc loads to the 3D signal being sent, the screen just goes blank.
> 
> 
> Cloudy with a chance of meatballs 3D loads fine and i can play the 2d version fine with 5 channel PCM, but as soon as i select the 3D verison, the screen just goes loses signal (VIP signal LED turns off) and i have to restart the PS3.
> 
> 
> back to square one it seems, have to put sequence back to PS3 > VIP > RECEIVER > Projector in order to at least watch 3D albeit with only 2 channel audio.
> 
> 
> Currently have my AVR set to PRO LOGIC mode so i can get audio from 5 channels, but i assume this is not the native 5 channel track rather than a converted 2 channel track?



The PS3 doesn't support multichannel PCM output while in 3D mode!


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20562049
> 
> 
> "So this means im getting 2 channel PCM, becasue that is the highest possible PCM that the PS3 lists when I run the auto detect wizard, is this correct?"
> 
> 
> I believe one of your earlier posts you showed 5.1 in as item #1 in the listing.
> 
> 
> 
> If you can get bitstream working on the PS3 it should pass the unprocessed audio through the VIP on to the AVR for proper decoding.
> 
> 
> 
> According to PS3s online manual there is a "bitstream"





thanks, i forgot about testing the PS3 bitstream function. - Looks like this method works okay for 3d movies and really seems like the only way to get 5.1 Audio through the vip. My reciever says "dts" on it while doing it this method.


However i dont want to use the lossy 5.1 track when viewing 2d movies. Remember, my fat ps3 doesnt bitstream *hd* audio, only the lossy audios. So does this mean i have no way to watch 2d movies with lossless audio, because it seems the vip doesnt support 5 channel pcm? I'd have to disconnect the vip each time i want pcm audio because thats the only way to get hd audio from my ps3.


----------



## darockk




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20562055
> 
> 
> The PS3 doesn't support multichannel PCM output while in 3D mode!



I am aware of that, but i didnt think that would cause the picture to lose signal and lock up. Isnt the ps3 supposed to send through the core lossy track instead when viewing 3d movies? I suppose i will have to test by changing output to bitstream before selecting the 3d version and see if it works.


If i can get this to work, i wont have to worry about the other problems ive been having when puttig the vip between the ps3 and avr.



edit: the reason why the signal is lost when playing 3D movies is because the VIP has to be connected directly after the PS3 when using this non 3D AVR.


----------



## darockk

VIP website looks to be updated, you can now see all their great products through their website!


----------



## SgtVideo

This technique allows you to change polarity using "Duty Cycle".


You can change the polarity via the Dongle on the transmitter. When you are in the Duty Cycle (UP & DOWN red lights)... imagine that the five lights are split in two equal halves of L and R. When you go left of the 2.5 settings with the RED lights, you are now configuring a different polarity than if you are extending the red lights to the right beyond the middle point.


Remember you are working with RED lights that change with UP and DOWN movement on the dongle!




*L C R*


Depending on where you find your best picture setting, you can always find the same setting either to the left of the centre or the right of the centre (c) with the correct polarity. This is the easist and the fastest way to change the polarity without having to go through the utility or without having to find the Midas touch on the dongle to get the centre push right.


----------



## Slump Buster

I was researching this topic heavily a few months back when I was on the fence trying to decide if I wanted a 3d-ready 720p projector or a high-quality 1080p projector. I went with the latter (a Benq w6000) figuring that I could always buy an adapter later if I wanted to go 3d.


So here I am considering such an adapter. Is this still the only adapter available for displays that are not 3d-ready? I've been skimming through this thread and it seems as though people are having positive experiences with the VIP line but there is a part of me that is leery of buying several sets of glasses that will only work with this product line. My main content source are blu rays from my ps3 (both streamed over the network from my server and played directly on the ps3).


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Slump Buster* 
I was researching this topic heavily a few months back when I was on the fence trying to decide if I wanted a 3d-ready 720p projector or a high-quality 1080p projector. I went with the latter (a Benq w6000) figuring that I could always buy an adapter later if I wanted to go 3d.


So here I am considering such an adapter. Is this still the only adapter available for displays that are not 3d-ready? I've been skimming through this thread and it seems as though people are having positive experiences with the VIP line but there is a part of me that is leery of buying several sets of glasses that will only work with this product line. My main content source are blu rays from my ps3 (both streamed over the network from my server and played directly on the ps3).
The problem is your projector can only work with 60Hz or 30Hz per eye so the only glasses that work at 60Hz are the VIP IR glasses and the VIP or Monster Vision RF glasses. The RF glasses are best for 60Hz operation because you can adjust them. These glasses can be used later with 120Hz setups too.


----------



## Slump Buster

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Ronomy* 
The problem is your projector can only work with 60Hz or 30Hz per eye so the only glasses that work at 60Hz are the VIP IR glasses and the VIP or Monster Vision RF glasses. The RF glasses are best for 60Hz operation because you can adjust them. These glasses can be used later with 120Hz setups too.


Thanks a ton for the response. I did not know that the VIP glasses are rebranded Monster RF. Are they the exactly the same thing? I'm assuming that I wouldn't need anything else besides either set of glasses and the displayer in my setup? I took a trip out to their new site and it looks fairly straight-forward.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Yes the rf glasses are thought to be the best and they are the same as monster vision 3D glasses. They aren't restricted to the VIP products. You could use them with whatever your next display is.


Edit - if you buy them from monster you get an IR receiver which may be needed if you went to another display and discontinued using the VIP gear.


----------



## Slump Buster

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* 
Yes the rf glasses are thought to be the best and they are the same as monster vision 3D glasses. They aren't restricted to the VIP products. You could use them with whatever your next display is.


Edit - if you buy them from monster you get an IR receiver which may be needed if you went to another display and discontinued using the VIP gear.


Ok, so if I am following you on this there is no difference between the VIP and Monster glasses except for the rf receiver that comes with the latter. Can you give me an example of a scenario where I would use this receiver down the road? Maybe if I bought a 3d-ready display?


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Slump Buster* 
Thanks a ton for the response. I did not know that the VIP glasses are rebranded Monster RF. Are they the exactly the same thing? I'm assuming that I wouldn't need anything else besides either set of glasses and the displayer in my setup? I took a trip out to their new site and it looks fairly straight-forward.
The RF glasses are both made by Bit Cauldron. Monster doesn't make them.


----------



## Brian Hampton

If you buy from monster you get a ir receiver.


So, later if you bought a "real" 3dtv that sends out ir the included ir receiver could be handy.


Edit keep in mind the Theater product from VIP gives you more compatibility. The Displayer is perfect for me because I only want 3d Blu (games compatibility is a bonus)


----------



## Slump Buster

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* 
If you buy from monster you get a ir receiver.


So, later if you bought a "real" 3dtv that sends out ir the included ir receiver could be handy.


Edit keep in mind the Theater product from VIP gives you more compatibility. The Displayer is perfect for me because I only want 3d Blu (games compatibility is a bonus)
Thanks again for the replies. Yeah, I was on the fence about which unit to buy because I also have directv and they are starting to ramp up their 3d offerings (although that isn't saying much). I guess for another $100 it might be worth it.


I'll probably bite on this package within the next week or two (Unless someone thinks that the price might dip in the near future).


----------



## Brian Hampton

Well the theater is $200 more than the Displayer.


I don't watch broadcast or internet videos so I am very happy the Displayer is a perfect fit for my use.


----------



## speedytweedy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> Well the theater is $200 more than the Displayer.
> 
> 
> I don't watch broadcast or internet videos so I am very happy the Displayer is a perfect fit for my use.



at the end of the day it is down to user preference.

www.aaron.tweed.talktalk.net


----------



## Brian Hampton

Or buying the hardware that suits your use.


(At least that's how it works for me.)


I guess the Theater would keep higher re-sale value which could be a consideration for some.


-Brian


----------



## darockk

has anyone tried loading the THEATRE 1.3 firmware update onto a DISPLAYER unit?


hoping to get the side by side / cable / sat 3D capability for free


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20580607
> 
> 
> has anyone tried loading the THEATRE 1.3 firmware update onto a DISPLAYER unit?
> 
> 
> hoping to get the side by side / cable / sat 3D capability for free



I suppose you only risk breaking it and winding up with nothing.


I won't try it if only because I don't watch those formats.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20580607
> 
> 
> has anyone tried loading the THEATRE 1.3 firmware update onto a DISPLAYER unit?
> 
> 
> hoping to get the side by side / cable / sat 3D capability for free



They already warned about that in the instructions, different chipsets, so if you want to blow your firmware be prepared to accept the risk.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Slump Buster* /forum/post/20578354
> 
> 
> Thanks again for the replies. Yeah, I was on the fence about which unit to buy because I also have directv and they are starting to ramp up their 3d offerings (although that isn't saying much). I guess for another $100 it might be worth it.
> 
> 
> I'll probably bite on this package within the next week or two (Unless someone thinks that the price might dip in the near future).



I doubt it, the next release will be Theater+, so whatever enhancements get finalized probably won't translate into a price reduction at this point in time.


If your looking for a price reduction on the current models, there are a few members on here that have stated their desire to sell their current units.


----------



## Slump Buster

Quote:

Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* 
If your looking for a price reduction on the current models, there are a few members on here that have stated their desire to sell their current units.
Ah, thanks, that is a good idea. I took a quick look on an auction site and only saw a gamer. I didn't think to look at the classifieds here.


I'm leaning towards getting a pair of the monster glasses and an rf receiver. Is there a specific model that works with the unit?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Slump Buster* /forum/post/20582226
> 
> 
> Ah, thanks, that is a good idea. I took a quick look on an auction site and only saw a gamer. I didn't think to look at the classifieds here.
> 
> 
> I'm leaning towards getting a pair of the monster glasses and an rf receiver. Is there a specific model that works with the unit?



They weren't posted in the classifieds here, just a few threads in the Displayer/Theater thread groups. You might have to scroll backwards to find them.


If you get the rebranded VIP units from Curt Palme, Consignia and VIP they are the Monstervision glasses/transmitter made by Bit Cauldron. Just remember the VIP versions are cheaper because the IR sensor is not included.


The IR sensor may or may not be included in the Monstervision package depending which vendor you purchase it from. If that is a necessity verify that before purchasing. I've noticed some sites aren't mentioning it in the package.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I pay extra for anything without the MONSTER brand on it.










I got the displayer today with RF glasses. Ordered directly from the 3D-Vip website.


I'm like a fish out of water with the hardware but I'm quickly figuring it all out.


So far I'm in love. My projector (and 82" screen) could not do 3D anything yesterday apart from anaglyph. Suddenly...3D is coming at ya. And ... I'm going to throw out all the anaglyph glasses in the house, I don't ever want to use those again.


And,... I see no color shift though the RF Glasses kit. I guess there is one through the glasses but it's not noticeable.


I'm in love... I hoped a product like this would come along.


=Brian


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20583119
> 
> 
> I pay extra for anything without the MONSTER brand on it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got the displayer today with RF glasses. Ordered directly from the 3D-Vip website.
> 
> 
> I'm like a fish out of water with the hardware but I'm quickly figuring it all out.
> 
> 
> So far I'm in love. My projector (and 82" screen) could not do 3D anything yesterday apart from anaglyph. Suddenly...3D is coming at ya. And ... I'm going to throw out all the anaglyph glasses in the house, I don't ever want to use those again.
> 
> 
> And,... I see no color shift though the RF Glasses kit. I guess there is one through the glasses but it's not noticeable.
> 
> 
> I'm in love... I hoped a product like this would come along.
> 
> 
> =Brian



I wish it was that easy with my RS1 but the little Acer H5360 is making me smile a lot now. Nice bright 3D image and no ghosting, 100% duty cycle and no delay. Basically a master reset of the emitter and glasses and it is spot on perfect. The RF glasses are nice and they seem to actually make the Acer colors look perfect. Skin tones in 3D are very good. Colors don't look off at all in 3D with the RF glasses. The Acer flesh tones look a little red in 2D but I will not use it for 2D. The two projector solution will work out well for me.


I plan to try it in 60hz mode next chance I get. Just to see what it looks like.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20583119
> 
> 
> I pay extra for anything without the MONSTER brand on it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got the displayer today with RF glasses. Ordered directly from the 3D-Vip website.
> 
> 
> I'm like a fish out of water with the hardware but I'm quickly figuring it all out.
> 
> 
> So far I'm in love. My projector (and 82" screen) could not do 3D anything yesterday apart from anaglyph. Suddenly...3D is coming at ya. And ... I'm going to throw out all the anaglyph glasses in the house, I don't ever want to use those again.
> 
> 
> And,... I see no color shift though the RF Glasses kit. I guess there is one through the glasses but it's not noticeable.
> 
> 
> I'm in love... I hoped a product like this would come along.
> 
> 
> =Brian



That's great Brian. I was wondering how things would work out with the lumens you were planning on using. What movie did you test with?


Have you tried delay and duty cycle settings?


If you see any odd colorizations like in facial tones, try just bumping duty cycle +- until it clears. I've seen that oddity fade in and out at different points throughout the range.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20583476
> 
> 
> That's great Brian. I was wondering how things would work out with the lumens you were planning on using. What movie did you test with?
> 
> 
> Have you tried delay and duty cycle settings?
> 
> 
> If you see any odd colorizations like in facial tones, try just bumping duty cycle +- until it clears. I've seen that oddity fade in and out at different points throughout the range.



Good advice.


I found that Disney's "Tangled" is the best for setting up the glasses, IMO... there are enough high-contrast scenes to really spot any crosstalk pitfalls. The animators also aimed for an "oil painting" look, which offers a lot of gradients and rich color transitions to adjust for the types of colorizations you're talking about.


Brian, remind us what projector you're using?


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20583598
> 
> 
> Good advice.
> 
> 
> I found that Disney's "Tangled" is the best for setting up the glasses, IMO... there are enough high-contrast scenes to really spot any crosstalk pitfalls. The animators also aimed for an "oil painting" look, which offers a lot of gradients and rich color transitions to adjust for the types of colorizations you're talking about.
> 
> 
> Brian, remind us what projector you're using?



Cloudy with the chance of meatballs is also very good for adjusting the glasses for near and far scenes.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20583630
> 
> 
> Cloudy with the chance of meatballs is also very good for adjusting the glasses for near and far scenes.



I just got that used from FYE! I'm gonna watch it tonight. Awesome!


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20583643
> 
> 
> I just got that used from FYE! I'm gonna watch it tonight. Awesome!



It's one great movie for 3D and also very funny and clever. I don't know how many times I watched it already but still enjoy it.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Cloudy is the only one I've checked so far but I can't wait to watch Tangled and Pirahna and RE:A and Tron.


I haven't even watched Tron.... Guess I've been waiting.


The pj is a Sony VW60. (Doesn't seem to have a frame locking problem... But... I need to spend some more time later on tonight.)


----------



## SgtVideo

I recently received Resident Evil 3D but won't be able to watch until my replacement glasses arrive. Had to ship out two pairs with different problems.

One arrives today the other next week.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20584078
> 
> 
> I recently received Resident Evil 3D but won't be able to watch until my replacement glasses arrive. Had to ship out two pairs with different problems.
> 
> One arrives today the other next week.



My two pair worked great last night. They were charged a couple weeks ago and have been sitting unused. Guess my old LG charger is doing a good job recharging.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20584250
> 
> 
> My two pair worked great last night. They were charged a couple weeks ago and have been sitting unused. Guess my old LG charger is doing a good job recharging.



Let us know how long the charge lasts. Mine take a charge but it doesn't last as long as specified. The most I can get between charges is about 4 hours.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20584295
> 
> 
> Let us know how long the charge lasts. Mine take a charge but it doesn't last as long as specified. The most I can get between charges is about 4 hours.



I used them at least two other times with one of the pair. They probably have around 4-5 hours on the pair i used the most. I'll wait until they are almost dead.


----------



## thebard

I just sent a pair back for a charge failure. I have 3 other pairs that I charged the same length of time, and they start right up after sitting overnight. This 4th pair will only fire up if I plug them back in for a few seconds, and then they only last about 10 minutes.


VIP has been very good about getting replacements out promptly (had another pair doa with a right lens failure). Jonathan told me Bit cauldron is requesting all the defective pairs from him in order to get to the bottom of this.


I have to say that I'm still pleased with the product's performance compared to the ir glasses... however I have a couple extras to fall back on. If I only had the one pair I could see it being very frustrating!


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20584335
> 
> 
> I just sent a pair back for a charge failure. I have 3 other pairs that I charged the same length of time, and they start right up after sitting overnight. This 4th pair will only fire up if I plug them back in for a few seconds, and then they only last about 10 minutes.
> 
> 
> VIP has been very good about getting replacements out promptly (had another pair doa with a right lens failure). Jonathan told me Bit cauldron is requesting all the defective pairs from him in order to get to the bottom of this.
> 
> 
> I have to say that I'm still pleased with the product's performance compared to the ir glasses... however I have a couple extras to fall back on. If I only had the one pair I could see it being very frustrating!



I want to get more too but am giving a little more time in hoping for some improvments.


I noticed the pair that came today had the VIP logo, plus this batch was made in Taiwan. Should get the other set Monday I hope.


Had lens failure in right side on one pair, and charging problem on the other pair. This group was non-labeled.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Spent a lot more time with it this evening and I'm still 100% thrilled.


I should write some type of review because you don't hear enough of people expressing how well the 3D-Vip products work.


I had a hard time starting a movie because the 3D Games were much too fun.


Then I watched Tron Legacy. It was fantastic.


I figure I must not have the frame locking issue. A little tuning and I had no ghosting... zip.


I think everyone with a "real" 3DTV that has ghosting has a good chance to tune it out if they pick up the RF glasses either from Monster or 3D-VIP.


-Brian


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20584607
> 
> 
> Spent a lot more time with it this evening and I'm still 100% thrilled.
> 
> 
> I should write some type of review because you don't hear enough of people expressing how well the 3D-Vip products work.
> 
> 
> I had a hard time starting a movie because the 3D Games were much too fun.
> 
> 
> Then I watched Tron Legacy. It was fantastic.
> 
> 
> I figure I must not have the frame locking issue. A little tuning and I had no ghosting... zip.
> 
> 
> I think everyone with a "real" 3DTV that has ghosting has a good chance to tune it out if they pick up the RF glasses either from Monster or 3D-VIP.
> 
> 
> -Brian



If you had no frame lock the picture would go in and out of sync over time. The more the two frequencies are off the quicker it drifts.


Boy I had bad luck! My RS1 drifted. My Sony XBR6 32 inch which is a straight 60Hz TV not 120hz internally had this bizarre ghosting and color shift that would pulse or strobe like a heart beat. Then my old 32 inch Olevia TV would change eye polarity like crazy and drift in a out of sync with the glasses.


So its a crap shoot! We have one guy with a JVC projector that is in sync so not all JVC's are broken with the VIP. Probably all the models with Gennum processing are broken.


Even with all the problems i had I was always positive about the VIP product. Now it works great with the Acer and bright like really bright on my Draper M2500. So no big deal...I also had the polarization issue where I even lost more light than i should be losing. That is what swayed me away from the RS1 all together.


Ron


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20584658
> 
> 
> We have one guy with a JVC projector that is in sync so not all JVC's are broken with the VIP. Probably all the models with Gennum processing are broken.



I missed that post. What JVC projector was working well?


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h* /forum/post/20584715
> 
> 
> I missed that post. What JVC projector was working well?



The HD250 was in sync with the glasses!


----------



## Brian Hampton

I was very worried about possible problems after reading about the JVC's and Frame Locking. I figured under the hood the early JVC and Sony LCOS pjs may have had too much in common like maybe they used the same chip.


Also,... with no tuning of the glasses I can clearly see both images though each resulting in severe ghosting. The RF glasses (or some type of adjustable glasses) are essential. After tuning I got perfection.


I still get 30 Frames per eye and a few times I can see some flicker. It's the limit of what my current projector can do and it doesn't bother me because it does so well with 3D it's worth it.


I noticed I can play some games better in 3D.


January 4 I posted on Blu Ray dot com and suggested someone should make a little black box that lets people with non-3D HDTVs watch 3D Blu Rays. That post is still there... And maybe a hundred days later... 3D-VIP delivered my dream to market.


Post is here...

http://forum.blu-ray.com/3d-hdtvs-pr...-3d-gizmo.html


----------



## mkoss

I confirmed that my Epson ex70 does not have a frame lock issue. Watched both resident evil and cloudy wtcm without having to readjust. Charged the glasses before viewing so I didn't have that as an issue. Going through a 3 to 1 hdmi switcher was no problem with the epson to get 3D.


Since my other pj's would not work at all with the VIP without inserting my HD3000 scaler in between. Got 3D and the drift issue over time as a result. So I tried an experiment of using the scaler between the epson and the vip. Could not get the 3D to be stable, was all over and inverting phase. What's confusing is the other pj's drifted slowly wheras I had a hell of a time trying to get good 3D with the scaler feeding the epson. Remove the scaler and back to normal. So the HD3000 looks like it is causing either all or part of the sync issue with the other pj's(60Hz).


I recently purchased a receiver that is 3D compatible that has a HDMI switcher. I will see if this works without using the scaler.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20584817
> 
> 
> The HD250 was in sync with the glasses!



Cool. Thanks.


Two generations newer than my JVC, so I'm still hopeful I'll hear a report of one of the RS20 gen JVC's working well. But this is a step in the right direction!


----------



## Brian Hampton

Just watched the Tangled 3D Blu through the 3D Displayer and it was surely the finest Home Theater experience I have had to date.


I'm floored. The 3D was natural looking and the 3D effect perfect. And, really added to the story and bringing me to the story.


I can't say enough good about the Displayer and 3D-Vip...


-Brian


----------



## mkoss

Watched Tron through the Acer H5360 last night. Some very dark scenes and good 3D. Had to get used to switching between 2.35 and 1.78:1 throughout the movie. No ghosting or flicker. Only have one problem which is I would get drop outs with snow pattern on the display. Had to stop and restart to get picture back. Could be HDMI switcher. I didn't have this problem at 60 Hz except 1 time in all my viewing.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20589152
> 
> 
> Watched Tron through the Acer H5360 last night. Some very dark scenes and good 3D. Had to get used to switching between 2.35 and 1.78:1 throughout the movie. No ghosting or flicker. Only have one problem which is I would get drop outs with snow pattern on the display. Had to stop and restart to get picture back. Could be HDMI switcher. I didn't have this problem at 60 Hz except 1 time in all my viewing.



I can't wait to get mine up on a new shelf I ordered in the back of the room. Right now its awkward with the projector right next to me. The Navitar 1.5x telephoto converter will allow me to project from 22 feet away on my 120 inch screen.


----------



## mkoss

One other thing I forgot to note during the Tron viewing was that I would get these repeated flashes which looked like it was trying to change aspect ratio throughout the movie. I don't know if this attributed to the dropouts. I was wondering whether anyone else had dropouts. Come to think of it when I would first start and switch to view 3D with 60 hz pj's I had these snow patterns in the beginning but not later during the movie. Tron yielded multiple dropouts through out the movie with the Acer whereas the other movies yielded maybe a single dropout.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20589363
> 
> 
> One other thing I forgot to note during the Tron viewing was that I would get these repeated flashes which looked like it was trying to change aspect ratio throughout the movie. I don't know if this attributed to the dropouts. I was wondering whether anyone else had dropouts. Come to think of it when I would first start and switch to view 3D with 60 hz pj's I had these snow patterns in the beginning but not later during the movie. Tron yielded multiple dropouts through out the movie with the Acer whereas the other movies yielded maybe a single dropout.



My Acer would change inputs. I set it to only use the selected source and it has been fine. How long is your hdmi cable? Maybe a problem with cabling. Right now I have only used it PS3 --VIP--Acer and no flashing of any kind.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20589715
> 
> 
> My Acer would change inputs. I set it to only use the selected source and it has been fine. How long is your hdmi cable? Maybe a problem with cabling. Right now I have only used it PS3 --VIP--Acer and no flashing of any kind.



Cables are short 6ft to15 ft. All equipment is localized near each other with no long runs. Tron does this thing with changing from 2.35 to 1.87 depending on the scene which maybe causing this aspect change flicker problem. This is not the same as 60 or 120 hz. It is quick and very low frequency in nature.I'm going to eliminate the HDMI switcher (could be bandwidth issue) to see what happens with the dropouts. Yes I also need to set the Acer so it doesn't cycle through all the inputs. Actually last night I also had a higher opinion of 2D viewing than the first couple times once I got the focus right. Haven't played with colors yet.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20589861
> 
> 
> Cables are short 6ft to15 ft. All equipment is localized near each other with no long runs. Tron does this thing with changing from 2.35 to 1.87 depending on the scene which maybe causing this aspect change flicker problem. This is not the same as 60 or 120 hz. It is quick and very low frequency in nature.I'm going to eliminate the HDMI switcher (could be bandwidth issue) to see what happens with the dropouts. Yes I also need to set the Acer so it doesn't cycle through all the inputs. Actually last night I also had a higher opinion of 2D viewing than the first couple times once I got the focus right. Haven't played with colors yet.



I think you can turn off auto aspect ratio too! I seem to remember seeing that. Maybe in the first time setup area if not in the menus.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I tried the fw update but it failed with a message of incompatibility.


I wonder why the 3d-VIP products process the audio at all. I understand not having the hardware for 7.1 but why can't the audio just be passed unchanged?


Edit: also have to wonder about the row of switches. I know the first is for 60/120hz but there's more.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20590226
> 
> 
> I tried the fw update but it failed with a message of incompatibility.
> 
> 
> I wonder why the 3d-VIP products process the audio at all. I understand not having the hardware for 7.1 but why can't the audio just be passed unchanged?
> 
> 
> Edit: also have to wonder about the row of switches. I know the first is for 60/120hz but there's more.



The audio has to be remuxed with the new video stream. Maybe they just didn't have the code to handle the multichannel bits so they blocked it at the source.


Go back to the beginning of the theatre thread and you'll find out about the switches. Its forced the different 3D modes before the push button was added.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20590226
> 
> 
> I tried the fw update but it failed with a message of incompatibility.
> 
> 
> I wonder why the 3d-VIP products process the audio at all. I understand not having the hardware for 7.1 but why can't the audio just be passed unchanged?
> 
> 
> Edit: also have to wonder about the row of switches. I know the first is for 60/120hz but there's more.



I assume you are using the Displayer FW with your Displayer.


If I remember correctly I saw that message as well. Just close everything and restart and it should do a normal complete.


The VIP driver should acknowledge the connection of the new USB device when you plug in your Displayer.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20589152
> 
> 
> Watched Tron through the Acer H5360 last night. Some very dark scenes and good 3D. Had to get used to switching between 2.35 and 1.78:1 throughout the movie. No ghosting or flicker. Only have one problem which is I would get drop outs with snow pattern on the display. Had to stop and restart to get picture back. Could be HDMI switcher. I didn't have this problem at 60 Hz except 1 time in all my viewing.



I watched it on the Panasonic AE4000 and didn't see any of that.

Didn't care for all the aspect ratio switching, I guess the producer thought it was cute.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20590449
> 
> 
> I watched it on the Panasonic AE4000 and didn't see any of that.
> 
> Didn't care for all the aspect ratio switching, I guess the producer thought it was cute.



I like 2.35:1. Didn't care for all the changing. You viewed at 60 hz I viewed at 120 Hz with the Acer. I'm going to view it as well at 60 Hz just to see the difference. This frequent drop out with a snow pattern is annoying and I need to find out the cause. It's just the video, the audio continues to be normal. If I stop the BR player and restart it is ok until the next Hiccup.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20590498
> 
> 
> I like 2.35:1. Didn't care for all the changing. You viewed at 60 hz I viewed at 120 Hz with the Acer. I'm going to view it as well at 60 Hz just to see the difference. This frequent drop out with a snow pattern is annoying and I need to find out the cause. It's just the video, the audio continues to be normal. If I stop the BR player and restart it is ok until the next Hiccup.



Is that snow pattern when it happens only visible through the glasses?


If "deep color" is enabled try disabling and see if the problem continues.

Assuming there is such an option.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I'm glad I'm not seeing this "snow" problem.


I also didn't see any problems with Tron but maybe I slept trough some of it cuz that movie was mostly weak.


Anyways,... I can't update the FW on my displayer. I tried again but ... didn't work.


I guess I could just get a optical cable because that would give me everything the new FW would give me though I'm curious you mentioned it had some effect on [email protected]


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20593039
> 
> 
> I'm glad I'm not seeing this "snow" problem.
> 
> 
> I also didn't see any problems with Tron but maybe I slept trough some of it cuz that movie was mostly weak.
> 
> 
> Anyways,... I can't update the FW on my displayer. I tried again but ... didn't work.
> 
> 
> I guess I could just get a optical cable because that would give me everything the new FW would give me though I'm curious you mentioned it had some effect on [email protected]
> 
> 
> -Brian




Before running the update program. When you plug in the Displayer do you get a message from the operating system something like "device detected" and "drivers loaded", your device is ready for use?


At least in WinXP that's what I see. If not, make sure the VIP driver is being installed. If the operating system doesn't load the drivers properly you will get incompatibility, because it see's a printer or some other USB device.


My video display (Samsung LED DLP) reported 1080/24 when I first used the Displayer going through a 1.3 AVR. So the AVR upscaled and it looked good.

I haven't set up the AVR to do upscaling, so it must have been a default setting operating at the time. When I moved it downstream from AVR the display now reported 720/60P.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I plugged the Displayer in and it was recognized.


Then,.. I un-installed the "3D-VIP" driver... And re-installed it with the Displayer plugged in because when you install it there's some message about scanning.


Anyways,.. It get's detected as some type of USBXpress device or something.


I'm very happy with it so far so I'm not in too much of a hurry to update it.


----------



## mkoss

Ran Tron again last night but used epson EX70 and didn't have any problem. Noticed the 3D was better using the Acer. Ex 70 suffers some in the contrast ratio area. I bought this mostly for travel. it has an instant on/off feature nice for quick useage. But no snow or the aspect issue during the viewing. I did not watch it all the way through. Need to try some suggestions with the Acer next viewing. Also RF glasses seemed to be no problem as well but not a lot of consecutive viewing hours between charges as of yet.


----------



## Grandmaster

I have an Asus VG236H 120Hz 3D Vision monitor and alas 3D Displayer doesn't work at all with this kit in 120Hz mode. Really disappointed bearing in mind the $500 outlay for the device and glasses.


I have confirmed that the kit is producing a 720p120 output, but it's rather odd that I get "out of range" errors from the monitor when I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC.


No response from tech support.


The 60Hz mode works mind you, but the flickering is so instrusive that I simply can't recommend it.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* 
I have an Asus VG236H 120Hz 3D Vision monitor and alas 3D Displayer doesn't work at all with this kit in 120Hz mode. Really disappointed bearing in mind the $500 outlay for the device and glasses.


I have confirmed that the kit is producing a 720p120 output, but it's rather odd that I get "out of range" errors from the monitor when I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC.


No response from tech support.


The 60Hz mode works mind you, but the flickering is so instrusive that I simply can't recommend it.
I wonder if they can sort it out. I have a Acer 20 inch monitor that won't work and I can't imagine why... just doesn't work.


I think monitors may be more difficult than actual "tv"s for whatever reason.


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* 
I have an Asus VG236H 120Hz 3D Vision monitor and alas 3D Displayer doesn't work at all with this kit in 120Hz mode. Really disappointed bearing in mind the $500 outlay for the device and glasses.


I have confirmed that the kit is producing a 720p120 output, but it's rather odd that I get "out of range" errors from the monitor when I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC.


No response from tech support.


The 60Hz mode works mind you, but the flickering is so instrusive that I simply can't recommend it.
It might help a little more if you tell us how you have the Displayer installed in the signal chain.


When you say "I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC." Are you using DVI or HDMI for that connection?


Is the PC the primary content playback device or are you also using a PS3 or BD player with this setup?


The particular monitor you are using Asustek only claims 120Hz timing via Analog mode. Maximum digital vert. is 85Hz.

*Analog Signal Frequency : 24~140 KHz(H)/ 50~122 Hz(V)

Digital Signal Frequency : 24~83 KHz(H)/ 50~85 Hz(V)*


Depending on how you have cabled this initially it appears there is a timing issue in the monitor support modes. But there isn't enough info presented in your post to make further comment in finding a resolution, if any.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Seems like that's the answer.


I wonder why it won't work on my ACER monitor though... I imagine the HDMI to DVI conversion is the problem but I don't know why.


The monitor is only capable of 720p but that still shouldn't be an issue because it can play back BLU Rays otherwise and the Displayer only puts out 720p as well.


I should try to figure it out because it would be nice to have another 3D setup for times I don't want to use the projector.



-Brian


----------



## walford

Some of the small screen 120HZ monitors only 120Hz content over a dual dvi interface.


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* 
I have an Asus VG236H 120Hz 3D Vision monitor and alas 3D Displayer doesn't work at all with this kit in 120Hz mode. Really disappointed bearing in mind the $500 outlay for the device and glasses.


I have confirmed that the kit is producing a 720p120 output, but it's rather odd that I get "out of range" errors from the monitor when I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC.


No response from tech support.


The 60Hz mode works mind you, but the flickering is so instrusive that I simply can't recommend it.
I spoke to tech support at VIP regarding your issue and there is no email on hand that describes the problem you've described. They checked all the way to last Wednesday.


Attached is an email support request in Excel format, fill that out and send the attachment to their support address shown in their sig.


G'day

 

VIP Support.zip 22.0048828125k . file


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* 
Seems like that's the answer.


I wonder why it won't work on my ACER monitor though... I imagine the HDMI to DVI conversion is the problem but I don't know why.


The monitor is only capable of 720p but that still shouldn't be an issue because it can play back BLU Rays otherwise and the Displayer only puts out 720p as well.


I should try to figure it out because it would be nice to have another 3D setup for times I don't want to use the projector.



-Brian
The DVI interface tries to maintain some analog compatibility. You need to review the timing settings that are available for the particular monitor to see where there may be a limitation. You can't use the analog specs (120hz) and say that will work with the VIP designs. Use the digital refresh specs for the modes of interests.


Trying to use dedicated PC monitors that support graphics modes just opens up a new can of worms when trying to use a product like VIP with non-traditional video displays.


Case in point, visit the HTPC builders forums and see the grief folks go through to resolve those issues.


Not saying, it can't be done, but mileage will vary.


When I built my HTPC and have it working on my 61" Samsung and Panasonic AE4000, I haven't even tried to see what issues as yet I'm going to run into by inserting the Displayer into that system. Maybe I'll luck out on first try, who knows.


For now I'm in the midst of resolving glasses and transmitter issues that no one else has experienced, so I'm not getting much use of the product until that is complete.


That by no means indicates I dislike the product, just that we will all have varying initial success to get things working with all the various combinations that people attempt.


For now, Bit Cauldron QC has been my main issue and hopefully will get resolved as an improved product. This is still a young industry and I am being patient with them. I also did a lot of due diligence on my own end with my setup before making the purchase decision.


Received a brand new pair set from VIP to replace the units I sent back for analysis that failed. One of these will not reach full charge doing overnight charging. Battery only charges to 2.92VDC, the functioning pair reaches 100% state of charge at 3.78VDC.


There is also an issue with my transmitter that is being returned which I will not go into at this time since I'm the only one experiencing it.


----------



## Grandmaster




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20596990
> 
> 
> It might help a little more if you tell us how you have the Displayer installed in the signal chain.
> 
> 
> When you say "I can get 720p120 working just fine from the PC." Are you using DVI or HDMI for that connection?
> 
> 
> Is the PC the primary content playback device or are you also using a PS3 or BD player with this setup?
> 
> 
> The particular monitor you are using Asustek only claims 120Hz timing via Analog mode. Maximum digital vert. is 85Hz.
> 
> *Analog Signal Frequency : 24~140 KHz(H)/ 50~122 Hz(V)
> 
> Digital Signal Frequency : 24~83 KHz(H)/ 50~85 Hz(V)*
> 
> 
> Depending on how you have cabled this initially it appears there is a timing issue in the monitor support modes. But there isn't enough info presented in your post to make further comment in finding a resolution, if any.



I have the PS3 connected to the adapter, and the adapter connected to the DVI-D port of the monitor in place of my PC DVI cable.


The monitor is recognised by my PC as being 120Hz compliant, I can select 120Hz refresh rates, I can play games in 3D at up to 1920x1080 at 120Hz and I can even play games in 2D at 120Hz. It is, after all, a 3D Vision monitor.


As Anandtech says, "With the 120Hz display, you're really getting every frame at or below 120 FPS drawn to the screen. At that high of a response time, you definitively can't see flicker. The result is a similar kind of once you've experienced it, you can't go back' to a solid state drive."


I have a capture card that can adapt to any digital output I give it and this is the way I have confirmed that both PC and Displayer are outputting 720p at 120Hz.


I will try tech support again.


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* 
I have the PS3 connected to the adapter, and the adapter connected to the DVI-D port of the monitor in place of my PC DVI cable.


The monitor is recognised by my PC as being 120Hz compliant, I can select 120Hz refresh rates, I can play games in 3D at up to 1920x1080 at 120Hz and I can even play games in 2D at 120Hz. It is, after all, a 3D Vision monitor.


As Anandtech says, "With the 120Hz display, youre really getting every frame at or below 120 FPS drawn to the screen. At that high of a response time, you definitively cant see flicker. The result is a similar kind of once youve experienced it, you cant go back to a solid state drive."


I have a capture card that can adapt to any digital output I give it and this is the way I have confirmed that both PC and Displayer are outputting 720p at 120Hz.


I will try tech support again.
Fill out their support form which I have attached and email it to their support address.


The configuration you are trying to accomplish is straying off the reservation of the design so-to-speak. I can see why your monitor is giving "out of range" errors but hopefully they can clarify it better or find an alternate method that works.


G'day

 

VIP Support.zip 22.0048828125k . file


----------



## mkoss

Snow issue seems resolved by wiring direct to Acer bypassing the the HDMI switcher. Still having charge issues with RF glasses not lasting very long. First time I used RF glasses with the Acer and saw same wierd color shifts Romony detailed in the glasses threads until adjusted properly.


----------



## 3Den




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20602300
> 
> 
> Still having charge issues with RF glasses not lasting very long.



How long do they last (ca.)?


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *3Den* /forum/post/20602461
> 
> 
> How long do they last (ca.)?



The most I get is about 3 to 4 hours before I need to plug them in.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20602300
> 
> 
> Snow issue seems resolved by wiring direct to Acer bypassing the the HDMI switcher. Still having charge issues with RF glasses not lasting very long. First time I used RF glasses with the Acer and saw same wierd color shifts Romony detailed in the glasses threads until adjusted properly.



That's good to hear. I have already measured three new glasses out of four that will not reach 3vdc of charge. My good pair hits 3.78vdc in short order.

The question: battery defect or charging circuit? We still don't know yet.


Jonathan is having his shop charge and measure the next pair before shipping to me. New, these should reach 3.71-3.8 at full charge.


I understand Ronomy's comment on the color shifts during the adjustment phase but these should not be appearing randomly and periodic after the final adjustment as in my case.


This problem didn't appear until the first night we tried to watch Resident Evil. I had previously used the transmitter settings for my projector, this time I set it up for my Samsung DLP TV. I zeroed my settings to start over but while holding the dongle for the last LED to wink out and it did, both pairs of glasses locked dark in the left lense.


I raised the adjustment in the delay, the wife's pair responded fine but the right shutter on my pair had blown, died whatever you want to call it. It was like it was a glitch that was transmitted which locked both glasses with only one recovering.


Ever since that incident the color shifts are constantly returning. Hence I shipped the transmitter back as well for evaluation.


My video image without glasses does not have this occurring.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Grandmaster* /forum/post/20601055
> 
> 
> I have the PS3 connected to the adapter, and the adapter connected to the DVI-D port of the monitor in place of my PC DVI cable.
> 
> 
> The monitor is recognised by my PC as being 120Hz compliant, I can select 120Hz refresh rates, I can play games in 3D at up to 1920x1080 at 120Hz and I can even play games in 2D at 120Hz. It is, after all, a 3D Vision monitor.
> 
> 
> As Anandtech says, "With the 120Hz display, you’re really getting every frame at or below 120 FPS drawn to the screen. At that high of a response time, you definitively can’t see flicker. The result is a similar kind of ‘once you’ve experienced it, you can’t go back’ to a solid state drive."
> 
> 
> I have a capture card that can adapt to any digital output I give it and this is the way I have confirmed that both PC and Displayer are outputting 720p at 120Hz.
> 
> 
> I will try tech support again.



As SgtVideo has been saying, you are probably seeing the difference between computer video timings-which your vid card will output unless you use custom timings-and consumer video timings. For instance, 60Hz in computer video is exactly that: 60.00Hz. But 60Hz to TVs, DVD and BD players, and other home video products, is actually 59-point-something-or-other. The same goes for 120Hz. Your PC monitor cannot use the 120Hz consumer video timing that the VIP unit is outputting, and it also appears that its reception of digital signals (like the VIP's HDMI) is restricted to a maximum of 85Hz in any case.


Also, note that DVI-I can carry both digital and analog computer video signals. This is the type of DVI that Walford mentioned in post 439 above. If your vid card, cable, and monitor all are DVI-I, then the monitor's 120Hz analog capability will be advertised to the video card via its EDID, and you will see 120Hz in the list of supported resolutions and refresh rates. But you'll still see "out of range" when trying to feed the monitor from the VIP at 120Hz.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *3Den* /forum/post/20602461
> 
> 
> How long do they last (ca.)?



I just got a new replacement pair that after charging lasted 55 minutes.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20602529
> 
> 
> I just got a new replacement pair that after charging lasted 55 minutes.



I friend of mine in work is having a similar problem with a cell phone using an after market charger. When she uses her Motorola charger it changes fine and holds a charge. I think maybe the glasses are indicating a full charge before the battery is charged. There must be a difference between different chargers people are using.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20602591
> 
> 
> I friend of mine in work is having a similar problem with a cell phone using an after market charger. When she uses her Motorola charger it changes fine and holds a charge. I think maybe the glasses are indicating a full charge before the battery is charged. There must be a difference between different chargers people are using.



I've worked with LI chargers. Depending on the degree of discharge there is an algorithm they need to charge by. They are first charged via a constant current source to a level by which the charger switches to a constant voltage mode where the battery finds most of its life cycle during use. The current is still monitored during this period and the charge is only terminated when the charge current drops below what is determined to be the termination current

for that battery. Since I only have 1 pair of glasses I have been hesitant to go inside more. Although I did not spend much time when I had them opened,

I did not see that they were measuring current. If I had a second pair I could then look closer and/or get a battery and set up a charge circuit myself.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20602591
> 
> 
> I friend of mine in work is having a similar problem with a cell phone using an after market charger. When she uses her Motorola charger it changes fine and holds a charge. I think maybe the glasses are indicating a full charge before the battery is charged. There must be a difference between different chargers people are using.



Well the real charging circuit is inside the glasses. All we really are providing to them is 5VDC from 500ma to 2500ma depending on what you are using.

The charge controller in the glasses should be doing all the regulation and tapering as it makes it's approach to full charge.


You are correct about the false full charge indication of the glasses. The only meaningful way is to physically measure it. And I've already measured enough to come to the conclusion that the 3 of the 4 I've had so far will never reach full charge. The LEDs just seem to give erroneous inconsistent info.


One of the brand new ones after charging all night wouldn't even power on.

It read 2.92VDC. I just shipped those back this morning with the transmitter.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Since you are measuring them, it's safe to assume your house wiring is ok?


You have so much trouble with the BC glasses I didn't expect mine to work when I got them.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20603990
> 
> 
> Since you are measuring them, it's safe to assume your house wiring is ok?
> 
> 
> You have so much trouble with the BC glasses I didn't expect mine to work when I got them.



Boy if house wiring was an issue they would have much bigger problems than dealing with 5 to 10 watt ac/dc power supply. Let us know how long between charges you get. Mine charge but only last a couple hours before I need to recharge


----------



## Brian Hampton

For me a watched 2 movies and then changed them and watched another the next day.


I suppose I should let them drain down to see ... but currently I'm depending on them as I work my way through all the 3D Blus I collected.


Also,... I used a Charging Station designed for PS3 that has a few USB ports on it (Just for reference.)


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20603990
> 
> 
> Since you are measuring them, it's safe to assume your house wiring is ok?
> 
> 
> You have so much trouble with the BC glasses I didn't expect mine to work when I got them.



That's because I told them to send you my good ones and the bad ones from the rest of you guys were sent to me....










Certainly, I retired from the industrial electrical and HVAC industry a year ago.

All panels and circuits updated two years ago.


Nothing else has a problem but glasses around here...heh!


Besides VIP is seeing their fair share, they just haven't put probes on them like me. I don't recommend anyone else to do it because you can short that battery. It takes small, sharp probes to get on that connector without shorting, then you got a burn mark and poof warranty.


BTW, the pair I just received and sent back Jonathan charged before he shipped them to me, they wouldn't power on. So I charged about 4 hours before use, got the ol' heartbeat which wasn't evident after I returned and got 55 minutes use before they died.


Charged them overnight, wouldn't power on. Measured battery before shipping back, 2.92VDC which is about 80% SOC; still should have powered up at that level or is the LED lying again..


----------



## mkoss

Another issue I thought of does the 5vdc have enough headroom to buck down to say 3.9 vdc for max charge which equates to an 80 % duty cycle. If the charger is duty cycle limiting it can never get the required top off voltage. I also thought I saw a sot23-5 chip used which is not enough pins to do the required voltage and current measurement. If the 5vdc were 5 % low it would make this worse. Need to get my hands on a really bad unit to do more investigating.


----------



## mkoss

Another issue I thought of does the 5vdc have enough headroom to buck down to say 3.9 vdc for max charge which equates to an 80 % duty cycle. If the charger is duty cycle limiting it can never get the required top off voltage. I also thought I saw a sot23-5 chip used which is not enough pins to do the required voltage and current measurement. If the 5vdc were 5 % low it would make this worse. Need to get my hands on a really bad unit to do more investigating.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20604700
> 
> 
> Another issue I thought of does the 5vdc have enough headroom to buck down to say 3.9 vdc for max charge which equates to an 80 % duty cycle. If the charger is duty cycle limiting it can never get the required top off voltage. I also thought I saw a sot23-5 chip used which is not enough pins to do the required voltage and current measurement. If the 5vdc were 5 % low it would make this worse. Need to get my hands on a really bad unit to do more investigating.



First off I agree with everything your saying on the above. Where I deviate is that the USB sources that I use (4) in my case, are not charging units at all, in principle they are nothing more than power supplies. All my other devices operate fine and charge themselves on my USB sources. They are strictly 5VDC sources and should regulate themselves to maintain 5V except under overload. Not likely with glasses. And it is also not likely that four sources of 5V with 550ma to 2500ma produce the same result.


It just leaves me with the conclusion that there is a component in the glasses charge control design that is not maintaining it's specification. Some glasses achieve full 3.71V design charge and quite a few of them won't.


And we still have the question whether it is a battery QC problem, or improper battery choice for the charge application and not a charge controller issue. Got me.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20606358
> 
> 
> First off I agree with everything your saying on the above. Where I deviate is that the USB sources that I use (4) in my case, are not charging units at all, in principle they are nothing more than power supplies. All my other devices operate fine and charge themselves on my USB sources. They are strictly 5VDC sources and should regulate themselves to maintain 5V except under overload. Not likely with glasses. And it is also not likely that four sources of 5V with 550ma to 2500ma produce the same result.
> 
> 
> It just leaves me with the conclusion that there is a component in the glasses charge control design that is not maintaining it's specification. Some glasses achieve full 3.71V design charge and quite a few of them won't.
> 
> 
> And we still have the question whether it is a battery QC problem, or improper battery choice for the charge application and not a charge controller issue. Got me.



I agree the problem is not in the 5vdc source your using. Where the problem is in their down converter used to charge the battery and/or the battery. There's not a lot of headroom in going down from lets say worst case 4.75 vdc to say 3.7 to 3.9 vdc. Also I believe the internal circuitry to run the unit is also there as a load while charging. All this requires a sophisticated method of charging requiring measurement of both voltage and current and utimately a charge timer for a faulty battery. I don't think I saw that being in place on the circuit side from the short time I did get a look inside. Also the battery being on the other side of the glasses without kelvin connections coming back

makes for potential problems.


----------



## Rolls-Royce

Do either if you guys know if there is a Li-ion battery available that could replace the Li-Po one that is currently in these glasses? If the switch to Li-Po batteries was done without some necessary reconfiguration, it may be worthwhile to retrofit a Li-Ion battery and see what happens, just for Ss & Gs....


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* 
Do either if you guys know if there is a Li-ion battery available that could replace the Li-Po one that is currently in these glasses? If the switch to Li-Po batteries was done without some necessary reconfiguration, it may be worthwhile to retrofit a Li-Ion battery and see what happens, just for Ss & Gs....
I was considering that.


The voltage and Mah rating should be easy to have a close match, the dimension requirements and the power connector might make it a little difficult. Just haven't made that effort yet.


Although, if the charge controllers are problematic, no battery will matter.

They will just deteriorate faster over time.


Not sure as yet if Bit Cauldron has received enough of them for failure analysis to localize the problem.


Or....it could be just some of us....


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* 
Do either if you guys know if there is a Li-ion battery available that could replace the Li-Po one that is currently in these glasses? If the switch to Li-Po batteries was done without some necessary reconfiguration, it may be worthwhile to retrofit a Li-Ion battery and see what happens, just for Ss & Gs....
My knowedge base is on the charger end. From googling the battery forum these use the same technology but different packaging but require the same charging algorithm. If their not charging properly switching to a different battery won't help. Some have differing top off voltages which needs to be taken into account when switching over to constant voltage mode. There are 2 types of chargers which are either stand alone or processor controlled. Because

most of the life of a given battery is depleted at a specific voltage this is why the current is measured and terminated once the charge current drops below a specific value in constant voltage mode. There should also be a charge timer to prevent the battery from becoming a fire hazard.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20609601
> 
> 
> My knowedge base is on the charger end. From googling the battery forum these use the same technology but different packaging but require the same charging algorithm. If their not charging properly switching to a different battery won't help. Some have differing top off voltages which needs to be taken into account when switching over to constant voltage mode. There are 2 types of chargers which are either stand alone or processor controlled. Because
> 
> most of the life of a given battery is depleted at a specific voltage this is why the current is measured and terminated once the charge current drops below a specific value in constant voltage mode. There should also be a charge timer to prevent the battery from becoming a fire hazard.



Thanks for the reply (and to SgtVideo, too). I was curious since I was noticing when searching the 'net that some chargers were listed for Li-ion only, while some were listed for both li-ion and li-po batteries. That drove me to think that the battery type might have changed without changes to the charging circuit. Now, if the full advertised life of 20 hours is attainable with proper charging, and the batteries are relatively easily removed from the glasses in order to bypass the built-in charger setups, I may purchase one of these li-ion/li-po chargers and give it a try.


My Theater and glasses are on the truck for delivery today, so I'll be able to look into this soon.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20611460
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply (and to SgtVideo, too). I was curious since I was noticing when searching the 'net that some chargers were listed for Li-ion only, while some were listed for both li-ion and li-po batteries. That drove me to think that the battery type might have changed without changes to the charging circuit. Now, if the full advertised life of 20 hours is attainable with proper charging, and the batteries are relatively easily removed from the glasses in order to bypass the built-in charger setups, I may purchase one of these li-ion/li-po chargers and give it a try.
> 
> 
> My Theater and glasses are on the truck for delivery today, so I'll be able to look into this soon.



Know what you are doing before you attempt to charge. See the attached

http://www.hardingenergy.com/pdfs/6%...%20Polymer.pdf


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20611460
> 
> 
> Thanks for the reply (and to SgtVideo, too). I was curious since I was noticing when searching the 'net that some chargers were listed for Li-ion only, while some were listed for both li-ion and li-po batteries. That drove me to think that the battery type might have changed without changes to the charging circuit. Now, if the full advertised life of 20 hours is attainable with proper charging, and the batteries are relatively easily removed from the glasses in order to bypass the built-in charger setups, I may purchase one of these li-ion/li-po chargers and give it a try.
> 
> 
> My Theater and glasses are on the truck for delivery today, so I'll be able to look into this soon.



That may be possible, but one of the risk would be damaging that thin ribbon cable. It's not made for frequent flexing and could easily crack one of the traces on it. OK for battery replacements down the road; the little screw threads won't hold up long either with frequent use.


----------



## Rolls-Royce

Thanks again to both of you. It appears that this will be a more complex undertaking than I first imagined. Guess I'll wait and see what VIP and Bit Cauldron come up with!


----------



## Ronomy

Still using my glasses that I charged 3 or 4 weeks ago. They don't blink quickly so the charge is still good.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I cant update the Displayer fw.


I thought my pc was the problem so I borrowed another and had the exact same problem.


First it says the fw is beta to which I say continue them it says wrong product and closes.


I didn't mind at first but I've tried again so many times I'm irk-ed now.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20615613
> 
> 
> I cant update the Displayer fw.
> 
> 
> I thought my pc was the problem so I borrowed another and had the exact same problem.
> 
> 
> First it says the fw is beta to which I say continue them it says wrong product and closes.
> 
> 
> I didn't mind at first but I've tried again so many times I'm irk-ed now.



What operating system?


Anyway for now go to ControlPanel>System>DeviceManager


Scroll down to "universal serial bus controllers", open that listing, there will probably be several listed.


The one you want to see appear/disappear is USBXpress Device as you plug and unplug the Displayer from the USB port. There is also an audible sound from Windows as well.


Is that happening?


IF so that tells me the VIP device driver is at least installed and working.


Is this the name of the update file you are running ?

VIP_Displayer_unreleased_Beta_V13.exe


Did you get the update files from here, Curt Palme site or VIP?

They should not be mixed up but who knows. Almost sounds like you

have Theater updater, can't rule it out.


Go to the VIP support site and download new Displayer firmware files and

retry.


----------



## mkoss

Well tried running through the HDMI inputs of the Dennon AVR 391 which is supposed to be 1.4 3D compatible, to see if my Hitachi TX100 would recognize

the Displayer. The good news is it was recognized. The bad news was all the colors were screwed up with a bright red backround that overlayed the image.

Routed the cable converter through also which was fine. Confused as to why this strange red color backround permeated the image. Tried reseating cables

which didn't help. Any one have a clue as to what is going on?


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20616822
> 
> 
> Well tried running through the HDMI inputs of the Dennon AVR 391 which is supposed to be 1.4 3D compatible, to see if my Hitachi TX100 would recognize
> 
> the Displayer. The good news is it was recognized. The bad news was all the colors were screwed up with a bright red backround that overlayed the image.
> 
> Routed the cable converter through also which was fine. Confused as to why this strange red color backround permeated the image. Tried reseating cables
> 
> which didn't help. Any one have a clue as to what is going on?



Strangely enough, this sounds like what can happen when you feed a component signal to a display looking for RGB, or vice-versa. If you do get a picture, it'll be reddish or greenish in cast. I'd look at the Denon's settings and see if there's a setting for output colorspace.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20616822
> 
> 
> Well tried running through the HDMI inputs of the Dennon AVR 391 which is supposed to be 1.4 3D compatible, to see if my Hitachi TX100 would recognize
> 
> the Displayer. The good news is it was recognized. The bad news was all the colors were screwed up with a bright red backround that overlayed the image.
> 
> Routed the cable converter through also which was fine. Confused as to why this strange red color backround permeated the image. Tried reseating cables
> 
> which didn't help. Any one have a clue as to what is going on?



Do you get the same thing if you config in this order.. 3D-BD>VIP>Hitachi?

Leave the AVR out for now.


----------



## SgtVideo

Well now I get to post some more of my successes and failures.


As I mentioned a few days returned glasses and transmitter.


Received new set yesterday. New glasses charged quickly to 3.74VDC. I now have two pairs that meet charge specs Hooo Ra!!


Now the part that suxx.


With the replacement transmitter I still have the drifting delay syndrome that screws my picture from excellent to bad in almost a regular several minute rythm.


This is on my Samsung HL61A750 LED DLP rear projection TV. This was the first set I used it on when I first got my Displayer.


Talked to Jonathan about it this a.m. and followed his suggestion to try the same setup without any other intervening devices; straight short cable connects. I.E. 3dBDP>VIP>AE4000


The Panasonic AE4000 has no issues, the Samsung has developed a wandering frame lock problem it appears. I have no clue as to why now.


I went to enable/disable every video related setting in the TV and BluRay one a time and tested for effect. Tried different HDMI ports on the TV inputs, different cables, nothing fixes this.


Just jacks me up that this set worked with it a few weeks ago. But that doesn't mean there's nothing wrong with the set.


Only desperate thing I haven't tried yet is flashing back to 1.0 and a full factory reset of the TV.


Im just flat out of ideas.


DadBlastIt!!!


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20617046
> 
> 
> Do you get the same thing if you config in this order.. 3D-BD>VIP>Hitachi?
> 
> Leave the AVR out for now.



I can't get the hitachi to recognize the VIP with a staight in connection. The only setup that does is by introducing my HD3000 scaler in between the VIP and the Hitachi. This same thing is true for my Optoma HD7100 and Sharp zx-12000 mkII. With the HD 3000 in the loop I get 3D now but because the scaler is now generating the sync I have a frame lock problem that requires the 3D image to be readjusted about every 15 to 20 minutes. I tried to use the Dennon to see if it would work with the VIP and eliminate the drift. The Dennon talks about colorspace compatibility and being 1.4a compliant but causes this red backround on the 3D image. Doesn't seem to have any video adjustments.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20617143
> 
> 
> I can't get the hitachi to recognize the VIP with a staight in connection. The only setup that does is by introducing my HD3000 scaler in between the VIP and the Hitachi. This same thing is true for my Optoma HD7100 and Sharp zx-12000 mkII. With the HD 3000 in the loop I get 3D now but because the scaler is now generating the sync I have a frame lock problem that requires the 3D image to be readjusted about every 15 to 20 minutes. I tried to use the Dennon to see if it would work with the VIP and eliminate the drift. The Dennon talks about colorspace compatibility and being 1.4a compliant but causes this red backround on the 3D image. Doesn't seem to have any video adjustments.



Then change the colorspace on the display or on the Blu-ray player.


Page 24 of the Hitachi manual has this option under "input". (Even if you don't want to leave it at RGB or whatever, it will verify if this is the problem.)


Don't know if you mentioned what BD player you have, but most likely it has a colorspace selection as well.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20617143
> 
> 
> I can't get the hitachi to recognize the VIP with a staight in connection. The only setup that does is by introducing my HD3000 scaler in between the VIP and the Hitachi. This same thing is true for my Optoma HD7100 and Sharp zx-12000 mkII. With the HD 3000 in the loop I get 3D now but because the scaler is now generating the sync I have a frame lock problem that requires the 3D image to be readjusted about every 15 to 20 minutes. I tried to use the Dennon to see if it would work with the VIP and eliminate the drift. The Dennon talks about colorspace compatibility and being 1.4a compliant but causes this red backround on the 3D image. Doesn't seem to have any video adjustments.



What order are the components arranged in? BDP->Denon->VIP->HD3000?


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20617468
> 
> 
> What order are the components arranged in? BDP->Denon->VIP->HD3000?



BDP>VIP->HD3000>pj100 works but sync issues and 3D image drift


BDP>VIP->Dennon>pj100 works but red color to everything


BDP>VIP->pj100 pj100 won't recognize vip. Like its not even connected


----------



## Rolls-Royce

I'd recommend trying BDP->Denon->VIP->HD3000->PJ, if you haven't done so already.


----------



## Star56

Guys,


Just got the Acer and I have paired it with a VIp Displayer.


Odd issue. In 3D 720P, it looks great! PQ is sharp with no ghosting.


What is odd is that when I view the Ps3 menus in default 1080P 2D, the PQ is nasty, soft and blurry. No amount of focusing will make it sharp. I have several other PJ's and they are sharp as a pin.


Like I said in 720P 3D it looks great so I suspect that the issue is the way the Acer is handling 1080P through the VIP unit.


Not a big issue since I will only use the Acer for 3D but just wondering if anyone had an explanation.


Tom


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Star56* /forum/post/20617830
> 
> 
> Guys,
> 
> 
> Just got the Acer and I have paired it with a VIp Displayer.
> 
> 
> Odd issue. In 3D 720P, it looks great! PQ is sharp with no ghosting.
> 
> 
> What is odd is that when I view the Ps3 menus in default 1080P 2D, the PQ is nasty, soft and blurry. No amount of focusing will make it sharp. I have several other PJ's and they are sharp as a pin.
> 
> 
> Like I said in 720P 3D it looks great so I suspect that the issue is the way the Acer is handling 1080P through the VIP unit.
> 
> 
> Not a big issue since I will only use the Acer for 3D but just wondering if anyone had an explanation.
> 
> 
> Tom



I noticed the same a couple days ago when I was setting up my new shelf and refocusing. Thing is it looks great with 1080p movies.


----------



## Star56

Interesting! Thanks for the quick reply.


----------



## avswilier

Have a pana 4000 hooked up to ps3.

Does VIP have a retailer in Hk as interested in the displayer but concerned about the quality control issues on the glasses' battery!


Having two kids I really need this product to just work without tinkering as I don't have the time or energy nowadays!


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/20618486
> 
> 
> Have a pana 4000 hooked up to ps3.
> 
> Does VIP have a retailer in Hk as interested in the displayer but concerned about the quality control issues on the glasses' battery!
> 
> 
> Having two kids I really need this product to just work without tinkering as I don't have the time or energy nowadays!



As far as I know Canada is the only retailer outside of US at the moment.


VIP and Bit Cauldron are working on the the battery charge problem. Hard to tell what % units are still in active inventory that could have a problem.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Star56* /forum/post/20617830
> 
> 
> Guys,
> 
> 
> Just got the Acer and I have paired it with a VIp Displayer.
> 
> 
> Odd issue. In 3D 720P, it looks great! PQ is sharp with no ghosting.
> 
> 
> What is odd is that when I view the Ps3 menus in default 1080P 2D, the PQ is nasty, soft and blurry. No amount of focusing will make it sharp. I have several other PJ's and they are sharp as a pin.
> 
> 
> Like I said in 720P 3D it looks great so I suspect that the issue is the way the Acer is handling 1080P through the VIP unit.
> 
> 
> Not a big issue since I will only use the Acer for 3D but just wondering if anyone had an explanation.
> 
> 
> Tom



Yes, but that is what's puzzling as the 3D content is already 1080P and the Displayer has converted it to 720P.


Have you tried a minimal hookup PS3>Displayer>Acer?


Are you also saying your other PJs work fine with the VIP and just the Acer has this issue?


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20618670
> 
> 
> Yes, but that is what's puzzling as the 3D content is already 1080P and the Displayer has converted it to 720P.
> 
> 
> Have you tried a minimal hookup PS3>Displayer>Acer?
> 
> 
> Are you also saying your other PJs work fine with the VIP and just the Acer has this issue?



I think he was saying the 3D content is fine. The 1080p pass through is soft. Now that I think of it I used a different BD player to check out 1080p playback.


I can't check again until later this week. I thought the 1080p menus with the PS3 looked soft. These menus looked great with my JVC and the ViP in the circuit. So I don't think it is the VIP. When I looked at 1080p on the Acer I was using 24p not 60p and with a different BD player with no VIP in the circuit. It is downconverted to 720 by the Acer so it should be softer.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20617696
> 
> 
> I'd recommend trying BDP->Denon->VIP->HD3000->PJ, if you haven't done so already.



I don't know what that config will buy me. I would be going through 2 sets of HDMI ports. I tried BDP->VIP->Dennon->PJ again last night and adjusted the color space on the pj. Colors were still off but I confirmed that the HD3000sync is causing the drift problem and not the PJ. Now if I can find a HDMI switch that doesn't cause this color space problem and is 1.4 compatible that would work to act as a buffer eliminating drift I could use all my 60 HZ pj's.

I'm sorry I bought this Denon. Usually they put out descent equipment. One other thing happened almost all the way throught the movie that all the HDMI ports started to go intermittent in operation. Strange. Powered it down, worked a little while and then went intermittent again.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20619229
> 
> 
> I don't know what that config will buy me. I would be going through 2 sets of HDMI ports. I tried BDP->VIP->Dennon->PJ again last night and adjusted the color space on the pj. Colors were still off but I confirmed that the HD3000sync is causing the drift problem and not the PJ. Now if I can find a HDMI switch that doesn't cause this color space problem and is 1.4 compatible that would work to act as a buffer eliminating drift I could use all my 60 HZ pj's.
> 
> I'm sorry I bought this Denon. Usually they put out descent equipment. One other thing happened almost all the way throught the movie that all the HDMI ports started to go intermittent in operation. Strange. Powered it down, worked a little while and then went intermittent again.



My thought was that a pure 1.4 3D signal may be passed through by the Denon with minimal or no video processing, but that a post-VIP (1.3) signal might not.


----------



## Star56




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20618827
> 
> 
> I think he was saying the 3D content is fine. The 1080p pass through is soft. Now that I think of it I used a different BD player to check out 1080p playback.
> 
> 
> I can't check again until later this week. I thought the 1080p menus with the PS3 looked soft. These menus looked great with my JVC and the ViP in the circuit. So I don't think it is the VIP. When I looked at 1080p on the Acer I was using 24p not 60p and with a different BD player with no VIP in the circuit. It is downconverted to 720 by the Acer so it should be softer.



Yes the 3D looks sharp and crisp. The PS3 menus look awful. My Sharp XGA PJ provides far far crisper PS3 menus than the Acer. It is blurry at all zoom and focus points. But the 3d PQ is terrific.


Here's a diagnostic cue, when I pop up the Acer menu it is far crisper than the PS3 menus in the background. There is something funky going on beTween the PS3---VIP----Acer. Take the PS3--VIP out of the equation and it sharpens up.


In any case 3D is fabulous with this setup and that is all it is designed to do. I have a 1080p pj for the 2d HD material.


I watched Monsters vs Aliens last night and it is jaw dropping in 3D.


Tom


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Star56* /forum/post/20620593
> 
> 
> Yes the 3D looks sharp and crisp. The PS3 menus look awful. My Sharp XGA PJ provides far far crisper PS3 menus than the Acer. It is blurry at all zoom and focus points. But the 3d PQ is terrific.
> 
> 
> Here's a diagnostic cue, when I pop up the Acer menu it is far crisper than the PS3 menus in the background. There is something funky going on beTween the PS3---VIP----Acer. Take the PS3--VIP out of the equation and it sharpens up.
> 
> 
> In any case 3D is fabulous with this setup and that is all it is designed to do. I have a 1080p pj for the 2d HD material.
> 
> 
> I watched Monsters vs Aliens last night and it is jaw dropping in 3D.
> 
> 
> Tom



Funny the other day when I was setting up I was wondering why I couldn't get it sharp using the PS3 menus. Then I watched some 3D and it looked awesome. Then you posted today and I remembered this happening to me.


I will look into this next chance I have. Like I said the menus are very sharp with my JVC 2D projector.


----------



## mkoss

Does anyone know if the theater/displayer are HDCP compliant? It's still a mystery to me why my HD7100,PJ-TX100, and XV12000mkII will not recognize the VIP Displayer if it is connected directly to these pj's. They do not recognize it unless I buffer them with my HD3000 scaler. Then I get resyncing issues causing drift.


----------



## Rolls-Royce

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
Does anyone know if the theater/displayer are HDCP compliant? It's still a mystery to me why my HD7100,PJ-TX100, and XV12000mkII will not recognize the VIP Displayer if it is connected directly to these pj's. They do not recognize it unless I buffer them with my HD3000 scaler. Then I get resyncing issues causing drift.
They have to be, otherwise a BDP-which sees the VIP unit as an HDMI 1.4 display-will refuse to play HD content/upscale SD DVDs, or may not even work at all. What kind of issues/error messages are you getting from these displays when the VIP is connected? Assuming they can accept a 720p 60/120Hz signal, there may be irregularities with the HDMI 1.3 signal the Displayer is sending out. Some displays are very touchy as regards to video signal timing-my old Mits HD-ready CRT RPTV is one of them.


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* 
They have to be, otherwise a BDP-which sees the VIP unit as an HDMI 1.4 display-will refuse to play HD content/upscale SD DVDs, or may not even work at all. What kind of issues/error messages are you getting from these displays when the VIP is connected? Assuming they can accept a 720p 60/120Hz signal, there may be irregularities with the HDMI 1.3 signal the Displayer is sending out. Some displays are very touchy as regards to video signal timing-my old Mits HD-ready CRT RPTV is one of them.
I don't get any error message. Each display acts as if nothing is connected to it. If it was one I could see this but all 3. They each require a HDMI to DVI interface cable which by itself should not be an issue. I have connected many other sources using this cable without a problem. It's just the displayer that poses a problem when connected to each. They all accept 720p/60Hz.


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
I don't get any error message. Each display acts as if nothing is connected to it. If it was one I could see this but all 3. They each require a HDMI to DVI interface cable which by itself should not be an issue. I have connected many other sources using this cable without a problem. It's just the displayer that poses a problem when connected to each. They all accept 720p/60Hz.
Try RGB out of your BD player. DVI will only work with RGB on some displays.


Jonathan told me once that DVI will work.


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Ronomy* 
Try RGB out of your BD player. DVI will only work with RGB on some displays.


Jonathan told me once that DVI will work.
He also told me DVI would work. I don't know using the RGB connection will buy me. I have no issue connecting other digital signals to these pj's from other sources. The fact that I get no error message is perplexing. The DVI cable is just providing a pass through conversion from HDMI to DVI for the digital signal sources.


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
I don't get any error message. Each display acts as if nothing is connected to it. If it was one I could see this but all 3. They each require a HDMI to DVI interface cable which by itself should not be an issue. I have connected many other sources using this cable without a problem. It's just the displayer that poses a problem when connected to each. They all accept 720p/60Hz.
Yes, but the VIP units have to be straight HDMI point to point. DVI interface has some analog components in it's pinout. I don't believe their firmware is capable of dealing with it as it stands. Basically, it sounds like your trying to do HDMI to DVI conversion. Right?


When I discussed an earlier situation with Jonathan concerning the fellow trying to use his DVI port on his computer monitor without success, it was my understanding DVI wouldn't work. Not sure if this is situation dependent or not, as some of us are getting conflicting info on this.



29 pin DVI Connector PinOut and Signal Names

Pin # Signal Name Pin # Signal Name Pin # Signal Name

1 TMDS Data2- 9 TMDS Data1- 17 TMDS Data0-

2 TMDS Data2+ 10 TMDS Data1+ 18 TMDSData0+

3 TMDS Data2/4 Shield 11 TMDS Data1/3 Shield 19 TMDS Data0/5 Shield

4 TMDS Data4- 12 TMDS Data3- 20 TMDS Data5-

5 TMDS Data4+ 13 TMDS Data3+ 21 TMDS Data5+

6 DDC Clock [SCL] 14 +5 V Power 22 TMDS Clock Shield

7 DDC Data [SDA] 15 Ground (for +5 V) 23 TMDS Clock +

8 Analog vertical sync 16 Hot Plug Detect 24 TMDS Clock -

C1 Analog Red - -- - --

C2 Analog Green - -- - --

C3 Analog Blue - -- - --

C4 Analog Horizontal Sync - -- - --

C5 Analog GND Return: (analog R, G, B) - -- - --


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
He also told me DVI would work. I don't know using the RGB connection will buy me. I have no issue connecting other digital signals to these pj's from other sources. The fact that I get no error message is perplexing. The DVI cable is just providing a pass through conversion from HDMI to DVI for the digital signal sources.
Your scaler might be doing auto conversion to RGB when attached to a DVI connection. My BD player didn't work with my old Lumagen HDQ unless it was in auto or RGB color. Try it and find out.


----------



## Rolls-Royce

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
He also told me DVI would work. I don't know using the RGB connection will buy me. I have no issue connecting other digital signals to these pj's from other sources. The fact that I get no error message is perplexing. The DVI cable is just providing a pass through conversion from HDMI to DVI for the digital signal sources.
What trying the RGB connection will buy you is the chance to eliminate one more variable. If it works, you'll know that was the problem.


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
He also told me DVI would work. I don't know using the RGB connection will buy me. I have no issue connecting other digital signals to these pj's from other sources. The fact that I get no error message is perplexing. The DVI cable is just providing a pass through conversion from HDMI to DVI for the digital signal sources.
I don't understand his comment for that.


Can't conceive that DVI would have the bandwidth to handle all that. It was hard enough for now to squeeze in 5.1 audio in the 1.3 update.

But then I have my limits of understanding some of the deeper technicals on this.


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* 
I don't understand his comment for that.


Can't conceive that DVI would have the bandwidth to handle all that. It was hard enough for now to squeeze in 5.1 audio in the 1.3 update.

But then I have my limits of understanding some of the deeper technicals on this.
DVI can be either digital or analog. The VIP can handle only digital input/output. It may only output 4.4.4 component and if the projector can only handle RGB in digital it will not work.


----------



## walford

DVI stands foir Digital Video Interface it is never analog. There are intergrated DVI/analog interface connectors( DVI-I) that on some sytems that support analog signals on the extra 4 pins that are not used by a single ore dual link DVI signal.

The following link disciusses more then you probably want to know about different DVI connector pinouts.

http://www.ramelectronics.net/DVI_info.ep


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *walford* /forum/post/20624804
> 
> 
> DVI stands foir Digital Video Interface it is never analog. There are intergrated DVI/analog interface connectors( DVI-I) that on some sytems that support analog signals on the extra 4 pins that are not used by a single ore dual link DVI signal.
> 
> The following link disciusses more then you probably want to know about different DVI connector pinouts.
> 
> http://www.ramelectronics.net/DVI_info.ep



Nerver say never! You contradicted yourself. It can support analog. Only the DVI-D interface can never support analog.


----------



## mkoss

The connector I have is a DVI-D. This cable was supplied by Optoma for my HD7100.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20624395
> 
> 
> Yes, but the VIP units have to be straight HDMI point to point. DVI interface has some analog components in it's pinout. I don't believe their firmware is capable of dealing with it as it stands. Basically, it sounds like your trying to do HDMI to DVI conversion. Right?
> 
> 
> When I discussed an earlier situation with Jonathan concerning the fellow trying to use his DVI port on his computer monitor without success, it was my understanding DVI wouldn't work. Not sure if this is situation dependent or not, as some of us are getting conflicting info on



There is no conversion other than pin out assignment to get from HDMI to DVI-D. As I said I have no problem with any other digital source just the VIP.

It acts like its not even connected.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Having a converting such as hdmi to dvi can be a show stopper. I have a computer monitor with a dvi port and it won't work with the 3d Displayer.


I'm not surprised or disappointed though because the Displayer works so well with my projector.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20625243
> 
> 
> Having a converting such as hdmi to dvi can be a show stopper. I have a computer monitor with a dvi port and it won't work with the 3d Displayer.
> 
> 
> I'm not surprised or disappointed though because the Displayer works so well with my projector.



These are not computer monitors. These pj's were very expensive in their day and work with Fios, BR players,etc and fully capable of 720P/60Hz. It's only the Displayer that causes an issue. This is why I raised the HDCP compliance issue. Going from HDMI to DVI-D is just a connector interface and pin assignment issue nothing else. Cable is relatively short. There are no analog signals. A clue might be when I connected to the Dennon HDMI switcher which is 1.4a compliant the tx100 was recognized but the color space was all screwed up.


----------



## Ronomy

Most older DVI interfaces require RGB color space. That is why I suggested it. The VIP converters may not work with RGB.


When I had my Lumagen HDQ I could only use RGB. My Directv receivers would change outputs to RGB. The VIP converters can't convert to RGB but they should pass it.


They are HDCP compliant because we all can watch movies which require it.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20625410
> 
> 
> Most older DVI interfaces require RGB color space. That is why I suggested it. The VIP converters may not work with RGB.



This doesn't make any sense to me. The normal color space setting is auto with any other HDMI connections I made not RGB. These pj's are not that old. and again have a DVI-D connector interface . It wasn't RGB color space that worked with the Dennon and TX-100. Colors were still off but I didn't have sync drift which is what I was trying to determine as caused by the scaler. Again was told DVI-D would not be a problem.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20625468
> 
> 
> This doesn't make any sense to me. The normal color space setting is auto with any other HDMI connections I made not RGB. These pj's are not that old. and again have a DVI-D connector interface . It wasn't RGB color space that worked with the Dennon and TX-100. Colors were still off but I didn't have sync drift which is what I was trying to determine as caused by the scaler. Again was told DVI-D would not be a problem.



Just stating what was happening with my lumagen HDQ that was out around the same time. At least one of your projetcors came out.


Everything I plugged into DVI would change to RGB. Not sure why you don't believe me.


----------



## Ronomy

DVI can work with component 4.2.2 and 4.4.4 but older projectors may not.


I looked up one model and it came out 5 years ago. The lumagen came out after that projector and it did support component video but a lot of displays wouldn't work. HDMI would default to RGB like my HDDVD player and my bluray player.


My directv receiver would also default to RGB but now with my DVDO Duo that has an HDMI connection the Directv receiver now defaults to 4.4.4.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20625564
> 
> 
> DVI can work with component 4.2.2 and 4.4.4 but older projectors may not.
> 
> 
> I looked up one model and it came out 5 years ago. The lumagen came out after that projector and it did support component video but a lot of displays wouldn't work. HDMI would default to RGB like my HDDVD player and my bluray player.
> 
> 
> My directv receiver would also default to RGB but now with my DVDO Duo that has an HDMI connection the Directv receiver now defaults to 4.4.4.



I think I understand what your saying. I need an interface such as yours that doesn't alter the sync but provides the necessary color space the unit requires. I can check by changing the color space to RGB while viewing normally to see if there is any changewhich should verify what your talking about.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20625929
> 
> 
> I think I understand what your saying. I need an interface such as yours that doesn't alter the sync but provides the necessary color space the unit requires. I can check by changing the color space to RGB while viewing normally to see if there is any changewhich should verify what your talking about.



Exactly! So your scaler doesn't frame lock or genlock?


The Duo frame locks.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20625468
> 
> 
> This doesn't make any sense to me. The normal color space setting is auto with any other HDMI connections I made not RGB. These pj's are not that old. and again have a DVI-D connector interface . It wasn't RGB color space that worked with the Dennon and TX-100. Colors were still off but I didn't have sync drift which is what I was trying to determine as caused by the scaler. Again was told DVI-D would not be a problem.



As I stated earlier the current VIP products had a memory limitation and reduced bandwidth that we are currently limited to 5.1 audio.


Inserting a converting device of this nature just adds another bottleneck.

*HDMI is a connector format that carries the same video signal as DVI, but instead of using the remaining pins for an optional video signal, pins are used to carry seven digital audio channels. HDMI also has much higher bandwidth capability than DVI. To keep confusion down, the plug is completely different.*


Notice, much higher bandwith.


This doesn't even take in account maintaining handshake between all devices in the HDMI interface signal chain. For now I say maintain HDMI throughout otherwise unexpected results.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20627284
> 
> 
> As I stated earlier the current VIP products had a memory limitation and reduced bandwidth that we are currently limited to 5.1 audio.
> 
> 
> Inserting a converting device of this nature just adds another bottleneck.
> 
> *HDMI is a connector format that carries the same video signal as DVI, but instead of using the remaining pins for an optional video signal, pins are used to carry seven digital audio channels. HDMI also has much higher bandwidth capability than DVI. To keep confusion down, the plug is completely different.*
> 
> 
> Notice, much higher bandwith.
> 
> 
> This doesn't even take in account maintaining handshake between all devices in the HDMI interface signal chain. For now I say maintain HDMI throughout otherwise unexpected results.



The VP would be placed after the VIP.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Innovation is their middle name. I can't wait for them to continue bring forth more and better solutions. They already have a list of do-ables like 7.1 audio and 1080p output.


I will welcome the opportunity to upgrade and in the mean time I love what they accomplished so far.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20627315
> 
> 
> The VP would be placed after the VIP.



I am strictly referring to any DVI adapter/convertor inserted between the HDMI daisy chain. I am fine with video processors but not if they change pinouts.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20627500
> 
> 
> I am strictly referring to any DVI adapter/convertor inserted between the HDMI daisy chain. I am fine with video processors but not if they change pinouts.



Who said anything about changing pin outs? We just want to try converting to RGB after the VIP with a VP that frame locks. Unlike his 3000 video scaler.


My guess is if the VIP can't handle RGB then it will not work with DVI unless the display can handle component via its DVI input.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20627361
> 
> 
> Innovation is their middle name. I can't wait for them to continue bring forth more and better solutions. They already have a list of do-ables like 7.1 audio and 1080p output.
> 
> 
> I will welcome the opportunity to upgrade and in the mean time I love what they accomplished so far.



Would be great for 60hz users to get 1080p but not usable for 120hz users.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20627556
> 
> 
> Who said anything about changing pin outs? We just want to try converting to RGB after the VIP with a VP that frame locks. Unlike his 3000 video scaler.
> 
> 
> My guess is if the VIP can't handle RGB then it will not work with DVI unless the display can handle component via its DVI input.



Since the connector is DVI-D the component connections are not available. I'm wondering whether the VIP can be updated to provide RGB colorspace.

It's to bad the the DVDO is around a grand. Might solve my problem. I'm still going to ping Optoma about my scaler and see if there is a way to get at the sync. I looked at the scaler and it only has VGA in not out. I also have a HDMI to component converter I have yet to use I got from Curt Palme to convert HDMI to component for recording off the Fios converter. I'm wondering whether this might work by going in the component connection. Might be worth a try.


----------



## Ronomy

Quote:

Originally Posted by *mkoss* 
Since the connector is DVI-D the component connections are not available. I'm wondering whether the VIP can be updated to provide RGB colorspace.

It's to bad the the DVDO is around a grand. Might solve my problem. I'm still going to ping Optoma about my scaler and see if there is a way to get at the sync. I looked at the scaler and it only has VGA in not out. I also have a HDMI to component converter I have yet to use I got from Curt Palme to convert HDMI to component for recording off the Fios converter. I'm wondering whether this might work by going in the component connection. Might be worth a try.
I was talking about component 422 and 444. Digital!


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20627733
> 
> 
> Since the connector is DVI-D the component connections are not available. I'm wondering whether the VIP can be updated to provide RGB colorspace.
> 
> It's to bad the the DVDO is around a grand. Might solve my problem. I'm still going to ping Optoma about my scaler and see if there is a way to get at the sync. I looked at the scaler and it only has VGA in not out. I also have a HDMI to component converter I have yet to use I got from Curt Palme to convert HDMI to component for recording off the Fios converter. I'm wondering whether this might work by going in the component connection. Might be worth a try.



The VIP probably does not do any color conversions. Was not designed for that. So you either have to feed to RGB or convert it after it passes through it.


Try setting your BD player to output RGB only instead of auto. If it can not pass RGB pass through then your VP is converting 444 to RGB is my guess.


When I get home I will try debugging for you. I'll be home in a couple days.


----------



## SgtVideo

Well I have 2 new pairs of glasses and one transmitter that was also replaced in hand. Turns out my color distortion problem is a frame lock drift problem. So the transmitter I sent back to VIP is not defective.


The Samsung LED DLP rear projection set is a so-called 3D ready and uses frame sequential via checkerboard format.


What is occurring with set is I achieve frame lock for several minutes and gradually drift out of lock. It then in the same amount of time gradually relocks, this goes on forever it seems.


The effect is similar to you setting duty cycle just right and then slowly detuning it. So it goes back and forth.


For now VIP is looking into a solution. I tried using all my available HDMI ports and the results were the same. This was the first set I tested my Displayer on and it worked, so not sure if there is a component beginning to fail in the TV that's causing this as yet.


Will see if VIP can figure it out first. None of this happens when hooked up to my AE4000.


Back to the new glasses:


Charged both pairs and measured a full charge at 3.74VDC. Watched the remaining hour of Resident Evil with them on the AE4000. So they were only in 3D use for an hour, also ran the projector for an additional 2.5 hours on non-3D material. So the Displayer was energized during those times. I keep mine on a switched receptacle strip when not using BD player.


Sunday morning I was going to do some more checks on my Samsung and neither pair of glasses would power on.


Pulled the battery on one set and measured 0 volts, totally dead.


Only way I could get the other pair on was to momentarily plug it in the USB and then after the LED came on unplug it.


So for now I am doing a detailed test and measurement on this one pair of glasses and will be sending it to VIP and Bit Cauldron for review.


Curses....foiled again!


At least I finally got to finish Resident Evil.


I haven't seen a lot of traffic on here, just a few with battery problems. Is it safe to assume this is not widespread among you folks?


----------



## mkoss

I still have battery charging issues but haven't said much because I can plug them in since my equipment is local to where I sit. I'm hesitant to ask for new ones thinking I might get something worse until I do a little more investigation. I can't believe that more people aren't having problems. Their just not complaining like us openly I think.


----------



## Ronomy

So far my pair are fine but I haven't really used them for a long time. I have been on the go so mucj lately I have been installing little by little. I want to watch a movie hopefully this weekend. So far the glasses have held a charge for almost 4 weeks maybe more. With several 1 hour uses in that time.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I may have battery problems now... I'm not sure.


The other day my glasses were dead and I used them plugged in.


There's no way I get 60 hours or something like I saw mentioned on Curt's site.


However,... If I can charge them for a couple hours in the afternoon and use them to watch a movie that evening... I'm fine with that.


I only need a few hours between charging for the way I use them.


-Brian


----------



## mkoss

Tried an experiment of routing the displayer output throught the Dennon AVR that claims to be 1.4a compliant, to my Epson EX-70 which has HDMI input and does not have frame lock issues just to see if there was color space issues like my Hitachi pj-tx100 which has DVI input. It acted as if the VIP wasn't even connected. It's just perplexing all the interface issues that can arise. Connect through my 1.3 hdmi switcher or direct there is no problem.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20632605
> 
> 
> Tried an experiment of routing the displayer output throught the Dennon AVR that claims to be 1.4a compliant, to my Epson EX-70 which has HDMI input and does not have frame lock issues just to see if there was color space issues like my Hitachi pj-tx100 which has DVI input. It acted as if the VIP wasn't even connected. It's just perplexing all the interface issues that can arise. Connect through my 1.3 hdmi switcher or direct there is no problem.



The VIP worked for me passing it threw my Duo VP. Although I suppose you could be experiencing an HDMI handshake problem. I don't recall many people having that problem other than you.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20632762
> 
> 
> The VIP worked for me passing it threw my Duo VP. Although I suppose you could be experiencing an HDMI handshake problem. I don't recall many people having that problem other than you.



The PJ-TX100 recognized the VIP through the Dennon although the colors were all screwed up. But this EX-70 did not even see the VIP through the Dennon. As I said somewhat of a crap shoot at times to get equipment to talk to each other. The Dennon claims 1.4a 3D compliance.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20633147
> 
> 
> The PJ-TX100 recognized the VIP through the Dennon although the colors were all screwed up. But this EX-70 did not even see the VIP through the Dennon. As I said somewhat of a crap shoot at times to get equipment to talk to each other. The Dennon claims 1.4a 3D compliance.



This begs the question: have you tried BDP->Denon->VIP->EX-70? Sometimes HDMI handshake problems with repeater/passthrough units can be solved with reordering components in the chain.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20633195
> 
> 
> This begs the question: have you tried BDP->Denon->VIP->EX-70? Sometimes HDMI handshake problems with repeater/passthrough units can be solved with reordering components in the chain.



No I haven't. I know that BDP->VIP->EX-70 works. I might try out of curiosity.

Also BDP->VIP-> HDMI 1.3->EX-70 works


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20633147
> 
> 
> The PJ-TX100 recognized the VIP through the Dennon although the colors were all screwed up. But this EX-70 did not even see the VIP through the Dennon. As I said somewhat of a crap shoot at times to get equipment to talk to each other. The Dennon claims 1.4a 3D compliance.



Definetely sounds like a color conversion problem!


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20633295
> 
> 
> No I haven't. I know that BDP->VIP->EX-70 works. I might try out of curiosity.
> 
> Also BDP->VIP-> HDMI 1.3->EX-70 works



Please do, and let us know what happens. My theory is that the Denon's HDMI processing circuit might be reacting to 3D metadata tags left in the datastream and retransmitting the data as a 1.4 and not a 1.3 stream.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20633407
> 
> 
> Please do, and let us know what happens. My theory is that the Denon's HDMI processing circuit might be reacting to 3D metadata tags left in the datastream and retransmitting the data as a 1.4 and not a 1.3 stream.



I will try tonight.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20633407
> 
> 
> Please do, and let us know what happens. My theory is that the Denon's HDMI processing circuit might be reacting to 3D metadata tags left in the datastream and retransmitting the data as a 1.4 and not a 1.3 stream.



I did try it between the BP and the VIP. It worked briefly. I'm having problems with the HDMI going intermittent shortly after warm up in this AVR. I need to get it to a repair dealer while it's still under warranty. Once it's fixed I can do more. I ordered a seperate 1.4a switcher I should be getting any day now to see how that fairs.


----------



## LVNeptune




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20618653
> 
> 
> As far as I know Canada is the only retailer outside of US at the moment.
> 
> 
> VIP and Bit Cauldron are working on the the battery charge problem. Hard to tell what % units are still in active inventory that could have a problem.



How is bit cauldron having all these issues but the Monster branded glasses aren't? I haven't read anything about the monsters failing to an extent I'm reading about. I have one good pair and one that the right lens won't shutter at all.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *LVNeptune* /forum/post/20646080
> 
> 
> How is bit cauldron having all these issues but the Monster branded glasses aren't? I haven't read anything about the monsters failing to an extent I'm reading about. I have one good pair and one that the right lens won't shutter at all.



probably a quality control issue between companies. VIP needs to screen these better before sending them out or have Bit Cauldron do more testing.

We don't know the QC arrangement BC has with Monster vs VIP.


----------



## LVNeptune

I am picking up two Monster's today from fry's... $380~ after tax.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *LVNeptune* /forum/post/20646080
> 
> 
> How is bit cauldron having all these issues but the Monster branded glasses aren't? I haven't read anything about the monsters failing to an extent I'm reading about. I have one good pair and one that the right lens won't shutter at all.




That's what doesn't make sense because they are produced at the same plant.


I just received two replacements and they fail to hold charge in 72 hours. VIP has forwarded my current and past tests results to BC. They also have 4 pairs of my earlier ones, one with shutter failure, for failure analysis. This last set was the first ones I've seen where the battery voltage goes to zero.


Hopefullly, they can make a determination and clear this up.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20646202
> 
> 
> probably a quality control issue between companies. VIP needs to screen these better before sending them out or have Bit Cauldron do more testing.
> 
> We don't know the QC arrangement BC has with Monster vs VIP.



It wouldn't be practical, would take three days to evaluate each pair prior to shipping. Part of the difficulty when outsourcing to Asia I suppose.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20647045
> 
> 
> That's what doesn't make sense because they are produced at the same plant.
> 
> 
> I just received two replacements and they fail to hold charge in 72 hours. VIP has forwarded my current and past tests results to BC. They also have 4 pairs of my earlier ones, one with shutter failure, for failure analysis. This last set was the first ones I've seen where the battery voltage goes to zero.
> 
> 
> Hopefullly, they can make a determination and clear this up.



Wow did I luck out! My glasses have been working great! I am using them more but decided to charge them up. After more than a month I figured time to recharge them.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> It wouldn't be practical, would take three days to evaluate each pair prior to shipping. Part of the difficulty when outsourcing to Asia I suppose.



Sorry, i completely lost your train of thought here.


While it would take three days to test, it's only a few minutes of actual work. It's like testing how long my laptop battery lasts only uses five minutes of my time, even though the test is running for hours. And can be done on any continent with the same results.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I don't think QC is any different on the Monster Glasses.


I'm sure there is QC done on these at the factory before they get "branded". I think maybe a different battery would be a good idea.


(Though... my own set it working... Not like 60 hours between change but still working fine for my own use.)


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h* /forum/post/20647539
> 
> 
> Sorry, i completely lost your train of thought here.
> 
> 
> While it would take three days to test, it's only a few minutes of actual work. It's like testing how long my laptop battery lasts only uses five minutes of my time, even though the test is running for hours. And can be done on any continent with the same results.



First I consider it Bit Cauldron's responsibility, second none of us knows VIP staffing; I would think they have enough on their plate with product development and support issues plus order fulfillment.


To test these glasses and I've already proved to them at this point it is meaningless and my results have already been forwarded to BC for review.


1. Determine the charge time to reach spec'd battery voltage of 3.71-3.74vdc. This means taking the battery out each time for measurement and resinstalling with the risk of stripping the screw or kinking the ribbon cable.


2. Test Power On for subsequent day or remove battery again for drain test to check for any loss of charge.


3. On third day remove battery again and see if it retained specified charge voltage prior to shipping.



My most recent test on replacements received last week show complete battery failure within 72 hours with the units off.


Personally I wouldn't mind occasional removal of the battery when it is spent to keep the glasses in service. But the frequency of the above comes with risk of cracking the traces on the ribbon cable from flexure.


VIP could do this without removing the battery but then they would have to keep track how long the battery maintains charge over time. Can they wait to see if it makes it 30 days or whatever? In the meantime folks want their glasses so then you start catching hell with order fulfillment. Thats just a no load test, how long do you set aside time for full load test on each pair of glasses before sending to customers?


Bit Cauldron should be doing this not VIP.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20647783
> 
> 
> I don't think QC is any different on the Monster Glasses.
> 
> 
> I'm sure there is QC done on these at the factory before they get "branded". I think maybe a different battery would be a good idea.
> 
> 
> (Though... my own set it working... Not like 60 hours between change but still working fine for my own use.)
> 
> 
> -Brian



Personally that was their advertised rating and I would only consider that on brand new units. Over time and depending on the number of charge cycles that would deteriorate. If the battery voltage is allowed to drop to zero each time then things would gradually deteriorate faster. I don't think you would like to deep cycle these or Li-Ion. Most rechargeable devices discourage the practice.


So far I have yet to see a new one make it 60 hours of op time.


Anyone try to see if their glasses function after first full charge when new and get 50-60 hours operation?


Mine didn't last long enough to find out.


----------



## mkoss

Besides having the proper algorithm to properly charge the battery, if the turn off circuit is not functioning properly the battery will drain. I suspect they keep the micro alive and it is a soft power down. If they had a hard power down ie removing the load completely, that would improve battery life .


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20647929
> 
> 
> Besides having the proper algorithm to properly charge the battery, if the turn off circuit is not functioning properly the battery will drain. I suspect they keep the micro alive and it is a soft power down. If they had a hard power down ie removing the load completely, that would improve battery life .



Yes indeed. I talked to Jonathan about having them do exactly what your suggesting with either a small surface mount slide switch instead of the logic power down.


Another thing I found odd when I received the glasses was I only had to charge them about 3 hours to get to the 3.71vdc range. But when I began doing Test1-3, the second charge was 5 hours but would only reach 3.52vdc.

But then that was from a completely dead battery which shouldn't matter as BC states in their Monstervision docs:


" Eyewear will reach a full charge from a completely dead battery in 3 hrs. The LED will flash in a slow heart beat indicating full charge."


I'm sorry I've belabored this issue to death but hopefully a refined product will emerge from this...unless of course we want to be tethered to a wall outlet..Ack!


----------



## mkoss

My equipment is local to where I sit so it's not a big deal for me to plug them in otherwise I would send them back. The charge time/battery life is sporadic on mine. What's wierd is I will charge them before viewing and sometimes need to replug in and this is monentary wherby I remove the power connector and their OK.


----------



## Ronomy

72 hours and dead! How do you explain my pair lasting well over one month and still working for an entire movie and not running out of juice?


There must be either a bad batch of batteries or faulty charge circuit chip.


Ron


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20648120
> 
> 
> 72 hours and dead! How do you explain my pair lasting well over one month and still working for an entire movie and not running out of juice?
> 
> 
> There must be either a bad batch of batteries or faulty charge circuit chip.
> 
> 
> Ron



Uuum...would you be interested in trading? Heh!


For now I believe the charge chip is draining them when off for lack of any other answer. The internal board is just a receiver and charging controller and whatever they use to shutter the LCDs.


It's still amazes me how the Monstervision thread is quiet on this problem.


----------



## darockk

4 weeks and still no reply from VIP about my glasses not reaching full charge.


c'mon guys, im getting sick of watching movies with a USB cable dangling from my head.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20648142
> 
> 
> Uuum...would you be interested in trading? Heh!
> 
> 
> For now I believe the charge chip is draining them when off for lack of any other answer. The internal board is just a receiver and charging controller and whatever they use to shutter the LCDs.
> 
> 
> It's still amazes me how the Monstervision thread is quiet on this problem.



Well I hope they figure it out...I would like to order more pair of glasses at some point.


I don't dare try to use anything other than the old LG phone charger that seems to work great with my glasses. I was thinking maybe your power source could be burning out the charger circuit in every pair you get. Just seems weird every pair screw up for you.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20648142
> 
> 
> Uuum...would you be interested in trading? Heh!
> 
> 
> For now I believe the charge chip is draining them when off for lack of any other answer. The internal board is just a receiver and charging controller and whatever they use to shutter the LCDs.
> 
> 
> It's still amazes me how the Monstervision thread is quiet on this problem.



Not totally. Post #23 in that thread details that user Eurotrance had charging/charge retention problems with 3 different pairs of the Monster glasses.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20648179
> 
> 
> Well I hope they figure it out...I would like to order more pair of glasses at some point.
> 
> 
> I don't dare try to use anything other than the old LG phone charger that seems to work great with my glasses. I was thinking maybe your power source could be burning out the charger circuit in every pair you get. Just seems weird every pair screw up for you.



Not quite, I've used 3 different charging stations from PC to standalones and it doesn't make any difference. Besides if they expect exact 5VDC sources for these then they need to avoid the consumer market and cater to labs. Everything I've used should meet their USB requirements.


Also as long as the charging station has the available (mah) it will not need to provide any more current than the unit requires from it. What you seem to be describing would be an overvoltage source issue exceeding the charging circuit's rating if that were the case.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20648431
> 
> 
> Not totally. Post #23 in that thread details that user Eurotrance had charging/charge retention problems with 3 different pairs of the Monster glasses.



Thanks for pointing that one out which I missed. Will forward a copy to VIP.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20647873
> 
> 
> First I consider it Bit Cauldron's responsibility, second none of us knows VIP staffing; I would think they have enough on their plate with product development and support issues plus order fulfillment.
> 
> 
> To test these glasses and I've already proved to them at this point it is meaningless and my results have already been forwarded to BC for review.
> 
> 
> 1. Determine the charge time to reach spec'd battery voltage of 3.71-3.74vdc. This means taking the battery out each time for measurement and resinstalling with the risk of stripping the screw or kinking the ribbon cable.
> 
> 
> 2. Test Power On for subsequent day or remove battery again for drain test to check for any loss of charge.
> 
> 
> 3. On third day remove battery again and see if it retained specified charge voltage prior to shipping.
> 
> 
> 
> My most recent test on replacements received last week show complete battery failure within 72 hours with the units off.
> 
> 
> Personally I wouldn't mind occasional removal of the battery when it is spent to keep the glasses in service. But the frequency of the above comes with risk of cracking the traces on the ribbon cable from flexure.
> 
> 
> VIP could do this without removing the battery but then they would have to keep track how long the battery maintains charge over time. Can they wait to see if it makes it 30 days or whatever? In the meantime folks want their glasses so then you start catching hell with order fulfillment. Thats just a no load test, how long do you set aside time for full load test on each pair of glasses before sending to customers?
> 
> 
> Bit Cauldron should be doing this not VIP.



In the business I work in, ultimately the person taking the money from the customer has a responsibility to make sure the product provided works as advertised. Whether that means testing themselves, or forcing their supplier to test, is their business.


If testing slows the delivery of orders, but actually results in working gear in the customer's hands, that's a necessary evil, imo.


In any event, all these problems are really making me rethink purchasing the product.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20648566
> 
> 
> Not quite, I've used 3 different charging stations from PC to standalones and it doesn't make any difference. Besides if they expect exact 5VDC sources for these then they need to avoid the consumer market and cater to labs. Everything I've used should meet their USB requirements.



Both VIP and Bit Cauldron should be shipping power/charging supplies with these products IMHO!


look at the problems people had with the VIP units with power supplies that didn't supply enough current. Just leaves a bad taste and poor reviews that turn away potential buyers. I bet they have lost a lot of sales already.


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20648582
> 
> 
> Thanks for pointing that one out which I missed. Will forward a copy to VIP.



I think this guys solved it using an old cell phone charger!

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post20276431


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Ronomy* /forum/post/20648650
> 
> 
> I think this guys solved it using an old cell phone charger!



A Blackberry one, I think.


It would be interesting to examine circuit boards from the VIP and Monster glasses side-by-side. Perhaps Monster had test examples first (they were somewhat earlier to market, after all), found issues, and specified some changes that have not been made for other OEM sellers. The contract between Monster and Bit Cauldron may very well provide for such things...


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nathan_h* /forum/post/20648589
> 
> 
> In the business I work in, ultimately the person taking the money from the customer has a responsibility to make sure the product provided works as advertised. Whether that means testing themselves, or forcing their supplier to test, is their business.
> 
> 
> If testing slows the delivery of orders, but actually results in working gear in the customer's hands, that's a necessary evil, imo.
> 
> 
> In any event, all these problems are really making me rethink purchasing the product.




VIP is in the background trying to work a solution to this but a resolution

hasn't been found as yet.



For now the VIP product is fine as long as you've researched your video display's compatibility. The RF glasses have been the issue for some of us.


You can avoid that by going IR or DLP Link type glasses depending on your needs. They are not without caveats either. There's plenty of glasses threads in Tech Talk showing the merits of other types.


----------



## nathan_h




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20648689
> 
> 
> VIP is in the background trying to work a solution to this but a resolution
> 
> hasn't been found as yet.
> 
> 
> 
> For now the VIP product is fine as long as you've researched your video display's compatibility. The RF glasses have been the issue for some of us.
> 
> 
> You can avoid that by going IR or DLP Link type glasses depending on your needs. They are not without caveats either. There's plenty of glasses threads in Tech Talk showing the merits of other types.



Thanks. I've got a front projection LCOS projector, so DLP link is out, and IR is problematic in my setup. I'll take a look at the RF glasses threads and see if there is a cost effective alternative.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20648673
> 
> 
> A Blackberry one, I think.
> 
> 
> It would be interesting to examine circuit boards from the VIP and Monster glasses side-by-side. Perhaps Monster had test examples first (they were somewhat earlier to market, after all), found issues, and specified some changes that have not been made for other OEM sellers. The contract between Monster and Bit Cauldron may very well provide for such things...



I'm using a blackberry charger and getting inconsistent charging. If I could get my hands on a couple batteries I have access to charger EVM's where I work to set up some tests.


----------



## mkoss

Solved my sync issue by using HDFury 2 in between the displayer and my Optoma HD7100. Watched entire movie with no sync issue. Went in via component. 2 more pj's to test. Maybe I'm prejudice but the 3D was stunning on this DLP with no ghosting.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *darockk* /forum/post/20648170
> 
> 
> 4 weeks and still no reply from VIP about my glasses not reaching full charge.
> 
> 
> c'mon guys, im getting sick of watching movies with a USB cable dangling from my head.



How long do you charge them and how long does it last?


I wish I could tell you the replacements would be better but the last set I

received last week won't hold charge either. So I will be temporarily tethered for a reasonable time for a solution to come forth. Taking a break from shipping these things back and forth.


If you haven't heard from VIPs support then email Jonathan and let him know how long you've been waiting on this.


( [email protected] )


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20651646
> 
> 
> Solved my sync issue by using HDFury 2 in between the displayer and my Optoma HD7100. Watched entire movie with no sync issue. Went in via component. 2 more pj's to test. Maybe I'm prejudice but the 3D was stunning on this DLP with no ghosting.



Glad you happy with the results, can't relate with the method you are accomplishing it with though.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20652492
> 
> 
> Glad you happy with the results, can't relate with the method you are accomplishing it with though.



The HDFury2 is a device that converts HDMI to component/VGA without compromising picture quality. Also does not resync like my scaler. Same resolution in and out. It is meant to allow pj's without HDMI and CRT pj's to see same quality as HDMI. I bought it couple years ago before it was outlawed by the HDMI police in the US. It is still available overseas. It is a wonderful device. There are later versions of it. Looks like price went up as well.


----------



## SgtVideo

Bit Cauldron has reviewed the problem glasses that were submitted to them and made this determination:

_"A small batch of controller PCBs happened to have a resistor mounted by hand, and the resistor used was the wrong value. This caused erroneous charge behavior. Replacing the resistor with the proper value corrects the charging behavior."_


For the moment I don't have information to post for those who have this defect and will post it at first opportunity for you to seek replacments.


I would guess this will be a direct exchange with Bit Cauldron, will try to get confirmed instructions and post later.


Glad they figured this out!


----------



## eschlene

So what about passive? I was looking at the LG setup in the store and, honestly, thought passive was just as good. Plus it would be far less expensive since this is, afterall, a home theatre where I may have 8 or 9 people viewing at a time.


Will the VIP unit display 3d output capable of passive viewing? Sorry, I've read the posts, but I'm still not clear on the formats. It would seem that a passive format would not be that much different than the one with the active shutter signal.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *eschlene* /forum/post/20664840
> 
> 
> So what about passive? I was looking at the LG setup in the store and, honestly, thought passive was just as good. Plus it would be far less expensive since this is, afterall, a home theatre where I may have 8 or 9 people viewing at a time.
> 
> 
> Will the VIP unit display 3d output capable of passive viewing? Sorry, I've read the posts, but I'm still not clear on the formats. It would seem that a passive format would not be that much different than the one with the active shutter signal.



The display format (active vs passive) is display-dependent, not source-dependent, so the VIP will output to passive displays as well as active.


----------



## eschlene




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20665444
> 
> 
> The display format (active vs passive) is display-dependent, not source-dependent, so the VIP will output to passive displays as well as active.



That would seem to make the vip even more valuable. If my LG blu-ray player can output a 3D image for passive glasses, and I send the signal through the vip to my mits hd1000u, I can afford to buy many more passive glasses for the occaisional 3D party in the HT.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *eschlene* /forum/post/20664840
> 
> 
> So what about passive? I was looking at the LG setup in the store and, honestly, thought passive was just as good. Plus it would be far less expensive since this is, afterall, a home theatre where I may have 8 or 9 people viewing at a time.
> 
> 
> Will the VIP unit display 3d output capable of passive viewing? Sorry, I've read the posts, but I'm still not clear on the formats. It would seem that a passive format would not be that much different than the one with the active shutter signal.



The VIP unit supports active shutter technology, either by RF, IR or DLP Link.


Passive technology utilizes circular polarization between the left and right eye lenses to separate frame information. I won't bother to get in depth on that subject as the information is readily available on the internet.


My wife and I usually view the 3D movies at our local Movie Tavern which uses RealD 3D passive glasses system. The RealD system does a fine job but when we view the same movies at home with the RF active shutter glasses it just seems there is more depth and that's at 60hz. Those using the 120Hz versions do not get a pronounced flicker effect as one would at the lower frequency.


Speaking in generalities I believe the shuttering effect gives a truer channel/frame separation than what passive accomplishes which might have a slight bleedover effect. Held tilt can effect how passive polarized information is received to the eyes.


Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoy what RealD has done. I just feel the shutter technology does a little better job image wise but at a price differential because of how the glasses function.


There are some weaknesses with IR and DLP Link that RF glasses overcome and give the user more flexibility of movement.


I'll leave that for those users to comment on if they wish since I own RF glasses.


IF you feel you get more bang for your buck with passive by all means go for it. You won't be making a bad decision if your satisfied with what you see.


The VIP units were designed for those wishing to turn non-3D displays into 3D capable displays.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *eschlene* /forum/post/20665478
> 
> 
> That would seem to make the vip even more valuable. If my LG blu-ray player can output a 3D image for passive glasses, and I send the signal through the vip to my mits hd1000u, I can afford to buy many more passive glasses for the occaisional 3D party in the HT.



Your HD1000U is not a 3D passive display projector so passive glasses wouldn't work. I haven't even mentioned screen design optimized for passive polarized systems. There are more informed sources than myself on that subject.


It is capable of 60Hz active shutter. The V-sync range is 85Hz. I get some flicker at 60hz but I'm tolerant of it, some aren't.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20665584
> 
> 
> The VIP unit supports active shutter technology, either by RF, IR or DLP Link.
> 
> 
> Passive technology utilizes circular polarization between the left and right eye lenses to separate frame information. I won't bother to get in depth on that subject as the information is readily available on the internet.
> 
> 
> My wife and I usually view the 3D movies at our local Movie Tavern which uses RealD 3D passive glasses system. The RealD system does a fine job but when we view the same movies at home with the RF active shutter glasses it just seems there is more depth and that's at 60hz. Those using the 120Hz versions do not get a pronounced flicker effect as one would at the lower frequency.
> 
> 
> Speaking in generalities I believe the shuttering effect gives a truer channel/frame separation than what passive accomplishes which might have a slight bleedover effect. Held tilt can effect how passive polarized information is received to the eyes.
> 
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoy what RealD has done. I just feel the shutter technology does a little better job image wise but at a price differential because of how the glasses function.
> 
> 
> There are some weaknesses with IR and DLP Link that RF glasses overcome and give the user more flexibility of movement.
> 
> 
> I'll leave that for those users to comment on if they wish since I own RF glasses.
> 
> 
> IF you feel you get more bang for your buck with passive by all means go for it. You won't be making a bad decision if your satisfied with what you see.
> 
> 
> The VIP units were designed for those wishing to turn non-3D displays into 3D capable displays.



I believe the VIP can support passive glasses by utilizing a polarity rotator placed in front of the projector along with a screen that maintains polarization. The sync from the VIP would control the rotator. I am eventually headed down this path but need to understand all the drawbacks before I leap in. The cost of the rotator will be around 400 dollars and have same adjustments the RF glasses possess.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *eschlene* /forum/post/20665478
> 
> 
> That would seem to make the vip even more valuable. If my LG blu-ray player can output a 3D image for passive glasses, and I send the signal through the vip to my mits hd1000u, I can afford to buy many more passive glasses for the occaisional 3D party in the HT.



As the responses above indicate, and to qualify what I stated... the VIP will output to passive displays as well as active, _but you need a passive display setup in order to use passive glasses._


----------



## mkoss

Now that I have 3 60 hz pj's working withe the Displayer 2 LCD and 1 DLP and 1 to DLP go. Two of these require going in through component via HDFury2. Both LCD's needed tweeking during different scenes to get rid of ghosting which only the RF glasses allow adjustments. The DLP only required polarity.


----------



## bloodta

I have a few questions about the 3D Displayer, and if they have been answered earlier in the thread I apologize. Can anyone confirm if this works with the Epson 6500ub? Does it always down convert to 720p or is just for certain display device? I have an Onkyo TX SR805 receiver, an Epson Powerlite HC 6500UB projector. I just want to know if it will work correctly with my setup before I plunk down the money for this thing. thanks


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bloodta* /forum/post/20677227
> 
> 
> I have a few questions about the 3D Displayer, and if they have been answered earlier in the thread I apologize. Can anyone confirm if this works with the Epson 6500ub? Does it always down convert to 720p or is just for certain display device? I have an Onkyo TX SR805 receiver, an Epson Powerlite HC 6500UB projector. I just want to know if it will work correctly with my setup before I plunk down the money for this thing. thanks



You asked the same thing in the theater thread and got answers. The difference between the displayer and theater is that the theater does everything the displayer does including cable and internet streamed video I believe.


----------



## bloodta




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20677267
> 
> 
> You asked the same thing in the theater thread and got answers. The difference between the displayer and theater is that the theater does everything the displayer does including cable and internet streamed video I believe.



Yes I did, and as you suggested in your reply to my original post in the other thread, I checked this one. I got some answers in that thread, I did not get a specific answer to the question about my particular projector.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *bloodta* /forum/post/20677227
> 
> 
> I have a few questions about the 3D Displayer, and if they have been answered earlier in the thread I apologize. Can anyone confirm if this works with the Epson 6500ub? Does it always down convert to 720p or is just for certain display device? I have an Onkyo TX SR805 receiver, an Epson Powerlite HC 6500UB projector. I just want to know if it will work correctly with my setup before I plunk down the money for this thing. thanks



First I can't confirm it works with the Epson 6500 as I am not an owner. Looking at the spec section of the manual indicate to me that the odds are it will. You will be only limited to the 60Hz use so you will experience flicker like some of us, I find it acceptable. The other unknown is whether the Epson would have a frame-lock issue.


The manual was vague on which HDMI version interface but since it's manufacture is in the 2008-2010 range it is probably 1.2a or 1.3 so that shouldn't be an issue.


As far as working correctly with the Onkyo your on your own. It's hit and miss whether AVRs will pass 3D correctly without some due diligence on your part researching the experiences of other users of Onkyo's AVRs. So checkout those relevant threads on AVS.


I'm guessing at this point you haven't added a 3D BD player as you haven't mentioned what 3D content you are interested in viewing.


I recommend that folks when receiving a VIP device at first is to basically "breadboard" the device into the system. By that I mean simple, short hookups from 3D playback device>VIP Unit>Video Display.


Prove that a basic hookup functions before adding in AVRs and HDMI switchers and such.


Personally, I would also communicate with VIP support and see if they are aware of successful installations of your particular model. They try to help customers get this equipment working on a global basis. If you take a chance on making a purchase as long as you make a reasonable effort in getting their units operating to your satisfaction, I don't believe you will have any problem returning it for a refund. Since 3D glasses have a hygiene issue for returns you might have to find another use or buyer for them unless defective.


If your not the patient type that is willing to put some time into resolving a problem then you might not want to pursue this. Most of the time it isn't PnP.


Sorry I couldn't answer this in one neat package but there are too many variables to give a yes or no response for your particular setup.


----------



## bloodta




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20677444
> 
> 
> First I can't confirm it works with the Epson 6500 as I am not an owner. Looking at the spec section of the manual indicate to me that the odds are it will. You will be only limited to the 60Hz use so you will experience flicker like some of us, I find it acceptable. The other unknown is whether the Epson would have a frame-lock issue.
> 
> 
> The manual was vague on which HDMI version interface but since it's manufacture is in the 2008-2010 range it is probably 1.2a or 1.3 so that shouldn't be an issue.
> 
> 
> As far as working correctly with the Onkyo your on your own. It's hit and miss whether AVRs will pass 3D correctly without some due diligence on your part researching the experiences of other users of Onkyo's AVRs. So checkout those relevant threads on AVS.
> 
> 
> I'm guessing at this point you haven't added a 3D BD player as you haven't mentioned what 3D content you are interested in viewing.
> 
> 
> I recommend that folks when receiving a VIP device at first is to basically "breadboard" the device into the system. By that I mean simple, short hookups from 3D playback device>VIP Unit>Video Display.
> 
> 
> Prove that a basic hookup functions before adding in AVRs and HDMI switchers and such.
> 
> 
> Personally, I would also communicate with VIP support and see if they are aware of successful installations of your particular model. They try to help customers get this equipment working on a global basis. If you take a chance on making a purchase as long as you make a reasonable effort in getting their units operating to your satisfaction, I don't believe you will have any problem returning it for a refund. Since 3D glasses have a hygiene issue for returns you might have to find another use or buyer for them unless defective.
> 
> 
> If your not the patient type that is willing to put some time into resolving a problem then you might not want to pursue this. Most of the time it isn't PnP.
> 
> 
> Sorry I couldn't answer this in one neat package but there are too many variables to give a yes or no response for your particular setup.



Thanks for the reply. I want to use the Displayer model because I'm only interested in 3D Blurays. I have read from the other thread that someone used the Onkyo 805 successfully. Also, I believe the projector is HDMI 1.3 compliant. I haven't purchased a 3D BD player yet because I'm still in the researching phase and don't want to commit yet.


----------



## avswilier

i have mild sensitivity to flicker i see in active glasses, but I have tried them only in very brightly lit showrooms. i note that some people mention that at 30Hz/eye, there is some noticeable flicker, but I would like to understand when this problem is exacerbated.


I plan to play PS3 3D games and watch 3D Blurays via my "fat" PS3 and Da-Lite HP 2.4 screen, in a quite dark room.


Does the flicker problem diminish as you darken the whole room, and why?

Does the flicker problem diminish as you lower the picture brightness, and why?


Thanks in advance.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/20682941
> 
> 
> i have mild sensitivity to flicker i see in active glasses, but I have tried them only in very brightly lit showrooms. i note that some people mention that at 30Hz/eye, there is some noticeable flicker, but I would like to understand when this problem is exacerbated.
> 
> 
> I plan to play PS3 3D games and watch 3D Blurays via my "fat" PS3 and Da-Lite HP 2.4 screen, in a quite dark room.
> 
> 
> Does the flicker problem diminish as you darken the whole room, and why?
> 
> Does the flicker problem diminish as you lower the picture brightness, and why?
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance.



You won't even notice it in dark scenes just bright. I find you get accustomed to it. Doing 60 Hz I believe requires the RF glasses whether you have LCD or DLP. DLP is easier to adjust the glasses from my experience.


----------



## Star56




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/20682941
> 
> 
> i have mild sensitivity to flicker i see in active glasses, but I have tried them only in very brightly lit showrooms. i note that some people mention that at 30Hz/eye, there is some noticeable flicker, but I would like to understand when this problem is exacerbated.
> 
> 
> I plan to play PS3 3D games and watch 3D Blurays via my "fat" PS3 and Da-Lite HP 2.4 screen, in a quite dark room.
> 
> 
> Does the flicker problem diminish as you darken the whole room, and why?
> 
> Does the flicker problem diminish as you lower the picture brightness, and why?
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance.



Flicker was terrible on my 60hz projector (HD20) and plasma screen. I tweaked it and tweaked it and it was just too much to tolerate.


On my Acer 120hz, perfection! Zero flicker.


----------



## avswilier

thanks for the feedback.. i would really love some add-on like the VIP Displayer, but the only 3D I have found truly comfortable using is the LG Passive 3D TV... decisions decisions!!! unfortunately, my 8 year old Sony Plasma refuses to die... grrrrr


----------



## Yeek

I connect my 3d Displayer like this:


3d BD player > 3d VIP > AVR > Projector (AE4000). I got picture but only stereo sound as I have yet to update the firmware.


when I connect it this way:


3d BD player > AVR > 3d VIP > Projector (AE4000) I got no picture at all.


It seems several people have reported on this forum the same issue. Has anyone managed to solve this?


My last resort is to use the 1st setup above and use my 2nd HDMI out just to carry sound to AVR.


----------



## avswilier




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Yeek* /forum/post/20683840
> 
> 
> I connect my 3d Displayer like this:
> 
> 
> 3d BD player > 3d VIP > AVR > Projector (AE4000). I got picture but only stereo sound as I have yet to update the firmware.



Hi Yeek


How do you find the flickering using a AE4000, as I have the same PJ and wish to buy the Displayer, I am looking for some hands on user feedback. Also, which RF glasses are you using? cheers.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Yeek* /forum/post/20683840
> 
> 
> I connect my 3d Displayer like this:
> 
> 
> 3d BD player > 3d VIP > AVR > Projector (AE4000). I got picture but only stereo sound as I have yet to update the firmware.
> 
> 
> when I connect it this way:
> 
> 
> 3d BD player > AVR > 3d VIP > Projector (AE4000) I got no picture at all.
> 
> 
> It seems several people have reported on this forum the same issue. Has anyone managed to solve this?
> 
> 
> My last resort is to use the 1st setup above and use my 2nd HDMI out just to carry sound to AVR.



Hi Yeek, I posted some recommendations on your post at Curt Palme so there is not need to repeat them here. Check it out when you get a chance.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/20683892
> 
> 
> Hi Yeek
> 
> 
> How do you find the flickering using a AE4000, as I have the same PJ and wish to buy the Displayer, I am looking for some hands on user feedback. Also, which RF glasses are you using? cheers.



As an AE4000 owner I was more than satisfied with the results from the Displayer. You will have to run it at 60Hz and yes there is flicker in bright high contrast scenes, whether you are as tolerable as myself cannot be answered. It certainly wasn't a deal breaker for me.


Most of us are using the VIP RF glasses which are made by the same manufactuer for MonsterVision. Since there is a tuning mode some of the adjustments can moderate the flicker effect. So you end up tweaking to find the best compromise.


Brightness levels were good on a 88" 2.35 Carada 1.3g screen and 92" Da-Lite HP screen in Eco-mode.


If you ever add a DLP 120hz projector down the road then all have to do is flip dipswitch#1 up for 120. When there is a closeout on the Acer5360 or Optoma HD66 I might end up with one of those as well.


Main issues are whether your AVR will interfere with the 3D signal depending on where you place the VIP in the system. But there are work arounds, you will see some by reviewing the past threads in here.


----------



## avswilier




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> 
> As an AE4000 owner I was more than satisfied with the results from the Displayer. You will have to run it at 60Hz and yes there is flicker in bright high contrast scenes, whether you are as tolerable as myself cannot be answered. It certainly wasn't a deal breaker for me.
> 
> 
> Most of us are using the VIP RF glasses which are made by the same manufactuer for MonsterVision. Since there is a tuning mode some of the adjustments can moderate the flicker effect. So you end up tweaking to find the best compromise.
> 
> 
> Brightness levels were good on a 88" 2.35 Carada 1.3g screen and 92" Da-Lite HP screen in Eco-mode.
> 
> 
> If you ever add a DLP 120hz projector down the road then all have to do is flip dipswitch#1 up for 120. When there is a closeout on the Acer5360 or Optoma HD66 I might end up with one of those as well.
> 
> 
> Main issues are whether your AVR will interfere with the 3D signal depending on where you place the VIP in the system. But there are work arounds, you will see some by reviewing the past threads in here.



I won't have an AVR, so one less complication







seems like come end of July the Hk dealer will start selling so I will likely get the VIP RF glasses, emitter, and displayer... I have an 88" HP so brightness should be sufficient


----------



## Yeek

THanks SgtVideo. As for the flicker, I'm still trying to tweak the delay and stuff....will know once I get it going


----------



## SgtVideo

It appears VIP3D will be handling the processing of RF glasses that we have discussed previously in our threads here.


If you feel yours are part of that problem group, here is the email address at VIP3D support that will assist you.


Include in your email a description of your charging method, how soon failure occurred, no power On, that kind of stuff so they can make a determination.


It was estimated about 25 problem glasses may have gone through production with the incorrect charging resistor. Hopefully we are done with battery problems!


Contact: *[email protected]*


----------



## Brian Hampton

I'd like to know how to determine if my BC glasses have the fault.


I had to use them plugged in once. Other times I was able to charge them a few hours before watching and then getting through a movie was no problem.


Seems the blinking led always indicated I only had 10% charge but with my use that's all I "need".


Basically,... I think my glasses have the problem but I would like a way to say for sure one way or another.


-Brian


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20693598
> 
> 
> I'd like to know how to determine if my BC glasses have the fault.
> 
> 
> I had to use them plugged in once. Other times I was able to charge them a few hours before watching and then getting through a movie was no problem.
> 
> 
> Seems the blinking led always indicated I only had 10% charge but with my use that's all I "need".
> 
> 
> Basically,... I think my glasses have the problem but I would like a way to say for sure one way or another.
> 
> 
> -Brian



In my case, one set you would get normal heartbeat after charging but 5-6 days later they wouldn't power ON. Another set would only last 55 minutes when viewing or be completely dead within 3 days and no power ON.


If yours have been left off for like a couple weeks and they still turn On, then your probably good. The problem usually indicates pretty quick.


The incorrect charge resistor never allowed them to get above the 30% level and whatever slight voltage drain took it down enough to disable the power On.


----------



## Brian Hampton

No,


I went to check... they don't power on unless they are coming off being on the charger for a few hours. I've never got them to keep a charge overnight.


It's hard for me to be sure though if they are defective because I use them sparsely.


I do believe they are defective and I also don't want to burden 3D-Vip since I'm very happy with the products they deliver.


-Brian


----------



## Ronomy




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20694681
> 
> 
> No,
> 
> 
> I went to check... they don't power on unless they are coming off being on the charger for a few hours. I've never got them to keep a charge overnight.
> 
> 
> It's hard for me to be sure though if they are defective because I use them sparsely.
> 
> 
> I do believe they are defective and I also don't want to burden 3D-Vip since I'm very happy with the products they deliver.
> 
> 
> -Brian



I have glasses that sat over a month and still worked fine for a movie. I think you need to send yours in.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20694681
> 
> 
> No,
> 
> 
> I went to check... they don't power on unless they are coming off being on the charger for a few hours. I've never got them to keep a charge overnight.
> 
> 
> It's hard for me to be sure though if they are defective because I use them sparsely.
> 
> 
> I do believe they are defective and I also don't want to burden 3D-Vip since I'm very happy with the products they deliver.
> 
> 
> -Brian



Brian,


Just go ahead and give them a 4 hour charge and leave them alone for 3 days and if they don't keep a charge then send an email to their support address. Document what you've done with them and include that info in your support email.


VIP didn't make the product but they understand the responsibility of selling another company's material. Hopefully there are only 25 bad ones out here.


----------



## SgtVideo

I went ahead and tried a pair of IR glasses, HI-Shock brand, just to see the difference since I never had any. One thing I noticed compared to the RF glasses the perceived brightness is lower. Part of it is understandable because there are no adjustments but has anyone else done a side by side comparison of the two?


----------



## mkoss

Quote:

Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* 
I went ahead and tried a pair of IR glasses, HI-Shock brand, just to see the difference since I never had any. One thing I noticed compared to the RF glasses the perceived brightness is lower. Part of it is understandable because there are no adjustments but has anyone else done a side by side comparison of the two?
There ok for 120 hz operation or if you just need to compensate phase for 60 Hz. RF is much better.


----------



## avswilier

For movies that are part of the PS3 Store, are these using frame packing? can the Displayer handle these?


----------



## Vancomycin

Will the VIP Theatre work with the Sony XBR 4 ?


Anyone has experience with such a set up?

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-LlX4L4t...DL-46XBR4.html


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Vancomycin* /forum/post/20709138
> 
> 
> Will the VIP Theatre work with the Sony XBR 4 ?
> 
> 
> Anyone has experience with such a set up?
> 
> http://www.crutchfield.com/S-LlX4L4t...DL-46XBR4.html



If you search the actual Theater thread, you'll find someone has discussed using one with an XBR set.


----------



## dbshelton

I have a Panasonic BDT110 Bluray player, and an Epson Pro Cinema 810 LCD projector (720p). Will the Displayer work for me? I know my DLP link 3D glasses won't work, but what about my Ultra Clear 3D glasses with the IR transmitter that I use with my Mitsubishi DLP TV?


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/0
> 
> 
> For movies that are part of the PS3 Store, are these using frame packing? can the Displayer handle these?



Yes.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20736194
> 
> 
> I have a Panasonic BDT110 Bluray player, and an Epson Pro Cinema 810 LCD projector (720p). Will the Displayer work for me? I know my DLP link 3D glasses won't work, but what about my Ultra Clear 3D glasses with the IR transmitter that I use with my Mitsubishi DLP TV?



I can't find in any specs the refresh rate for 720P, but I find it hard to believe it wouldn't support 720P/60Hz. So I'm guessing it should work in that mode.


You should be able to connect your IR emitter to the Displayer's emitter port and use the IR Ultra Clear.


Next question is whether the Epson has any frame-locking issues and I just don't know.


If I were you before ordering I would still send an email to Jonathan at VIP3D and get his opinion. That way if significant time goes by and there is an issue that can't be resolved you would be able to get a full refund on an inoperable product.


He is reasonable about things like that.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20736194
> 
> 
> I have a Panasonic BDT110 Bluray player, and an Epson Pro Cinema 810 LCD projector (720p). Will the Displayer work for me? I know my DLP link 3D glasses won't work, but what about my Ultra Clear 3D glasses with the IR transmitter that I use with my Mitsubishi DLP TV?





> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20739099
> 
> 
> You should be able to connect your IR emitter to the Displayer's emitter port and use the IR Ultra Clear.



Unless I'm mistaken, dbshelton's projector isn't 3D-ready. Would be wise to check that the emitter & ultra clears can sync at 60hz... not all emitters/glasses will.


If not, may need to go with the VIP IR glasses or Bit Cauldron setup.


----------



## dbshelton

Projector will do 60hz at 720p but is not 3D-ready. I sent VIP an email and will see if they have any ideas.

What do you mean by "Frame Locking Issues?"

Thanks.


----------



## SgtVideo




thebard said:


> Unless I'm mistaken, dbshelton's projector isn't 3D-ready. Would be wise to check that the emitter & ultra clears can sync at 60hz... not all emitters/glasses will.
> 
> 
> I got mixed up on that because I have a set of Hi-Shock IR glasses which work with the Displayer by attaching an IR emitter to it's port. I guess the
> 
> Ultra Clears will not run below 120hz, the Hi-Shocks made for VIP will.
> 
> 
> There wasn't much I could find in his specs for his particular model Epson, it appears the least it could do is [email protected] 3D Ready or not.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20739378
> 
> 
> Projector will do 60hz at 720p but is not 3D-ready. I sent VIP an email and will see if they have any ideas.
> 
> What do you mean by "Frame Locking Issues?"
> 
> Thanks.



In my case my Samsung rear proj. DLP will have a perfectly tuned 3D picture and within a few minutes drift out and develop ghosting and color distortions.

It will within the same time fram gradually resync. This goes on in a continuous repeated pattern.


Other individuals have the same problem but they may never have sync because at no point in the viewing cycle are the frames locked or synced.


My Panasonic AE4000 does not have any of these issues and works fine.


So in your case unless someone else on the boards has proven use of the VIP model with your Epson then I cannot say you won't experience frame locking issues.


Like you said you wrote VIP so maybe they already know from their customer base that the particular Epson you have works.


Let us know what you find out.


----------



## mkoss

I've been playing around between using the Displayer with my 3D BR player and using the Monoprice for side by side source material. I'm very happy I went this route vs's the theater, primarily because the Monoprice can handle 1080P 50/60 hz side by side to DLP Link/anaglyph. This saves about a $100 in the process and gives me more versatility. The only negative with the Monoprice is it does not pass 1080P/24hz 3D BR. This is an inconvience for some including me but not a show stopper.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20742517
> 
> 
> I've been playing around between using the Displayer with my 3D BR player and using the Monoprice for side by side source material. I'm very happy I went this route vs's the theater, primarily because the Monoprice can handle 1080P 50/60 hz side by side to DLP Link/anaglyph. This saves about a $100 in the process and gives me more versatility. The only negative with the Monoprice is it does not pass 1080P/24hz 3D BR. This is an inconvience for some including me but not a show stopper.




What kind of source content have you found in anaglyph?


As a kid I remember one of the 3D Sci-Fi movies "It Came From Outer Space", they handed out the B/R glasses for that one if my memory is functioning correctly today.


----------



## falafala




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *mkoss* /forum/post/20742517
> 
> 
> I've been playing around between using the Displayer with my 3D BR player and using the Monoprice for side by side source material. I'm very happy I went this route vs's the theater, primarily because the Monoprice can handle 1080P 50/60 hz side by side to DLP Link/anaglyph. This saves about a $100 in the process and gives me more versatility. The only negative with the Monoprice is it does not pass 1080P/24hz 3D BR. This is an inconvience for some including me but not a show stopper.



could you please give more details of what this Monoprice product is ? thanks


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20748539
> 
> 
> What kind of source content have you found in anaglyph?
> 
> 
> As a kid I remember one of the 3D Sci-Fi movies "It Came From Outer Space", they handed out the B/R glasses for that one if my memory is functioning correctly today.



There are some movies out there in anaglyph but what I'm talking about is the Monoprice wiil convert side by side half 720P/1080P 50/60 Hz to either red cayan analglph for 2D displays or to DLP Link for 3D DLP displays. With the DLP link glasses, you get true 3D. So if you have side by side on cable or access to movies converted to side by side the monoprice will give true 3D besides also doing a reasonable job at 2D to 3D conversion adding depth.


----------



## Star56




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20748539
> 
> 
> What kind of source content have you found in anaglyph?
> 
> 
> As a kid I remember one of the 3D Sci-Fi movies "It Came From Outer Space", they handed out the B/R glasses for that one if my memory is functioning correctly today.



Nope your memory fails you







It was not anaglyph it was the Polaroid active system.

http://www.3dfilmpf.org/3d-film-expo...ter_Space.html


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Star56* /forum/post/20752657
> 
> 
> Nope your memory fails you
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It was not anaglyph it was the Polaroid active system.
> 
> http://www.3dfilmpf.org/3d-film-expo...ter_Space.html



Ahh yes indeed, thanks for that link!


One thing I do miss living in this area is a nostalgic theater. When living in Va. there was one that had a different theme each month. On one occasion the entire month was all classic 3D movies and they handed out the glasses, double features. Guess it isn't the profitable to do that anymore, although our local Movie Tavern has a Retro night twice a week set aside on one of their screens. So far they haven't ventured into the 50's era.


The Egyptian Theater in that link reminds me of that.


----------



## dbshelton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20739626
> 
> 
> In my case my Samsung rear proj. DLP will have a perfectly tuned 3D picture and within a few minutes drift out and develop ghosting and color distortions.
> 
> It will within the same time fram gradually resync. This goes on in a continuous repeated pattern.
> 
> 
> Other individuals have the same problem but they may never have sync because at no point in the viewing cycle are the frames locked or synced.
> 
> 
> My Panasonic AE4000 does not have any of these issues and works fine.
> 
> 
> So in your case unless someone else on the boards has proven use of the VIP model with your Epson then I cannot say you won't experience frame locking issues.
> 
> 
> Like you said you wrote VIP so maybe they already know from their customer base that the particular Epson you have works.
> 
> 
> Let us know what you find out.



So far no response from VIP. Are they noted for crappy customer service?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20758726
> 
> 
> So far no response from VIP. Are they noted for crappy customer service?



I guess you could review the threads to find out, or maybe they can't answer your question at this point. How long ago did you write?


----------



## dbshelton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20758927
> 
> 
> I guess you could review the threads to find out, or maybe they can't answer your question at this point. How long ago did you write?



I haven't given up yet. It's been about a week. Just sent them another email.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *falafala* /forum/post/20748826
> 
> 
> could you please give more details of what this Monoprice product is ? thanks



First off check the posts on this device in another topic of its own. Esentially it can handle 2D and 3D side by side source material. It will convert 2D to 3D reasonably adding depth for 2D and 3D displays. It does pass through except frame packed BR 3D. It will convert 3D side by side to red/cayan anaglyph or 3D DLP Link. I think this device along with the displayer gives me many options for viewing on both 3D and non3D pj's


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20736194
> 
> 
> I have a Panasonic BDT110 Bluray player, and an Epson Pro Cinema 810 LCD projector (720p). Will the Displayer work for me? I know my DLP link 3D glasses won't work, but what about my Ultra Clear 3D glasses with the IR transmitter that I use with my Mitsubishi DLP TV?



I think most likely this will work with the displayer with the added caveat that you will most likely need the RF glasses as well for ghosting. The fact that it has an HDMI input reduces the likely hood of having interface issues but not 100%guaranteed. i had problems with my pj's that have DVI inputs but solved those by fortunately having a HDFury2 to go in through component.


----------



## Brian Hampton

I have only great customer service. It's a small company though so sometimes it's not instant.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dbshelton* /forum/post/20736194
> 
> 
> I have a Panasonic BDT110 Bluray player, and an Epson Pro Cinema 810 LCD projector (720p). Will the Displayer work for me? I know my DLP link 3D glasses won't work, but what about my Ultra Clear 3D glasses with the IR transmitter that I use with my Mitsubishi DLP TV?



I spoke to Jonathan last night about your question and yes he is behind on email. He's been on travel alot plus working with Bit Cauldron on a transmitter polarity change update.


Anyway, he doesn't have anything on record in regards to your particular Epson 810. He believes it will work at 60Hz, plus he gives everyone 30 days to try it out. So if it doesn't work out then send it back. The packaging isn't large so return shipping should be nominal. You will perceive some flicker at 60Hz., I tolerate it fine, some don't.


I forgot to ask him about the Ultra Clear glasses, I doubt that they will sync at 60Hz., the only IR ones that I know of that do are the Hi-Shock brand VIP sells. My guess is your Ultra Clears do 120Hz. for your Mitsi.


I use the VIP RF glasses for my setup.


----------



## shahram72

Wow! I just read almost this entire thread. I had no idea there was a solution for those of us who have 60hz projectors. I have an Optoma HD180 which I believe is the same as an HD20. I want to use it with a PS3. I would buy it right now and think $300 is well worth it but it seems I need these expensive RF glasses which would make it too expensive and then there are battery issues, These glasses are really simple, no reason why they are so expensive, especially being made overseas. I only see one dissatisfied Optoma HD20/HD180 owner. Did I miss any others? I watch in a totally dark room and the image is already too bright on eco mode for me at times so I can just put it on normal lamp mode for 3d to help with brightness. But the glasses are stopping me from diving into this.


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *shahram72* 
Wow! I just read almost this entire thread. I had no idea there was a solution for those of us who have 60hz projectors. I have an Optoma HD180 which I believe is the same as an HD20. I want to use it with a PS3. I would buy it right now and think $300 is well worth it but it seems I need these expensive RF glasses which would make it too expensive and then there are battery issues, These glasses are really simple, no reason why they are so expensive, especially being made overseas. I only see one dissatisfied Optoma HD20/HD180 owner. Did I miss any others? I watch in a totally dark room and the image is already too bright on eco mode for me at times so I can just put it on normal lamp mode for 3d to help with brightness. But the glasses are stopping me from diving into this.
Don't let the glasses stop you; the battery issues have been identified & are in the process of being corrected. I have been very happy with the VIP unit and my Optoma HD70.


Also, remember that you can use the IR glasses that VIP offers; they are a little less expensive, but not as adjustable. The RF glasses will give you a much better experience, and you'll likely be able to carry them over when you upgrade your system.


----------



## shahram72

Yeah, but the glasses, only one pair add $200 to the price? Are you kidding? I'm not made of money. What am I going to do with one pair?


----------



## avswilier

Quote:

Originally Posted by *shahram72*
Yeah, but the glasses, only one pair add $200 to the price? Are you kidding? I'm not made of money. What am I going to do with one pair?
The price is what it is... If it's not worth it then just don't buy it or just wait until it becomes cheaper as most technology does.


----------



## Brian Hampton




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *shahram72* /forum/post/20763899
> 
> 
> Yeah, but the glasses, only one pair add $200 to the price? Are you kidding? I'm not made of money. What am I going to do with one pair?




I understand.


I was tempted to get a passive flat panel HDTV because I can get maybe 20 sets of glasses cheap (practically free.) That's one BIG advantage to the passive 3D systems. (Some forum members got a box full of the passive glasses just by asking a local theater for one and also DisneyMovieRewards offers them in Adult and Kid sizes via the Rewards program.)


However,.. If you want to use a projector there's no off the shelf passive system only DIY and expensive DIY options which I didn't consider as options.


The RF glasses are the BEST active shutter glasses on the market. And they are the most universal. I only have one set, such is life on a budget. That means I watch (3D content) alone. Hopefully I can get a couple more for the holidays and then I can let the kids know what I have going... ha ha.


The RF glasses are more expensive but you may only need 3 to 5 pairs ever and they are the very BEST in my opinion.


If I ever moved to a native 3D projector... they would still be my choice for 3D Glasses.


The glasses alone are only $130 not $200... it's the emiiter in the kit that costs the other $70 and that's one time only.


-Brian


Edit: amazon has some of the rf glasses for $125 (few pairs left when I checked). The monster vision max glasses are the same as the ones from 3D-VIP


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *avswilier* /forum/post/20764283
> 
> 
> The price is what it is... If it's not worth it then just don't buy it or just wait until it becomes cheaper as most technology does.



Agreed. 3D is a luxury option right now, until that killer software that everyone just has to have comes along and the technology becomes much more widespread. You have to pay to play, unfortunately.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* /forum/post/20770038
> 
> 
> Agreed. 3D is a luxury option right now, until that killer software that everyone just has to have comes along and the technology becomes much more widespread. You have to pay to play, unfortunately.



There already is cheap technology available if one is willing peruse the various topics on this forum.


----------



## shahram72

I'll get something eventually, I just have to wait. Heck, I just got a 1080p projector just this year! And it was a refurb! I had a 576p projector for years before that. They don't call me the advanced cheapskate for nothing. And I have to be, two kids and I only make decent money half the year.


----------



## Brian Hampton

Hi,


Has anyone got the 3D-VIP products to work with a computor monitor?


I have the Displayer and I use it with my PS3 and non3d projector and that's grand, so I can't complain.


However,... I also have a small ACER monitor that I prefer to use for video games and I can't get the Displayer to pass it video.


Anyone have ideas?.... I've turned off stuff like SuperWhite and DeepColor and [email protected] I've also setup the HDMI output to force RGB.


I get the link light to light up now but the monitor always says "Cable not connected."


-Brian


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Brian Hampton* /forum/post/20809080
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> 
> Has anyone got the 3D-VIP products to work with a computor monitor?
> 
> 
> I have the Displayer and I use it with my PS3 and non3d projector and that's grand, so I can't complain.
> 
> 
> However,... I also have a small ACER monitor that I prefer to use for video games and I can't get the Displayer to pass it video.
> 
> 
> Anyone have ideas?.... I've turned off stuff like SuperWhite and DeepColor and [email protected] I've also setup the HDMI output to force RGB.
> 
> 
> I get the link light to light up now but the monitor always says "Cable not connected."
> 
> 
> -Brian



If your monitor has vga or component input it might work with a HDFury product.


----------



## Brian Hampton

True. I sold my Hdfury but since then I have often needed it. D'oh!


----------



## SgtVideo

Do to filesize constraints the above update is posted at the CurtPalme web site:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=314630 


This change allows an improved method for the user to change polarity.


The new instruction for this is as follows:

*SET POLARITY:*

Push joystick UP momentarily to clear LEDs. Now hold UP until 4 LEDs are lit and release. This is Polarity Mode, pushing Joystick Left/Right momentary while in this mode will produce the following:


2 LEDs= standard polarity

3 LEDs= Reverse Polarity.


After 10 seconds non-use the mode is saved and returned to normal operation.


Hope you enjoy.


----------



## SgtVideo

I was informed earlier this week that VIP3D had entered into a new distribution contract. The initial effect will be that the VIP3D web site will no longer be a direct purchase consumer site. Current equipment can still be purchased from CurtPalme and Consignia as before.


The new international distributor will begin the process of setting up additional distribution sites.


This will allow VIP3D to best utilitize it's resources for product enhancement and expansion in the video realm.


The website will shortly be revamped and themed towards a supporting role.


This is all I know for now but I look forward to the possibilities that may come from this.


----------



## Star56




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20818462
> 
> 
> Do to filesize constraints the above update is posted at the CurtPalme web site:
> 
> http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=314630
> 
> 
> This change allows an improved method for the user to change polarity.
> 
> 
> The new instruction for this is as follows:
> 
> *SET POLARITY:*
> 
> Push joystick UP momentarily to clear LEDs. Now hold UP until 4 LEDs are lit and release. This is Polarity Mode, pushing Joystick Left/Right momentary while in this mode will produce the following:
> 
> 
> 2 LEDs= standard polarity
> 
> 3 LEDs= Reverse Polarity.
> 
> 
> After 10 seconds non-use the mode is saved and returned to normal operation.
> 
> 
> Hope you enjoy.




YES! My biggest issue with this unit has now been fixed! Thanks a ton!


The VIP Displayer and Acer PJ is a 3D dream come true!


----------



## jimvela




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20763490
> 
> 
> Don't let the glasses stop you; the battery issues have been identified & are in the process of being corrected. I have been very happy with the VIP unit and my Optoma HD70.
> 
> 
> Also, remember that you can use the IR glasses that VIP offers; they are a little less expensive, but not as adjustable. The RF glasses will give you a much better experience, and you'll likely be able to carry them over when you upgrade your system.



So, I got my Displayer and RF glasses kit. The Displayer is installed like this: PS3 slim>Yamaha RX-V867>Panasonic AE4000U all using HDMI cables. The transmitter is hooked up to the Displayer using the 3-pin cable that came with it. I see all three lights up on the Displayer so I know everything is hooked up properly.


My problem is, I see the same fuzzy, flickering picture with or without the glasses. When i powered on the glasses it will momentarily then goes off. It was fully charged as I see the lights blinking like a heartbeat after charging for 4-5 hours. I tried sending 3 e-mails already to VIP support group and no response yet so far from them. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20885802
> 
> 
> So, I got my Displayer and RF glasses kit. The Displayer is installed like this: PS3 slim>Yamaha RX-V867>Panasonic AE4000U all using HDMI cables. The transmitter is hooked up to the Displayer using the 3-pin cable that came with it. I see all three lights up on the Displayer so I know everything is hooked up properly.
> 
> 
> My problem is, I see the same fuzzy, flickering picture with or without the glasses. When i powered on the glasses it will momentarily then goes off. It was fully charged as I see the lights blinking like a heartbeat after charging for 4-5 hours. I tried sending 3 e-mails already to VIP support group and no response yet so far from them. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.



Are the lights on the emitter going from "scanning" red (searching for 3d sync) to green (3d transmitting) when you play 3d content? Some people have had better luck plugging the usb into an outlet adapter rather than a computer. Same thing when charging the glasses.


Have you adjusted the delay & duty cycle on the emitter as per the manual? If these are set incorrectly, severe ghosting may give the impression that the glasses aren't working.


----------



## mkoss




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20885802
> 
> 
> So, I got my Displayer and RF glasses kit. The Displayer is installed like this: PS3 slim>Yamaha RX-V867>Panasonic AE4000U all using HDMI cables. The transmitter is hooked up to the Displayer using the 3-pin cable that came with it. I see all three lights up on the Displayer so I know everything is hooked up properly.
> 
> 
> My problem is, I see the same fuzzy, flickering picture with or without the glasses. When i powered on the glasses it will momentarily then goes off. It was fully charged as I see the lights blinking like a heartbeat after charging for 4-5 hours. I tried sending 3 e-mails already to VIP support group and no response yet so far from them. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.



Test with the yamaha out of the loop first. if it's resyncing you will have a problem getting phase and ghosting balanced out with the glasses dongle.


----------



## jimvela

Thank you both for your quick reply. I think the problem is with the glasses as I don't see the led light on indicating it's working. So, my question is how could you tell if the unit is working? Every time I powered on, the lights will lit and blinks six times then go off. Again, thank you for all the help.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20887333
> 
> 
> Thank you both for your quick reply. I think the problem is with the glasses as I don't see the led light on indicating it's working. So, my question is how could you tell if the unit is working? Every time I powered on, the lights will lit and blinks six times then go off. Again, thank you for all the help.



Is the emitter plugged into anything for power? In my setup it wasn't enough to just plug in the vesa connector, I had to supply external juice via the usb.


When the emitter is on and in operating mode, it will constantly "scan", with the row of lights scrolling red back and forth (like a cylon from Battlestar Galactica) until it detects a 3d signal. It will show steady green when it locks onto 3d sync.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20885802
> 
> 
> So, I got my Displayer and RF glasses kit. The Displayer is installed like this: PS3 slim>Yamaha RX-V867>Panasonic AE4000U all using HDMI cables. The transmitter is hooked up to the Displayer using the 3-pin cable that came with it. I see all three lights up on the Displayer so I know everything is hooked up properly.
> 
> 
> My problem is, I see the same fuzzy, flickering picture with or without the glasses. When i powered on the glasses it will momentarily then goes off. It was fully charged as I see the lights blinking like a heartbeat after charging for 4-5 hours. I tried sending 3 e-mails already to VIP support group and no response yet so far from them. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.



Try this email address, I don't know why their other one gets failed contacts sometimes:

[email protected] 



With all 3 LEDs lit on the Displayer and 3D content playing, is the transmitter showing all Green LEDS? --With no 3D content playing transmitter should be strobing all Red LEDs.


If yes, are the glasses shuttering or dead?


When first powering the glasses how many blinks?


Make sure the Displayer is powered from a 5V USB source that has a minimum of 1A/1000ma, 1.5A-2.0 preferable.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20887333
> 
> 
> Thank you both for your quick reply. I think the problem is with the glasses as I don't see the led light on indicating it's working. So, my question is how could you tell if the unit is working? Every time I powered on, the lights will lit and blinks six times then go off. Again, thank you for all the help.




I missed your blink count in my earlier response. Sounds like the old battery problem is resurfacing. Do your glasses have one or two VIP labels on them?


Need to know as there was a production change made that may have a bearing.


----------



## jimvela




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20888308
> 
> 
> I missed your blink count in my earlier response. Sounds like the old battery problem is resurfacing. Do your glasses have one or two VIP labels on them?
> 
> 
> Need to know as there was a production change made that may have a bearing.



It has two labels. Last night, I was so frustrated that I gave up after an hour of tweaking I guess, without nothing accomplished. So, I decided to charge the glasses again this time connected to my u-verse usb port. After about thirty minutes I see the light blinking like a heartbeat pattern so, I though it is fully charged, but I decided to let it stay connected overnight. This morning though I see no light on and looks like dead.


Thank you all for the help I'm getting and I appreciate all the suggestions. I will try to send another e-mail to the support2 group you've mentioned. Have a good day.


----------



## jimvela




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/20887360
> 
> 
> Is the emitter plugged into anything for power? In my setup it wasn't enough to just plug in the vesa connector, I had to supply external juice via the usb.
> 
> 
> When the emitter is on and in operating mode, it will constantly "scan", with the row of lights scrolling red back and forth (like a cylon from Battlestar Galactica) until it detects a 3d signal. It will show steady green when it locks onto 3d sync.



Yes, I see the emitter scanning with red lights and turns to green lights when a 3d signal is detected.


----------



## dswdallas

I understand that the Displayer only does side by side display (not sure if I am clear on that) and that the Theater does all displays. I watch a lot of Blu-Ray discs so the Displayer would work for me. I also have Directv. Do they use the same format or would I need to go to the Theater version?

Thanks


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *dswdallas* /forum/post/20888677
> 
> 
> I understand that the Displayer only does side by side display (not sure if I am clear on that) and that the Theater does all displays. I watch a lot of Blu-Ray discs so the Displayer would work for me. I also have Directv. Do they use the same format or would I need to go to the Theater version?
> 
> Thanks



I think you may be confusing input with output. Actually, the Displayer does _not_ support side by side. For Direct TV or other broadcast/cable/sat 3D, you'd need the Theater. The Displayer supports 3D for gaming and Blu-Ray, while the Theater supports 3D in gaming, Blu-Ray, and broadcast.


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *jimvela* 
Yes, I see the emitter scanning with red lights and turns to green lights when a 3d signal is detected.
Sound like it's definitely the glasses. Call & see if you can get an exchange.


----------



## jimvela

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
Sound like it's definitely the glasses. Call & see if you can get an exchange.
Sent an e-mail both to Consignia and VIP and we'll see who will respond first. I waited this long before placing my order hoping that the bad glasses are gone, unfortunately, they are still in circulation, I guess.


But, I haven't got any answer yet on my earlier question if the light stays on while the glasses is working. Could someone please confirm this? Thank you very much.


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *jimvela* 
But, I haven't got any answer yet on my earlier question if the light stays on while the glasses is working. Could someone please confirm this? Thank you very much.
You know, I've never noticed! If the light does stay on, it apparently isn't a distraction for me.


I'll have to check it out tonight. Anyone?


----------



## SgtVideo

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
You know, I've never noticed! If the light does stay on, it apparently isn't a distraction for me.


I'll have to check it out tonight. Anyone?


The glasses will blink after power On for about 10 minutes with no signal. Otherwise the blinking continues through the viewing cycle and ceases when

the transmitter breaks link and they go into software shutdown after 10 minutes.


----------



## dswdallas

Quote:

Originally Posted by *Rolls-Royce* 
I think you may be confusing input with output. Actually, the Displayer does _not_ support side by side. For Direct TV or other broadcast/cable/sat 3D, you'd need the Theater. The Displayer supports 3D for gaming and Blu-Ray, while the Theater supports 3D in gaming, Blu-Ray, and broadcast.
Thanks for the help.

Don


----------



## jimvela




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/20889815
> 
> 
> The glasses will blink after power On for about 10 minutes with no signal. Otherwise the blinking continues through the viewing cycle and ceases when
> 
> the transmitter breaks link and they go into software shutdown after 10 minutes.



With this reply, I now conclude that it is definitely the glasses problem. The good news though is that VIP has responded to my e-mails today, kudos to Jonathan for taking charge. Hopefully, I could get the replacement very soon to get this going.


Again, thank you for all who responded. In numbers we could make a difference.


----------



## thebard

I'm cross-posting this on the Monster Max and VIP product threads. There have been numerous posts dealing with the less-than-ideal sync (L/R) invert feature for the rf emitter, and I've come up with an easy way to do it, literally at the touch of a button... without getting out of your seat! This method does require that the emitter be hooked up to a running pc; I use my music server, but a small laptop or netbook will suffice.


Here's what you do:


- Install the Bit Cauldron/Monster Max management utility, and hook up the emitter via usb.


- Purchase this inexpensive wireless usb remote and plug the usb receiver into the same computer as the emitter.


- Assign a shortcut key (e.g. Ctrl + Alt + A) to the management utility's shortcut that coincides with one of the remote's hotkeys (e.g. Hotkey A). (In windows XP: Right-click > Properties > Shortcut tab > Shortcut Key.)


- Press the following button sequence on the usb remote, or (even better) program it into your universal remote:


Hotkey A,

tab,

tab,

tab,

tab,

tab,

enter,

enter.


If programing a macro on a universal remote, you may need to account for some lag between commands.


Presto! Now, when you hit the button that activates the macro, the pc will automatically open the Bit Cauldron utility, select the "Switch Left/Right Lenses" button, and exit. While viewing 3D content, the left & right views should switch on screen a moment later.


The only drawbacks I've found are (1) the need to have a pc turned on & hooked up to the emitter (but I don't find this to be a problem, since my music server is adjacent to my HT gear and I already have it running while my system is on); and (2) depending on your computer, it may take a second or two to execute the commands (especially the hotkey that opens the utility). But the _advantages_ include _remote control_ of the sync invert function, and _never having to mess with that awful toggle switch again!_


Hope I was able to help out some others with this tip.


----------



## jimvela

Quote:

Originally Posted by *thebard* 
Sound like it's definitely the glasses. Call & see if you can get an exchange.
It took a little longer but I finally got the replacement RF kit and was able to make it work. I was at first hesitant to use the glasses as I noticed it has two labels on both sides which was proven to be defective but I guess not all of them are. Are there any glasses that has only one label? I hope next time I'll order, I'm gonna get one of those.


I thank Jonathan and his support group in resolving the issue and now I can finally enjoy 3D. I watched the Imax Under the Sea last night and the 3D effect is awesome. One question to all, is it okay to leave the transmitter on with its led light strobing or is it necessary to unplug it? Again, thank you all who contributed in resolving the issue.


----------



## thebard

Quote:

Originally Posted by *jimvela* 
It took a little longer but I finally got the replacement RF kit and was able to make it work. I was at first hesitant to use the glasses as I noticed it has two labels on both sides which was proven to be defective but I guess not all of them are. Are there any glasses that has only one label? I hope next time I'll order, I'm gonna get one of those.


I thank Jonathan and his support group in resolving the issue and now I can finally enjoy 3D. I watched the Imax Under the Sea last night and the 3D effect is awesome. One question to all, is it okay to leave the transmitter on with its led light strobing or is it necessary to unplug it? Again, thank you all who contributed in resolving the issue.
Glad it's working for you. enjoy your new setup!


I leave the emitter on all the time.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *jimvela* /forum/post/20969809
> 
> 
> It took a little longer but I finally got the replacement RF kit and was able to make it work. I was at first hesitant to use the glasses as I noticed it has two labels on both sides which was proven to be defective but I guess not all of them are. Are there any glasses that has only one label? I hope next time I'll order, I'm gonna get one of those.
> 
> 
> I thank Jonathan and his support group in resolving the issue and now I can finally enjoy 3D. I watched the Imax Under the Sea last night and the 3D effect is awesome. One question to all, is it okay to leave the transmitter on with its led light strobing or is it necessary to unplug it? Again, thank you all who contributed in resolving the issue.



If the glasses don't timeout when leaving the transmitter on then they will drain down. I noticed mine still had heartbeat even though I wasn't using them at the time after 3 hours non-use, so I had to shut off the Displayer for them to do auto-shutdown to turn off the transmitter. Of course if you want to do a good battery drain test then see how long they last.


Next time I talk to Jonathan, I will ask him about the double-label group glasses. It was my earlier understanding that single label glasses were new production but only some of the 2-Logo glasses were part of the recalled ones.


----------



## mkoss

Any plans to be able to use 2 devices for seperate left right 60hz projectors similar to the 3D-XL inorder to impliment passive polaized setup?


----------



## John-Alden

I have had my vip 3d displayer box for a couple of days now and i've been having trouble of getting the emitter or the glasses to work, everything else works as it should. Emitter can't seem to pick up a signal and the RF glasses seem to be fully charged. Any help on my situation would be welcome to know if I need to get replacements.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *John-Alden* /forum/post/21114419
> 
> 
> I have had my vip 3d displayer box for a couple of days now and i've been having trouble of getting the emitter or the glasses to work, everything else works as it should. Emitter can't seem to pick up a signal and the RF glasses seem to be fully charged. Any help on my situation would be welcome to know if I need to get replacements.



Please tell us how you have everything hooked up (what source are you using, is the emitter the only thing between source & display, emitter usb into ac adapter or direct to pc, etc.).


- Does the emitter turn from scanning red to solid green when a 3d source is played?

- Are you sure the glasses are turned on (two FIRM presses of the button on the earpiece)?


----------



## John-Alden

My setup is PS3>Displayer>Sony HTCT100 Surround Bar> Mitsubishi HC3800. The displayer and emitter is powred by usb outs of Motorola cable box with suppiled usb cables. I'll report by later if I still can't seem to lock on to the signal.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *John-Alden* /forum/post/21116319
> 
> 
> My setup is PS3>Displayer>Sony HTCT100 Surround Bar> Mitsubishi HC3800. The displayer and emitter is powred by usb outs of Motorola cable box with suppiled usb cables. I'll report by later if I still can't seem to lock on to the signal.



You're going hdmi through the Sony Surround bar? I'm not familiar with it; you're sure it's 3d (hdmi 1.4) capable (you're getting a combined, "double-image" when viewed without the glasses)? If not, go direct to the display & see if that helps.


If 3d is passing ok, again, make sure the emitter has power (solid green lights when 3d is playing, red scanning cylon eyes when not). Make sure the red led on the glasses lights when you power them on.


----------



## John-Alden

I'm getting the double image. Might not be geting enough power to both of them.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *John-Alden* /forum/post/21116571
> 
> 
> I'm getting the double image. Might not be geting enough power to both of them.



Ok, so you seem to be getting 3D signal to the display.


You mentioned rf, so I'll assume you are indeed using the rf emitter (not IR).


- Are the lights on the emitter on?

- Do they turn solid green when you play 3D content?


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *John-Alden* /forum/post/21116319
> 
> 
> My setup is PS3>Displayer>Sony HTCT100 Surround Bar> Mitsubishi HC3800. The displayer and emitter is powred by usb outs of Motorola cable box with suppiled usb cables. I'll report by later if I still can't seem to lock on to the signal.



It is recommended your USB power source have minimum capability of 1000ma (1amp) at 5VDC to 1500ma (1.5 amp). Otherwise you can have issues even though the indicator LEDS on the Displayer appear normal.


----------



## pkmn-source

I just got this 3D Displayer... got it all hooked up on my 40" LED TV...


When i switch to 3D mode, the screen is shaking... Help?


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pkmn-source* /forum/post/21165613
> 
> 
> I just got this 3D Displayer... got it all hooked up on my 40" LED TV...
> 
> 
> When i switch to 3D mode, the screen is shaking... Help?



Can you describe "shaking"?


What glasses are you using? Does the screen "shake" when you view through the glasses as well?


----------



## LVNeptune

Quick run down:


I sold him my spare 3D Displayer.


He's using it on a 60hz TV with the DIP switch set down. I gave him a pair of Monster 3D Max Glasses with the RF adapter. The screen WITHOUT the glasses on shakes. The images are fighting to be on screen and it makes a jitter, kind of hard to explain. It looks slightly better with the glasses on but I basically see them visually shutter on and off.


I have attempted every bit of troubleshooting I can with it. The unit works fine on 120hz. I have the same issue on my Theater at home if I try to switch to 60hz mode and switch into 3D mode, everything jitters and is jumpy.


Any ideas?


----------



## pkmn-source

oh, my TV btw is a Samsung UN40C6300. It's advertised as 120hz but Displayer won't work with the dip switch up.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pkmn-source* /forum/post/21166341
> 
> 
> oh, my TV btw is a Samsung UN40C6300. It's advertised as 120hz but Displayer won't work with the dip switch up.



Yeah, the 120hz is internal for picture adjustment; the maximum vertical frequency for HD sources, listed on p.11 of the manual, is 60hz.


Try turning "Auto Motion Plus" off if it is on.


----------



## pkmn-source




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/21167093
> 
> 
> Try turning "Auto Motion Plus" off if it is on.



It's off and the picture on the screen still shakes. It's like struggling to split the image in half.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *pkmn-source* /forum/post/21167886
> 
> 
> It's off and the picture on the screen still shakes. It's like struggling to split the image in half.



What Blu-Ray player and movie title are you using? Make sure the content

you are playing matches the acceptable input resolutions on the Displayer datasheet.


Also what is the power rating of the USB power supply you are using? Anything under 1 amp 5VDC can cause malfunction.


Show us how you have everything connected, like so:

BluRay>Displayer>TV


If there are other devices in the signal path then show them.


Some folks forget to mention they're playing files and they can be in the wrong format.


The Displayer datasheet can downloaded .PDF here:

http://www.3d-vip.com/ 


Click on the Products tab and choose Displayer.


----------



## digitalrhino

I have a problem I am hoping someone can help me out with. My set up is PS3 - VIP Displayer - GT720, I am using dlp link glasses with this setup. My problem is that when I watch a 3d blu-ray it will set my resolution to 720p 120hz, but the menu on my projector where I switch dlp sync does not show up. The 3d works great but if I am out of sync I have to quite the blu-ray and load it up again until my glasses sync properly, a longer process then just switching sync in the projector menu. 3d games show the menu it is just 3d blu-rays. I hope some else has had this issue and might have found a solution.


Thanks


----------



## madhak

Hi Guys,


After a lot of spending and waiting, i finally got my 3d setup up and running...


3D source => Sony AVR DN610 => 3D-Displayer with IR glass => BenQ MP511...


Using PS3 as 3D source with Killzone3 for now as I have yet to try PC and XBox... sticking to what work for my test. Killzone3 have amassing graphic and 3d effect are fabulous (I tried to avoid a rocket by moving my head lol)


I originally had and still have a BenQ MP525P which I had planned to convert to 3D but the HDMI2VGA adapter I'm using doesn't let the signal goes trough... see half a screen then projector search for signal and keep looping between half screen and no signal... I have a few hdmi2vga converter in the mail but all order got delayed and still in transit... So I upgraded to a 3D ready projector for 400$ on boxing-day (200$ saving)...


I also tried the VIP displayer on 2 old LCD TV with awful response time and it just doesn't work... I see 3D but only in some portion of the screen which change when I play with the sync button...


While the 3d effect are stunning and visual quality, the brightness and contrast on my new projector are slightly better than my previous one so I'm very happy with my purchase... but I think it could be better and I think the IR glass are doing a poor job and are most likely the weakest equipment on my setup (HI SHOCK glass supplied with the 3d-displayer bundle).


On dark scene, luminous spot in the scene seem to be out of focus... look great when thing are exploding but for static object in the scene, it get annoying...


QUESTION IS:

Would better glass or other technologies of glass help me whit that issue or I bought a cheap 3d ready that use poor implementation of 3d technologies?

I guess DLP-Link would be better since they can sync directly with the output and the rotating well in the projector... I can sometime see the crosstalk of white object change in HUE, like sometime the crosstalk is bluish, sometime reddish, when looking at the same object for 20 min the same ghosting do a 360 in the HUE... Not sure if I'm clear enough here...


Thanks a lot... BTW VIP-displayer is a very well done piece of technologies and the inside components represent the relatively high price of those device... It consist of a Silicon Image HDMI 1.4 receiver chip, an Altera Cyclone III FPGA and a Silicon image HDMI 1.3 transmitter alongside with 1 ram and 2 rom chip, PCB layout is clean and high quality and provide several test point including the Sync tap i was looking before to sync multiple VIP attached TV on one glass, but haven't tried yet as I'm still perfecting my new setup.


----------



## thebard




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *madhak* /forum/post/21440660
> 
> 
> Hi Guys,
> 
> 
> After a lot of spending and waiting, i finally got my 3d setup up and running...
> 
> 
> 3D source => Sony AVR DN610 => 3D-Displayer with IR glass => BenQ MP511...
> 
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> QUESTION IS:
> 
> Would better glass or other technologies of glass help me whit that issue or I bought a cheap 3d ready that use poor implementation of 3d technologies?
> 
> I guess DLP-Link would be better since they can sync directly with the output and the rotating well in the projector... I can sometime see the crosstalk of white object change in HUE, like sometime the crosstalk is bluish, sometime reddish, when looking at the same object for 20 min the same ghosting do a 360 in the HUE... Not sure if I'm clear enough here...



Upgrading to dlp link will require a new projector if your current one is not 3d ready (which I think your BenQ is not). That will improve 3d in that the refresh rate will be 120hz native (less flicker. However, some folks have noted a color cast due the the dlp "flash" used to sync the glasses (this can vary with individual pj/glasses setups).


The rf glasses I got with my VIP & 60hz setup improved picture quality quite a bit. They can be adjusted for delay & duty cycle to eliminate crosstalk. They require some tuning, but well worth it IMO. Available branded as VIP, Monster or Optoma.


----------



## madhak




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *thebard* /forum/post/21440961
> 
> 
> Upgrading to dlp link will require a new projector if your current one is not 3d ready (which I think your BenQ is not). That will improve 3d in that the refresh rate will be 120hz native (less flicker. However, some folks have noted a color cast due the the dlp "flash" used to sync the glasses (this can vary with individual pj/glasses setups).
> 
> 
> The rf glasses I got with my VIP & 60hz setup improved picture quality quite a bit. They can be adjusted for delay & duty cycle to eliminate crosstalk. They require some tuning, but well worth it IMO. Available branded as VIP, Monster or Optoma.



Thanks for your quick reply, Maybe I've poorly explained my situation due to my bad english but my new projector is 3D ready... I failed at converting my old not-3d-ready projector mainly because of the HDMI2VGA converter, and being impatient, I couldn't wait for a new HDMI2VGA to ship and they are hard to get in Canada and still no guarantee they will work... so I opted for a new 3D ready projector...


What I really concerned about is which of the following may be the source of the ghosting;

1. Cheap 3d ready projector (400$~600$) i can still return it to the store and grab e better one but cant seem to find optoma hd66 in canada which has great review here.

2. VIP in the way? Cant test if its better without if i don't have DLP-Link glass.. again shipping time...

3. IR glass just suck? HI-SHOCK or all of them?

4. Wrong configuration of the source or display? maybe both?


I tested without the AVR and does the same thing, played with various setting in PS3 but nothing help... Projector dont allow picture correction on HDMI... what next, I need that 1300$ hdmi 3d video processor?


Again, issue is that I see ghosting when watching a dark scene, ie. night scene, and there is a bright spot in the scene, it appear out of focus. Which could be normal since shutter-glass doesn't block 100% of light, maybe I'm just too difficult, i can definitely live with it but if I can fix it why not...


I thought DLP-Link glasses would help but I don't want to see that rainbow effect... I already saw it on my old projector when playing with xbox kinect or ps3 move in 2D... add that on top of ghosting and i get sick... New projector doesn't do the rainbow effect in 2D anymore...


Thanks a lot


----------



## HokeySmoke

Does anyone know if the 3D Displayer will output 120Hz 3D sync when there is no display attached? We have a TV with a bad 3-pin sync port and were thinking this might be a way to get it working again.


----------



## madhak




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/21445079
> 
> 
> Does anyone know if the 3D Displayer will output 120Hz 3D sync when there is no display attached? We have a TV with a bad 3-pin sync port and were thinking this might be a way to get it working again.



It need a 3D source attached with 3D signal to start the Sync port (3D Led need to be on)... Not sure if it work without the display (my guess would be yes but there is about 1 frame delayed by the processing that is accounted in th sync output to match the VIP HDMI output, otherwise it may require tuning if your glasses support it) but if you put it in between your TV and 3D source, this will replace the defective 3-pin sync port of your TV for sure.


----------



## HokeySmoke




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *madhak* /forum/post/21450633
> 
> 
> It need a 3D source attached with 3D signal to start the Sync port (3D Led need to be on)... Not sure if it work without the display (my guess would be yes but there is about 1 frame delayed by the processing that is accounted in the sync output to match the VIP HDMI output, otherwise it may require tuning if your glasses support it) but if you put it in between your TV and 3D source, this will replace the defective 3-pin sync port of your TV for sure.



The TV is not 720p120 compatible, and I don't want 60Hz 3D. I'm not worried about the delay as the emitter can adjust for the delay.


I think I am going to go ahead and get one to try this. It is by far the least expensive way I could find to do this, and worst case I can return it.


----------



## madhak




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *HokeySmoke* /forum/post/21452731
> 
> 
> The TV is not 720p120 compatible, and I don't want 60Hz 3D. I'm not worried about the delay as the emitter can adjust for the delay.
> 
> 
> I think I am going to go ahead and get one to try this. It is by far the least expensive way I could find to do this, and worst case I can return it.



Just confirmed that it does output the (120hz or 60hz) sync on the 3-pin DIN port of the 3D-Displayer without a display attached... now you just have to worry about sync between VIP and your TV but if your glasses support tuning you should be fine.


Don't know about VIP return policy but they really stand by their product and their support is excellent, something we don't see often anymore...


[EDIT] You might have issue with splitting the HDMI signal between VIP and TV unless your HDMI spliter or matrix support HDMI1.4, Alto I've seen passive HDMI spliter that work in way not permitted by HDMI protocol... It really come down to how your TV implement the handshake required for HDMI to output the picture...


----------



## EvilResident

I'm having an issue where my glasses flicker in one eye slower than the other, and it slowly drifts from one eye to the other as well. I can't tell of this is a frame locking issue or if I possibly got a faulty IR transmitter. In the brief moments where both eyes are working in sync, it looks great! I'm using a ps3 with a Panasonic viera plasma tv from a few years back.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *EvilResident* /forum/post/21789602
> 
> 
> I'm having an issue where my glasses flicker in one eye slower than the other, and it slowly drifts from one eye to the other as well. I can't tell of this is a frame locking issue or if I possibly got a faulty IR transmitter. In the brief moments where both eyes are working in sync, it looks great! I'm using a ps3 with a Panasonic viera plasma tv from a few years back.



Is this a new purchase or just something that just recently developed and worked fine previously?


----------



## EvilResident

It's a new purchase.


----------



## Sengimage




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *threed123* /forum/post/20210213
> 
> 
> VIP Displayer takes input from 3D bluray and PS3 and converts to 120hz frame sequential for 3D DLP ready projectors, and 60hz frame sequential (30 frames per eye) for non-3D projectors--but an IR emitter and corresponding 60-120hz capable glasses are necessary. Yes there might be slight flicker. According to other threads reviewing the VIP Theatre (which is a step up model to the Displayer), it works very well with minimum flicker and it's not as bad as you would think. We'll see.




What qualifies a Projector as 3D ready? Is it the Vertical refresh at 120Hz or is there more to it?


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## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *EvilResident* /forum/post/21790012
> 
> 
> It's a new purchase.



In a frame lock issue the glasses shutter the same rate for both eyes, video image syncs for maybe a few minutes and then begins to drift/ghost as frame sync is lost. This pattern of syncing and unsyncing may repeat throughout the entire viewing session.


If the glasses are shuttering differently in each lense then something is amiss at the emitter or glasses. Not quite sure if that is the point you are trying to make.


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## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Sengimage* /forum/post/21829779
> 
> 
> What qualifies a Projector as 3D ready? Is it the Vertical refresh at 120Hz or is there more to it?



Some of the earlier manufacturers like Samsung for instance with their RP DLP sets took liberties with the 3D Ready logo and ended up not supporting it after all in those sets. They briefly offered a kit but dropped it, Mitsubishi made a product for their customer base that was also compatible for Samsung users.


Basically the 3D Ready set should be able to handle 3D BLuRay, side by side and top 2 bottom formats. Samsung and Mitsubishi used 3D Checkerboard in the early designs. Most sets now utilize 120/240hz sync rates. Whether a particular 3D Ready projector handles the main 3D formats would be hidden somewhere in the manual.


The 3DVIP Theater processor made that possible for most non-3D Ready displays and some so-called 3D Ready units that didn't cover all the main formats.


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## EvilResident




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/21830078
> 
> 
> In a frame lock issue the glasses shutter the same rate for both eyes, video image syncs for maybe a few minutes and then begins to drift/ghost as frame sync is lost. This pattern of syncing and unsyncing may repeat throughout the entire viewing session.
> 
> 
> If the glasses are shuttering differently in each lense then something is amiss at the emitter or glasses. Not quite sure if that is the point you are trying to make.



Yes, I have been working with support since I got it all in the mail, and now they are sending me a replacement emitter. I'm keeping my fingers crossed, because in the few moments when the glasses DO work, I can tell that this thing really works.


Their support is extremely helpful and thorough, as well.So far, I really appreciate this company.


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## nunofcp




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *John-Alden* /forum/post/21114419
> 
> 
> I have had my vip 3d displayer box for a couple of days now and i've been having trouble of getting the emitter or the glasses to work, everything else works as it should. Emitter can't seem to pick up a signal and the RF glasses seem to be fully charged. Any help on my situation would be welcome to know if I need to get replacements.



Hello

I have a Mits 3800 too, and im thinking about buying a theater or a displayer, but i dont know if the VIP products will work well with my projector. Could you give me your experience please?

I love my projector and if the investiment in the displayer worth it, i will old the mits a few more years.

Thank you


Nuno


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## Sengimage




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo* /forum/post/21830145
> 
> 
> Some of the earlier manufacturers like Samsung for instance with their RP DLP sets took liberties with the 3D Ready logo and ended up not supporting it after all in those sets. They briefly offered a kit but dropped it, Mitsubishi made a product for their customer base that was also compatible for Samsung users.
> 
> 
> Basically the 3D Ready set should be able to handle 3D BLuRay, side by side and top 2 bottom formats. Samsung and Mitsubishi used 3D Checkerboard in the early designs. Most sets now utilize 120/240hz sync rates. Whether a particular 3D Ready projector handles the main 3D formats would be hidden somewhere in the manual.
> 
> 
> The 3DVIP Theater processor made that possible for most non-3D Ready displays and some so-called 3D Ready units that didn't cover all the main formats.



Then what would be your guess on the following?...


I have an InFocus IN5316HD. It has a vertical refresh of 120Hz which is the same exact spec as two lesser units...the IN5312 and the IN5314.


The two lesser units are listed as 3d Capable and have a feature in their menu system for turning the feature on or off. My unit the IN5316HD is supposedly one of the two upper end models in terms of true HD resolutions of 1280 X 1080p, however the two top end models are listed as not 3d capable. However with the vertical sync rate still rated for 120Hz, aren't they technically capable? Even if there is no feature to enable this onboard.. would a Player or converter play happy with this model? And Are there any out there that will allow for full 1080p without downsampling to 720P or is this a moot point?


Thanks in advance for any feedback or advice.


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## Sengimage

My bad... I meant to add this projector is 1920 X 1080 true HD


120Hz Vertical Sync, native 16 X 9


DLP


???


I'm assuming these specs meet the requisites for 3d and 1080P?


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## Sengimage

Okay... Ummm can the output from the 3d VIP theater be upscaled back into a 1080p output?


and still provide a 3d image?


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## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Sengimage* /forum/post/21830490
> 
> 
> Then what would be your guess on the following?...
> 
> 
> I have an InFocus IN5316HD. It has a vertical refresh of 120Hz which is the same exact spec as two lesser units...the IN5312 and the IN5314.
> 
> 
> The two lesser units are listed as 3d Capable and have a feature in their menu system for turning the feature on or off. My unit the IN5316HD is supposedly one of the two upper end models in terms of true HD resolutions of 1280 X 1080p, however the two top end models are listed as not 3d capable. However with the vertical sync rate still rated for 120Hz, aren't they technically capable? Even if there is no feature to enable this onboard.. would a Player or converter play happy with this model? And Are there any out there that will allow for full 1080p without downsampling to 720P or is this a moot point?
> 
> 
> Thanks in advance for any feedback or advice.



From what I can read about the IN5316HD you should be good for 1280x720P/120hz. 3D. Keep in mind since we are in the Displayer thread that the VIP Displayer is now a discontinued product. 3DNow is taking over distribution of the original 3DVIP Theater, whether the "new" Theater supports full 1080P is an unanswered question. It is unclear to me whether they are talking about Theater or TheaterPlus when it comes to full 1080P. How these versions get released are in the hands of 3DNow. Actually I am quite satisfied with 720P/120 3D.


I invited the developer (Jonathan) to post his comments regarding the newly labeled release and to solidify the specifications in the Theater forum so that we would not end up speculating regarding some of those questions. Unfortunately it seems he hasn't responded as yet.


Here is the link to the 3DNow brochure for the Theater:

http://3dnow.com/downloads/3DNow-Brochure.pdf


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## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Sengimage* /forum/post/21835374
> 
> 
> Okay... Ummm can the output from the 3d VIP theater be upscaled back into a 1080p output?
> 
> 
> and still provide a 3d image?



It's been like since last June when I did that through one of my AVRs but I don't remember anything noteworthy. It's hard to beat watching it at 120hz, it seems flicker became more prominent at 1080P/30 that it negated any benefit of the resolution enhancement. Plus at that time we were more focused on the RF glasses battery charge problem I got sidetracked. You would still want to use RF 3D glasses and 3DNow will be releasing the improved versions we were wishing for last year.


Perhaps some others who have tried it recently can give a more accurate account regarding 1080P upconversion results.


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## jmaccool

I have a Panasonic plasma TV from 2007, it is a 720P version at 42". Do you think this product is for me? I really like 3D and if this works well with Panasonic plasmas then there would be some big savings over buying a new 3D display. I also have an 82" 2012 3D Mits and it works great, the TV in my bedroom still looks real good but I would like to be able to watch my pretty big 3D collection up there from time to time as well. What would I need? I have DLP and IR glasses, I assume I need a DLP TV not plasma to use DLP glasses, or does the VIP send that weird underlying color signal that DLP uses? I assume that I would simply need an IR emitter and the VIP for the plasma if the DLP glasses do not work? I own 3 PS3’s so that would not be an issue. Would anyone also recommend it for a 2007 Mits DLP rear projection TV? I have a 65” in my den and it would not hurt to have that 3D as well. Would I need any kind of emitter for that if I had DLP glasses or would the glasses work without that like they do on my 82”? Any help is grately appreciated.


John M.


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## jmaccool

Hello,


I have noticed that this place is a bit of an elite forum, if you are not in here often and act like you know everything about A/V then you are ignored. So sad but true.


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## nickels55

Or it could be that you have an issue that is rare about a product that is even more rare, so nobody knows the answer to your question.

I will give it a shot.


DLP Link glasses require a 120hz signal, so you will probably need IR glasses and a emitter with your plasma set. The MItts set may work with DLP Link glasses if it is 120hz set. There may be some flicker when viewing 3D using the device due to the 60hz.


I have no first-hand experience with this product. Just knowledge from my personal research on it.


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## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo*  /t/1323631/3d-displayer-vip-product/690#post_21840792
> 
> 
> 
> It's been like since last June when I did that through one of my AVRs but I don't remember anything noteworthy. It's hard to beat watching it at 120hz, it seems flicker became more prominent at 1080P/30 that it negated any benefit of the resolution enhancement. Plus at that time we were more focused on the RF glasses battery charge problem I got sidetracked. You would still want to use RF 3D glasses and 3DNow will be releasing the improved versions we were wishing for last year.
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps some others who have tried it recently can give a more accurate account regarding 1080P upconversion results.



We upscale ours to 1080i-that's all the CRT RPTV it feeds can take-with no issues from it that we can detect.


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## SgtVideo

Well it looks like the 3DVIP website has been updated and shows their current and new product line including Theater+.


Looks like they will be marketing themselves again.



And now it appears that the Displayer and Gamer have been restored to production.

http://www.3d-vip.com/#!home/mainPage


----------



## nickels55

I was thinking about saving up for one of these for my Optoma HD20. I have found one review of a user who liked the results. Some people complain about flicker. Can anyone update on their experience with this product? Seems like not too many people out there use this so finding a recent hands-on review is not that easy. Is this worth $250?


I barely use the 3D on my 6187s TV so I am not sure it is worth it to upgrade my projector, but with a projector and a 120" screen that should make 3D look incredible.


----------



## Hambo2000

Does anyone know if the Displayer will work correctly on a JVC RS10?


It should right? I read the RS1 has some frame lock issues.


Just want some reassurance before i take the plunge..


thanks


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *Hambo2000*  /t/1323631/3d-displayer-vip-product/690#post_23026586
> 
> 
> Does anyone know if the Displayer will work correctly on a JVC RS10?
> 
> 
> It should right? I read the RS1 has some frame lock issues.
> 
> 
> Just want some reassurance before i take the plunge..
> 
> 
> thanks



There have been many posts about JVC D-ILA units and the VIP units. Take a look through this thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1336919/a-call-to-all-jvc-users-wishing-to-use-the-vip-3d-theatre-device as well as the other VIP threads in this forum to see if your projector is mentioned.


----------



## SgtVideo




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *nickels55*  /t/1323631/3d-displayer-vip-product/690#post_22522436
> 
> 
> I was thinking about saving up for one of these for my Optoma HD20. I have found one review of a user who liked the results. Some people complain about flicker. Can anyone update on their experience with this product? Seems like not too many people out there use this so finding a recent hands-on review is not that easy. Is this worth $250?
> 
> 
> I barely use the 3D on my 6187s TV so I am not sure it is worth it to upgrade my projector, but with a projector and a 120" screen that should make 3D look incredible.



Generally 60hz flicker tolerance is subjective and also influenced by other light sources entering the viewing area or more noticeably in bright scenes. Some individuals may just be easily annoyed with it and have no tolerance level. Whether you or your household would be affected similarly cannot be predicted. It can be mitigated to a certain degree by balancing the tuning adjustments for the RF glasses at the emitter and dropping the brightness levels some at the projector. 60hz 3D does pop with active RF 3D glasses and that may overcome any objection to what degree of flicker remains. Keep in mind most vendors will not accept glasses for refund just because you might not like flicker, they will exchange if they are defective, they cannot be sold again because of hygiene use and scratches.


As far as worth, it was worth more at the time for me when it cost more than $250 as an early adopter as it gave three other units 3D capability that they didn't have one of them also a 60hz projector.


----------



## Rolls-Royce




> Quote:
> Originally Posted by *SgtVideo*  /t/1323631/3d-displayer-vip-product/690#post_23030972
> 
> 
> Generally 60hz flicker tolerance is subjective and also influenced by other light sources entering the viewing area or more noticeably in bright scenes. Some individuals may just be easily annoyed with it and have no tolerance level. Whether you or your household would be affected similarly cannot be predicted. It can be mitigated to a certain degree by balancing the tuning adjustments for the RF glasses at the emitter and dropping the brightness levels some at the projector. 60hz 3D does pop with active RF 3D glasses and that may overcome any objection to what degree of flicker remains. Keep in mind most vendors will not accept glasses for refund just because you might not like flicker, they will exchange if they are defective, they cannot be sold again because of hygiene use and scratches.
> 
> 
> As far as worth, it was worth more at the time for me when it cost more than $250 as an early adopter as it gave three other units 3D capability that they didn't have one of them also a 60hz projector.



This!


----------

